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Author Topic: SW - Episode 7: Mary Sue wakes up but there's no coffee. RAGE.  (Read 300605 times)
Evildrider
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Reply #280 on: July 21, 2014, 03:03:41 PM

Supposedly a lot is pulled from McQuarrie's art.
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #281 on: July 21, 2014, 03:29:39 PM

This image is the best one I found to describe the new design.

~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #282 on: July 21, 2014, 03:31:35 PM

Also...


~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
Tannhauser
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Reply #283 on: July 21, 2014, 03:33:24 PM

Are you Mr. Fantastic?  Because that's one hell of a stretch.  awesome, for real
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #284 on: July 21, 2014, 03:34:09 PM

Sarcasm? It's a stretch to assume that is just from normal wear and tear.

~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
Merusk
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Reply #285 on: July 21, 2014, 04:49:43 PM

No, it's battle scarring for sure, the question is who's the enemy.  Most doubt this is going to be a rehash of a bad 1990s Dark Horse Comic meme.

I'm still only seeing a Z-95, though. Too many goddamn hours of X-wing and TIE Fighter.

The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
Surlyboi
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eat a bag of dicks


Reply #286 on: July 22, 2014, 04:08:12 PM

In case nobody saw this...

How the S foils work.

Tuned in, immediately get to watch cringey Ubisoft talking head offering her deepest sympathies to the families impacted by the Orlando shooting while flanked by a man in a giraffe suit and some sort of "horrifically garish neon costumes through the ages" exhibit or something.  We need to stop this fucking planet right now and sort some shit out. -Kail
Abagadro
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Reply #287 on: July 22, 2014, 06:49:47 PM

Whew. I'm glad that national nightmare has come to an end.  awesome, for real

"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

-H.L. Mencken
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #288 on: July 22, 2014, 07:05:30 PM

Whew. I'm glad that national nightmare has come to an end.  awesome, for real

This? This is only a light sprinkle.  There's a an internet shitstorm brewing, one the likes we have never seen.

~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
Surlyboi
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eat a bag of dicks


Reply #289 on: July 22, 2014, 07:36:22 PM

It's as if a million fanboys cried out in nerdrage and were sadly not silenced.

Tuned in, immediately get to watch cringey Ubisoft talking head offering her deepest sympathies to the families impacted by the Orlando shooting while flanked by a man in a giraffe suit and some sort of "horrifically garish neon costumes through the ages" exhibit or something.  We need to stop this fucking planet right now and sort some shit out. -Kail
Riggswolfe
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Reply #290 on: July 22, 2014, 08:35:20 PM

I think it'll be interesting to see if this gets the kind of backlash his Star Trek movies did. While the second one has lots of issues the first was a darn good movie but to hear Star Trek fans tell it, JJ has ruined the franchise for all time. It's like they've never watched Enterprise.

Then again, after George Lucas raped the corpse of Star Wars, this franchise can only get better.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
Surlyboi
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eat a bag of dicks


Reply #291 on: July 22, 2014, 10:58:08 PM

I think it'll be interesting to see if this gets the kind of backlash his Star Trek movies did. While the second one has lots of issues the first was a darn good movie but to hear Star Trek fans tell it, JJ has ruined the franchise for all time. It's like they've never watched Enterprise. anything after Deep Space Nine.

Fixed

Tuned in, immediately get to watch cringey Ubisoft talking head offering her deepest sympathies to the families impacted by the Orlando shooting while flanked by a man in a giraffe suit and some sort of "horrifically garish neon costumes through the ages" exhibit or something.  We need to stop this fucking planet right now and sort some shit out. -Kail
eldaec
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Reply #292 on: July 22, 2014, 11:05:17 PM

I think it'll be interesting to see if this gets the kind of backlash his Star Trek movies did. While the second one has lots of issues the first was a darn good movie but to hear Star Trek fans tell it, JJ has ruined the franchise for all time. It's like they've never watched Enterprise. anything after Deep Space Nine. that wasn't TNG.

Fixed

Fixed

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DraconianOne
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Reply #293 on: July 23, 2014, 04:20:29 AM

I think it'll be interesting to see if this gets the kind of backlash his Star Trek movies did. While the second one has lots of issues the first was a darn good movie but to hear Star Trek fans tell it, JJ has ruined the franchise for all time. It's like they've never watched Enterprise.

Then again, after George Lucas raped the corpse of Star Wars, this franchise can only get better.

On the whole I enjoyed the second one, warts and all, probably because I'm not a Star Trek fan. But I spent most of the film thinking "this is more Star Wars than Star Trek."  Quite honestly, the scene with the Enterprise crashing at the end was more



than Trek.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 06:32:26 AM by DraconianOne »

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Ironwood
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Reply #294 on: July 23, 2014, 04:39:22 AM

A lot of Trek fans liked the first one.  I certainly did.

The second one was total toss tho.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Riggswolfe
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Reply #295 on: July 23, 2014, 06:46:33 AM

A lot of Trek fans liked the first one.  I certainly did.

The second one was total toss tho.


Anecdotally I've noticed a lot of Trek fans (I'm getting this from interactions in STO and on some forums) hate the "JJverse." It almost comes across like a hipster cool thing to do as opposed to genuine feelings though. "Oh, it's new, and the enterprise doesn't look like it did in the 60s." The 2nd one had some good moments but went off the rails towards the end which isn't surprising with Damon Lindwhatever writing it.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to this. Say it with me people: Not written or directed by George Lucas. I thought Star Trek improved when Gene Rodenberry started losing power over it and it got much better after he died and I think Star Wars will be the same. Lucas never really 'got' his own movies and why people loved them.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #296 on: July 23, 2014, 06:51:40 AM

Long time trek fan and I don't hate the JJverse as a whole.  It's nice to have a new take on the classics but they are just way too action oriented to be good trek.  Of course hollywood WANTS big action films and tried pushing the TNG movies into it which failed horribly for many reason but primarily because TNG was NOT an action series to begin with.   The new trek films have been action movies from the get go and while that was fine for at least the first film in that "oh look, this is new and exciting!" way, it got old fast and as soon as they started retreading the most popular stuff (khaaaaaaaan!) but ya know, actiony, that's when people threw in the towel.

Nothing is wrong with either JJtrek movies on paper but they are just grimdark action movies that no one asked for.  Also, tribble blood revived kirk from the dead, so there's that.

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Merusk
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Reply #297 on: July 23, 2014, 07:02:28 AM

Long time trek fan and I don't hate the JJverse as a whole.  It's nice to have a new take on the classics but they are just way too action oriented to be good trek.  Of course hollywood WANTS big action films and tried pushing the TNG movies into it which failed horribly for many reason but primarily because TNG Star Trek was NOT an action series franchise to begin with.   The new trek films have been action movies from the get go and while that was fine for at least the first film in that "oh look, this is new and exciting!" way, it got old fast and as soon as they started retreading the most popular stuff (khaaaaaaaan!) but ya know, actiony, that's when people threw in the towel.

Nothing is wrong with either JJtrek movies on paper but they are just grimdark action movies that no one asked for.  Also, tribble blood revived kirk from the dead, so there's that.

Changed it, because it's not just about TNG.  Even DS9 and the shit-shows that came after it kept to part of the Trek/ Sci-Fi premise of asking "big questions" while inserting T&A and character melodrama. (Granted it started to be less and less of the first and more of the latter two)

 Nu-Trek as a whole said, "Fuck that, Michael Bay has it right. Explosions, thin stories to get us places and fuck whatever logic there is. We need blockbusters and we need more of them!" 

It's the same problem the Prequels had. Abandoning what the earlier work was about, to chase something the property wasn't.

Wars has never been more than the movies to me. The EU was a distraction, fluffy entertainment. The SW movies were all about spectacle and a convoluted story arc of 'convenient coincidence' and as much logic as greek myths.  The Hero's Journey.  Trying to make it more is what hurt the prequels the most, believing in its own hype.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 07:06:59 AM by Merusk »

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Riggswolfe
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Reply #298 on: July 23, 2014, 07:04:35 AM

Long time trek fan and I don't hate the JJverse as a whole.  It's nice to have a new take on the classics but they are just way too action oriented to be good trek.  Of course hollywood WANTS big action films and tried pushing the TNG movies into it which failed horribly for many reason but primarily because TNG was NOT an action series to begin with.   The new trek films have been action movies from the get go and while that was fine for at least the first film in that "oh look, this is new and exciting!" way, it got old fast and as soon as they started retreading the most popular stuff (khaaaaaaaan!) but ya know, actiony, that's when people threw in the towel.

Nothing is wrong with either JJtrek movies on paper but they are just grimdark action movies that no one asked for.  Also, tribble blood revived kirk from the dead, so there's that.

I think the first one is exactly what Trek needed. It was getting stale to be blunt. Sure it had lens flares and some plot inconsistencies but it was the best Trek movie since First Contact and the best thing in Trek in general since Ds9 IMO. The 2nd one would have been 1000X better if John Harrison was just John Harrison, didn't have magical blood and they didn't feel the need to redo the end of the best Trek movie but just switch the roles. Also, they started out making him somewhat sympathetic and intriguing as a character then went "RAWR I'M EVUL!" at the end which just sucked. I think it would have been much more interesting if they made it so he represented a moral crisis for Kirk and the crew. They should have kept the Admiral as the villain and made John Harrison a man who did something very wrong but for the right reasons.

Anyway, back to Star Wars. JJ needs to put out a trailer! I saw Kevin Smith's 10 minute talk about his set visit and it's hard not to get excited after listening to him talk about how tactile everything is and how JJ 'gets it'.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
Ironwood
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Reply #299 on: July 23, 2014, 07:11:17 AM


The 2nd one had some good moments but went off the rails towards the end which isn't surprising with Damon Lindwhatever writing it.


I'd say it went off the rails about five minutes in, but hey ho.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Khaldun
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Reply #300 on: July 23, 2014, 08:04:47 AM

I'm reasonably interested in what the new SW films will be. I think the property is closer to Abrams' heart and talents. And in some ways there's a clearer template out there of what good Star Wars is and what bad Star Wars is that should hopefully guide this along. Plus they're also doing a good job of getting some different people in the door to direct and write further down the line so it's not just JJ Abrams and his two scriptwriter goons.

Disney has its weaknesses but one thing that they do sort of seem to understand at this point is how to nurture franchises.
01101010
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Reply #301 on: July 23, 2014, 08:19:39 AM


 Nu-Trek as a whole said, "Fuck that, Michael Bay has it right. Explosions, thin stories to get us places and fuck whatever logic there is. We need blockbusters and we need more of them!" 

It's the same problem the Prequels had. Abandoning what the earlier work was about, to chase something the property wasn't.

Wars has never been more than the movies to me. The EU was a distraction, fluffy entertainment. The SW movies were all about spectacle and a convoluted story arc of 'convenient coincidence' and as much logic as greek myths.  The Hero's Journey.  Trying to make it more is what hurt the prequels the most, believing in its own hype.

I am interested in the new SW, but only mildly because of this reason. I have zero faith that Abrams will do anything more than a blockbuster space action movie in the Star Wars setting - just as he did with the Trek movie. That is about the only thing tempering my enthusiasm. I hope it turns out to be much more, but recent history doesn't bode well. And this is not to say the original SW movies were masterpieces of film, but they had more substance IMHO.

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Reply #302 on: July 23, 2014, 08:42:16 AM

Yes, but what will be the Mystery Box for these films?
eldaec
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Reply #303 on: July 23, 2014, 09:15:02 AM

Did someone just use the phrase "the best trek movie since First Contact"? Because that seriously makes absolutely no sense.

But as others have said JJ Trek 1 was fun, JJ Trek 2 was a terrible movie and I say that as someone who gives zero fucks about trek continuity. It's just a bad film that fails as an action blockbuster regardless of how it compares to other trek films.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 09:20:30 AM by eldaec »

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Cyrrex
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Reply #304 on: July 23, 2014, 10:03:43 AM

The only Trek series I ever watched with any consistency was TNG, and I rather liked it.  Far more than the original.  That said, I just started watching Enterprise for the first time ever, and am about 10 shows into the first season.  I do not understand why people supposedly hate this one?  It is actually a bit less cheesy than some Trek, but in general it seems like it follows the basic templated.  And I like a few of the characters already.  So what is it that I am supposed to hate, exactly?

I am not being snarky, I am serious.  I have a high level of tolerance for continuity issues and general suspension of disbelief, so maybe that is why I am not getting it.  Or perhaps my neck lacks sufficient beardiness.

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Reply #305 on: July 23, 2014, 10:10:36 AM

The pandering really got on a lot of people's nerves.  "Hey, we have a hot lady vulcan. Let's find every opportunity to strip her down, oil her up and make her wear incredibly tight clothes."

Other than that I'm failing to remember the rest of the complaints.  I think some were centered around the hippy doctor with his animal cures. I remember that the underdog status of the Enterprise that rubbed people the wrong way. "Fuck this, we're Humans and The Federation should always be top dog"

Also the time war nonsense really got tiring.

The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
Cyrrex
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Reply #306 on: July 23, 2014, 10:14:13 AM

Wait...it is a bad thing to want the hot lady vulcan to be stripped down and oiled up?  I think I see where the divergence here is. 

"...maybe if you cleaned the piss out of the sunny d bottles under your desks and returned em, you could upgrade you vid cards, fucken lusers.." - Grunk
Numtini
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Reply #307 on: July 23, 2014, 10:17:40 AM

I never hated Enterprise, I just had way too much Trek-Fatigue at that point and there was nothing particularly great about it either. We watched the first season, maybe into the second and drifted off. I think it also suffered from not having a tight story arc, something that I just take for granted these days in SFF shows and have since B5. Voyager is the one I really couldn't stand, but it was still mostly just because it was "meh"and I'd just as soon they warp into a sun for all I cared about the characters.

I really dislike the new movies because they're just not Trek to me. I think his talents will be far better suited to SW.

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Draegan
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Reply #308 on: July 23, 2014, 10:22:14 AM

Enterprise was really terrible early on. But towards the end it was actually pretty decent. Shame the good episodes came when they knew the show was being cancelled. The new Trek movies were pretty good. I enjoyed them. Not amazing, but fun.
Nebu
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Reply #309 on: July 23, 2014, 10:32:52 AM

The new Trek movies were pretty good. I enjoyed them. Not amazing, but fun.

Compared to the last three Star Wars movies, the latest Trek films were Oscar candidates.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 09:20:22 PM by Nebu »

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Reg
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Reply #310 on: July 23, 2014, 10:37:37 AM

I think it was season 3 of Enterprise with the Space Nazis that really killed the show. Season 4 was actually good and probably should have saved it if it hadn't already been cancelled.
Riggswolfe
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Reply #311 on: July 23, 2014, 01:56:18 PM

Enterprise had a good cast but the writing was just shitty. I remember the episode with the Orion slave girls about made me sprain my eyes from rolling them so hard. "So, the Orion slave girls actually run the entire Orion government and lots of other stuff too." That was just a level of stupid I couldn't tolerate and felt like utter PC bullshit. "We can't have slavegirls...uhhh....they're secretly in charge!"

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
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Reply #312 on: July 23, 2014, 03:43:07 PM

Enterprise had a good cast but the writing was just shitty. I remember the episode with the Orion slave girls about made me sprain my eyes from rolling them so hard. "So, the Orion slave girls actually run the entire Orion government and lots of other stuff too." That was just a level of stupid I couldn't tolerate and felt like utter PC bullshit. "We can't have slavegirls...uhhh....they're secretly in charge!"

Slave-run governments exist in our own history, it's not a real stretch to imagine them existing elsewhere: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mamluk

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Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #313 on: July 23, 2014, 03:46:40 PM

Enterprise was just one big fan wank.  I remember in the first episode it was supposed to be this cool low-tech space cowboy shit.  Discovering the universe, making mistakes along the way while being the underdog.  Then in the second episode "oh look we invented photon torpedoes!"  and it just got worse from there.  They couldn't stand a new concept for more than 60minutes.

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Reply #314 on: July 23, 2014, 08:11:17 PM

Nothing is wrong with either JJtrek movies on paper

No, actually paper is where EVERYTHING is wrong with them, at least as far as Into Darkness goes. It was an idiotic script with really very terrible fan wank service to good spots in Trek history that went horribly horribly wrong because the people writing it didn't really give a shit about Trek and though that if they just mentioned tribbles and did the KHAAAAN!!!! thing and had a character die then come back only reverse who it was that somehow it would be ok.

Into Darkness was a well-filmed adaptation of a SUPREMELY shitty script. It isn't even that they didn't respect the material, they didn't respect the audience. It was big, loud and dumb.

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