Sooooo....Dragon Age

[Tarami]

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?elfporn

I guess you'll have to sign up then.

[Merusk]

Without elves there are no elf tits. And that's just sad.

Still bitter they took down Elf Porn, are we?

They did?  Huh, I knew but forgot I guess. I brought back the avatar out of nostalgia.   It's ok we have World of Whorecraft for our girls with fake ears fetishists.

[caladein]

... I just noticed your avatar had elf ears.  And you switched from the Kasumi one ages ago.

I don't really know how to deal with this revelation.

[Merusk]

What, that the avatar is from the old Elf Porn website or that I switched avatars a long while ago?

... Wait. No, I wasn't being self-referential with the fake ear fetish.

[caladein]

The revelations were either: a) "Oooh, elf ears." or b) "How did I not notice the ears after all this time?" or c) "What does it all mean?"  Bonus revelation, the word "fetishists".

[Velorath]

Alpha Protocol was recently announced to be an October release, so it looks like we could be getting a Bioware RPG and an Obsidian RPG this Fall.  A new trailer for Alpha Protocol was also released.

[fatboy]

So I decided to check up on Dragon Age today, and noticed that Bioware announced an October 20 release date.

Now I know what Santa will be bringing me for an early Christmas gift.   

[Brogarn]

I'm desperately trying to keep my hopes from getting too high with this. I'm also trying to ignore what Bioware's marketing department has been doing for the game. I don't hate Marilyn Manson but those ads are fucking ridiculous.

[Vash]

That's why you watch the version with Hawaii 5-O theme music, pretty hilarious and fits the trailer quite well.   

[WindupAtheist]

Holy shit, they really may as well have named this game Generic RPG. I watched that silly Marilyn Manson ad and I started yawning as soon as I heard the Generic Inspirational Speech about how they will defeat "the blight". Which I'm guessing is actually the Blight(tm), Generic Evil Legion of Doom. You know, like the Horde or the Scourge or whatever. Also, yeah, that chick in a bikini sure was scandalous. I think my monocle popped out.

[rk47]

Bioware will always be bioware.

A dark storyline set in a dark world where you have a chance to make dark decisions to overturn the ultimate darkness that threatens to consume the darkened lands. Experience jealousy as you develop romance between party members and it may develop into something deeper than your left hand in a dark basement.

[Tarami]

Or you could say that they're trying too hard?

[WindupAtheist]

At least it will likely have action combat instead of shit-tastic AD&D "Save vs Fucked failed, load saved game" combat. Between the two of them, Bioware and Bethesda seem to be destroying the whole "RPGs must have shitty slow-paced fighting" trope.

[AutomaticZen]

At least it will likely have action combat instead of shit-tastic AD&D "Save vs Fucked failed, load saved game" combat. Between the two of them, Bioware and Bethesda seem to be destroying the whole "RPGs must have shitty slow-paced fighting" trope.

Isn't it just using the KOTOR combat system?  Pause, move your guys around, queue up some moves, unpause and watch the fireworks?

[rk47]

Don't think action combat works with a bad party AI. I'm struggling to remember the last time I played with a great party based AI. Even Diablo only had a semi-retarded henchmen. KOTOR combat was a simple 'buff & win' so it doesn't really count as much.

[WindupAtheist]

A plain old d20 system would be nice and generic, but I had hoped for better.

Edit:  As far as I know Bioware has never made a bad RPG, but they should fire their marketing people and give this game a new name.

[UnSub]

At least it will likely have action combat instead of shit-tastic AD&D "Save vs Fucked failed, load saved game" combat. Between the two of them, Bioware and Bethesda seem to be destroying the whole "RPGs must have shitty slow-paced fighting" trope.

I'm on forums where people are lamenting the loss of "old-school RPG gaming" to "twitch-based consoletards". There are a vocal group for who slow combat was an integral part of RPG gaming.

[rk47]

It wasn't the slowness they wanted, they wanted tactical depth. Something akin to a board game on PC that automates the dice roll but give rise to multiple approach in combat. This is done very well in Temple of Elemental Evil with turn based system and D&D rule implemented.

[Ingmar]

ToEE is held back by some interface problems, I think.

I admit I tend to prefer the slower pace when it comes to games that involve significant melee combat - neither Mass Effect nor Fallout 3 do, so the faster shootery feel is better there, but I think the faster paced 'click button swing sword' thing is a big part of why Oblivion fell kind of flat for me. It works for Diablo-like games, but for whatever reason it just feels really lame in first person.

[Sky]

I like both and my only fear is that we end up with neither, just a shitty washed down hybrid of the two. Which is more or less where we are now.

[CmdrSlack]

I like both and my only fear is that we end up with neither, just a shitty washed down hybrid of the two. Which is more or less where we are now.

Would you count Fallout 3 as the hybrid? Or just very shooter-ey? I kind of like the ability to use a system like VATS. I remember not digging Morrowind too much because of the first person melee without something like VATS. The combat style in games like BG and BG II was pretty nice, and my preferred method. (Fallout and Fallout 2 as well.)

For some reason, I really like the ability to pause and issue orders (or at least aim at the enemy) before the fight continues.

For less deep storyline games (Bioshock had a good story, but was mainly a shooter), the lack of a pause is just fine.

[Malakili]

At least it will likely have action combat instead of shit-tastic AD&D "Save vs Fucked failed, load saved game" combat. Between the two of them, Bioware and Bethesda seem to be destroying the whole "RPGs must have shitty slow-paced fighting" trope.

I'm on forums where people are lamenting the loss of "old-school RPG gaming" to "twitch-based consoletards". There are a vocal group for who slow combat was an integral part of RPG gaming.

I think there is definitely an appeal to the slow combat.  Sure, it isn't pulse pounding or exciting, but there is definitely something to be said for a more tacitcal slower based RPG combat.  I mean, I like action games too, but if its going to be die-roll based, I want to be able to position and hem and haw over ability use. 

[WindupAtheist]

Give me Fable with a little more fighting game mixed in, and decent AI for party members. This other shit can shuffle off to wherever they keep the hex-based wargames these days.

[Koyasha]

Yeah, the fast pace games keep pushing toward isn't really that great because it removes tactical considerations and a lot of the strategic thought simply because you don't have time to do much.  It also makes it so you have to limit the amount of abilities a character has at their disposal, since the player doesn't have time to consider each of their abilities and decide which to use.  Most fast-paced games give you button-press combos to activate different but still rather similar abilities, and most players simply can't memorize very many of them, much less all of them AND tactically choose which to use in an intelligent manner from moment-to-moment.  Most people end up picking a few combos they like and sticking to them.

[Kail]

For less deep storyline games (Bioshock had a good story, but was mainly a shooter), the lack of a pause is just fine.

I don't know that I'd really tie "has a storyline" with "has a pause function" that tightly together.  Unless the combat is tied in with the story somehow (and it almost never is), there's no reason one would impact the other.

[Tannhauser]

BG and Icewind Dales have good storylines and pause button.  Just sayin'.

[squirrel]

I'm still excited for it - I'm sure the actual game will be top-shelf as others mention. But the generic title, trailer and descriptions are sig worthy...

[Mrbloodworth]

Without elves there are no elf tits. And that's just sad.

Are they some how different than humans?

[Xuri]

They're more pointy? Or wait, that was the ears. Hm.

[rk47]

Without elves there are no elf tits. And that's just sad.

Are they some how different than humans?

at least i'm spared from this epic inter-racial romance

[Slyfeind]

I admit I tend to prefer the slower pace when it comes to games that involve significant melee combat - neither Mass Effect nor Fallout 3 do, so the faster shootery feel is better there, but I think the faster paced 'click button swing sword' thing is a big part of why Oblivion fell kind of flat for me. It works for Diablo-like games, but for whatever reason it just feels really lame in first person.

I think it's all about the moves. Ultimately these things in the game aren't us, so we're really witnessing other people doing what we tell them to. Swinging a sword is more a bodily experience, so if you're not doing it yourself, it can seem a bit silly watching over someone's shoulder. But if you're watching it happen from afar, you get to see the whole body work together, and thus empathize more with the action.

Ranged weapons like firearms are a bit different. They're more a "death button" kind of thing, where you press a button and whatever you're looking at is dead. From that perspective, a closer viewpoint is more immersive.

[vos]

I think it's all about the moves. Ultimately these things in the game aren't us, so we're really witnessing other people doing what we tell them to. Swinging a sword is more a bodily experience, so if you're not doing it yourself, it can seem a bit silly watching over someone's shoulder. But if you're watching it happen from afar, you get to see the whole body work together, and thus empathize more with the action.

Ranged weapons like firearms are a bit different. They're more a "death button" kind of thing, where you press a button and whatever you're looking at is dead. From that perspective, a closer viewpoint is more immersive.

Could it be that it's a matter of perspective enforced in other media types?

In many movies you often see from the sniper's perspective, and will see the kill shots in a first person view. However, with sword fighting it is almost always a third person view. (In fact I can't ever think of a time when a movie/tv show has shown 1st person with a sword)

Another factor might be than many people (at least in America) have at least fired guns at targets. Granted I grew up in Oklahoma, where it's difficult to find someone who hasn't fired a gun, I'm sure someones experience in an area without gun culture would be different.  Even a toy gun shooting a dart at a target would help with this effect. Whereas perhaps only people who have tried fencing, have any idea of what handling a sword is like and only one style at that. I'm not sure that toy swords have the same effect that a toy gun would even have.

Admittedly, I've always thought even knifing people in FPS games looked and felt weird too, so it might just be my personal bias.

[Merusk]

Without elves there are no elf tits. And that's just sad.

Are they some how different than humans?

They're immune to gravity. No sag.

[Slyfeind]

Could it be that it's a matter of perspective enforced in other media types?

I think it's the same thing. We don't see first-person sword fights because they'd just be shaky shots of someone's face going 'WAAUUGGHH' a lot. I want to see Obi-Wan do backflips, not watch the scenery get blurry for a while.

[dusematic]

This isn't Voltaire. If elves don't exist we don't need to create them.

lol.  quote worthy.