Warhammer ends quarter with 300,000 paying subscibers

[columba]

I don't believe that it makes financial sense for EA to attempt to save that game.  Its problems are too fundamental.  A flawed game engine, poorly designed zones, pve focused endgame and chronically unbalanceable classes.  Fixing it will cost millions and will likely generate far less cash than the cost.  This is a business not a charity.

[Threash]

I have always said that I'll be the first to give them a pat on the back when they do something right. They're doing something right. That's good. It's to be commended. Mind you, it's okay to laugh about it happening all of two weeks after Jacobs gets shitcanned the same way it was okay to laugh about Conan doing the exact same thing two weeks after Gaute was.

They really aren't though.  This changes were supposed to be on the last patch but got pulled because of massive concerns about balance.  Nerfing EVERY SINGLE AoE ability in exactly the same manner is incredibly fucking retarded.  Its not blackguards wiping out whole warbands with their AoE, its not marauders that need nerfing (fucking AoE detaunt is now MELEE RANGE), it wasnt war priests using smite that was the problem.  This is a huge fucking mistake, they are taking a sledgehammer to something that requires a scalpel, the last time this patch was pulled they promised instead they would look at EACH INDIVIDUAL ability and adjust them as needed.  Instead all they've done is nerf everything by a set number, and call it a day.

[Modern Angel]

They fired their entire QA staff. Whatcha gonna do?

I got curious and looked over the old suggested changes and these seem more in tune with what people want though the AE change is a bit off.

[amiable]

I know your missing the point. If Mythic had real balls then they would have stopped the progression at tier 2. But they didn't so here is what is wrong with the game. RVR is boring, not everyone who found WAR enjoyable in tiers 1-2 found it fun because you can steam roll people in rvr lakes, it was because you could pve and the scenarios were fun to play and was not treated as a method to grind xp/rr. When you hit tier 3 and finally tier 4 only 1 game type is supported by WAR and that is keep seiges. By that time you run out of pve to slog through and scenarios are blatantly only exist as a tool to grind. People avoided doing rvr because rvr is boring, and when you ask all 500k subscribers to bang their dick against a castles door or leave then it should be no surprised they left. Adding incentives to bang dick against doors keeps the current player base and aids in Mythics survival mode for WAR. Actually providing something else for players to do not only saves WAR but provides a playerbase rvr actually needs to survive. Age of Conan could have closed all pve severs and added full loot on death and would have kept 50k subs and paid the light bill that way. But Funcom decided that making money is kinda important so they decided that people might actually want to do something besides ganking each other. Fuck EVE supports a playstyle besides camping warp gates.

Thank you, I will no longer confuse your posts with someone who knows what the hell they are talking about.

[Typhon]

they promised instead they would look at EACH INDIVIDUAL ability and adjust them as needed.  Instead all they've done is nerf everything by a set number, and call it a day.

To MA's point, this is something that a business that is struggling with staff reductions would do.

They need to decouple the scenarios from RvR and have them pull from the full WAR population to minimize the queue times.  If they blunt the impact of CC, the scenarios are fun and can sustain the existing population enough to give them time to figure out how to make RvR entertaining.  Decoupling PvE from RvR would be the next FUCKING OBVIOUS thing to do.

After that, they are pretty much stuck with a bunch of bad design choices.  1v1 RvR seems inherently susceptible to population imbalances.  The only fix I can even imagine having a halfway decent chance of being successful is if there were some means of temporarily augmenting a conflict (keep offense/defense) with population from the total population pool - let's call it "reinforcements".

[nurtsi]

I just logged back in with the 10 free trial thingy. Getting stuck inside torches in Keeps in T2, unable to unstuck since I'm in combat. UI settings cannot be saved, but you have to manually edit the XML file on your harddisk if you want to adjust your settings. The game won't even start if your desktop resolution is different from the one you selected in game... Fucking amateur hour.

[columba]

I just logged back in with the 10 free trial thingy. Getting stuck inside torches in Keeps in T2, unable to unstuck since I'm in combat. UI settings cannot be saved, but you have to manually edit the XML file on your harddisk if you want to adjust your settings. The game won't even start if your desktop resolution is different from the one you selected in game... Fucking amateur hour.

This made me chuckle, especially the last line.  Seriously, does mythic even HAVE quality control, or do they leave it to the players to do their dirty work?

[DLRiley]

Thank you, I will no longer confuse your posts with someone who knows what the hell they are talking about.

Just as long as there isn't another rvr game being made that isn't wow with asian graphics i'm happy.

[amiable]

Thank you, I will no longer confuse your posts with someone who knows what the hell they are talking about.

Just as long as there isn't another rvr game being made that isn't wow with asian graphics i'm happy.

After WAR's crashing and burning I suspect you may get your wish.

[Soln]

we can expect EA's Q1 earnings presentation by July 28 or 29th. Maybe Paul will host?  do a dance?  WAUUGGH!

[UnSub]

I don't believe that it makes financial sense for EA to attempt to save that game. 

Ultimately that is what is going to kill WAR. If breakeven is 500k players and they are struggling to make 300k, WAR is going to die even if the devs do everything right from here on in. When they do switch the servers off, players are going to rant that WAR had turned the corner, with Jacobs gone things were improving, that if they only leave it running a bit longer things will be fixed (just like with TR). However, the truth (unless EA is making killer profits elsewhere it needs to hide, so WAR serves as a nice buffer for that) is that it can't be making enough money to pay back its development costs.

Assuming that Jacobs was accurate with his figures, of course. And I think he was, because he really wanted to boast about how much money got poured into WAR and how big the player base was going to be.

we can expect EA's Q1 earnings presentation by July 28 or 29th. Maybe Paul will host?  do a dance?  WAUUGGH!

Barnett's a rock star, so I expect an 8 minute guitar solo while he's dressed only in sliver sequinned pants.

[columba]

I don't believe that it makes financial sense for EA to attempt to save that game. 

Ultimately that is what is going to kill WAR. If breakeven is 500k players and they are struggling to make 300k, WAR is going to die even if the devs do everything right from here on in. When they do switch the servers off, players are going to rant that WAR had turned the corner, with Jacobs gone things were improving, that if they only leave it running a bit longer things will be fixed (just like with TR). However, the truth (unless EA is making killer profits elsewhere it needs to hide, so WAR serves as a nice buffer for that) is that it can't be making enough money to pay back its development costs.

Assuming that Jacobs was accurate with his figures, of course. And I think he was, because he really wanted to boast about how much money got poured into WAR and how big the player base was going to be.

we can expect EA's Q1 earnings presentation by July 28 or 29th. Maybe Paul will host?  do a dance?  WAUUGGH!

Barnett's a rock star, so I expect an 8 minute guitar solo while he's dressed only in sliver sequinned pants.

I doubt Jacobs really knew the breakeven point.  Even if the breakeven point were 300k, EA would still not be smart to put more money into this, because they need a decent return on the incremental investment from here forward.  In other words, they'd need well above breakeven subs to pay out the investment to fix the game.  No one in their right mind would expect even a fixed version of this game to garner that.

Paul would probably dress like a slayer to do the conference call.  I never trusted that guy.  LOL, he didn't even enjoy pvp.  I have no idea what his job was, other than to bilk customers out of their hard earned money.

[ghost]

Even if the breakeven point were 300k, EA would still not be smart to put more money into this, because they need a decent return on the incremental investment from here forward. 

This is pretty much the key.  EA has been having too much trouble financially to have a boat anchor like WAR dragging their resources down.  I'm sure they would much rather have their talent working on something that could have a huge ROI, e.g. KOTOR MMO, versus having them work on a project that is barely breaking even. 

[DLRiley]

So Daoc and Ultima Online gets sacrificed before the alter of SWTOR? 

[Hawkbit]

The sad part of this is that reading these threads over the past few days is making me want to play through T1 Greenskin again.  But I know how that book ends, with me unsubbing because of mid-T2. 

[Shatter]

So Daoc and Ultima Online gets sacrificed before the alter of SWTOR? 

Yes, bow before your new god

[Der Helm]

The sad part of this is that reading these threads over the past few days is making me want to play through T1 Greenskin again.  But I know how that book ends, with me unsubbing because of mid-T2. 

Everytime someone posts this, I scratch my head and ask myself what exactly was so much fun about T1.

I played the free trial and none of the starter areas I tried and none of the classes yelled "FUN!" at me.

If found the whole experience bland and uninteresting and the combat just infuriating unresponsive.

I had more fun in LOTRO during me free trial, and I liked the combat better.

What did I do wrong ?

[Nebu]

Everytime someone posts this, I scratch my head and ask myself what exactly was so much fun about T1.

Accessible pvp.  Little to no CC.  Decent balance, particularly among groups.  Rapid progression.  Small, but fun maps.  

For us ex-DAoC players, it feels like Thid v2.0

[tazelbain]

I really loved the chaos starter area.

[Hindenburg]

Accessible pvp.  Little to no CC.  Decent balance, particularly among groups.

After the second alt, you start to realize that all of that only applies from levels 8 to 10. 1-7 is pretty much /yawn.

[Nebu]

After the second alt, you start to realize that all of that only applies from levels 8 to 10. 1-7 is pretty much /yawn.

True.  I argued near release that the game could be boiled down to 12 levels since the 3 nearest cap for each tier are the only levels that are relevent. 

[Hawkbit]

Everytime someone posts this, I scratch my head and ask myself what exactly was so much fun about T1.

Accessible pvp.  Little to no CC.  Decent balance, particularly among groups.  Rapid progression.  Small, but fun maps.  

For us ex-DAoC players, it feels like Thid v2.0

It was most fun in beta, because all the players were focused in one area, so PQs were overflowing with people.  The two biggest failings (imo) of WAR was the grind to get to 40 and they built too much land for too few players.  If they had made it so leveling a 40 casually took 3-4 weeks, they would have retained me for at least a few months so I could play through a few classes.  All the ward gear shit could have sorted itself out later.  Hell, wasn't even necessary. 

[Threash]

If they really go through with that blanket AoE nerf i don't see them surviving.  A lot of classes that have been expecting fixes for a LONG time getting nerfed instead in order to correct a problem with a few overpowered abilities will kill whatever little patience most players have left.

[waffel]

Aaaand the 1.3.whateverthefuck patch goes from test to live!

You may have read the Producer's Letter from yesterday (if not check it out!) and thought to yourself "How long am I going to have to wait to sink my teeth into 1.3.0b?"

The answer? As long as it takes you to patch your PTS client! (How to access the PTS Server)

To make things a bit more exciting, we've also turned on the Return to Nordenwatch weekend event, so no matter what Rank you are, you can duke it out in this beloved Scenario as you get back to basics and tell us what you think on the 1.3.0b Public Test Forums!

It's been about a month since 1.3 rolled your way and we started discussing "The future of WAR." Since you've been fighting in the sands and exploring the ancient Necropolis of Zandri and Tomb of the Vulture Lord, we've been working tirelessly to bring some of our goals to life.

1.3.0b primarily focuses on Combat & Career changes with an emphasis on area-of-effect and crowd control abilities, in addition to delivering the revised Mastery trees and improvements for the Archmage and Shaman. To top it all off, we've got a host of other tasty changes to better sate your appetite.

We're not done yet though, and this is only one step of many we have planned for accomplishing the goals we set out to achieve with the release of 1.3. So, read on for the 1.3.0b PTS Highlights and Patch Notes, and join us for the PTS of 1.3.0b. Be sure to visit the official forums to share your feedback and help to squash any bugs you come across!

After 4 days of testing massive AOE changes and they roll the retard onto the stage. Brilliant!

[Der Helm]

1-7 is pretty much /yawn.

Ah. That must have been it, never got past level 5 or 6 I think, PvP was not fun at this level and PvE progression already felt slooooow.

Also the crazy timer that delayed every action from using an ability to opening my inventory or a menu made for a very sluggish feeling play experience.

[Hindenburg]

After 4 days of testing massive AOE changes and they roll the retard onto the stage. Brilliant!

Readind is a bit hard today, I take it?

[Lum]

After 4 days of testing massive AOE changes and they roll the retard onto the stage. Brilliant!

Readind is a bit hard today, I take it?

The Herald headline is 1.3.0b Public Test Server - Now Live!. The mistake at first glance is understandable, though it's pretty obvious in the actual notes that they're talking about a new test build.

[Hayduke]

After 4 days of testing massive AOE changes and they roll the retard onto the stage. Brilliant!

Readind is a bit hard today, I take it?

The Herald headline is 1.3.0b Public Test Server - Now Live!. The mistake at first glance is understandable, though it's pretty obvious in the actual notes that they're talking about a new test build.

He's actually not wrong.  He simply posted the wrong link.  There's nothing on the herald yet, but this is on the PTS forums.

PTS going down in preparation for Live update

Our Game Update 1.3.0b Public Test has come to a close, and Warpstone is currently down in preparation for the launch of 1.3.0b this week.

 
Thank you to everyone who participated in the 1.3.0b Public Test. Your feedback and contribution is much appreciated.

[Modern Angel]

Really, is there anything to lose at this point?

[Der Helm]

Really, is there anything to lose at this point?

Honour ?

Dignitiy ?

Their paycheck ?


... who am I kidding... 

[columba]

I found this on the OF from Andy.  It looks as though they do intend to push this live, soon.

"Folks,
Before I lock this thread It's important to reiterate on what we've said.
These changes needed to occur before we could rationally adjust the abilities of careers. AoE's were far too cost to benefit effective across the board. Each careers abilities were adjust by hand, but a global reduction of AoE effectiveness needed to occur for us to get anywhere."

I dont' really get this.  If they can adjust each ability by hand and did so already, why don't they pursue that path vs. the global nerf?  Presumably they could make larger changes to the most problematic skills.

[Shatter]

THey need to clarify better.

AE Heals = reduced from x range to y range(Class ilrelevant)
AE Morale cone dmg = reduced from x degrees to Y degrees(Class ilrelevant)
PBAOE dmg = reduced from x range to y range(Class ilrelevant)
Ranged AE Dmg = reduced from x range to y range(Class ilrelevant)

By doing this they didnt go through each class, just the general ability type and nerf every class that uses it across the board. 

[Nebu]

By doing this they didnt go through each class, just the general ability type and nerf every class that uses it across the board. 

Yeah... many Marauders will be either quitting or rerolling to an OP class due to the lack of thought put into this patch. 

Another band-aid fix for a game that needs a heart transplant. 

[Shatter]

By doing this they didnt go through each class, just the general ability type and nerf every class that uses it across the board. 

Yeah... many Marauders will be either quitting or rerolling to an OP class due to the lack of thought put into this patch. 

Another band-aid fix for a game that needs a heart transplant. 

Them plus tanks.  A tanks job is largely to AE CC, its never been overpowered and its their job to protect healers, hold the line, etc.  They got nerfed and there was no need for it. 

[Kail]

Yeah... many Marauders will be either quitting or rerolling to an OP class due to the lack of thought put into this patch. 

Really?  I thought Marauders were more focused DPS than AOE; I know White Lions were, when I played.  A global AOE nerf would seem to me to make melee DPS more viable (less "ranged DPS chucks AOEs at front line, tanks get healed [in theory, anyway], melee DPS goes down again").