Patches 1.1a-d Have Arrived

[UnSub]

That original link didn't work - I found the post on page 20 here.

I agree with the poster who said "goodbye to the last shred of realm cohesion". While the change serves its technical purpose, it only makes those players valid who have hit lvl 40 - everyone else is GTFO.

So, Mythic has solved one issue (even temporarily) by creating at least 3 more - 1) getting booted to the warcamp is no fun, 2) getting booted because you aren't the right level is no fun and 3) it again destroys ORvR and the whole tier rank thing by making level the only thing that counts.

[ashrik]

YOU DIDN'T DESERVE THAT DEFENSE

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRR

[Bismallah]

So, Mythic has solved one issue (even temporarily) by creating at least 3 more - 1) getting booted to the warcamp is no fun, 2) getting booted because you aren't the right level is no fun and 3) it again destroys ORvR and the whole tier rank thing by making level the only thing that counts.

Yes, and what happens when most everyone is 40? You can add 4) Have half your group not get in because they were locked out with the cap

Awesomeness.

Have you guys seen the mess happening on Dark Crag? Hilarious. People getting randomly booted from their guild (graphical error?), Order cannot zone into Altdorf, Destro has Altdorf on farm status... it's all here: http://vnboards.ign.com/warhammer_online_age_of_reckoning_general_board/b22997/109906520/p1/?11

[Shatter]

I like the change, it keeps the lowbies out while the grown ups do the work.  Problem you get when a fortress is being assaulted is you get lowbies from all over coming to watch, basically not helping and causing additional lag.  This is a way to keep that under control, they even said if you were already in the zone and are <40 you can stay.  They are basically stopping a lowbie zerg on a fortress and thats good cause I want level 40's on the assault, not level 31's. 

[Nebu]

I like the change, it keeps the lowbies out while the grown ups do the work.  Problem you get when a fortress is being assaulted is you get lowbies from all over coming to watch, basically not helping and causing additional lag.  This is a way to keep that under control, they even said if you were already in the zone and are <40 you can stay.  They are basically stopping a lowbie zerg on a fortress and thats good cause I want level 40's on the assault, not level 31's. 

YOU MUST BE "THIS" TALL TO RIDE THIS RIDE!

If they didn't want level 31's participating, they could have installed any number of mechanisms to prevent it.  The selling feature of WAR was to be that levels mattered less because the gameplay was broken into four tiers.  Instead the game is devolving into the usual MMO faire where only those that have "earned" the priviledge to play the endgame, get to. 

It's a shitty solution to a problem that was created by a severe lack of forethought.

[rk47]

it's a temporary solution. And hardly 'comfortable'. There's no way of knowing if the siege is capped or not. Until you get kicked out. But when most of the players are 40, what then? Highest RR get to stay? I'm afraid they have to slowly instance the whole fortress siege.

I don't mind stepping aside to let people do this crap, because I couldn't give a damn about it. The fortress game sucked dick. It's a glorified keep siege with 3 outer doors and 3 stairs to climb. That's it. Nothing else except it unlocks capital siege if 2 of them are captured.

After that, onto an instance farming for Invader sets in Altdorf, where the RVR champs can reap the rewards of their hard earned war.
Congrats, you beat the game. Continue? 10

[Arthur_Parker]

Hardcore guild, all players with two accounts, have your low level Order alt log in at the fortress, log main Chaos character in, attack fortress.  1 less defender for every alt bot.

Debuff fortress defender bots replace DAoC buff bots.

[rk47]

Hardcore guild, all players with two accounts, have your low level Order alt log in at the fortress, log main Chaos character in, attack fortress.  1 less defender for every alt bot.

Debuff fortress defender bots replace DAoC buff bots.

The lower levels will get kicked out first. But if you're willing to grind to 40. Hell. I duno ? First come first served?

[Arthur_Parker]

I thought the low level kickout was still a bit buggy.

[Bismallah]

I like the change, it keeps the lowbies out while the grown ups do the work.  Problem you get when a fortress is being assaulted is you get lowbies from all over coming to watch, basically not helping and causing additional lag.  This is a way to keep that under control, they even said if you were already in the zone and are <40 you can stay.  They are basically stopping a lowbie zerg on a fortress and thats good cause I want level 40's on the assault, not level 31's. 

Ok, so for the 10th fucking time, what happens when everyone is 40 and "grown up"? Start booting randomly lower RR characters? Good idea! Let the "grown ups" fight it out...

Lowbie zerg, sigh. They paid for the game just like you did. So when you get blocked out of a Fort siege because another level 40 that has a higher RR then you takes your spot (ya know, when everyone is 40 and they have to put in another cap code) then be sure to remember what you said here. (assuming you still play by then)

[ghost]

I like the change, it keeps the lowbies out while the grown ups do the work.  Problem you get when a fortress is being assaulted is you get lowbies from all over coming to watch, basically not helping and causing additional lag.  This is a way to keep that under control, they even said if you were already in the zone and are <40 you can stay.  They are basically stopping a lowbie zerg on a fortress and thats good cause I want level 40's on the assault, not level 31's. 

YOU MUST BE "THIS" TALL TO RIDE THIS RIDE!

If they didn't want level 31's participating, they could have installed any number of mechanisms to prevent it.  The selling feature of WAR was to be that levels mattered less because the gameplay was broken into four tiers.  Instead the game is devolving into the usual MMO faire where only those that have "earned" the priviledge to play the endgame, get to. 

It's a shitty solution to a problem that was created by a severe lack of forethought.

Clearly by their initial server caps they didn't understand the populations that were necessary to even make their game run correctly.  It is a little staggering how screwed up the mechanics in this game are- with a cool $100 mil you should be able to come up with something that at least runs somewhat correctly on a global mechanistic level. 

Expect to see more of this.  they can't fix the game without essentially instancing the fortresses and, possibly, the keep takes too.

[Nebu]

Well, I still think the point I made a couple pages ago stands.  This is going to be a mechanic that will cause even more people to cancel their subs.  If you talk to people playing WAR currently, they fall into two factions: those that will stay through anything and those on the fence.  I think sub numbers will drop by another 20-30% in the next month or two due to this, especially as more people approach the level cap.

[ghost]

I think sub numbers will drop by another 20-30% in the next month or two due to this, especially as more people approach the level cap.

This may be a low estimate. 

[Bismallah]

Add more transfers in there too... along with the decreasing number of subs.

I thought I would be surprised if WAR dropped below DAOC, at peak, but that reality is starting to look very plausible.

[BitWarrior]

November 3, 2008 was the last time Mythic announced subscribers, which was the 800,000 number...and I think we had some debates about that. I didn't follow AoC so I don't know the answer to this question, but if a company has seen a massive drop in subscription numbers, do they ever announce it anymore?

[tazelbain]

They have never released subs, just registered users.  Which is useless since it includes people who quit.

[waylander]

I think sub numbers will drop by another 20-30% in the next month or two due to this, especially as more people approach the level cap.

Its pretty boring not being able to push the war to a capital city, and fortresses have been the bottlneck. Now I admit that zone control/VP issues are still bad, and doing all that work to see yourself set back via fortress crashes is very demoralizing.

Honestly they should instance the fortress fights, and make the minimum level 39. Too many times I've seen one side or the other just flood the zone with level 15's (or other lowbies) to force a crash and save their realm.

At this point I'll take any solution that allows fortresses to be captured while keeping out people who have no business being there or no hope of surviving the fight (i.e. anyone below level 39 and no ward gear).

[HaemishM]

keeping out people who have no business being there or no hope of surviving the fight (i.e. anyone below level 39 and no ward gear).

If this is true and not typical "IAMHARDCOREPK!" bravado, that signals a pretty epic failure in game design. No surprise really.

[Shatter]

So I heard the sky is falling, any input?  I know there will be cause this is the doom n gloom board!  lol you guys kill me

[Fraeg]

So I heard the sky is falling, any input?  I know there will be cause this is the doom n gloom board!  lol you guys kill me

ahh but it just may very well be:

"As globe warms, atmosphere may shrink.

With tongues nowhere near their cheeks, British scientists report this month that the sky is actually falling. Radar measurements show that the upper atmosphere has contracted since 1958, matching the predictions of greenhouse warming theory. "

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/As+globe+warms,+atmosphere+may+shrink-a021227591

Humor aside, I think even the most optimistic of people would recognize that Mythic is having serious fucking issues with getting WAR to where they want it to be (and hopefully that is somewhere that the playerbase also wants to be).

[Evildrider]

keeping out people who have no business being there or no hope of surviving the fight (i.e. anyone below level 39 and no ward gear).

If this is true and not typical "IAMHARDCOREPK!" bravado, that signals a pretty epic failure in game design. No surprise really.

Yes because the other side spamming in chat to get whoever they can to the zone to help crash it is much better then kicking out the underleveled that shouldn't be there.

Also without the required wards you are going to be 1-2 shot in there anyway.

[tazelbain]

Defending side doesn't need wards or did that change?

[Evildrider]

Nah defenders don't need wards. 

But you also don't need as many defenders as you do attackers.

Once again though, either side with too many numbers could crash the zone in the old system.  The new system isn't great but its somewhat of a band-aid at least.  They still need to  do more.

[Nebu]

So I heard the sky is falling, any input?  I know there will be cause this is the doom n gloom board!  lol you guys kill me

You keep saying things like this, but when called on your statements you lack any type of reply.  I'm still waiting for your recommendation of a mature and insightful forum for WAR information. 

If you can't see the problems that WAR is facing you're blind.  EA/Mythic invested 10's of millions in this title with the goal of maintaining 500k + subs for years.  How do you propose to spin their epic failure into a good thing?  We're not doomsayers... we just call it like we see it.

[Jherad]

From the patcher:

Experience Enhancements - Phase V:
01/9/2009

It's been a while since we've done a round of experience enhancements but with the new year comes some good news for those players working their way through Tier 3 and eager to join their friends in Fortress raids and capital city sieges.

We are pleased to announce the fifth phase of our ongoing experience enhancements. In response to the valuable feedback of many players, we have reduced the required experience needed to attain ranks 20 through 33. As a result, it will now take you less time to advance through Tier 3 and the earliest ranks of Tier 4.

We hope you will enjoy the brisk new pace of advancement, as well the many challenges and rewards that await you in Tier 4!

[schild]

We'll find out what brisk is soon, I suppose. I don't think their definition falls in line with what I said... in what, September? Maybe it was October.

[Arthur_Parker]

linky

Yet I could still do nothing but RvR and still level out of the tier before maxing influence. (starting at 22 and staying till 32)

/shrug

Can't really complain about them making it faster, but I don't hardly see how it could have been considered slow.

Hey I agree with ya, I never minded the leveling speed.  But then there are lots of other people that play this game, and they feel T3 is the slowest.  Nothing wrong with making more people happy ;)

Bingo! Couldn't agree more.

Mark

Just quoting because it's funny Mark now agrees that T3 is too slow, still I guess closing 54 servers kinda affects how you see things.

[Nebu]

From the patcher:

Experience Enhancements - Phase V:
01/9/2009

It's been a while since we've done a round of experience enhancements but with the new year comes some good news for those players working their way through Tier 3 and eager to join their friends in Fortress raids and capital city sieges.

We are pleased to announce the fifth phase of our ongoing experience enhancements. In response to the valuable feedback of many players, we have reduced the required experience needed to attain ranks 20 through 33. As a result, it will now take you less time to advance through Tier 3 and the earliest ranks of Tier 4.

We hope you will enjoy the brisk new pace of advancement, as well the many challenges and rewards that await you in Tier 4!

They have really learned nothing from DAoC.  This was the norm in DAoC for years... fast leveling from 1-40, slower to level 50.  I don't know why this wasn't the case at release and was dumbfounded when the game launched with a steeper xp curve than beta. 

[Arthur_Parker]

I don't know why this wasn't the case at release and was dumbfounded when the game launched with a steeper xp curve than beta. 

DAoC did that at release too, I think it's old EQ thinking combined with last minute release panic, the idea being slower leveling means more time to form bonds with other players and therefore aids retention.  Doesn't work because, lol Vanguard, players don't want to sit camping and chatting any more, also the more involving play style of WAR scenarios means people rarely chat anyway.

Slower leveling today just increases boredom and kills replay value through alts, which harms retention.  There's also the fact that it's a class based game, players pick a character class while pretty much clueless, if leveling speed puts them off rolling alts then there's less chance of them finding a different class that they might enjoy more.  But even if they fixed it, the gear grind and population problems would still put people of alts, I think there's a real chance EA might pull the plug on this in 18 months or so.

[Fordel]

You also fuck up any hope of having a quest based leveling system if you arbitrarily double the amount of total XP needed. "Hi I'm level 31 and I've exhausted all the quests in my tier, time to grind  "

[Modern Angel]

So I heard the sky is falling, any input?  I know there will be cause this is the doom n gloom board!  lol you guys kill me

Fuck you.

[Raguel]

From the patcher:

Experience Enhancements - Phase V:
01/9/2009

It's been a while since we've done a round of experience enhancements but with the new year comes some good news for those players working their way through Tier 3 and eager to join their friends in Fortress raids and capital city sieges.

We are pleased to announce the fifth phase of our ongoing experience enhancements. In response to the valuable feedback of many players, we have reduced the required experience needed to attain ranks 20 through 33. As a result, it will now take you less time to advance through Tier 3 and the earliest ranks of Tier 4.

We hope you will enjoy the brisk new pace of advancement, as well the many challenges and rewards that await you in Tier 4!

They have really learned nothing from DAoC.  This was the norm in DAoC for years... fast leveling from 1-40, slower to level 50.  I don't know why this wasn't the case at release and was dumbfounded when the game launched with a steeper xp curve than beta. 

It may be poor form to rag on a game one has never played, but before DAoC was released, the selling points IMO were rvr and levels didn't matter. However (1)levels mattered more than even in EQ, (2)the pve grind, while less than EQ, appeared to be worse because their pve was far more dull than EQ's, and (3)OMG who in the world thought crowd control in pvp was a good idea?

Now I read the major gripes with WAR and I get a feeling of deja vu.

[waffel]

juicyness

Folks,

   The first step in improving the oRvR experience of fortress taking went LIVE across all servers last night.  The good news is that there were lots of fortresses captured and defended.  The even better news is that there were no fortress-related crashes last night while these battles raged and were completed by the players.  Performance in these battles was also improved, but still not where we want it to be of course.  While this is a good start, continuing to improve the mechanisms behind these battles remains one of our top priorities now and going forward.  Over the next few weeks, we will be working on a number of initiatives that I can now talk about.

   First, the team will tweak the settings for the Fortress Lords to make sure that their power is in line with the current numbers of players expected to participate in the siege.  Second, the team will continue working on optimizing the code’s performance in large-scale battles so we can increase the population cap over the next few weeks.  Third, the team is looking at additional tweaking of the pop cap to ensure that it is where it needs to be in order to allow these battles to be as well-balanced (from a design perspective) as they can be.  In the end, it is up to the players to decide to defend and/or attack a fortress but it is our job to make sure that the pop cap is set properly to ensure that the maximum number of defenders/attackers that can *choose* to participate is set up so that if the population hits max cap (and assuming that both sides are equally powerful), neither side has an advantage over the other.  Most importantly, the team will also be looking at moving the fortress areas out to their own zones to allow an even a greater of number of players to participate, while also maintaining a high level of performance.  While they are doing that, they will also be looking at ways to enhance the fortress areas to take advantage of having their own dedicated zone.  This might also allow us to get slightly lower-level players into the action, either directly in the fortress sieges, and/or in supporting roles around the main action.  However, we won’t move the sieges into their own zones unless we are sure that we can get either some deign and/or performance improvements by doing so.

  As always, we appreciate your feedback, suggestions, patience, and participation as we continue to work on these issues and initiatives.  What we’ve done so far is only the first step and we have a lot more coming in the next few weeks.

  Oh, and expect a major announcement from us at the end of the month regarding our plans for the next few months and beyond.  It’s going to get even more interesting around these parts soon.[face_thinking]

Mark

Instancing all of the endgame? Oh how warhammer has fallen.

[Evildrider]

I think they mean that they'll move it from being connected to the T4 Tier.  Make you have to actually zone in instead of just crossing a boundary line.

[Lantyssa]

I think they mean that they'll move it from being connected to the T4 Tier.  Make you have to actually zone in instead of just crossing a boundary line.

You mean make it its own zone?  Like... an instance?