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Author Topic: Carbine Studios' "Wildstar"  (Read 979328 times)
Ginaz
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Reply #1260 on: December 13, 2013, 07:56:57 PM

It's ... it's a statement. Sorry if that's super-tease-y, but it's mostly meant as a neutral statement.  why so serious?

I know.  I was hoping for some more info but its difficult because of  NDA.
Lantyssa
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Reply #1261 on: December 13, 2013, 09:41:33 PM

Overall I think it's a good sign.  I'm always wary of a game with excessive hype, and if everyone is openly mocking an NDA'd game then it's worrying.

RIFT is kind of what I think of in this regard:  I  had a positive opinion of the game because I respected the work being done even though I knew the game wasn't going to be something I played.  These days that's almost the  most important thing to me after all the poor excuses we've seen released.

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
MediumHigh
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Reply #1262 on: December 13, 2013, 09:48:11 PM

We live in the internet age? Why go into anything cold when there's a million ways to get spoon fed, forked fed, chopstick fed information. Especially if we're dealing with jaded PC gamers who are quick to uninstall things that hit the "nope" moment early. The more discussion the more likely we are to play.
Threash
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Reply #1263 on: December 14, 2013, 08:29:47 AM

Seriously, this site doesn't do NDA breaking but anyone who wants info on any game can find it in a million places if they want it bad enough.

I am the .00000001428%
Falconeer
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Reply #1264 on: December 14, 2013, 01:52:05 PM

For example, I don't understand: is this guy breaking the NDA? Cause Twitch is sponsoring this stream, so I guess it's OK... or is it?

Evildrider
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Reply #1265 on: December 14, 2013, 02:40:11 PM

Some people got the ok to stream and release info on Wildstar.  I think it's only level 1-15 though.
MediumHigh
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Reply #1266 on: December 14, 2013, 03:05:56 PM

Seriously, this site doesn't do NDA breaking but anyone who wants info on any game can find it in a million places if they want it bad enough.

Only arguing that the NDA is really dumb considering where the internet is with expectations.
Venkman
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Reply #1267 on: December 14, 2013, 03:44:43 PM

Seriously, this site doesn't do NDA breaking but anyone who wants info on any game can find it in a million places if they want it bad enough.

Only arguing that the NDA is really dumb considering where the internet is with expectations.
I think the NDAs are dumb because of the internet itself. I'm sure marketing people think having one prevents rampant conversation from ruining expectations of potential buyers. But that really only works for annualized sequels and other such games that people buy for enjoyment but which don't include the emotional  attachments that MMOs do.

tl;dr: NDAs don't do anything for MMOs
koro
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Reply #1268 on: December 15, 2013, 08:52:59 AM

Paelos
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Reply #1269 on: December 15, 2013, 09:35:16 AM

I think the game is polished enough to not need the NDA either. The fact they have one in my mind is mostly because the game is similar to other things you've played so they don't want comparisons. That's my guess. I wasn't planning on playing it and my opinion hasn't changed.

CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
Threash
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Reply #1270 on: December 15, 2013, 10:19:34 AM


I am the .00000001428%
Wizgar
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Reply #1271 on: December 15, 2013, 10:29:17 AM


Holy shit, the races in this game are awful looking.

But yeah, someone writes one of these stupid articles about how game designers should waste their time rendering dumpy female models no one would pick every time one of these games comes out.
luckton
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Reply #1272 on: December 15, 2013, 10:52:29 AM

I think the game is polished enough to not need the NDA either. The fact they have one in my mind is mostly because the game is similar to other things you've played so they don't want comparisons. That's my guess. I wasn't planning on playing it and my opinion hasn't changed.

It has the polish, sure.  They're still trying to shine that polish in though.

Out of boredom, I binged on catching up on the last six weeks of class content drops they've been doing on the website.  The Engineer looks fun, and the Medic might actually pull off the DPS/healing hybrid thing that Bliz tried to do with the Monk (and ended up caving in, turning the heal-spec into yet another variation of a heal-bot).

http://www.wildstar-online.com/en/the-game/classes/

"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."

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Reply #1273 on: December 15, 2013, 11:14:52 AM


Venkman
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Reply #1274 on: December 15, 2013, 11:27:12 AM

I think they meant that it's retarded because there's well known reasons why it still occurs in the core video game industry.

And let's not assume this is just about video games.

The problem will perpetuate until the demographics of the development, publishing, and retail communities shifts a tad closer to gender balance, thus potentially expanding the market beyond the same core 18-34 male they've been selling to.

Until then we'll just have the same self-fulfilling prophecy that justifies these creative decisions based on the data being collected.
Nevermore
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Reply #1275 on: December 15, 2013, 12:01:31 PM

Is it that video games are marketed towards men because women don't play video games, which is the excuse always given for the hypersexualization of women in games, or could it be that less women play video games because they are marketed towards men?

Over and out.
Threash
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Reply #1276 on: December 15, 2013, 12:01:50 PM


Yes it is.  The number of people who want to play ugly females is extremely small, wasting time making characters for them that could be used on something else is dumb.

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Threash
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Reply #1277 on: December 15, 2013, 12:03:37 PM

Is it that video games are marketed towards men because women don't play video games, which is the excuse always given for the hypersexualization of women in games, or could it be that less women play video games because they are marketed towards men?

Most women don't want to play female dwarves or tauren either.  Given the choice between the current hot versions of those weird ass wildstar races and ugly counterparts most women would chose the hot ones.

I am the .00000001428%
Nevermore
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Reply #1278 on: December 15, 2013, 12:10:59 PM

Your mistake is thinking that the only choices available for developers are 'hot' or 'ugly'.

Over and out.
luckton
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Reply #1279 on: December 15, 2013, 12:13:03 PM

There's an easy fix here.  They just need to make female Chua.  No way in hell they could pull it off, unless they just broke the 4th wall, invoked the 34th rule, and, well, actually pull it off.   why so serious?

"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."

"Tuning me out doesn't magically change the design or implementation of said design. Though, that'd be neat if it did." -schild
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Reply #1280 on: December 15, 2013, 12:36:30 PM


Yes it is.  The number of people who want to play ugly females is extremely small, wasting time making characters for them that could be used on something else is dumb.

What Nevermore said. Clearly, you are not a valid interlocutor on this topic as you are biased and narrowminded. Between ignorant and idiot, your pick.

Samprimary
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Reply #1281 on: December 15, 2013, 02:05:55 PM

Wildstar clearly and blatantly engages in dimorphic and oversexualized female form objectification in its race models, beyond a stylized comic degree. We've all seen on their public press. And it's a problem for gaming in general, if one cares to look into it.

That said, that article is nuts. It's obsessively making the exact wrong argument — a sputtering, overly technical indignation that the sexual dimorphism of Wildstar's cartoon fantasy races is not grounded in realism and is not scientifically sound, and goes off about the potential combination of boobs on pseudo-reptilian bipeds with viviparity or on the Rock Bro race.
Nevermore
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Reply #1282 on: December 15, 2013, 02:13:25 PM

Are you saying boobs on reptiles, robots and especially on rock people isn't incredibly stupid?

Over and out.
Hoax
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Reply #1283 on: December 15, 2013, 02:28:06 PM

I'm saying you guys are incredibly stupid. This is a boring pathetic thing to complain about. Why aren't you wasting resources making models, textures and animations that satisfy how I think things should be!!! Waaaaaa.

Cry me a fucking river.

I know you think you have a moral imperative to cry that you aren't seeing what you want. But this conversation has no more value than people who cry about anime andro males or overly tiny cutesy races or there being no fat race or there being a fat race or no left handedness or not enough black people or WHATEVER. If you don't like it? Don't fucking play. But its not that you can't handle it, its that you enjoy feeling righteously outraged. Bravo. The internet totally needs more of this.

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
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Threash
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Reply #1284 on: December 15, 2013, 02:33:39 PM

Are you saying boobs on reptiles, robots and especially on rock people isn't incredibly stupid?

Biologically wise, sure.  Not stupid in the sense that it is clearly what the market, both male and female wants.

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Venkman
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Reply #1285 on: December 15, 2013, 02:38:05 PM


What Nevermore said. Clearly, you are not a valid interlocutor on this topic as you are biased and narrowminded. Between ignorant and idiot, your pick.

Is this the thread where we'll have a serious discussion about this? And are we qualified to, or are we reflective of the demographic of the industry itself?

Is it that video games are marketed towards men because women don't play video games, which is the excuse always given for the hypersexualization of women in games, or could it be that less women play video games because they are marketed towards men?
That's why I call it a self-fulfilling prophesy. By and large it's guys deciding what core video games to create, guys designing and developing them, guys at publishers and guys at retail (note I specifically am talking about core video games).

Did this evolve this way because it was mostly guys playing competitive arcade games on the Jersey shore and then guys buying the early generation Atari 2600, Intellivisions and Colecovisions such that it was guys growing up on competitive games and then wanting to work in the industry? Does this perpetuate because that much testosterone in any room is going to result in alienating people who don't fit into that culture's idealized vision of itself as depicted in the 80s action heroes they all create and market? Shit, this culture even fucks up strong female leads like that schmuck peddling his stupid PR message about the recent Tomb Raider.

This isn't about over sexualized girl avatars with skimpy armor. That's just a tiny symptom of an entire industry. I will say in the last year or two it seems like people are finally starting to openly talk about it. But there still seems to be too much money flowing through to change how things are thought.

But I'm also optimistic about some of the other publishing and platform games that have been coming too. They don't seem to have the same retrograde roots.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2013, 02:39:38 PM by Darniaq »
Samprimary
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Reply #1286 on: December 15, 2013, 02:54:40 PM

Are you saying boobs on reptiles, robots and especially on rock people isn't incredibly stupid?

Not any more so than that the rock people have testicles, or noses, or vocal cords that work in the same range as humans, or the same general bipedal shape and stature despite a completely different density at similar gravitational levels. The argument that he goes on about is stupid because it wasn't the designers' intent to make scientifically realistic or plausible races; they're purposefully stylized cartoon sci-fi fantasy aliens, to which the argument of the plausibility of rock lactation or pseudoreptilian viviparity and mammalian secondary sex characteristics is pretty much irrelevant. Even the males and the females of the humans on both sides are completely stylistically dimorphic, so.

The issue isn't realism and it serves as a distraction to the point, which is that the stylization that wildstar went for involves cartoonishly hypersexualized female models, and this has a bunch of problematic things going on with it and these days games should not be offering that as a mandatory or default form. It's coming on 2014 and Wildstar felt compelled to go in full-bore on the exaggeration of sex characteristics.
Nevermore
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Reply #1287 on: December 15, 2013, 03:04:42 PM

Wait, how do you know that the rock people have testicles?  why so serious?

I could argue that boobs on a rock person is more stupid than noses or vocal cords but there's really no point in going further down that rabbit hole.  The point remains that the character designs in this game are terrible.

Over and out.
MediumHigh
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Reply #1288 on: December 15, 2013, 03:32:11 PM


Yes it is.  The number of people who want to play ugly females is extremely small, wasting time making characters for them that could be used on something else is dumb.

What Nevermore said. Clearly, you are not a valid interlocutor on this topic as you are biased and narrowminded. Between ignorant and idiot, your pick.

No its stupid. We spent nearly dozen post on the size of robot boobs. Next were going to arguing how two rocks should scientifically have sex. Oh wait...
Samprimary
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Reply #1289 on: December 15, 2013, 04:04:26 PM

Wait, how do you know that the rock people have testicles?  why so serious?

haha, watch the 'meet the exiles' video - she straightly alludes that granok's balls are bigger than their brains
Draegan
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Reply #1290 on: December 15, 2013, 04:08:48 PM

You should all feel bad for having this argument. Hoax is right.
Evildrider
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Reply #1291 on: December 15, 2013, 04:35:37 PM

You should all feel bad for having this argument. Hoax is right.

Wizgar
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Reply #1292 on: December 15, 2013, 04:48:27 PM

I've never seen any evidence that anyone other than concern trolls really give a shit about this.
Samprimary
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Reply #1293 on: December 15, 2013, 04:56:04 PM

I dunno where that leaves me if I'm in the ambiguous position of both thinking that article's nuts AND thinking that we shouldn't have figures quite as hypersexed as wildstar has stylized them as. I promise I'm not a concern troll though!
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Reply #1294 on: December 15, 2013, 05:36:12 PM


"The world is populated in the main by people who should not exist." - George Bernard Shaw
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