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Author Topic: ATTN SPACE LARPER: CHECK YOURSELF  (Read 68500 times)
Signe
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Posts: 18942

Muse.


Reply #70 on: March 21, 2013, 10:43:26 AM

ForumBot 0.8 beta is so hot.

My Sig Image: hath rid itself of this mortal coil.
tazelbain
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Posts: 6603

tazelbain


Reply #71 on: March 21, 2013, 10:48:09 AM

Don't date robots.

"Me am play gods"
Segoris
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Posts: 2637


Reply #72 on: March 21, 2013, 11:03:21 AM

This new concept of a front page confuses me greatly. I thought it was just for reposting BIIFs.

Nice job Schild.

While I'm not against Kickstarter being used to fund indie games, I am against anyone (or any company) with enough money to fund their own interests/projects using it, especially while they're out blowing their money on really unnecessary shit.

I don't know if people are sending me paypal cash because ..... they just want me to take more people to task. Either way, thanks gentlemen.

Step 1: Make a board with mug shots (or Western style "wanted" posters) of shitbags in the gaming industry (or anyone who calls themselves a "gaming journalist" without any reason to), take bids/pledges/whatever and the McShitty with the biggest bounty gets ranted on.
Step 2: ? ? ? ? ?
Step 3: Profit Server funded annually.
Lucas
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3171

Further proof that Italians have suspect taste in games.


Reply #73 on: March 21, 2013, 11:15:47 AM

Official statement from Richard Garriott:

http://www.portalarium.com/images/docs/Words%20Taken%20Out%20of%20Context.pdf

(sorry for the formatting, it also looks like I can't post a "spoiler" message in this particular thread?)

Quote
Words Taken Out of Context
Wow did I strike a nerve! In the midst of a much longer more contextual conversation, PC
Gamer noted “Wow, you just gave me my headline!” At that moment, I knew to brace for an out
of context backlash. Without the broader real time discussion, as often happens, much can be
made out of partial thoughts used as headlines of comments meant as quipping simplification of
complex issues, as was the recent case for me. The variations of headlines where I either
disparage others, or glorify myself are inaccurate representations of the intent of my full
commentary.

Still, I have received numerous comments of support and numerous complaints about my recent
words about the challenges of finding great game designers. But, please let me clarify! By no
means did I intend to disparage others who have led the many great games of each era in gaming
history. I was trying to say, and show why finding or growing NEW great game designers is
hard!
Behind the inaccurate inflammatory headlines extracted from a longer dialog, I really do see a
major challenge to our art form, specifically in the area of design. The design of a game is
simultaneously 1) the most valuable aspect when it comes to the potential of success of a game,
2) the hardest part of game development to improve over previous efforts because of
competition, and 3) the skill set with the least formal and informal training available to game
developers.

Let me examine the history of design from where I watched it unfold.

Once upon a time, only one person made a game. By necessity that person was the programmer,
artist and designer (as well as holding many other roles). I can honestly say that the first artist I
ever hired was FAR better than I ever was. I was, and could still be, a passable programmer.
Some programmers who my companies have hired have been better than me, some worse, as I
would expect. And there are designers whose work in many areas is far better than mine. But I
also think some of the work I have done as a designer remains a top contribution for its time.
However, while ALL artists in the industry are better than I ever was, and while I can easily hire
a programmer who is better than I ever was, it is far more difficult to hire a designer who is
clearly capable of leading a top 10 game. For any company, growth only comes when the
company finds another leader who can make a top 10 game.

Origin only grew when we found people like Chris Roberts and Warren Spector. Most other attempts at creating new game lines
failed when we gave the reigns to junior people looking to advance. I want emphasize that this
was not always the case, but it happened more times than not. As a business it’s important to
understand why.
At Origin, after we successfully added art teams and programming teams, we realized we had
huge worlds to build that did not demand the same drawing skills as an artist. We also had NPC
scripting needs that did not demand a top programmer. Thus we invented the Technical Design
Assistant, often someone from QA (still a traditional source of designers) to build maps and
script NPCs.

These people did this to GREAT success! But, as the industry evolved, we began to lean more heavily on new “designers” to develop the
actual plans for the game itself and to describe the game we planned to build. They were also
tasked with making design calls on how much of the computer’s limited resources should be
spent on the competing fields of art, sound and interaction. This difficult trade-off is generally
best handled by someone who knows the difficulties of coding and art creation issues, and that is
more often someone who has programmed and drawn art than it is someone who has not.
Sadly for people who really are passionate about designing the next great game, “game design”
remains a hard skill to learn.

A lot of indie developers right now who are “triple threats” of artist,
programmer and designer, will likely rise to the occasion. They will have a good understanding
of ALL the issues. Designers, who never coded and never drew art, have a far harder path ahead
of them. After all, we are making “computer games,” and a deep knowledge of the computer is
mighty helpful.

Artists can take classes and create portfolios of their work and an employer knows they can do
the work. A programmer can take classes and produce code samples to prove the same. For
designers, there are now at least a few good schools like the Guildhall at SMU, that turn out
quality designers.

Yet these quality designers remain a rare breed. Sadly, I really do think that
most people who get into design roles on a team have no more skills at design than the
programmers and artists. They may not be worse, but they rarely have better training than the
others to tackle the hardest job of all, determining what game is going to be built.
Perhaps my statement that has been quoted so often in recent days could have been presented in
a more eloquent fashion. But I stand by the point I was making, that game design is the hardest
profession in our business to understand and to learn.

And I certainly am not trying to put my own career on some sort of game design high ground.
While I have hit occasional home runs, I have made plenty of unforced errors. I was not
attempting to prop myself up with these comments, but rather lament my need…our industry’s
need for proper training in the most important skill required to make a good game. I never had
any formal training either; I have just had more time to learn from my mistakes than most. If
what comes from all this is a frank discussion and lively debate on how to best address this issue,
then hopefully I’ve accomplished something.

Thanks for your time,
Richard “Lord British” Garriott
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 11:18:24 AM by Lucas »

" He's so impatient, it's like watching a teenager fuck a glorious older woman." - Ironwood on J.J. Abrams
schild
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Reply #74 on: March 21, 2013, 11:26:13 AM

He has not hit occasional home runs.

He hit one home run.

I do not believe even in the slightest he knows what good game design looks like or is capable of training or helping people achieve that.

(Nearly) all the people he listed in that article are all universally crap and in the same league of one-hit wonders he is.

He is a douche of the highest order. Lord Douche of Douchetannia.
Ghambit
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Posts: 5575


Reply #75 on: March 21, 2013, 11:33:06 AM

Knee jerk class warfare rhetoric

If the people, however misguided or ignorant, are giving their money voluntarily, it's not socialism.
Using Kickstarter to fleece the gullible is deplorable, sure, but let's don't mar this otherwise awesome thread with political dogma.


Well, given the size of the kstarter marketplace (which isnt all that big), can you necessarily call it voluntary when big studios with plenty of capital hog the splash pages and the headlines?  It's a fine line.  If my project gets bumped to the bottom of the pile because a few dozen non-indy companies want to fleece the system of cash, how is it at that point still voluntary?  A supporter would have to click-scroll through a helluva lot of projects to reach mine beneath all the bullshit noise.

Moral of the story:  Capitalism is sadly not voluntary.  It's sheep led by wolves w/o the sheep choosing to do-so.  Even Gekko realized that.   Ohhhhh, I see.

Let us further examine what Kickstarter would look like if it were truly 'socialist.'  You'd have no "projects we like" or "staff picks" sections.  It'd be setup more like Amazon (tracking the supporters interests, etc.).  There would be no "popular projects" section.  Etc.  Everyone would be on equal footing.  Going further, they'd cap the marketplace for use only by groups below a certain threshold, to prevent bloat from established IPs.  Ironically, this seems a lot more voluntary then the way it works right now.

"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom."  -Samwise
Rasix
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Posts: 14481

I am the harbinger of your doom!


Reply #76 on: March 21, 2013, 11:36:35 AM

Mmmm. This was like a warm, fuzzy draught of the mid-2000s f13 all over again.

We need to go crash GDC parties or something again, Schild. Those were the days.

Neckpuncher.

-Rasix
Yoru
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Reply #77 on: March 21, 2013, 12:00:27 PM

Mmmm. This was like a warm, fuzzy draught of the mid-2000s f13 all over again.

We need to go crash GDC parties or something again, Schild. Those were the days.

Neckpuncher.

Round 2, fight!
Outlawedprod
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Reply #78 on: March 22, 2013, 12:34:23 AM

UnSub
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Reply #79 on: March 22, 2013, 04:35:57 AM


1) I can get behind spite as funding motivation.

2) Also seems scammish to me, although that's probably more because it only wanted $829 (someone didn't calculate fees and transaction costs, it seems) and now has $10k+. I predict a backlash.

rk47
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The Patron Saint of Radicalthons


Reply #80 on: March 22, 2013, 04:52:32 AM

Yep. Same feelings.

I hope this makes you feel better, schild.

« Last Edit: March 22, 2013, 06:44:59 AM by rk47 »

Colonel Sanders is back in my wallet
schild
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Reply #81 on: March 22, 2013, 07:38:15 AM

I like to assume that 15% of those got donated to me.
schild
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Reply #82 on: March 22, 2013, 07:39:52 AM

Also, I'd like to point out that we're only -$89,000 and change from hitting our goal of his Kickstarter not succeeding.
Lantyssa
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Reply #83 on: March 22, 2013, 07:44:11 AM

Did I just see a UO graph that went into negative numbers? Grin

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
schild
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Reply #84 on: March 22, 2013, 08:45:25 AM

Currently at -$3,965. TOGETHER, WE CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
tazelbain
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Posts: 6603

tazelbain


Reply #85 on: March 22, 2013, 08:51:14 AM

Ya, my idea anti-funding that raises the funding threshold and goes to charity if the ks was blocked would be making a fortune here.

"Me am play gods"
schild
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Posts: 58608


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Reply #86 on: March 22, 2013, 08:52:48 AM

Ultima: Shroud of the Redeemed

Now with 100% less Richard Garriott. All proceeds go to the Schild Fund for a Better Tomorrow.
MrHat
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Posts: 7396

Out of the frying pan, into the fire.


Reply #87 on: March 22, 2013, 08:54:35 AM

So that last bit is people withdrawing their pledge?

 DRILLING AND MANLINESS
tazelbain
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Posts: 6603

tazelbain


Reply #88 on: March 22, 2013, 08:55:28 AM

Why would we fund you when you are well on your way to being a trophy husband?

"Me am play gods"
schild
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Reply #89 on: March 22, 2013, 08:55:37 AM

So that last bit is people withdrawing their pledge?

 DRILLING AND MANLINESS
Correct. And god-willing my hatred will spill over into other corners. This is one of the very few things from this site I wish would actually go viral. I might not have enough personal insults in it to drive the point home though.

Quote
Why would we fund you when you are well on your way to being a trophy husband?

Because a dollar for me is a dollar for... justice and good taste?
rk47
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Posts: 6236

The Patron Saint of Radicalthons


Reply #90 on: March 22, 2013, 09:00:49 AM

I'm doing what i can schild. im spreading it to my usual haunts. I don't really want to see LB succeed.
Your vitriol is inspiring.  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?

Colonel Sanders is back in my wallet
schild
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Reply #91 on: March 22, 2013, 09:02:48 AM

It has come to my attention that people don't realize they can cancel their pledge. GONNA HAVE TO MAKE A WALKTHROUGH.
rk47
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Posts: 6236

The Patron Saint of Radicalthons


Reply #92 on: March 22, 2013, 09:07:55 AM

Yes,... upload it to youtube.

Colonel Sanders is back in my wallet
Lantyssa
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Posts: 20848


Reply #93 on: March 22, 2013, 09:08:12 AM

Come on people!  We need -$55,000 to bring this full circle.

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
schild
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Reply #94 on: March 22, 2013, 09:22:11 AM

Come on people!  We need -$55,000 to bring this full circle.
Well, slightly more than that.
schild
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Reply #95 on: March 22, 2013, 09:23:25 AM

I just made a pledge, commented, and canceled my pledge to make a walkthrough, and in that time one of the slovenly chucklefuck Ultima fanboys replied and now I can't respond. I don't want to make another fake pledge to deal with them. Bleh.
Mrbloodworth
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Reply #96 on: March 22, 2013, 09:40:01 AM

All that because he said the equivalent of "Those that can't do, teach"?  Head scratch

Today's How-To: Scrambling a Thread to the Point of Incoherence in Only One Post with MrBloodworth . - schild
www.mrbloodworthproductions.com  www.amuletsbymerlin.com
schild
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Reply #97 on: March 22, 2013, 09:41:16 AM

Those who can't really shouldn't be teaching either, but that's another discussion.
tazelbain
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tazelbain


Reply #98 on: March 22, 2013, 09:44:48 AM

Those who got rich from success once should use their riches to fund further ventures rather than charity funding.

"Me am play gods"
Mrbloodworth
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Reply #99 on: March 22, 2013, 09:48:29 AM

But, snark aside, he does have a point.

If a designer comes up from QA, as many do, and runs in and scribbles all over the white board about the new awesome idea. Its going to mean fuck all as a design when the artists, Techs and programmers tell him its unfeasible. "Designers" with out the technical knowledge and understand of the core competencies of the field is useless. That seemed to be the thrust of his comment. Not that hes super awesome.

I Do agree with the part about extremely successful people using kick starter without ponying up money made during that success themselves.  I Do not believe kickstarter was created as a financial risk mitigation. Personally I have only ever donated to one kickstarter, that would be star citizen.

I don't see what the fuss is about.

Today's How-To: Scrambling a Thread to the Point of Incoherence in Only One Post with MrBloodworth . - schild
www.mrbloodworthproductions.com  www.amuletsbymerlin.com
schild
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Reply #100 on: March 22, 2013, 09:53:21 AM

You don't see what the fuss is about because your brain doesn't operate anywhere near the same realm as a normal humans. You're on the third moon of Neptar 7 whereas we're on Earth and Garriott is a big 'ol self-righteous cockhead. Also, he doesn't have a point because he hasn't made a goddamn thing that would classify as an actual game with design and shit in the last 20 years.
schild
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Reply #101 on: March 22, 2013, 10:01:31 AM

The responses to my comment on the kickstarter campaign are interesting. And if there's any truth to it, there's literally no reason whatsoever for them to be using Kickstarter other than as a platform for free press.

Which implies to me that Kickstarter should pull the project. I think we all know how to tank this thing now.



It's at the bottom of the main project page. Can't decide whether to classify it as "This is not a project" or "Prohibited Rewards." Or even "This is a charity project."
KallDrexx
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Reply #102 on: March 22, 2013, 12:26:10 PM

I like the guy that argued with you saying that Richard Gariott (a millionaire who can fund this on his own if he wanted to) is taking more risks than you not putting in your $1.

Holy god the comments on that page are fucking retarded. 
schild
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Reply #103 on: March 22, 2013, 12:55:07 PM

They're really horrendous.
Sky
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I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.


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Reply #104 on: March 22, 2013, 01:21:10 PM

RG should've used an IGG flexible funding campaign. Funds charged immediately and he keeps everything even if the goal isn't met.

Newb.

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