X-Men: Days of Future Past

[Pennilenko]

Yeah but Logan is just a mutated wolverine, so he's not really human!   

Oh, no you didn't...

[Lakov_Sanite]

All mutants and superheroes are just proto-dieties evolved from earths original life to be powerful protectors of the godseed of an eternal lying at the center of the earth, duh.

[Pennilenko]

All mutants and superheroes are just proto-dieties evolved from earths original life to be powerful protectors of the godseed of an eternal lying at the center of the earth, duh.

[Velorath]

All mutants and superheroes are just proto-dieties evolved from earths original life to be powerful protectors of the godseed of an eternal lying at the center of the earth, duh.

Celestial, not Eternal.

[Lakov_Sanite]

When you really go deep into marvel lore it gets so fuckstupid that only the most meth-addled brain would find it interesting.

[Ubvman]

The cool kids on this board may not like her, but I am a fanboi...

Ellen Page is Kitty Pryde again.
http://www.digitalspy.com/movies/news/a483168/x-men-days-of-future-past-ellen-page-didnt-expect-kitty-return.html

Just because:       


Anyways, this movie jumped up several notches in my expectations.
It seems that all the important leads from X-Men: First Class is in it and all the important leads from the previous other three X-Men movies (including the Brett Ratner one) is going to be in this one. It feels like Fox is doing their own "mini-Avengers" mega gathering with their X-men franchise.

Tyrion Lannister Peter Dingklage is also in it. The easy guess is that he's playing Alpha Flight's Puck but rumor has it that he would be a baddie,playing the creator of the Sentinels - Bolivar Trask.

[Velorath]

Anyways, this movie jumped up several notches in my expectations.
It seems that all the important leads from X-Men: First Class is in it and all the important leads from the previous other three X-Men movies (including the Brett Ratner one) is going to be in this one. It feels like Fox is doing their own "mini-Avengers" mega gathering with their X-men franchise.

Tyrion Lannister Peter Dingklage is also in it. The easy guess is that he's playing Alpha Flight's Puck but rumor has it that he would be a baddie,playing the creator of the Sentinels - Bolivar Trask.

I'm not entirely sure how "contains 20 main characters who will each get two lines of dialogue" is a selling point.

[Tannhauser]

Spiderman had two supers
Spiderman 2 had three supers
Spiderman 3 had four supers
So if X-Men has 20 supers that means it's 10x better than Spiderman 2 and furthermore Romney is President.

[Lantyssa]

I'm guessing they won't be focusing on everyone extensively.  But they let the old team reprise their roles as the future X-men and the new guys as the First Class alumni who have to deal with the future creeping into the present.

[palmer_eldritch]

Yeah, I'm guessing from Kitty's costume that the modern day X-Men as they appeared in the first three films, or I suppose seven years older, are going to be living in the dystopian nightmare future. (As opposed to the comics where Kitty is all growed up in the bad future and a teenager in the present world - to do it that way you'd need another actress for middle-aged Kitty, or at least some aging makeup on Ellen Page, who looks about 12).

The cool kids on this board may not like her, but I am a fanboi...

Ellen Page is Kitty Pryde again.

Can't speak for the cool kids but for me, Kitty is the best X-Person. Unless it's Ellen Page who's meant to be uncool?

She's also the real star of Whedon's Astonishing X-Men run, which are probably my favourite X-Men comics.

[Lantyssa]

Yeah.  That was a really good run.

[sickrubik]

So they've thrown up a Trask Industries website, which included a picture of Dinklage as Bolivar Trask.

It was missing something. I have added this. http://imgur.com/gallery/urJwFRy

[Lakov_Sanite]

The more I think about the casting of Dinklage the more I love it. It's so dripping with comic irony and symbolism to have someone with a "normal" genetic mutation condemning others who through no fault of their own are born different.

It's a bit too on the nose for most other movies but when we are dealing with comics and x-men in particular it fits so well.

[sickrubik]

Yeah, X-Men has always been a bit on the nose.

Plus Dinklage is just awesome.

[K9]

Trask Industries Advert

[Evildrider]

So the fact that they are only using Quicksilver in Days, and not Scarlet Witch as well, makes me think that they are just trying to fuck with Marvel.

[Raguel]

Marvel doesn't have the rights to Scarlet Witch? Too bad cuz she was one of my fave Avengers.

[Evildrider]

Marvel doesn't have the rights to Scarlet Witch? Too bad cuz she was one of my fave Avengers.

No, they do... apparently they have shared rights to Quicksilver and Scarlett Witch.  They are to both be in Avengers 2.

[jgsugden]

The current plan is to 'Marvel' the rights for X-men and Fantastic Four, making movies for pretty much everything to which they have the rights to make movies.  I expect 10 movies in this shared universe between 2015 and 2020.

X-Men and Fantastic Four could open up the rights to a lot of characters: Silver Surfer, X-force, Doctor Doom (Emperor Doom would make a good movie), etc...

The thing I find interesting in all of this: Fox has the rights to the Fantastic Four on screen.  However, Marvel has the rights to put the Fantastic Four on animated TV.  And they also have the rights to put Wolverine on animated TV.  Both have shown up on Marvel animated shows recently. Do they also have the TV rights to the Fantastic Four and X-men for live shows?  Could they put Reed Richards on Agents of SHIELD?

[Khaldun]

The speculation has been that this is also why Marvel is doing stuff like Superior Spider-Man and Miles Morales as Ultimate Spider-Man--trying to see if they can't open up a big enough hole in the rights to shake some characters loose or at least threaten to do so.

I really would love to see a good version of Fantastic Four and in some ways I think they can live in their own self-contained universe pretty well--I'm not sure they work so well with the "realistic" presentation of the Avengers' films, maybe only with Thor. FF should really be full of crazy Lee/Kirby looking shit. So if Fox wants to go that way it'll be ok.

Spider-Universe I'm not so sure about. It seems to me he works well in a more inhabited universe.

X-Men do really well in an isolated universe--you can have fucktons of mutants and then you don't have the distraction of trying to explain why the public reacts differently to "mutant guys in spandex" and "not-mutant guys in spandex".

[Ironwood]

You don't think the Fantastic Four were good ?

[jgsugden]

You don't think the Fantastic Four were good ?

If you look carefully, you can see the Bones of a good approach under a ton of crap. I've always been curious if there was a draft of the script that would have been much better.

[sickrubik]

The speculation has been that this is also why Marvel is doing stuff like Superior Spider-Man and Miles Morales as Ultimate Spider-Man--trying to see if they can't open up a big enough hole in the rights to shake some characters loose or at least threaten to do so.

Comics have always done weird shit. I don't buy this as a ploy to get the rights to anything. There's simple enough reasons without going into conspiracy crap.

[Ironwood]

You don't think the Fantastic Four were good ?

If you look carefully, you can see the Bones of a good approach under a ton of crap. I've always been curious if there was a draft of the script that would have been much better.

I thought the Four were Ok, it was just Doom that sucked balls.

[jgsugden]

The speculation has been that this is also why Marvel is doing stuff like Superior Spider-Man and Miles Morales as Ultimate Spider-Man--trying to see if they can't open up a big enough hole in the rights to shake some characters loose or at least threaten to do so.

Comics have always done weird shit. I don't buy this as a ploy to get the rights to anything. There's simple enough reasons without going into conspiracy crap.

I buy this theory.  Look at what they've done in the Avengers comics and cartoons and tell me they're not tryling to cross-market witht e movies.  If they're doing that, it makes sense that they'd try to do the opposite with the other characters that are in the hands of other studios.  I'm betting the terms of the contracts Marvel, Fox, Sony and any other studio signs prohibit revealing the details of how the rights change hands.  Based upon Marvel's apparent lack of effort in terms of getting Spider-man, the X-men, etc... back, I've been wondering for quite some time if the rights have a firm expiration date and Marvel is just waiting for that date to come.  I can see them letting the X-men rights stay out of their hands, but Spider-man is the most iconic Marvel character - I'd think they'd have done everything possible to get the rights back.

[sickrubik]

The speculation has been that this is also why Marvel is doing stuff like Superior Spider-Man and Miles Morales as Ultimate Spider-Man--trying to see if they can't open up a big enough hole in the rights to shake some characters loose or at least threaten to do so.

Comics have always done weird shit. I don't buy this as a ploy to get the rights to anything. There's simple enough reasons without going into conspiracy crap.

I buy this theory.  Look at what they've done in the Avengers comics and cartoons and tell me they're not tryling to cross-market witht e movies.  If they're doing that, it makes sense that they'd try to do the opposite with the other characters that are in the hands of other studios.  I'm betting the terms of the contracts Marvel, Fox, Sony and any other studio signs prohibit revealing the details of how the rights change hands.  Based upon Marvel's apparent lack of effort in terms of getting Spider-man, the X-men, etc... back, I've been wondering for quite some time if the rights have a firm expiration date and Marvel is just waiting for that date to come.  I can see them letting the X-men rights stay out of their hands, but Spider-man is the most iconic Marvel character - I'd think they'd have done everything possible to get the rights back.

These deals always have expiration dates. They HAVE been trying to get Spidey back but Sony is clutching on to that with all they are worth. Not only did Spidey make a ton of money, but the success of the other Marvel movies have really only made Sony clutch harder onto those rights.

[Margalis]

Comics have always done weird shit. I don't buy this as a ploy to get the rights to anything. There's simple enough reasons without going into conspiracy crap.

Agree.

Captain America was John Walker for a while, the Hulk has been green, red and grey, Spider-Man was a clone, Superman got replaced by 5 imposters, Batman has been played by Robin and Azrael. If you mess with a character it can make things interesting then when you inevitably return to the status quo everyone can be happy and nostalgic.

[sickrubik]

Hell, the whole FAKE PETER PARKER shit happened before the Sony movies hit.

[jgsugden]

Look at the percentage of time the characters have been 'out of their skin' during their existence.  It is pretty small.  Peter was a clone for a short period of time, they 'killed' Peter and had Kraven replace him for a short period of time, they sent Xavier off to live with aliens for a short period of time, etc... However, the vast majority of their lives they've been kicking and fighting in the pages of their books. 

It is just too much of a coincidence that the current deaths/disruptions are occuring all at once and all at the same time the movie rights issues are at issue.  If it looks like a duck, and smells like a duck, and quacks like a duck... you've got Howard.

[sickrubik]

I can't believe we have to use Occam's Razor for fucking comics. There is no evidence that leans towards conspiracy over the same old comic shit.

[Margalis]

The Ultimate line is also running into the problem that it has no reason to exist.

It was introduced to juice sales and attract new readers by offering stories not weighed down by decades of continuity. But now that the Ultimate line has been around for a while it has its own continuity. The world doesn't need another Peter Parker Spider-Man book.

[Velorath]

The speculation has been that this is also why Marvel is doing stuff like Superior Spider-Man and Miles Morales as Ultimate Spider-Man--trying to see if they can't open up a big enough hole in the rights to shake some characters loose or at least threaten to do so.

Superior Spider-Man is one character Sony has the rights to inside the mind of another character Sony has the rights to. No holes are being created.

[jgsugden]

I can't believe we have to use Occam's Razor for fucking comics. There is no evidence that leans towards conspiracy over the same old comic shit.

The razor is the evidence.  It may not be bullet proof, but it is there.

In terms of Superior Spider-man and the theory that this is intended to undermine the Spider-man film value, the theory is that having no Peter Parker driving Spider-man in the comcis makes the movies seem 'out of date' with the current continuity.  If Sony were to introduce Doc Ock in AM 2 or 3 and put him in Garfield's body in AS 4, Marvel would have plenty of time to put Peter back in his body before the movie came out, again keeping the movies out of step with the major developments of the character in the comics.

The big problem in analyzing this who situation is that we, the fans, can't read the Marvel/Sony/Fox contracts.  We don't know how the terms under which a character can be used by a studio, and under what situations the rights revert.  We've had a few brief comments on the way it all works, but it is all shrouded in mystery when it comes to the details.  AFAIK, they've never confirmed or denied that there is a calendar date on which the rights revert regardless of whether the studio keeps making movies. 

Regardless, being able to put a Disney controlled Spider-man into the Avengers universe would be a HUGE financial win for Disney.  You can bet that they're looking at every option possible to get those rights back and are not above poisoning the well to do it.

[HaemishM]

In terms of Superior Spider-man and the theory that this is intended to undermine the Spider-man film value, the theory is that having no Peter Parker driving Spider-man in the comcis makes the movies seem 'out of date' with the current continuity.

I hate to tell you this, but the only ones who give two rat fucks about the current continuity are the people writing and editing the comics. The Marvel Studios guys? Don't really give a fuck. Sony? They SURE don't give a fuck, because they are selling an iconic brand, not peddling monthly funny books for manchildren.

[sickrubik]

No one is arguing that Disney/Marvel aren't trying to do everything they can to get Spidey back. Of fucking course they are. Don't build that strawman.

But that doesn't fuel any sort of weird conspiracy on storyline. Because it wouldn't even fucking matter for the movies. The movies are their own damn continuity anyway.

Seriously, the whole Spiderman Conspiracy is starting to drive me more insane than chemtrails.