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Topic: This Was my Last MMO (Read 51765 times)
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Paelos
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Posts: 27075
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That's because it's Empire versus Alliance Republic with a slightly different logo
Note, the logo actually devolved over 2000 years. Probably due to lack of funding.
Empire though?
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8306
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Right because we really need to design for the colorblind and deaf. At this point I'd just say that's what mods are for, but they fucked that up too. Fuck the colorblind! (We have like at least 3 people in SLAP that are colorblind, including Ingmar. It made him tanking that boss in Mechanar a real hoot ) -- I have no more issue with StarWars being eternally at the same level of technology then I do LOTR or any other fantasy setting. I also have no issue with this conflict only being important to the people of this Era. The movies aren't any different really, in the grand scheme of the Republics history. They are what, 50-80 years of conflict? That's a footnote in terms of Republic History.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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Ratman_tf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3818
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Dumb rant, but there it is :)
Heh. I totally agree. When I saw the dudes frozen in carbonite, I was like "Wait, what?" Sometimes TOR feels like My First Star Wars by Fisher Price.
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"What I'm saying is you should make friends with a few catasses, they smell funny but they're very helpful." -Calantus makes the best of a smelly situation.
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Nevermore
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4740
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Did I miss something from Empire that said freezing someone in carbonite was experimental and new? All I remember them saying was that the carbonite freezer in Cloud City wasn't designed for humans so Vader wanted to test it on Han first. Given Lando's little operation was so small it was beneath the notice of both the Empire and the Mining Guild, it seems unlikely he had brand new, never before seen experimental tech. I have no with carbonite freezing existing back then.
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Over and out.
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Merusk
Terracotta Army
Posts: 27449
Badge Whore
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Right because we really need to design for the colorblind and deaf. At this point I'd just say that's what mods are for, but they fucked that up too. You continue to live down to expectations. At some point in the near future the ADA is going to have it's own version that applies to software, so yes, sensible designers would be planning for it now.
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The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
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You continue to live down to expectations.
It's a fucking game. Get over yourself. Honestly the bleeding heart shit some of you people champion at times IN GAMING makes no sense to me. In real life? Absolutely. In an entertainment arena? Fuck off.
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« Last Edit: February 11, 2012, 02:42:43 PM by Paelos »
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Sjofn
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8286
Truckasaurus Hands
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Because only "normal" people deserve entertainment, you guys! Even if I bought into the "fuck anyone not exactly like me" mindset, there are a lot of colorblind people (it's something like 8% of all dudes, although practically no ladies). And for whatever reason, a lot of them are nerds. It's stupid not to design with those people in mind.
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God Save the Horn Players
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
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It's stupid not to design a moddable ui.
The rest of it is just people shoving their own baggage into the situation.
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Sjofn
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8286
Truckasaurus Hands
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Yes, that's right. It's all "baggage."
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God Save the Horn Players
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Surlyboi
Terracotta Army
Posts: 10963
eat a bag of dicks
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How many other MMOs or just games in general, for that matter, are designed with the color blind in mind?
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Tuned in, immediately get to watch cringey Ubisoft talking head offering her deepest sympathies to the families impacted by the Orlando shooting while flanked by a man in a giraffe suit and some sort of "horrifically garish neon costumes through the ages" exhibit or something. We need to stop this fucking planet right now and sort some shit out. -Kail
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Velorath
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How many other MMOs or just games in general, for that matter, are designed with the color blind in mind?
A lot of mmo's. Isn't that why a number of them used icons in addition to color for their con system? DAOC for instance used the grey, green, blue, yellow, orange, red, purple color system to show a mobs level relative to yours and then supplemented it with -'s and +'s for colorblind people. I seem to recall that sort of thing being fairly common.
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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So, what you are saying is. You don't like talking to people.
That's what you got out of my post? In short: - text works and there are a lot of good templates for how such a system can look and what functions it can offer. - I've had technical issues with VOIP before (e.g. breaking up, too faint, etc) that means I don't trust it / think it reliable. And, to add one in that wasn't in the original post: - I PUG a lot. I don't have a guild. I've had some PUG-related VOIP experiences that aren't uncommon but that I don't want to repeat because they take away from the fun of playing. If someone wants to lolfag me in text chat, they can, but then it's logged and easily reportable.
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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It's stupid not to design a moddable ui.
The rest of it is just people shoving their own baggage into the situation.
No, it's sloppy design. There are some basic "Don't do this and consider this" rules for when developing for the mass market that aren't hard to implement. However, it requires the devs responsible for those parts to think a little bit about it, which sometimes doesn't happen. It isn't appropriate to think that mods will fix what should have been there in the first place. Improve it? Sure, but not add in basic things that were missed.
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
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It isn't appropriate to think that mods will fix what should have been there in the first place. Improve it? Sure, but not add in basic things that were missed.
This is ridiculous on so many levels. First, mods add in new things all the time. Hell, mods for many other games add in complete worlds that get built on the engines. To suggest that it would someone be onerous on a minority community of geek males (who seem to be primarily the ones struck with colorblindness) to write a mod for the UI? TOO FAR! We save that kind of effort for dps parsers and threatmeters!
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Der Helm
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4025
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I don't think you guys are arguing about the same thing.
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"I've been done enough around here..."- Signe
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
Error 404: Title not found.
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Meh probably not, I'm just firing into the dark at this point. It's Saturday and the college games are sorta boring.
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Kageru
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4549
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I see text and voice as complementary systems. If I'm soloing I probably don't want to listen to someone chat about something that has nothing to do with me in game. So chat is a lower impact form of communication and easier to ignore if they're just talking shit that doesn't interest me (which is generally the case). I mean imagine zone general chat done as voice and that's the only communications interface. Of course if I'm doing something with other people, like an instance or a raid, it works the other way around because I don't want the delay of typing and I know that whatever they say is going to be relevant because they're in the same instance or group (and thus people I selected and am playing with).
On top of that most in-game chat clients are pointless. I can find a lower ping and better performing ventrilo or mumble server than the in-game solution, and most big guilds will have an established voip solution.
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Is a man not entitled to the hurf of his durf? - Simond
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Ingmar
Terracotta Army
Posts: 19280
Auto Assault Affectionado
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Right because we really need to design for the colorblind and deaf. At this point I'd just say that's what mods are for, but they fucked that up too. 10% of all men are colorblind. Ignoring that in your design is stupid.
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Margalis
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12335
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This is ridiculous on so many levels. First, mods add in new things all the time. Hell, mods for many other games add in complete worlds that get built on the engines. To suggest that it would someone be onerous on a minority community of geek males (who seem to be primarily the ones struck with colorblindness) to write a mod for the UI? TOO FAR! We save that kind of effort for dps parsers and threatmeters!
Yes, color blindness primarily effects geeks. Thanks doctor. In real life, rather than your self-entitled fantasy land, color blindness is extremely common in the population at large and there are very simple things you can do to (partially) proof UIs against it. Things that also make UIs better and more readable for everyone. Isn't that why a number of them used icons in addition to color for their con system?
I good UI will use color, shape, positioning and as many other visual cues as possible. It makes it easier for everyone to quickly pick things out.
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« Last Edit: February 11, 2012, 07:38:55 PM by Margalis »
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vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
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Ratman_tf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3818
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Did I miss something from Empire that said freezing someone in carbonite was experimental and new? All I remember them saying was that the carbonite freezer in Cloud City wasn't designed for humans so Vader wanted to test it on Han first. Given Lando's little operation was so small it was beneath the notice of both the Empire and the Mining Guild, it seems unlikely he had brand new, never before seen experimental tech. I have no with carbonite freezing existing back then.
For me, it's that they were frozen nearly exactly like Han at Cloud City. Same rectangular casing, same half-in half-poking out poses. Sometimes their references to the movies make sense, and sometimes they seem like concept cut n' paste.
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"What I'm saying is you should make friends with a few catasses, they smell funny but they're very helpful." -Calantus makes the best of a smelly situation.
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eldaec
Terracotta Army
Posts: 11843
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You really get the feeling it isn't a knowing wink, but a just someone without any imagination copying and pasting.
Of course, both the prequels and the EU plumb the same depths so *maybe* this is a subtle commentary on the overexploitation of the core 3 movie canon.
OK maybe not.
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"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson "Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
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FieryBalrog
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Posts: 205
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I suspect the dearth of imagination about that stuff is more of a Lucasarts thing than anything else.
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Numtini
Terracotta Army
Posts: 7675
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I believe a lack of imagination is a trademark owned by Lucasfilm LTD.
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If you can read this, you're on a board populated by misogynist assholes.
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Riggswolfe
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8031
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You really get the feeling it isn't a knowing wink, but a just someone without any imagination copying and pasting.
Actually I get the feeling that they wanted people to constantly feel like they were in Star Wars. So you see a carbon frozen man and go "good lord get original." I, and lots of people like me, see a carbon frozen man and go "cool just like Han!"
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"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
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eldaec
Terracotta Army
Posts: 11843
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There is carbon freezing, but then there is carbon freezing everyone in identical poses and identical machinery.
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"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson "Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
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Merusk
Terracotta Army
Posts: 27449
Badge Whore
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Machinery? Hell my BH fires it from his wrist at every damn target. Many of whom stand upright and stoically as they're turned into a living statue.. who then winds up looking like Han in the next cutscene. THAT is what makes me all As to a lot of the rest of the "just like the movies!" stuff (Sith ships for example.) They looked different enough in the original KOTOR series, so I'm going to blame it on wanting to look like the movies so as to not alienate the non-hardcore SW geeks.
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The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
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Simond
Terracotta Army
Posts: 6742
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How many other MMOs or just games in general, for that matter, are designed with the color blind in mind? Yeah, TOR in yet another "Not as good as WoW" shocker.
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"You're really a good person, aren't you? So, there's no path for you to take here. Go home. This isn't a place for someone like you."
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Venkman
Terracotta Army
Posts: 11536
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Like the other 8-10% of global males, I'm partially color deficient (on the red-green side). For those who are not, this isn't total color blindness, which is extremely rare. This is just having some issues differentiating between certain proximities of warm colors. If you look at an old standard set of Crayola markers, I can't tell the difference between the Red and the Brown caps. I struggled with the yellow and green orbs in Zuma until they put in color-blind mode that added gray orbs. I put my vote in for the - and + symbols they added to DAoC. Having said that, I didn't have any problems with SWTOR. Where they used closely-related color symbols, they made clear the differences in the tool tips. Did I miss something from Empire that said freezing someone in carbonite was experimental and new? All I remember them saying was that the carbonite freezer in Cloud City wasn't designed for humans so Vader wanted to test it on Han first.
It was that plus C-3PO's "ooh, they encased him in Carbonite. He should be remarkably well preserved, assuming he survived the freezing process" all together which implied this wasn't some stock-standard consumer-grade tech, which therefore probably still had the kinks anything new does. It is kinda easy to argue it either way though. If one is a fan of the story in SWTOR, they could argue as you did: feh, "standard issue stuff but Lando's sucked". If you're critiquing the story in SWTOR, it's "retcon raawwr!" :)
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Lakov_Sanite
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Posts: 7590
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Or you know, you could have half a brain and realize that carbonite freezing was intended to be not meant for humans.
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~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
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FieryBalrog
Terracotta Army
Posts: 205
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You really get the feeling it isn't a knowing wink, but a just someone without any imagination copying and pasting.
Actually I get the feeling that they wanted people to constantly feel like they were in Star Wars. That may in fact be the same feeling.
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Sky
Terracotta Army
Posts: 32117
I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.
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I think we should argue more stridently about made-up shit.
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Nevermore
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4740
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There is carbon freezing, but then there is carbon freezing everyone in identical poses and identical machinery.
What they should have done is spend 20 man hours making 40 unique blocks of carbon frozen people in different positions so Eldaec wouldn't be offended by their lack of imagination. Most people when they look at the one pose just think 'hey, it's carbon-frozen man', but they should have spent more time for that one guy who thinks 'HOW DARE THEY COPY HAN'S FROZEN POSE!'. Edit: It was that plus C-3PO's "ooh, they encased him in Carbonite. He should be remarkably well preserved, assuming he survived the freezing process" all together which implied this wasn't some stock-standard consumer-grade tech, which therefore probably still had the kinks anything new does.
Now see, I look at that same exact quote and what I see is a protocol droid spitting out common knowledge, as he usually does. So if C-3PO actually knows about carbon freezing, it must be fairly common.
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« Last Edit: February 12, 2012, 01:21:30 PM by Nevermore »
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Over and out.
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Threash
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Posts: 9170
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It's not just that they copied the pose, it looks exactly like han solo frozen in there down to the hair and face.
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I am the .00000001428%
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Margalis
Terracotta Army
Posts: 12335
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Actually I get the feeling that they wanted people to constantly feel like they were in Star Wars. So you see a carbon frozen man and go "good lord get original." I, and lots of people like me, see a carbon frozen man and go "cool just like Han!"
Well yeah, of course. Depending on your slant the game is some sort of callback, homage or pastiche. I get the complaints that the game just takes stuff from the movies and riffs on them, but at the same time does anyone really want to see new stuff given how horrid new Star Wars stuff has become? I think at this point most people realize that from a creative standpoint the best days of Star Wars are decades removed - the best strategy for exploiting the IP is not telling exciting new tales of new characters in new places but rather "hey, remember the time Boba Fett flew around on a jetpack? Yeah, that was awesome!!" It's comfort food.
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vampirehipi23: I would enjoy a book written by a monkey and turned into a movie rather than this.
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Nevermore
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4740
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I'll take Han Solo-shaped carbonite man over the Yuuzhan Vong or whatever the fuck they were called any day.
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Over and out.
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