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Topic: Patch Notes (Read 182369 times)
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cironian
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Posts: 605
play his game!: solarwar.net
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I just browsed a bit on the current info on threat mechanics, since I wasn't really sure myself. It looks like it's really screwed up... You need to be super-close, clipping way into the body of the mob for most bosses for the melee effect to trigger. Which is not really a threat bonus but a switch in AI behaviour to make it easier to grab aggro. Taunts on the other hand give more of a threat bonus when you trigger them from outside that reduced melee range. So your perfect tank would stand within the enemy most of the time, then move away to taunt then move into the enemy again. edit: or just spam taunt at max range at all times. should finish reading before posting. Found it here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=341126
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« Last Edit: April 24, 2012, 08:50:56 AM by cironian »
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caladein
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Posts: 3174
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Yeah, I'm not sure who was the bright spark that thought Taunt doing anything when you already have the most threat was a good idea, but I'd like to smack them with a newspaper.
E: Missing word was missing.
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« Last Edit: April 24, 2012, 09:13:04 AM by caladein »
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"Point being, they can't make everyone happy, so I hope they pick me." - Ingmar"OH MY GOD WE'RE SURROUNDED SEND FOR BACKUP DIG IN DEFENSIVE POSITIONS MAN YOUR NECKBEARDS" - tgr
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Minvaren
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Posts: 1676
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Seems they finally fixed the spaaaace combat sync issue. ...by dropping you into the spaaace battle 10-15 seconds before the mission officially starts.
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"There are many things of which a wise man might wish to remain ignorant." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Ingmar
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Posts: 19280
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I've heard that's not really a problem anymore but I haven't tested it recently myself.
EDIT: Oops, missed a page. Was replying to Lanty.
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« Last Edit: April 24, 2012, 12:20:27 PM by Ingmar »
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
Error 404: Title not found.
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Yeah, I'm not sure who was the bright spark that thought Taunt doing anything when you already have the most threat was a good idea, but I'd like to smack them with a newspaper.
E: Missing word was missing.
To be fair, tanking has been fucked up since release. They are just trying to put some duck tape on it.
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Ingmar
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I don't think the taunt thing is duct tape, it has been like that since release. It just took players a long time to figure it out since we all just assumed it would work the same as WoW.
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Paelos
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Posts: 27075
Error 404: Title not found.
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I don't think the taunt thing is duct tape, it has been like that since release. It just took players a long time to figure it out since we all just assumed it would work the same as WoW.
Do you believe it's a good mechanic that should exist?
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Sjofn
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Posts: 8286
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When you say it's duct tape, you make it sound like they added this in to fix a problem. Stupid mechanic or not, it's not something they randomly threw in to fix a problem.
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God Save the Horn Players
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
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When you say it's duct tape, you make it sound like they added this in to fix a problem. Stupid mechanic or not, it's not something they randomly threw in to fix a problem.
That's a really dumb thing to argue over. It's a stupid mechanic. Call it whatever you like.
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Lantyssa
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Posts: 20848
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Electrical tape.
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Hahahaha! I'm really good at this!
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Ingmar
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I don't know if it is stupid or not, really - games have done it both ways and I'm not sure if I have a preference. It isn't the way WoW does it, so yeah, if you think WoW's version of taunting is the best way to do it, then this probably looks stupid. I do find it kind of hard to get used to thinking about it this way, but that's tons of years of WoW warrior affecting me.
In any case my original point was this is not some change they made flailing around trying to fix the taunt system, this is their actual design. Better tooltips and a working combat log would have made us figure out how it works a lot faster, that's the part I would criticize myself.
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Fordel
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Posts: 8306
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The only thing truly stupid about it, is them not telling us how taunting worked right off the bat. That would of saved a lot of Guardians a lot of Grief.
It's not that different then just increasing the threat mod by 5000% or whatever happens in WoW now.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
Error 404: Title not found.
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The only thing truly stupid about it, is them not telling us how taunting worked right off the bat. That would of saved a lot of Guardians a lot of Grief.
It's not that different then just increasing the threat mod by 5000% or whatever happens in WoW now.
Spamming a look at me button, to me, seems a lot different than increasing a threat mod. I agree the tanking tooltips were horrific. If memory serves, only one or two actually referenced threat at all.
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Sjofn
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Posts: 8286
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would of
Would HAVE, you sonofabitch. That said, I don't have a huge amount of trouble holding aggro on something I intend to hold aggro on, and this is without spamming taunt. The only time there's a problem is when Ingmar or his companion (not so much mine, as I usually have the healer pet out) decide to focus on something that isn't my main target, which is ... pretty much the same it's always been, really. HOWEVER, I haven't actually tanked a flashpoint since level 30-ish (maybe even earlier) because Slap has pretty much no healers.
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God Save the Horn Players
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Nevermore
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Posts: 4740
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Transfer your Paladin over.
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Over and out.
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Sjofn
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Posts: 8286
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I already have TWO level 50 healers on the Republic side (and one on the Imperial side, now!). My point is if Slap does a flashpoint, I have to be the one healing it.
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God Save the Horn Players
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Surlyboi
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Posts: 10963
eat a bag of dicks
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I'll just die and be done with it.
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Tuned in, immediately get to watch cringey Ubisoft talking head offering her deepest sympathies to the families impacted by the Orlando shooting while flanked by a man in a giraffe suit and some sort of "horrifically garish neon costumes through the ages" exhibit or something. We need to stop this fucking planet right now and sort some shit out. -Kail
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Nevermore
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Posts: 4740
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I already have TWO level 50 healers on the Republic side (and one on the Imperial side, now!). My point is if Slap does a flashpoint, I have to be the one healing it.
My point is you enjoyed Paladin healing waaaaaaaay too much.
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Over and out.
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Sjofn
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Posts: 8286
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The trooper is close enough.
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God Save the Horn Players
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Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8306
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The only thing truly stupid about it, is them not telling us how taunting worked right off the bat. That would of saved a lot of Guardians a lot of Grief.
It's not that different then just increasing the threat mod by 5000% or whatever happens in WoW now.
Spamming a look at me button, to me, seems a lot different than increasing a threat mod. I agree the tanking tooltips were horrific. If memory serves, only one or two actually referenced threat at all. Not when they increase the threat mod so much that EVERY button a tank pushes is a "look at me" button. It's once every 15 seconds off the GCD for single target, if you hit it as much as possible. It's a non-issue.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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FieryBalrog
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Posts: 205
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It's a bit weird to have the look at me button be the same as the get back on me button.
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Paelos
Contributor
Posts: 27075
Error 404: Title not found.
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It's stupid. The idea of a taunt is to get something to notice you when it's not currently focused on you. Your other abilities are supposed to keep it on you.
I will give Blizzard credit for reworking shield block and heroic strike because it was getting spammed on every available cooldown by tanks. That's not what I would consider to be the purpose of tanking. They removed things which were no longer optional for tanks, and made them more situational. The taunt should be that, a situational ability, not a spamhole.
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CPA, CFO, Sports Fan, Game when I have the time
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Sjofn
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Posts: 8286
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It isn't, though, not really. It CAN be, but I'm pretty sure most tanks aren't doing that, and doing fine.
I like that if you use it on something already on you, it does something instead of nothing more than making me go "shit, whoops" and it being on cooldown.
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God Save the Horn Players
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Sky
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Posts: 32117
I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.
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caladein
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3174
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I don't really care one way or another about the concept of "Taunt", what I do care about is that is by far and away the best threat button one can push as a tank. And almost as importantly, that the game doesn't do one thing to explain that, either through tooltips or exposing threat data through the UI. As a napkin math exercise, here's a graph! Y is threat, X is time in seconds. The red line is sort of the worst case scenario from switching a non-taunting to a taunting rotation: only 500 TPS, no increase in APM, and the taunts are replacing "average" threat generating abilities. Realistically, taunts aren't on the GCD, it's only four or five extra APM, and I'm pretty sure raid tank TPS goes a good deal higher, but I'm not in a position to look at others' logs right now. E: Added link to sheet. E2: Grammar...
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« Last Edit: April 25, 2012, 12:34:50 PM by caladein »
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"Point being, they can't make everyone happy, so I hope they pick me." - Ingmar"OH MY GOD WE'RE SURROUNDED SEND FOR BACKUP DIG IN DEFENSIVE POSITIONS MAN YOUR NECKBEARDS" - tgr
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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Electrical tape.
Duck tape.
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Ingmar
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Posts: 19280
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Electrical tape.
Duck tape. Rabbit season!
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Sky
Terracotta Army
Posts: 32117
I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.
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Electrical tape.
Duck tape. Rabbit season!
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Ingmar
Terracotta Army
Posts: 19280
Auto Assault Affectionado
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Sjofn
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Posts: 8286
Truckasaurus Hands
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Target Markers can now be bound to keys in the preferences menu. That should please some of the people of Slap.
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God Save the Horn Players
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DraconianOne
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Posts: 2905
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Target Markers can now be bound to keys in the preferences menu. That should please some of the people of Slap. I missed that in the notes. Brilliant! Will make targeting healers in warzones so much easier!
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A point can be MOOT. MUTE is more along the lines of what you should be. - WayAbvPar
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Minvaren
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Posts: 1676
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"There are many things of which a wise man might wish to remain ignorant." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Fordel
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Posts: 8306
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Disappearing trinkets, nice.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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Lantyssa
Terracotta Army
Posts: 20848
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Please note, logging in to the game counts as entering a new area.
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Hahahaha! I'm really good at this!
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