Summer Expansion - Incarna

[Amaron]

I don't ( Being just a ship being one reason ), but I have always watched it for various reasons. I did not see the reaction of utter waste of time when it was heavily revealed publicly in 2008.

 That's 2008 and even then most logical players thought it was stupid.   Maybe a lot of people hoped it wouldn't be such a boondoggle but nobody said "Geee that's awesome and it's obviously what I want you to work on instead of all this other stuff".

The CQ is leggy, I get that. The whole thing to me reads as a very loud portion of the player-base is resistant to change that was always going to happen one day.

It's most definitely not a vocal minority or anything even remotely of the sort at this point.  I don't think you really quite have a concept of how bad it is.   They don't even have strafing animations.   You can't even walk sideways while mouse looking properly.   You can't run either but that might be on purpose since the cabin is smaller than my closet IRL.

[tgr]

So they added skills for sale already?

They haven't yet, no, but the soon to be 220+ page thread is basically repeating that question over and over, same with the soon to be 60+ page thread as a response to their last devblog. Apparently they're still not out and out refuting that claim.

[Kageru]

There's probably a difference between "yes, I guess avatars would be cool" and "the whole expansion was one room, a cash shop and a less functional interface?".

Really CCP have been distracted by other priorities for a while and Eve is on the back-burner. They've pretty much missed their chance to address sov being shit and super-caps being imbalanced and lost thousands of subs in the process I'm sure. The PvE experience is terrible, the progression from empire to the PvP game is broken and null-sec is sickly. They've been losing "faith" for some time, this is just a trigger.

[Comstar]

CCP thinks "nothing can replace them". But 70-90% of the players live in Empire. And the ship combat in SWTOR is going to be (well it looks like) more fun that running missions, or ratting, or mining. 

I'd like to know what Raph Koster thinks CCP is doing, and where does he think Eve Online will be in 6 months.

[Ingmar]

The ship combat in SWTOR is just a minigame basically, don't expect that to be the nail in CCP's coffin or anything.

[Comstar]

Just posted on EveNews24. Is this the nail you wanted? Our old enemy Lalante cancelled his 9 accounts this week. The nails are being hammered in.

Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:16:54 -0400
To: riverini@gmail.com
Subject: ccp ceo global msg sent today
From: evewatch@hush.com
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=.UTF-8.
Message-Id: <20110623221654.CF1E76F438@smtp.hushmail.com>

sent by hilmar to ccp global list-

(strt)

We live in interesting times; in fact CCP is the kind of company that if things get repetitive we instinctively crank it up a notch. That, we certainly have done this week. First of we have Incarna, an amazing technological and artistic achievement. A vision from years ago realized to a point that no one could have imaged but a few months ago. It rolls out without a hitch, is in some cases faster than what we had before, this is the pinnacle of professional achievement. For all the noise in the channel we should all stand proud, years from now this is what people will remember.

But we have done more, not only have we redefined the production quality one can apply to virtual worlds with the beautiful Incarna but we have also defined what it really means to make virtual reality more meaningful than real life when it comes to launching our new virtual goods currency, Aurum.

Naturally, we have caught the attention of the world. Only a few weeks ago we revealed more information about DUST 514 and now we have done it again by committing to our core purpose as a company by redefining assumptions. After 40 hours we have already sold 52 monocles, generating more revenue than any of the other items in the store.

This we have done after months of research by a group of highly competent professionals, soliciting input and perspective from thought leaders and experts in and around our industry. We have communicated our intention here internally in very wide circles through the Virtual Economy Summit presentation at the GSM, our Fearless newsletter, sprint reviews, email lists and multiple other channels. This should not come as a surprise to anyone.

Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change.

We went out with a decisive strategy on pricing and we will stay the course and not flip flop around or knee jerk react to the predictable. That is not saying nothing will change, on the contrary, in fact we know that success in this space is through learning and adapting to _what is actually happening_ and new knowledge gained in addition to what we knew before and expected.

All that said, I couldnât be prouder of what we have accomplished as a company, changing the world is hard and we are doing it as so many times before! Stay the course, we have done this many times before.

(end)

Mitten's was speechless. 8 Pages in 20 minutes on the Eve-O Forum.  No one is awake in Iceland apart from two graveyard GM's who told the rioting that no one else is paying attention. The forums are on fire and threads are going so fast they aren't being monitored.

Anyone who was playing SWG when NGE started remember if this is as big a reaction? It looks like it.

[Fordel]

That letter can't be real, can it? 

[Kageru]

The original thread I was reading got nuked from orbit which is basically confirmation.

[FatuousTwat]

we have also defined what it really means to make virtual reality more meaningful than real life when it comes to launching our new virtual goods currency, Aurum.

wat

This whole email stinks of bullshit, but if it isn't, glorious.

[Kageru]

I could imagine that becoming a classic... though mostly of self-delusion in the gaming domain.

[Amaron]

 

I need to stock up on popcorn.

[jcthebuilder]

CCP's stance to let player actions determine the future might have been okay if new stuff didn't keep coming out fanning the outrage of players.

Putting off their response until Friday afternoon might have been a really bad move on their part.

[Simond]

we have also defined what it really means to make virtual reality more meaningful than real life when it comes to launching our new virtual goods currency, Aurum.

wat

This whole email stinks of bullshit, but if it isn't, glorious.

To be fair, the EVE ISK is (or was) probably more solid than the RL ISK. 

And I'm out. Haven't really been playing for a while now, and this just gives me the final nudge over the edge.

[Sparky]

If that email is real I'm defecting to the "this is thier NGE moment" camp.

[IainC]

Bloodworth:

The history of Incarna is an interesting one and you are missing a lot of the context as an outsider. CCP first revealed it at Fanfest in 2008 and said that at that time they had already been working on it for a couple of years. At Fanfest players were able to see some work-in progress environments and concept art and to have a quick hands-on with a multiplayer minigame that was going to be implemented in the shared areas.

The next year at Fanfest, CCP said that they were radically reworking Incarna and they didn't show as much as they had the year before. In both cases, the general public perception can be summarised as cautious optimism - if there was significant gameplay that could be added to the station environment and if the players who were invested in the main flying in space game didn't have their experience eroded as a result then it would be a generally good thing.

For the next couple of years CCP were completely dark on the project. All they would say was that they were still working on it and that they planned to reveal it when it was ready. At Fanfest 2011 - three years after it was first announced and five years after they started development on it, CCP gave some tentative details about the summer expansion. Limited to Captain's Quarters, no multi-player areas, no minigame, no social experience other than the chat. Players were less enthusiastic especially after the CSM open letter (which I was a part of drafting) had warned CCP that the CSM impression of the feature was that it was lacking in direction and that CCP's messaging fell hopelessly short.

So now Incarna has released. It's incomplete, shows schizophrenic design, is ugly and way behind the curve technically. 3D is a solved problem, Everyone except Obsidian has been able to produce quality environments, animations and models for a while now, what we see in Incarna is 2003 levels of technical aptitude. For Hilmar to call it 'beautiful' and 'redefining production quality' is either wilfully obtuse or simply delusional. There is no gameplay and CCP does not seem to have a plan to make it a meaningful part of the Eve experience except as a conduit for MTx. All it is at present is a clumsier and less functional interface for the things you could do already with a cash-shop bolted on the top and there has been no indication to the playerbase or to the CSM that this is going to change. At the December summit we asked CCP for the general direction of Incarna and what the long term plan was and they were unable to give it to us. For me and the majority of the CSM at the time the impression was that they weren't refusing to answer our questions out of a desire to keep things a secret but more because they simply didn't know. Questions on the actual function if Incarna were met with surprise as if it was inconceivable that players might want more from the feature than to simply see their character.

All the while CCP have been failing to manage the expectations or control the message regarding an expansion that they presented to the CSM as their 'bet the farm' moment, the expansion that was likely to be the most significant in their history and the most critical to the continued success of their flagship product.

[tgr]

ARE YOU MOVING PAST VANITY ITEMS FOR AURUM?:
[ ] YES
[ ] NO
[ ] MAYBE
[ ] AFRAID TO TELL
[ ] SCARED ****TLESS
[ ] I WANT MY MOMMY


Just answer the QUESTION !!

 

[Amaron]

Oh shit we're about to see if their forums roll over when the threadnaught hits 256.

[Tyrnan]

 I wish there were some dev trackers for EvE.   I feel like I'm missing some truly good tidbits out there.  Every time they post something without even promising some changes is sort of hilarious in it's own way.

http://www.eve-search.com/search/dpf/dev

There you go, although given the current level of communication I wouldn't expect too much from it.

[Sparky]

[tmp]

They are clearly overlooking where teh money is, though.

(pay with AUR to get a move on the jump-in queue)

[sinij]

CCP is trying to cash in on micro-transactions (M-T) while double-dipping with monthly subscriptions. Its a risky and bold move for a company, but whatever the outcome is - gamers lose. Next step is to slowly "boil the frog" to the point that M-T are considered mandatory and everyone buys couple 'monocles', because they have to.

Predictably steps to M-T milking are as follows: Get your players invested in the game during early progress, slowly introduce M-T as optional shortcuts around tedious parts mid-game to get them used to the idea, by the end game have M-Ts completely mandatory, with a model where you don't have any limit/cap on how beneficial they are - more you buy "better" it gets.

[Simond]

Can we stop calling these microtransactions, please? I think paying more than retail price of a newly-released AAA game makes them more some sort of...macrotransaction.

[Amaron]

Can we stop calling these microtransactions, please? I think paying more than retail price of a newly-released AAA game makes them more some sort of...macrotransaction.

If you buy 10 legos for 1 dollar is that a macro transaction or a micro transaction under this new terminology?

[tgr]

legotransaction.

[Amaron]

legostransaction.

FTFY

[sinij]

$60 price shocker is just a failure of marketing department. It isn't that hard to create 60 different monocles (that you can wear at the same time) and charge 1$ each. CCP are amatures, pros charge less than "enrage price" and donate half to charity so you don't object as much. End result - you still pay for worthless pixels.

[Mrbloodworth]

I believe the pricing was part of the attempt not to upset the market, as stated.

[sinij]

I believe the pricing was part of the attempt not to upset the market, as stated.

Sorry, what market? Monocle industry?

[palmer_eldritch]

If the only way they can add monocles without upsetting the market is to charge $60 for them then they've done something wrong, surely?

Even so, I've resubbed. Got to be there for the next glorious phase in Bat Country's story.

[Modern Angel]

I believe the pricing was part of the attempt not to upset the market, as stated.

You pick the weirdest goddamned things to be an apologist for, Blood.

[tgr]

Honestly, it's much easier (and probably more correct) to just assume that they're either incompetent or just plain greedy/out of touch with the world. Occam's razor and all that.

Let's go through what CCP has been doing the past 2 weeks.
1) Golden Scorpion. Pay AUR, get ship with paintjob.
2) $99/year "commercial license" just to connect to their API.
3) $70 monocles
4) Devblog from Arnar, senior producer
5) Alleged (but seemingly verified as real) global email from Hilmar, CEO

Just to emphasize parts of that last URL:

Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change.

Combine all that with what I believe is very little denial that this is actually the case, and well... yeah.

Edit: Oh, and before I forget, no more shipspinning

[kildorn]

Honestly, it's much easier (and probably more correct) to just assume that they're either incompetent or just plain greedy/out of touch with the world. Occam's razor and all that.

Let's go through what CCP has been doing the past 2 weeks.
1) Golden Scorpion. Pay AUR, get ship with paintjob.
2) $99/year "commercial license" just to connect to their API.
3) $70 monocles
4) Devblog from Arnar, senior producer
5) Alleged (but seemingly verified as real) global email from Hilmar, CEO

Just to emphasize parts of that last URL:

Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change.

Combine all that with what I believe is very little denial that this is actually the case, and well... yeah.

Edit: Oh, and before I forget, no more shipspinning

You forgot the line: "After 40 hours we have already sold 52 monocles, generating more revenue than any of the other items in the store."

If you're taking monocle sales figures as proof it's a success, you were not planning on lowering that price quickly. You're pretty much going "jackpot!" and extrapolating sales figures to see if you can maybe sell a few extra lows or mids on ships for $40/pop.

[tgr]

Yes, yes I did. Thanks.

[Comstar]

CCP Zulu responds to player concerns Via Youtube, from this eve-o thread

The players reaction is exactly what mine was. I guess the price of pants in Iceland is a lot.

[luckton]

Pfft...figures.  I finally get the gumption to try this game out again and it has to go all 'Viva La Revolution' on me    At the very least the game's still here, unlike some other sandbox game that recently called it quits.

Still having fun noobing it up, but depending on how this pans out, I guess I'm back to waiting on TOR.