Re: LOTRO Goes Free to Play : Sept 10 (Sept 8 for Cool Kids)

[Sky]

Regardless crafting gear for yourself is rather pointless since you're not getting good stuff for the time you can craft it, and you don't need to use it to "fill slots"

Seems crafting might need some work.

Then you can hear everyone whine about not earning gear!

[Rishathra]

I've found crafting extemely beneficial, but only in a specific circumstance - twinking.  My supreme master tailor, metalsmith, and weaponsmith can furnish great sets of armor and weapons for my lower level characters, especially if i crit the one shot recipes.  Otherwise, I agree that you can't really make stuff for yourself.  There are a few useful items I can make for my max level guys, like the Galadhrim armor and weapons, but that's it.

[Yegolev]

if it's for bored twentysomethings,

If that's a dig at me, I should probably be honored....

Was not, but feel free to be honored.  Just a comment on where I suppose MMO gaming is going (or staying).

[Azazel]

I've found crafting extemely beneficial, but only in a specific circumstance - twinking.  My supreme master tailor, metalsmith, and weaponsmith can furnish great sets of armor and weapons for my lower level characters, especially if i crit the one shot recipes.  Otherwise, I agree that you can't really make stuff for yourself.  There are a few useful items I can make for my max level guys, like the Galadhrim armor and weapons, but that's it.

It depends on how much you play. My group play an evening once per week at best, but more likely once a month or maybe a couple times a month. Meanwhile it's easy enough to log on now and then for the tradeskill bumps, so we're making the guild-tier blues in advance of getting to level since we have a bunch of supreme master tradeskillers (including 4 SM tailors on alts).

We're obviously unusual in this way though, and we never played EQ or WoW in the same manner.

As for the class thing, unfortunately none of the healers stand out to me, which is what I usually play.  Among the damage dealers though, Burgler totally has "Cal, play me."  I would like to make a healer eventually, just that choosing between Minstrel, Rune-Keeper, and Captain seems a bit like choosing among different places to get stabbed...

I played a minstrel to 30.  It's a buff class.  If you don't like mashing buttons to keep buffs up, then don't bother.

My Minstrel is now 55. I play in a group of 4, and sometimes, duoing with my wife's hunter. Most of the times we play, I spend all my time making things blow up. I drop a couple of buffs from time to time. I pull. Very occasionally, I drop a heal or two. Outside of instances, I rarely need to heal. Inside instances, I drop my warspeech and go heal-bitch and quite enjoy it.

I haven't yet encountered the buff-button-mashing aspect, personally. Unless you mean Ballards. But my ballards hurt people, so I consider them attack spells that happen to have group buffs on them. 

[Soln]

at end game you will need to maintain ballads and fellow heals  (main was a minnie)

[Azazel]

I have to say, the more I hear about the end game of this thing the less excited I am about getting there. It seems more grindy than WoW, and I have no interest in raiding.

[Rishathra]

I think I've spent more time at max level with my main than I did leveling it.  I still have things I like to do and stats I can buff more and objectives I can grind up.  I like that there are still options for me to decide what I might like to work on today.  The beauty of it is that I have never raided.  I have done maybe three instances, one time each.  I couldn't stand them, or raiding.  This is not a LotRO-specific hate.  I hate how they work in every MMO.  The ones here are actually the least offensive I have experienced, because they are paced and scripted well, and I can do one and afterward be guaranteed to have gotten something from it, even if it's only a token.

[Yegolev]

September 10th.

[Nebu]

I think I've spent more time at max level with my main than I did leveling it.  I still have things I like to do and stats I can buff more and objectives I can grind up.  I like that there are still options for me to decide what I might like to work on today.  The beauty of it is that I have never raided.  I have done maybe three instances, one time each.  I couldn't stand them, or raiding.  This is not a LotRO-specific hate.  I hate how they work in every MMO.  The ones here are actually the least offensive I have experienced, because they are paced and scripted well, and I can do one and afterward be guaranteed to have gotten something from it, even if it's only a token.

Thank you for this.  I'm leveling a toon up and knowing that there is something fun to do solo at endgame will help me through those times when I want to give up. 

I like the world, the people, the housing, the deeds, and the appearance tab.  A lot.  I just can't seem to push myself past level 35.  I've made it there 4 times.  Maybe my 5th attempt will make it to the endgame.

[Reg]

Making it past 35 doesn't make you safe from burn out. I've come and gone several times since then even in the middle of Moria. The game is still boringly grindy, and in Moria they still use travel as punishment to make you indulge in another horrible faction grind just to get a working mount - your horse doesn't work underground you see.

[Nebu]

Making it past 35 doesn't make you safe from burn out. I've come and gone several times since then even in the middle of Moria. The game is still boringly grindy, and in Moria they still use travel as punishment to make you indulge in another horrible faction grind just to get a working mount - your horse doesn't work underground you see.

 

Sounds like cold weather flight in WoW.  At least that was relatively inexpensive. 

[Reg]

This is much worse than cold weather flight in WoW. Moria is huge and walking around takes forever. The last few times I've gone back have only been during the promotions when they had double experience and free fast travel everywhere. Even with that I'd lose interest before the promotion expired.

I'll check it out once it goes free to play but I suspect the devs will use their inclination to bore their players to death with pointless grinds as incentive to force them into the game store. There's not a chance in the world that I'll spend money just to buy my way past their shitty grinds so I'm not real hopeful.

[Zetor]

Sadly, that's not too much of an exaggeration. Moria has some really bad zones (eff you silvertine lodes) and even fast travel is gated in a way that you'll get access to it when you don't need it anymore (my favorite is the road on the horse / foot path that winds about 10 times before going into 21st hall... definition of a timewaster right there); in order to use mounts you need to do some serious grinding or a deep purse + AH scavenging for rep items. On the bright side, Moria does have some neat zones (the water and lava one, and some of the dungeon subzones) and some interesting quests (stealth op, riddles, whatnot) so it's ultimately still worth the hassle imo.

As an illustration, the best way of travel inside Moria for our group was binding at the northernmost location (west from 21st hall, near to most of the quest hubs) and jumping into the well if we needed a shortcut to the southern areas. Jumping into the well teleported you to the waterworks, but it also killed you (repair cost and everything). It was STILL worthwhile to use as a main method of transportation. 

[Reg]

I hate being so painfully negative. The game has so much potential - there's a reason I keep going back. Unfortunately, the devs just don't seem to quite understand that the days of wasting players time with long painful travel and arduous grinding as a way to slow down content consumption is well in the past.

Seriously, some heads need to roll starting at the top. Some improvements have been made but not enough - or they wouldn't need to be doing this free to play nonsense.

[Nija]

I just can't seem to push myself past level 35.  I've made it there 4 times.  Maybe my 5th attempt will make it to the endgame.

I'm right there with you. I've got 4 characters between 30 and 42. It just gets SO FUCKING BORING right there. You have to run all over the fucking place and you end up having 20 group quests in your log that would push you over the edge if you could just get in those groups. Of course, those 20 group quests are spread between 4 zones, and you never seem to be in the correct one where a group is forming to knock them out.

It's a fucking nightmare and the entire 30-45 level range needs to be entirely revamped. I'm going to pass up the game when it goes FTP until I have confirmation that this section has been reworked. So essentially that means I'll never play lotro again.

[Ingmar]

Huh I burned through that range faster than I could finish quests, I was dropping grey quests all over the place. I didn't bother keeping group quests in my log at all. I did almost all of Evendim, parts of Trollshaws and Misty Mountains, and then taxied on into Angmar. Skirmishes helped.

[caladein]

September 10th.

It's the 8th if you are a:

Current subscribers/players (anyone who has an active subscription as of Sept. 7th.)
Former Subscribers.
Anyone who has purchased Shadows of Angmar, Mines of Moria, or Siege of Mirkwood products.
LOTRO F2P Beta participants (must have logged into and played the beta version of LOTRO F2P Beta prior to the close of beta)

[Zetor]

Mini-bump -- LOTRO f2p is coming next week. 

As a reminder, there are some things you can do pre-F2P to get VIP access for a few months on the cheap, see here -- http://www.casualstrolltomordor.com/2010/08/experience-lotro-vip-access-for-less/
This Massively article also gives a good overview about F2P resources and how to get the most out of the game on a tight budget. I find it interesting that the purchase of only 3 leveling packs (North Downs, Evendim, Forochel) gives you enough content to get to Moria... at least in theory. :p

[Sir T]

I'll go back as my eve subscription is over by then, but I wont play on anything other than my Hunter. The travel in that game drove me bonkers and caused me to quit.

[birdsguts]

Mini-bump -- LOTRO f2p is coming next week. 

As a reminder, there are some things you can do pre-F2P to get VIP access for a few months on the cheap, see here -- http://www.casualstrolltomordor.com/2010/08/experience-lotro-vip-access-for-less/
This Massively article also gives a good overview about F2P resources and how to get the most out of the game on a tight budget. I find it interesting that the purchase of only 3 leveling packs (North Downs, Evendim, Forochel) gives you enough content to get to Moria... at least in theory. :p

Awesome.
Did this about a month ago just to get prepped for the F2P mode.
Went with the MoM version. I'd recommend it to anyone who isn't sure yet. You get most of the money back in points and you keep the content that comes with the "box".
Figure I'll keep a couple characters around to slowly level.
Lots of value for 8 bucks.

[amiable]

I hate being so painfully negative. The game has so much potential - there's a reason I keep going back. Unfortunately, the devs just don't seem to quite understand that the days of wasting players time with long painful travel and arduous grinding as a way to slow down content consumption is well in the past.

Seriously, some heads need to roll starting at the top. Some improvements have been made but not enough - or they wouldn't need to be doing this free to play nonsense.

As someone who had 2 65's and played with a group of friends and family I couldn't agree more...  The thing that made this game great pre-moria was that pretty much everyone could obtain top end gear from the crafting system then go do what they want, hit dungeons, pvmp, hang in bree playing "stairway to heaven" on their lute, raid, etc...  in my mind the absolutely absurd grind introduced to obtain radiance gear to gate all of their content was completely unnecessary and totally destroyed the feel of the game.  What finally caused us all to quit though was the legendary item system and the completely absurd grind associated with finding and leveling up weapons.  That whole system is an abortion and needs to be culled.

[birdsguts]

Gah, I'm sorry to hear that. I'll have to be sure to take the journey extra slow.

[Kitsune]

One thing to note, Gamestop's selling the collector's edition of Moria for ten bucks if you can find a copy in a local store.  Two bucks more than standard and you get some in-game goodies for it.

[Yegolev]

Somewhat ironically, I stopped playing Eve partly due to the travel time.

[Modern Angel]

The travel time is waaaayyyyy better than it used to be. Plenty of fast travel, plenty of paths. The only irritating remnants are Forochel's paths being entirely linked to rep, so that when you go there in Book 13 post-leveling speed changes most people don't have anything unlocked. That's obnoxious as fuck.

[Ingmar]

The travel time is waaaayyyyy better than it used to be. Plenty of fast travel, plenty of paths. The only irritating remnants are Forochel's paths being entirely linked to rep, so that when you go there in Book 13 post-leveling speed changes most people don't have anything unlocked. That's obnoxious as fuck.

There are rep-tied horse routes in Angmar and Evendim too.

[Modern Angel]

There are but they're not remotely as bad.

[Ingmar]

There are but they're not remotely as bad.

If you're doing the epic chapters in Angmar, that one at least is quite horrible to not have access to imo.

[Modern Angel]

I agree somewhat. I'm saying it's not as bad as Forochel. I did an alt run through the Book I epic stuff and Angmar was annoying but did not break me. Forochel just about broke me.

[shiznitz]

It comes down to the fact - a simple business fact - that all these MMOGs eventually lose any momentum with new subscribers.  At that point, maintaining becomes all the dev care about and that means stretching out the experience, not speeding it up.  Devs seems to believe that it is only a matter of time before everyone quits so they seem to approach game design in a mature game as "if I can just keep the 100 players (whoever they are) that are about to quit for just one more month.." over and over again.

[Reg]

The thing is, most people I know who have problems with Lotro were driven off by the appalling grindiness long before they actually used up all of the content. If what you're saying is true the Lotro devs have killed their own game by being too worried about people hitting the level cap quickly.

[Modern Angel]

I don't know. I just don't feel the grindiness. If I were still the guy who had to have top gear in everything, yes. That is grindy. But I'm not that guy. The only gated stuff are the raids. I can see how it can be grindy, certainly, but I don't play it that way so I've never really run into it.

[Numtini]

I know very few people who played LOTRO seriously and left on some kind of negative feelings. Most people just never tried it. Most of my friends who left have drifted in and out of LOTRO and other games without any "I quit" sort of feelings. More the sense that there was a shiny somewhere else they wanted to check out. I was having fun in LOTRO when I joined up with LOVEU/Goons. It was me getting drawn into that, not LOTRO sucking or anything.

I found the most frustrating part being the group instances and systemic disincentives to to forming groups. Followed by making the instances so trivial they were effectively participatory cut scenes--if they ever actually finished doing that. To me, the instances are the best part of the game. and the most difficult and irritating to experience. The first time I did the great barrow, with a level appropriate group, it was one of the best dungeon experiences I've ever had in a game. Getting "run" through it by a bunch of level 50s, not so much. Getting a buff and doing one solo, when it was so easy I went afk for five minutes in a fight and still won? Not so much either.

All "end games" are going to be grindy whether they are levelling a weapon or doing the same raid for six months. It's the nature of the thing. An "end game" is what you do repeatedly when there's nothing else left you haven't finished. At least with raids and instances you do it with friends, which is to me the fun part of raiding or pvp.

[DraconianOne]

I don't know. I just don't feel the grindiness.

Do you not bother with traits and titles or crafting then?

[Reg]

Communities are self-selecting. A group of people who play any game "seriously" is going to generally have positive feelings about the game and not perceive its problems as problems.  These aren't the guys to listen to if you hope to attract and retain new people. On the other hand you don't want to destroy their game like SWG did either.

I've come and gone from Lotro lots of times. I never leave in a rage. I just get overcome with boredom and stop logging in.