Patch 3.3

[Polysorbate80]

Last time, then I'm off to DM for the group--it's D&D night, and I've got a bottle of Balvenie and a full party to kill 

A)  I didn't want to change.  Whatever the fuck reason, it doesn't matter, because

B) I didn't need to change.  Everything worked smoothly regardless of whether you think I made a poor choice or not.

So, whatever.  Drinking time in 15 minutes :P

[WindupAtheist]

It "works" because at this point in the expansion the average group of retards can easily four-man a heroic, they don't really need you at all, and they don't feel like kicking you. If you were trying to heal with this same sense of "Expecting me to play the game right is elitist!" entitlement, you'd have people cussing you out as they wiped over and over. But you're a PUG DPS and as long as you appear to be fighting and aren't naked, everyone will just roll their eyes and go on with their business.

[Selby]

But you're a PUG DPS and as long as you appear to be fighting and aren't naked, everyone will just roll their eyes and go on with their business.

Exactly.  As long as you are remotely appearing to DPS (1500+) most people aren't going to care outside of the 3 new heroics.  People care about those, because they are considerably harder and require more effort from people to complete.  You can't always easily carry a 5th person who wants to do things their own way in them (same with raids, which he admit he won't do this in).  I've run with mages who insisted on nothing but casting arcane missiles over and over again using some bizarre spec that doesn't really get any deep talents or hunters is who use scattershot and autoshot and nothing else.  These guys did technically work at what they were doing, but they were barely making any real dents in the mobs and we might as well have been 4-manning the instance.  Most of the time we just ignore them, but every now and again we'll get someone who is rubbed the wrong way that a 213+ geared character is only doing 1100DPS and will start a major scene ending with that person either leaving or kicking the low DPSing offender out.

[Shrike]

An il213 character should still be able to throw down some good dps IF they're trying. That's what gets my spacegoat: people that don't even try.

I"m still reminded of a quasi-PuG in a 10 man Uldaur. We were struggling on skychicken/dragon/whatever and during a rebuff I actually started to look around at my fellow raiders. Rogues with no weapons enchants, rogues with no armor enchants. Half the raid without flasks. Toons with blue gear. WTF? This is Uldaur. Blue gear? Man. We did make it to Kologarn and to this day I'm still not sure how. Nice people, but have some pride. I wouldn't have dared set foot in Uldaur with a character set up like this. I was a little pissed at first (wasting my time...but I was only there for the Lev trinket), but I suspect some were alts and they were civil. Not a small thing in WoW these days.

[Selby]

An il213 character should still be able to throw down some good dps IF they're trying. That's what gets my spacegoat: people that don't even try.

Indeed.  This is what most people are going to have issues and start a scene over.  If they think you are not trying.  No one considers a DPS in old heroics doing 2500+ to not be trying, even if their spec is goofy and gear is wonky.

Nice people, but have some pride. I wouldn't have dared set foot in Uldaur with a character set up like this.

I had this issue with TotC-10 a few weeks before the patch.  I get called in to heal as a druid and the first thing the shaman healer who was recruited to main tank heal is "I won't do it, I'm geared for chain heal only" so I have to HoT up BOTH tanks as BOTH of the other healers ONLY want to raid heal and one begrudgingly agreed to assist me.  I should have known something was up then.  On the first boss, the shaman raid healer goes down in the first 30s (I do not know how for the life of me this happened as firebombs hadn't even gone out yet) so now I am on raid heals in addition to the two tank heals.  Well obviously you can imagine that this is difficult, but I'm keeping the tanks and raid alive and we get Gormok down and start on Acidmaw and Dreadscale.  I notice firebombs are still going off and that the DPS is NOT killing the snobolds AT ALL.  We wipe and repeat this 3 times because every single time the DPS refuse to kill the snobolds despite the raid leader yelling at them to do so.  Finally the tanks say "the druid healer is good, the rest of you fuckers suck" and quit the group.  I start inspecting people out and most are decked out in 200 level gear and using really crazy bizarre specs.  No enchants or gems that made much sense (lots of +spirit on a warlock, str on a rogue, etc) so all I can guess is that people wanted to see the raid, but didn't have a single clue as to what the fuck they needed to do to make the raid successfull such as how to kill the boss or not die.

[Sheepherder]

lots of +spirit on a warlock

Warlocks get 50% of their spirit as spellpower with Glyph of Life Tap and Fel Armor, and Life Tap scales off of spirit with a 300% coefficient.

[Sjofn]

I have yet to tank for a group where I am not #1 or #2 on dps. Basically me and the healer (my healers have all been good) give free piggyback rides through heroics.

And you know what? I refuse to feel bad for thinking "wtf, people" at the dpsers that cannot beat my totally awesome 1700 dps.

[WindupAtheist]

I hate to bag on Poly too much, like some WoW general forum e-peen warrior, but if you want to be Mr. Unique Snowflake McCrazyspec then keep that shit to your guild where they can slap you around if they don't like it, or just use it for dailies or whatever. Don't go foisting it on the general public. We have enough problems with people who don't even KNOW they're doing it wrong. I'm as casual as they come (except when it comes to lore, RAWR) but I still have a thread on the first page of this forum where I link my armory and go "This doesn't look too retarded does it?"

PS: The new LFG tool is just jizztasticly awesome. Every game of similar design from now on that doesn't copy it is offically BROKEN.

[Sheepherder]

Blizzard's random dungeon queue manages to be the single largest innovation in MMO's since 2004.  That I can knock over three dungeons in an hour if my selected group isn't too fucking stupid is sublime.

[K9]

The only time I hate the LFG tool is when it keeps pairing me with crap DPS. I was 4th on damage as a disc priest in hc CoT yesterday, and 2nd in overall damage in hc VH the day before. My gear is decent for healing, but if you're a DPS and loosing out to smite and holy nova spam, you are fucking terrible.

[Fabricated]

I've only had like 2 really terrible heroic random pugs and both were when I got one of the new Icecrown 5-mans. Which is annoying since there's a few items I'd like out of there.

Meanwhile every old heroic I get a pug full of people pulling 4-5k+ DPS. My current record for clearing Azjol'Nerub is 6 minutes.

[Fordel]

Six Minutes is 

[JWIV]

I have yet to tank for a group where I am not #1 or #2 on dps. Basically me and the healer (my healers have all been good) give free piggyback rides through heroics.

And you know what? I refuse to feel bad for thinking "wtf, people" at the dpsers that cannot beat my totally awesome 1700 dps.

I wish I could say this.  I know my tank skills are a bit rusty,  but god damn they're not THAT RUSTY.  While the majority of the groups I've healed for have been passable at the least, the majority of groups I've tried to tank for have been complete fuckwits.  Or is stand back and let me break LOS that difficult of a concept these days? 

[Lakov_Sanite]

The only time I hate the LFG tool is when it keeps pairing me with crap DPS.

You can fix the lfg tools, you can fix the game but you can't fix stupid.

[Rasix]

I have yet to tank for a group where I am not #1 or #2 on dps. Basically me and the healer (my healers have all been good) give free piggyback rides through heroics.

And you know what? I refuse to feel bad for thinking "wtf, people" at the dpsers that cannot beat my totally awesome 1700 dps.

Are you #1/2 in actual DPS or damage done?  I've seen the later a lot in areas where there's a lot of AE packs or stuff that dies very quickly because the tank (usually a pally/DK) can kill the stuff before anyone else can react. 

I've started finishing first in about 80% of the groups I do now.     Last time I almost lost to a tank, it was a feral pulling 3k+.  I've seen paladins pulling almost 3.5k. 

[Draegan]

I'm doing the whole leveling in instances thing while doing gathering/trades in between.

Holy fuck is it tough going through inscription.  I'm in the process of making Jadefire Ink from Emerald Pigment.  God damn goldthorn/whiskers/fadeleaf.  There isn't a big concentration of these herbs and it's a god damn pain.  God damn.

I don't have enough cash to buy ink/herbs from the AH either.

[Soulflame]

it's 15 minutes until you can vote to kick someone anyway.

Nah, you can vote to kick before 15min.  We had a healer DC on zone-in this morning and we were able to votekick after killing the first trash, with 11min on the timer still.

I believe you can vote to kick someone if they have been disconnected for more than one minute.  It's one of the few exceptions (maybe the only one) to the 15 minute rule.

I should also note that the blizzard devs think it's supposed to be 5 minutes, so it may change in the near future.

[Sjofn]

I'm number 1 or 2 in both dps and damage done most of the time. If I'm number two, number one has usually done like 4500 dps over the course of the instance, and that doesn't bother me as long as it doesn't bother them.   I do take the AE aspects into account but it's really not "Sjofn is just swiping to dps victory before anyone else can do anything." It really is "Sjofn is tanking for mostly shitty DPS." In the long run I don't care, it makes my job pretty facerolly, and I'm not really taking that much damage even with stuff dying kinda slow.

I met my first total asshat of a DK yesterday! He decided to Army of the Dead on the whirlwindy boss in Nexus. Not a big deal but it was annoying, and I told him to please not do that on the other bosses because sadly the dungeon bosses don't ignore the ghoul taunts like raid bosses do. And he totally fucking sneered at me saying, "What raids do YOU tank in THAT gear? Naxx 10?"

I enjoyed that because a) he was rocking blues, b) he was also rocking about 1400 dps, c) the assumption Jassan is my main, and d) Jassan's gear is NOT THAT BAD ANYWAY (his tank shit is mostly HToC or whatever).

He also liked standing in front of mobs (I got to explain why he shouldn't) and learned his main is a hunter. I laughed. Then I put him on ignore.  


EDIT: Oh yeah, Dreagan, learn to love Swamp of Sorrows. If you just ride in circles along the edge you should get plenty of goldthorn. If you're feeling sassy and run all over the place, you'll trip over lots of fadeleaf and whiskers as well, plus blindweed for TEH FUTURE.

[Soulflame]

It "works" because at this point in the expansion the average group of retards can easily four-man a heroic, they don't really need you at all, and they don't feel like kicking you. If you were trying to heal with this same sense of "Expecting me to play the game right is elitist!" entitlement, you'd have people cussing you out as they wiped over and over. But you're a PUG DPS and as long as you appear to be fighting and aren't naked, everyone will just roll their eyes and go on with their business.

Exactly.  If a healer tried to run some weird ass spec, it probably wouldn't work at all, and the group would die repeatedly.  If a tank ran some weird ass spec, it'd probably work even worse, and the group would dissolve after a few wipes, and someone realized that hey, this "tank" isn't anything of the sort.

Right now all that's saving you is the 15 minute kick timer.  PUG DPS is literally dime-a-dozen, or possibly dime-a-hundred.  You can be replaced in less time than it takes to link Recount to the guild to show how this one DPS can't even match the tank.

[AutomaticZen]

Exactly.  If a healer tried to run some weird ass spec, it probably wouldn't work at all, and the group would die repeatedly.  If a tank ran some weird ass spec, it'd probably work even worse, and the group would dissolve after a few wipes, and someone realized that hey, this "tank" isn't anything of the sort.

Right now all that's saving you is the 15 minute kick timer.  PUG DPS is literally dime-a-dozen, or possibly dime-a-hundred.  You can be replaced in less time than it takes to link Recount to the guild to show how this one DPS can't even match the tank.

If it teleported the new DPS to where the rest of the group was, there'd be even less reason not to.  Waiting for the new DPS to catch up to everyone is the worst part.

Hell,  I had a warlock yesterday pull while I was buffing.  I calmly watched him die, and then I tanked the mobs.  Once the pull was over, I told him directly, 'you pull it, you tank it.'  No problems after that.

[K9]

I'm doing the whole leveling in instances thing while doing gathering/trades in between.

Holy fuck is it tough going through inscription.  I'm in the process of making Jadefire Ink from Emerald Pigment.  God damn goldthorn/whiskers/fadeleaf.  There isn't a big concentration of these herbs and it's a god damn pain.  God damn.

I don't have enough cash to buy ink/herbs from the AH either.

Hit swamp of sorrows, it's a great place to powerlevel both herbing and inscription. I feel your pain though, I can only reassure you with the fact that it does get better, especially once you hit 300, from there it's a breeze up to 430ish when it really slows down again.

[Draegan]

Swamp of Sorrows... I had complete forgot about that little place.  I'll be there tonight.

I'm already up to 230ish with herbalism at level 38 and 151 inscription.  I'm almost caught up with my level.

[Jayce]

I hate the new LFG tool.

[WindupAtheist]

My sub was due to run out in a few days. I was going to let it lapse. Then the new LFG tool came crashing in through a plate glass window on a motorcycle, dramatically took off its sunglasses, and went "Oh no you don't motherfucker!"

[Lt.Dan]

I'm doing the whole leveling in instances thing while doing gathering/trades in between.

I thought I'd do that...then I hit Outlands and random isn't so random anymore    I got Ramparts 6 times in a row, then I got Slave Pens 3 times in a row, then UB 6 times in a row and now I'm in my Auchenai Crypts cycle.

Also, Auchenai Crypts is not my favourite instance.  Two bosses which you can't faceroll and a couple of tricky pulls almost guarantees a wipe or two.  Sure the challenge is nice but would be nice to have a clean run.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I'm doing the whole leveling in instances thing while doing gathering/trades in between.

I thought I'd do that...then I hit Outlands and random isn't so random anymore    I got Ramparts 6 times in a row, then I got Slave Pens 3 times in a row, then UB 6 times in a row and now I'm in my Auchenai Crypts cycle.

Also, Auchenai Crypts is not my favourite instance.  Two bosses which you can't faceroll and a couple of tricky pulls almost guarantees a wipe or two.  Sure the challenge is nice but would be nice to have a clean run.

/shrug

for old world levelling i can see dungeons being a fun alternative but i can literally be out of outland in a week of casual play(at most) so it's best to just plow through those levels

[Ironwood]

I just want them to man up and make heroics out of the old instances.

Don't even bother with loot.  Just pump the creatures full of stamina and strength and let us loose.

Badges for the boss x2.  All good.

[dd0029]

I just want them to man up and make heroics out of the old instances.

Don't even bother with loot.  Just pump the creatures full of stamina and strength and let us loose.

Badges for the boss x2.  All good.

Can you imagine all that trash?  Fuck, Scarlet Monastery would never get run.  Hell Undead Strat.  I really like Scholo, but damn is there a lot of trash.  Seem to recall that they were going to do a Heroic Deadmines from Blizzcon.  That whole place is a trash nightmare .

[pxib]

Well if you're removing loot, just add more bosses.

[Sheepherder]

It's not like they don't have the technology to select and delete trash.

[Lakov_Sanite]

im fairly sure a LOT of old world dungeons are getting revamped and possibly given heroic modes in cataclysm, which is why they arent bothering with it right now

[Ingmar]

Only Deadmines and Shadowfang Keep are getting heroic modes.

[apocrypha]

It would be nice if neither of them were available vis the LFD tool so you still had to do an epic trek to the enemy lands for them. But on reflection maybe, just maybe, that would trigger a veritable shitstorm of whining... 

[Tannhauser]

Last night I tanked SC Armory.  In my five years playing I've never tanked an instance before.  The run went smoothly, the priest and the mage drew aggro a couple of times by not hugging walls.  It was fun!  I even got Herod's Shoulders.  Which is nice.

That's why 3.3 is the best patch ever.  It encourages folks to try different roles and specs.  Plus I get to re-visit zones that I've only been in once or twice or not at all. 

I've not been doing the random instances yet, I have some weird problem letting the system send me somewhere, but I will try it this weekend.

[Delmania]

On one hand, the LFD tool does help to further remove the immersion from WoW because you no longer have to travel to the entrance of the instance and the people you group with are not from your server.

On the other hand, running 5 man heroics has become fun again.