SWTOR

[luckton]

http://twitter.com/#!/Rockjaw/status/81131085781671936

QQ

Nothing popped up in my inbox.  I call shenanigans 

As for the survey, it's legit that it's how they're handling applicants, which is extremely 

[Malakili]

I can't decide if I should even beta games anymore.  On the one hand, it keeps me from purchasing games I won't like, on the other hand, it ruins games for me that I will like.

[luckton]

Here's some schadenfreude for ya. Feast upon my tears, and be satiated.

So I just got an email from Bioware, subject "STAR WARS: The Old Republic Testing Opportunity". I SQUEEEEEEE like a 13 year old girl the captain of the varsity team just invited to homecoming, and click the link, nipples fully erect. It sends me to fill out a 10 page long survey, which I diligently spend 15 minutes or so doing, then at the end posts a screen saying the following:

"Survey Completed: Thank you!

We’re sorry, but you do not qualify for this particular test. This does not exclude you from future tests however, and if future tests occur you may be contacted to participate. Thanks for your time and may the force be with you!"

Clearly whoever is running the beta program has succumbed to the dark side of the force. Have you ever heard of such a sadistic cocktease?

Don't suppose you'd be interested in filling us in on some of those survey questions, eh? 

[Ingmar]

I went over there to confirm this claim and found this gem:
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=342508

am a hero, and supposidly master of my domain by the time I'm level 50... but someone is going to tell me what color lightsaber I am going to use? I'm a Darth, I want a green lightsaber...

 

I only wish I could make this shit up.   

As a Colorblind-American I would like to point out that Vader's saber looks like it could be green to me.

[Malakili]

I went over there to confirm this claim and found this gem:
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=342508

am a hero, and supposidly master of my domain by the time I'm level 50... but someone is going to tell me what color lightsaber I am going to use? I'm a Darth, I want a green lightsaber...

 

I only wish I could make this shit up.   

As a Colorblind-American I would like to point out that Vader's saber looks like it could be green to me.

Man, this must totally alter your entire Star Wars world view.

[01101010]

I can't decide if I should even beta games anymore.  On the one hand, it keeps me from purchasing games I won't like, on the other hand, it ruins games for me that I will like.

I originally applied site-unseen. But now that I look at this a bit more, no way do I beta something story-ridden. No reason to ruin it before my free month.

[Malakili]

I can't decide if I should even beta games anymore.  On the one hand, it keeps me from purchasing games I won't like, on the other hand, it ruins games for me that I will like.

I originally applied site-unseen. But now that I look at this a bit more, no way do I beta something story-ridden. No reason to ruin it before my free month.

To be fair, that first month is actually the most expensive.  But I actually agree with what you are saying, I'm just nit picking.

[Surlyboi]

Here's some schadenfreude for ya. Feast upon my tears, and be satiated.

So I just got an email from Bioware, subject "STAR WARS: The Old Republic Testing Opportunity". I SQUEEEEEEE like a 13 year old girl the captain of the varsity team just invited to homecoming, and click the link, nipples fully erect. It sends me to fill out a 10 page long survey, which I diligently spend 15 minutes or so doing, then at the end posts a screen saying the following:

"Survey Completed: Thank you!

We’re sorry, but you do not qualify for this particular test. This does not exclude you from future tests however, and if future tests occur you may be contacted to participate. Thanks for your time and may the force be with you!"

Clearly whoever is running the beta program has succumbed to the dark side of the force. Have you ever heard of such a sadistic cocktease?

Got the same survey, but they didn't shoot me down outright, so we'll see what happens.

[Malakili]

Why you should care about Companions

To begin, companions are essentially full fledged party members. Unlike in World of Warcraft where a Hunter needs put little thought into his pet beyond acquiring it, your companions in TOR have full gear slots like  playable characters. You’ll have to equip all of them with armor and weapons, the droids with their separate droid equipment.

As each class has five companions, and they’ll all be fulfilling different roles, you now have six slots of equipment to juggle. On the plus side this means that any random drop you get is not worthless if its not for your class. A Jedi Consular who manages to pick up a green blaster can now give it to one of his companions, and gain actual benefit from it, instead of being forced to sell it for a pittance.

I didn't realize it was like this.  This is actually really neat.  I like the idea of companions being able to use all that loot I'd normally just vendor or AH a lot actually. Definitely adds a lot of interest.

[01101010]

I didn't realize it was like this.  This is actually really neat.  I like the idea of companions being able to use all that loot I'd normally just vendor or AH a lot actually. Definitely adds a lot of interest.

Oh god I can hear the crying now:
"That ninja stole that blue blaster! He's a fucking jedi!!"
'I needed it for my companion - it's an upgrade'

Followed by thread upon thread on the topic of GEAR: PLAYERS > COMPANIONS!!

[Rasix]

That'll probably be a setting in the loot roller, unless the devs are completely retarded.

[cironian]

That'll probably be a setting in the loot roller, unless the devs are completely retarded.

Or you could just spawn a private set of drops from the loot list for each player (Player A has a 5% chance of getting that piece of uber-loot, but player B still has the same 5% chance even if player A has already gotten it). Then the kids don't have to fight over the toys. I mean, quest rewards already work something like that and no one is really complaining about that.

[Lantyssa]

Outfitting my heroes in Guild Wars is a huge draw for me.  I approve of this.

[Amaron]

I was simply excited to have NPC's around to toss in dialog now and then.  Getting to equip them with gear is a big bonus.

[01101010]

Outfitting my heroes in Guild Wars is a huge draw for me.  I approve of this.

I am not opposed to this at all, I am just saying that if not handled correctly, it will lead ot very bad things. In fact, I really enjoyed being able to equip my drone crew in STO... As long as the devs have a plan on how to dole out the goodies that is.

[Abelian75]

To be fair, that first month is actually the most expensive.

Man, so good to see someone else who realizes this.  Mind you, I'm generally only irritated by the term when I see people using it as a justification for why you aren't entitled to complain about server downtime and such because the first month is "free" (which it isn't).

[Lantyssa]

I am not opposed to this at all, I am just saying that if not handled correctly, it will lead ot very bad things. In fact, I really enjoyed being able to equip my drone crew in STO... As long as the devs have a plan on how to dole out the goodies that is.

Since I rarely group, and only then with friends who are mature enough to be able to talk about who needs loot, those issues are irrelevant to me.  Now sure it might be clownshoes for the game at large, but I'm not concerned with them at this point.

But conveniently, GW assigns loot, too.  No idea how SWTOR will do it.

[Sky]

Outfitting my heroes in Guild Wars is a huge draw for me.  I approve of this.

Remember that non-humans and droids only get kit upgrades for visual effect. So Blizz the awesome will have a set of models/textures rather than displaying the gear you put on him (except maybe weapons?). I think the humanoids will upgrade visually, though. Daniel talked about it during the Tatooine walkthrough.

[Amaron]

You know speaking of the whole lightsaber color thing.

What happens if you're a Sith Jedi and you decide to go light side?  Do you stop using lighting bolts and force choking people?  Originally I just assumed they'd sort the Jedi powers by faction.

[tmp]

If it's anything like the single player KotOR then you can use the powers no matter the alignment, but certain powers cost more to use if you're on the "wrong" side of the morality scale.

[caladein]

Yeah, if that happens I'll eat my hat.

[Azuredream]

You know speaking of the whole lightsaber color thing.

What happens if you're a Sith Jedi and you decide to go light side?  Do you stop using lighting bolts and force choking people?  Originally I just assumed they'd sort the Jedi powers by faction.

As long as you only force choke the bad guys I would think you'd be alright.

[Amaron]

If it's anything like the single player KotOR then you can use the powers no matter the alignment, but certain powers cost more to use if you're on the "wrong" side of the morality scale.

Honestly that could seriously suck so I hope they aren't doing that.  I can easily see that sort of system devolving into "Raid LF dps Jedi must be dark side!".

[tmp]

I can easily see that sort of system devolving into "Raid LF dps Jedi must be dark side!".

I can just as easily see any sort of system devolving into that

[UnSub]

Followed by thread upon thread on the topic of GEAR: PLAYERS > COMPANIONS!!

It also throws a spanner in the idea of a functional player crafting economy. A player won't be crafting just for themselves, they are potentially crafting for all their companions too.

(Not that I think SWOR was going to actually succeed in implementing the fully player driven economy, but this is something that makes it harder.)

[Ingmar]

I'm not sure I follow - doesn't it just increase the size of the market essentially?

[Amaron]

I'm not sure I follow - doesn't it just increase the size of the market essentially?

Yea that post lost me a bit too.   Is it some logic like more crafters = bad?

[Murgos]

Post by Damion Schubert that touches on a lot of the stuff that's been discussed here in the last few pages:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=6819747#edit6819747

When we started out this project, we decided to make an MMO with Bioware-quality story. Perhaps y'all have kind of picked up on that – we’ve been known to mention it from time to time.

A point here is that we decidedly didn’t want to make ‘standard MMO with Glowsticks’. There are some areas where we wanted to take some big chances. One of which is the story, which is really a two-part feature. Most people talk about the high-quality plots and characters, reminiscent of the best Bioware has to offer - but lots of games have good story. The bigger focus is actually on the delivery mechanism for the story: the camera-work, the full VO, the feeling of choice and ramifications, the companions interjecting their two cents from time to time – when we say ‘story’, we don’t just mean ‘we’re telling a good tale’ (although we usually are), what we mean is that ‘we’re using our Bioware-best-practices to make you feel like you actually are living the Bounty Hunter experience through the story we invite you to take part in’.

We took some chances with this design, and most worked. There are some that, quite frankly, didn’t do so great (some of which we took out, a few we’re working to change before ship). However, in the case of the story stuff – and I realize I sound like I’m tooting our own horn here – the sense I get from my own playthroughs, and from the feedback from those who have gotten to test the game, is that we have, for the most part, nailed the story experience. Put it this way - a lot of testers say things like ‘gamechanging for the MMO genre’.

So that’s pretty cool.

Anyway, one of the things about game design is that the designer is continually forced to make choices – decisions in terms of which way the design can go. Despite what some armchair designers with absolutist opinions might tell you, these choices rarely are black and white. For example, a game design idea that is excellent in one MMO might be a terrible idea to add to another MMO, and maybe an even worse idea to add to a third game. Every game is trying to do radically different things. Every game has communities that value different things. Every game is, ultimately, striving for different things.

And so it is with us.

As I’ve written about previously, we consider community to be a very important aspect of the game’s design – on equal footing as to the ‘game-y’ aspects and the ‘world-y’ aspects of the MMO. We devote a lot of time -- and a ton of energy --to being sure that we have features that build and encourage community in the game. Some of these features are tightly integrated with the story, such as the multiplayer conversation and social points systems. Other features are wholly separate from the story, and designed to encourage and be bolstered by the community. Our Crew Skills/Crafting/Economy design, for example, really comes into its own for players willing to socialize and trade with each other, and other than leveraging the companions you gather, intersects little with the story.

Are there limitations that are imposed on our design because of story? Sure. One of the key reasons we don’t have Republic Bounty Hunters (for example) is that then we’d have to create an all-new Republic side class quest line, and create full scripted responses and VO for all of the Republic Bounty Hunter quests in the game. Given the intricacies of Bioware-style quest content, this is an enormously expensive and complicated proposition, and despite what the naysayers say, we do not have infinite resources at our disposal, and we’d really like to ship this game before 2035.

Do I think this hurts community? I reject that. I note that ‘other’ MMOs have limitations in terms of which side can play Bright Wizards and Minotaurs, for example, and they still seem to have loyal followings. All games, ultimately, constrain player actions in certain ways. Hopefully, in most cases, these decisions elevate the game design.

Are there elements of our story experience that are non-congruent with being in a shared space? Possibly. However, ultimately, all story-based games – and this goes for even single-player games – require a certain suspension of disbelief. So far, our testers don’t seem to have any problems doing so. In fact, I’d say the community makes the Bioware story experience more interesting.

As one example, a lot of people I talk to about The Old Republic initially think it’s weird that two Bounty Hunters can both have essentially the same story, with the same key moments, the same key bounties, win the same titles, and both be called, by their story NPCs, effectively the best single bounty hunter in the galaxy. Isn’t that kind of dissonant? The players that play the game don’t see it that way. Two Bounty Hunters playing the same story are having a very unique communal experience. I’ve seen them congratulate each other, share tips, help with bosses, and even compare notes about key decision points in the story (“I killed him, you saved him, what happened to you?”). Put another way, the fact that two people are walking the same path means that they have something to talk about. And this is good for community.

TLDR Version: What is going to be good for any particular MMO’s community is going to be wildly divergent between MMOs, depending on each MMO’s focus and feature set. We’re continually keeping an eye on our community to be sure that they remain healthy, but for the most part, there are some really neat interactions going on.

[Malakili]

As one example, a lot of people I talk to about The Old Republic initially think it’s weird that two Bounty Hunters can both have essentially the same story, with the same key moments, the same key bounties, win the same titles, and both be called, by their story NPCs, effectively the best single bounty hunter in the galaxy. Isn’t that kind of dissonant? The players that play the game don’t see it that way. Two Bounty Hunters playing the same story are having a very unique communal experience. I’ve seen them congratulate each other, share tips, help with bosses, and even compare notes about key decision points in the story (“I killed him, you saved him, what happened to you?”). Put another way, the fact that two people are walking the same path means that they have something to talk about. And this is good for community.

This right here has generally been my biggest worry about this game.  I'm still not convinced it won't be an issue, but frankly, it isn't an issue in WoW, and I doubt it will be here in the big picture.  To me its come to the STORY IN and MMO and the HISTORY OF an MMO.  There will be very little history of SWTOR, compared to something like EVE where you could write a history dissertation on the history of the in game galaxy - like, actions by real people. 

I think what he says is actually right though.  For all it makes me uncomfortable about the fact that my imperial agent has the exact same story as every othr imperial agent plus or minus a few details, most people are going to be totally 100% happy with just experiencing the content and sharing that experience with friends.  If I buy this game and enjoy it, it will be totally based upon my ability to put myself into the mindset of enjoying the experience for what it is without getting hung up on this sort of thing.

[Azuredream]

It's not an issue for me. If anything it's a plus like he was saying; I remember talking about DA:O with my friends and discussing what choices we made. It'd be cool to have those kinds of discussions in /guild or /party.

[Rasix]

We've done that plenty here for all recent Bioware releases.  Water cooler talk for RPG nerds.

A guy I work with just loves to talk about Mass Effect 2.  It's fun and has the bonus effect of making my officemate really uncomfortable (officemate doesn't game at all).

[cironian]

Yeah, everyone being the one true hero of the story never much bothered anyone in LOTRO so I don't think it's going to be a problem here.

[Malakili]

Yeah, everyone being the one true hero of the story never much bothered anyone in LOTRO so I don't think it's going to be a problem here.

Its never stopped me from playing an MMO in practice, but it always rubs me the wrong way anyway.  I think it dates back to the earlier days when I saw MMOs as potentially being the ultimate RP experience.  This was over a decade ago, but I really thought in those days that there would be 1000s of people living out their unique lives in a virtual game world.  Obviously I know the genre didn't go in that direction, and I've raided, meta gamed and in fact effectively given up RP all together and gone for that more "hardcore" number crunching style precisely because RP in the MMO genre turns out to actually be paying 15 bucks a month for a glorified chat room.  But there is still just this little tiny remnant in my mind of that original hope for the genre that still pops up any time a new game is coming out, especially when they go on and on about how RP and story matter - my definitions just aren't the same though.

[Bunk]

It's not an issue for me. If anything it's a plus like he was saying; I remember talking about DA:O with my friends and discussing what choices we made. It'd be cool to have those kinds of discussions in /guild or /party.

Hmm, wonder if they will integrate a spoiler tag system in to the chat? (only half kidding)

[Malakili]

It's not an issue for me. If anything it's a plus like he was saying; I remember talking about DA:O with my friends and discussing what choices we made. It'd be cool to have those kinds of discussions in /guild or /party.

Hmm, wonder if they will integrate a spoiler tag system in to the chat? (only half kidding)

[General]DarthWanker: I'm stuck on the Tatoonie quest where you have to fine the holocron, can anyone help.
[General]DerpSkywalker: Dude, that quest line sucks, I can't believe the Sith backstory is X,Y,Z.

Good times, good times.