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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  Warhammer Online (Moderator: tazelbain)  |  Topic: State of The Game - Mark Jacobs 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: State of The Game - Mark Jacobs  (Read 189167 times)
tazelbain
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tazelbain


Reply #35 on: October 17, 2008, 11:57:16 AM

The general opinion is turning against WAR.  Mythic needs to do something drastic ASAP while players are still looking their way.  They need to learn from LotRO/CoH/DAoC/EQ2 and fix things sooner rather than later.  These games have made great changes to make them on par or better than WoW in many ways.  But these changes came long after the popular opinion solidified against them and only the die-hards noticed. Even if all the issues for WAR are resolved by this coming spring, it'll be far to late.

Tripling the xp from RvR may not be best solution, but they can implement it today, it could get people attentions focused back on WAR and be a good stop gap until their real solution is ready.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 01:57:58 PM by tazelbain »

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Lantyssa
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Reply #36 on: October 17, 2008, 12:05:51 PM

Mythic has to be real careful saying that.  The company that wins HANDS DOWN for added content free of charge is Turbine with LOTRO.  This content they are adding was taken out before release because it wasn't ready and everyone knows that.
CoX, too.

I'm happy about the addition of the tank classes, since I prefer durable over pew-pew-boom and the missing third of the Holy Trinity is one of my gripes, but yeah,  Jacobs needs to give Lum less material.

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Montague
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Reply #37 on: October 17, 2008, 12:13:54 PM

From Lum's blog, quoting MBJ:

Quote
“The corollary to that is if you’ve seen a game consolidate servers, you know it’s in deep, deep trouble — that’s not a healthy sign for an MMO,” he said, citing Sony’s January-released “Pirates of the Burning Sea” as a recent example. “It will be the same for ‘Warhammer.’ Look at us six months out. Look at us six weeks out. If we’re not adding servers, we’re not doing well.”

Whooops...

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Reply #38 on: October 17, 2008, 12:16:32 PM

I think the part that might be tweaking Mythic more is that at this point the number they can float isn't that much more than what AoC could brag about for a brief period. THAT has got to inspire a "get off my lawn kid" McCain-to-Obama feeling for a company who's first launch such an abject trainwreck (AoC by comparison was so very not a wreck).
Jacobs has been very open about expecting WAR to easily have 500k subscribers.  I'm guessing between current retention, WotLK releasing next month, and knowledge of how long it takes to patch things in, he's a bit nervous about maintaining that right now.

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Nevermore
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Reply #39 on: October 17, 2008, 12:46:04 PM

Quote from: MarkJacobsEA
Folks,

Please show me another MMORPG which has added new classes to the game without charging the players through an expansion pack.

City of Heroes, you fucking drama queen.

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Reply #40 on: October 17, 2008, 12:47:23 PM

DDO just added monks too.

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Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
Paelos
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Reply #41 on: October 17, 2008, 12:59:53 PM

Quote from: Mark Jacobs
- smoothest launches in MMORPG history
- the future’s so bright we have to wear shades 
- WAR is doing fabulously
- fastest selling MMORPG out of the blocks
- most highly rated MMORPGs of all time 
- WAR is truly a glorious MMORPG
- giving players more value for their subscription dollars than any other MMORPG developer
- performance of WAR is great on most higher spec machines
- enhance WAR’s mail system until it is one of the best mail systems found in any MMORPG
- ongoing content updates to WAR and it is a great start.
- a ton of good stuff coming down the pipeline.
- it’s going to be a doozie.

I've isolated the parts of the State of the Game that jumped out to me. The whole time I'm reading the message, I can't get the ridiculous hyperbole out of my mind. It sort of overshadowed the improvement message with a theme that "EVERYTHING IS FINE, IT'S GREAT, YOU ALL LOVE IT!"

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Soukyan
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Reply #42 on: October 17, 2008, 01:08:26 PM

From the sounds of it, WAR will follow roughly the same development as DAoC. There are a lot of bugs and incomplete systems, missing classes (which were promised and revoked), other mechanics needing adjustment. In about six months, WAR will be at its prime.

Regarding the whole "free" classes thing, I think it's funny. Mythic took them away pre-release and is now selling it as free content. Umm, no. You do not remove content and then put it back in with some marketing fanfare. I'd like to think we're not that stupid.

If they were to charge for the classes, there would be an uproar from the players. That's really why they are free. But what do I know. I hung up my MMOG hat a while ago. Back to cleaning the litter boxes I go.

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Soln
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Reply #43 on: October 17, 2008, 01:20:26 PM

EA needs to replace Jacobs ASAP.  He delivered and that's really it.  He shouldn't be left to manage this service now.  And certainly not keep being the mouthpiece for it. 

Jacobs is still stuck in 1998 and doesn't get current expectations for consumers. 

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Reply #44 on: October 17, 2008, 01:41:53 PM

Quote
"I also said that we would not charge any additional fees for this new content or put it in a separate expansion pack; that’s not how we operate. We’ve kept to that plan and with the introduction of these two classes, Mythic shows that once again we are happy to keep giving players more value for their subscription dollars than any other MMORPG developer."

Mythic has to be real careful saying that.  The company that wins HANDS DOWN for added content free of charge is Turbine with LOTRO.  This content they are adding was taken out before release because it wasn't ready and everyone knows that.

CoX has a bid for that as well. And they ALSO added archetypes (the goofy alien one) free of charge, so there goes the OMG BUT IT'S CLASSES winging. I'd say LotRO adding more things to play in their wacky PvP counts too. :P


EDIT: I should probably read the entire thread before posting, huh.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 01:47:04 PM by Sjofn »

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Draegan
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Reply #45 on: October 17, 2008, 01:42:11 PM

Last two nights have had horrible queue times in T3.  My server went from High/High to Med/Med.  Damn WOW 3.0

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Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #46 on: October 17, 2008, 01:53:48 PM

Last two nights have had horrible queue times in T3.  My server went from High/High to Med/Med.  Damn WOW 3.0

That's just the patch too, imagine the expansion...MJ is.

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d4rkj3di
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Reply #47 on: October 17, 2008, 02:25:48 PM

Wait, IainC got fired?
« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 02:30:20 PM by d4rkj3di »
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Reply #48 on: October 17, 2008, 02:28:11 PM

Last two nights have had horrible queue times in T3.  My server went from High/High to Med/Med.  Damn WOW 3.0

The past two nights on my server, Praag, there have been fuckin' enormous RVR lake battles at and around Keeps. Mostly Avelorn.

While you're picking your ass up there at the warcamp, look at the map.
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Reply #49 on: October 17, 2008, 02:39:09 PM

Wait, IainC got fired?
No.
And that's the only comment I can make on the subject.

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Phunked
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Reply #50 on: October 17, 2008, 03:02:25 PM

So MJ is butthurt again because his game isn't capable of beating the other game that's in the MMO market because that other game does pretty much everything with more polish than WAR.

Face it, all we want it the RvR. If I want PvE I'll play EQ2/WoW/LOTRO for fuck's sake.

Polish the shit out of the RvR, cut all other systems. Add them in if you want at a very slow pace as they become polished. No, then we won't be getting the full MMO experience, but what we will be getting will be very good. As it stands now, we don't get a full MMO experience either, and what we get is passable in some places, decent in others and terrible in the rest.

Face it MJ; YOU NEED TO MAKE A GAME THAT'S FUN NOW, NOT FUN IF IT CAME OUT FOUR YEARS AGO.

Current WoW is not the same game as the release WoW. Release WoW wasn't as good. WAR is probably a bit better than release WoW. Current WoW is substantially better in a lot of aspects than current WAR.

I know you stole systems almost completely. Why couldn't you just steal them right? Hell, that's pretty much all Blizzard does, and they have the money hats.
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Reply #51 on: October 17, 2008, 05:17:42 PM

It occurs to me PotBS is also adding 2 new classes for free.

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Reply #52 on: October 17, 2008, 05:24:17 PM

Quote
Please show me another MMORPG which has added new classes to the game without charging the players through an expansion pack. I can't think of one right now but even if there is one that I am forgetting, the vast majority don't.
City of Heroes did (Kheldians in Issue 3).

Edit: whoops, dup
Nevermore
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Reply #53 on: October 17, 2008, 06:15:31 PM

Also: Soldiers of Arachnos

And as someone else already pointed out, it doesn't count when all you're doing is putting back in classes you had earlier yanked out.

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Reply #54 on: October 17, 2008, 06:43:07 PM


Adding new classes would seem to be a bit less tempting when the game is based around having a large player population at your level. That would restrict you to levelling via PvE which I believe is somewhat short on the "fun". Of course new players who missed the initial population surge are probably experiencing the same. I can't see this helping them attract and retain population.

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Azazel
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Reply #55 on: October 17, 2008, 07:58:33 PM

He needs to stop talking.

New classes? He's not introducing the fucking Death Knight or something that was unplanned from release. He only cut those classes like 2 months ago. edit - ok, I see a bunch of others picked up on this and posted as such as well before I got on today.

Also, he really needs to stop talking. He's turning into Smed.


Last two nights have had horrible queue times in T3.  My server went from High/High to Med/Med.  Damn WOW 3.0

That's just the patch too, imagine the expansion...MJ is.

WotLK is going to annihilate WAR.

« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 08:05:55 PM by Azazel »

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Arrrgh
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Reply #56 on: October 17, 2008, 09:42:35 PM

DDO just added monks too.

Gnome monks?
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Reply #57 on: October 17, 2008, 09:56:40 PM

EMERGENCY ANNOUNCEMENT:  ATTENTION CHILDREN, ALL IS WELL IN THE SCHOOL.  MY AUTHORITY AS PRINCIPAL IS TOTAL. 

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MarkJacobs
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Reply #58 on: October 17, 2008, 10:38:29 PM

So, let me get this straight.  I've got the COO of the major competitor saying things that make it *look* like 1/2 of our players have left (which is ridiculously untrue), talks about our European launch being bad (oh yeah, WoW's launch in NA and Europe was flawless right?)  while his game director spins BS about how the way Blizzard runs its beta shows its confidence in the game (forgetting of course the large internal alpha with paid employees that the games goes through and only then has a short public beta) while our beta, which has the general public in it for years, shows our lack of confidence.  He then goes on to say that "he's thinking of quitting our game" (and by inference, saying that other players might want to as well) and that our interface looks like his (forgetting how many interfaces were done before WoW) and generally pissing on our game and when I respond, I'm the jackass?  I had the following choices:

1) Say nothing - Of course, by saying nothing I validate Paul Sams' (COO) comments about our numbers and the Internet would have been full of "Blizzard must be right, no response from Mythic" and then I would have to explain to EA why I didn't respond (which I have in a followup interview with GamesIndustry) and if its true (which its not).  In terms of Kaplan's comments, sure, I could have said nothing about them but again, people would have wondered why I said nothing.   

2) Come out with guns blazing - By doing so I expected to get slammed in certain places (no surprise) but at least I get to respond.  Of course, the only comments I made were on the Vault and to the reporter when she called me up and asked if I wanted to comment.  I did not post anything on my blog, didn't go all over the Internet posting the same stuff but simply responded to a thread on the *one* place where I'm spending my time right now.

3) Come out but a bit more gently - Possibly but I'm sorry, I care about my game and since I do admit when we screw up or something isn't working, I also feel I have the right to defend it myself.  If I let a CM or PR person do that, places like this would, of course be saying, that's just the PR flack/CM doing his/her job and, probably, the same line about it being true because after all, if it wasn't true why would they send the poor CM/PR guy out to take the heat.

In terms of whether I should be doing this or not, or how EA feels, well, since I talked to them before I responded, I know that they are fine with it.  This gets back to the whole "Shouldn't a CM do this stuff" stuff and no, I don't think so.  Our CMs are already doing more on WAR than they did at launch but when it comes to stuff like this, I expect to take the lead and the heat for it if I screw up.  I'm not going to throw Bob or Missy out there to respond to this type of stuff because I don't want them to have to take the heat if something goes wrong or have abuse heaped on them because they couldn't say much without risk.  I could frankly care less about the publicity since I'm neither a conference-whore (I barely go to one a year anymore and at most ever went to 3 a year) or press-whore and as the development of WAR has shown, guys like Paul, Jeff and Josh have spent like 10x the time I have in the spotlight.  And if you go back to DAoC, well, this is the exact opposite of how things were then in terms of publicity as Matt and I and Sanya really did almost all of the press stuff.  And certainly if you go back to my older posts early in the DAoC days, I was more outspoken, vocal and absolutely was willing to get into a tussle with people but how often have I done that in the last say, 5 years?

And for those that say I should always just keep my mouth shut, even when competitors (or people) say things that are wrong about us.  Ask yourself how you would feel if you or something you cared about was getting attacked unfairly?  Would you sit back and never say anything about it?   Would you simply ignore it and move on?  Maybe some of you would but that's not how I am.  I usually go out of my way to praise most other games and developers  (with a few well known exceptions) as I did today in 2 separate interviews.

In terms of me having a thin skin, LOL.  In the 20+ years I've been making games, I've been called more obscene things, accused of being responsible for every thing that went wrong in DAoC (even when I wasn't involved in the game at all after a few years because of Imperator or WAR), blamed for the state UO is in (except thatEA wanted to shut down UO when they gave it to us but I convinced them to spend more money on the game), gotten death threats (and had to call in the FBI), told that I should "shut up and die" more times than I can remember, criticized because I want to start a blog, had someone wish that my son and I should die in a car accident because we changed how one of the classes in DAOC worked, get hate mail on said blog (I know, I expected it) and my personal email constantly and generally blamed whenever possible for everything that is wrong in Mythic, Imperator, WAR, DAoC, UO, etc. and I almost always (especially nowadays) ignore them.  I'm not saying this to be whiny or complain but simply to point out that when some people say I have a thin skin that I ignore 99% of the things that are said about me and Mythic especially when they are said by anonymous posters on the Internet so my skin can't be that thin.  And BTW, when things did go wrong with those games, I took full responsibility for it because as CEO/GM both externally and internally at EA as well, because I consider it part of my job (even if I had nothing to do with the decision at any level like changes to classes past a certain point or statements made by Mythic guys) unlike many both in our industry and in our world who never take responsibility.  And somehow, some say I should say nothing ever in response and that I have a thin skin when I respond once in a blue moon.  I'm not expecting one iota of pity or sympathy for that stuff because I know as the frontman for Mythic, I'm going to take the heat but not being able to say anything, ever?  That's not fair and it is a double-standard. 

So, I'm sure I'm going to get flamed here by some of you as well.  But I'll say the same thing I said years ago and that is why is it okay when everyone else can say whatever they want here and in other places (no matter how untrue, vulgar or rude) about me, Mythic, WAR, DAoC, life, etc. without consequence but when I express an opinion or respond in any way, I get flamed for it.  And before anyone says "Because you're GM of EA" the same thing held true when I was head of a company that had a few employees and I was probably making less than the a assistant manager at a fast food restaurant.

Mark

P.S. And in terms of the added classes to a couple of other games, I honestly didn't know that and nobody pointed that out to me either unfortunately.  I'll correct the SoG because if it's more than one, which it certainly appears to be, then I really should change my statement even though I had a bit of a disclaimer on purpose in regards to that statement itself.  As to whether they were cut and should have been added, well, my point was that when we cut them, there were a lot of posts on the WHA and Vault that we were going to save them for an expansion and then charge for them "because that's what Mythic does!!!"  and "Mythic is greedy!" were the standard lines. I think I was well within my rights to be proud that we didn't do that.

« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 10:56:17 PM by MarkJacobs »
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Reply #59 on: October 17, 2008, 10:44:29 PM

How do you solve this Mark?
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When I was younger, I used to be a clumsy, slow and awkward girl.
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Why don't you get to know me a little better?
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schild
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Reply #60 on: October 17, 2008, 10:49:55 PM

I have no way to be kind about this, so I'll just spit it out.

The EXP grind post-20 to get to 40 and only worry about PVP/Renown is mind-numbing and worse than anything CoH ever threw at it's users. The tiered beta testing, unfortunately, had no way of really revealing that and the open beta wasn't long enough. And those that realized it figured out how to AoE grind before you fixed it. The level disparity, populations, and BLARGH HORRIBLE CRAP SHIT PvE really buggers up the whole equation.

</insanity>

The changes being made and the fixes being applied are not playing enough to the game's stronger qualities. Please revert your attention to shortening the road to 40 and making the journey a leisurely one instead of a head-banging-against-concrete uphill battle against the EXP bar.

Also:
1. Too many scenarios.
2. Too many RvR lakes.
3. Too many ways to split apart the playerbase.
4. Not enough ways to bring them together and focus on the PvP.
5. Someone needs to get punched for 90% of the scenarios, just say the name.

Edit: I feel like I've typed all of this before. Oh, I have, in like 50 threads. /sigh Oh, and NEVER ask the Vault for anything. Christ, they advertise your competitors over there. It's a cess pit. WHA or in Game, thx.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 10:51:51 PM by schild »
MarkJacobs
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Mythic Entertainment


Reply #61 on: October 17, 2008, 11:05:27 PM

I have no way to be kind about this, so I'll just spit it out.

The EXP grind post-20 to get to 40 and only worry about PVP/Renown is mind-numbing and worse than anything CoH ever threw at it's users. The tiered beta testing, unfortunately, had no way of really revealing that and the open beta wasn't long enough. And those that realized it figured out how to AoE grind before you fixed it. The level disparity, populations, and BLARGH HORRIBLE CRAP SHIT PvE really buggers up the whole equation.

</insanity>

The changes being made and the fixes being applied are not playing enough to the game's stronger qualities. Please revert your attention to shortening the road to 40 and making the journey a leisurely one instead of a head-banging-against-concrete uphill battle against the EXP bar.

Also:
1. Too many scenarios.
2. Too many RvR lakes.
3. Too many ways to split apart the playerbase.
4. Not enough ways to bring them together and focus on the PvP.
5. Someone needs to get punched for 90% of the scenarios, just say the name.

Edit: I feel like I've typed all of this before. Oh, I have, in like 50 threads. /sigh Oh, and NEVER ask the Vault for anything. Christ, they advertise your competitors over there. It's a cess pit. WHA or in Game, thx.

I don't disagree with some of the things you are saying and we are taking a serious look at pretty much all of your points and already taking action on some.  I would try to spend more time here but as this thread proves, it wouldn't be much better here once it was known I was spending time here.  As you know the SoG is meant to be short, sweet and deal with only a handful of issues.  It is not meant to cover all the issues that the game has or even all the things we are working on.  Every time I talk about what we might do, that automatically becomes what we will do and then if we don't do it, well, it's Bash Mythic time so I've learned to keep things like the SoG as short and yes, predictable, as possible.

Oh, and BTW, the Vault folks have been extremely helpful in finding bugs very quickly.  The Vault is not perfect, has plenty of trolls but has a dedicated core of people who are happy to tell me about bugs and issues and I can't count the number of times that they have pointed out new bugs.   Of course, they also have their "Nerf every class but mine!" folks but there are some really good posters there and the mods are trying hard to keep the signal to noise down to a dull roar.

Mark
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Reply #62 on: October 17, 2008, 11:07:03 PM

Omg..

Please fix Electromagnet and Rift so they can't be used to pull defenders through the keep doors.  That is just absolutely retarded. 

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Reply #63 on: October 17, 2008, 11:09:21 PM

I think most people would sympathise with the amount of internet retardation you are exposed to Mark, the message still remains though - play it cool.
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Reply #64 on: October 17, 2008, 11:13:18 PM

You seem to think this is about bashing Mythic. No, not really, this is about getting as many people to 40 as possible so the full populations of servers can take part in the best part of the game. Sure, it doesn't help that the vast majority of the scenarios are only exciting to those who drool when they hear a bell, but at the same time. Well, hell. If you can datamine a specific character, go ahead and scrape Tryst. See how many times I ran Mourkain and then Tor Anroc and then (now) Serpent's Passage, just to get through the end of t2/t3 and as I trodge through tier 4. It's fucking harsh man and the last thing I'd want to be compared to is City of Heroes - fortunately you have an interesting endgame whereas they had and still have a nebulous factory for me to fuck up Cloned Thug B with a pipe wrench or whatthefuckever.

Basically, apologize to your quest writers, PvE folks, and such for me - but it's all crap keeping me and everyone else from getting to the Awesome. And have someone reitemize the stats on uhhhh everything?

In other words, find bugs, sploits and stopping gold sellers and finding out where things need to be nerfed and attempting to find out what's missing from the game is fine and all - but if the churn on players that keep their already 40 AOE grind characters vs the number of people that leave once they start troding through the 30s is out of wack, well the problem explains itself. I'm sure you all have the metrics, but I can tell you first hand that the PvE is like, 1/1,000,000th as fun as the PvP. Which is a good thing for the design and a terrible thing for the execution and presumably subscription base once WotLK drops.
MarkJacobs
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Mythic Entertainment


Reply #65 on: October 17, 2008, 11:35:27 PM

You seem to think this is about bashing Mythic. No, not really, this is about getting as many people to 40 as possible so the full populations of servers can take part in the best part of the game. Sure, it doesn't help that the vast majority of the scenarios are only exciting to those who drool when they hear a bell, but at the same time. Well, hell. If you can datamine a specific character, go ahead and scrape Tryst. See how many times I ran Mourkain and then Tor Anroc and then (now) Serpent's Passage, just to get through the end of t2/t3 and as I trodge through tier 4. It's fucking harsh man and the last thing I'd want to be compared to is City of Heroes - fortunately you have an interesting endgame whereas they had and still have a nebulous factory for me to fuck up Cloned Thug B with a pipe wrench or whatthefuckever.

Basically, apologize to your quest writers, PvE folks, and such for me - but it's all crap keeping me and everyone else from getting to the Awesome. And have someone reitemize the stats on uhhhh everything?

In other words, find bugs, sploits and stopping gold sellers and finding out where things need to be nerfed and attempting to find out what's missing from the game is fine and all - but if the churn on players that keep their already 40 AOE grind characters vs the number of people that leave once they start troding through the 30s is out of wack, well the problem explains itself. I'm sure you all have the metrics, but I can tell you first hand that the PvE is like, 1/1,000,000th as fun as the PvP. Which is a good thing for the design and a terrible thing for the execution and presumably subscription base once WotLK drops.

Hey, now who's being sensitive guy?  I never thought you were bashing Mythic with what you said.  I know you mean it and you care.  I honestly don't know why you think I thought you were bashing us?

My comment on this thread was just the personal stuff about me.  Say whatever you like about the game that you think can help, it doesn't bother me.  What did bother me was the attitude of "Jacobs is a XXXX" stuff just because I stand up and respond to a fellow developer and his COO who's talking trash about our game.  If I had jumped down the throat of a player posting on the boards about why he didn't like the game, well, then I would be worthy of some fair amount of ridicule but to say I can't respond or when I do, I'm mocked when the response is to another developer (especially if they might be other reasons behind the comments) or company, just feels wrong to me.  And I am a little steamed that everyone seems to forget all the extremely nice things I've said about the competition, time and again, even though it's been suggested to me over the years by PR and management, that I should never say anything nice about the competition.  That frustrates me too since if you counted the number of times I've said something bad about a competitor versus the number of times I said nice things (or even done nice things to help them) the scales would be so unbelievably unbalanced on the side of being the nice guy versus being the jerk.

Mark
« Last Edit: October 17, 2008, 11:55:07 PM by MarkJacobs »
Lum
Developers
Posts: 1608

Hellfire Games


Reply #66 on: October 17, 2008, 11:42:42 PM

Mark,

So, it's REALLY obvious you're passionate about Warhammer. Which is entirely justified. In many ways it's your baby.

Doesn't that mean you should NOT be the one responding to various slings and arrows about it in public?
MarkJacobs
Developers
Posts: 109

Mythic Entertainment


Reply #67 on: October 17, 2008, 11:45:07 PM

I think most people would sympathise with the amount of internet retardation you are exposed to Mark, the message still remains though - play it cool.

And I do, 99.9% of the time when it is a user or forum warrior but in this case it was different, it was the COO/Game Director of our #1 competitor.  That makes it a very different situation in my eyes and the few times I've said something uncomplimentary about another game/company, I would have no problem if the other guy responded.  A good example of this is when I made my comments about EQBay.  John responded publicly and then he and I talked and we're still on good terms.  If I make comments about something or somebody, I'm fair game for them to respond to and I won't get all pissy about it.  

But honestly, I don't think that all of you do know just how much IR I've seen over the years and totally ignored.  I've learned a lot over the years contrary to what some people have said.  Again, it's not a plea for sympathy but simply a defense to the whole thin skin thing.  And in this case what really pissed me off was because of all the nice things I've said about WoW and Blizzard over the years and the fact that we let them visit our shop and talk to us about our tech and about launching MMOs as well as some conversations I had with the VUG CEO about Blizzard/WoW when we were working with VUG.  It just felt like a really crappy move to me and it did rile me up quite a bit but there was more to the story than just the comments.  

Mark
MarkJacobs
Developers
Posts: 109

Mythic Entertainment


Reply #68 on: October 17, 2008, 11:53:34 PM

Mark,

So, it's REALLY obvious you're passionate about Warhammer. Which is entirely justified. In many ways it's your baby.

Doesn't that mean you should NOT be the one responding to various slings and arrows about it in public?

When it comes to slings/arrows from a competitor, no Scott, I think I really do need to be the one.  I'm not going to put Bob/Missy/James on the frontline when it comes to responding to a competitor, that can be a very dangerous career move and if someone is going to mess it up, I'd rather it be me than them.  In terms of on the boards, yes, it should be the CMs now that we've launched and they are already starting to take a bigger role but we are doing it slowly.  I expect that by next year I won't be posting much on the forums and I will let the CMs do their jobs.  Since you know what I've said on the Vault, the attitude I take towards the guys on the forums is very different than I took with Kaplan and Sams.  Other than the occasional troll comment or when I know someone is lying and I can prove it, I don't get very angry in the way I did at the Blizzard guys.  And I like talking to the players because I do believe that they have something useful to add to the process but unlike with DAoC, we have the tools that we didn't have then to look at what is really going on with the game and not just react to what people are saying on the boards.  And as GM of Mythic, when I say to the players that we intend to do something, most of them take that seriously.  And if we are wrong or have to admit a mistake, I don't send the CMs in to clean up our mess, I take the heat myself.

Does that make sense?

Mark
schild
Administrator
Posts: 49403

The face of cool.


WWW
Reply #69 on: October 17, 2008, 11:56:56 PM

I don't understand why it matters who said what.

I mean, so what, the guy is a dick. A rich dick with a game that has 10M subs. He can say whatever he wants, he's the king of the castle and his players don't care if he's crapping on the competition. He could say just about anything and not hurt his game. In fact, it's probably in his best interest to shit on other titles/companies in terms of being the BIGGEST MEAN BULLY on the block.

At the same time, he is just another dick on the internet. It doesn't matter if it's a CEO or a QA guy or a CRM or a forum member going around flame warrioring it up. They're still just assholes on the net.

Aren't there more pressing matters than even wasting a breath on that schmuck let alone the written word?

Also: Just because I posted again, let me reiterate - the PvE grind is crap. Kill it with the fire of a thousand suns.
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