Dragon Age

[Morat20]

I wouldn't say they did a bad job of removing Shale (probably at a very early stage). But do you honestly believe they wrote/recorded all the Shale's dialog separately? Planned the anvil of the void then thought 'oh hay lets add all this Shale extra shit'?

Considering Shale's comment in game about being "cut down to size" was a reference to Shale's  model having to be shrunk so it could fit through doors, I really do think Shale was an idea that came a lot later.

Most especially because there's an entire seperate area for her to recover her heritage, instead of merely stumbling across it in the already packed Deep Roads.

[Koyasha]

You can say the same for the entire Elven main quest.

Or the mage one.

Or the alienage.

Or Lothering.

I wouldn't say they did a bad job of removing Shale (probably at a very early stage). But do you honestly believe they wrote/recorded all the Shale's dialog separately? Planned the anvil of the void then thought 'oh hay lets add all this Shale extra shit'?

They have stated that Shale was originally planned as one of the party members, the dialogue was recorded during the initial design and so on, but some bugs (particularly the too big for doors thing) were going to make it necessary to not include the character because they wouldn't be able to make it work for the original release date.  However since the game was delayed in order to achieve the simultaneous multi-platform launch, they were able to hammer out the problems and include Shale, so they included the Stone Prisoner with every copy of the game. 

The character was apparently always designed to be a secondary part of the game, integrated but not crucial, which is why she's never mentioned in any dialogue and there's absolutely no hint of her existence if you don't have the DLC installed.

But again, and to press the point, Shale isn't DLC in the sense that you're expected to pay extra to get that content.  Shale is part of the game, and is included in every single copy.  Only if you acquire the game secondhand would you have to pay for that "DLC."

[Reg]

That makes sense. I think Shale is every bit as central a character as Sten, Leliana and Zhevran. You can miss all three of those and not even know it if you skip something or make a wrong decision.  I think the only truly central characters are Alistair and Morrigan.

[eldaec]

If you kicked Morrigan, all you'd miss out on is her sidequest and the ability to save both Grey Wardens in the finale.

From very to not very integrated, I'd rate them...



Alastair, Loghain

Shale
Oghren


Morrigan


Barkspawn
Leliana, Zevran, Sten, Wynne

[stray]

If you kicked Morrigan, all you'd miss out on is her sidequest and the ability to save both Grey Wardens in the finale.

"All you'd miss out on.." I'd say that was pretty big.. considering that leaves you with what..? One option for an ending? I mean, it wasn't the greatest ending either way, but it ceases to be a Bioware game with just one ending.

[CmdrSlack]

Barkspawn? Ok, I missed something in my first playthrough....

[Ingmar]

If you kicked Morrigan, all you'd miss out on is her sidequest and the ability to save both Grey Wardens in the finale.

"All you'd miss out on.." I'd say that was pretty big.. considering that leaves you with what..? One option for an ending? I mean, it wasn't the greatest ending either way, but it ceases to be a Bioware game with just one ending.

Two options for an ending.

[tmp]

Barkspawn? Ok, I missed something in my first playthrough....

Just a meme probably.

[Raguel]

If you kicked Morrigan, all you'd miss out on is her sidequest and the ability to save both Grey Wardens in the finale.

"All you'd miss out on.." I'd say that was pretty big.. considering that leaves you with what..? One option for an ending? I mean, it wasn't the greatest ending either way, but it ceases to be a Bioware game with just one ending.

Two options for an ending.

Oh I thought only female characters get two options, depending on their relationship with Alistair. Does it work the same way with male chars?

[Morat20]

Oh I thought only female characters get two options, depending on their relationship with Alistair. Does it work the same way with male chars?

I'll go ahead and spoiler this:


For the record, Barkspawn is an awesome name for the dog. That's pretty much his name, as far as I'm concerned.

[BitWarrior]

I had the dog in my party the entire time through a playthrough, and I got next to zero diaglog with it. My other party members were Sten and Morrigan - whom themselves actually became rather boring. Not sure what I did wrong or perhaps Dog just doesn't have much dialog with those specific characters.

[caladein]

Dog was worth having around if only to put a purpose to all those "Landmarks".  I also remember him doing the "Party Member Interjects During Dialogue" once or twice... maybe,

[stray]

I want do a new playthrough with just a Bow Ranger and Dog.

I mean, just those and the other untalkable pet.  

[Slyfeind]

Dog's most entertaining moments are in camp, imo.

Is there any way to get Alistair to marry, keep him in the party, not kill Loghain, and have Loghain sacrifice himself at the end?

[Morat20]

Dog's most entertaining moments are in camp, imo.

Is there any way to get Alistair to marry, keep him in the party, not kill Loghain, and have Loghain sacrifice himself at the end?

No.

And Barkspawn was worth it just for the first time I went into Denerim with him. Or Morrigan bitching to him in camp. Talk to him in camp until he stops offering anything but "pet or leave Barkspawn".

Since my current party is Archer/Rogue Me, Wynn w/Bonus Damage, Shale and Barkspawn -- I'm having fun. Sadly, Barkspawn WILL be replaced with Oghren later, because Oghren is a raging killing machine that nothing can stop.

[Ingmar]

If you kicked Morrigan, all you'd miss out on is her sidequest and the ability to save both Grey Wardens in the finale.

"All you'd miss out on.." I'd say that was pretty big.. considering that leaves you with what..? One option for an ending? I mean, it wasn't the greatest ending either way, but it ceases to be a Bioware game with just one ending.

Two options for an ending.

Oh I thought only female characters get two options, depending on their relationship with Alistair. Does it work the same way with male chars?

[sidereal]

Just skimming the last couple of pages on DLC rage and Shale, so I might be redundant, but in retrospect I regret installing the Shale DLC, even though it was free.

Shale's an okay tank, but she's boring as fuck to play.  Assuming you're tanking with her, she stays in Heart of Stone or whatever the entire fight, which gives her access to a whole 3 special abilities.  If you like to coast in battles, that might be attractive, but I like to micromanage and pull off carefully timed abilities.  And Shale has very few.  Total bore.  Also, leveling her offers almost no satisfaction.  She only has one set of abilities, and going to max level will get them all.  And if you're tanking her (as most people would), only one of the lines is even used, so after level 9 or so you don't get any new abilities of use when she levels.  I ran her as my main tank for about half my runthrough, then switched over to Alistair out of boredom.

And unless you're really sure you're going to run Shale in your party the whole campaign, you should absolutely not install the Stone Prisoner DLC, because if you do, you 1) need to be logged into your Bioware account to even start the game (so it can verify you own the DLC) and 2) will get a lot of useless crystal drops.

[eldaec]

If you kicked Morrigan, all you'd miss out on is her sidequest and the ability to save both Grey Wardens in the finale.

"All you'd miss out on.." I'd say that was pretty big.. considering that leaves you with what..? One option for an ending? I mean, it wasn't the greatest ending either way, but it ceases to be a Bioware game with just one ending.

Two options for an ending.

Oh I thought only female characters get two options, depending on their relationship with Alistair. Does it work the same way with male chars?

[Ingmar]

I was going on how the achievements define an 'ending'.

[Koyasha]

Just skimming the last couple of pages on DLC rage and Shale, so I might be redundant, but in retrospect I regret installing the Shale DLC, even though it was free.

Shale's an okay tank, but she's boring as fuck to play.  Assuming you're tanking with her, she stays in Heart of Stone or whatever the entire fight, which gives her access to a whole 3 special abilities.  If you like to coast in battles, that might be attractive, but I like to micromanage and pull off carefully timed abilities.  And Shale has very few.  Total bore.  Also, leveling her offers almost no satisfaction.  She only has one set of abilities, and going to max level will get them all.  And if you're tanking her (as most people would), only one of the lines is even used, so after level 9 or so you don't get any new abilities of use when she levels.  I ran her as my main tank for about half my runthrough, then switched over to Alistair out of boredom.

And unless you're really sure you're going to run Shale in your party the whole campaign, you should absolutely not install the Stone Prisoner DLC, because if you do, you 1) need to be logged into your Bioware account to even start the game (so it can verify you own the DLC) and 2) will get a lot of useless crystal drops.

I agree that Shale's combat is really rather boring overall, since it's really not that beneficial to switch modes often.  You just stay in tank mode forever and that's it.  Interesting character though, fun banter and lots of amusing interjections - and I haven't even played a full game with Shale as a main party member. 

As for the being logged into your Bioware account, that seems to be an odd issue, because I thought the same thing myself - then I disconnected my computer from the internet entirely and had no problems playing a game with Shale.  On the other hand it does sometimes bitch if I am connected to the internet but try to load the game before it finishes logging into the Bioware account.

Oh, and if you want to deactivate any DLC for a particular playthrough, just uncheck it in your DLC menu, none of the stuff will appear.

[caladein]

Return to Ostagar is out for PC/360, for reals apparently.  Has anyone picked it up?

Kind of a terrible time for it come out as I'm still playing through Mass Effect 2 so I'll be waiting for a while.

[Venkman]

Yea, I'm in the same boat. I am enjoying ME2 too much to finish up DA:O, but am glad that there looks to be a lull for awhile. Honestly, while ME2 and DA:O are completely different games, I've still got a preference for fantasy so am eager to get back

[Raguel]

Personally I can't wait for both the DLC and expansion to come out so I can play them and bitch about how they weren't worth the money. 

For some reason, I found the ME1 hard to get into.  The combat is fun, if a bit difficult for someone who has the reflexes of a dead 70 yr old.    For some reason, things like the Landsmeet and the Saren (sp) bit in ME just kill my enjoyment. Maybe it would be different if I thought of my character as a Batman-type.

[rk47]

Yep for all the Renegade and XTREME actions Shepard is allowed to take you still end up being the Council's bitch.
At least until the final 10% of the game where the decision is so easy to make.

[Morat20]

Return to Ostagar is out for PC/360, for reals apparently.  Has anyone picked it up?

Kind of a terrible time for it come out as I'm still playing through Mass Effect 2 so I'll be waiting for a while.

I picked it up -- was planning on running there today. If I have time, once I get home.

I spent yesterday cursing my way through the Majorlie (or whatever her name is -- Leliana's Bard Friend) fight. I was gimped because Leliana has to be in the party (and I wasn't using her, so her gear was for crap and she wasn't levelled to be a companion to MY archer rogue).

Took me three tries. Finally managed it with clever switching between Shale's Stoneheart and Pulverizing Blows (quake is nice), remembering I gave Wynne Forcefield (to take Majorlie out of the equation) and some acid flasks. It's the nasty crossfire from the mages + annoying guards + hard-hitting bard.

[Merusk]

Yep for all the Renegade and XTREME actions Shepard is allowed to take you still end up being the Council's bitch.
At least until the final 10% of the game where the decision is so easy to make.

It's REALLY, REALLY easy to justify it to yourself, even on a Paragon play through.

[Riggswolfe]

Yep for all the Renegade and XTREME actions Shepard is allowed to take you still end up being the Council's bitch.
At least until the final 10% of the game where the decision is so easy to make.

It's REALLY, REALLY easy to justify it to yourself, even on a Paragon play through.

Edit: Changed in response to me being mistaken about which game they were talking about.

[CmdrSlack]

Yep for all the Renegade and XTREME actions Shepard is allowed to take you still end up being the Council's bitch.
At least until the final 10% of the game where the decision is so easy to make.

It's REALLY, REALLY easy to justify it to yourself, even on a Paragon play through.

I think they're talking about ME, not ME2.

[Meester]

Dragon Age is a good game although I abandoned my dwarf character to be a blood mage. Shame Loghain comes so late. Can't wait for Awakening either.

[angry.bob]

Yeah, I'm restarting too. I somehow managed to block myself from doing some of the character side quests and one of the area quests halfway through the first area after Lothring. Plus my character sucked. But at least the porno movie romance cutscene mod is out now.

[Lakov_Sanite]

But at least the porno movie romance cutscene mod is out now.

Please explain.

[Polysorbate80]

Yep for all the Renegade and XTREME actions Shepard is allowed to take you still end up being the Council's bitch.
At least until the final 10% of the game where the decision is so easy to make.

It's REALLY, REALLY easy to justify it to yourself, even on a Paragon play through.

Am I the only person that saved the council? I figured, sure, they deserve a hot laser enema, but everyone already hates the humans enough as it it.

Come to think of it, I think starting ME2 with a new character defaults to all the opposite possible carryover options than what I ended ME1 with (I saved the council, kept wrex alive, killed off the irritating human guy who was supposed to be my love interest).  Apparently I play the game wrong or something.

[tmp]

But at least the porno movie romance cutscene mod is out now.

Please explain.

i'm guessing http://www.dragonagenexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=548

[caladein]

Am I the only person that saved the council? I figured, sure, they deserve a hot laser enema, but everyone already hates the humans enough as it it.

Come to think of it, I think starting ME2 with a new character defaults to all the opposite possible carryover options than what I ended ME1 with (I saved the council, kept wrex alive, killed off the irritating human guy who was supposed to be my love interest).  Apparently I play the game wrong or something.

No, that was my first playthrough on 360.  Paragon Male Infiltrator, saved Council/Wrex, killed Kaiden, slept with Ashley.  Over all a nice guy.

I only did my Renegade playthrough on ME2 PC first because it lined up well enough with canonical Shepard (except for the saving Kaiden business as a female, that guy's lame).

[Velorath]

Couple bits of news from EA's recent Q3 financial reports:

Dragon Age has sold 3.2 million copies.

Untitled Dragon Age game is expected for Q1 2011 on consoles, handhelds, and PC (also Dead Space 2).