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on: March 18, 2007, 11:56:18 PM

GDC07 - Fury of a Thousand Suns

In the corner, the subdued shimmer of a blade unsheathed. Prey. Swiftly, behind the rock, peek around. He's alone, unaware, unescorted, unprepared. Perfect. Their base is far, our goal is not. My allies, likewise, scattered far - too far. It's just us in this dusty crevice, it shall be our wits against the other's.
 
I know it, at least; he doesn't. He plods along unwarily, sword bobbing. A trap, perhaps? Could be. But he shall not pass.

It is time. Spring out from behind the rock, a shriek echoing through the chamber, and we are locked in battle, joined in Fury.

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Murgos
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Reply #1 on: March 19, 2007, 08:59:26 AM

Maybe I missed it in the article but are there standard MMOG conventions and PVE going on too or is the entire thing like BF1942 but with Elves?

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MrHat
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Reply #2 on: March 19, 2007, 10:21:00 AM

And if so, do the elves bleed gold and rainbows?
Samwise
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Reply #3 on: March 19, 2007, 10:38:18 AM

It's pure PvP, but you gain levels.  Gameplay is more like UT than BF1942.  Except that instead of clicking your mouse button to attack, you have a MMOG-style hotbar that you use for every swing, so you're mashing a number key about once a second.

"I have not actually recommended many games, and I'll go on the record here saying my track record is probably best in the industry." - schild
Yoru
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Reply #4 on: March 19, 2007, 12:17:48 PM

What Sam said. I was hoping the comparison to Guild Wars would make it clearer. It's very much like the max-level game in GW, but much faster. There's no real PVE grind - advancement is primarily for breadth rather than depth, although there is some shallow upwards advancement.

So there's levels and gear, yes, but both come from PVP. Matchmaking is supposed to ensure more of a balanced fight - the example given would be that if you'd lost 10 fights in a row, you'd mostly be fighting guys who'd also lost 10 fights in a row, or as close to that as a game can provide.

And yes, they're pretty adamant about hitting buttons fast - once a second was quoted a number of times.
Sky
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Reply #5 on: March 26, 2007, 02:12:38 PM

Hot-key seems like it would interfere with movement in anything but a pve diku. Especially 1/s.

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Reply #6 on: March 26, 2007, 02:49:31 PM

Hot-key seems like it would interfere with movement in anything but a pve diku. Especially 1/s.

That's why movement is mouse-driven, although not in the point-and-click manner. You hold down both mouse buttons to run forward, in the setup we were given. It takes some getting used to.
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Reply #7 on: March 26, 2007, 07:38:55 PM

The control scheme is the aspect of the game that needs the most work IMO.  I got used to the mouse-driven movement, but it still felt crippled compared to WASD.  In particular, the combat really lends itself to strafing around defensively, and you can't do that with the click-to-run-forward thing.

On the other hand, WASD is completely incompatible with the hotkey mashing, so that's no good either.

The whole thing cries out for some sort of perverse twenty-button mouse so you can get more mileage out of that right hand.  But I hate those too.   tongue  Maybe foot pedals?

"I have not actually recommended many games, and I'll go on the record here saying my track record is probably best in the industry." - schild
Trippy
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Reply #8 on: March 27, 2007, 02:54:23 AM

An Hands-on-Throttle controller would probably work. I used an ancient version of one of these to play MW2 (plus joystick and rudder pedals). As you can sort of see from the picture there are 4 hats in the thumb area and there's another one under the index finger and buttons under the other fingers. So using the hat under the index finger for movement plus buttons under your second and third fingers for strafing would take care of the movement controls. Then your thumb could manipulate the various hats to do things like targeting and whatever other non-power related stuff the game required. That would leave your right hand free to mash away at the number keys or number pad.

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Reply #9 on: March 27, 2007, 12:12:44 PM

That would about do it, except that you also have to click-target stuff sometimes.  Plus you need mouselook to change direction.  So you'd still need a third hand for a mouse or joystick.

If you could get something like that throttle controller with enough buttons on it for all your frequently used attacks, though, you could use that in place of the number keys + WASD, and have the mouse in your right hand.

"I have not actually recommended many games, and I'll go on the record here saying my track record is probably best in the industry." - schild
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Reply #10 on: March 27, 2007, 01:10:28 PM

That would be why they're going to be selling Fury-branded prosthetic hands after release.
Hoax
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Reply #11 on: March 27, 2007, 05:17:00 PM

I dont see WASD inhibiting rapid hotkey mashing at all.  I can use about 13 keyboard keys effectively in a WASD=movement game.  Take out spacebar for jump and still you have 12 keys you can get to easily and more for less used abilities.

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Reply #12 on: March 27, 2007, 06:02:28 PM

I dont see WASD inhibiting rapid hotkey mashing at all.  I can use about 13 keyboard keys effectively in a WASD=movement game.

You're able to move around and track a target with WASD while mashing rapid sequences of number keys?  Please post photos of your freakish twelve-fingered left hand.

The key difference between Fury's use of the number keys and most FPSes is that you don't press the key to switch to a weapon, you press the key to USE it.  Imagine playing Quake and having to press the 1 key to fire your gun rather than having it bound to your mouse button.  It's like that. 

The reason it's like that is that most of your abilities need to be activated by others in combo sequences -- so imagine that you can only fire the rocket launcher after you've hit someone with the shotgun a couple of times, and then you have to switch back to the shotgun.  Except unlike most FPSes, you don't auto-switch back to your next best weapon when your current one is dry, you just get an error message.  So you basically need to have all of your weapons/abilities in front of you all the time instead of being able to just switch to one and use it exclusively.

Actually, if you could ever get the ability to program in sequences of abilities so that you can bind the "current best ability" according to some simple rules to your mouse button (e.g. "when I'm in this mode, have the button fire my charged attack when it's charged, and the attack that charges it when it's not"), that might solve a lot of the control issues.  Of course, some would no doubt argue that this eliminates skill from the game or something.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2007, 06:04:12 PM by Samwise »

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Hoax
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Reply #13 on: March 27, 2007, 10:55:08 PM

I still dont get the problem, unless they are too stupid to let me rebind the hotkeys to keys of my choice...

You do use WASD movement in WoW and you use hotkeys in WoW perhaps not every second and not in actual timed combo's for most classes but I still dont see too much difference.  I'm not saying you're wrong I haven't played the game you have, just saying not being able to use WASD always makes me sort of annoyed.  Similar to the feeling I get from games that dont have jump, force me to acknowledge the existence of f(x) keys or refuse to allow me to rebind certain controls.

To clarify my earlier post, of the 13 keys I was refering to the only number keys involved were 1 2 & 3.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2007, 10:56:44 PM by Hoax »

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
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Samwise
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Reply #14 on: March 27, 2007, 11:04:32 PM

It's hard to express in words how constant the number key mashing is.  It is literally every second.  Imagine circle-strafing around someone in an FPS while staying in melee range, and firing off one shot with each of five weapons in sequence while you're doing it, without a macro.  It's like that.  Nothing whatsoever like hitting a number key every now and then to change weapons, or to fire off a special now and then in the midst of a bunch of autoattacks.

My perceptions might be colored a bit by the fact that I was playing a melee'er, so movement was VERY important for me -- I couldn't just sit in one place and snipe at people, I had to chase them around and mash buttons whenever I got them in range.

"I have not actually recommended many games, and I'll go on the record here saying my track record is probably best in the industry." - schild
Trippy
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Reply #15 on: March 27, 2007, 11:05:18 PM

The problem is that if you are mashing one of the number keys with one of your left hand fingers that finger isn't available to move your character. E.g. if you use your middle finger for forward and back and you need to mash 2 repeatedly you can't move unless you fold one of your other fingers over or under to either handle the movement or the number key.
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Reply #16 on: March 27, 2007, 11:10:56 PM

What Trippy said.

"I have not actually recommended many games, and I'll go on the record here saying my track record is probably best in the industry." - schild
Yoru
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Reply #17 on: March 28, 2007, 12:44:13 PM

I played a ranged character. Running around to keep people in LOS and/or myself out of range of melee still demanded fairly constant movement, especially when there's lots of powerups around - grabbin' them powerups helps a lot.
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Reply #18 on: March 28, 2007, 04:53:17 PM

Back/forward mouse buttons should clear up a bit of movement, but that leaves you having to do turn with camera movement instead of being able to do a clean strafe...

I mean, if you guys were able to be serviceable your first play through it can't be too bad, but it still seems sort of awkward without a million-button mouse.

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Samwise
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Reply #19 on: March 28, 2007, 08:52:52 PM

Serviceable but.... frustrated.  I guess it's "fair" since everyone's gimped equally (except that one guy with four hands and a customer controller setup), but I'm always annoyed when I have to wrestle with a game's controls instead of having them fade into the background.

I suspect that at some point in the future they'll have some sort of UI breakthrough and things will get a lot better.  A sufficiently robust macro system might be enough.

"I have not actually recommended many games, and I'll go on the record here saying my track record is probably best in the industry." - schild
Suranju
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Reply #20 on: December 03, 2007, 12:45:43 PM

I know I'm bringing back an old post but I thought I'd give my overview now that Fury has been released: First of all, the movement isn't that hard once you get used to it. You use WASD for movement as well as dual clicking the mouse. The mashing is pretty fast but It shouldn't be that hard to mash while hitting the movement key you want. Besides you mostly hit  one key as you attack (strafing etc.). You get used to the charge based combat system and, personally, I prefer it to that mana bullshit. Anyway, if you don't have the game yet and my rabbling has done anyone any good than I reccomend going to their website www.unleashthefury.com and trying the trial. Make you're own conclusions. As far as my oppinion goes I give Fury an A+.
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Reply #21 on: December 03, 2007, 02:26:23 PM

What's that smell?

Is is... astroturf?  Ohhhhh, I see.
Hutch
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Reply #22 on: December 03, 2007, 02:57:31 PM


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stu
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Reply #23 on: December 03, 2007, 03:50:45 PM


Dear Diary,
Jackpot!
Hoax
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Reply #24 on: December 03, 2007, 04:23:30 PM

To be fair though, somebody should do a proper review of Fury now that it is out.  If we can't make jokes about the GW/Fury community then what good are we?

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
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Reply #25 on: December 03, 2007, 04:46:23 PM

I think someone would have to be interested in Fury to actually review it.

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Reply #26 on: December 03, 2007, 04:57:12 PM

 Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?

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Reply #27 on: December 04, 2007, 07:19:40 PM

C'mon, at least Saranju could have thrown in that Fury was going to be getting a content patch that provided a new gametype with a greater PvE focus (it's still competitive, but you ... score points or something... against PvE targets while another team competes to get the same points).

MY REVIEW OF FURY:

Not a bad game, but the barrier to entry is too damn steep. You may learn to love it after the first 4 hours, but that 4 hours is going to see you decimated in every battle you take part in, often in ways that leave you confused about what just happened. On top of this, since Fury is a PvP game, every day that passes that you haven't started to play sees current players get more advanced that you, meaning you are even further behind.

It does have some nice systems - loot drops at the end of matches are based on what your oppoents were, but don't actually come out of their backpacks, it's a fast paced game with a very flexible character creation system - but the core gameplay isn't for the faint-hearted. 

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