EvE Devs play with BoB. Investigation in progress....New Scandal page 9!

[Yoru]

So, how much for the 'roids?

Free, just hope you enjoy standing up a lot.

Was Mittani the one that got banned from SA for threatening to sue over the "I am a professional voice actor!" thing?  Even the WoW goons look down on the Eve goons.

Although the drama it starts is a huge margin more interesting than the game itself.

Nah, that was Mawg Spawn. He reads books over teamspeak. Obviously not someone to be messed with.

[Megrim]

Yesssssss, page 23.

ONWARDS, TO VICTORY1!!

[LK]

So, so glad I unsubscribed and got away from this.  This is like a daytime soap opera.

[cmlancas]

I think I wouldn't enjoy it so much if I had time invested in this game.


But because I don't, it's a hell of a lot more engaging than watching television. This is unbelievably good drama, simply because in the BoB/Goon/CCP triangle they all are fucking themselves.

Hilarious.

[NiX]

Has something new come out of this? I want new drama! Someone make up a rumor to fuel the fire again.

[Sparky]

Has something new come out of this? I want new drama! Someone make up a rumor to fuel the fire again.

C'mon man, if gay ewhoring for spaceship lulz doesn't keep your drama hunger satiated for at least a few pages I'm not sure how much more we can do.

[Endie]

My suspicions about those logs revolve mainly around how well-ordered they are.  If two people talk on IM, then they tend to speak across each other: one asks a question while the other is still typing an answer, and you get conversations that are hard to read because they are slightly out-of-order as a result.

That reads like voice dialogue.  I think it's faked.  And I wouldn't be hugely surprised if it's Mittens' doing.  It claims to slag him off, after all, but only a mong would think that anyone but CCP and ISD come out of it actually damaged.  If anyting, Mittens looks like scheming, evil cold-war-bunker guy again, which is always fun.

[Megrim]

My suspicions about those logs revolve mainly around how well-ordered they are.  If two people talk on IM, then they tend to speak across each other: one asks a question while the other is still typing an answer, and you get conversations that are hard to read because they are slightly out-of-order as a result.

That reads like voice dialogue.  I think it's faked.  And I wouldn't be hugely surprised if it's Mittens' doing.  It claims to slag him off, after all, but only a mong would think that anyone but CCP and ISD come out of it actually damaged.  If anyting, Mittens looks like scheming, evil cold-war-bunker guy again, which is always fun.

Just out of curiosity, how old is that Mittanni guy?

[Simond]

Has something new come out of this? I want new drama! Someone make up a rumor to fuel the fire again.

There isn't really anyone who can capitalize on the latest part - both BoB & CCP have their hands tied by the fact that it confirms the "dev hotline" thing, and Goonswarm is busy having fun in SGBS with it.

(Plus it's probably fake anyway)

[Reg]

You see? This is what happens when you let outsiders into your magic circle!

[cmlancas]

Goons are just mad that they didn't get invited to Fraggle Rock.

Sorry.

[Arthur_Parker]

My suspicions about those logs revolve mainly around how well-ordered they are.  If two people talk on IM, then they tend to speak across each other: one asks a question while the other is still typing an answer, and you get conversations that are hard to read because they are slightly out-of-order as a result.

That reads like voice dialogue.  I think it's faked.  And I wouldn't be hugely surprised if it's Mittens' doing.  It claims to slag him off, after all, but only a mong would think that anyone but CCP and ISD come out of it actually damaged.  If anyting, Mittens looks like scheming, evil cold-war-bunker guy again, which is always fun.

It's not faked, Eronarn is real or has cover story that would outsmart 007.

NOT SAFE FOR WORK LINK FOLLOWS.

THIS IS THE NOT SAFE FOR WORK -> LINK.

[cmlancas]

Ogle. Whips and chains? This is amazing. It just adds angle after angle.

[SansWetware]

My suspicions about those logs revolve mainly around how well-ordered they are.  If two people talk on IM, then they tend to speak across each other: one asks a question while the other is still typing an answer, and you get conversations that are hard to read because they are slightly out-of-order as a result.

That reads like voice dialogue.  I think it's faked.  And I wouldn't be hugely surprised if it's Mittens' doing.  It claims to slag him off, after all, but only a mong would think that anyone but CCP and ISD come out of it actually damaged.  If anyting, Mittens looks like scheming, evil cold-war-bunker guy again, which is always fun.

Just out of curiosity, how old is that Mittanni guy?

Late twenties----->early thirties.

[UnSub]

It just keeps getting better and better.

Since we are right off into daytime soap land, here's hoping the next discovery is that the EVE server is actually Hitler's brain, powered by Norwegian orphans tied to a Conan-esque Wheel of Pain. My lack of surprise would only be outstripped by my delight at such drama escalation.

[gimpyone]

What is SGBS?

[Righ]

Bulldog syndrome.

[Endie]

My suspicions about those logs revolve mainly around how well-ordered they are.  If two people talk on IM, then they tend to speak across each other: one asks a question while the other is still typing an answer, and you get conversations that are hard to read because they are slightly out-of-order as a result.

That reads like voice dialogue.  I think it's faked.  And I wouldn't be hugely surprised if it's Mittens' doing.  It claims to slag him off, after all, but only a mong would think that anyone but CCP and ISD come out of it actually damaged.  If anyting, Mittens looks like scheming, evil cold-war-bunker guy again, which is always fun.

It's not faked, Eronarn is real or has cover story that would outsmart 007.

NOT SAFE FOR WORK LINK FOLLOWS.

THIS IS THE NOT SAFE FOR WORK -> LINK.

I wasn't really saying that Eronarn was an alt of Mittani.  What I mean is that the dialogue looks odd.  Maybe someone just "cleaned it up a bit" by changing the order.  Maybe Herr Spymaster-in-exile wrote it up or doctored it and asked Eronarn to post it.  Maybe Eronarn did it himself, based on some real discussion.

Certainly, it shows me nothing new about Mittani, but makes CCP/ISD/Aurora look even more riddled with corruption.  It certainly looks bad on the original accusation re the Admiral Chanchenchunjiggerer stuff.  If the Mittani had still been in charge, and had that available, I don't see why he wouldn't release it at some point.

[Simond]

And maybe Eronarn made it all up - as mentioned previously this is, after all, the person who span a thousand-word novella about how he was secretly working for BoB all along...purely to troll Space GBS.

[Yoru]

What is SGBS?

Space General Bullshit, the Goonfleet main forum.

[Endie]

The whole thing has been utterly forgotten on SGBS (no doubt not entirely coincidental) by the return of a (well verified) GIA agent in from the cold, complete with delicious stories of Bob's internal workings and state.

[Arthur_Parker]

And maybe Eronarn made it all up - as mentioned previously this is, after all, the person who span a thousand-word novella about how he was secretly working for BoB all along...purely to troll Space GBS.

I could list a dozen reasons why it's true, including a high member of BoB who confirms part of it and a couple of goon directors who confirm other parts.  But the fact is, nobody really cares anymore that ISD is corrupt, Eronarn probably was a BoB spy as well as a goonspy, he's already on record as swinging both ways, but again nobody cares that much.  I just thought it was funny that someone would go to that much effort to attack the Mittani while missing the point that everyone knew how he felt anyway.

[Comstar]

The return of a (well verified) GIA agent in from the cold, complete with delicious stories of Bob's internal workings and state.

Please link or copy and paste?

[neep]

This is the original post, take it for what its worth...

---snip--

Hi everyone! Lets be honest, you all know Mittani has eyes and ears everywhere, and today I'd like to let you know just how the campaign against BoB is going from the inside. Obviously this'll be sparse on details, I don't want them to know just where I am and who I am.

Mittani asked me to talk about 'what it's like in BoB' and how they feel about our current tactics, and how they feel about us, so:

What it's like to be in BoB

Boring, fucking boring. Everyone in BoB barely plays the game, they don't rat and they certainly don't mine, they simply log in and use their stockpiled resources to take part in gangs and kill as many people as they can. Like many other alliances it's all about the k:d ratio and simple losses can devastate the morale of some players as they simple cannot comprehend losing. I've seen the loss of a HAC make someone quit for over a week.

Generally life in bob consists of monitoring IRC for notices that alert you to some kind of action, once you start beeping it up, you log in and hopefully kill whatever is annoying the directors, then generally you get bored and log out again, this is the reason their roaming gangs are so brief at camping, they mostly lack the attention span to stick it out.

What I'm trying to get across is they don't play the game in any traditional sense of the word, I've seen references to cockfagging BoB specifically in Delve before and it's just pointless, it'll never achieve a damn thing, the only time you generally see movement is when they are moving from Delve to the frontlines.

How they feel about our current tactics

They don't fucking like it, not one bit. They fucking hate the fact we won't give them a fair fight. If Mittani keeps you guys from engaging them in their prime and only during your prime, they will eventually explode under their own faggotry. BoB is all about unfair hammering of their opponents, and while you can't see the results of hiding in a pos, they spend their time on IRC bitching about what faggots you are, how they hate you for not fighting, and eventually fuck off to play with their curvy kickboxing girlfriends.

Interestingly, whenever BoB lose a fleet fight they absolutely refuse to discuss it. Corp chat and IRC chat will be a fucking wasteland, it'll go from busy chat to dustballs the minute you fighterbomb the fuck out of them. This is often the time they will claim lag caused them to die and they disconnected and it wasn't their fault. You'd be surprised how often they lose connectivity when goonfleet happens to kill them.

The worst thing you can do is meet them head on, they are DESPERATE for that and every discussion about us leads to same thing, a desperate desire we'll all get in battleships and meet them head on.

How do they feel about us

Quote:
<BOldMan> i am sure. i just wish to kill them all
<BOldMan> and all their friends and families
<BOldMan> my dautgher just puke on me, damn goons
As you can imagine, they fucking hate you. They think you're a pack of upstart faggots should just have to decency to die already. Mittani is a moron and you're a bunch of isk selling RA slaves. You all slave away for your masters while RA live it up in the plexes.

They were really pleased by the serious business thread, because they thought they were going to get their fair fight, the fact you won't pisses them off and makes them hate you more. They don't understand our mentality at all, they are offended by the word 'rape', 'cockfagging' they believe means 'cloaking' and jewing baffles the shit out of them too. Keep being yourselves and don't let these faggots beat you.

How will we beat them?

If you guys can keep your cool and keep building up your capfleet you will nullify the only advantage they have, once you can field as many caps as they can they can no longer fuck us over by bringing an overwhelming force, and they risk losing them every single time they deploy them. So don't fuck it up and blow your loads early.

----snip----

and then the Mittani offers the next gem:

----snip----

here's a couple of reasons BoB hate us, let's go through them.

1. Newbies with power: Old-guard faggots think you need 30m sp before you even get to 0.0, and since all of EVE has always revolved around the older players being able to kill the newer players with impunity, an entity like Goonfleet completely flips their system and their "rightful place" on its end. They hate this.

2. Offensive culture: RAPE RAPE RAPE RAPE RAPE most pubbies can't handle it. Combine 1 and 2 and you see why they see us as a 'cancer of EVE'. This is great because it's true: we're here to shit in their sandbox. I don't know why but RAPE is particularly bothersome to them.

3. Unconventional tactics: We don't fight 'their way' or the 'right way' or the 'fun way', which amounts to lining up to be blown up by their superior sp, t2 ships and capitals. Most other entities in EVE play their way except for RA and GS.

----snip----

As much love as I have for the goons carving out some space for themselves and letting new people to eve participate in their pew-pew, posts like this makes me happy I don't have to put up with their directorate (or at least the mittani's drivel).

[Reg]

All the "rape this, rape that" makes them sound pretty juvenile. I'm moving more towards "A pox on both their houses" at this point.

[Endie]

Neep, that's by the same guy, but much older.  This thread is new, fresh and deliciously detailed.

Comstar, I can't really post the details, although no doubt the many Bob spies on the GF forums have passed it on to them.  Loose lips and all that.  I have no doubt it'll spread out over the next few days, but there's nothing specifical that's gobsmacking, just an encouraging view of the situation of various elements of bob and the issues they face, as well as some pointers as to what they do well (and not so well), what their key approaches are and stuff like that: where they make their money, where it goes, and so on.

[Simond]

http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/8538

The recent scandal was a response from the EVE community as a whole. EVE is billed as a "sandbox", created by CCP but always with the intention of being developed by the players. Customers create characters and venture into the "box" to shape the metaphorical hills and valleys in the "sand". Whether it be through conflict or peace, destruction or production, we as the entire collection of people who play EVE wish to be in charge of our own direction.

Developer misconduct has occured in the past, a fact admitted by the company. Direct communication between players and members of CCP's volunteer team which handles forum moderation, in-game bug hunting and storyline development has occured despite the rule that members of the volunteer program should under no circumstances reveal who they are to anyone, a fact admitted by some of the players and members of the volunteer team in unison. Both instances lead to the perception that biased influence is being injected like a virus into the "sandbox" which strips away some of the freedom people log in to experience.

We all play this game to have fun, whether it be to rise to power as a space-controlling alliance, to corner a part of the player-driven market and reap the financial benefits, or simply to undock and fly off into the darkness looking for a target to point our guns toward with the expectation that no favoritism from an outside and infinitely powerful entity exists.

Resentment occurs when the assumed level playing ground begins to vanish, regardless of which side it appears to favor. The scandals existed and exist whether Goonswarm plays or not, to paint it any differently is to hypocritically deny that there has ever been a problem. While a collection of members within Goonswarm made a loud racket (primarily a knee-jerk reaction to the perception that misconduct still exists even after CCP's creation of an Internal Affairs department to stamp out such issues), the voices of hundreds and hundreds of other unaffiliated players rose up from all corners of EVE's universe to express their equally shared dissatisfaction.

EVE Online is an amazing source of entertainment with a vast market, constant conflict and heart-pounding PvP combat always at the hand of, and created by, the players, using the systems set up by the developers. The space for metagaming within the conflict between powerful groups and alliances of players with respect to internal disruption and spying is by far one of the best "features" which has come about, again due to the actions of players interacting this way within the unbiased construct of the game. Many people play the game solely for this aspect and the desire to lay waste to whatever opposition bars their way, or to stand up and fight against the well-established old powers of veteran characters.

It's not about winning or losing an intergalactic space war inside an imaginary universe on the internet, it is about feeling secure that whatever we do is the direct result of our own efforts free from the assistance or impedance of a guiding hand. To view the events that transpired as unwarranted outrage or to claim that a certain group of people behaved in a manner purely because of a conflict within a computer game is to ignore and discard the feelings and opinions of many thousands more who wish to see EVE shine in its full capacity and enjoy the ride.

- Goonswarm

The increased interest in EVE Online, not only from gamers but multilaterally – even from those who have never actually played the game – illustrates the extraordinary characteristics we believe set us apart. Just because it's a game doesn't mean that everything related to it is virtual. It's compelling, aggressive and provocative, and those core elements are not only what makes it interesting but also what can evoke real emotion from the players who delve deeply into it. They have a genuine sense of ownership within the gameworld that we want to encourage. Moving beyond the confines of the server lines to discuss in-game matters with gusto and fervor is as much a part of the game for them as hunting NPCs or building a battleship. It's that passion that inspires us as developers and makes us strive to continue to push the boundaries of what EVE is and all that it can be.

- CCP

[gimpyone]

I think my head spun around with that CCP spin.

[cmlancas]

CCP.

[Arthur_Parker]

THINGS MITTANI LIED about:

God, where to start? There's like a year and a half of stuff I could go over. Time to get some stuff off my chest, it's been long enough.

Personally I think the Eronarn drama-squib is pretty funny. He'd identified a dev, was looking to move to Iceland to work for CCP, and said the dev was hitting on him on irc, So saying "go fuck him and find out what you can" didn't seem like a stretch, since bragging about his gay exploits was part and parcel of Eronarn's persona. Let's not forget this is the "I fucked Kirtaner in an anime 4-way" guy. Compared to some of the other things that went on, that was downright tame. Alas, it was not to be, as Eronarn turned out to be uselessly homosexual. When Death asked me to locate Enslaver's house in the UK such that he could have angry Russians cut the power to it and knock him offline to kill his titan, now that was wild.

And no, I never did look up Enslaver's house; shortly thereafter Dungar exposed him as a GM to AnthonyZ and got a (relatively) innocent fat kid's character nuked. Welp.

The funny thing about the "CCP is fucking us" issue is that it was a self-created problem. People from ISD or other areas would approach me and volunteer information; we never had an explicit GIA campaign to infiltrate CCP, though when we DID get a leak we'd wring it for all it was worth. And every time we'd get a volunteer out of the blue, it'd be more apparent that other alliances have similar volunteers. Or we'd find stuff on other people's boards about contacts with CCP, and it just built up over a year and a half. If we'd never looked behind that curtain we'd never have found abuse and corruption, and I probably wouldn't have reached the spectacular levels of bitterness and loathing that I did at the end. Oops!

We (me and the directorate) never thought that there was a 'conspiracy' within CCP to keep us down, but 10-ish devs or GMs or QA guys all working independently from each other within the company with BoB's interests at heart. Even the most innocent of the exposed GMs, Enslaver, was found dropping strong hints about the changes to the t2 market, and what bpos to buy and sell in relation to upcoming game adjustments; that one bit of knowledge had a market effect of billions in-game. When you start throwing in more high-level employees the level of "harmless leaks" really gets to the point that you throw up your hands and say fuck it. Oh sure, you'd hear us bitching about 'CCP is fucking us', or 'Fuck CCP', but some people take this to mean that we were expecting a smoke-filled boardroom with Oveur and Magnus chewing on cigars mulling over ways to fuck us. This was not the case. However, it only takes one Enslaver or Admiral Charmafaggot to break a game, much less a ton of Aurora, its head, T20, etc etc etc.

Not that we were white knights. It was just that there was a hidden arms race in the game, and apparently BoB was way fucking ahead of us, and had been since the game came out.

Hypocrisy: Jesus, the level of doubletalk and inconsistency would make your eyes bleed if you cared about that sort of thing. Some directors did, some didn't. Most of GS's leadership has held something of a fortress mentality, particularly among the longer-serving directors; much like Taiwan under the gun of China, survival was all that came to matter, and principle be damned. Most of the universe has been trying to stomp out GS for so long that we couldn't afford to 'fight with honor' or 'avoid metagaming'; lacking skillpoints, isk, capitals, we had to turn to ruthless metagaming and open hypocrisy to buy GS time to survive.

When I'd say something like "These guys are awful people, hate them" when in reality they're nerds just like us, I knew it was a line of bullshit. But if it made people angry and fired them up enough to log in and push the other guy's shit in, so be it. At the end of the war they could always be 'rehabilitated' like D2 was. "Oh, those guys weren't so bad, cute pubbies, we like them now!" Yeah. Using xenophobia, emphasizing the dichotomy between 'pubbie' and 'goon' (congrats, you paid 10bux, you have a 'unique culture', now go kill those other guys), pointing out how we'd been persecuted as a group... all of that appeared to help form a strong GS identity that was lacking in other goon corps. Nothing helps form an identity like a little persecution and nemesis, after all. In hindsight you can step back and wag your finger, saying that such Nixonian antics helped nothing, but who knows for sure.

People would ask, "What is the difference between GS and BoB really" and about the only thing I could point to, as far as tactics and methods go, is that we were very aware about our hypocrisy, while they seem completely blind to it. Everyone's a bastard, some just admit it. Or maybe they aren't bastards, and they end up like FIX, praying to Jesus and wondering why they keep losing.

Ultimately, the best thing that ever happened to GS as a matter of cohesion was BoB. They cemented the ingroup vs outgroup feelings, they persecuted us as a matter of identity ("goons have no souls", etc) and provided external validation for the goon/pubbie dichotomy that previously had only been puffed up within GS. One of the reasons I think that Goonfleet seems so odd to the average SA poster is that "goon identity" is taken very seriously compared to that of a non-goonfleet forumgoer. When you hate your enemy, you're much more likely to ignore losses and wake up wanting to push their shit in, and who could avoid hating DBP?

Most people saw through the propaganda as just that, but enjoyed it nonetheless. A few people bought the propaganda hook line and sinker. And some actually thought that they were part of an enlightened minority who saw though the propaganda, not realizing that 90% of the fleet did too and was just running with it. That's why we kept using it even if it got old or stale, because most people kind of got a kick out of it and it fired them up, even if it was quite apparent to all parties that it was just rah-rah.

So while hating the other guy would make people log on, finding out that the other guy had GMs and devs in his pocket would make people log off and quit. Primarily me, too; there's a lot of crap that's never been revealed publicly and eventually it just ruined my desire to play, leaving nothing but a sense of bitterness and loathing. Once we actively began investigating the corruption problem it became sort of a self-fulfilling prophecy; we'd find dirty laundy and it'd ruin our desire to play. For a while there, even before I had CEO dumped in my lap, Illuminati Jabber was more like City of Villains jabber. If I had to point to a low point, the absolute worst, was when in 9-9 we sat there watching Widebrant and Parid try to fuel pos's and time stront while getting repeatedly bowled by supercaps. It was so obviously wrong, so clearly a stupid retarded exploit, with the smirking cunts in local giggling about it... and then of course, as soon as we got a supercap it was declared an exploit on that very day. Just a coincidence in a sea of bitter coincidences. Bein said that Titans made me crazy, and yeah, he's right.

Getting CEO dumped in my lap sucked. I never wanted it, and one day Rem just said "I'm quitting, I can't take it anymore, here you go." I hated being in the big chair and it's obvious to everyone that I didn't want the job. The only thing that was keeping me there was a feeling of obligation to goons, and eventually that snapped too. Before I was CEO, EVE stayed at the office, something I did in my off-time to amuse me. When I was made CEO, suddenly EVE became an all-day job from hell. Perfectly timed, might I add, for the worst part of the war and the worst part of the supercap abuse era. Jabber was a nightmare; Remedial was repeatedly trying to convince me and the directors to abandon absolutely everything and go back to Syndicate. He was the worst backseat CEO possible, and he called his 'abandon everything' plan a Modest Proposal. Had a whole writeup ready to go, and every fucking day he'd try to wear me down into posting it. I almost did, too. It's incredibly demoralizing to have the guy you followed from day one telling you that everything is hopeless and all of your efforts will come to naught, and it's even worse when you're supposed to 'put on a brave face' for a job you hate. It was a great one-two punch: "I'm quitting. You're in charge, you have to make the tough decisions and accept responsibility for them! Now, do this. Why aren't you doing this? Nothing you will do will succeed. You need to take us back to NPC space." Etc.

Basically, I was intended to be Rem's fall guy, looking back on it. He was convinced that GS was doomed and wanted it back to NPC space where he felt it would be safe, but he didn't want to accept responsibility for that decision, so he made me CEO (you can forcibly grant CEOship, it requires no consent in-game), told everyone I was CEO, then tried to make me be the one who forced goonfleet go back to Syndicate. Then he stole the titan fund and proved to everyone that he's a shithead, so I can now gleefully reveal his efforts throughout my very brief, disastrous administration to give up and go all the way home.

The cunt.

Still bitter.

I'm still pissed about it, and yes, he did steal the titan fund, no, it's not some secret prank or plan. He took the money from the people who put a roof over his head and paid his rent, and no, I haven't said a word to him since I resigned.

Speaking of Zosh, VCBees were awesome fun and some of my fondest memories in EVE are of setting up GoonPlatoon with Kiwillian and bumping into shit and demanding missl. They also pissed BoB off so much that it was some of the best griefing we've done in the history of GS, and if I could somehow still have VCbees actively polluting empire and causing havoc or just blowing up horribly and comedically, I'd do it.

aaaaaaaaanyway, that's a big load off my chest. I did to Sesfan what Rem did to me, namely dumping CEOship on him (THE ABUSED BECOME THE ABUSERS), but he's been a war leader, and a leader of men (space nerds) since the day I joined goonfleet; he's much better suited for it than me, and has done an amazing job turning a shit situation around. The big thing that I did for Sesfan that Remedial didn't do for me was to fucking vanish for a good long while and not offer any advice or policy suggestions unless specifically contacted about them, and then in private. Because good god is it hard to manage an organization this big with a fat faggot sitting behind you openly telling your directors how your plans suck and are doomed and that we should all just give up and go back to S-U.

That's not to say that I would have been a good CEO had Rem not interfered, since I didn't want to be CEO and am flat out not suited to being the Guy In Charge. The whole thing seriously damaged my ability to make dispassionate political calls, which before I was very, very good at before being CEO; it's easy to make a reasoned political choice when it's your boss who's going to take the heat, but when it's you yourself in the leadership chair, suddenly a lot of other personal considerations and fears start fucking with your ability (or mine, the really good politicans can lead and make sober calls at the same time) to make sound decisions.

Oh hey look at that, still bitter. All political careers end in failure, the DC maxim goes, and there we are. The important thing is that GS has finally reached the goal we've worked so hard on for so long: it is self-sufficient and unable to be destroyed. You guys have finally caught up, by and large, in terms of skillpoints, capital pilots, and logistical ability. You don't have to worry about anyone coming down and wiping you out, because you're kicking the balls of the meanest thing in this game every single day. And ultimately that bottom line is all that matters.

The Mittani's version of events, I found it interesting.

[Endie]

Is that in spacegbs somewhere non-obvious?  Tell me I don't have to go into SPYAD? 

[Arthur_Parker]

Page 5 of the "We Never Wanted That MMO Anyway" thread in SGBS.

[Endie]

Why would you lie to me?  It was page 7.  You Mittani-rolled me :colbert:

[Simond]

I'm tempted to post the "Remedial Plan" - it's hilarious with hindsight.

[Endie]

yeah, if BoB only knew how close they were to winning there, before the tables turned.

Well, given the number of spies they have on our boards, they do know. But you know what I mean.