Guitar thread

[stray]

Jimi just downtuned a half step, @ Eb. He played normal .010's and .011's. He used an Octavio for getting those weird sounds (and it was an "octave up", not octave down pedal). You can't even downtune an octave on a guitar, no matter how big your strings. Can't even do it on a B baritone (.70-ish gauge) well either. You need a true baritone, which is closer to a bass than a guitar.

[edit] Umm... If you're having trouble playing in C on a strat, then first off get another spring (usually they only come with 3). Or at the very least, tighten the spring tension more. You don't need to hardtail it. Then give your truss rod a quarter clockwise turn, just a little more stiffness. Helps to get a mix-matched string set as well -- like a .010-.060. Your small E string doesn't need to be .011 necessarily (unless you want it to, which is cool), but you're better off with fatter low E and A strings. For the sake of convenience, GHS makes a Zakk Wylde set that's 10-60 gauge. E is 60, A is 52. Would work well whether you're in Open C or drop C.

[Righ]

My current favorite 'jam' album is Fleetwood Mac's Live in Boston. I've had it a couple years now and I never get tired of it. Peter Green and Kirwin pwn.

Excellent album. My current favorites include Man's Be Good To Yourself At Least Once A Day and Mountain's Twin Peaks. 

[Amarr HM]

Jimi just downtuned a half step, @ Eb. He played normal .010's and .011's. He used an Octavio for getting those weird sounds (and it was an "octave up", not octave down pedal). You can't even downtune an octave on a guitar, no matter how big your strings. Can't even do it on a B baritone (.70-ish gauge) well either. You need a true baritone, which is closer to a bass than a guitar.

[edit] Umm... If you're having trouble playing in C on a strat, then first off get another spring (usually they only come with 3). Or at the very least, tighten the spring tension more. You don't need to hardtail it. Then give your truss rod a quarter clockwise turn, just a little more stiffness. Helps to get a mix-matched string set as well -- like a .010-.060. Your small E string doesn't need to be .011 necessarily (unless you want it to, which is cool), but you're better off with fatter low E and A strings. For the sake of convenience, GHS makes aZakk Wylde set that's 10-60 gauge. E is 60, A is 52. Would work well whether you're in Open C or drop C.

Yeh ur right half step is what I meant actually my terminology isn't great being kinda self taught or from just watching others. Needed to switch tunings quickly playing live sometimes and hence had to put a shaped wooden block against the springs (no truss rod for me til I get that back to normal). Was playing live with 3/4 different tunings and didn't have enough guitars to pass around so was best option at the time & tbh I don't do much truss rod work so not suffering for it.

[Selby]

Add Steve Vai to the list of technical guitarists to sleep through.

Steve Vai... is one of those guitarists who I only liked one aspect of their work, that of his time with Zappa.  His solo work is yawn inducing for me, even if it is technically brilliant at times.

Steve Howe did some amazing work on several Yes albums, but alot of it is just... so uninspiring.  I mean so much of it gets lost in the mix of keyboards and flutes and other wacky stuff it makes it hard for me to take it seriously.  My guitar instructor worshipped Steve Howe and could play any song he ever put to record.

Dream Theatre... ugh.  I bought one album of theirs that was supposedly their "best" at the time.  I couldn't believe how boring it was.  I pretty much don't buy albums based on "sounds like artist X, Y" that most music links try and put together, because they suck ;-)

My favorite guitarist are always ones who aren't recognized as "geniuses" or "virtuosos" but people whose playing I just admire.  A good punk record can be more enjoyable than some of the most technically proficient and well played guitar work in my opinion.  A good song is a good song regardless of genre.  Technical wankery minus a good song is just technical wankery.  Put a good song with it and keep the wanking to the song's structure and you have a recipe for delight.

[stray]

Yeh ur right half step is what I meant actually my terminology isn't great being kinda self taught or from just watching others. Needed to switch tunings quickly playing live sometimes and hence had to put a shaped wooden block against the springs (no truss rod for me til I get that back to normal). Was playing live with 3/4 different tunings and didn't have enough guitars to pass around so was best option at the time & tbh I don't do much truss rod work so not suffering for it.

Ah yeah, I have the same problem sometimes (lots of tunings, not enough guitars).

Truss rods... Yeah, you can screw up a guitar big time if you don't know what you're doing.. But like I said, little quarter turns are the key. If you don't see a difference after a couple of days, then do another quarter turn. As long as you know that, you're a-ok. People who screw up their necks turn multiple rounds, not realizing what a dramatic difference that makes.

[Sky]

NEED MOAR GEETARS :)

I need to make a winter shim for my Alvarez acoustic. It's been sitting in the closet with the first string unplayable all winter. Still frets out on bends around the 10-13 on the 1st string, it's pretty cheap and the fretboard humps a little over the body connection Anyway, it's playable now and I love it because it has a built-in tuner. Only time I play the Rain Song is when that guitar is 'in season'.

I've also mentioned I keep my old crappy electric around with the action raised very high to play slide on. I need to learn an easy memory trick for transitioning from open G to open E/D. I love open G for the old Muddy Waters/delta stuff but Allmans/Trucks and a lot of other more modern stuff uses open E. And then there's later era Muddy/Margolin/Haynes slide in standard tuning...but I bash the shit out of the slide and don't want to mess up my beloved SG with it...

NEED MOAR GEETARS!!!

[stray]

I don't play slide much in open G either. Really like Open E though. I have no idea how those dudes played slide in standard.

[Sky]

Lots of chord fragments. Problem with open tunings is learning scale positions and chord fragments. I find it very limiting to do anything beyond some basic riffs in open tunings.

[Amarr HM]

Ah yeah, I have the same problem sometimes (lots of tunings, not enough guitars).

Truss rods... Yeah, you can screw up a guitar big time if you don't know what you're doing.. But like I said, little quarter turns are the key. If you don't see a difference after a couple of days, then do another quarter turn. As long as you know that, you're a-ok. People who screw up their necks turn multiple rounds, not realizing what a dramatic difference that makes.

I got a guitar tech to do it to be on the safe side its an  1954 anniversary USA strat I wasn't goin messin with it cost me enough but worth every penny love it.

One thing about open tunings is that G C and D all have the same chord shapes except you move a string across C G D (in that order) same for the slide licks.

[stray]

Cool. Is that one of the masterbuilt ones?

Anyhow, it's easy. Unless your tech is doing it for free, it's good to know this stuff. I am/used to be a guitar tech btw. Trust me. Muhaha 

[Amarr HM]

It has the original contour body and the original machine heads but I don't think its a masterbuild is there somewhere I can check it? Its one of the nicest guitars I've ever picked up much less to own it 

[stray]

I don't know about limited Custom Shop models if that's what it is, but masterbuilt guitars usually have a decaled name of the builder on the back of the headstock.

[Amarr HM]

Right it ain't masterbuilt that would have been a bonus. Playing slide in standard tuning ain't so bad cause you know most of the positions already although if you mean solo slide players playing in standard then I have no clue how that could be done.

[Sky]

Well, playing a C, G or a D isn't very difficult with a slide in open tunings. Playing a C, G7 and Am in the same tuning...not so easy.

There's never enough time to play guitar imo. Here's a guy who knows how to play properly in open G:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=pJQNiYQqmIQ

I like the version Johnny Winter does on Hard Again, it swings a lot more. Keb Mo did a nice version on the Tribute to Muddy PBS special, real snap on the A#, which Margolin said Muddy always used to bust his balls about (not snapping it hard enough).

Playing around watching the Keb Mo clip again, I noticed a pretty hot related link:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=0891fMsvBy4

I need to learn that tune bluesy like that! Most need to learn open G better and get an independent thumb. My thumb/bass lines are always my weakest thing with acoustic blues. Back when I linked my first recorded slide tune (Can't Be Satisfied) here, the bass was awful, uneven and frenetic.

Since I'm posting links, here's one of the tunes I have pretty well under the belt and want to debut at the blues jam assuming I ever make it to another one :P http://youtube.com/watch?v=8MlHxDsaWMU

[Amarr HM]

Ha nice links not really listened to much keb mo but very cool must get more of his stuff. Open D is great for practicing thumbwork the 6th string (E) is your bass lines and you if you have the thumbpick (Im a leftie so I have to order mine in :( ) You can get some real nice snapping going on.


Went to see this guy last year hes techinically awesome slide playin. Probably playing slide since he was 3 years old.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=3hMIdxb_pYY&feature=related

[Sky]

The location of the root isn't the problem, it's my problem of not being able to play two things independently. Not sure I'll ever surmount it, it's the same reason I'll never be a good drummer, I can't keep a steady hi-hat while playing syncopation on the drums. I also don't use thumb or fingerpicks, I originally learned to play classical style and then my fingerwork was honed during the years I played bass.

[stray]

I just like open E/D for the bluesy slide riffs, and Open G for rock riffs or folky stuff. If I could play blues in G more, I would. I can kind of fake an RJ style, but it's buzzy and sketchy. So much plucking. I think this goes to what I saying awhile back about fingerstyles -- I need a wider neck. I play that stuff better on a classical, but it needs a steel sound. Besides, nylon sounds like shit with a slide. Once I get a new steel string though, I'm gonna try to improve it.

[penfold]

You can't even downtune an octave on a guitar, no matter how big your strings. Can't even do it on a B baritone (.70-ish gauge) well either. You need a true baritone, which is closer to a bass than a guitar.

The current Metal solution to down tuning is add more strings. Dino Cazares talks about it extensively in this Ibanez 8 string promo.

There's a track on Meshuggah's Nothing album that used a detuned 7 string to BbO.

[Selby]

The current Metal solution to down tuning is add more strings.

And yet half of these bands still can't write a tune to save their life.  Blast beats and de-tuned 1 finger races up the fretboard combined with gutteral groans or tough guy screams.  Just a tad one-dimensional...  Adding one more string to the mix isn't going to make up for writing boring songs!

[Righ]

That's okay, listen to the other half of the bands. Meshuggah's mesmeric polyrhythms and instrumental interplay is anything but boring.

[stray]

Messhugah's cool. Drummer is sick.

I'm just confused on how they'd get a 7 string to "BbO" -- assuming you mean Bb, but a full octave down? A standard 7 string tuning starts off in a low B. So do you just mean they tune down half a step to Bb? Because as far as I can tell, getting a full octave down seems impossible. The neck isn't long enough -- and B is already low to begin with.

Besides that, Bb but an octave lower would just be the 6th fret of the low E on a standard 4 string bass. I mean, if you want an octave lower, then just play a bass! If it's the feel/thickness of bass strings you're concerned about, then play something like a Fender Bass VI (or Schecter's Hellcat VI). You can riff quite well on them (a lot of Cure songs use them, to give an example).

[Righ]

I think you're right - just standard Bb:

http://www.deadtide.com/interviews/page.php?id=41

[penfold]

Ah i confess to reading about the BbO tuning elsewhere. I just know it's looooow.

[Selby]

Messhugah's cool. Drummer is sick.

Minus their vocals, I have to agree that their earlier stuff is pretty cool.  I haven't listened to anything they've done since 2002 or so, so I can't really comment.  My problem is more with the lame opening bands I have to suffer through opening good metal bands ;-)  That and Hatebreed.  I don't see why they are worshipped so and I've seen them live twice.  Tons of energy and decent stage presence... just every song sounds the same and does not excite me.

[Llava]

Here you go, have fun:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jIf6Z4cOQSA&feature=related

I'm still practicing with the bass, Paul McCartney makes me angry.  RELAX MAN.

[Raph]

Did the Taylor factory tour on Friday. The T5 is sweet, didn't get to try any of the new solidbody models, none were in the visitor center. Did get to see some of the Builder's Reserve half-built. All of them preordered going back to January.

Tonight saw David Wilcox live. He does nutso tunings. BTW, on one of his songs he drilled a larger hole in the tuner to string a bass string thru there, and tuned it down a full octave below whatever it was at.

Peter Mulvey detunes the low E to an A, or sometimes both of 'em to a GG pair.  For what he's doing he wants the buzzy sound, and frets 'em together. This is actually an F# in the bass, the rest capoed at the 5th fret, I think.

http://www.last.fm/music/Peter+Mulvey/_/If+Love+is+Not+Enough

I did a tune with it that way too, don't have a recording of it though; I actually tuned AADGAD, then capoed the four higher strings at the 7th fret.

[Raph]

OK, here's a bit of a trainwreck. :)

http://www.raphkoster.com/2008/04/13/the-sunday-song-polliwog/

200bpm blues jam trainwreck! Whee! 

[stray]

Here you go, have fun:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jIf6Z4cOQSA&feature=related

I'm still practicing with the bass, Paul McCartney makes me angry.  RELAX MAN.

Uh, video's dead.

OK, here's a bit of a trainwreck. :)

http://www.raphkoster.com/2008/04/13/the-sunday-song-polliwog/

200bpm blues jam trainwreck! Whee! 

Yes, a bit of a trainwreck. 

Are all of those real instruments? I can't tell with the drums.

[Llava]

Here you go, have fun:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jIf6Z4cOQSA&feature=related

I'm still practicing with the bass, Paul McCartney makes me angry.  RELAX MAN.

Uh, video's dead.

Still works for me.

Try this:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=uWAbyFQxqG8

[stray]

Got it now. Funny. Had to search for what song he was referencing though (don't watch the show much).

[edit] In other news, my classical's tuning pegs are thrashed.  Back to playing my shitty takamine steel string -- which not only sucks now to me because of the neck width, but I can't seem to cure of it intonation issues. It's a piece of shit.

I played a Seagull over the weekend. A $500 range guitar, and it sounded SWEET. I'm surprised. Just a mere vibrato on it sounded like it came out of a much more expensive guitar. Neck width suited fingerstyling as well. I may have to get one of these. I'd rather shell out big for an electric.

[Raph]

OK, here's a bit of a trainwreck. :)

http://www.raphkoster.com/2008/04/13/the-sunday-song-polliwog/

200bpm blues jam trainwreck! Whee! 

Yes, a bit of a trainwreck. 

Are all of those real instruments? I can't tell with the drums.

The drums are sample loops. The instruments -- Washburn bass, the Melody Maker for the two electric parts, and the Yamaha P70 with a piano VST.

[stray]

Well it sounds like you're having fun, trainwreck or not. I don't think you mentioned before that you finally settled on a keyboard (or did you?).. P70 eh?


I must re-mention Seagull. Have you played any of them? Check em out, if you can. You're a discerning acoustic player. I'd like to know anyone else's opinions.

[Sky]

I liked some parts of your trainwreck, Raph. Not sure why you jumbled all that together like that, though  The piano in particular I enjoyed because there a bajillion blues guitarists around, but not many good blues pianists.

I do hate fake drums, though.

Totally jealous you toured Taylor. Want want Taylor classical cutaway. Never played a Seagull.

[Furiously]

I bought a capo to play the Jeff Buckley Hallelujah version, have to look at the tabs a bit more.

[stray]

5th fret capo, basically a G shape chord to Em (C to Am in standard). I can't type the tab here, but the intro is based around E->G->A to umm B, then to the main G/Em rhythm.

...

Eh, I'm sure you find something better to explain it! Pretty easy song, except for singing, of course