f13.net

I started a reply to a pm from Stray (from a while back, it's not very personal so I hope he doesn't mind, pm if you do, Stray), but I figured maybe it'd spark some conversation from the musicians in the crowd, and imo we need more music talk!

Anyway, here's the quote I was addressing:
We were talking about tone and gear. I didn't have any experience in newer gear, so at the time I couldn't really provide a decent answer.

Lately, I've been thinking of ditching my cheesy cheapo guitar and buying a 'real' guitar. Also been playing sickly downtuned, inspired by my recent purchase of the live Black Label Society discs. Since I hate the idea of a 7-string guitar, I started looking into baritone guitars, which are very nice indeed. Fills an aural gap I often have playing either the guitar or bass, sounds heavy as hell and great for squeels and bends.

I think for the time being I'm going to shoot for a standard guitar (probably a les paul studio, can't afford custom with the tastier necks).

But one thing of interest I learned from my blues buddy, Jimmy Wolf (http://jimmywolf.iuma.com), who uses a baritone when he plays without a bass player (duo with drummer). He avoids the mud that baritone and downtuned guitars suffer by cranking up the mids most guitarists scoop out for a heavy sound these days. It cleaned up a lot of the sound, though there's obviously a lot farther you can take it, but that little bit helped me out (and was obvious once he said it). Didn't do much for the muddiness when palm-muting, though, but then, I'm still on an extremely downtuned standard guitar.

Anyone else want to talk guitar playing or gear? And if I'm playing a mmog with you and suddenly disappear...I'm playing guitar and forgot I'm logged in ;)

I have nothing to add here, except that I want one of these basses:

(http://www.spaltbasses.com/images/lwpage1.jpg)

You're well aware of my n00bishness when it comes to all things guitar, but I'm all about this sort of thing, particularly where gear is concerned.  I may not have talent/skill, but I do have disposable income.  :P

Have you checked out the Schecter Hellcat VI?  

(http://www.schecterguitars.com/Dproducts/2004_models/hellcat_VI/hellcat_VI_blk.jpg)

Sounds like what you're looking for gear-wise.  I played with one for a little at the Mobile GC and was pretty impressed w/fit/finish.  30" scale(!) and 3 'buckers.  It really punches out that 'chunka-chunka' sound it sounds like you're looking for.

I had the good fortune of speaking with Tommy Victor after that PM (singer/guitar of Prong, current guitarist for Danzig). Straight from the horse's mouth! He gave me the rundown on baritones, and recommended the Schecter C1-EX (the Schecter Scorpion is similar, just a different body shape -- the Hellcat has a 30" scale and is kind of in a category of it's own). It's a 6 string slim neck, with a slightly longer scale to compensate for the big strings (String size is 13 to 62 -- standard tuning is B to B, but can go even lower than that and still sound great. The Hellcat is too crazy for me -- 25 to 95).

Funny that you mentioned this though. I finally gathered enough spare cash that I ordered one this morning, in fact. I'm not sure if it'll replace my SG or Fenders, but I understand what you're saying about that aural gap between bass and guitar. It may not be standard, but somehow this sounds just right. I'm also 6'4", and the extended scale feels perfect...Like a bass. Yet, it isn't a bass.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Misc/bj_c1_ex_blk_pop.jpg)
C1-EX - Simple, but pretty

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Misc/scorpion_sbk_pop.jpg)
Scorpion - Same great sound, but a little tacky for my tastes

Since you like Black Label, why not go for a Zakk model (Supposedly the Epiphone models are still pretty good....but about $2000 dollars cheaper)? From what I understand, he downtunes to the C range on some of his guitars, but still sounds great. Not exactly what baritones are capable of, but that's low enough.

I'm sure it's possible to get a LP Studio to do some of the same things, but I think the ZW necks are a little different than most LP models (not sure about that). I was thinking of doing the same with my SG, but figured it best to keep it how it is, since it's my only Gibson.

A couple of things to do is get the neck set up to handle really thick strings. Supposedly, Zakk's signature GHS strings (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/100447/) are perfect for it : He uses very thick guages for rhythm (70), but normal guages on the high notes for leads (10). The EMG active pickups (EMG 81's and 85's) on his models boost a lot of midrange as well (among other things), so you're friend may be on to something.

He says he shaves the necks down, I'm not sure if he's just talking shaving off the finish or if he actually digs down deeper to change the shape at all. He says he's going for the feel of a baseball bat, heh. But yeah, I was checking out his model, it seems to make a lot of the upgrades I'd need anyway...I just hate to have another guitarist's recognizable pattern on my guitar :) Like playing Eddie's black and red or something. Just feels cheesy.

Part of the issue I have with BLS tuning, they super detune the low string, I prefer standard tuning, which is why I was thinking about the baritones. Get some of the low end but keep the standard tuning. I dunno, might just have to learn to play detuned (I can do drop d, it's just annoying imo, though it makes basic power chords simple, I guess).

That Schecter looks nice, I need to get myself to a decent guitar shop (long drive, over an hour heh). Kinda looks like a PRS imo. I don't like the shallowed body scoop of the Scorpion, though, looks like it's not as friendly to playing on the higher frets. Thanks for the heads-up.

Bought the BLS concert DVD, pretty nice. Besides being a great show (and Trujillo on bass), there is a bit from some guitar instruction thing Zakk did, three solos. I ran through those and watching him riff just brought me back to the days of shred, so I did some shred practice and learned just how much stamina I've lost. Great practice, though, and highlighted the fact that I never learned a good climbing arpeggio to match my descending arpeggios. My landlord must've thought someone else was playing, because I'd rip out the descending and then struggle to find a good picking pattern (hint: alternate picking ain't cutting it, heh) for teh ascending, and it's all sloppy and mistimed...and then rip back down the descending. I got a kick out of sounding like total garbage, oddly enough. Fun to learn something I've let slide for decades. Also hilarious to hear Zakk, who's a boozing, cussing redneck, give a lesson, trying to be polite and aiming it toward younger guitarists, obviously.
Yeah, that's the dilemma...I want a nice guitar for my more aggressive stuff, and a baritone is perfect. But I really need to get hands-on to see how it fits with all the other stuff I play. I definitely need a good acoustic, too, love playing acoustic guitar, I love the rich tone and percussiveness. Maybe what I really need is a second job ;)
Nice looking bass. I'd like to get a Warwick bass (http://www.warwickbass.com/basses/thumb_bass.html) if I had the dough. Hell, even some new pickups (bartolini PJs) for my old ESP Custom bass (bought at their shop in hollyweird directly from the luthier!)

I'd love one of those too! All I have is the getting started bass from Ibanez. Of course, I haven't been playing it enough to really get started. Fucking computer games.

Heh, I'm what you'd call a "slow hand". Don't feel bad about losing any of the shredding capabilities that you had -- I never really had them to begin with. I'm mainly into rhythm, or songwriting, I guess....Pretty much stink at everything else. So I won't have some of the issues with baritones that I suspect you may have. Hard to say. It could be just that I suck at leads in the first place.  :wink:

For what it's worth, reviewers on Harmony Central seem to be of all types though. Some lead players, some not, but just about all of them consider it (or the Scorpion) one of the better guitars they've ever played. And for $500, it's a steal. It may not be American made, but very rarely are guitars with the same features that cheap. The only thing I'm going to replace is the bridge pickup with a Dimebucker. But after that, I don't really see much to improve.

Here is my experience with detuning:

Dropped D - works well for a heavy sound, and can make some heavy licks a bit easier to play.  Works well because you have a complete octave scale within two strings playing basically only two frets.  :-)

Half step down (E flat) - Metallica did this, and SRV used to play like this.  Songs in this tuning are a bit easier to sing (natural E is a difficult scale to sing in for some reason).  String tension is still ok with a standard scale length.

Dropped C - this is where you tune down a full step (D G C F A D), then drop the low D string down a full step (just like dropped D with a standard tuning).  I'm not a big fan of this, but many a metal band has tried this.  For me, the sound gets too muddy because there is no string tension, and you loose a lot of harmonic content.

7 String (low B) - This is my current favorite tuning, because everything is standard.  7 string guitars also have a little bit longer scale length, which means you can maintain string tension at alternate tunings without loosing sustain.  I posted a few song clips I did with my new 7 string here on F13 about a month ago.

I got my 7 string from the Carvin custom shop, and it's a spawn of Satan.  Gloss black, black chrome hardware, and no fret dots.  I'll take some pics of my gear tonight and post them here, if anyone is interested.

I'm interested  :) How much did it run anyways?

It was about $800 delivered, with case.
 (http://www.carvin.com/products/guitar.php?ItemNumber=DC747)
The Carvin custom shop does some really fantastic work, especially considering the cost.  About the only complaint I have with this guitar is the pickups.  I'm thinking of switching to an EMG setup (http://www.emginc.com/displayproducts.asp?section=Guitar&categoryid=6&catalogid=89), which I basically use on ALL my guitars.

Miguel - that was some good stuff, too. I haven't unchecked it in iTunes yet (bad songs get unchecked quickly, only 2100 songs on my work pc, though), it comes up on random now and again and I have to think "Who the heck is this, pretty good!...Oh, that guy!" If you want to show off your gear, please do! When my band was first getting out and about, we used to keep a current Carvin catalog in our van to drool over the PA systems and whatnot. Always been a solid company imo.

I think part of what I dislike about drop-d is that it's so easy to do basic metal stuff, so a TON of players use it. I don't like things the easy way, I guess, but at the same time, the running transposition of what fret on the "E" string I should be playing when in drop d gets annoying to me. So I use it for stuff I wrote years ago in drop d, but I don't write or play with it otherwise.

I was playing my cheesy guitar (real cheesy, an exgirlfriend's that she left me because she felt pity, a Cort strat knock-off) sickly downtuned, as I mentioned. I just tuned it back up last night, forget what the E was at, but it was waaaay down, I think it was A, the rest tuned to that in standard tuning. Jangly and wicked muddy. Sabbath also played in Eb (flat, heh), I think I'm tuned in standard tuning with the low string at D or Db right now.

Another problem I have with nonstandard tuning is that I can play in any key pretty easily in standard E tuning, and as I say about drop d, it's just annoying to constantly try transposing keys in my head, I'd rather just sit back and play ;) If I'm thinking about scales and signatures, I'm not playing well.
I have spent the last couple years rebulding my chops, and I've really spent a lot more time playing blues than anything else. My good friend is a blues connysewer, and he absolutely hates when people start shredding during a blues song. To be fair, he means inappropriately, and we discussed this because one standard guy at a local open mic is ALWAYS shredding at the wrong time, in the wrong song, with his teeth (I'd even slap Hendrix for that crap, heh). So I almost feel bad about having shred chops, heh. I'm putting them in more now that I have a lot better emotion, I've gotten my bends and phrasing up to snuff (acceptable, anyway), so they are fitting in here and there.

But shredding is definitely only one aspect to what I'm shooting for. I'd like to get a band where I can be polyinstrumental and polygenre, play some reggae, blues, metal, rock, jazz, country, just have fun and jam type thing. Shredding just takes a lot of physical practice, no getting around it, heh...

Here's another question: How many guitars, basses, and amps have you owned in your lifetime? Just wondering if you're like me. I'm 27 now, started playing around 12, and off the top of my head, I can think of something around 20 guitars (some pretty good), several basses, and at least 10 amps (some were crappy combos, but not all) that I have passed through my hands. All doomed to pawn shop hell  :evil: It seems like only recently that I've managed to hold on to my gear for more than a few years (don't get me started on effects pedals heh).

Oh hell, I don't know. What I do know is that I've never sold anything, it's always been ripped off. I'd estimate maybe a dozen guitars, I find one I like and stick with it. Nothing too fancy, I used to play BC Rich Biches when I was playing a lot of guitar in the band, when I was playing bass, I'd play my guitarist's (very nice) Ibanezes. Ibanezii? For the bass, I started on a Peavey which I had gutted and rebuilt, my sound guy and I redid all the electronics, it was hot as hell, huge body that held a shitton of stickers, super long maple neck. When that got stolen, I used a Rickenbacker for about a year, which was pretty limiting as far as upper fret access, so I bought the ESP custom (kind of a cross between an explorer and a bich) I have now, which has the best neck I've ever played, real long and thin, great action.

Effects, can't count those, either. I was a studio rat in addition to my band being a road dog, we played an average of three or four hours every day for years, not counting individual practice. Part of why I'm such a fan of great live bands. But as a studio rat, I collected a ton of gear, I liked the older effects over the newer digital combo effects units (though that's what I'm using now, because it's cheap and available: a Boss GT-6, decent pedal, but just a placeholder until I can get some decent amps). Stomp pedals, I'd say I've had at least 50 over the years (some traded, most stolen). My favorite stomp pedal is probably the proco rat distortion.

Amps, as a guitarist I was using a Laney full stack. The only thing besides my first guitar my parents bought me, as a high school graduation present (for graduating with honors). Thanks mom and dad, heh. Nice stack for metal stuff, which is where I was then. We had been cobbling old amps together before that, my singer was singing through my old guitar head (for rehearsal, natch). When I moved to bass, I took that guitar head, which was some crazy 60's brand Kustom Lounge or something, but had great raw power without distortion. Put it on a 2-15" Peavey cab loaded out with a couple full range 400W EV speakers. Wicked solid and punchy, I stuck with that cheesy combo through my whole professional bass career, much to the amusement of other bassists....until they heard the tone I pulled from it, then they came with lots of questions, heh. I was alll about the tone, who cares how you get it! After that was stolen, I picked up a cheesy Peavey bass amp (only like 150W, limp) but a couple nice cabs, an Ampeg 8x10" and a Dean Markley 1x15" loaded with my sweet EV 400W full-ranger. That's what I'm playing guitar through as well, these days.

The band also went through a couple PA systems. Got our first one from a retiring local band for a song, complete. We had no clue how to use it at the time, and an art school friend of mine was at a rehearsal and laughed at our setup. Turns out his dad's an electrician and he knows his stuff, so he rewired everything and updated a lot of the cheesy electronics and became our first sound guy (the one who helped customize my peavey bass). When we 'made it' (heh) we bought a sick sound system with 4 4x15"s as the main beef, upgraded our board and rack.

I have two different rigs I use depending on what kind of band I'm playing/practicing with at the time:

Rig #1 - Jazz Setup - I am playing a fretless 5 string Carvin with Tomastik Infield flat wound strings.  Gives that great "muwah" sound for jazz.  For amplification, I'm playing through a Sovtek Mig 100B 100W tube bass head, with a ported 4x10" cabinet.  Great gobs of low end, however it can get a bit growly if I turn it up too much.  I'd love to get a real upright double bass but I don't have two grand to throw around at this time.

Rig #2 - Rock Setup - Playing my new Ibanez 5 string (the Music Man copy, SRX505 (http://www.ibanez.com/guitars/guitar.asp?model=SRX505)) with dual humbuckers.  I am using a preamp/power amp setup:  preamp is a SansAmp RBI (http://www.sansamp.com/rbi.html) rack mount preamp, into a QSC 700 watt PLX power amp (http://www.qscaudio.com/products/amps/plx/plx.htm).  Takes up only 3 rack spaces in total, and weight less than 30 pounds total.  Cabinets vary depending on where I am playing:  I have a 2x12" cab I use, and sometimes I use the 4x10" cabinet from the jazz gigs.  I am currently assembling parts to make up one of Len Moskowitz's Compact Bottom Ends (http://www.core-sound.com/bottom-article.html) since I am selling my truck, my main avenue of mass gear transportation.  I don't have a ton of room to lug around huge cabinets anymore.

However I don't use any of this stuff for making recordings, with the exception of the Sanamp RBI.  For everything else I am using a Vamp Pro system from Behringer and recording everything direct using a cabinet simulator.

Right now, my primary guitars are an SG Special and an American Standard Strat. Everything is pretty much stock atm. I have a couple Tex Mex Teles and Strats, a Tex Mex Jazz Bass (no bass amp atm), and an old Ibanez as well (not sure what model...I just keep it around for the Floyd Rose). And of course, the Schecter is on it's way.

The only gig worthy amp is a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe (40 watts, but tube power!=solid state). When Fenders are plugged in, I'm jacked in through the guitar input. Just Fender tone. Rarely any effects. For the Gibson, I use a V-Amp, but jacked directly into the preamp input, which bypasses the Hot Rod's 12ax7 preamp (Digital modeling preamp with a 6L6 poweramp -- Sweet as hell).

Since I've purchased a Vox Valvetronix (http://www.voxamps.co.uk/products/valvetronix/vt_audition.htm), I use it more often though. It isn't nearly as loud as the Hot Rod, but the tone blows away any of the other digital modelers like Line 6 and Behringer. Compare them yourself. It kind of follows the same principle of what I do with combining the Vamp and the Hotrod's 6L6's (by using real tube saturation for the power stage), but with 12AX7's (at least for saturation. The output is still dependent on a solid state power stage). Not only that, but it models famous stomp boxes as well. The only better combo I could think of is if I purchased a Vox Tonelab (stompbox version of the Valvetronix) and ran it through the power amp of the Hot Rod (like I do with the V-Amp).

EDIT: Hmm...I was just reading that previous paragraph over, and on second glance, it seems a little confusing. My bad.

Anyways, point is: Combining power tube saturation with a digital modeling preamp has given me the best tone (and verstatility as well) for the least amount of cash.

Zakk plays a pretty bare bones rig.  His Les Pauls sport EMGs and that's about it.  He tunes 'em down, but you can get the same strings he uses at any big store.  His amplification is strictly 80s and was produced long before the downtuning trend began.  I think he does a  good job at showing that one doesn't need exotic equipment to produce "modern" sounds.

I've always had a thing for Line6 because they have dedicated themselves to 100% digital.  Their newest software is pretty damn good, IMO.

But if you want to combine digital with loud, run a line out from your Valvetronix, into the line in of your HRD, which will bypass the preamp section of your HRD.

So...Just got that Schecter today. The top string is creating a lot of fret buzz, but since baritones and 7 strings are kind of new to me, I'm not sure if I should try adjusting it myself or not. I don't want to fuck with the truss rod. At a glance, the neck looks OK, so I don't think that's it anyways.

Do you think a simple bridge adjustment may work, or should I just take it to a shop? Did any of you with baritones or 7-strings need additional setup after you got 'em?

Not on the topic of gear (cause my bass is a sucky one for fooling around on), but on the topic of guitars....

Does anyone know of a good place to find scales/drills for bass to build dexterity/speed?

I'm tired of seeing how fast I can play a 12 bar blues progression....

Where's it buzzing?  Nearer the headstock or the bridge?

http://www.activebass.com/lessons/lessdir.asp
http://www.cyberfretbass.com/

Both....Think I solved most of it though. I called Schecter up and they told me to just loosen the truss rod one turn. I might need to raise the bridge a tiny bit too, not sure. There's still a little buzz, but not as much before, especially when plugged in. Now it sounds like another one I played, so I guess I'm cool.

Next stop: New pickups  :-D

This guitar is frickin' sweet as it is though. And the next chance I get, I'm gonna have to buy a standard tuning C-Series Schecter as well.

Sky: In case you lose interest in the baritones, you should still try one of the normal Schecters. They're a fuckload better than any Gibson or Fender in the same price range. Hell, even better than some models that cost twice as much...and a Schecter is versatile enough to sound like both.

Sweet!  :)


(http://namm.harmony-central.com/WNAMM05/Content/Schecter/PR/Banshee-Marine-Metallic-sm.jpg)

This upcoming Schecter model has me drooling something fierce, but I really dig vintage-style guitars.

I love my schecter, it's a Blackjack C-1.

I mainly play metal, but this guitar has got some versatility.  The stock pickups have a quite nice sound to my eyes, clean or distortion.

I don't know a ton about guitars by any means, I just know what I like.  And I like this.  Probably better than anything else I've played thats priced around 500 bucks, although the ESP Viper 400 for me definitely was up there as well.


(http://www.schecterguitars.com/Dproducts/2004_models/bj_c1/bj_c1_blk_pop.jpg)

The C-1 is exactly like mine, except the EX is extended scale. Other than that, same good guitar.

To derail a bit:

I hate drummers.

At least I do right now. Lately, it seems like every one of them wants to be the next Neil Peart. I'm tired of that shit -- play a fucking song damnit! Everything I've tried to get going lately turns into session of watching the drummer getting his rocks off -- at the exclusion of everyone else (i.e. the song). With all due respect to Neil, fuck him. Fuck Keith Moon and fuck Dave Lombardo too. Give me Charlie Watts instead.

Better yet, I'll just use a sequencer.

edit: Heh...Sorry, bad night.

Oh, and don't correct me on Neil. I'm just ranting. I know full well what he's capable of, and that he himself has no problem with song structure. Hell, he's even the primary songwriter for his band. I just don't get the deal with some of the guys I've run into lately. I've accomplished nothing with any of them. Seems to me like they've been playing by themselves for far too long.

Shit, that's why I'm not in a band. I've sauntered through the musical community in my backwater town and found it sorely lacking. I did find one good drummer, but he's in a long term project that I thought sucked. Too bad, that cat was good on drums and could play guitar, too (which was cool because it let me get some time on the bass).

I like active, syncopated drummers. I don't like drummers who play stock beats, straight 4/4 rock beats, that stuff. That said, I assume a drummer can play to the song and stay in time, etc. If you can't even do that, you need a few more year's practice with people who need practice. I mean, I feel I need a ton of practice, but with higher level stuff, not just playing the song and keeping it in time.

The other side of it is personality. I like strong, confident players, but not egotistical ones. Unfortunately, it seems in this local arena, confidence and ego seem to go hand in hand. One kid I was going to approach for bass duties in my project totally blew it one night. Walked into an open mic night and I was jamming with the aforementioned wicked drummer, improving some tasty metal and shredding some leads (we were talking about doing a totally improvisational metal project. well more than talking, heh) and the bassist walked in. At first I was excited, I wanted him in on this project...and he just played some off the wall shit, out of tune and time, basically killed the jam we had going. When we stopped, he kept asking us if we wanted to play some Primus. After he asked like a dozen times (literally), in the interest of not being seen as the local jerk guitarist, I set the guitar down and hit the bar with the drummer, leaving the kid alone on stage. He then went to the mic and started asking the house if anyone wanted to play Primus. I hate folks who get so hung up on one artist like that, if I really like an artist, I intentionally try to NOT learn their music, to avoid getting stuck on them and not developing my own sound. I'd heard the kid (bassist) was a pita to work with, but then, so am I, heh. But apparently I'm a bit less so....unless you want to play Primus, I guess. There's also a tension, because I used to be the pre-eminent bassist in my podunk town before my band moved on to pursue a professional career, I think he always held that against me and was trying to show off. Of course, I was also the last of the traditional Geezer Butler/Cliff Burton type bassists, after our band most bands started with that slap bass crap. I can appreciate it, I think Les Claypool is nothing short of an amazing genius...just totally not my thing.

Funny thing is...I watched Some Kind of Monster last night, and seeing Cliff always inspires me. I got to the audition scene and was surprised at how many 'big name' bass players (jeordi white, danny lohner, eric avery, etc) just don't have much going on. They could barely play Seek&Destroy, a song that was so overplayed in our old scene that I actually boycotted it (and creeping death). Now.,..I was a guitarist back then, I don't actually know any metallica songs (well, a few like master of puppets, battery, and shortest straw) on bass. But I picked up the bass and wailed through the audition, I guess part of it is that Cliff was such an influence, got me into music theory, and the jammy Geezer, so I tend to jam through pieces more (leaving room for the singer and solos, natch, it's a balancing act). And I'm sure being in my living room cut down on the stress of jamming with metallica, heh. Anyway, point it, I've been working on my guitar chops for a few years now and I can still pick up the bass and destroy my guitar playing, like riding a bike (except for the massive blood blisters because I play so hard hehe).

/morning ramble where's my caffeine whew that was a ramblation sorry

Neil Peart is a great drummer. But like you both said, he plays to the song and adds his personality moments TO the song, instead of in spite of the song. Any asshead who wants to be in a band has to learn it isn't all about him and his instrument. Same with Les Claypool. Outstanding bass player, but if he tried to play the Primus type stuff in a Metallica joint, it would totally fuck the song up, because they wouldn't mesh. I don't play anymore, but I at least understand that colloborative projects like bands require compromise on all fronts, or you end up sounding like Yngwie Malmsteen.

What, is there something wrong with liking 'Rising Force'?

......

Nothing wrong with liking Malmsteen, I just think he's a great guitarist who can't write a good song to save his life. He's too caught up in scales and blistering solos to worry about melody, harmony and good hooks.

I agree actually, my elipses were more of a contemplation on the probably non-existant possibility of internet sarcasm...

Ygnwie was extremely talented, and put on a great live show, too.

But his albums were nothing more than musical masturbation, lacking soul entirely. I wonder if I can still play Black Star...

The Oysterhead album consisting of Claypool, Anastasio and Copeland is brilliance. Peart was the wrong example for the arrogant drummer. You should have used Carl Palmer. Brilliant, but prone to excesses that compromise the music.

I've got just about everything Les has put to disc :) Oysterhead does indeed rock, there are a couple tracks floating around the net, maybe from the official site or Les's site, leftovers from the studio sessions. Just a couple nice little ditties. Another great disc is the 2 cds (sold seperately) from a live show the Flying Frog Brigade did. First disc is mostly Les and Sausage tunes plus Shine On You Crazy Diamond. Second disc is the entirity of my favorite Pink Floyd album, Animals. I always wanted to play it live in its entirity, Les lived my vision. Pretty cool.

I'm glad someone else picked up on this!  I too watched this a few nights ago, and thought the exact same things!

Now I wonder a bit:  those additions happened about 35 miles from where I live, could I have done better than those douchebags?  Could I have gotten a 1 million dollar signing deal, and been granted a red name on F13? :)

Where is the talent today?  Where did all the bass gods go?

Well..the thought of what would I have done did occur to me (I was on the wrong coast at the time, anyway). So as they were jamming Seek & Destroy, I picked up my bass and ripped that out, sounding better than everyone but Trujillo (who definitely deserves the job, he totally rocks imo). Then I thought further as to what /I/ would have done, and that's pretty easy: play Anesthesia/Pulling Teeth! I've played that for so many years I have rewritten and extended some sections, it's familiar yet different than the original. And Lars jams through part of it, and I'd bet he doesn't get to sit and jam it out with a creative bass player too much, so it may have been fun for him. The song which follows it on the album was Whiplash, which I never really knew on bass. But I know the song backward and forward, we listened to so much metallica as kids, so I was able to wail out Whiplash, as well.

Then I saw the conference James, Lars, and Kirk had and one thing they were amazed by was Trujillo playing Whiplash with his fingers, and using his index finger as a pick for the sections that are physically impossible to play with traditional alternating fingerpicking, and how they hadn't seen anyone play it like that since Cliff...and I had just set my bass down after doing so. I felt pretty damned good after that, even though I've been focused on guitar. Or maybe because I've been focused on guitar.

Have you seen Bela Fleck and the Flecktones live? Victor Wooten is a GOD. As good as Pastorius ever was.

Which is why Metallica didn't hire Claypool when he tried out for them after Cliff Burton died.

Also, LOT'S of bands cover thier ears and say "na na na!" the second any drummer says he worships Neil Peart.

Hah! One good thing about having that baritone around: I'm flying on my other guitars now. If I was into shredding, this would be as good a practice technique as any.

Speed really isn't much of an issue for me, my first band started on thrash metal. I'm also trying to get in more time on the bass, which is great for finger strength. It's more finger articulation, I'm trying to force myself to re-learn theory. I really hated school and textbooks, so it's been tough going, I learn a couple little things and just start jamming. I can jam for hours on end if I stick to minor and mixolydians, I struggle with everything else. Great for metal, some rock, and blues, but I'd like to master at least major playing as well. Luckily, one thing that did stick from my (years) of theory was fretboard integration, I'm still pretty decent at playing something anywhere on the neck and rusty but still can transpose in realtime.

Got my transposition skills in the theater, oddly enough, playing in the house band for my high school production of Grease. It was so very cool to have a real band playing those rock-n-roll tunes, but our teacher (and my renfaire wench!) insisted on using drama club actors, not singers. So we had to transpose every song to a key the actor was comfortable with. 

I talked with my buddy who I mentioned plays baritones in his duo setup (he has three marketed setups: solo, duo with a drummer, and trio) and I think I might just stick with a standard tuning guitar for now, because I really need a nice guitar and I tend to drift across styles, so I'd be better off with the most versatile instrument, getting the baritone down the road somewhere. I'm extremely good at talking myself out of buying expensive things, I've needed a new guitar for years.

I just need a house of my own a lot more (for a studio I want to build).

This being the guitar thread, I'll barge in with a request for advice.  My beloved old acoustic guitar seems to be losing its bridge (looks like the pressure from the strings is slowly but surely prying it loose).  Is this something I can remedy myself with commonly available tools (like, say, wood glue), or should I bring it to the guitar hospital and show it to somebody who knows what they're doing?

Yeah, it's doable, but I wouldn't recommend it. Acoustics need a tech's hand moreso than electrics, and it usually won't cost much anyways. Also, they'll find other things to adjust in the process of fixing the bridge, and getting it sounding as good as it can in every aspect (usually for free).

I'll bring it to a reputable instrumentician then.   :-)  Thanks!

Stray, is your sig being dynamically generated?

Yeah, I'm using the Audioscrobbler plug-in that Big Gulp pointed out (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=2263.0) the other day. Pretty cool.

http://cyberjamarchive.com/mp3-uploads/bach-chaconne.mp3

Free music. Bach in Drop D  :-D

Damn, I don't know if I'm crying from the beauty of the song, or the fact that I'll never be this good  :cry:

That's weird; I don't see Stray's sig anymore.

Bruce

I took it off. Just for you  :-o

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Misc/Jaguar_HH.jpg)
Jaguar HH

Oh my.

This comes out at just the wrong time too. Just when I thought I had all the humbucking guitars I'd want, Fender comes out with this. I was actually planning on getting another Strat, or a Jazzmaster, but damn, I can't resist. My affinity for old "twangy" guitars is going to have to wait.

That's a nice looking guitar, good price on it, too. I like the electronics, some nice options for pickup control. I think I might be going with a standard maple neck strat for my next guitar, I've been playing rosewood (on El Cheapo...hey I have an idea for a new headstock graphic!) necks for a few years now. I kinda wish that guitar had an ebony neck (which is what I've specced for my humbucking guitar, a les paul as of now, but daaamn are they expensive) Back in the day I played maple necks (because I mostly played strats). But I'd like to tap the pickups like that, phase inversion ftw and whatnot.

I'm holding out for the baritone Jag ;) New guitar #3, ETA: 2112, heh. But I'm thinking #1 is the black american hardtail strat, maple neck (I'm no whammy man, I've always taken the bar off and twist the body use the string beyond the nut, or move the bridge itself, etc, I hurt guitars when I play :) Heck, I wear down the thickest picks I can find, too...)

That bach piece was cool, reminds me of being in school. I could never play that cleanly, I've always been more about passion. Well, not always, I used to think Jimmy Page was way too sloppy when I was a kid just starting out, heh. But after going to school to learn how to play classical, I wanted to play dirty. After going to recording school, I wanted to underproduce my sound. I was actually working through a paganini piece I found in a magazine, but I dropped it because really all I do is sit back and wail. I've always found it much better to listen to an hour or so of good classical music and then apply the theory, the structure, but not try to imitate the actual work. Thus my 'improv classical' stuff, which snakes into my blues in an odd way (I mostly do slow minor blues). Tough to pull off without sounding like a wanker showing off, I strive for that balance and it can be really sweet and different.

/ramble

Yeah, I prefer maple necks too. The strats and teles I have now are all maple. But I've always wanted a Fender with a 60's C-Shape neck. The ones with a 7.25 radius. To me, the Fender 60's models are perfect.

All 7.25 C Shaped necks are rosewood though (at least that I know of). The cheapest model with a neck like that is the 60's reissue Strat and the Jaguar HH above. Further up, the vintage Jags and the Jazzmaster. Further up from that, the "relic" and "NOS" models. And of course, further up from that, a real 60's model. All rosewood though. The only way I can get a 60's shape neck with maple is through the custom shop (and one day I'll get just that!...I just need more.....money).

Anyways, I don't prefer rosewood, but I don't hate it either. I just have to accept my options. For now, I was in the market for either the 60's reissue (Mex made guitar, but to me, those things feel better than many of their expensive American models), or I was going to throw down for a Jazzmaster (which I've ALWAYS wanted, but end up talking my self out of for one reason or another).

The Jags, on the other hand, have never been what I want out of a Fender. The short scale of a Gibson = one of the more un-Fender-like guitars they make. To top it off, these new ones have humbuckers and no tremolo bar. The thing that's appealing to me here is the looks!

I really should be talking myself out of this. Heh.

I dunno. I still want to get it, but I just know I'll regret it sooner or later. I already have a Gibson and an Ibanez (and that Schecter baritone as well). I really don't need another "hot" guitar. I barely play the ones I have.

Which brings me to another thing: I've been "experimenting" too much lately. Nothing wrong with that, of course, but it really isn't getting me anywhere. It's just for kicks....but it ends up costing me. I'm starting to realize that my best playing is always going to come through with single coils. That Fender "quack" sound. Same goes for what I prefer to listen to. While I love players like Angus, Townsend, B.B. King, Iommi, Page, and metal guitarists in general, I worship players like Jimi, Keith Richards, SRV, Dick Dale, and Tom Verlaine (and if you haven't heard Tom, go out and get the Television album Marquee Moon. He's subtle, and not necessarily "rockin'", but it's beautiful nonetheless).

Anywho...I didn't realize you were into Fenders as well. Cool deal, man. "Hardtail" or not  :-P


I'm kinda the same way, but I'm not exactly sure to what extent I'm using the minor scale. I know jack about theory. I wish I did. Someone told me once that I'm messing around in mixolydian...But I don't even know that means. As far as injecting bluesy stuff into "classical" type improv playing, I know that I'm bringing blues technique into that style (i.e. bends and the like), but really, it's not the blues either :-)

To make it even more confusing, if I'm playing classical sounding stuff, I came up with a weird tuning to play it in (I doubt I really "came up" with it actually. I'm sure it's listed somewhere, but I did find it intuitively on my own).  D-A-D-G-A#-D --- Basically, Keith Richards' or Open G slide tuning, except with the B string tuned to A#. With the way I tune it, one finger bar chords are in minor instead of major. Not bluesy like Open G at all, but it's still pretty interesting.

Overall, I kind of suck at "real" classical or blues. I've been playing for about 15 years now, and I've gotten pretty good at this "other thing" I'm doing though. It makes sense musically, that much I know, but I'm not sure how to identify scales and modes. There's some classical melody in my tunes, some blues and jazz technique, applied through the freakout aesthetics of Jazz horn players like Coltrane/Davis, with the "twangy" sounds of Dick Dale and Duane Eddy. Heh. That's all I know. I've tried learning theory from time to time, but without a teacher, it isn't easy.

Rhythm wise: Whatever works, I guess!  :wink: I usually prefer single note melodies in my rhythms rather than strumming chords though.

The Mixolydian mode is basically the major scale, with a flat 7th interval.  But it does matter what chord you play it over.  If you're playing over a C chord, you play C D E F G A Bb.  However, if you are playing over,say, a I IV V progression, you can't play those same notes and have it be "mixolydian" the whole time; you have to change with the chord changes(C D E F G A Bb/ F G A Bb C D Eb/G A B C D E F).

I'm no expert in the area of modes (in fact, I suspect someone will correct something I posted above).  But be aware, there is a TON of misinformation when it comes to modal teachings aimed at guitar players.  Most books will tell you that modal playing is a matter of the note you start and end on (Ionian = C D E F G A B C, Dorian = D E F G A B C D, Phrygian = E F G A B C D E, etc), but this is flat out WRONG.  What really matters is what chord you are playing a certain scale over.  That is what gives you the modal sound.

Modes are merely an expression of scalar intervals. Ionian = Major, for instance. That's why mixolydian is 'basically' the major scale, with a slightly different interval. I remember my theory book having the modes written out on the inside cover (by me, I was in a Leonardo DV phase), and it was like:

Mode name: 1-1-1/2-1-1-1/2-1
Mode name: 1-1/2-1-1-1/2-1-1
etc

(and this is a little spotty, because I last took theory in college over ten years ago, heh...I can look up the true answer if you'd like with each mode and it's intervals, I still have my old theory book at home somewhere)

Right now I'm just using a mode of convinience, the B mixolydian over the E minor. It has all the notes of the E minor scale, played on a B tonal center. It's my 'stock' metal riffing material, the stuff I was using for my improv metal nights at an open mic club last summer. I'm pretty tired of it's restrictions, though. But I'm insane inside those scales, total fretboard mastery, so I tend to fall back on 'em for freedom of playing. Kinda ironic, limiting yet freedom as far as playing in any position within those limits.
I don't have any preference, I try not to, intentionally. I like all kinds of stuff, from palm-muted stuff, single and chords, to strummy acoustic stuff. I try to always keep it interesting, with walking bass lines, passing tones, little independant melodies, chord inversions, etc. That's really where I am right now, chops coming back and moving on to more advanced stuff and trying to get the theory down once again.

Thanks for the explanations. Except...err...I still don't get it.

Could either of you two recommend a book on scales and modes? Preferably, one that assumes no prior knowledge or experience with music notation and theory. Something geared more towards guitars and fretboard patterns, and has lots of pretty little pictures.

Everything I've learned up to this point has been by ear or imitation (and by "imitation" I don't mean cover songs or whatnot. I just mean by learning patterns and techniques by listening to other guitarists). I think I've got a pretty good intuitive sense on what kinds of notes I should mashing together, but it's not uncommon for me to hit those "sour" notes when I'm trying to improvise. Sometimes those sour notes turn out to be not so bad at all, and simply take me into a new direction. Most of time though, they just fuck up a song. I'd like to get to the point where I know exactly what I'm doing. Where accidents (at least the bad kind) never happen.

I'm working with this book (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0825821711/qid=1111785826/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-5409200-1240800?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) right now. It's a series and I'll probably check out the others, it's fairly well done. It has almost no prose in it, but a gajillion scales in tab. I also got a little gig bag book of chords which is nowhere near as extensive as I want, as I said, I'll probably get the guitar grimoire version. I like to work on scales and chord progressions concurrently, and build chords straight from scale tones, but at some point I need to work more on standard chording, too.

It's been a pain, since I'm really just getting back into theory, but it's fun when things fall back into place, and I'm glad I'm doing it, because it's a lot more satisfying knowing the individual notes in each chord, because then it's so much easier to build things up from there.

I can totally empathize with hitting sour notes during improv, it's to be expected from anyone but a true master. But that's why I'd been sticking to the safety net of my minor scales, which I can improv anywhere with almost zero sour notes. Like I said, it makes me feel like a newbler when I play anything else, heh. But there's a funny sense of dedication that brings out in me...because I can play a blistering full neck minor run and then struggle with some basic patterns or scales I'm not used to, makes me want to get as good at those as I am with the minor stuff. I'm intentionally revisiting a lot of problem areas from when I first learned to play, I skipped alot because it wasn't relevant to the music I was playing at the time, which let me get good a lot faster than if I had done things 'properly'.

And don't knock the ...For Dummies series, it's been damn good on just about any topic I can think of, guitar is no exception. I'm actually using it, as well. Mostly as a springboard, but also as a nice review of some basic techniques across a variety of styles. Your local library probably has it or can get it for you, the copy I am using is from work (the library).

Thinking about it...I think I can trace this whole renewed interest in major scales and whotnat to a single lick, I was listening to some minor blues and they kept using a cool major passing tone. Rather than just cop that one lick, I wanted to learn how to mix and match scales like that on my own, so I'm not so stratified. And of course, at speed in real-time, because I'm hell-bent on becoming an improv player (first time around the focus was on writing and structure).

Thanks. I've seen those Grimoire books around for years. They've always seemed a bit daunting to me, but maybe I should just dive in. After all, it's a better way to devote my time than with a lot of other things.


Slightly off topic:

You want to hear something sad? Jimi Hendrix only played for 11 years of his life.

What gives? I could devote all my time to music education for the rest of my life, and at the ripe age of 70, I'd probably say to myself: "You've gotten pretty good over the years, haven't you? But you know what? Compared to Jimi, you still suck!" Heh.

Here's how I think of modes:

Modes are just ways of playing scales with different intervals inbetween certain notes.  You can memorize the patterns on a fret board then you can play any mode in any key, by selecting a different starting note.

If you write the notes of a scale, you can see the starting notes for each of the seven modes, in a particular key.  Let's do the Key of C:

C - Ionian
D - Dorian
E - Phyrgian
F - Lydian
G - Mixolydian
A - Aeolian
B - Locrian

All seven of these modes are based on the key of C, thus contain the same notes as the C scale.

If we use the example above (from Sky) of the E minor scale, we have the following:

E - Ionian
F# - Dorian
G - Phrygian
A - Lydian
B - Mixolydian
C# - Aeolian
D# - Locrian

Hence we can see that for the Mixolydian mode, we are actually playing notes from the E minor scale (as was pointed out by Sky above).  Since a lot of metal is based around the E power chord, you will see a lot of riffing around the minor modes, which are B Mixolydian and G Phrygian (the two most common).

The modes follow a set number of intervals from the root note of the key (or tonic note).  They all follow the same pattern:

Ionian - based on major scale
Dorian - based on major scale one whole step below tonic
Phrygian - based on major scale two whole tones below tonic (major third)
Lydian - based on major scale 5 half steps below tonic (major 4th)
Mixolydian - based on major scale a perfect 5th below tonic (6 semi tones)
Aeolian - based on major scale one whole step above tonic
Locrian - based on major scale one third above tonic

So if someone says "play an C Mixolydian scale", you count a perfect 5th below that note, which would be F (so this would be based on notes in the F major scale).  So a solo based on the C Mixolydian scale would be appropriate for certain songs in the K of F (provided the scale fit the intended mood of the piece).

We don't tend to think of modes since as guitarists we play chromatic instruments.  This means we can play every semi-tome (or half step) starting from the low E up to the high E two octaves up.  Older instruments, like dulcimers, were tuned to major scales, so you really had to think about modes when the key of the song was changed!

Hmm...There's a recent thread goin' on at Harmony Central about this actually. I'm finding some of it interesting (even though I don't quite understand it all).

"Do you think modally or in terms of superimposing a scale?" (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=ea91e39c0088c259adbca2498101c630&threadid=891092)


Some of the thread is too technical for me, but it seems like many guitarists think in terms of modes.


Also, this guy derailed a bit, but I thought he made a cool point:


As obvious as it is, I've never given much thought on the similarities between spoken language and music. I mean, how much does one have to understand about their language in order to convey a powerful message?

Really, not much at all.

I think the examples are endless, so I'm not going to bother listing any here. I will say, however, that a George Carlin can stir up a crowd long before a William F. Buckley could even make an impression. Doesn't the same apply to music to an extent? Or any art for that matter?

Anyways, it's slightly off point and all that, but it's interesting to me. I'm still going to devote more time to learning more, but I think "reaching one's potential" with music is an entirely different thing.

I mentioned Tom Verlaine earlier, so I thought I'd post this. Bootleg quality, but still...

His quirky singing style may not be for everyone, but IMO, this is some of the best guitar playing ever put to tape: Little Johnny Jewel (http://home.satx.rr.com/dasnake/music/Little_Johnny_Jewel.mp3) (27 MB)

The second solo, 7 and 1/2 minutes in, kicks my ass every time.

Kind of a shame what happened to punk after the 70's. It pretty much became synonymous with lack of skill on one's instrument, and vanity, when in the beginning it was just about putting the balls back into Rock.

Try this exercise I got from a Joe Satriani article and it should help you get it.  It will show you that a mode is a certain sound and not just a series of notes with a certain beginning or ending, as many other sources suggest.

Use your low E string as an open drone.  Strike it and then play the E Major scale (starting on on the 7th fret of the A string is probably the easiest position); that's your E Ionian.

Next, strike the drone again, and while it is ringing, play the D major scale over it.  This is D Dorian, and it has a b3 and b7 (compared to the E Ionian).

Then play the drone and a C Major over it.  This is C Phrygian.  The Phrygian mode has a b2, b3, b6 and b7.  Remember that E Ioninan is E F# G# A B C# D# E and C Major is C D E F G A B C, so if you flat the 2, 3, 6 and 7 in E Ionian, you get the C Major scale (this same idea applies to all the modes).

I'm not going to take you through all the modes, but you should get the idea and hear the sounds.  A good thing to help you is memorizing the circle of fifths.  If you know that the Lydian mode has 1 sharp (the 4th) and you are playing over E, you can just add 1 sharp to the "key signature", to go from E to B. 

E F# G# A B C# D#

to

B C# D# E F# G# A# B

The progression of sharps and flats is always the same in the circle of fifths.  So if flatting some notes leaves you with 2 sharps, you know the mode you end up with will be a D and it will have the notes D E F# G A B C# D, no matter what mode it is.  The circle of fifths makes it easy to do "musical arithmetic" by just adding sharps or flats to the key signature.

What's interesting is reading guitar boards and seeing all the different ways people use to think these things out and the little mental devices they use to make them work.

Since I come at it from the circle of fifths angle, when I think Mixolydian, I think "1 flat".  Since C major has no sharps or flats, adding one flat to it gives me the key signature of F Major.  If I was to play D Mixolydian, I'd add one flat (aka, subtract a sharp) and end up with 1 sharp in the "key signature", which means G Major.

Yes, I find this interesting as well.

For me, it made more sense to think of modes as positional entities.  Like in thinking of how I changed frets within a scale in order to play a different mode.

If you look online, you'll find fret board charts for each mode (http://www.theguitarsuite.com/modepositions.html) that will show you the pattern that each mode follows.  So I know for example that if I want to play C Mixolydian scale, you just select the starting position and follow the pattern.  Also notice that the circle of fifths follows a sepcific pattern on a fretboard too!

I try to stay away from fretboard patterns and think in terms of notes.

If I put together some quick MP3 clips of the various modes played over a basic root chord (like an E power chord used in rock or metal), would anyone be interested in hearing them here on F13?

Heh. You might want to pm one of the admins. I'm not sure if they even look at this thread.

Oh, and btw, if possible, can you give me a brief idea of what the guitarist is doing in that song I posted above (Little Johnny Jewel)? I'm just curious. He was originally a classically trained pianist, then moved to free jazz on saxophones. According to him, he didn't even care about guitars until he was older (he called them "twee" -- whatever that means) -- but I'll be damned if I could find a better guitar player that I could name as my personal favorite (he completely restored my faith in lead playing, at a time when I considered guitars to be a bit "twee" myself).

Miguel, we really should start posting some little snippets, that would be cool. For me personally, I'd like to record something polished for once, I usually just throw down some ideas for future exploration and never revisit them. I was listening through my clips a while back when I put in a new hd, sometimes the same idea will crop up several months later in some odd morphed form, I'm actually building a song out of three of those clips. My obstacle is that I grew up (literally, from age 14) as half of a songwriting duo. Get some ideas cooked up, throw it on tape, then bounce it off my singer and we work to arrange and fill out the ideas and put lyrics to it. It's crushing trying to do it alone, imo.

Wish I wasn't saving for a house, a new guitar and a Digi002 would go a long ways in helping me record more easily... :)

(downloading that song now)

My PC has been apart for the past few weeks so I haven't had access to any of my recording gear.  I've been converting it with a new power supply, fans, vid card coolers, etc in order to silence it.  It was getting distracting trying to record songs in the same room as a PC that sounded like a 12 HP leafblower on gardening day.

My mic pre is on loan ATM, but if you all don't mind listening to direct recordings of guitar I should be able to throw a sample clip together by this weekend.  I'll host in on my own website and link it here.

You might want to look into getting a ProTools MIX system. Hell of a lot better and slightly cheaper than Digi002's, M-Audio, and the like. The only reason they're cheap is that Digidesign moved on to HD for their Pro systems. But they'll still do everything an 002 can do (and more). You might even getting lucky and end up paying half than you would for something new.

On the subject of guitars, I ended up getting ordering one of these over the weekend:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Misc/jazzmaster.jpg)

Really cheap too ($300). Mine's white. I was going to settle on a Am. Vintage reissue, but I found this used Made in Japan model (usually these still run $600 or so, but I don't think the dealer knew wtf he was doing). I ended saving about a grand. All I have to do now is upgrade the pups ($100 for a pair) and I'll be happy with it. Hopefully this will subside the G.A.S.

Did you find a method to Verlaine's madness btw? I read that he used the Bop Scale a lot (from his Sax experience), but I'm not sure to what extent and whatnot.

PM Shockeye and Schild. I have no problem with it, but Shockeye's the one who'd have to put them up.

No need to PM Me, I'm all good with it.

But the control surfaces = $$$. The reason I'm thinking the 002 is the motorized control surface that is included. Otherwise, I'd just go with an m-box and do stereo recordings.

To the admins:
Reading comprehension is HARD ;)

I wub u 2.
That was a great piece, their live album is up on my fye wishlist now :) My ears are out of shape, I couldn't tell you what he was playing over the top. If he's anything like me, though, he's not sticking to any particular thing, but just using whatever occurs to him as he's jamming. I'd like to get to the point where I can play 100% by ear, it's insanely difficult for me for some reason, but I do practice just closing my eyes and humming melodies, then play them on guitar. Good for the ear and the technique (but I'm pretty crappy at it, heh).

Got out to the local Fender dealer (I've known the manager for years). The only maple neck strat they had was the 50th Ann. gold-tone model, with the U neck. I've always played C necks, so it was like playing a baseball bat. Felt odd. Then when I got home, I noticed I arch my hand a lot, and there is room for a U neck in there, so I'm thinking I might spend some more time playing that one next week when I go up there. Downside is the garbage truss rod system, it's like the vintage models, you have to take the neck off to adjust the truss, but he showed me a cool trick - put a capo at the base of the neck and leave the strings on. Still, a pita. A nice bonus - he said they could get in any Fenders I was interested in (slowly, a few at a time) so I could try them out, no obligations.

Gave me some crazy gore-tex strings, they are supposed to keep that 'new string' feel forever. They are super slick, nice in a way, but I actually prefer playing on dead strings, I think. I like the rough texture and extra grippiness for bending. Totally weird.

My guess is you're talking about the Blow Up, which is where that version of Little Johnny Jewel is from.

Anyways, yeah, great album, but fair warning: He's struggles a lot with vocals live. LJJ is one of the exceptions, for some reason. They're all great songs though....But most of them make better sense after listening to Marquee Moon imho. Marquee Moon = Best dual guitar album ever  :-D

Also, I have every "unreleased" live performance if you're ever interested.


Yeah, I'm the same way. But like I said earlier, I tend to hit those sour notes often. Trying to educate myself lately though. I ordered that book you suggested as well.
 

C Neck guy here too. The old 60's "chunky C" though....Which would be mean Vintage models or reissues. I don't like the truss rod adjustment on those either, but I figure it's a tradeoff. That Jazzmaster I just got is the same way as well.

As for the arch in your hand, have you ever tried V Necks? Sounds like that may work, without it being too big.


I strung up some Elixers on a couple guitars recently, which are similar. I'll keep 'em on the acoustic and the baritone (which needs as much brightness to it that it can get), but I already took them off the other electrics. Pure Nickel all the way. Only problem is that I have to order them all the time, as the stores around here never carry them.

You better smiley that shit! Priest, Allmans, Maiden, Mercyful Fate, Skynyrd, etc etc ad nauseum :)

Heh, the smiley was just another way of saying "imho".  :wink:

It's much different from what those other bands are doing though (by virtue of Verlaine...Lloyd is the more rock oriented guy), that it's probably not even wise for me to make a comparison. There's also a subtle difference in how the guitars accompany each other -- instead of dualing and trading off each other with leads, Lloyd and Verlaine dual and layer over each other more in the rhythms. Like violin players would, for example, and not like guitar duos (or trios etc.) usually do. Plus, they play mostly in clean settings, which sets it apart somewhat.

Ok, then. I'll pull out the big gun (http://shop.fye.com/product.aspx?sku=60108226&loc=50244).

Best guitar album EVER. Period. You must own this. If you do not, you know what to do.

I don't have that one, but those three are some of my favorites. McLaughlin in particular. I'll take note.  :-)

As for Marquee Moon, it's not anywhere near that territory. The only one who plays like that is Lloyd, and his acrobatics are kept to a minimum (he does let loose on the Matthew Sweet albums though). It's not a virtuoso guitar album by any means. It's romantic through and through.

I always liked the ending of that movie Crossroads (not the Britney Spears version!), because it makes that distinction between the two types of musicians. I don't really think Ry Cooder could own Steve Vai like the movie portrays though. I think they're equal -- just completely different, and can't be measured against each other.

Hell, I like Crossroads for a bevy of reasons, as a blues fan/musician. Robert Johnson is the father of modern rock music, imo, since everyone from Clapton to Pagey (hell, half the early Zep tunes were Johnson's) to the friggin' Blues Brothers movie (Sweet Home Chicago). Ry Cooder doing the music was just sweet, way underrated player. Having Vai during his (arguable) peak was great, too.

But it's even more personal for me now, because I feel it represents my own internal struggle of the classically trained shredder (such as my skills are now) against the feel player I'm growing into. I'd rather master a single bend than an arpeggio these days, and holding back the shred so it doesn't taint the music is damned hard (as in I can't seem to yet, heh).

Then again, I listen to a guy like Johnny Winter, who can shred tastefully through an entire SET, let alone a single solo. Put in some ear time with a couple of his live mid-70s albums, I love the guy. If I can't downplay my tendency to shred, I hope to channel it into this style. He uses a lot of lick-based stuff, too, which makes it easier and fun (less to remember :)).

And I do think Cooder could pwn Vai, because Vai lacks a certain soul (imo). That's what gives Cooder (who has great chops) the edge, Vai has great technique, and even great melodicity, but not very good feel. When I was a young woodchuck in shredding school, I always thought Jimmy Page was /sloppy/. Took me years before I came to appreciate the rough edges and despise overly clean studio work (which then led to many heated debates as I was in recording school at the height of ultra clean recordings...). Partly why I prefer live albums today.

Some more details on modes and scales.

I discussed this topic (modes and scales, and how we decide which one to use in any given situation) with my bandmates and several interesting things came out.

First, a common practice for guitar players to learn modes is to memorize the fretboard patterns that are associated with each mode.  For example, check out this link:

Fret patterns for all seven modes (http://www.theguitarsuite.com/modepositions.html)

So if you know the root of the mode you wish to play (for example, C Dorian), then you align the root of the pattern with that root note (in this case, C), then you follow that pattern and out comes the scale!

The reason this method works well for guitar players is that it goes very well with matching a mode with any given key on the fly.  If I know I am playing a C7 chord, and I want to solo using a Mixolydian scale, then I know I want to play in the G Mixolydian mode.  I align the pattern to the root (in this case G), and away I go.

The problem with this method is that you need to learn at seven fretboard patterns!  And of course this does not even completely cover all the minor variations that one can play in a given situation.

However there's another way to think about it.  As I said before, all modes are based on major scales.  All scales are relatable by the circle of fifths, by adding sharps and flats to any major scale you can get to any mode.

Hence if you learn the pattern for the Ionian (or major) mode/scale, you automatically know the pattern to every mode possible!  All that is required is to know the major scale any given mode is based on, then you play that scale starting on a different note and you have the exact same modes as the patterns above dictate.  However in this case, I only need to memorize two patterns (one for starting on the low E string, and another for starting on the A string).  However these two patterns are based on the common Ionian scale (look at the first pattern on the link above to play the major scale).

Using this second method is much easier from a memorization point of view, however we now have to think about what major scale each mode in any given key is based on.  We can do this fairly easily by remembering how many steps in the major scale we need to move down from the root of the chord we are playing.

Let's set up a hypothetical situation where we want to solo over a plain E power chord.  Our song is in E minor, so we get the following notes for the scale (this is the E natural minor scale, which is a major scale with flat 3rd, 6th, and 7th notes):

E natural minor scale:

E - Root
D - Flatted seventh
C - Flatted sixth
B - Fifth
A - Forth
G - Minor Third
F# - Second
E - Root

We know for a fact that all of these notes are 'good' notes for soloing, which means we can solo using the E natural minor scale.

However there are seven modes which we could theoretically play over this chord and would 'work out' (in the sense that the notes may be legal, but the scale may not fit the intended mood of the piece).

E - Ionian
E - Dorian
E - Phrygian
E - Lydian
E - Mixolydian
E - Aeolian
E - Locrian

Some of these modes we can throw out right away.  Since our song is in E minor, we should stick to the 'minor' modes, and not play any of the 'major' modes (since that major third would be dissonent with the minor third the song is based on.  Also, the flatted seveth would not match!).  The major modes would also be too 'happy' to go along with a song in a minor key.

If you look at this link (http://www.mandolincafe.com/niles2.html), you'll see that we have four modes that are based on minor scale progressions:  Dorian, Phrygian, Locrian, and Aeolian.  So these we already know are going to be good choices for soloing in the key of E minor.

So based on the information above, I know I have four potential modes I can choose from, and I know that they have to be based on major scales.  I know the Ionian scale pattern by heart so I'm now ready to play my solo!  All I need to figure out now is what scale each mode is based on!

From my previous post, you'll see that the different modes can be related to major scale using the following pattern:

Ionian - based on major scale
Dorian - based on major scale one whole step below tonic
Phrygian - based on major scale two whole tones below tonic
Lydian - based on major scale 5 half steps below tonic
Mixolydian - based on major scale a perfect 5th above tonic
Aeolian - based on major scale one whole step above tonic
Locrian - based on major scale one third above tonic

If I super-impose these two patterns, here's what I get:

E natural minor scale:

E - Root - Ionian
D - Flatted seventh - Dorian
C - Flatted sixth - Phygian
B - Fifth - Lydian
A - Forth - Mixolydian
G - Minor Third - Aeolian
F# - Second - Locrian

So now I'm really close to the answer!  Let me throw away the 'major' modes, and I'm left with the following:

D - Flatted seventh - Dorian
C - Flatted sixth - Phygian
G - Minor Third - Aeolian
F# - Second - Locrian

So we have:

I want to solo in E Dorian, I play a D major scale starting on E.
I want to solo in E Phyrgian, I play a C major scale starting on E.
I want to solo in E Aeolian, I play a G major scale starting on E.
I want to solo in E Locrian, I play a F# (or Gb) major scale starting on E.

I now have the all the scales I need in order to solo in this key.

I am going to do my backing tracks and make some MP3 clips of all these scales in the comnig week and post in this thread so you can hear what I am talking about.

Stay tuned!

The note you start on doesn't matter; that's just a bit of misinformation that has creeped into guitar lore.  Just play the right major scale and you will be playing the right mode.

Did you guys teach yourselves? God, I've tried off and on since the time I started strumming, and just can't get a grasp on it. Patterns (and a good ear) are so much easier, and it's never been a roadblock for me.

I wouldn't mind learning more, but would I be better off getting an instructor?

Edit:

Also, would you guys indulge me a little and talk about gear and songwriting (as opposed to shredding) every once in a while?  I feel so left out with all this talk about scales and modes.   :-P

Don't feel too bad. I don't have that level of theory any more. It was a nice refresher for me, too. As I've said, I'm much more of a feel player now. An instructor is always a good idea, no matter your level of playing. Randy Rhoades took classes in every city he played, iirc. I've been keeping my ear to the ground to find a decent instructor here that's not a long drive, but I mostly just self-teach. I had theory in high school and college, but that was 15 years ago and I had set the guitar down for 10 of those years.

But I can't say much about gear, because I'm not a gear guy. When I was at the Fender shop the other day my buddy was laughing at me, he's way into gear (well, he does work at the fender shop!). For me, it's all about playing and making whatever you play through sound good, because when I was learning, all we had were crap amps. So I had to make those amps sound better, and that's where technique comes in (to a certain extent, some amps just sound bad).
Right. That's why I can so easily play a B Mixolydian because it's the E minor scale started on a B. There are several ways to approach modes, as evidenced by this thread, heh. None are "wrong". Besides, all this talk of everything being based on major scale is funny to me, because I'm terrrible at playing major scale leads :) That's why my personal way of looking at modes is simply intervals. Because that's what modes are to me, an expression of intervals across an octave.

I like to focus on intervals partly because that's how I was taught in school. We'd be given a key signature and told to transcribe music by ear, and intervallic listening is essential. We spent a lot of time on training the ear to hear different intervals, and even with as much as I've forgotten and/or atrophied over the years, it's still the core of my playing. Whenever I'm successful playing what I hear in my head, it's because I'm almost 'transcribing' it, and intervals are how I transcribe (or used to, heh). I guess learning all the scales would be a huge boon, but I'm not all that disciplined these days :) So I learn little sections off intervals and then transpose it around the neck, after a while I have a decent mental map for that "sound", like a spanish sound, f'rinstance. I don't worry about the scales so much as playing the right intervals to make the "sound" or "flavor". Hard to explain, I guess.

Songwriting...that makes me cry. Miss my old songwriting partner, but I have been penning a few more tunes lately. Started one last night called Backstabbin' Blues, going to use it to write a more elaborate fingerpicking song than I've done in a while, I think. Songwriting is tough as hell, or easy as pie. My band's best songs were alternately written in the time it takes to play it, or broken down and restructured over the course of months to make an epic. Sometimes we'd have a concept we'd write to, sometimes we'd have a riff we'd have to make a concept for. Sometimes I'd be futzing with effects and stumble across something, because I always tried to write parts that fit effects when I was in futzing mode.

Hell, let's talk about pentatonics, I play them too much anyway! :) That's what has actually spurred my reinterest in learning some scales, the multitude of variations on the pentatonic scales I play leave holes when I try to do more styles of blues, and I used to suck at 7th chords. It's funny because they are so easy...and I remember them by an interval, actually (by remembering to play one interval down from the higher octave root, one or two steps depending on chord quality)! :)

Vai played everything, except for the slide parts, which Ry did.

Vai actually wrote and performed Eugene's Trick Bag in that movie, then he was pretending to be unable to play his own piece, so he's actually defeating himself.

Most people don't know about Vai's love of classical guitar, or his ability to do it so ridiculously well, as he had been practicing it since his time at the Berklee College Of Music in Boston.

/edit

http://epicrecords.com/g3/quicktime/

Vai on a tripleneck.

Actually, it came on yesterday, and I started suspecting that very thing.

He really should play a Tele more (or something besides an Ibanez). I'd probably buy one of his albums if he did.

Oh yeah .. Vai took on Satriani's use of Ibanez. Hmm.

I love Vai, I really do. Great guy, family man, absolute master of what he does, etc. But I understand what is said when his music does not have 'feel'. I don't feel any aesthetic behind most of his pieces, but understand when listening to them that they are being constructed in a way that makes them amazing on a technical level. Problem is, I don't really like the way most of his music sounds, because he so rarely creates .. yeah, a .. I dunno, feel.

But he does have the technical amazingosity, which is why I love his live performances, and have the G3 DVD. His music, to me, is entertaining to watch. In fact, I was live at that concert in the clip I posted, just to watch that kind of stuff.

Occasionally, he manages to emulate the feel that his sensei Satriani has (Always With Me, A Train Of Angels, etc), and makes songs like Juice, which have wider appeal.

Don't forget his early gig as a transcriber for Frank Zappa. That's great ear and theory practice alone.

I'm not a fan of Vai, though I do hold him in great respect. To me, Vai is the guitar Yanni/Tesh.

In guitar news, I'm going to be getting an acoustic, I've decided. Relatively cheap, don't want to spend more than $500, if anyone has recommendations (or cautions/warnings). I like/enjoy using two words/concepts like this! :) Sorry.

I also grabbed a few books for some inspiration since I've done so much electric lead playing lately. I listen to a lot of old blues masters, but I've put in more time than usual with Robert Johnson the past couple weeks and I'm itching to work on my acoustic fingerstyle, which I used to be pretty good at (albeit classical style, not blues). Hoping to also locate my grandfather's banjo and apply some things to that, too.

I'll keep my recommendations to Fenders:

Standard Tele or Strat. Mex made has become a good value in the past few years methinks. Even better, find a used 50's/60's reissue model (the MIM ones) -- fucking great guitars, and just as good as Am. Standards, but with vintage hardware (new, around $500-600...used, $300-$400 range). The 60's neck is sweetness.

EDIT: At least get that guy to order one so you can play it for yourself. Then decide.

If you don't happen to like those, the Jimmy Vaughn is a great value (similar to the 60's model, but with a modern radius and Tex-Mex pickups. He was even nice enough to put the "Jimmy Vaughn" signature at the back of the headstock, instead of the front).

The Deluxe Players Strat is in the same price range, and has some cool features as well. 12" radius, ala Gibson/SRV, Noiseless pickups, 7 way switching

If those don't entice you (I highly recommend that 60's reissue...I can't express that enough), I'm looking to sell a 2002 Gibson SG Special for $450 (paid around $700). No case, barely a scratch, and the only mods are (better) Schaller tuners.

I'll post pics soon...

Just watched the G3 stuff linked.

Vai. Meh. Could barely sit through the entire thing. I would sum it up as simply showing off without much thought toward making good music. This guy needs to learn songwriting and structure from more than a technical perspective. Good chops delivered in a boring and bland fashion.

Satriani. I put it there with Vai's piece, but with a band. He fit the music better and made a song out of it, but it wasn't a very good song, not memorable in the least. Good chops delivered in an unflattering medium.

Malmsteen. I'd never thought I'd say Malmsteen is the strongest songwriter of the bunch. It helps he's playing one of my favorite tunes (of his). But note how he integrates his shredding with the band, strong melodic lines and structure. Good chops delivered in a kick ass format with a shredding band. Everyone has huge chops and is using them to play to the song and unify the melodic movements. Song has hooks without rock cliche.

To sum up, I need to go get me some old Rising Force stuff. Hell, I was trying to remember how to play Black Star a while back...Yngwie is the man, he just don't like donuts (no-prize to whoever gets the reference!!).
Acoustics, man, acoustics! :) Martin, Rodriguez, etc. Not sure whether to go steel strings for blues/rock or gut strings for flamenco/classical...seperate pickups, I'm thinking, though, rather than acoustic/electric combo.

Those "3" could have benefited from a "fourth" imo. Like I mentioned before, I'm not a big fan of the shredder type of guitarists, but Eric Johnson kind of stands out to me. He's also one of the only ones that uses better (vintage) gear....Another plus for him in my book. If he happens to not play "soulful" all the time, his guitar will make up for some of it at least.

Oops, didn't realize that you only wanted recommendations on "Acoustics"....At least that's what it sounds like on a second reading (?). Sorry for my rant on the Electrics.

Anyways, I've always been happy with Takamine. Then again, what do I know? I've never had anything but sub-$500 acoustics.

I know that Martin offers some guitars in the sub $500 range now (USA made too). I've only messed with some of those in store, but they sound and look great. If I wasn't already happy with my own acoustic, I'd probably get one.

I'll just post pics of the Gibson anyways, just in case you're interested. My camera is broken, so I had to take pics with DV. I'll find something else later if you want.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/sgsc_wc.gif)
Gibson's pic

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/sg_body.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/sg_inlays.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/sg_headstock.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/sg_serial.jpg)

The only difference between mine and the one at the top is that I have better tuners and moon inlays.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/sg_scratch.jpg)
Couple scratches too.

EDIT: Actually, $450 is probably a little too much. $400 (that's with shipping price) sounds better.

Nice SG, those inlays are a nice touch. Wish I were in the market for an electric! Got the $500 in my pocket right now, goign to hit up the local El Cheapo shops and see if I can find something with decent sound and construction (the acoustic I referred to), I'm going to attempt to ignore branding and whatnot.

Nice way to slip in a pic of that Jag, heh. And the Apple/Jesus Hawk board, heh. My favorite board back in the day was a funky Christian Hosoi design (shark or mako or something). I did tigerstriped grip tape over the top of it, bought it in Long Beach, CA in summer '86, iirc. I'm so not a skater anymore, heh. Fall and bust my ass kind of skater, maybe.

Good luck on that SG, though, damned fine guitar! I'd be embarassed to post my guitar, but I just might for fun and grins (it's pretty bad, heh).

Good luck then  :-)


Sweet. I know exactly what you're talking about. My brother always skated those.

edit:
That Hawk board you see is the last I've stepped on...So far. Chipped my 4 front teeth skating that thing, and had to get a bridge. Don't feel bad -- I'd give anything if I had simply "busted my ass". That was more of a "Face" --- Meet your new friend "Concrete" ordeal.

Well, that was pretty easy! Hit up the local shop (they have a great tech there) and played through their acoustic guitars. They had a decent selection of acoustics (yay school music programs), played some Deans, Yamahas, Alvarez, and Washburns (and a few El Cheapos I've never heard of). Since I tend to downplay my guitar experience, he started me on starter guitars, which was cool to get a feel from the bottom up.

As soon as I'd played through a few starters, I had a much better feel for what I was looking for, indeed, the neck I was liking the most was the cheap Alvarez. But I didn't like the electronics, nor the finish and inlays. He said, oh, here's the higher quality version, and I swear it had a little halo when he brought it down (could have been beer+sunlight). Had everything the cheaper model didn't, decent electronics, all natural finish with maple side/back, and just an inlay at the 12th fret. Alvarez AJ60-SC. The maple back is perfectly matched with a nice knurl on each side, a beautiful piece of wood.

Sound is nice and bright with good low-end punch. Loud. The electronics are good, some tone control beyond the 3 band eq and two gain stages. Running through the electric rig, it's serviceable with only a little mud at the very bottom and twang up higher. And the action is so nice, besides bending I forget I'm on the acoustic. Bending whole steps is a grade-A bitch, but that's the nature of the beast with acoustics, in my experience.

Paid $500 on the nose for the guitar + case + tax (which is nearing 10% in New York, yay).
(http://www.alvarezgtr.com/heartprodmedia/artistsprodmed/aj60sc.jpg)

Oh, yeah. I was checking prices on a few things, and noticed this mandolin (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=guitar/search/detail/base_pid/519193/) was going for $40! Sure, it's cheap....but $40! Less than a damned console game. Think I'll grab one for the hell of it.

Nice choice! Is that as big as it looks? Kind of looks like a Gibson Jumbo shape, except with a cutaway.

Btw, have you ever tried Silk and Steel strings? They give a quicker feel, like electrics or classical nylon, in my experience. Good for bending too.

I like men, i'm also a little girl.

It's pretty huge. Kinda feels like playing a Gretsch with a thicker body.

Downside is I now have to buy another guitar, because I wanted to take this one hiking/camping with me, and it's too nice ;)

Schild: yeah, it's no secret.

Live on the edge, man!

Seriously, it's meant for playing. Play it. Heh. Just don't let it fall of a cliff or something.


Well, don't feel left out. Little girls (http://www.daisyrock.com/) can play the guitar too.

Nah, they didn't have a hardshell case, I'm not going hiking with a huge fragile instrument in a gig bag. Maybe you have to know me in person...it's just not a good idea, I'm way too impulsive and hyperactive. I know in no uncertain terms I'd break it within an hour if I were out in the wilderness with it.

Now that's the essence of modal playing, IMO.  The Phrygian mode isn't a scale to me, it's a sound.  I love it, so I throw the flat 2 into my playing a lot, just for that sound.

You obviously understand modes, but what I was trying to say is the way most method books teach students about modes is wrong.  If you play the C major scale, starting on F, over a C chord, you aren't playing in the Lydian mode; you are playing the C Major scale.  If, however, you played the C Major scale over an F chord, you would be playing in C Lydian.

I saw the first G3.  Johnson followed Vai and got booed by the crowd, but he had a really hard act to follow.  Vai put on an amazing set with great showmanship.  Johnson had major problems from his vintage equipment and because so, wasn't that good.

Vai was my favorite of the night (missed the KWS set).

Get a Baby Taylor.  I got one for when I was travelling for work and it kicks ass.  When you get your hands on one, it looks very cheap and delicate, but it can take a beating.  And they sound HUGE for their size.  I've played with people who had cheap, full sized acoutstics and the Baby kept up, and in some cqases, sounded bigger.  Oh, and because of the short scale, they almost play like an electric.

The only downside is that because of the short scale, the intonation isn't the best.  You have to tune the B string a bit flat to get all your basic, open chords to sound in tune.  Playing chords up higher on the neck is annoying too, because they sound out of tune.  I need new strings for my regular Taylor, so I'm using my Baby and it annoys the hell out of me when I sing "No Excuses".  Luckily, I'm just singin' for myself :P

I saw Vai on Tuesday at the Fox in Boulder.

Y'know, I wasn't expecting much. His music is not stuff I consider to be interesting, and I hadn't enjoyed his performance at the Fillmore at G3 in Denver (The performance in that video I posted was taped there and then)

Buuuut this performance was dynomite. Absolutely wonderful, including a wonderful opening show by Eric Sardinas. It was incredibly cool, and far more than I would have expected given the fact that Steve and co. had picked up a bug and were performing sick.

Even though I have no particular interest in his CD's still .. I now thoroughly reccomend seeing his performances.

Hmm, well that's a shame. It's not like I'm a big fan of his either, but I think I think he just stepped up a notch in my book. Anyone who gets booed by the Vai/Satriani crowd that easily is OK with me.  :wink:

I've only seen Vai once, with David Lee Roth on the Eat 'Em And Smile tour (Tesla opening behind their debut album, they kicked all kinds of ass, too), with Sheehan and Bissonette. Great show.

I saw Tesla a couple years ago, in Sacramento (their home town), right after they reformed.  They kicked major ass.  I forgot how many good songs they had; almost every one they played was a sing-along.  Plus, they had a beer cooler on stage.

Since Stray whined about me ignoring this thread :)

I found this clip (http://home.twcny.rr.com/iamthey/bwlg.mp3) among a bunch of guitar riff clips when I was cleaning out my data drive. I like to "jot" down ideas and back them up to cd every now and again, so I don't lose them. It was the only bass riff among hundreds of guitar riffs, according to the file metadata I recorded it last october.

I remember doing it, it is the germ of a song idea I have on guitar that I was trying to flesh out with a bass line and come up with some bass hooks. This is just me trying to jam out a few ideas, so it's pretty rough both in content and timing, lots of pauses and crap. But as I don't play bass any more, and only recently started playing guitar again, I thought it was pretty decent, the latter half is closer to the style I played professionally, I was pretty classical-heavy (hey, that was the era for it!).

Not much, but it's something to keep the thread alive :) Some day I'll actually record something worth listening to, I'm not much for polished recordings, heh.

You sound like a Geezer.  :wink:

Pretty cool. I've got stuff laying around here that I should go through....I "notebook" just about everything, but haven't put together something substantial in a while. It's hard to get a good rockin' song going without some friends around (for me at least).

Also been buying a lot of "guitar" albums lately. Getting CD versions of some old albums (Band of Gypsies and Jeff Beck for the win). Also been getting a lot of this guy (http://www.nelscline.com/). Nels Cline. He's the bees knees, I tell you. If Di Meola was in Sonic Youth, it'd sound like him. Some MP3 samples here (http://www.nelscline.com/mp3.html). I recommend getting the "Instrumentals" album.

Geezer 'taught' me how to play bass. I worship at the altar of Geezer. I love Cliff, but to me Geezer is what a bass player should be. Heck, lots of my blues guitar riffs are Geezer riffs, too :) So...thanks!

I hear you on trying to write without a band, it's tough. I always had a songwriting partner in my singer, but it's been over a decade since I've seen him.

Speaking of guitar albums, which I'm always buying, finally got the cd version of Ozzy's Tribute to Randy. Goddamned I love Randy. He's so aggro when he plays, listening to his Iron Man or Paranoid is refreshing. Also got Clapton's From Cradle to Grave disc, some great blues soloing on there.

I've wondered what would have happened to EVH's rep if Randy hadn't died. Rhoads was just as good (well, maybe that's arguable), but much different as well. Would Eddie still have been the most influential 80's rock guitarist? Would there have been as many imitators?

I'll just post some Cline clips directly. Most of this is his Jazzy stuff, not the noise rock-ish stuff.

Beer Bottle Collection (http://www.nelscline.com/sounds/Ground/beer_bottle_collection.mp3)

Square King (http://www.nelscline.com/sounds/Pin/squareking_edit.mp3)

Bath (http://www.nelscline.com/sounds/Chest/bath.mp3)

Cause for Concern (http://www.nelscline.com/sounds/Instrumentals/cause_for_concern.mp3)

Ghost of the Pinata (http://www.nelscline.com/sounds/Instrumentals/ghost_of_the_pinata.mp3)

Anyways, I'm always happy when I stumble upon an indie/punk musician who's really skilled on his/her instrument. It's like the best of both worlds to me. Too bad that there's very few of them.

That's good stuff. I think if I were playing with a band currently, I'd be a lot looser like that, as I enjoy just jamming along. But playing alone, I focus a lot more on not only technique, but note selection and a hundred other critical things (critical in that I self-criticize a lot while playing alone, whereas I'm more likely to forget minor flubs in favor of the overall groove when playing with others).

Bath was very nice, but they all rocked. Cause for Concern reminds me of my scale jams. When I get tired of running scales, I start to make little melodies that still traverse back and forth, up and down. I like the syncopation in the last clip. I saw the Holmes Brothers sunday (completely incredible, from soul to blues to gospel, and awesome guitar work) and I noticed I tend to watch the drummer more than anyone else, part of why I can always lock into that groove, and why 'stock' drummers bore me. I like them to constantly change up the rhythym...to give me ideas!

Really bums me out that cat from Syracuse lives so far away and has a band (with his brother, so a solid band connection). The freeform classical/metal stuff we were doing on open mic nights was completely fucking amazing, wish I had recorded it. It was a constant jam, him throwing out new rhythyms and me weaving them together, him feeding off what I played and viceversa, just a great experience, and pretty much what I'm looking for in a band. Start with a drummer like that and then try to find other musicians who can keep up.

Geezer kicks ass!  I love how he's so tight when it's time for the monolithic riffs, be he gets loose and groovy when one of those isn't happening.

I made out like a bandit recently....Picked up a Vibro-King (i.e. the Holy Fucking Grail of Tone) off eBay for cheap.

A $2100 hand wired, Fender Custom Shop amp for $900. Kind of different from other Fenders, in that it doesn't just produce a Blackface or Tweed type sound. It'll do the Stevie Ray or Dick Dale thing, but it'll go into MC5-ish territory too (Townsend and Chris Isaak both use them these days, if that gives you any indication of it's versatility and how good it sounds). It's a 3x10, which makes it a little different from other Fenders as well.

It has a built in Fender Reverb Unit (not the standard kind, but the old school stand alone 3 knobbed one, like this (http://www.pedaldoctor.com/images/IMG_0586.JPG)), and I can get a perfect Surf sound out of it. Especially with the Jazzmaster. Only downside is that it's a single channel 60 watter...Which means, if I want overdrive, it has to be CRANKED......But when it is, it's one of the best.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/vibro-king-ebay.jpg)

I'll take a snapshot of my guitar with it soon.

I'm downsizing on just about everything I own now. Besides the occasional stompbox, I don't need anything else.

So anyways, here's my new rig...I got rid of all of my electrics except for a Tele and Jazzmaster (including the baritone that sparked this thread). No more amps except this bad boy:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/VK_and_Jazzmaster.jpg).

That's a sweet combo! The 3x10 is interesting, I was playing through my 7x10 (an 8x10 with a bad speaker ;)) and it is real nice and punchy, but now I'm playing through my 1x15 (dean markley cab with an ev 400W full range 15" in it).

I really need to forget the mortgage for a couple months and buy a decent guitar. I've been playing a lot more lately, trying to master the happier styles, less doom and sludge playing. Recently I've been studying the Allmans and Betts, much to the delight of my girl. Just got the 2-disc Setzer Orchestra live set, it smokes. Also got in a Rev. Horton Heat compilation, really been stretching out and it feels great.

And my electric strat knockoff is dying in a big way, the electronics are shot, and it's not worth fixing. I've had a big eye for a couple Epiphones, the Epi les paul custom and the Epi les paul baritone, or perhaps a real strat. I'm pretty excited about it, hopefully I'll have some pics to share soon!

Those Epi's are great guitars for the money....There's just too damn heavy for me personally. Les Pauls in general, I mean. I've gotten wimpy over the years or something.

I've been eyeing a Gretsch Duo Jet lately, but it's the same deal. Heavy as shit, but man, they sound great. They look sweet too:

(http://www.gretschguitars.com/repository/gretsch/images/G6128T-1962_xl.jpg)

Anyways, go for it....Just get it out of the way :) Good luck on whatever you get.

That Gretsch is teh sexay!

Listening to all this Setzer and Horton really, really makes that Gretsch look teh sexay! If only for that nice tremolo system, I don't use a tremolo bar (I'm a bender with crazy vibrato), but for the psychobilly, it's essential.

Also, I was at the shop my buddy works at and one of the teachers there thought I sounded very rockabilly, he thought that was my 'specialty' from the jam I was playing. At the time I found it odd, but I can hear it in my chording and phrasing now that I'm listening to more of it.

I'm not sure what the heck I'm good at any more, classical, metal, blues, rockabilly, rock, southern rock...I don't care so long as it sounds good! It's interesting having my girl listen to me play (she loves the guitar, luckily), she picks out so many more mishmashed influences and trends in my playing, it's been a great analytical tool.

Edit: Holy crap, it's not cheap, though! $2700 for the bigsby model @ musician's friend!! Yowzers, but it IS nice...

The guy who taught me how to play was into all of this 60's instrumental type stuff (like surf), so I think it's always resonated with me the most. Not just surf necessarily, but the general approach. Spacious reverb, echos, not really blues based. That could be anything from Television, Sonic Youth, My Bloody Valentine, Surf, or Spaghetti Western music. Then again, I'm just as enamored with Link Wray...Who was more in-your-face and rockin'. I've also been...for all intents and purposes....into "punk" (then again, that word means little these days).

I guess you could say that I play slow surf (i.e. Spaghetti).....Just with more "noise". I like single note type riffs drowned in reverb, but when I play chords, I like them to be hard and ring out. And sometimes, I just play "noise". *shrug*  :wink: I need to upload some clips.

Not that I don't like anything else, but playing-wise, I'm just comfortable along those lines. I can do a little "Angus", or "Jimi", or "Kerry King"....But to be honest, it isn't really happening. That much I know.

To me, punk is old  CoC (though the newer stuff is cool, too, Pepper Keenan rocks), Accused, Black Flag, the traditionals like the Pistols/Ramones/Clash/Kennedies, Butthole Surfers, Fear, stuff that was raw and uncommercial. Not so much the Good Charlotte or Green Day, though those are decent punky pop bands imo. I listened to a lot of that stuff, still have some LPs around I think, because I was in the skate scene when I was a kid, back when Tony Hawk was making videos in his backyard. I recently dug up my Fear tape because they butchered "Let's Have a War" from The Record on that eMotive APC disc, which I thought sucked (a first for MJ Keenan imo). "I Love Living in the City" is a classic. The Surfer's "Lady Sniff" was one of my favorites for rawness, with their entire "Rembrandt Pussyhorse" album being one of my favorites of all time, stuff like "Waiting for Jimmy to Kick", "Whirling Hall of Blades", and the hauntingly cool "Creep in the Cellar".

I should upload some clips, too. I moved the room around and everything is unplugged. When I first started playing again a couple years ago, I recorded everything, because I have CRS (can't remember shit). Now that I'm getting a little better and actually trying to write stuff I could use the focus of the recording. I'm just way too jammy, my girl cracks up because I have exercises designed to play boring rythyms without going off: throwing in fills, trying for alternate fingerings, etc. I don't think it's possible :P I think my best is two repetitions of a 12 bar blues/rockabilly riff before I start noodling about.

I know nothing about any of this.

But my cousin and brother are both very big into music.

Here are a couple songs my cousin digitally recorded.  All him, all original stuff.  Just in case you guys want to hear it.

If you're impatient- it's definitely Vai or Satriani inspired, reminds me of The Black Mages (Japanese rock band who cover Final Fantasy music)

http://travisaustin.bluedomino.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/breakpoint.mp3
http://travisaustin.bluedomino.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/blue.mp3

Now I will step back out of this thread, into a subject where I belong.

That's some cool guitar work. It does sound a lot like the Vai/Satriani thing. I enjoyed it, though it's not really my thing: a bit too slick. And I hate synths. I blame Eddie VH and Geddy Lee for that.

The composition is nice, too. A bit more dynamic than most one-man projects, and the drums didn't annoy me, which often happens with drum machines. Personally, I intend to play my own acoustic drums when I put my stuff together, even if it means it's messier.

I also have the benefit of a great bass player...I find it funny (and sometimes frustrating) that I'm /still/ a better bass player than guitar player, even though I put the bass down almost ten years ago and have only been focusing on guitar for the last couple years. I actually started as a thrash metal guitarist, then learned classical in school, then picked up the bass when every bass player we auditioned sucked (our original bass player was from a Rush cover band). When I was playing open mics to see if I could still rock the stage (I can, phew), it was funny how nobody believed (from my playing) that I wasn't really a bass player anymore, hadn't played in years.

Then they saw my right hand fingers dripping blood after two songs, from the burst blood blisters on the tips...I play hard, and had no callouses...but it did prove my point...Anyway, one project I've got going on right now is restoring the neck on my bass, it was gunkified to hell and back from being in storage.

I had a friend who told me I was a better bass player than a guitar player (I had a guitar in my hand at the time)....

I was *this close* to knocking him across the head with it.

Heh, it's true though...I just won't let anyone else tell me that  :wink:

Ah, aiming for that level 60 Metallica world tour end game? You need to kill the Kirk Hammet boss mob first.

See? You cannot escape!

Kill Kirk Hammett? He's the only one left that shouldn't be smacked across the head.

Every shmoe wants to play lead/rhythm.  The real men play Bass.    :evil:

I play both....As do most guitarists. I rarely meet a straight up "bass player". They're just guitarists who see bass as having less of a barrier to entry.

Besides, this is Metallica we're talking about. Why someone would want to play bass in a metal band is beyond me. You're going to get mixed out in the end anyways.

Playing and being are two different things.  I could give a crap either way as I do neither and was just parroting something I'd read years ago.   However, as you said, you get mixed out in the end*, so you have to REALLY want to play it to be the bassist, IMO. 

*Unless  of course you're Burton oldschool or Terjilligjilo on that newest piece of shit.. Damnit let Kirk play!

I don't mean to derail further, but I don't know what the difference is in "playing a bass" and "being a bass player".  Care to explain that to me? Is it some kind of Lemmy thing, or what? :) I mean, I guess I prefer the timbre and feel of guitars more often than other instruments, but all I really am is a musician.

Yeah, it's a philosophy and a mindset thing.  Kind of the difference between playing an instrument and being a musician.  I can play the sax, but I'm no musician. It's all technical to me, I have no heart in it.  You can play a bass, but that doesn't make you a bassist if you're just playing it because they won't let you play lead or rhythm. You'll suck at it because your heart won't be in it, even if you're technically perfect.  Just MNSHO.

All I'm trying to say is that the same "dedication" that requires a musician to be proficient on bass is the same dedication that's used when they pick up a guitar. With basses and guitars, there isn't much to learn to switch from one and have the same effect on the other.

All fall under the disicpline of "string instruments", then further differentiate themselves in such ways like violins and cellos and their use of bows; harps and lutes being non fretted and intonated on a string by string basis; dulcimers using a hammer to sound off notes; sitars using some strings for droning, etc., etc.. Basses aren't too much different than guitars other than that their necks are about 6 inches longer, and they (traditionally, though not exclusively) provide 4 strings instead of 6. Both have at least 21 frets, notes are primarily sounded with a plectrum or finger (and not a hammer or bow), both are traditionally tuned to standard EADG(BE) tuning and use the same scale fingerings......The only striking difference is that the bass is an octave lower. Which kind of, though not necessarily, lends itself to a rhythm mindset (but a "rhythm mindset" is very much a big part of guitar playing anyways....).

Other than that, it's a guitar in every sense. If a guy is a good "bassist" then he's probably pretty competent on a guitar as well. And vice versa. Look at Geddy Lee playing classical duets with Lifeson, or Paul McCartney, who could play better than either John or George -- They're both awesome bass players, and awesome guitar players as well.

I don't see how there's any inherent personality differences in the people who use them, because neither instrument requires much of a paradigm shift to switch to the other. It's not like moving from guitar to percussion or horns. That would make a little more sense.

Ahh...I see my perspective is called for! ;)

I started on guitar, but switched to bass when we couldn't find a good bass player. I was good with my fingers from classical fingerpicking. After playing strictly bass for a year, I pretty much started becoming a bass player. There's a different approach and mindset to playing bass, you can't just play guitar licks. It's pretty easy for me to pick out guitar players on bass in local bands, they play it like a low-tuned guitar.

Stray, you're talking technicality. Sure, they're both stringed instruments*. But the way in which they are utilized in a band setting are quite different, a different philosophy. Almost completely different. Hard to explain, I guess.

I'm feeling this now because a local blues artist is interested in me playing bass with him, I told him give me a couple weeks to build up my callouses...but now I'm finding my mindset has shifted and I'm playing bass like the guitar (which I've been practicing exclusively the last few years). That's why he hasn't asked me previously, and I tend to agree with him, as it's a disservice to the music to have a half-assed bass line driving things. A "full-time" or "real" bass player is always preferable.

* But really, one can't play the bass as a guitar due to the low register, the chording gets muddy, you have to adjust everything to fit the honkin' big sound waves you are pumping out and be careful about muddiness. And it's a different 'rhythym mindset', too, more locked in with the drums. My girlfriend finds it fascinating how much I tune into the drums when listening to music, it's from years of bass playing. Not that guitarists don't, as well, just that it's a more visceral thing on bass because your job is to hold the whole mothership together through the ride.

In my college days, we had 6 or 9 guitarists on each track...1 bass player. Even though we had a dozen guitarists and three bass players in the band. Totally different, despite all the similarities.

Hell, listen to a guitarist's solo album, if he's playing the bass. It's generally nowhere near as good as a real bass player, I'm listening to some Buckethead...great guitarist, but leave the bass to the bassists imo. Almost all guitarists make that mistake. I do, too, though at least I have the benefit of 6 years of professional bassing in my repertoire.

Hah..Give me a little credit here, man. I've been playing both instruments for close to 20 years now. It's not that I play chords on the bass or anything. I hate tooting my own horn --- But I rip it up plenty. Many people have even pointed out (much to my chagrine) that I should be playing bass more than guitar  :x.

The thing is, I wouldn't know anything about bass or guitar playing if it wasn't, first and foremost, because of a general understanding of music. I'm a musician, in the generic sense.

Like I said, I don't play chords on the bass. Nor do I "shred" on the bass. What I do, however, is break chords down to their individual notes. And from there I build a melody and a rhythm. The rhythm is always in the root, and depending on whether the song is major, minor, 7th, 9th, whatever..That's where my note options will be.  The same options are there if I was playing lead guitar instead of bass. Take a C major chord being strummed on the guitar, for example, and you've already got a bassline with C, D, E, G, and A (the same way it'd be safe bet to melodize with those notes on lead guitar).

Now, as for a "guitar player's" mentality coming into the picture. I can understand one thing here -- Some (immature/wanker) guitar players don't understand the role of the backbeat. Which is why they sound like shit on bass. They don't have enough control to keep the rhythm, and start doing fill ins all over the place. They lose track of the root notes and throw themselves off (and the listener as well). But you know what? Those kind of guys suck at guitar too.

See, you get what I was saying, I just had no idea how to convey it to you. These are guys who aren't thinking like Bassists.

Oh, I play chords on the bass. Just have to be careful so they sound good. The 7th chord turnaround on a 12 bar blues is tight.

Chords or intervals? More than 2 notes at a time on bass just doesn't fit for me.

Duck Dunn would hurt me cry if I played chords on my bass.   

Nice name drop.  :-D

It was an attempt at humor... apparently, a poor one on my part.

Speaking of Donald "Duck" Dunn, the 25th Anniversary edition of "The Blues Brothers" comes out on DVD today.

*points at Steve Harris of Iron Maiden as counter-example*

That said, it seems that the Metallica/Ozzy switcheroo has brought them a bass player that knows what you wrote to be true, and thus aims for stage showmanship instead.

Iron Maiden doesn't have a lot of low register drums, which is probably why Harris can play bass the way he does.

I am legally bound from answering this question.

Anyway, Harris is out front because he, you know, started the band and wrote most of the music. It's pretty much the Steve Harris Band, always has been. But as a former metal bassist, I agree with the sentiment, it's certainly possible to have a good metal mix with a strong bass. I would've mixed out Newstead, too. I never found him very interesting on the bass, I really like Trujillo, though. I hope he gets some love on the next album (I actually like St. Anger, too)

The 7th turnaround I refer to is a 3-note chord the way I play it. I actually used bass chords quite a bit, which is why I know how finicky they are, we had one guitarist so I'd do a lot of higher octave playing while he did solo work. And intervals...I do love me some intervals.

Funny Duck Dunn was brought up...about a week ago I was talking to my local blues buddy and I realized he hasn't had a bass player in his band in two years or so (he duets with a drummer ala white stripes, still a great sound).

So I ragged on him for a bit and looks like I'll probably get the gig. He just told me to work over some Albert King material (King played with the memphis folks - Booker T and Co, including Duck). Duck uses a lot of solid basics, but adds so much flavor to it, it'll take a while to get all the intricacies down, but I can pull off a lot of that stuff without a sweat (as in, all but one track off Born Under a Bad Sign learned in the time it took to play the track, same as this blues buddy's original material).

But it's all about the nuances. Takes a couple minutes to learn the song, a couple years to master the nuances, especially since this is new ground for me, tonally I skipped a lot of theory that didn't apply to minor keys (:(). Fun stuff.

I figured the downside would be my right hand, when I was doing open mics they literally broke out in blood blisters and I bled all over the place. But oddly, it's my left thumb that's killing me, I guess it got out of shape for those long stretches on bass (I have stubby fingers) and increased pressure.

But it's feeling pretty good and once I strengthen that thumb some more, I'll be playing in a blues outfit! Woot and whatnot. Even though my girlfriend feels I should be fronting my own, playing guitar. She just doesn't understand paying dues and learning on the road. What better way to enhance my blues guitar than playing with an excellent blues guitarist, even if it's on bass. I'm still learning all his tricks. Oh, and free beer.

Dunn is great, but I think I learned more about bass playing from listening to James Jamerson (and Paul McCartney, who's very much like Jamerson in many ways). Maybe it's my preference for Motown over Stax, I don't know.

Albert King is the shit as well. I hate to say it, but umm....Stevie Ray Vaughn....I'm sorry, but he's just trying to be Albert King (and I do like SRV, don't take me wrong). Also, as much as I like BB King, it's kind of sad that everyone knows who BB is, but Albert's barely remembered outside of guitarist circles these days.....But that could just be because BB has had the fortune of living a long time. Albert's influence on modern electric blues is just as far reaching as BB's. They're like the two branches that set the tone for what is blues today..But only BB gets the mention, and the sound that is Albert's is attributed to Stevie Ray.

Anyways, that's my rant..

Blues Power (http://home.earthlink.net/~kthompsen/Blues_Power.mp3) (always a good track...)

I'm the guilty party that brought "Duck" into this.  

I've been playing bass for over 20 years now.  As I've grown and matured (yes, they are different things), I've come to realize that more isn't necessarily better.  When I was in my early twenties I got all caught up in technical bass (Lee, Squire, etc.).  Now that I'm older and more secure in my playing, I find that it's more about "the groove" than it is about the notes.  That's something I've always loved about Dunn.  The guy has all the technical skills needed to be a flashy bassist, but would rather find his place in the music.  

Then again, it could be that my fingers just don't move like they used to... damn those synapses.

That's one thing my girlfriend was concerned with: this guy I'll be jamming with is pretty basic, and I tend to be pretty fancypantsy on guitar. I had to explain it's all about that groove and subtlety.

SRV...I don't really listen to his stuff since I started a serious blues journey through time. He's ok, but he's also real..I dunno, clean and commercial, like a more talented Robert Cray. Too slick imo. Sure, he can crush that texas guitar, and his Little Wing is my very favorite song ever, but overall I don't give him much ear time.

Otoh, Albert's BUBS, which I mentioned above as the album I went to, is one of my very favorites. His voice is just so mellifluous, almost like Orbison on the ballads. His left-handed crazy bending is mind-blowing, and then adding in the band...just some great stuff.

Some other great stuff I've been wearing out: John Mayall's Bluesbreakers with Clapton: such an incredible album. I'm working through some of that on guitar, in fact (I got the majority of All Your Love in one playthrough, woot!). Clapton plays a lot of minor pentatonic, which is my safety zone, so I love jamming his stuff, it flows off my fingers, whereas SRV is a struggle because of the texas shuffle style. Also why I can identify with Pagey really well, too: he does a lot of pentatonic minor with modal coloring. Clapton's From the Cradle is pretty intense, and I've got the DVD he made during the sessions for the Me & Mr. Johnson sessions...I actually like the sessions more than the finished product. And of course, my beloved Robert Johnson cd...I'm years away from his incredible fingerpicking style, but I'm whittling away at it slowly. And Muddy...always listening to Muddy, my first bluesman. Gotta track down that album I had as a kid, a live Muddy disk with Johhny Winter on guitar (which turned me onto that crazy mofo).

So much good stuff.

Hope you got that tune, gotta be fast when I'm leeching webspace :)

You know what it is? It's that damn in-phase sound (2 and 4 positions on the Strat pickups) that Cray exclusively uses, and Stevie/modern Clapton to an extent. It's good for a lot of things, but for the blues, there's just no balls in it. I don't understand why these guys, who are some of the best blues guitarists ever, gravitate towards that sound. You can hear Stevie's weaker moments in that Stormy clip, for example, and it's only when he's flipped in the in-phase position. Out of phase, he grows his balls back.

Almost everything Clapton does these days (on electrics, that is) sounds sterile and weak for the same reason too.

Little Wing has balls because SRV was doing Jimi, who played in the neck.

Don't take me wrong though...These guys could outplay me for all eternity, even with a shitty tone. It isn't the playing I'm knocking, for sure.

No, I understand about the criticism disclaimer ;)

Like when I was explaining why I didn't like Tull's guitarist to my girl. I told her that's why I have to be good, I have to be able to back up my opinion with my own playing...eventually. She laughs because I don't compare myself to my peers in the area, I compare myself to Page, Clapton, King, etc. The way it should be imo. Why pat myself on the back because I'm better than some podunk nobody, anyway?

Found an old copy of Cakewalk (9 iirc, with the manual for 8, heh) an old bass buddy gave me years ago. Without the gimping of shareware (no multitracking) I'd been using, I've got to start laying some shit down! I'm not used to cleaning things up for recording, my loose playing style + listening perfectionism run at counter purposes... The bass gig thing is another thing I didn't need on top of trying to work in more guitar.

Gaming? I remember when I had time for that...

Well, good luck with all that, man. I hope you have fun.

I haven't done much of anything myself in the way of gigging, or even jamming, for a while now. Not because I don't want to, or because I'm busy....I'm just lacking the motivation or something.

I've got a new favorite blues album: Hound Dog Taylor's first (http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=10:5287gjer86ix).

Holy crap man. If you like the blues, check this puppy out. I'm using it for bass practice right now, but the guitarwork is phenomenal as well. Leans a bit to the boogie side of the blues. This is the cd that will clinch my spot in my buddy's band ;)

I also found out I'm improving on slide, I had my acoustic and slide out when doing my first listen and my girl was pretty impressed (though that's not real tough, heh). Improving from totally sucking isn't saying much, heh. Slide ain't easy (good slide anyway...haven't explored open tunings yet ala Derek Trucks, Allman, ad nauseum).

I love slide too, but admittedly, I'm not too good at it. I don't play blues slide much though....I use open minor tunings mainly. Kind of gives it a more arabesque/gypsy feel.

[edit] I'll check that CD out.

Try soloing in that open minor tuning over major chords, that's how a lot of blues go. I'm struggling learning bass lines for blues because there is so much major keying, I keep hitting sour notes :P But it's coming along pretty damn good, I've got a few good patterns with fills and if it calls for a pentatonic bass line, I'm golden.

I was hitting up some guitar sites, and I found a 'lesson' that got me thinking. It was for 'dexterity', just chromatic patterns all up and down the neck. That got me to wondering...do you guys do that kind of stuff? I used to when I first started many revolutions ago, but I found it to be a waste of time. I get my dexterity practice by playing tough pieces or by focusing on tough passages (like repeating a section of string skipping or whatever). I basically don't like playing stuff that's not musical, especially if I can get the same benefit from playing music instead (I tend to the shred side, which bugs me :P).

Still loving that Hound Dog album, got Derek Truck's live album, too. Trucks' live album is a nice melange of styles, blues, jazz, latin, african. Not something I'd listen to every day, but some great jams in there.

Well, the one I mainly use is open G minor tuning. All I have to do is put the second string back to B, and I've got major G (ala Keef)....So, that works pretty good for blues. I use open D a lot too, which is a blues tuning (i.e. Robert Johnson), but you can do other things with it too.

Stray, don't kick me :)

Just bought a Gibson SG.

No idea I wanted one, I spent saturday with a guitar tech at a local music shop going through about 50 guitars (a fraction of their selection, just the good stuff). Played a wide variety of strats, because I thought I wanted one...but it's just not versatile enough (and I dislike the out-of-phase positions). Played some expeeeensive Les Pauls, including the Black Beauty (omg...I didn't plug it in, the pickups are too sweet), which I actually didn't care for. The neck was a baseball bat. Went through a couple Schecters, almost bought one with a sweet neck with an abalone vine inlay all up the neck and another with abalone around the perimeter of the fretboard..but they just looked a little too slick for me.

Played some great Gretsches, but again, they are a little too limiting for my main guitar (it'll be a while before I can swing another one as I'm saving for a mortgage). Also worked over some Teles, I really like those guitars, but again, limited sound. I can definitely see a Gretsch, Strat, and Tele in my future, though.

Finally narrowed it down to a sweet Strat and the SG. I had no intention of buying an SG, but when I finally plugged them in, there was no contest. All the guys at the store agreed I was really tearing it up on the SG compared to the Strat, it was pretty funny how the tone made that much of a difference in my playing.

'61 Reissue, standard red stain finish. Got in the car and remembered this thread. D'oh! ;) Anyway, I'm pretty happy with it.
Actually he seems to use an oddball open Aadd7 or something. The exact tuning escapes me just now, I'm still lazily working slide in standard tuning.

Hey, a 62 RI is FAR better than what I was gonna sell you (though for much cheaper). Mine was a SG Special (did end up selling it though).

Anyways...Congratulations, man. Kick ass guitar. I'd probably have my SG around still, but it helped pay for that Vibro-King I ended up buying. I'm sure I'll get around to owning another some day. Probably a 60's model as well (that 60's slim neck is much better than what they do on current models imo).

Going to pick it up tonight, I'm totally stoked. So is my girlfriend...since she doesn't have to hear me say "Damn I need a new guitar" anymore. Now it's "Damn I need a new amp", I was also checking out tube combos surreptitiously :P There was one sweet vintage tweed 2x12 that really sounded shweet...

She also loves Derek Trucks, I didn't tell her until I chose the SG that it's what he plays. Bonus points with the little woman there. We have a deal - she can marry Trucks if I can marry Susan Tedeschi ;)

On the playing front, been making great progress on acoustic blues, getting my foundations. Working turnarounds and vamps and bridges, etc, then applying them to a lot of tunes from Johnson to Clapton, Muddy to Buddy. Listening to a lot of Buddy Guy and Muddy lately.

OMG why didn't I buy a new guitar years ago!?!

This guitar is so sweet I can't stop playing it. Brought it into work, ostensibly to play show & tell, but really just an excuse to play it some more :)

Now it's time to buy more  :-D.

I wish. I'm cool for now, I've got two great guitars now, the SG and the Alvarez jumbo acoustic I bought a few months back. Really going to buy a lot more once I get settled into a nice house in the country, though. Might have a line on a used banjo (gratis) so I don't have to refurb my grandfather's. Then maybe a mandolin. After that, I'll start considering the laundry list: Telecaster, Strat, Gretsch (or Gibson semi), baritone (Jag, maybe), P bass, Ricky bass, dobro, etc, etc, etc.

But for now I'm more than happy.

Actually, as I mention above, now I'm thinking about a nice little tube combo amp...

I'm starting to realize lately JUST how much bending is a whole discipline in it's own right.

Of course, I've always known how to bend....But to really make 3 or 4 notes sing, and flow into each other: That isn't easy.

Yep. And unlike my el cheapo, the SG is set up for very wide bends. I should make a run at some Albert King 2 and 2-1/2 step bending again, literally couldn't bend my old guitar enough to hit them. The SG is like bending butter. If that makes any sense :P

The more I try to work on scales and now chords, the more I have to remember to focus on just a handful of notes and work the shit out of them. My inner critic keeps popping up and saying I need to play an arpeggio or something. I need a popup blocker in my brain. I'm still feeling pretty bad about my playing, but for the first time since I've been dating my girl, I said it sounded good. I mean, it does sound good at times, I guess it's the first time I told her so...odd.

Yeah, though I do like Fenders more, and the old 7.25 radius (newer Fenders are almost 10), I fret out a lot. I don't have my SG anymore, but it's was always better for this kind of stuff.

You electric players crack me up. :)

Then again, I am not much of a gear-head.

Ah, I love my acoustic too! Been playing more of that lately actually.

But yeah, I sound pretty silly when it comes to gear. Ever since I got my new amp and Jazzmaster though, the G.A.S. (Gear Acquisition Syndrome) has subsided. I haven't bought a thing.

[edit]

But...The same madness still applies to all instruments for me. It's a matter of timbre and playability. I could never truly be happy with just one sound and feel. I wish I could though...

I had a bad case of GAS when I got my first good job, and I bought a lot of gear.  I was up to 5 electrics at one point (now I'm at 2).  I still have 5 tube amps though.  But mostly, I've been playing acoustic these days and working on the playing/singing thing.

Bah, I'm no gearhead. When I was playing bass professionally, I was using a hock shop bass with a hock shop amp. And it was originally the amp powering our singer, pre-PA days when he sang through a 4x12. I like things as simple as possible, with a basic decent tone which I then work with to find a good tone. I'd really like to get a new amp, looks like I'll be playing Oblivion on low settings! With the new guitar, though, my Boss GT6 got some legs and sounds decent enough, I guess. Sky want toobs.

I have crappy tone, but playing through a few Sabbath cds last night (been a looong time since I've jammed metal, though Sab is almost blues a lot of the time), it was sounding really nice with minimal effects. I was in a serious hammering groove, Iommi style. It was a nice break from what I've been working on. My main goal right now is visualization, being able to mentally see more options so I can more closely play what I hear in my head. I can often do this with Em/B mixolydian, but I need to work over more scales and get them all memorized. Blah, I hate that stuff, but it makes me better at what I love, improvisation.

Acoustic? I love mine, read back a few pages, Raph ;) Got one earlier this year.

Walking lines on the bass (in blues) is exceedingly easy if you remember 4 notes: 1, 3, 5, and 7 (and yes, that's *major* third).  Every other lead in tone around those notes is legal as well, and sounds damn good.  Bass lines in classical I-IV-V blues changes (12 bar blues) are centered around the root not so you are always safe with those 1-3-5-7 notes, regardless of the key.

As to why this sounds good over a pentatonic blues scale, well, I can't explain the thoery, I just know it works.  Guitarists rarely riff around the minor third so this may be why.  I also walk chromatically to the root of each chord change from whereever I am, since all those lead-in tones are 'legal' as well.

Of course this isn't jazz, so you will spend a lot of time on the roots and 5ths of the chords, especially if the guitar player is way far out there in their soloing.  People don't like it if someone isn't constantly reminding them of the chords!

That's what trips me up, the difference between bass lines that sound good with the rock-n-rolly 1,3,5,7 and stuff that sounds good with the walking pentatonic. Just a lack of experience in blues bass, in a way, since most of my blues bass actually came from Sabbath :P I can walk a /mean/ pentatonic line, which bleeds over into my soloing and vice versa (in soloing my blues pentatonic is often merged with various minor scales). But not having a firm grasp of major keys, the 1357 line always sounds like shit if I improv away from standard patterns, mostly because I don't know all the sweet spots.

I'm often on the minor third as a soloist, actually. With a 1/4 step bend, it's very bluesy. I dunno, it's just a great tone all around, not sure why people wouldn't use it.

My next project is a big ol' fretmap so I can start paying attention to note names in places I just have memorized, and to start using that to pay attention to notes I play alot and also as a reminder of coming back to tonal center and to make this a ridiculous runon sentence, also becoming more aware of my melodic motion through changes. Basically trying to pull my theory education back up through the decades of mental sludge I've built up...

I think I stated it badly in my original post:  actually, the minor third is a *great* note in the pentatonic blues scale, however most of the time guitarists don't start their solo phrasings on it.  Roots and fifths are more traditional places to start, however of course there are exceptions.

The way I think if it is like this:  if I am in a Bflat blues progression, I know that I have four major (or strong) notes that I can emphasive in the chord:  Bflat (the root), D (the major third), F (the major fifth), and Aflat (the seventh).  I always start a walking pattern at the root, and go from there:  if you are jamming with only a guitarist, you are the only person there to establish the root of the chord so it's important that you do so.  If you have a keyboard or piano player with you, he/she will often leave out the roots in order not to tread on your playing.

So a common progression on the first chord (Bf7th) would be something like this (the first four beats leading into the IV chord):

Bf -> D -> F -> Af

Then we go to the IV chord, which is Ef7th:

Ef -> G -> Bf -> Df

Then for the V chord (F7th):

F -> A -> C -> Ef

You could play these four notes and it would sound perfect, since of course the progression is based off the notes of these chords.  However this would be incredibly boring.

So the 'trick' is that you can walk chromatically to the next chord from any of these notes, and it sounds perfect.  Let's take the first example:

Bf -> D -> F -> Af

We are in Bf, and we want to go to Ef, so lets go 'towards' this note:

Bf -> D -> F -> E -> Ef

So once we got on the F, we descend down chromatically towards Ef.  We can do this on the Ef chord going back into Bf:

Ef -> G -> Af -> A -> Bf

This would be a chromatic trend upwards toward Bf.

This sounds good because it leads the ear towards the chord you are moving towards, and the ear picks that up and 'completes' the progresssion.

I have an MP3 of my band playing a progression like this, with bass lines that follow this pattern.  Try this link (http://www.savefile.com/files3.php?fid=4092765)
to download it.  If someone can host permanently that would be great.

(from stray's aborted true confessions derail)

I've been jamming along with major key stuff, trying to get some good riffs going. It's so funny to have a huge trick bag I can't touch while playing. My girlfriend thinks it sounds great (she's a former pianist), because I have to focus on strict melody without riffing at all. Damn her being right sometimes.

But I still crush when a minor key comes on, I can play just about any genre in minor keys.

I've really gotta get into the stuff Miguel is mentioning, playing more interesting stuff over progressions, and developing some good progressions and chords.

I have a question for you guys:

I'm a bass player but get dragged into playing guitar quite often (usually because I like to play rhythm and sing harmony and have no desire to solo or vamp much).  I've been playing a strat or tele most of my years and have been toying with the idea of buying a Gibson.  I've had my eye on a late 80's - early 90's Les Paul Studio double cutaway but won't have a chance to play it before buying.  I've played a few Les Pauls and I love the sustain and tone.  Have any of you played the double cutaway and have an opinion to share?  How does the double cutaway vary from the standard Les Paul.  Also, are there other guitars you'd recommend?  I've thought about a Rick or Gretsch as well. I had an old Gibson ES325 a while back and liked it a bit.

Thanks!

The DC is obviously lighter....In Gibson terms at least (all mahogany bodies are pretty heavy to begin with). Upper fret access compared to an LP is easier as well.

Soundwise, as far as I'm concerned, the DC's, SG's, and LP's all sound the same when equipped with the same electronics. Besides the 60's models and remakes (like Sky's new SG....Which has a slimmer neck), you'll get the Gibson solid body sound and feel from any of them.

The ES325 is a different beast though, and if you like that, don't expect the same. They're louder, nastier, more prone to feedback, and don't carry the same sustain as a solidbody. Not to say loud and nasty isn't good though! Just different.

Rics are similar, and if it's a Ric with single coils, it even more nasty. Just with more high end bite ala Fender.

So what do you like anyways? Fat, easily overdriven chords, with smooth leads and long sustain? Get the DC if the price is good. Or do you want something more like the Tele and Strat sounds you've been messing with?

I would recommend the Gibson SG 61 reissue :P It's a great guitar, I played about a hundred guitars before settling on it. But that's me. I didn't get my hands on a Les Paul double-cutaway, though. Any reason you can't get your hands on it first? It's really worth the journey to a big guitar store to put the entire stable through the motions, imo, especially if you're going to drop big bucks on one.

Playing a newer version is possible, but finding a place to play vintage instruments is tougher.  I guess I'll make a trip to Denver and see what I can get my hands on.  Living in Wyoming really has had a profound effect on my ability to explore instruments.  Sometimes I miss my days working as a tech in a guitar shop in Minneapolis.

Thanks for the input Sky.  I'll give the reissue a try... though I think I may be too much of a hack to really appreciate it.

Yeah, that kind of sucks if you can't explore a bit. Even same model guitars sometimes differ from each other. Especially Gibsons (a lot of the newer, more affordable, multi piece bodies are sketchy especially).

[edit] can't spell today...

No one is too much of a hack to appreciate a good guitar. I think even kids deserve a decent instrument, but that's me.

It's a Gibson, just like the DC. The differences apart from the horned and thin body shape (which makes it lighter than both the DC and standard LP), is that it has a 60's style slim taper neck, and '57 Classic pickups (the 57's are modeled after the standard Gibson PAF pickup sound. It's the sound heard in just about all Gibson guitars before 1980. They're not super hot like modern metal humbuckers. Think Angus/Townsend).

The slim neck is what makes it really stand out. 60's Gibsons tried to go for more slim feel like Fenders, but resorted back to the older style baseball bat sized necks by the 70's. Some people prefer the 60's feel.

Note: Depending on what year that DC is, it could have 57's as well.

Yep, the neck sealed the deal for me. There was a $3500 Les Paul that felt like a baseball bat, I thought it sucked...to the amusement of the shop staff. My SG is very thin, but also pretty wide. I'm honest when I say I've never played a better guitar (for me). I can't believe I waited 12 years to get a good guitar, it's really worth it if you enjoy playing, no matter your ability level. Hell, it brought my playing up a notch, easily.

Odd thing - now I see SGs everywhere I go, though a lot seem to have the whammy bar (boo!).

Yeah, and those Gibson trems are barely stable. Worse than a Strat. Pretty much why I use a Jazzmaster for that kind of thing. It's just as stable as a Floyd Rose, but not as ugly or hard to work on.

I'd still buy a Firebird though:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/gibson_firebird.jpg)

As for the use of whammy's in general, I play a lot of surf-ish type stuff and like...Among other things. I like them. I like making all kinds of noises besides just touching frets. I'll yank my strings out with my bare hands if I think it'll make a good song!  :-)

I just came across this (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7369771912&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1) during my daily trip through eBay.  I figured that some of you guitar players might appreciate this bass.  It has a thin, fast neck for a bass and a wonderful fuzzy/hollow sound.  I've recorded with one of these basses and while they're pretty terrible for live shows they produce sounds so unique that they're tough to duplicate.

I may just have to buy this thing. 

I actually prefer bigger bass guitars, not small ones that guitarists are supposed to like. I did play bass professionally for six years or so, it was tough getting back into guitar after quitting music altogether for about 5 years. My first bass, which was a beater when I was playing guitar in the band, was some monstrously huge peavey bass. Very wide, thick, and long neck. My current bass (after that one was stolen) is a custom bass from the ESP shop in Hollywood. It's pretty thin, thin and long. The custom has some really shitty pickups I never got around to replacing, I was going to slap some bartollinis in it.

Yes, please. (http://cgi.ebay.com/Rare-1969-Gibson-Les-Paul-Goldtop-69-dead-perfect_W0QQitemZ7371020630QQcategoryZ38086QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

This (http://cgi.ebay.com/ORIGINAL-PRE-CBS-FENDER-CUSTOM-TELECASTER-GUITAR-CASE_W0QQitemZ7369791585QQcategoryZ38083QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) would be more to my liking.  I just need to win the lottery or WSOP.

Very beautiful.

Vintage guitar prices make me cry. Please.

There was a time....Hell, only a little over a decade ago.....When yuppies didn't inflate the shit out of everything.

That P90 Goldtop is cheaper than usual though.

When I worked in a guitar store in the early 80's, I took a pre-CBS p-base in on trade for about $300.  I'm sorry I ever sold that bass. 

I want that goldtop ...

I let a buddy stay with me during his divorce in the mid90s, right about as I was giving up on music. He picked up a mint condition, in case, with tags, Gibson Grabber bass, I forget the year, 63 maybe. For $150 at a yard sale in Mass. He didn't play, just thought he might some day. Even though I opened my doors to him and offered him $500 (all I had, I was warshin' dishes), he wouldn't part with it. Hell, I told him I'd give him my custom ESP plus cash, so he could still pick up the bass, he refused.

That guy was a dick, I'm friends with his ex-wife now.

As far as vintage goes, who cares. If it plays great, I don't care when it was made or what it looks like, really. People should stop watching antiques roadshow.

You have a steady now right?  Just want to make sure dick still isn't involved... ;)

My latest blog post actually has a recording in it. Feedback welcome, tho of course I will ignore it all. ;) It's a pretty simple little piece, and a hurried recording.

I liked the music, but no offense: Midi guitar cracks me up  :-D.  No fluidity or finger/pick dynamics. I look forward to an audio clip though.

Again, I liked the music itself. No offense.


Also, that partial capo tuning is great. I've never used it before....There's a Townsend vibe coming from my guitar now.

[edit] Something about that song strikes me as sort of....Civil War-ish (?). Y'know, like those old folks songs used in PBS specials? And if it was recorded on a real guitar, it would seem that it'd be even moreso.

Maybe it's the name "Memorial" that's making me say that, I don't know. You can call me crazy if you want :wink:

Uh, the blog post has an actual recording. Did you miss that? There should be a little flash player embedded in the post, and you can click on Play and hear the real thing. The whole point was to replace the crappy MIDI. Go forth, and check again! ;)

I wrote the song on Memorial Day quite a long time ago, and yeah, it does have a bit of that old-school sound to it.

Ah, I see it now. Beautiful, man :)

Much different with the new tempo as well. Only at the slower pace did it take on that 19th century feel. Do you have a recorded version at the MIDI pace too?

No, I'm lucky to have this recording of it. I think it was originally written somewhere halfway between the two tempos.

Hey, since you have the tab and a reference recording, you can record it yourself, any tempo you like! I'll post the cover on the blog if you do it. :) Think you can do a shredder version?

Heh. Probably not. I'm a bit of slowhand...With a clanky Fender to boot. I'm sure someone here could though.

I did try messing with that tab last night on my acoustic actually, but ended up getting lost in the possibilities of that capo tuning. I never learned your song, but I did come up with two little things of my own.

A little explanation on "slowhand": I'm lefthanded, but I learned how to play righthanded. It's been 15 years since then, so I doubt I'll ever correct that mistake. In some ways, it may aid me, but my right hand technique, quick fingerpicking especially, isn't all that great. I doubt I could play your song with the same ease as you....And seriously doubt that I could shred it!

I love the loud, racuous, sound of electric guitars and all that, but I've never been much of a shredder. I can if I put my mind to it, I guess, but I'm more from the Neil Young or Richard Thompson school of shredders -- Those who play loud, but try to be as expressive with as little notes as possible ;).

That partial capoing style was taught to me by Don Conoscenti  -- http://www.donconoscenti.com/ -- and I use it a lot. Basically, what it does is make an open strum give you the same intervals as a DADGAD tuning, only up one step. But you can use standard tuning chord shapes above it, to either meld with the modal sound, or if you barre or pluck carefully, come back in with a standard diatonic or chromatic sort of vibe.

I like it because it leads to a lot of really cool open fingerings. Just taking your current standard tuning pieces and playing them in it will open up your ears to some cool modal stuff, without putting you as far afield as actually going to a total alternate tuning.

If you feel adventurous, try moving the capo to 4th fret. If you have a second capo, you can also put it on first wherever you like, then capo with the partial two frets above it.

If you feel totally adventurous and are comfy in DADGAD, tune to DADGAD first, THEN use the partial capo. It's yet another world.

Cool thanks for the tips. I'm going to play around with this for awhile now. I can't believe I've ignored the capo all this time!

DADGAD was the first alternate tuning I ever experimented with I think, but since I started playing with DGDGA#D a few years ago, I've become less comfortable and adventurous with the former. The partial capo sounds great though (while DGDGA#D with partial capoing sounds like shit....So far at least).

Well, yeah... for one, you are losing one note out of the harmony since you have those two octave pairs on your low strings. For another, it's effectively DAEAA#D, which is strange. On the 3rd fret you would get more A#s at least (I'd write it as D-Bb-F-Bb-Bb-D, and now you're in Bb major...) Kinda plain.

What sort of stuff do you play in that tuning? It's like Gm power chord central.

Crap. I just had a whole bunch written out, but my browser crashed.

I'd offer a few recordings, by my mics suck. The songs that I have been writing lately are being jotted down on a memo recorder. It doesn't make for quality listening.

Anyways....It varies on what I play. The tuning lends itself to a lot of droning and minor sounds, so I do that a lot. There's sort of a Morrocan/Gypsy feel to my leads (Sorry for the non technical terms. Most of my music training has been intuitive and guitar/fretboard pattern oriented). I already have a liking for that Spanish/Surf/Phrygian? sound in standard tuning, so all of that rubs off here as well.

I also alternate between a tuning with the low D dropped to an even lower C.

Sometimes I'll full capo at the second fret for A minor and play slide (it doesn't sound anything like blues slide though).

Over time, I've stumbled into various chord fingerings and areas that have expanded it's use beyond droning leads. Some of the rhythms I'll strum about on my acoustic just sound like normal folkish or pop songs.

I still play in standard tuning more often than not though...And in that respect, I'm pretty traditional. A little mixo/penta based Rock as well as surf and spaghetti western-ish stuff. Alternate tunings are always an adventure though....Not knowing what the hell I'm exactly doing with them is half the fun ;)

Bah, I'm crappy at acoustic or I'd give it a shot. Sounds great though (!), wish I could play like that! I'm working some fingerpicking techniques but I get frustrated pretty easily by them.

And to make matters worse, I'm a capotard. I've never used one. And a bit of a tabtard, so even if I wanted to put up a version of it (that'd be a cool exercise as I need to record more!), it'd take me forever to transcribe the notation to something I could use.

The only open tuning I've used, and this only in the last month, has been DADF#AD for my slide playing. I've got one nice tune in the works with that tuning, but without my old writing partner I'm super lazy about progressing things beyond the raw ideas phase. I've got a few dozen song ideas mapped out without any structure ;) I used to write with my singer, I'd pull out the main ideas and as he developed lyrics, they gained structure.

I've put this one piece up before, it's my spanishy jam (http://home.twcny.rr.com/iamthey/spanish_jam.mp3). Recording quality sucks, because it's through some crappy shareware, and it was a one-off, just jotting an idea down. I want to get a little hard disk recorder for ideas, because using the pc (well, MY pc) is onerous for that kind of thing. I was practicing fingerpicking patterns a couple years ago and laid the first (barely audible for a lot of it) track down. While listening to playback, I was playing the second track, so before the first track was up, I rewound it and laid the second track over it, never went back to fix it up or do an alternate take...but it's all I've got on my work pc besides some crappy shred piece. I don't even know why I'm posting this after Raph posted that nice piece :P

edit: That was on my crappy old electric guitar, I had the EQ and effects set to make it kinda sound like a nylon string acoustic ;)

Hmm, I should put up a produced track, if you like that one so much!

Your spanishy piece sounded good, but I couldn't really hear the backing track, only the lead line. :(

What notation do you use if not tab? Just chord shapes? I notate a lot of pieces first pass with chord shapes like this:

Memorial would go something like...

partial capo at 2nd fret as advised (note the tablature on the site is already capoed at 2nd fret, then partial capoed at 4th fret, so don't let that mess you up).

now, pretending that the partial capo is the nut, your chord forms are:

xxx2x2  (e.g., open strings on the x's, holding the highest string and the string two strings lower at 2 frets above the partial capo)
x2xx2x
x4x2xx
xx2xxx
3xxxx3
2xxxxx
0xxxx0
xxx23x

that should get you the main riff. Obviously, most of those x's are strings that are actually played.

I generally record using a A-T condenser mic in front, a cardioid pointed at the 12th fret or at the amp, plus the pickup running direct, all running into my 4-track (which has a 6 track mixer on it); from there into the Audigy card, into ACID usually. I also have a compressor/limiter I just about never use (it seems so NOISY!). ACID is just very handy for messing about.

My pickup in my main acoustic (which is what you heard in the recording) sucks though. I think that recording is just the mic open air.

Besides my main acoustic (a Blueridge with a neck like a baseball bat, the way I like it) I also have a Baby Taylor, a Mike Kelly mandolin, a mtn dulcimer, a Gibson '62 acoustic that I use for slide, a goofy Star Wars Fernandes electric, and my grandfather's old Harmony uke. Like I said, not an electric gearhead. :)

No, I use tab...it's just that whole partial capo thing I'm not getting. I don't use capos, and I'm not sure I understand the partial capo concept. I was saying I'd have to transcribe the notation into raw tab, not considering the capo, which might make it impossible to play :P

That spanishy thing was recorded on el cheapo, direct into my asus a7n8x :P Using some shareware I don't like and don't have a manual for, heh. As I mentioned earlier, I really need a little 4 track of some kind for jotting stuff down, I haven't recorded anything in the last year or so!

I used to be a little bit of a gearhead, but it was all stuff that I got very cheaply. I had one of those first gen ART DSPs, but other than that I had about six stomp boxes (ProCo Rat distortion was my favorite, I was into metal in the 80s). My favorite rack gear was a Time Machine or summat, a great 70s echo/reverb unit that was capable of some truly odd stuff, got that one in a deal from a band that was hanging it up (their whole PA system for $1k!). I was playing a pearl BC Rich Bich, a knockoff V, knockoff Strat, a Martin Acoustic (man I wish I still had that), various cheapo guitars for throwing around, and my Peavey Bass. Laney full stack (head + 8x12 loaded with nice celestions) for guitar and an ancient amp (forget the name) and 2x15 for bass.

My current rig is also piecemeal: my SG, as mentioned, Alvarez Jumbo Acoustic, my el cheapo Cort for slide, and my ESP custom bass. Up until this year I only had my bass and el cheapo. A couple years ago I bought a Boss GT6, which is nice enough. I've not found a real comfortable sound on it yet, though, but it's fine for practice. I'm playing guitar through part of my bass rig. When my old band split and certain people absconded with much of the gear (meh, fuckers, it's happened many times to me), a bunch of locals who knew me back when helped me get my shit together, I got a crappy Peavey amp (Mark III Centurion) that I'm putting into a Dean Markley 1x15 cab loaded with a 400W EV full range 15". That's what I'm playing guitar through now, I also have an Ampeg 8x10" that I'm not using because it's a bit much for practice ;) Also, the Mark III doesn't drive it well, need the head for that unit some day, it's sweet. Got the head, the 1x15 and the 8x10 for $200. Got a ubiquitous shure sm57 laying around somewhere, I run that through the GT6 into headphones when I'm in the mood. The list is rounded out by an old beater drumset, it's beat to hell and back, really needs new heads but I hate dropping any money on it. I replaced the footpedal because I broke the cheap old one ;)

Thinking about getting a Fender Twin at some point, but the current setup cuts the mustard ok for just messing around.

/ramble

See, the whole last paragraph just about lost me entirely. :)

I have a Boss ME-50 effects pedal unit, and a Genz-Benz acoustic amp (Shenandoah Jr). That ends my lengthy list of amplified gear.

Oh, and I do have a bass, I forgot to list that, it's a Washburn.

The tab that is there is written as if the capo is not there at all. So if you follow the tab straight, you'll learn the piece in standard tuning. But I bet it'll be a bitch. :) At the very least, capo normally at 2nd fret, or you'll have to try to play the whole thing out of position.

The partial capo concept... well, a regular capo just moves the tuning of the guitar up by as many half-steps as you want depending on what fret you put it on. But a partial capo is like having a third hand that just holds down a chord shape for you, and you play above that chord shape. Imagine if you were in standard tuning in the key of A, and someone held down the regular open A for you down at the 2nd fret, which you noodled aorund up the neck. Every open string you hit will be in tune, because the A is held for you down there.

The particular capoing we're discussing actually gives you an Esus4 as your "base chord" down there.

Ahh, ok, I understand how you tabbed it now. Capos are still voodoo or mob bosses in my book :P I'd probably play it a whole step low with 2=O, etc. But I can see how the capo is superior in a lot of situations because you can play in standard tuning for the rest of the neck. Just tough wrapping my head around a partial capo, I only think of them as a full bar across the fretboard.

That gear paragraph really just boils down to a few guitars, the Boss GT6 effects unit, an amp head and cabinet. Nothing fancy, I just got rambly talking about it.

I thought that this was a partial capo:

http://media.putfile.com/thumpoff

Heh, I guess you could call it that, but that's "partial" in a different sense. He's just muffling basically.

I know - I was being facetious, and using it as an excuse to post some fabulous Wooten bass. :)

[edit] Oops. Wrong thread.

I still have my first real guitar that I saved my money from detasiling corn and doing odd jobs.  It is a Gibson Corvus II, still in great shape after all these years.  I'm not sure what happened to my Peavey Decade practice amp...should have gotten the Marshal 10 back in the 80's, but hey I was a rock-n-roll plowboy who dug the country/rock mix.   :-D

I'm glad I didn't add the Kahler aftermarket or Floyd Rose aftermarket tremolos system and I'm really glad I didn't get the Washburn tremolos system that the guitar shop wanted me to get, even if it didn't add any holes to my ax (heck I can't find any information on that unit...it was a big clunky system that mounted in your bridge and had all the cams in there so they didn't have to cut into your body, with a neck locker too...).

Found a pic of what the Corvus I looks like :
http://www.muc.de/~hm/music/Guitars/gibson-corvus-82973530/

Yeah, those were made when 80's guitarists considered Gibson's timeless designs, like the LP, to be out of touch (when it was actually those guitarists who were out of touch). The same thing happened to Fender to an extent as well. That was probably the last time when an average player could get a real nice vintage piece for an affordable price......Because all of the expensive guitars were Jacksons and Kramers!

Some of the ideas from back then were pretty neat though. The Corvus is both can opener AND guitar at the same time ;).[

My guitar player had a couple nice Ibanez blade guitars, a bit thinner than my SG, basic strat body shape, though. My bass is an 80s metal shape, very pointy, kinda like an explorer put through the Buzz Bunny experience. And I did play BC Richs for a while, I would still play a Warlock, they are pretty nice. But yeah, the 80s had some very weird stuff, especially the headless little box guitars.

Tremolos...blah. Everyone and their brother was using Floyd Rose floating bridges (and Jacksons and Kramers, heh), and I had such a heavy right hand (my band began as pure thrash metal, we were blistering) I'd fuck up everyone's guitar when I played it :P I hated those things, probably formed my anti-tremolo bias I still have. First thing I'd do with a new guitar is take off the bar if it had one. Love my SG with just a simple fixed bridge, it's perfect.

good stuff here for you Sky

http://www.godofguitar.com/poses.htm

Nice thread.

I'll be buying my first guitar tommorow. Not sure what one yet, will be heading down to see whats good for me and in my price range. Will be doing the equivilent of taking a mechanic along when buying a car as my guitar playing sound engineer/muscian friend is coming and will test, advise and haggle for me :)

Will also be getting a Guitarport (http://www.line6.com/guitarport/) (watch out for the dodgy music on the flash intro if at work, it blares unexpectedly) for effects and stuff. I'm into metal but my (and aforesaid music bloke) roots are in tech/dance music so its a cool crossover with an interface i understand and i like the idea of the online lessons and stuff.

Anybody here, besides me, into bluegrass or appalachian folk music?  I've been flat picking on a Martin DMX for 5 or 6 years now but aside from festivals, it's hard to find people to play with anymore. 

I saw an incredible mandolin player with a trio (guitar and fiddle) a couple weeks ago in Clinton. The guy's name escapes me, but he's a legend in the field, he was 71 or 72 and jamming like mad. Had a great and funny personality, too. Wish I could remember his name! An acquaintence of mine from the local Fender shop plays mandolin in a jam band and got on stage with that guy for a few numbers, he was phenomenal as well. Here's the site for his band, WoodenSpoon (http://www.woodenspoontheband.com/).

I got a line on another local metal jam, I had mentioned the old one I played at a few times (the first time I've played 'out' in a decade!). This one has all the usual local suspects, so I'm not real hot to get down there, especially in the winter when there is poor turnout (of musicians). There is a reason my band left this area, it's amazingly bad for creative eclectic musical folk....unless you dig a commute to jam, and I like to play a lot. I've gotten responses from a few guys I know that range from a 45 minute commute (each way), which blows for me since I want to jam at least three nights a week, to "I need $150 to plug in" (we call him HunnertFitty now) to "I only practice with the band once a week, I can learn the songs at home" Everyone is very paying-gig oriented, and I'm not in it for money at all, just to jam. Bah.

At least I'm still making (slow) progress in my own playing. It's cool when you're working on some theory and suddenly realize why you've been playing certain riffs for years. I love the feeling when something magically drops into place like that, it's pretty rare. Listening to a lot of Buddy Guy for inspiration, he's the man. Also Susan Tedeschi, she's a total badass. And Brian Setzer, but his playing fries my fragile circuits.

Awesome.  Good idea taking a knowledgeable player with you if it's your first guitar purchase, too.  :)

I also picked up a new bass (http://www.zzounds.com/item--IBAEDA900SVF) fairly recently when Musician's Friend was blowing them out at $299 including HSC.  It's not the 5'er I really wanted, but it's still a damned sweet instrument.  Super-articulate (occasionally a bit too bright) thanks to the piezos, and has the ultra-skinny/slim Ibanez bass neck.  Lightweight and very resonant -- sounds great even when played unplugged.  The distinctive looks are just icing, though they're likely the reason the bass is discontinued now.

I'm into the more catch-all "Americana", if that counts? I like a lot of old American roots and folk as well, but nothing particularly/strictly bluegrass (not to say that I don't like it....I just don't own any specific albums or play that way).

That's a shweet looking bass, Mr N! Cool beans. I did the same thing when I got my ESP custom, I had been at the Carvin store playing a very nice 5 string, but I was sold on the neck on the ESP. I do miss Hollywood, with manufacturer stores, vintage stores, and Guitar Center all in a couple blocks.

Now I need some new damn pickups for the old clunker, that's one reason I got it pretty cheap: stock passive crap pickups I always meant to replace with some Bartollini p-bass pickups.

Nice bass Mr. N.  As for the 5 string bit, I always figured that if I wanted more than 4 strings I'd play guitar.  I'm still banging away on my 1970's Fender Jazz 4 string and can't imagine going to 5.  The neck width alone makes me cry. 

I hope that you discover the joy in music that all of us in this thread find. 

I picked this bass (http://www.ibanez.com/guitars/guitar.asp?model=AGB140) on eBay for dirt cheap last week and have been using it to see if I could harness some new sounds.  It's an inexpensive bass, but put together relatively well for the cost.  If I like the sound and feel of the open body, I'll likely pick up a vintage Vox teardrop or a Gibson from the late 60's.  Now I just need to find a good guitar and I can stop buying instruments for a while... I need an excuse to build myself a new cabinet!

The Fender of the day was stupid though.  They should have made out like bandits in the 80s, but they waited too long before trying to get in on the action.  They should have gone humbucker + Floyd Rose WAY earlier, and they should have backed a dump truck, filled with money, into EVH's driveway.

Now they've got Charvel/Jackson + EVH, and it will add a different market share and, in the case of EVH, boost their sales, but they should have done that shit when he was a REALLY hot property.

No Derek Trucks love?  He is amazing.  I love Warren Haynes, but whenever I watch that newest ABB DVD, I scream at the screen, "JUST STFU AND LET TRUCKS SOLO!" everytime Warren takes a solo.

Bought myself a Yamaha RGX121Z (http://www.chamberlainmusic.com/ProductDetail.asp?ProductID=RGX121Z) in sliver, a Guitarport (which is great) and various assorted accessories and am happy so far :)

My friend got the Ibanez S520EX (http://www.ibanez.com/guitars/guitar.asp?model=S520EX) and will be putting in some EMG pickups, i get the ones in the S if they fit, and my brother took back an ESP he bought last week that turned out to be slightly damaged and upgraded to the Ibanez JEM7V. (http://www.ibanez.com/guitars/guitar.asp?model=JEM7V)

Thanks, Neb and Sky.  :) 

As for the 5-string thing, I just like the extra bit of range that they offer, though I prefer narrower neck widths in general (I started with an Iby Soundgear).  The EDA905 5-string, and to a lesser extent, my Peavey bass, have fairly narrow string spacing, so it's tolerable still - I've fiddled around with some others (Warwick 5-strings in particular) that always make me feel like I'm trying to play an aircraft carier, even with fairly long hands.


Damn, I like those Iby semi-hollows.  They've got both that and the doublecut version of it at the local shop, and I can't resist picking 'em up and doodling away for a little every time I visit.  Right now, I'm kinda hankering for a short-scale (mmm... Mustang bass reissue)  for some reason though, and am running out of space for all my instruments as it is. 

Gah.  So much gear, so little time.


Awesome -- the two or three other Yamahas I've picked around on have been nice playing axes, and the pickup swap shouldn't be a problem.  I've been really curious about the GuitarPort, but have had decent (nothing pro-quality, but it's tolerable) results simply feeding a multi-FX directly to my soundcard for recording.  I hope you dig it and keep at it -- even though I'll probably never play for anyone but myself, I get a lot of pleasure from it.

Trucks is great. We saw him with ABB in September and with his band in November. I prefer him with ABB way more, because of the interplay with Haynes and because his solo stuff is jazzier, and I barely like jazz. Both were great performances, though. I totally disagree with you about Haynes, he's an incredible guitarist and singer, too. It's one of the reasons ABB shows are so great, everyone on the stage (including the Juke Horns w/La Bamba) just kills. You can focus in on anything on stage and it's better than many bands entire output. We got the Instant Live cds (3) of the show, they hold up to the vintage ABB stuff I've got (Atlanta Pop and Fillmore). But...they've got a DVD with the new lineup? Woohoo!

After the holidays, I'm thinking of getting one of these (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/240341/). I need something for ideas, and I don't like using the mouse to move sliders :P

Prompted by a joke in the Useless Video thread, I remembered my camera has video capability. So I made a crappy improv video just to see how it'd turn out. Here it is, fuckups and all (removed video link, took it down due to MB), I'm just jamming off the cuff to test the idea. Figured it might be passingly interesting to someone, at the least you can see my nice SG :P Well, kinda.

You cut your head off.

Hey... guitar players want to see guitar and the hands playing it :)

Nice one Sky. I enjoyed watching it. I like SGs

Guitar players have heads?


<Nice improv Sky.  You're going to make me want an SG damn you!>

So my two cents.  And I have not read the full thread.  :)

Haven't posted since I haven't played seriously in a while.  Regardless...

My goal in 1994 was a Gibson _anything_.  Through great karma I got my hands in 1995 on a Gibsons ES-335 to supplement my hopelessly thick and high-action acoustic Fender FGx.  I played a lot of pop, some funk with it, wee jazz.  Had a "guitar computer" second hand for a while that allowed me to change to strat, etc.  Also had a lovely twin-chorus amp which was a jazz delight.   When I say "jazz" you must know I mean "standards" and BS, nothing original or interesting.

Ultimately, what I find myself pining for these days is a really really nice (American made) Strat AND one of these ... GODIN  (http://www.godinguitars.com/godinproductlistingp.htm).  I first encountered the Godin guitars (from Quebec no less) in a music shop in Belgium.  They are fascinating guitars.  One day, when I'm as rich as Raph I too shall have n+1 amazing guitars.  /dream

(http://www.godinguitars.com/gtrsacs.jpg)

The thing about guitars...they make a great investment if you buy quality. I'll have my SG on my deathbed, after going through another 18 pcs or so (assuming I die in my mid70s), a few more hdtvs and projectors and cars and maybe even houses.

If you like the Godin guitars but are looking for a non-classical for flat or fingerpicking, this (http://www.tacomaguitars.com/products/search.php?partno=0381100721) isn't a bad alternative.  As a resonant guitar for onstage or recording, Tacoma makes a very decent guitar for the money.  Think of it as a budget alternative for the non-nylon crowd.

I actually own a Tacoma acoustic and bought it to ease my urge to own a Martin. I'm very pleased with the quality and sound of the instrument for the price.

Thought it'd be cool to post some guitar vids

Otis Rush (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1u18IFzvbA) (gotta love that crowd)

If you didn't know, he played upside down (Low E on the Bottom, High E on Top).

Jeff Beck - Brush with the Blues (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKVr6CZg4HQ&search=jeff%20beck) (aka How to really use a vibrato bar...And a guitar for that matter)

And just for a laugh: Sun Ra (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SsBtfuSDxw&search=sun%20ra)

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=guitars+suck

3 vids showing clips of guitarists doing tricks and other virtuoso type stuff. Bumblefoot, Rusty Cooley,  Shawn Lane, Jimi, Buckethead,  Satch, Vai, the usual lot. The original is the best one i think, although theres some cool accoustic stuff on No. 3.

Oh man, I loves me some Otis Rush. There's the real deal. Almost all I listen to these days are the old-timers. Nice little arpeggios in there, so much feeling. I wish I could slow down and phrase more like that, I always end up playing more like Johnny Winter... And man, can that cat SWEAT!

Jeff Beck is a great guitarist, but his performances somehow are always lacking, imo. I guess I'm just a bit too into traditional blues? I dunno, I definitely like his playing, but not his style, or something. I'm not a fan of the whammy bar or tapping. He's also kind of a dick.

Guitars Suck 3...the 12-string stuff was decent. The rest of it was pretty much shitty masturbation. Great technique, shitty music. Exhibit A in why I hate drum machines, at the very least. Reminds me of when I was 16 and too young to know any better.

My background is drum and bass/hard techno music, as with the musician friends I know (heh, we end up playing highly repetative, very heavy rhythm without even realising it when jamming but im gradually slowing my head down to some different timings). All that tech and drum machine business sounds pretty good when done right and with the appropiate kit, virtual drummers have come a long way since an 808. The Guitars Suck vids are admittedly a complete wankfest though, and theres a couple of examples of why shredding a million notes a minute is pointless if none of the million notes actually go together, but I love that shit.

Bah computerized drums. I used them extensively in the studio and in college (I was a studio engineering dual majored with improvisational performance). But it's a matter of taste, when I was younger I dug it and electronica (which wasn't electronica then...). I used to use very early generation digital gear and echo boxes to create what can be done real easy with modern effects. It was fun stuff, but almost totally lacking in emotion.

Now I have my own (cheap, crappy) drum kit and I'm dying to buy a house so I can set them up and record rhythym tracks to play over.

My friend uses the Steinberg Virtual Instrument plugins for the backing tracks, mainly the bassist and drummer. They are huge sample librarys basically (50gb install or something), although as he's a sound engie/musician type he can actually combine the digital recording/logic pro/instrument plugins and real instrument into something workable and actually has the ability to lay down something structured enough to play over. There's way too much of a learning curve for me to use unfortunatly.

Hillybilly Yngwie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q8N-HDUvvg&search=60%27s%20country)

Sister Rossetta Sharpe (http://youtube.com/watch?v=4xzr_GBa8qk&search=rosetta%20tharpe) rocking gospel on a White SG

More upside down crazyness. This time from Albert King (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4xhS3dPTdk&search=albert%20king)

I understand, I think. I think it's a matter of his songwriting style, and not necessarily his playing?

Anyways, it's not like I'm a big fan or anything, but I still dig the guy if only because he's so innovative when it comes to technique. Nobody really sounded like that or got those kind of noises out of an electric guitar until he came along.

He might be better off if he didn't even try to resemble blues or rock at all though...Like in this clip: Link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3Vktv_yB7s&search=jeff%20beck)

The other cool thing about him is that he's probably the only person in the world who's maintained a Ziggy Stardust haircut for 30 years.

Just saw this (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/peripherals/lightsnake-smart-audio-cable-169650.php) at Gizmodo.  Quite possibly the coolest thing for guitar I've seen in a long time.

Pretty cool. Not that expensive either ($40).

That's very cool.  It reminds me that I need to record more... except that recording always reminds me of those little bad habits that I can so easily hide with effects pedals.

That looks cool. I've been shopping for a HD recorder for a while, though, because I tend to lose ideas in the time it takes my pc to boot up and run a cable to it  :| Also, mouse != faders, I hate the mouse interface for recording.

I've learned HD recorders are a gaggle of compromise. Either it's too feature-limited or it's a total goddamned studio.

At the least I want four simultaneous mic/line inputs (for drums, snare/bass/2 ambient), the ability to upload discreet tracks to the pc (cheap models export the whole bundle), decent onboard faders, aux for punch-ins, stuff I thought was pretty basic, heh.

Believe it or not, a Roland drum sample disc and a sampler are a pretty good alternative. The disc I have has about 30 different kits on it (which you can mix and match, etc.). You'd be missing actual drumming dynamics, of course, but it's still a lot more realistic than the average drum machine.

/rant

So is it me or is the typical guitar player flat out ignorant of "technical" things?

And when I say technical, I use that term lightly. I'm not talking about mods or amp maintainance. Just little things. Like adjusting intonation or getting their EQ settings right. Hell, I know plenty of people who'd consider even a string change some kind of big job....And then when they do happen to change strings, they can't even do that right either (You know, when they just wind the string all the way into the post, instead of giving it slack? Or when they let 8 inches of wire swing around on their headstock?).

Also, I have a neighbor who's probably been playing for 40 years, and he barely changes his strings.....And when he does, he tries to salvage the old ones by boiling them. I'll tell him: "Dude, I've got a gazillion packs at home. Take one," but then he acts like that's some big deal.

I don't know what's that's all about.

Secondly: Tuning. More often than not the sound coming out people's guitars is out of tune and out of pitch. Yet, they go about their happy way, completely oblivious that they sound like complete shit (regardless of what the song is, or if they have skills).

Thirdly: Tone/Timbre/etc. I may be a little picky here, but again, I'm not talking about anything silly, like Ash vs Mahogany or Rosewood vs Maple. Just simple things.

For example, I've got a friend, who for the life of me, can't distinguish between a humbucker and a single coil sound. Apparantly, all guitars are the same to him, besides looks. The same goes for amps -- There's just clean and distorted in his world. This is a guy, who, for some reason, makes (rather, has made) money playing music.

/rant off

I've noticed it, but what other people do has never really bothered me - if the situation permits, I usually offer to do a setup for them.  The combination of fear and ignorance is what keeps 'guitar techs' in business doing maintenance and setups, despite the ready availability of the Internet and cheap tools.  One of the advantages to buying and modding up cheap gear or building from kits is that you have no fear when it comes time to take the things apart, and can then apply that experience elsewhere.

I keep waiting for one of the guys with strings hanging out all over the place to stab someone in the eye.

Being an acoustic player, I just learned how to adjust intonation on an electric two weeks ago.  :|

I also have no idea what the tonal difference between a single coil and a humbucker is. :)

I can tell the difference between spruce and koa tops, though.

Anyway, that's all about to change. I just inherited a '61 Gibson Melody Maker. Despite being in a basement for thirty years, it's in great shape. The repair guy at the local shop looked at it, and sent it back, saying "you can do everything that needs done to it."

It sounds great too. I can tell the tonal difference between it and the cheapo Fernandes electric I have.

The repair prognosis on the 112-year-old banjo (not a typo -- SS Stewart, 1894), however, was a bit dicier. Looks like it'll be maybe $175 and a few weeks to get it back into shape.

I wouldnt have a "guy at the local repair shop" working on a 112 year old musical instrument. I would look for a professional antique restoration company, so as to ensure the greatest historical and therefore potential monetary value is retained. Maybe thats just me though.

Singles vary from each other more than humbuckers do, but generally speaking, they're more bright and crisp (and noisy). Humbuckers offer higher gain and output, produce more sustain, but lack the high end dynamics of a single coil. For clean, non distorted playing, humbuckers are more mellow and lack the chime that a single coil produces. Both are great in their own way though.

More than likely, that Melody Maker you have has P-90 pickups. These are single coils, but they're more compressed, hot, and midrangey than the average Fender design.

Fucking capitalists. I agree with you about the professional restoration, but from a player's viewpoint.

I've traditionally played Strat knockoffs, but since I got my Gibson SG, I'm a total convert. Well, probably not total, because my Strat knockoffs were cheap, playing with some quality single coils would probably mitigate that a lot. I am hooked on the 61 reissue's thin wide neck, though. Bendy bendy bendy, big chunky Albert King bends.

Went to a great blues jam last night, hosted by my buddy Jim Wolf (http://www.myspace.com/jimmywolf). He's an amazing guitar player, he started playing a few years before I did, but kept with it professionally all through (and didn't make a major genre switch halfway along, heh). My girlfriend kept kicking me under the table to play, because I was better than a lot of the guys up there, but I'm simply not that comfortable playing blues yet. I don't want to halfass things, and my playing has been progressing well, so it's just a matter of time until things gel.

Now I just have to learn some actual blues songs (opposed to jams) :P I've got much of "All Your Love" (Mayall's version w/EC), "Since I've Been Loving You" (Zep, got that one pretty cold but requires a keyboardist), a decent chunk of "Hideaway" (Freddie King),  "Born Under a Bad Sign" (Albert King), a couple EC tunes off "From the Cradle". I can play pretty much anything with a standard progression without much in the way of tricky signature passages, but of course I enjoy playing songs with those passages to tie together extended jamming to avoid the dreaded jamband syndrome (beating the same three chords to death). I just have a hard time focusing on learning a song without going off constantly :) Luckily, that'll pay off as I learn some tunes, because I love to play around with arrangements and change the way I play songs to keep it interesting.

Best part of the jam last night was when there was an ensemble onstage and this old guy (had to be in his 70s) comes out of nowhere, walking through the crowd, playing trombone. He was really wailing on it, too. Great stuff. If I ever form another band, it'll be goddamned huge, horns, keys, I love varied instrumentation.

Sounds fun, man.

I haven't made a conscious effort for blues in quite some time, but lately I've been getting better at slide (mainly open E tuning). Tried to learn some Robert Johnson tunes as well, but that ain't happenin'! So I'm learning Keith riffs instead  :lol:.

Robert Johnson seems a lot more complex than he is, but it's sure not easy. The seperate bass line is killing me, it's the reason I'll never be a drummer. I've been working on acoustic blues a bit lately, but it's slow going and hard to stick with when I'm still at such a beginner level (imo) compared to my skill at other styles.

I'm working some slide, too. Open G stuff "In My Time of Dying" was the first slide tune I learned a couple years ago, now I'm working on some Muddy stuff like "Can't Be Satisfied" (actually the Library of Congress version "I Be's Troubled").

My latest cd binge:

T-Bone Walker - Blues Masters
Sonny Boy Williamson II - King Biscuit Time
Muddy Waters - Folk Singer (with Willie Dixon and Buddy Guy)
Elmore James - King of the Slide Guitar (3cd)
Paul Butterfield - Paul Butterfield Blues Band
Paul Butterfield - East West
Little Walter - His Best (my favorite harp player)
Otis Rush - The Essential Otis Rush
Alan Lomax - Deep River of Song (Alan and his dad among a few others did the Library of Congress field recordings, some great stuff from varied artists, some of the most essential listening you can do for blues imo, the /real/ stuff, non-commercial)

Well, I've got the general idea and can do some of those songs "my" way, I guess.  8-) I know the notes, but it's his attack and sense of rhythm. It's sketchy. It's amazing that he sang the way he did against this stuff.

Plus, combining slide with all of that finger picking isn't doing me any favors. I'm a lefty, but I play righty, so I'm a little slow for this kind of thing (same goes for classical).

Yeah, I can't really bring slide into it because I play on my middle finger :( It's just how I learned, originally (up until a couple months ago) I played slide with a bic lighter that I pressed down with my middle finger.

And singing while playing anything is pretty much out for me, still. I'm working on it, and I've been having fun harmonizing...but when the rhythms start to get too independent of each other, sayanora to one of them :)

Im still having great fun with my guitars. Been at it since Xmas now, and pick up the guitar daily so looks like its here to stay.

I still havent got a clue about scales, have trouble knowing what key im playing in and can barely remember a chord, but can now getting hang of play some powerchords, play can jam rhythm along with mate, palm mute, pinch harmonics, tune the guitar down, as well as play some nice spanish melody stuff when the chicks are round, and yeh blimey, to think ive missed out on such a good fannymagnet for all these years.....

Scales....Well...

I've been playing for about 16 years, and I'm no authority on scales either (though I do know some things intuitively i.e. or as a result of learning riffs and whatnot over the years). My advice is just learn the songs and musicians you've been dying to learn, get at least a rudimentary understanding of rhythm (That's the real bane of new musicians. Not scales), how to recognize chords and keys a song's in, learn riffs and patterns (if not scales), and let it go from there.

There are more musicians (especially guitar players) who don't know a lot about theory than those who do. You're not alone.

Having played professionally for years I can honestly admit that while I know how to set up my instrument, I often pay people to do it for me.  They are often more efficient and can sometimes bring new ideas to the table. 

As for the rest, there are many people out there that can play an instrument... very few of them would I consider musicians.  Too many young musicians focus far too much energy on becoming technical gurus and lose sight of the purpose of music. 

That's definitely true. There was one young guy at that open mic wednesday that was a decent player, but he kept plugging in these stock riffs rather than play melodies along with the band. It was kind of sad, really. But it was a good point to explain to my girlfriend that that was what I was trying to work out of my playing before I look to form a band. Riffs should be there to support the melodic playing, not just to wank off.

The worst part was he was playing a SRV strat and half of his band's covers used very recognizable SRV licks. It's like "Oh, they're doing the intro to Pride & Joy...no it's an original that is bland and stock beyond the SRV lick." Bah.

Actually, I'm starting to feel pretty comfortable in the blues, when a few more things become automatic, a couple scales (major pentatonic for instance, I always have to think to play in that mode because I've played minor and blues pentatonic for almost twenty years) and some chord variations (working on 7th variations has really enhanced my blues, but now I have to fit them with my scales!). I don't like to think about the technical stuff when I'm playing, I like to be very playful with the melodies and rhythms. Rhythms are really my strong point, I love playing around the beat and doing interesting attacks, a leftover from my metal days.

It's funny learning basically the opposite way I did originally. Back then, I practiced for hours every day with my band, at least two hours a day, often all day long writing sessions. But I rarely had time to practice alone, because it was either playing or partying. Now I never get time to jam with a band to work things out :) There were a couple tracks on the last...Guitar One, I think...guitar mag cd that are nice. They are basically cheesy backing tracks, a C shuffle and Am slow blues (which I totally crush, heh, I kerpwn minor keys).

/ramble

Er, the guitar shop is Buffalo Brothers (http://www.buffalobrosguitars.com/) and the repair guy is a banjo specialist who regularly works on vintage instruments. :) Give me some credit...!

Tho, fwiw, finding 100-year old banjos isn't that uncommon. There were several there for sale in the store. It's not like finding a 100 year old guitar.

Yeah, I've noticed that. Same goes for most folk instruments (dulcimers, etc). A lot of them seem to sell for pretty cheap.

So yesterday I cleaned and restrung my grandfather's 1950's Harmony ukulele.  It's a baritone, so it's tuned like a guitar's 4 high strings. It came out rather gorgeous looking -- I never expected that underneath the dust. Sounds quite nice.

There doesn't seem to be a way to date these more accurately than by decade. I'm going off the logo styling...

I posted a pic of the uke and also a recording. Wow, the tone on that thing, for a uke! Sounds like a classical guitar.

http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/05/14/may/

Watch out, Tiny Tim!

Sounds like a cool thing to have around actually.

When he's not snapping necks, he's just your average, humble "blues man" (http://www.stevenseagal.com/music/index.shtml).

Hey, the guitar thread.

I think I'm breaking down and taking lessons for a while. I'm signed up for some basic blues harmonica lessons from a local cat (through our Art&Community Center), and went to see him play the other night. The guy he was with did some great acoustic blues guitar, and he gives lessons (through another Music & Art Center), so I figured wth. I'm also getting to the networking phase where I need to integrate into the local blues scene, this should help a lot because he has a studio as well.

He asked if SRV got me into blues, I chuckled and started listing my listening, I listen mostly to pre-1970 stuff, heavy on the 20s-50s. SRV is cool, but I'm not too interested in sounding like him, more like Big Bill Broonzy style. Should be good times as I finally figure out what chords I'm playing (some of them I can't quite pin down), and re-learn some theory I've forgotten.

Also, something to do on Tuesday night, heh.

The sad part is....I've heard worse.

Looking at getting a baritone ukulele myself, just for a bit of fun.

I was going to link Jake Shimabukuro but your article about him on your website comes up on page 1 of google searches for him, so i guess you know ....

Here's a vid of his thats not the Ukulele Gently Weeps one.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8395698617458049023&q=ukulele

Strange article (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/artsentertainment/2003012147_seagal25.html) here.


I gotta admit though. I don't really dislike him. Out for Justice is one of my favorite comedies.


[edit]

What's pretty kickass though is that he owns Jimi's Jazzmaster. That's even cooler than Jimi's white strat imo, since it's the first Fender guitar Hendrix was gigging with.

The only video of it in action, I think (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmRXikp8GAo&search=jimi%20hendrix). Very cool.

Right after he answers some of the preceeding questions as if he was the soul of jimi hendrix reborn.

Might as well show off my new guitar. Im a big fan of Lamb of God and for ages I've wondered what guitars Willie uses, Ive always seen the ones with the sunburst many times. I found out exactly what it was on ebay last night;

(http://myspace-716.vo.llnwd.net/00767/61/71/767801716_m.jpg)

Its Willie Adler from Lamb of God's Framus Diablo Custom Shop (http://www.framus.de/modules/frameset/frameset.php) guitar and differs from the others they do as has a fast flame maple neck and wilkinson bridge. It was a bit battered and dirty from the tour it was used on (bloke said was relic finish, but just looks scratched and dinged to me) and willl need new strings and setting up again but I'm pleased.

That guitar looks nice, but the site doesn't likey Safari :(

Lamb of God is cool, but I'm not big on yelling guys. Love the music, though.

I actually got my non-metal girlfriend into metal watching the VH-1 stuff this past week, because she's never really heard the heavy stuff with a melodic vocalist that doesn't sing in piercing registers. Unfortunately, there really isn't much actual heavy stuff like that, but she was digging Maiden, vintage Priest, etc. I'm a bad influence  :evil:

I hate to admit it, but I just recently discovered the first two Iron Maiden albums. Bruce Dickinson's amazing and all, but I can only take him in small doses. Paul Di'Anno rocks! And the sound of Maiden in that stage was tight. Very "unepic", less spacious, etc.. It's just raw and rockin'. Not at all what I expected.

Best non high pitched vocalist in metal is Glenn Danzig. He's also the best Goth and Punk vocalist as well. :)

I like all Maiden, up until Bruce quit, really. But the Dianno stuff is really great, so punky, raw and punchy. They are actually the only Maiden albums I own in cd format right now, since my blues buying interrupted backfilling my metal catalogue. Wait, I do have Live After Death.

Rime of the Ancient Mariner helped me pass 9th grade english :)

Do you know what show this clip (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eG37Mol9ms&search=iron%20maiden) is from? That's pretty a good quality and performance for an early vid.

It might be from the Early Years (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006B29Z2/qid=1148661464/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/104-5695724-7348745?s=dvd&v=glance&n=130) DVD. Not sure, I haven't watched it in a while. HIGHLY recommend grabbing it.

Posted another thing, this one with some electric in it (gasp!).

http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/11/the-sunday-poemsong-feel-the-slide/

I like the lyrics; it's really not my musical style, but it does grow on me, it's catchy. A coworker (a vintage hippy) liked it. I didn't care for it at first, but by the end of the song I liked it.

Since it's guitar update time: I'm learning to read music. Again.

Took my first lesson last tuesday and it was a real barrier not being able to read music. Spent the last week grinding the very basics of music theory, which I remember enough to know I knew it, but not enough to use it. It's been torture.

But good stuff, in the end. My knowledge expands, my chops expand, and my repertoire expands (+All Your Love - Mayall's Bluesbreakers or Otis Rush). Not sure where these lessons are going, because I'm on track for a few months worth of re-learning basic theory, which I can do alone, I think it's time to needle the guy for some style lessons in early (pre-WWII) delta blues.

Just added the first Taj Mahal album and a Mississippi John Hurt disc to the collection, both strong albums in their styles. I can't believe I didn't have that Taj album, it's great funky blues. And Hurt is a great transfer technically, the stuff sounds like it was just recorded, but it's from 1928. I love that old multiple melody solo acoustic stuff, that's where I want to go in my current phase of playing.

My Personal Update:  Still wishing I was Keith Richards. Electric, acoustic, whatever...


Also, my acoustic sucks.

Actually, it doesn't suck per se. It's just a plain jane Takamine dreadnought is all. I want a Jumbo.

Mine's a jumbo, an Alvarez. I loved it so much when I just had the Cort electric, but the SG has totally spoiled me. I played an incredible Taylor classical that was marked down to $900 from $1500, I came sooo close to buying it, I really wish I had. I've been hunting a classical for years.

Funny you mention the acoustic, I'm compiling a list of acoustic stuff to burn to give my instructor an idea of where I want to be on the acoustic. Here's the list so far:

Too Too Train Blues - Big Bill Broonzy
Brown Skin Shuffle - Big Bill Broonzy
Mistreatin' Mama Blues - Big Bill Broonzy
Catfish Blues - Buddy Guy & Junior Wells
Bukka's Jitterbug Swing - Bukka White
A Spoonful Blues - Charley Patton
Dimples In Your Jaws - Joe Lee, Boy Blue, Darnel Walker
Crawlin' King Snake - John Lee Hooker
Stagolee - Mississippi John Hurt
Rolling Stone - Muddy Waters
I Be's Troubled - Muddy Waters
Bowlegged Charlie - Otis Taylor
From 4 Until Late - Robert Johnson
Love In Vain - Robert Johnson
Rolled and Tumbled - Rosalie Hill
The Ponly Blues - Son House
Mississippi Blues - William Brown

On a scary note, I think I'm developing carpal tunnel in my left hand. Last week, I was waking up with sharp pains in my fingertips, which would carry on and off throughout the day. The past two days though I've been waking up with a sore in my bottom thumb/wrist area.

Greatest white blues lineup ever (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5H7TEIveNZY&search=rolling%20stones) (and Yoko Ono killing it, just like she did with the Beatles).

I must've missed Mike Bloomfield, Johnny Winter, Ry Cooder, Stevie Ray, Billy Gibbons, Peter Green, and that's just the start of the guitar section :P

Ok, I've never hated Yoko until now. Whoever let her and that violinist on stage needs to be kicked in the nuts, even if it was Lennon's idea. The first jam was nice, though.

Heh, I was kidding really. But when Keith, Clapton, and Lennon are in the same song, it's hard to think of another link title.

Anyways....Funny thing about Yoko is that Lennon didn't start writing cool, depressing, earthy stuff until he met her. She's a double edged sword, I guess. Another song I can think of like that is Cold Turkey (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtcUEP6goZ0&search=john%20lennon%20cold%20turkey) (too bad that's the dubbed version).

Man, I swear, Youtube has everything...

Gatemouth on a Jag (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkJkBorWQTM&mode=suggested&search=ry%20cooder)

More swingin' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szKnP17bR4Y&mode=suggested&search=ry%20cooder). So much style man.

Heh, you're hurting my productivity, man.

The King (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4xhS3dPTdk&search=albert%20king)

The more of this stuff I watch, the more I think I'm going to cancel my guitar lessons. This instructor played some decent acoustic blues and has really gotten me on the right track for practicing better, but he keeps pushing me into jazz, which I hate. So far every decent instructor I've met is way too into jazz, and argues with me when I say blues shouldn't be tainted by jazz. Country delta blooze forever (with some Chicago spice), bitches!

I just need to practice more, is all. Screw these jazztards.

Yeah, that one's great. Seen it (and watching it again now).

That Gatemouth vid says otherwise. Though to be fair, that's New Orleans jazz. More sweaty, less smooth :)

I don't care for it.

Matt Murphy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDi9XdDamE8), all vintage-like.
My man Buddy Guy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5VmOPrmviA). Love his vocals and guitar style, very distinctive. Great saxomaphone.
Great video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Grfp3iJ6czg) of T-Bone Walker with Willie Dixon, Memphis Slim and others. Dig those keys!

Thank you for that.   :heart:

Here's a fun guitarist in a quite different style - Porcupine Tree's Steven Wilson:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxeANJx8uho

And because he was mentioned... Kid Rock (skip ahead 3 mins of crap til Billy Gibbons):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJSi7vbNznA

Cancelled my lessons. As I said, screw jazztards. I just want to play blues, maybe some rock.

Just need to practice more, in the non-comfort zone. My hand aches from working on chord forms. I actually considered plastic surgery to slim down my fingertips (they are very wide). Only for a split-second, but the thought was there (damn you A chord form high on the neck!). I always hated physical limitations when I was college, I was at the point on the bass where I was pushing my physical limitations on how fast I could play with my fingers. I really miss the times I had 8 or more hours a day to practice and sit at the top of my game. It just sucks knowing I could be so much better than I am :)

I know exactly how you feel.  I've been listening to some studio stuff I did about 20 years ago and I can't even play my own licks.  It amazes me how much style and polish you get from just playing out all the time. 

As for the lessons, I think it's a good call.  There are so few instructors out there willing to teach what the student wants to learn that it's often a lost cause.  Use the cash you would have spent on lessons on cds instead.  With your level of self-discipline, you'll do well.

I lolled. I have almost no self-discipline. That's why I started taking lessons.

I did quickly see several things to work on, chord vocab using the CAGED system was one. Of course, the book he wanted me to work out of was on my amazon wishlist for about two years  (Fretboard Logic, it's a great book and the source of my aching hand the other night), so it's not like it was some groundbreaking idea. Same with the fingerpicking acoustic blues, he was showing me stuff out of a book I already had.

So it's really that I just need to practice more :)

You had me fooled.  You're always talking about playing and trying new things here.  I tend to fall back into old patters and rarely stretch myself musically anymore.  That's where my comment came from.  You seem much more self-disciplined than I do musically. 

My latest stretch has been playing scales.  I've basically gone back to basics and took a look at some commonly used scales and reviewed my pentatonics.  I'm hoping that if I get these things ingrained in my head again, that I'll be able to vamp more around basic keys.  Sadly after about 20-30 mins, I just slam on a few cd's and start playing along.   

Just an update. Working with a couple books right now and thought I'd pass them along, as they are excellent.

Fretboard Logic (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0962477060/sr=8-2/qid=1151000799/ref=pd_bbs_2/104-5695724-7348745?%5Fencoding=UTF8) - I mentioned this one above. Nice way to put together the guitar's fretboard mentally. CAGED system, which I pretty much used subconsciously already. But studying it and putting it together with theory is cool. I just never thought about the fact I had been using the C form, and I didn't really use the G form much, but the C, A and D I had been using pretty extensively. The author then uses that simple system to build out chords anywhere on the neck spontaneously and then as a platform to learn scales and arpeggios. Good stuff.

Fretboard Workbook (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0634049011/ref=pd_bxgy_text_b/104-5695724-7348745?%5Fencoding=UTF8) - Similar to the above, by Musician's Institute Press. Same idea, substituting numbers 1-5 for C-D.

Berklee's Guitar Series v1 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0793545110/sr=1-2/qid=1151000954/ref=pd_bbs_2/104-5695724-7348745?%5Fencoding=UTF8&s=books) - The Beast. Guitar exercises, all in notation (I'm a recovering tabtard).

Mostly trying to learn notation and master the fretboard in all positions at this point. Funny how boring yet exciting something can be. Also working some repertoire development, open G slide on "Can't Be Satisfied" (http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=50:y9d7yz7jxpmb~T).

Posted another track off the CD, an acoustic instrumental piece.

http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/08/20/the-sunday-song-after-the-flood/

That was nice. Some of the arpeggios were a bit labored, but I really liked the little slides at the end of phrases.

Speaking of acoustic stuff, I'm very tempted to buy a Baby Taylor after playing one a couple weeks ago. I could've used one out on Monhegan Island last week. I missed out on a classic Taylor that was only $900, really bummed me out. To wrap up gear news, I'm also considering a Pignose amp.

My playing's been a bit stalled lately, but I've been working on a version of Catfish Blues I can actually sing, so it has to be artfully sparse because I can't play and sing at the same time. I throw in a lot of fills and I'm doing one line in unison with the guitar, which actually sounds very Hendrixy. I wish digital hard disk recorder tech would catch up to what I want. Right now it seems everything is mixed onboard at the low end or just a front end for the pc software at the high end. I want something totally integrated, so I can record without the pc on but mix on the pc. Ah, well. Maybe next year.

I really do enjoy my Baby, though I don't play it hardly at all these days given that it sits at home and my main guitar is equally within reach. I tried a lot of travel guitars, and it was literally the only one with anything resembling a real tone. It also sounds better to the audience than it does to you, I've found.

Why can't you sing and play at the same time? Maybe you need to back up, play some simpler stuff and get the simultaneous singing and playing down a bit better, then work the guitar part complexity back up.

I dunno, I've chalked it up to coordination difficulties. It's not so much I can't sing and play simultaneously as I can't do differing melodies/rhythms. Thus doing the unison thing with Catfish. I am trying some simple chording, it's no problem at all to strum chords as long as there isn't too much going on under a lyric. But something as simple as a shuffle blues? Not happening. I have a version of Kind Hearted Woman Blues I've been doing, based on George Thorogood's slide version (it's quite nice) with a shuffle inserted in a middle verse ("Ain't but one thing that make Mr. Johnson drink...."). I can do nice slide chording and fills but the shuffle defeats me every time.

It's the exact thing that happens to me on the drums when I can't play a straight high-hat line (like straight 8ths) while syncopating the bass drum. It's like the right hand and foot are connected or something.

Both problems bug the hell out of me.

Hmm. All I can think of is to try some basic rhythm sightreading exercises.

Heritage Cherry (http://gibson.com/Products%5FEuro/GibsonElectric/Gibson%20Electric%20Guitars/SG%20Specials/SG%20%5F61%20Reissue/) sez Gibson.

Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Much cooler version of cherry than mine was (which I sold). I'd like to get another like yours one day.

Ever seen this? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ID2q35M5gk4)

Keith Moon is one of the best drummer ever. Bonham is my favorite, though. Mitch Mitchell was awesome, too. I tend to really key in on drummers, probably from playing bass for so long.

I own a dvd of that concert.  Damn I miss the Ox. 

You guys are right about Entwistle and Moon, but the real star of the show is Townsend's windmill! It's never looked better.  :-P

Seriously, I love that kind of stuff. What's with SG players (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBcZpN05_lk&search=bon%20scott) anyways? They all seem to have more "show business" savvy than the average git player.

Are you using Marschall tube amps with that SG? Cuz if you're not, you're not really playing an SG! Sorry, had to add 70s metal guitar freak to my list of strange fetishes

I worship at the altar of 70's guitar gods -- But as far as playing goes, that sound is just not me. I've had a couple of Marshalls before, but never really liked them. The amp I have now is a Fender VK, which can do the "Marshall" thing better than other Fender amps, but I use it for other reasons. Anything sounds great through it. It's versatile enough for everyone from the present day Townsend (Marshall poster boy and cabinet destroyer if there ever was one) to completely opposite players like Dick Dale and Chris Isaak to use.

I also have a Vox amp modeler, if that counts. It has Marshall Bluesbreakers, Plexis, and 80's, 90's, and 00 stack models on it. I was dialing them in from time to time when I had a Gibson to muck around with.

Or are you asking Sky? If so, then I'm gonna feel like an ass for saying all of that then. :)

Hmm. My guitar gods are all over the place. Priest, Maiden, Mercyful Fate, Zakk, Dime, Iommi over to Buddy Guy, Muddy, Albert King, Johnny Winter to Jimi, Page, Clapton, Gilmour, etc, etc. I basically like good guitars over interesting music. I'm not picky, though I'm picky in a way, which is not intended to be a pun on picking.

I'm playing a cheap old bass head a guy sold me when I moved back from CA and my guitarist decided to keep my rig. One guy sold me a nice 8x10 Ampeg cab I'm not currently using (and one 10 needs replaced) for $100. Another guy sold me an old Peavey Mark III bass head (crappy model without the graphic eq, but it's serviceable) and a 1x15 (nice Dean Markley cab) loaded with a 400W EV 15", my old favorite speaker from when I played bass. My main rig was a Peavey 2x15 with two of those in it, back in the day. Crunchy. Got the amp head and cab for $100, too.

So I'm running into a Boss GT-6 I bought but don't really know how to use properly, thence into the Peavey bass amp into the 1x15.

The sound in that clip was my default metal lead sound, something with distortion and some echo and verb. I normally use a very dry sound with just a hint of overdrive, I'm tempted to pull the GT-6 out of the loop and just use the amp's gain circuit. I'm a pretty firm believer in pulling good sound out of whatever you're plugged into. I didn't use any effects when I played bass, just an ancient Kustom guitar head (that used to be our singer's amp before we had a PA!) into the 2x15. It's mostly in the fingers and attack. I used to beat the shit out of the bass when I played, last time I played in public a couple years ago I played three songs and my fingers were literally bleeding, it was very gorey (and kinda cool, heh).

That said, I'd love to have a marshall tube stack! I'd have to sell my truck to afford it, though....I've been looking at some combo amps, a couple decent looking fenders, maybe a 4x10 super reverb. Also toying with the idea of grabbing a Pignose amp.

I would recommend the Super Reverb. The only Fender combo better than it is the VK, imho. But that's about a $1000 more and doesn't do bright and clean as well as an SR. Have you played your guitar through one already? Since you're a plug and play kind of guy, I'd think you'd be really happy with it for sure. Even with your SG, it might take a lot of volume to push it into hard overdrive, but if you like crunchy-clean, it's perfect.

There's also the Deluxe Reverb. It's more than half the wattage and half the price. It has a similar sound to an SR, but if you want it to saturate at lower volumes (like small club/garage levels), that's what it's good for.

Didn't one of you guys just say earlier in this very thread that you're "no guitar geek"?

How do you defend a statement like that after this discussion?

Stray, I was talking to both of ya. I'm no longer a guitar geek, so most of what you talked about went over my head. However, for arty lines, wicked sounds and a clean flat neck, you just can't get better than an SG. If I were to seriously pick up playing again, I would lust after the SG.

As for amps, I never managed to pony up enough for a marshall tube. You're right that it does tend to be very limited in what sounds it can make, and I did have a Fender Blackwidow amp, which had a lot of built-in toys, including chorus and flange, which were a hoot to play with.

Regrettably, I had to put the guitar down and admit defeat. I just have no musical ear and my sense of rhythm sucks. Badly. I'm the kind of dancer that makes white people think they have a some black in them because at least they aren't as bad as I am.

I know what I wrote /sounds/ guitar geeky, even when we get into some discussion of modes and stuff in the Guitar Thread (which some mod should probably split this into :P). But not really.

A guitar geek knows how to download custom GT6 sounds and hack his GT6. Fuck, a guitar geek would know how to work the stupid thing properly. I have maybe 4 tones I ever use out of 200, and I haven't done any custom tones of my own.

A guitar geek would actually care that he made mistakes in that video or maybe discuss how I overused pentatonics and maybe praise my integration of melodic minors and blues pentatonics or summat. I just play and whatever comes out is what it is :)

Basically, I don't get too hung up in technical stuff, theory or gear. I do enjoy talking about it, though, so I won't deny a bit of geekism in that respect. I'd say 'enthusiast', though ;)

Was planning on it. Gotta keep you guitar geeks somewhere I can safely ignore you  :-D

I don't know a lot about theory, but I guess I'm a guitar geek. More like a tone freak really. I'm probably better at that than I am playing. I don't wind my own pickups or anything, but I do like to tweak things to an extent. Outside of major modifications, I work on my own stuff. I can be pretty obsessive over less-than-optimal guitar setups, if the pickups are 1 cm too high, or lame amplifier speakers, and fix them accordingly. I can operate a GT6, but I'm more geeky in an analog kind of way. I tend to not like digital stuff.

I used to be into that stuff when I had a full studio at my disposal. I guess it's a whole shift in my perspective since I got back into playing.

I got real lucky when I bought the SG, the shop's setup guy was there and had just finished setting it up (and several others). He walked me through stuff, watched how I played, he was a great help assisting me. He got a kick out of how I insisted on playing about 40 guitars before I'd plug any in. I had it narrowed to the SG and a nice little strat before I ever plugged them in, because I wanted a sweet fretboard.

I might have to pull out the 8x10 this weekend and see if I can rig it up to play through 2 of them for a practice cab ;)

Ah, here's another cool SG vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUHz0i8_ziA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUHz0i8_ziA)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-twUOi1CM0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjYOXcWz_Uk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkbMd3Bygzs - nice bonus, Geez is playing a Ricky bass. I had a chance to borrow one of those when my old bass got stolen, they're such great bass guitars (though they do lack some frets up top)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Abc2WoORw54 - Not sure what kind of SG Frank is playing


FYI this is NOT me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkNAZcF18NA :) Ouch.

Cool vids. I was checking out some of those, but couldn't decide what to post.

I wish there were vids of the Wipers. Greg Sage is my favorite SG player by far.

...

Moving away from SG's for a sec, I was looking up examples of cool Jazzmaster players. Too many Sonic Youth and Dinosaur Jr. vids to sift from; I don't have the time. And there was hardly any video footage of Television back in the day.

I found this gem (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHpBOhwXMak) though.

Not sure if that's anybody else's kind of thing, but as far as I'm concerned, that's the shit. That's a perfect Jazzmaster song if there ever was one. Never heard of those guys before (of course, it's a 60's Lounge band from Belgium....So I guess I wouldn't).

[edit]

You mean to tell me there's another guy named "Sky" on Youtube posting faceless vids of himself playing his SG?

Basically, this seems to me like knowing all the events in the Lord of the Rings, having read the Silmarillon, knowing Aragorn's lineage and all the regions of Middle-Earth, but because you only speak a little Sindarin and no Quenya you don't consider yourself a Lord of the Rings geek.

I think I'm just the type of person who, when he/she likes something, likes it in a totally obsessive way. I have no casual hobbies or interests. I geek out on all of them.

MMO's are one of the things I often wish I could pull away from though. :D

I should clarify that I'm not mocking you on this.  I'm certainly a geek on many worse things, and there's no doubt that if you're going to geek out about something, guitar is one of the few that'll get you laid.

More SG goodness from Seattle's all-women AC/DC cover band. Chose this particular track because its got better sound than most. Its still bootleg quality.

Semi NSFW due to semi-topless guitarist

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNcOSAE-RM&mode=related&search=

Heh, too bad the singer adopts Johnson's manner and garb instead of Bon Scott's.


Scott makes a funny chick (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VlRUIHwygc) btw.  :-D

Funny:

The "better" version of Third Stone. (http://home.earthlink.net/~kthompsen/Third_Stone_from_the%20Sun.mp3)

I finally listened to my entire Hendrix box set and came across that. Is that a well known clip or what? I know it's basically the same track, but I never heard it before.

Ah, how could I forget this? I ran across this vid awhile back. Very cool.

Sister Rosetta Sharpe and her Pearly Gates SG (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xzr_GBa8qk).

If you like that, you should buy the Family Jewels (http://www.cdconnection.com/details/Ac/Dc__Family_Jewels_(2pc)_/_(Rmst_Dig)/1017712) DVD, which is split evenly across two discs between Scott & Johnson periods.

Fuck SGs. '59 Les Paul (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-940116725401968736)

Oh, I love LP's too. They're pretty heavy, but I'm not complaining (To speak of something totally silly, I've always thought that a Black LP would seal the deal for me as a rock star. Haha. They look perfect on me. Now if I just knew how to sound like a rock star, I'd be set ;) ).

Soundwise, both SG's and LP's aren't totally my thing, but there are times when I wish had one or the other around. Over the years, I've purchased several mahogany/humbucker guitars (Gibson or Gibson like SG's, LP and 335 copies, double cutaways), but I have a bad habit of selling them off. Next time I get one, I plan on keeping it.

....

Jimmy Page seems to look more and more Chinese with age. Is he part Chinese? I wonder now. Not long ago, I found out that the Van Halen brothers AND Zak from Saved By the Bell (yeah, the blonde guy) are part Indonesian. Surprised me.

I guess you could see it in Alex, he always looked a bit odd.

I'm all about the SG sound, with whatever pickups are in my 61 reiss. One of the first guitars I tried when I was shopping was a Black Beauty LP, but it was like trying to fret a baseball bat. Which was cool by me since it was also $4k. The thin, wide neck of the 61 SG is just too sweet for bending imo.

Just got back from vacation playing just my Alvarez acoustic/electric and my fingers are just recovering. Shredded them and then built up monster callus. It was great for building strength for bends and chords, especially since I'm trying to work on the CAGED system I've mentioned, which seems to be very cool.

I remember playing a Gibson Explorer and an ES 325 when I was working in the 80's.  Neither belonged to me, but I really enjoyed their sound and how well they played.  I've never spent much time on an SG, is the neck much different than the Explorer? I remember both of them being more comfortable to my bass-player hands than the Telecaster I owned. 

I need to learn that CAGED system, i bought the book recommended further up the thread but havent really had any decent time with it yet. My latest guitar is finally back in action after i broke the output jack some time ago. I bought a replacement and soldering iron today and got it working and am pleased i bothered to do myself instead of taking it in.

I have problems with its tuning tho, its loses tune within seconds when im tuning, and i re-do over and over for 5 mins or so  and then it keeps it for a few sessions. Its a wilkinson trem, not a locking nut/floyd rose setup. I suspect i have too much string wrapped around the tuners, would that do it ? I think the innotation is ok. It's also used (toured with even) and is a bit battered.

 

There are rumours that he has some Chinese blood, though they're unsubstantiated as far as I know. I suspect its more likely that the majick rituals haven't been doing their job and he's had to resort to a little nip/tuck. :P

Most Gibson necks fall under the same category. The original Gibson design was borrowed from acoustic guitars (fat neck profile, 12" radius, etc.).

The SG, however, has a slim tapered neck (more akin to Fender), but retains the 12" radius (Fenders usually have a 7-9" radius). It's kind of a cross between the Fender and LP feel. This only goes for 60's reissues though (as well as Angus and Iommi models, which are based on the 60's design). Modern SG's feel more like Les Pauls and have fatter necks (though they are much lighter).

Anyways, to answer your question: A modern SG will feel more like that Explorer or 325 you played, but a 61 reissue, like Sky has, won't.

Thanks!

Now the 2h drive to Denver to give it a whirl.  I've set aside money for a new 6 string, I just haven't found anything that screamed "BUY ME" yet.  I played a Schecter and a Les Paul studio, but I rather prefered my old G&L.  Maybe I should just buy a strat from the late 70s or early 80s.  A good compromise were the early Ibanez guitars.  Very similar feel for a fraction of the price.  The hard part is finding an early 80's Ibanez that wasn't beat to shreds as a backup. 

The only guitar that has really tempted me in the last 6 months was a 1978 Rickenbacker bass... I played one through the 80's (like everyone else) and miss the tone.  I like the feel of my Jazz, but I miss that Rick-o-sound.

I wouldn't recommend 70's or 80's Strats really.  :-) Your G&L is more than likely much, much better. Same goes for Ernie Ball: Whereever Leo went, the guitars were better Fenders than Fender's (Standout Fenders from the 70's were the Tele Deluxes, Tele Customs, and the Basses though. Not the Strats. Standout Fenders from the 80's were the Japanese ones, both for price and that they didn't try to change the original designs too much, as the Americans did).

[edit]

I must say though, unless you're set on getting a vintage Strat, you're much better off with a new one. Especially the '62 reissue. They're awesome guitars. No Strat from the 70's is going to match it in quality. Besides actually having a real 62 Strat (which I think will run about 30 or 40 thousand dollars these days), it's as good as a Strat can be.

Thanks Stray.  Excellent advice as always!

I'd love a Ricky bass, too. At this point I'd consider trading up my ESP Custom bass for one, since I don't think I need more than one bass in my lineup. I would like a nice standup, but those are a bit pricey for a secondary instrument (these days). I'm still toying with the idea of a Baby Taylor, but I can't get over the decision-hump on it. I don't really need another steel-string acoustic, but it would be nice to have in the office...

At this point I'm balancing urges for an iPod 80GB, a hard disk recorder unit, and building a new pc next februaryish (which will cost a bundle). I'd like to get the recorder this winter if I can swing it, but as I've mentioned before the market is kinda odd. Doesn't seem to be a unit to do exactly what I'd like, fully functioning unit that can also bounce individual tracks to the pc for the mixing stage. They seem to either be pc interfaces (I don't want to have to boot my pc every time I want to jot an idea down) or only able to burn to cd or bounce a fully mixed stereo track over. Also on the wishlist is a drum machine for scratch tracks (I can play drums enough to lay the final) and a nice vintage wooden metronome (which I've found aren't cheap).

I did splurge and get a little pignose with some leftover vacation fundage ;) Hope to have it in by the weekend.

Just get a portable flash recorder like an Edirol R-09 or M-Audio MicroTrack 24/96 and use that instead of an iPod.

Those are cool but still don't quite fit the bill. I need a couple more tracks and better monitoring, as well as bouncing. For instance, if I have a bass track, a guitar track, a scratch drum machine track and I'm laying down the drums on another track. I'd love to have a flash recorder for jotting down ideas, but that'd have to come after a more fully-featured recorder.

What about something like this (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Korg-D4-4Track-Digital-Recording-Studio?sku=242060) or this (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Fostex-MR8HD-8Track-Digital-Recorder-with-40GB-Hard-Drive?sku=240341)?

Yeah, I'm familiar with all the current hard disk recorders out there right now, I think. They're all just a bit lacking, and that's a lot of dough (imo) to drop on something that doesn't quite do what I want. I keep holding out hoping someone makes what I'm looking for, but I'm not sure it'll happen. It's academic right now anyway, truck is in the shop and I'm broke :)

Ideally, it'd be a fully-functioning recording unit (we used to have a tascam 8 channel for demos, but we also had a studio setup with a 24 channel board we fed into it, so I'm a little picky on features) that could be mounted as a hard drive on the pc/mac to be worked from in the full featured recording package (pro tools, eventually), importing individual tracks discreetly. There are some decent units way up high, but that's more than I want to spend on an intermidiate unit, it's in the price range of the Digi002 I hope to buy when I put the studio in my house (that I haven't found yet, heh).

I'll probably end up buying the Fostex at some point, though. Seems to be the only choice for a low-end unit, really.

Been playing around with the pignose amp for a while now. Great little amp, has a nice tone to it and really shines when I hook up the Boss GT-6. I've been playing long enough to have messed aroung with the onboard tone and volume settings on my guitars, but the pignose really puts that out front, because it doesn't have much, just the one volume knob. I can set it pretty loud and a little distorted and with the onboard controls shape the sound from fingerpicking rhythm to lead tones.

Hooking up the effects unit makes it a perfect practice amp, actually a bit loud (according to my girlfriend). Oddly, I could play quieter on my amp + 15" cab. *shrug*

The only downside is a noticeable hum, especially at low volume. Trying to isolate it, at first I had thought it was the flourescent bulbs I've been using, but it's not.

Anyway, for $75 or so, can't go wrong. Can't wait to try it with batteries, it has little bolts for a guitar strap, too. I've got an old Pantera video with Dimebag out on the street using this amp to play blues and beg for money.

I know you said you didn't want to boot up a PC in order to lay down ideas, but for now if you want to do more than 4 tracks without bouncing it really is the best way to go.

You can get a copy of Sonar bundled with a Firewire audio interface for right around the $550 level.  It's totally worth the money.  You can record two mics and four line sources simultaneously (which I have found to be more than enough for most projects), and you can even connect it to a laptop for quick takes when out somewhere.  You can put hundreds of tracks in (provided you have the CPU horsepower) along with some really nice effects package (like Sonitus).

I just haven't found an all inclusive unit that offers the same amount of editing and tracking flexibility for a comparable cost.  I was using the Boss (e.g. Roland) unit and although it is nice and portable, you'll go out of your mind trying to fix mixes after you have bounced a few times.

Gear envy time again. Saw Porcupine Tree last week. As well as incorporating gorgeous Les Pauls into their arsenal for the first time, they also used these new Babicz Octanes. They sure do sound and look nice:

(http://www.studiomlive.com/artists/porcupinetree1006/images/_DSC9730.jpg)

Those are nice. Even the introductory model is nice (The Spider (http://www.babiczguitars.com/spider.shtml)). Only in the $600 range too. I want one.

I traded in my Yamaha Strat and got myself a Pod XT Live. I was actually after the XT but the Live has come down in price and with the trade in worked out very cheap.  I've not bought any proper kit like this before, it even came with a ringbinder manual, which really appealed to the inner geek in me.

It's already changed so much, just having access to so many (128 presets you can programme or download to) tones and fx at the press of a pedal opens up so many more possibilities. Best still, i can just use it with headphones, as i'm in a small flat with thin walls..... according to the neighbours, heh. I've been playing with some user created sounds from customtone.com (http://www.customtone.com). various tones that sound like pantera, slayer, metalica etc. Mainly using a Burzum one tonight, but I won't be burning any churches down any time soon.

The next step is using it and the Line 6 software to interface with some means to record, and play over backing tracks, and I really must structure my learning on the guitar. I've more or less been playing for fun but now im at the stage I can hear stuff in my head that i just can't play.


 

Took me awhile to play the stuff I was hearing in my head (and frankly, I still can't do it well after over 15 years of playing. Most of the songs I make up are just snippets of what I heard in my head --- I flesh the rest out with whatever my fingers want to do). So....Just have fun, like you're doing.

Pods are cool. Grats on the purchase. I used to have one, but I've since purchased a Vox/Valvetronix amp. Same principle, but it has better Vox and Marshall models than the Pod (Pod does other brands better.....Plus, it has custom cabinet configuration....While the Vox doesn't).

Just picked up one of these (http://www.seagullguitars.com/products6+cedargt.htm) from my buddies brother for a decent price. Just wondering if you guys knew of any good resources for learning? I was learning to play and then my old acoustic fell to shit. It was something someone dumped on me. Esteban quality kinda guitar. Finally got around to picking up a new one and lost all my resources for learning acoustic.

Lol, Esteban.

If possible, the best thing you can do is find an experienced guitar player (even someone who has played for a year or two) to strum songs with. Nothing beats learning that way.

If you're completely on your own, then learn the basic chords (if you haven't already) and get some kind of songbook. Learn through songs. The most important lessons are understanding the different sounds chords make (your ear), getting physically comfortable shaping those chords (your left hand), and getting a sense of rhythm (your right hand). Songs will help you with all three.

Stay away from bland/esoteric theory for the moment. Without an understand of songs, that shit is a vacuum.

I'll leave it up you about which songs to learn, but I'd suggest oldies. They lend themselves better to learning on an acoustic. Songs like Bad Moon Rising by CCR, No Reply by the Beatles, Knockin' On Heaven's Door by Bob Dylan. Beautifully simplistic songs.

If you had an electric, I'd just tell you to learn Iron Man and the Ramones' Commando. You'd be well on your way to rock stardom from there.

Esteban was the only flamenco instruction I could find in a store :| Looking at his picture and the packaging, I passed on it and went online and found some decent rasgeudo (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0786649224/ref=pd_cp_b_title/102-8653668-0511355?ie=UTF8) (sp) instruction books to slap on ye olde wishe liste. I'd like to flesh out my flamenco a bit because I'm pretty decent at the couple of things I've conjured from my anus, some celtic guys I jammed with a couple months ago were calling me the flamenco guy. Of course, I'm no Esteban or even a Charo (she rocks on guitar).

I'm completely inept as a teacher, though. I learned by smoking copious amounts of pot, drinking Yukon Jack, and jamming with friends who were also trying to learn. We sucked for at least a year or two, but it sure was fun.

I guess maybe one of the Travis picking books (http://www.amazon.com/Art-Contemporary-Travis-Picking-Fingerpicking/dp/0936799005/sr=8-1/qid=1161698292/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/102-8653668-0511355?ie=UTF8&s=books) would be a good place to start with an acoustic. Fretboard Logic (http://www.amazon.com/Fretboard-Logic-Reasoning-Arpeggios-Complete/dp/0962477060/ref=pd_bxgy_d_text_b/102-8653668-0511355?ie=UTF8) is a great book to wrap your head around the fingerboard, I'm working through that one now. Wish I'd had it when I was starting out. This general book (http://www.amazon.com/Play-Acoustic-Complete-Mastering-Guitar/dp/0879308532/sr=8-1/qid=1161698667/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/102-8653668-0511355?ie=UTF8&s=books[/url) has some nice ideas, but it's a bit light. There's a few pages on different genres, bluegrass, celtic, blues, rock, folk, etc, but the first half of the book is prose about acoustic guitarists so it's not all instruction.

Ack, don't start with Travis picking. Start with plain old chords. D, C, G, E, A, Em, Dm, Am. Then when you hit the "hard ones" like Bb, F, and B7, you'll feel  like a god. :) And you can stack Travis-style on top of this basic knowledge.

I learned off of songbooks for old folk songs and for singer-songwriters. Pick the music you like, though, you want songs you know in your bones so that you can hear what you're shooting for.

BTW, any acoustic guitarist should grab "Rise Up Singing" (the spiral-bound one, of course) -- yeah, it's got a ton of shit you don't want. But it's also guaranteed to have dozens you do want to learn, plus dozens more you've at least heard. And it's portable, and you'll be armed for playing when someone asks you to play something, because it does have something for damn ner everyone. Just ignore the hippie vibe. :) http://www.amazon.com/Rise-Up-Singing-Songbook-Anniversary/dp/1881322122/ref=ed_oe_o/102-9784383-0470531?ie=UTF8

Hell, I can barely do Travis picking very well after the length that I've been playing.

I blame it on being a lefty who learned on a righty though ;). In some cases, this can be a benefit. In others, it can be a real problem.

Either way, it's a bit advanced. I agree.

Just get basic chords and rhythms down. Your only goal right now should be getting used to fingering chords/pressing down on frets, getting every string to ring clearly throughout a chord, transitioning between chords clearly, and not sounding so sketchy when you strum.

Another of my cousin's pieces:
http://travisaustin.bluedomino.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/downtherabbithole.mp3

Again, heavily Satriani/Vai inspired, so you ain't gonna like it if you don't like them.  Not my style personally, but some people here might enjoy it.

(It's all him, no other people.)

Not my thing either, but I thought it was pretty cool. I think he'd sound 10 times more impressive ripping it up within a more raw/rockin' song.

Then again, the same would go for Steve Vai and Satriani as well.

Made me think of it because his name is Travis.

I found some instructional videos online that's teaching notes. Figured it would be a better start than just learning off tabs. Right now I'm learning to play Ode To Joy. YAY!

If you want to learn theory 'the right way', I suggest Berklee's stuff, starting with this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Method-Guitar/dp/0793545110/

I'll see Raph's oddball collection and raise you a cowboy campfire songbook:

http://www.amazon.com/Cowboy-Campfire-Songs-Tab-Guitar/dp/1569221464/

It's got some popular stuff like Clementine. I like the grim tone of the lyrics in songs like Bury Me Not On The Lone Prairie.
I dunno, I did mention I'm not good with teaching :P Unless my suggestion to find a few mates, get piss drunk and have at some music is good teaching...

This is a cool thread.


That's the way I learned my first few chords.  My step-father and his brothers would cook fish in a cauldron, get all liquored up, and play bluegrass on Saturday night.  Of course, I was too young at the time to drink but it's the thought that counts.

I'm still pretty much a n00b on guitar.  I play sporadically but I love it and enjoy instruments themselves as works of art.  Currently, I've got a Rickenbacker 4003 bass, a Geddy Lee signature Fender Jazz bass, and a 60th anniversary Fender Strat that I just picked up a couple of months ago.  The Ric is in bad need of repairs with a stripped-thread volume knob and bridge screw.   I could probably replace the volume knob myself but I'd like to get someone with experience to work on the bridge, perhaps replacing it with a Bad Ass.

Here's a video from Dead Meadow, a band I'm currently digging mightily at the moment:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2SnG7iE4c4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2SnG7iE4c4)

Heh. For a second there, I thought you said you were gigging with Dead Meadow (as in, you were in Dead Meadow).  :-D

But yeah, cool band.

...

Those are cool instruments for a "n00b". What year is that Ric? Is it old and beat up, or just fairly new and in need of repairs?

I wish.  Given their sound, I imagine they tour in their Mystery Machine, solving groovy mysteries along the way.


It's an '85 model.  I bought it used back in '95 from an evangelist who was hesitant to sell it to a long-haired hippie type but I won him over in the end.  It played without a single problem up until about two years ago, and that's when I decided to pack it up and get the Jazz bass.  I prefer the bottom end sound of the Jazz over the Ric, but no other bass cuts through mid and high ranges like a Ric can.  I'm a big sucker for that Chris Squire/Geddy Lee type sound.

Nice axes (particularly the Ric - love those things, but they're too pricey for me), and many thanks for the YouTube link/band recommendation - good stuff.

Just discovered this online jam app tonight, thought was worth a mention.

http://www.ninjam.com/

Just had a long jam with a friend, and it worked well. Had it set up in minutes, I ran the server and my own client, and just used pod via usb and set ninjam's input and output to asio and it was ready to go.

Anyone else tried this type of thing? This was near the top of a google search, but noticed some others too.

There used to be something called the Rocket(?) Network. Something like that. You could jam, but it was mainly used for collaborating. It was bundled with a stripped down version of Logic (when Logic was owned by Logic, and not by Apple).

This is pretty cool though.

I'm still strapped for mics, but I might have something crappy lying around for input. I'd love to jam with you guys.

Alrighty, so I just bought myself a Spencer acoustic. Nothing fancy.

I also don't know how to play guitar. I can play the piano, so I figured I could pick up the guitar no-problem. Turns out my music reading skill has atrophed mightily, so I've turned to tabs. I've fooled around with them a bit, but my biggest problem is moving my uncoordinated left hand around the neck in to hit the next chord in time. Do you experienced guitar players have any tips for easy tabs of recognizable songs for an acoustic guitar?

I listen to mostly classic rock, so those are really the songs I know best. Furthermore, my not-so-distant goal is to be able to play "Kiss Me" by Sixpence None the Richer for my wife. She loves that song. I do alright until I hit the chords that look similar to this on a tablature:

0            3
1            3
2            4
3            5
-            5
1            3

Could anyone help me out with the fingering of those?

Them be barre chords...

A little hard to form for a newbie, but it's merely a physical thing. Takes practice is all I can say. Your index finger needs to lie flat, straight down on the fretboard:

(http://www.electric-guitar.co.uk/Images/Lessons/Barre_Chords/gminphoto.jpg)

That's a picture of a G barre chord (edit: wait, he's lifting up his middle finger, so in actuality it's a G minor....same basic concept though):

3
3
4
5
5
3

====================

Here's another way to break it down:

3 -- Index finger, 1st string, 3rd fret
3 -- Index finger, 2nd string, 3rd fret
4 -- Middle finger, 3rd string, 4th fret
5 -- Pinky finger, 4th string, 5th fret
5 -- Ring finger, 5th string, 5th fret
3 -- Index finger, 6th string, 3rd fret


Note, "6th string" means the big, bass string, and "1st string" means the thinnest string. Standard numbering conventions count from bottom to top, high notes to low.

Suck on it, Muddy Waters! (http://www.desktopblues.lichtlabor.ch/)

Hey Stray, thanks for the help - that picture was extra useful. I will point out that I'm not so much of a newb that I don't know which strings are which :)

I'm having a lot of fun learning how to play the guitar. I already know how to read music, so thats bonus, but I am not familiar with the chords and such so I can't read fast enough to play at speed. That's why tabs are a godsend.

Thanks again Stray.

No prob.

Heh, when I said newb, I was only referring to the "dexterous" aspect of guitar playing. ;)

Since you have experience with pianos, you more than halfway there, as far as music making goes.

Another question for you Stray:

I've had more luck with fingerpicking style than chord songs so far. For instance, Classical Gas is something I would think that I'd never be able to play. I was bored, though, and found a tab and after a hour or so of practice I can play through the intro and into some of the first verse. Maybe I should learn more about that style of playing? Know of any good online references for that kind of stuff? Also, I'd really like to learn a bit about the blues style so that I can sit and do a lot of improv, but I've yet to find a site for that stuff with good info.

I'm a pretty shitty fingerstyle player, so I'm the last to ask there. I can get by alright, but I'm a lefty who learned righty -- my picking/right hand technique is lacking.

Whether you like fingerstyling or not though, you'll still have to learn chords. It's fundamental. Even with fingerstyling, you're still forming chord shapes with your left hand.

As for Blues...Hmm, I don't know any online sources really. There's a nice little book though called "101 Must Know Blues Licks" (http://www.amazon.com/Must-Know-Blues-Licks-Wolf-Marshall/dp/0793595878/sr=8-1/qid=1163988372/ref=sr_1_1/002-6183995-7351264?ie=UTF8&s=books) that charts riffs and lines from pre-war Charlie Christian/Robert Johnson type blues to Delta style to Memphis to early British rock. It's cheap, helpful, and comes with a CD as well. It's a good way to learn blues lead concepts (through riffs, instead of indirectly through pentatonic theory).

Some groundwork needs to be laid though -- mainly physical stuff. You need to get comfortable bending strings, learning how to do hammer ons and slides smoothly. That sort of thing.

All that being said, the first thing you should do is just learn basic rock songs you like. You mentioned Classic Rock earlier -- Can you give a specific example? Sabbath? Zep? Neil Young? The Beatles? Punk?


Either way, many rock rhythms can be played or imitated with power chords (especially hard rock, metal, and punk). Power chords are just basic 2 or 3 string chords.

Like that G barre chord above would just be this in power chord form:

5
5
3

Again, thanks for the help Stray.

Songs I've been working on, from most interested to least:

Kiss Me by Sixpence None the Richer
Classical Gas - Eric Clapton version and only because I seem to have good luck with it.
Canon in D - Pachelbel and because it's the individual string picking style
Give Me One Reason - Tracey Chapman and because it's good and bluesish.
House of the Rising Sun - Animals and again bluesey.
Horse With No Name - Neil Diamond and because I can play it with two chords only.

As far as classic rock goes, it's typically stuff like Clapton, Cream, The Who, The JHE - that type of music.

Some Clapton and Who is easy, some really complex.

White Room and Sunshine are easy. My Generation and I Can't Explain are easy. -- Do a Google tab search for those.

Layla isn't easy. Love Ain't for Keeping isn't easy.

House of the Rising Sun -- Definitely a 'rite of passage' type of song:

Am, C, D, F, Am, C, E, E

Am, C, D, F, Am, E, Am, E

Hey Stray, have you got AIM or something? It would make these conversations easier.

Either way, my biggest problem is fighting my rampant ADD. If I sit and concentrate on one thing for a while I will certainly improve. However, I flop between too many songs and never get anywhere. Actually, that's my downfall in MMO's too.

Don't have an IM atm.

As for the ADD:

You need to learn a song you really, really like  8-). That way you'll enthrall yourself to learning it, and stay enthusiastic each time it sounds more and more like the real thing.

I'm the king of song ADD, you'll never beat me because I have such a long headstart.

I jammed with a couple folks on some acoustics last week. They were folkies, and looked at me to pick a song. I just kinda shrugged and had to admit I really don't know any front to back. I can cobble a few together (I did Old Man by Young and Wish You Were Here by Floyd...because they were folkies). But I sit in like a mofo, they did Scarborough Fair and I tried to pick out the melody with some success but played some great minor leads and fills. Basically, if I can play a minor lead, I'm jamming, if not, I'm struggling :)

I also found I really need to work on my rhythms, I tend to wander into leads. The folkies laid down a decent 12 bar for me to play over, and then I basically forced the guy to do a solo (they were both very tentative players, which was too bad because they're both solid). I had a real hard time staying focused on rhythm playing.

My Fostex MR8HD comes in today. I'm hoping that will help me focus on song structure again, it's the skill that seems to be eluding me the most, as I don't really jam with others much.

Climbjtree: check out the entire thread, there's a few fingerpicking suggestions. I have one book that I keep ignoring, beginning blues fingerpicking or something. Alternate bass thumb independent of melody fingers makes hulk smash.

That sounds a lot like where I am on acoustic blues right now. I have a pretty aggressive style, especially when I fingerpick it, I have a tendency to pop the strings. Holdover from playing the bass for so many years, I had a super loud aggressive style on the bass. I dislike namby-pamby guys who barely brush the strings :) You gots to rough her up to get her to scream, babies.

Holy shit!

Someone on youtube has posted video of Rush performing "2112", "Anthem", and "Bastille Day" live from 1976.  I've collected bootleg audio/video for Rush for many years now and this is the first time I've even heard of, much less seen, live footage from this era.

2112 (part 1):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm08ZO9fZqw&mode=related&search= (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm08ZO9fZqw&mode=related&search=)

2112 (part 2):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_QJMYIRvRA&mode=related&search= (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_QJMYIRvRA&mode=related&search=)

Anthem:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15GXZ8lvLBg&mode=related&search= (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15GXZ8lvLBg&mode=related&search=)

Bastille Day:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCt4orYLBJA&mode=related&search= (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCt4orYLBJA&mode=related&search=)

Climbjtree, you don't need to do that G barre if you don't want to. You can play the open G and get by, at least until you feel comfy with barre chords.

In fact, newbies often learn a "cheap G" where they play xx0003. (finger the open G chord shape but don't try for the bass strings).

For blues suitable for beginners, I suggest Pride and Joy by SRV. Ignore the fills, just try to master the basic chords first, then layer in the bass line.

If you want advice on fingerpicking, I can probably help out where Sky can't. :)

Arg, I wouldn't recommend Pride & Joy. For me, at least, the strum is very tough. The walking bass I can pull off, but the high strings backstrum is so damned awkward. Maybe something like Mannish Boy, bada bada bump! All E without chord changes. And also Hootchie Cootchie Man, a solid 12 bar (though Muddy was very loose with the format, more like a 10-15 bar, heh).

Blues basics are easy. 12 bar I-IV-V, most blues follow this format, often with 7th chords for the IV and V. Once you get the basic chording down, work on a shuffle which is the 02xxxx-04xxxx repetition (IV = x02xxx-x04xxx, V = x24xxx-x26xxx, etc). Then get into turnarounds to glue it together. Solo with a minor pentatonic (1, m3, 4, 5, d7, 8; in E: e, g, a, b, d, e). That's basically the blues, with about a gajillion things you can do within the framework. The best thing to do is listen to some Muddy Waters and play along, imo. And remember: you can never play the blues too slow (Muddy's phrase, not mine :)).

My open G always defaults to 320033, it's hard for me to do a standard open G. Sucks because it makes open G7s tougher for me. Ah well, I'm a horrid mishmash of styles and learning :)

First comments on the Fostex MR8HD unit: It's pretty slick. Metal unit, sliders are a bit cheesy, but it's a relatively low-end unit. It lists for $400, I paid $350 at musician's friend. 40GB hard drive in it. Display is very tiny, the unit is a bit loud due to the hd spin. Forgot to buy a punch-in switch and headphones :P Going to spend a few days learning the interface and then try to get something up for you guys to hear. Can't wait to start recording some of my truly stupid ideas, like my blues version of Jay Z's '99 Problems'.

Arpeggios from Hell (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiYwOfaPf5I&mode=related&search=)

Interesting to see all the modes Yngwie goes through.  My only complaint is that it would have been more interesting to hear clean. 

He has great technique but I get bored pretty fast with that stuff. Especially the rhythm section, no groove at all. It's the 'hey look at me' show, blah. I wasn't a big fan of shred even back in the day when I could do some shred. Now shred is 'in' again. I'd rather listen to someone creative like the cat playing with Mars Volta, or more traditional stuff like Warren Haynes or Derek Trucks.

Shred? Bah. Maybe I'll be happier about it if the new shred trend gets rid of cookie monster vocals.

I agree completely.  I was more interested in the modes and neck usage.  The guy obviously has a firm grasp of theory... he must have gotten that in exchange for his soul.  That's what his music has always lacked, soul.

I guess the shredders can do all that hold out a note for 5 mins whilst making fuckfaces so the audience can hold lighters in the air malarkey, it's just that their market dont want anything less than 10 note a second neo classical stuff. Yngwie's been churning out variations of Far beyond the Sun for decades heh. I don't mind heavily arpeggiated music anyway, I was brought up on electronica and classical.

There's a time and place for guitar music with soul too, I saw my first Slayer concert on Monday. I don't think they are going for that type of emotional response. There's feeling to it, but as it's the musical equivilent of an artillery barrage it's a bit more physical and tangible than a bluesman's licks.

Here's a bit of guitar wankery thats a little bit more musical than chaining endless sweep argeggio's (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-741601852741074772&q=bob+zabek)

I always thought of Slayer, or just about any thrash/death metal guitar players, as percussionists. With a few exceptions.

I feel that's the kind of state of mind I have to be in when jamming with metal buddies as well. I just don't really feel like a "guitar player"....The way I see it.

Not to say I don't like it though. Slayer riffs are the shit. Raining Blood, Behind the Crooked Cross --   :rock:

This thread lacks acoustic stuff in it.  :-D

Months ago, I broke the 4th string on my 112-year-old banjo that I think I have mentioned here before. Since it predates steel strings, that means I had to go looking for gut or nylon. I ended up getting several sets of LaBella nylons that seemed like they were decent. Then I picked up one set of Aquila "Nylgut" strings, which are supposed to have the same characteristics as gut. They cost like it too... one set was $8, whereas $8 got me three sets of the LaBellas. The Aquila ones are what the guy who fixed up the banjo put on there in the first place. I replaced the broken 4th with a LaBella for now. I figure, I'll try replacing them all with the complete Aquila set when they wear out.

This means I started playing banjo again for the first time in ages.

I was getting these strings at Elderly Instruments because of course nobody close by stocks weird-ass banjo strings. (I went to three stores and only two of them even had the steel strings). Elderly has free shipping if you get your order large enough. So I figured I should shop. I picked up some polish and fretboard cleaner and the like.

Then I grabbed a Kyser partial capo, because my usual trick of turning the capo upside-down doesn't work so well on the Melody Maker (which I love to play, btw, you may get me to try doing more electric stuff just because of this guitar). This is great for doing the partial capo 3-4-5 thing, which I do a lot, but I also do other things (for example, partial 2-3-4-5-6 at the 5th fret, or 1-2-3-4 at a variety of frets, particularly when in DADGAD tuning) and this won't help with those. But for what it does, it's really nice, much nicer than the upside-down solution.

This led me to also find this thing called a Third Hand Capo -- basically, you can capo each string independently. It's basically an elastic capo, but with rotatable plastic ovals for each string. You just roll them out of the way. Unfortunately, well, it's an elastic capo. It does let me do all of my weird capoings (hey, at least I have mostly stopped doing double capoing -- one regular and then a partial above it!) so I may mess with it for that purpose.

I usually order strings online. Hate going to a store for that.

http://www.juststrings.com/ (http://www.juststrings.com/)

They have those La Bellas you were talking about, I think. It's a good and fast site to buy bulk from.

Who made that banjo anyways? Or can you tell?

I enjoy buying strings. Supports the local music shop, I always buy a few picks though with the heavy gauge I use my picks last for years. I try to buy what I can from them, but they don't stock much good stuff. I got my Alvarez jumbo there. They mostly focus on lessons and school band stuff. Also, good opportunity to shoot the shit with some locals, I helped some guys with a recording solution for their band.

I inherited my grandfather's banjo, a crappy Silvertone. Real crappy, action is ridiculous. I thought about trying to lower the bridge, but I don't want to destroy the thing. I just bought some new strings for it. Need to actually learn how to play it, I tune it like a 5 string guitar :) Right now it's strung with the high and low string and I've been doing an Indian chant with it. Don't ask. In other stringed instrument news, I've been thinking about picking up a Charango (http://www.bolivianstuff.com/index.php?cPath=43_87&osCsid=855b990f84b518560ec1fc03681d7934). I know a guy from Chile who is just amazing, a master of the instrument. I know him from the renfaire circuit and might be able to talk him into lessons during the summer while his band is here.

Slayer. One of my favorite bands from the early 80s, I remember buying a Metal Massacre compilation with them on it, it turned out to be their vinyl debut. We used to get a lot of compilations because it was a great way back in the pre-internet days of digging new music (and a huge thanks to metal blade records!). There was some metallica, helloween, lots of cool stuff. Then I got their debut, Show No Mercy. Bought every subsequent album up until Seasons of the Abyss. Reign in Blood, of course, is the classic, but there were some great tracks on every album. I even arranged South of Heaven with a midi orchestra when I was in music school. The teacher didn't know the source, but my clique of metal buddies were sniggering in the back of the room. It really lent itself to the full orchestral treatment, suprisingly. For so many instruments, I had to layer in a lot more harmonies and side melodies than the band put in, but it turned out great. Wish I still had a tape of that.

Speaking of tape (I now date myself by calling all recording tape, like the DVR "Did I tape that episode"...bah), I laid down my very first full vocal/guitar song :) I never used to sing (except a few regretable backups) back in my band days. And I did lay down a snippet of "Sweet Dreams" when testing a recording setup (that sucked) in the late 90s. But this is my very first actual recording with my instrumentation + vocals. I did "I Can't Be Satisfied", a Muddy Waters slide in open G. Turned out ok, and I need to clean it up because I was kinda nervous and not really in the zone. Messed up the guitar several times, and my vocals...well, they're on there, anyway. A friend was over for football on Sunday and I played it for him. He loves slide guitar, so he liked it. I asked him about the vocals and he said it sounds like Tom Waits. Not sure if that's a compliment.

I'll probably retrack both the guitar and vocals, but first I want to test out the whole bouncing to the pc thing. The Fostex MR8HD is a nice little unit. A bit limited, but hey, it was only $350. Actually...my first track was "Old Man" by Neil Young...but oof...the vocals on that had me laughing my ass off. I'll stick with Muddy for a while ;)

Hmm...What's that?  :-D

Seems like everything has been taken over by the Sam Ash and Guitar Centers of the world. Even the local shops that do exist function in much the same way as Guitar Center. There's a popular local shop here in my town called "Hermes Music", but it's just as big and impersonal as Wal Mart.

There's one cool shop that's fairly small, but they specialize in boutique-ish triple rec amps, and not much else.

The used shops spread about have shit for vintage equipment.

When I'm feeling nostalgic, I like to check out Ed Roman (http://www.iwantguitars.com/store/?search=1&select2=&order=sku&s_dept=&s_brand=&s_name=&s_model=&s_desc=&s_vint=on&s_rstr=&page=0) and eBay for vintage stuff. Some of the prices make my jaw drop, but it's still fun to look.  I miss all of the local shops, but can understand why it's so hard to stay in business as one.  Finding cheap gear is as easy as firing up your computer.

I like to check out Ed Roman for his rants. He's incredibly asshole-ish.

I agree.  I think it's his best quality.  Reading the tips on his site reminds me of a sign hanging in a small guitar shop in Minneapolis (B-Sharp was the store if you've ever been there):  "In God we trust.  All others pay with cash."

Well, I was hoping to have them that day. No such luck.


S S Stewart. I blogged in detail, including pictures, here:

http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/07/07/1894-stewart-banjo/

(http://www.raphkoster.com/wp-content/_Banjo.JPG)

I got a steel string acoustic when I was 16 and tried to learn how to play for about 15 years on and off, I was pathetically bad however. I could be considered one of the worlds' worst guitar players but I probably don't even qualify for that. Anyways, I've got a masochistic streak and want to give it another go. I remember the first time sitting down with my guitar and not being able to figure out which way to hold it (righty or lefty). I'm sort of ambidextrous, probably more accurate to say I'm neither handed though. I think I wanted to play it lefty but it was strung right-handed so I just stuck with that.

I recently got a cheap nylon string guitar and am thinking maybe I'd have more success playing it lefty, but is it ok to just flip it over to play lefty? I restrung it a few days ago and it seems to work OK but I'm worried the string tensions might warp the neck or something... also should I flip the plastic bridge thingies around (the one at top seems glued in place)?

Another question I have is that I hate having long fingernails, I always cut them all down to the quick so I'm using my fingertips to pluck the strings. Seems like every finger-player (term?) uses their fingernails. I'm also using my pinky to pluck, I haven't noticed guitarists using their pinky much, but I'm thinking why let that bugger go to waste? Will this style work out ok in the long run? thanks

Don't worry about neck tensions. It's quite fine. If the guitar has been strung like that for a LONG time though (i.e. is it new or old?), then it might mess with the tension a tiny bit. If that's the case, all you'd have to do is readjust the truss rod a small amount (like a 45 degree turn).

Flipping the bridge around is up to you, but not absolutely necessary. It might mess up your intonation a bit though.

You can play quite successfully with flesh as opposed to nails. So don't worry about it. With nylon, it will not make a huge difference except in tone. If you were playing on steel, playing on nails helps reduce blistering on the fingertips of the picking hand.

I use my fleshy bits to fingerpick (term: fingerpicker). I'd like to cultivate nails, the guy I mentioned who plays charango has some crazy hard pointy nails, I just can't do it. Also, my style is very influenced by my years playing bass with my fingers (striving to be Cliff Burton or Steve Harris...I can be percussive...). I have a shortcut to callous my right hand, I practice bass for a few hours a day before doing some intense fingerpicking guitar.

Righty/lefty, just go with your writing stance. If you write left-handed, play lefthanded. It really doesn't matter. In fact, that's kinda been my credo: it doesn't matter, go with what's right for you. If it feels natural (and sounds good) playing with your pinky, go for it. I use my pinky occasionally because it just kinda does it (I'm not real disciplined :)). I got a lot of compliments on my bass style when I was in music school because of my (disciplined!) two finger style (it took a lot of work to make them alternate properly), but mostly for my incorporation of the ring finger into more complex rhythm patterns (especially triplets, it's the only way I could play Maiden tunes, hours spent playing The Trooper ftw). So yeah, if it works, work it. If it feels odder than playing without it, maybe you could learn pieces with and without the pinky so you'll be able to play both ways or drop one down the line.

If you do decide to go lefty, you have to make the string flip decision early. Some lefties played with restrung right-hand guitars (Hendrix), some with lefty guitars, some with right-hand guitars strung for right-handers (Albert King, it's one of the reasons for his mighty bends, I've read).

I'm dying to post my crappy little song I recorded, but I'm striving mightily to wait until I have a better version recorded. I've already laid down a new (a bit too drunken) voice part that is much more in the direction I'm trying for. I have a very non-melodic voice (I find it very unpleasant :P) so I'm going for more of a Howlin' Wolf growl, which isn't so apparent in the first take. Also, need to fix a couple guitar bits. My girlfriend says I have 'show & tell' syndrome, as soon as I do something or get something new, I love to share it with everyone.

Thanks for the info and tips. Its a new guitar ($99 Yamaha, seems pretty nice considering). Its a very pleasant feeling to play with the fingertips, physically satisfying (I tried with steel strings + pick in the past), though the tone is maybe not as clear as with a pick/nails. I write lefty but do other stuff righty/ambi - I always wondered about guitar handedness, thought the fret hand is the trickier part so its seems a bit counterintuitive how it works out for most people.

Go for it Sky I'd like to hear it, seems like a friendly place here, no worries.

Raph, that ukulele is freaking kool, nice tune (May) and the tone is sweet. Its astounding to me you are an accomplished musician on top of all the other stuff, makes me wonder what your parents/childhood were like. That your granddad had the uke is really neat, such a personal thing, all that sweat and care going into playing it... I wish I had been able to snag my granddads piano.

Thats interesting about Hendrix, his later live recordings have always tore me up real bad, 'Machine Gun' especially just lays me low. I was reading the BBC website last week with my mom nearby, there was a blurb for Jimi's birthday and I mentioned to her that he would have been 64 that day. She said "I didn't know you like Jimi Hendrix" then told me about how she and my dad had taken me to a Hendrix concert when I was about 4 months old, I was like "WHAT?!?"; my mom is the last person in the world I would have expected to be at a Hendrix concert, she is straight out of the old world (from Latvia on a donkey fleeing the Russians during WWII) and very elegant/conservative. She said "I couldn't believe that so much...(pause, clenches fists and grimaces) power could be going through one person." Damn, damn, damn... that hit me in the chest like a hammer.

The music stuff seems to have skipped a generation, actually. Both of my grandfathers were musicians. Of my paternal grandfather, my dad said "if it had strings, he could play it." But none of my uncles and aunts play. I do have a few cousins who do, though -- one's a drummer, and I think there's another guitar player. Many of my memories of my paternal grandparents involve song circles around a camper in Key Largo, lots of older folks playing all these jazz tunes.

My other grandfather played the Puerto Rican cuatro. He loved to sit on the porch and noodle on it. I never really listened to him much on it -- now I wish I had. I should chase down a cuatro at some point. Who knows where his ended up.

But me, I didn't pick up the guitar until I was 18. I messed around with keyboards before that. It was one of those things that I just said, "you know, I think I would like to learn how," and I had an old guitar that my brother had taken lessons on and ended up not pursuing.

No musicians in my family (that I know of). Several kinds of artists though. My grandmother illustrated a lot of old Hollywood magazines. Mom's involved in arts and crafts stuff. Brother's a painter. I'm a fairly competent doodler. ;)

Picked up guitar at 13. Probably would have done it sooner if I had known it was "possible" (I had been under the impression that it was one of those things only famous people did or something. Hehe). The second I saw one of my old neighbors bust out his electric, I had to get one. He's the guy that originally taught me a lot of surf stuff, and to this day, those sensibilities have stuck with me.

SirFodder, I'm a lefty playing righty too (if I read you correctly). I, too, think it's a natural fit. Most notable guitarist in our boat that I can think of is Nels Cline. Pretty kickass experimental/jazz player, but probably more known for being in Wilco.

Here he is in Banyan (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmddP2cJkJ8).

No great musicians in my family, and I'm the only one still practicing. I grew up under the piano, though. Had an uncle and grandmother who played a lot, she did all spitiruals (southern baptist) and he was real eclectic (ragtime, 70s rock, classical, tv themes, he had a great ear). My mother used to play, too, but she hasn't in years. I think everyone should play a musical instrument, it's part of being a human :)

Part of why I'm reluctant to upload stuff is that I set the bar very high for myself. Fodder is new and maybe hasn't read the whole thread, but I used to be a pro metal bass player back in the 80s/90s (no you never heard of us or I'd still be pro hehe). Now I play blues guitar. My bar for quality is set where I left it when playing metal, very high. I was at the top of my game, pushed to what I could do with my genetics, when I was playing metal, vs being a blues newb. I'm used to having a singer as good as Bruce Dickinson or Geoff Tate, and my voice is barely musical. I've forgotten just about everything about recording I learned in school. So I'm wicked shy about my music right now, even if I'm not exactly a shy person about anything else...

[link removed]

Sorry, the hosting was only temoporary. I lost my isp password :P

Link doesn't work. You did that on purpose, didn't you?  :-P


I don't upload anything because I sold my mics. Serious!

Oops.

Pretty cool man. I thought you said you had problems with slide? Sounds good to me. That was G right? Do you have anything in E too? I've been dabbling with that tuning lately myself.

One nitpick though: Need to turn down the lows a bit, and get that bad boy in the midrange (or alternatively, play on your bridge pickup). Also, bring those vocals to the forefront (not bad btw!).

[edit] Or in other words, I'd really like to record you Sky ;)

I botched a spot where the lyrics break for a bass solo (that's not on there), and ended on the wrong note :) It's in open G. I don't have any EQ set up (I don't have an EQ), I probably could have imported it into Cakewalk, but I don't know how to use Cakewalk. I've got an old copy a friend gave me without a manual and the only manual I could find to download is the wrong version...And forget adjusting the guitar, that's my crapola guitar an ex-girlfriend left me because she felt too bad about me not having a guitar to take it. Cort strat knock-off, total garbage. I set the strings wicked high so it works decent for slide stuff and I can leave it in open tunings rather than always retuning. I also prefer a low boost like that, chalk it up to years of cutting out the midrange playing bass. But even when I was in school, no 'trained' people ever like my mixes, I guess I have an odd ear.

I did mess around with open E a couple weeks ago when I was toying with Statesboro Blues (Allmans version), but I decided to stick with works-in-progress before starting anything new. Muddy Waters played in open G for all of his early career, which is what I'm working on right now.

Finally, my bass thumb on guitar just sucks imo :) It's hard for me to break it into two seperate lines.

Vocals intentionally put way in the back :P

That put a big  8-) on my face Sky, bravo! (btw I've been around forever, just don't post much).

I was one of 6 kids, and the only one to never receive musical instruction. All the rest got extensive training, I was the only kid seriously interested in music too, WTF mom and dad? They said I was too "difficult" to even try,  jeesh; I went downtown (a BIG no no!) with a pocket full of change when I was in second grade and bought Sgt. Peppers. The thin tie clerks gave me a ton of good natured crap, especially when they found I was short some change, they still let me have the album. Of course nowadays I'm the only one among my siblings still pursuing music.

One note regarding my folks bringing me to see Hendrix when I was an infant; I've always "bragged" tongue in cheek that my first concert was a Neil Sedaka and Carpenters show I saw at age 7 or so, haha! Apparently I also got to see Glen Campbell perform "in a small restaurant with about 5 other people present" a few days after the Hendrix show. Damn. Neil and Carpenters were only my 3rd show  :cry:   :-D

Hardly worth a bravo, but thanks.

My lady gets out of work a half hour later than I, so last night I broke out the guitar when I got home, intending to lay down a twelve bar to play over. I'm very bad at discipline, as I've mentioned, I can't even keep a twelve bar rhythm going without noodling around...Anyway, while I was tuning up the acoustic, I revisited an old jam I'd shared here before, so I decided to lay it down for grins. And just like the original, once I'd laid down the rhythm I had to put a lead on it...then I decided to add another rhythm track...and then I decided to put on a mysterious background sound..

It's a fingerpicked acoustic rhythm on 1, I think I flatpicked the acoustic solo on 2, a flatpicked acoustic rhythm (for percussiveness) on 3, and some spacey guitar sound on my SG on 4. Pushed the two rhythm tracks left and right, pushed the SG way back for just a kind of ethereal odd sound in the back. Very sloppy as always, just first take improv stuff I quickly laid down (about 15 minutes total) while waiting to go to the store. Once I spend the time to do good takes I might actually be happy with my stuff :)

I've got a lot of work ahead to get back my recording skills. One reason my mixes are not up to snuff is my monitor situation. I used to have good studio monitors and headphones, as well as a variety of stuff to play the mixes on (home stereo with nice speakers, etc). Now I've got cheap old pc powered monitors (shorted out, they suck), a cheap headphone I used to use for teamspeak, and my 5.1 (which lacks good stereo fronts because I'm cheap).

Nice solo/lead playing, but yeah, you're right, you lack discipline for rhythm. I thought you had played bass! Next time, only lay one rhythm track. ;)

I was trying to layer and intertwine them, because the fingerpicked and percussive things played well off each other...I just couldn't hear the first one well when I was laying down the second one and kept forgetting where the changes were because I was doing it off the cuff :) When I played bass, I had an amazing drummer to keep time and whatnot.

Oh i liked that spanish like one. Mix was a bit messy, but solo and fingerpicking was real nice.

Its nearly a year since i started playing, and seem to be keen as ever. Hope i keep it up as long as you guys, perhaps one day i will be able to lay down the Dragonforce solo of my dreams lol.

I missed the performance - maybe you could find another host? I'd like to hear it!

I'm still trying to figure out the best way to hold my classical type guitar, the left side of my back ends up getting fatigued real quick (playing left handed). I put a strap on it and it helps a lot though its still not great. I don't like the idea of using a foot stool / raising one leg up to rest the guitar on. I watched some videos of classical guitarists not using a foot stool but I can't figure out how they do it, like this guy (who IMO is amazing): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6W7CCQi-CWI     I tried holding the guitar like him but the neck wants to just fall down to horizontal, how the heck is he holding it like that?

Takes practice.

Like I said to someone earlier in this thread, a big part about learning an instrument is dexterous. Getting acquainted and used to the physicality of it. Be it piano, horns, percussion, or string instruments.

----

Sorry to derail, but I came across a cool video of one of my favorite guitarists (and singer/songwriters to boot):

Richard Thompson - 1952 Vincent Black Lightning (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxKTzwaEa2o)

Pretty cool. I wish all my favorite musicians filmed themselves strumming in their living rooms.

Any Fairport/Thompson fans here?

That guy was pretty good. As far as classical guitarists, I've been listening to Christopher Parkening (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQ7iX_dWec4) doing some Segovia and flamenco. Sans Placido, though ;) Also some Pepe Romero (http://youtube.com/watch?v=X0m2iSLaWQo), who is pretty amazing. The guy who first got me into flamenco style (though he's really more jazz now that I'm eruditer ;)) was Paco DeLucia (http://youtube.com/watch?v=OV_OysllKJQ) on the amazing Friday Night in San Francisco, with John McLaughlin (http://youtube.com/watch?v=W-MkGO0th9Y) and Al DiMeola (http://youtube.com/watch?v=RHnth4Av-Nk). If you don't own that album, YOU MUST GO BUY IT NOW. It's the best guitar album I've ever heard, I've had a copy since 84 or so.

The guy Fodder is looking at seems to be balancing the butt of the guitar in his lap. I imagine that would take some practice. I sit the hip of the guitar on my right leg (I'm right-handed), though I was taught to sit it on my left leg with a foot step. I might play around with new stances because lately I've really been digging into the top side with my upper right arm. I don't know if that's because I'm just playing so much more acoustic now (blues and some clsasical I'm working on for the holidays) or if it's because it's a jumbo guitar or what.

Damn, you people have some good taste, I usually have a hard time finding music I like. Thompson is amazing, I just heard his stuff for the first time a few weeks ago on a Sierra Nevada show that popped up on a public access channel. I was admiring his stage presence/writing/singing for a while, then suddenly it hit me what an amazing guitarist he is.  DeLucia yes! DiMeola not so much, he always seemed to me a bit spastic and infatuated with technique, same for McLaughlin but I do like some of his early 70's stuff. Haven't heard any of their more recent (post mid 70s) stuff though, I'll keep an eye out for the live album.


Back to guitar holding: in that Parkening video he seems comfortable with the foot stool but his torso appears sort of twisted, I want to avoid that (my spine is really long and back not too strong) and the between the legs style seems more ergonomic (I'm not sure though) and sexy to boot. If I try to hold the guitar this way though it seems to be more than just a matter of dexterity, it would require superhuman picking-arm-strength or a super sticky guitar without propping it with the fretting hand, which seems awkward...

Hmm! I was looking for more examples of guitar holding and came across this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbeAbllBpGo  and this  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZkK5Bbn0Og  There appears to be some kind of stand attached to the side-underside ofthe guitar. I thought there was something fishy going on. Anyone know anything about this prop thingy?

Damn though, I took another look at that Peo Kindgren video I posted and there appears to be no prop, the guitar seems to just magically stick there, it can't be balanced at that angle! and it's clear that his fret hand isn't propping it up, what the heck is going on? Hmm, is it just a shadow here? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rC0tuRFHbUg maybe he's got a mini-prop?

If you want a guitar that naturally holds itself in an upright position you could always try a Flying V Accoustic (http://www.deanguitars.com/dean_winter_06/v_coustic.htm). Gimmicky though!

Paul Gilbert playing spanish guitar. (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4136369911221730998&q=paul+gilbert+flamingo) I won't comment on the standard of his playing compared to the masters listed above, but it's a really nice tune.
I don't really have a clue whats going on here. Some kind of Japanese TV show (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peQiudKTyiE&mode=related&search=) involving him and Marty Friedman. I like the way that even though they both speak Japanese, they get subtitled. Bizarre and strangely watchable though, and plenty of good ol' guitar wankery.

Yeah, that's a great show. I wish someone did something like that in America.

...Then again, maybe not. Without the Japanese goofiness, it'd probably suck.

Yeah, I really dig him. Definitely in my top 10. Too bad there aren't very many good examples of his electric playing on Youtube...Especially before he left Fairport. He's an amazing lead guitar player, but on acoustic, it's the singing and songwriting that stand out (I'm not complaining though).

Oh wow, I didn't realize Richard Thompson was in Fairport. Back in '84 I saw an open air Jethro Tull concert on a pier in NYC (right next to that aircraft carrier they just moved); the opening act was supposed to be "Fairport Five" but there was a transport problem and only 2 of the members made it on time, I'm now almost certain one of them must have been Thompson - there was some prodigious acoustic jamming going on. The Tull band joined them on stage and they had a raucous medievalish acoustic set that was freaking amazing, one of those things where everything just came together perfect.

OK, I think I've got to the bottom of this mysteriously balanced guitar mystery! Take a look at the ErgoPlay and Efel Rest on this page: http://www.staffordguitar.com/shop/accessoriesnew.asp  I must have one of these things, anyone have recommendations for online guitar gear sellers?

That might have been him in 84, but not likely. He was one of the founders of Fairport, but he left in the early 70's. He occasionally gigs with them though.

The Thompson era Fairport (which was more Folk Rock-ish, with Thompson's guitar antics) is a completely different beast than what it became (more Folk and Experimental).

This is the only decent example of him in Fairport on Youtube:

Time Will Show the Wiser (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMIq_pmHLAI)

Really cool groove, some great lead fill ins (although brief). Still not a good example though.

[EDIT] Crap, I screwed up in editing this thing and lost another link I put up....Oh well.

Anyhow, he's not doing Paganini like some of these links you guys are posting. ;) I don't like him because of virtuosity or anything. He just has these quivering vibrato techniques that I love...Really expressive, even with one note.

I'm not really into the folk thing. I occasionally jam with two folkies and it's tough to integrate into their playing. I usually just sit back and noodle. It's funny with them and the capoes, though (hi Raph!). I just find capoes throw me off, so I just play in whatever key without the capo.

I have been getting a little into the Renaissance thing, I've been very inspired by a chilean guy Conrado Garcia. I think I've mentioned him before, he's a charangista (plays the charango), and he's got amazing technique. The main reason I go to our local renfest is to watch him. You can check out some videos and mp3s here (http://www.cantigamusic.com/music.html), though he's not on all of them. I also picked up this book (http://www.amazon.com/Cantigas-Renaissance-Festival-Favorites-Bielefeld/dp/078664432X/sr=8-2/qid=1166627042/ref=sr_1_2/102-5870137-5632113?ie=UTF8&s=books) they just put out. Nice collection of instrumentals and renfest singalongs.

My neighbor (and the guy I play with the most these days) is pretty renfaire-ish and folky. He even looks like James Taylor. Hehe. Very cool guy though. He's been playing for 30 years longer than I have, and has taught me a lot.

But anyways, Fairport is definitely folk-y. You'd have to be into it somewhat. The early Fairport was better at incorporating it with rock though.

Umm....

Here's a good example I just uploaded:

Matty Groves (http://files.filefront.com//;6390859;;/)

Probably the coolest version of Matty Groves ever. Almost gets a little Prog-ish towards the end there. But the standout in that song is not Thompson, it's Sandy Denny on vocals.

I don't think I've mentioned these fun books I found: Blues Play-along (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0634056271). There's a couple blues (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0793574625), some funk, some soul, some rock, etc, etc. I got the two blues and a southern rock (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0634084003) for xmas. They have two versions of each track: one with the vocal stripped and one with vocals and guitar stripped. Fun to play along with and kind of interesting to hear some very guitar-heavy tunes sans guitar, bringing out the piano and horn parts (which I love). Wish I had known about these years ago. Thanks, Hal Leonard!

Santa also brought me a couple of things for the SIAB (studio-in-a-box, my MR8HD): a decent pair of Sennheiser headphones (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Sennheiser-HD280-Pro-ClosedBack-Headphones?sku=242411) for monitoring and the all-important footswitch (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Korg-PS100-Momentary-Footswitch?sku=152189) for punching in. I'm also starting to learn how to use the dern thing. I'll spare you guys my test recordings for a while :) I did a decent Kind-Hearted Woman and an atrocious Sweet Home Chicago (Robert Johnson not Blues Brothers). Robert Johnson is so simple yet so complex, it's pretty wild stuff. If you haven't listened to his stuff, I highly recommend it (if you're interested in blues, of course). Also a super-seekr1t version of Melissa by Gregg Allman for my ladyfriend, going to surprise her with it.

(Continued from pet projects)

I've been going direct guitar > Boss GT6 > Fostex MR8HD. I don't have a good sounding amp right now, so it's not a huge deal, but at some point I'll need to get something for playing shows, a fender twin or something. Right now it's some cheezy Peavey 150W bass amp into a Dean Markley 1x15 cab loaded with my old favorite bass speaker, the EVMB 400W 15". Also, using the phantom on the MR8HD for my only mic right now, the mighty dynamic Shure SM58 road warrior. I should probably look to upgrade that at some point or learn how to use the mic better (I actually do know how to use one well, though...) because it's been more uneven than it should be for recording.

I could see mics becoming an obsession. I wasn't too obsessed in the band days, because I didn't really have any money, I just worked with what I had. But now I have to be real disciplined...At the very least I want to grab a large diaphram condenser and a few small diaphrams for my drum kit when I get to that point. And a new drum kit at some point, bought mine for $100. The SM58 actually isn't too bad for my vocals as I'm going for a growly thing anyway, but I'd like some flexibility.

And then there's equalization...I'm a fan of analog gear, it's what I learned on. Or at least hardware, I haven't really enjoyed using a computer for recording (though I learned them, too, back in the early 90s). My thought there is one of those nice rack graphic EQs with the shiny lights :) I'm working hard at not getting GAS (gear acquisition syndrome) until I've recorded at least one cd worth of material, though.

Right now I just want a Senn MD421 and an SM57. Nothing too fancy, but I keep spending cash on other stuff.

Me, too. Especially trying to build a high end pc next month. And I think I want to grab an ipod before they screw them up. My bets are on a bigger screen with the next product refresh, and I don't want a big screen. There's a decent SM57 drum set (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Shure-Drum-Mic-Package?sku=270263) I'm considering because it then gives me three 57s to play with (plus 'free' drum mounts). I'm tentative about the kick mic, since it doesn't look like it'll be a multitasker, but it might be ok for my bass. I'll probably hold off on a large diaphram condenser until I can afford something nice, the dynamic really should be good enough with my crappy vocals.

I really wish I had somewhere better to set up my drums. They are in the basement of my mom's house (she LOVES that), and it scares the hell out of her cats when I go over there to play. And I'm limited to times when she's not there, it's a long drive, etc. Bah. Drums r fun.

Not strictly a guitar thing, but I'll drop it in here: Belkin Tunestudio (http://playlistmag.com/news/2007/01/08/tunestudio/index.php). Rather limited (16bit) but to be expected given the device involved. Basically, a ministudio to interface with an ipod. Kinda nifty (though I still don't have an ipod!).

(http://edge.macworld.com/2007/01/images/content/tunestudio.jpg)

That's slick.

Sniff, I don't own an iPod, but that thing looks like a good replacement for my aging setup: a Tascam Portastudio II that I use only as a mixer, running into an Audigy EX (yeah, the original Audigy).

I'll pimp the fostex mr8hd again. Great little unit, though I really think I need some EQ. And more mics. And near-field monitors. :| The 40GB HD is nice, my biggest worry was that I couldn't bounce discreet tracks, only the stereo mixdown...in fact, that's what the manual says, too. But when I mounted it on my pc (as an external USB drive), I had access to all the files. I'm not sure about the other way (discreet tracks from the pc to the unit, but mixdowns to the unit are supposed to work, not sure why).

So if I ever get off my lazy ass and get a decent pc program to edit and mix (I'll take suggestions, I have an old undocumented copy of Cakewalk (6 maybe?)), I should be golden until I want to move into the low-end professional space.

At the end of the day, just remember that Bruce Springsteen made Nebraska on a tape 4 track.  :-P

Well, I do my recording to hard disk on my computer these days. But having something more portable would be cool. This thing looks like it does double-duty.

Thread... must... not... slip... off... front... page....!

Recent musicky stuff I have posted:

http://www.raphkoster.com/2007/02/04/the-sunday-poemsong-longitude/
http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/11/26/the-sunday-song-the-coming-gloria/

You are far more focused than I :P I should have some new stuff soonish, though. I think I need to take my acoustic into the shop and get a winter shim made (or figger it out meself), it usually bottoms out on bends on the first couple strings in the 10-13 fret range, where I play alot (bb box area!). This morning it was totally fretting out and unplayable there :( Sonofa. I mostly practice on the acoustic for finger strength, so I might raise the action a little, too.

The Longitude reminds me of some stuff I wrote in the 80s, about archeologists in Egypt. My singer rejected them as 'geek songs' :P I took it as a compliment, but they were never recorded.

The Coming sounds like it could have been an early Claypool tune, I like how you crafted it as a story.

I have built a 350 song fakebook of stuff I enjoy playing at jams, and have a copy of it at the office now too. That's where most of my playing has gone lately... those songs are actually years old (Longitude dates from 2001 and that recording from 2002).

I have a new accoustic, a Yamaha APX 500BL (http://www.musik-service.de/yamaha-apx-500-bl-prx395756080de.aspx). Its was only cheap, but the neck and action are more like an electric than other accoustics i've played, although strings little close together, and cant do bends as easy. Tone could be better of course, but its nice for its price. Just so easy to pick up and play for a little bit without having to plug in my POD etc. It's small too and more suited to me. A dreadnought body is too big i can barely get my right arm over those, and are uncomfortable to play.

I've been trying to focus enough to play a few songs in their entirity :) I really, really need to get out and play at some blues jams, we have one a month here. Problem is I tend to odder songs, and nobody really plays the older country blues style I enjoy (my boss called it 'sittin on the porch' music). I've mentioned the play-along books I got and they are great for discipline, as the recorder has been. I'm feeling pretty confident (although I'm sure I'll do better than at least a third of the hackers that get up there), but I'm a perfectionist coming from (ok, 15 years ago!) being at the top of the game as a metal bassist, so my standards are set really high.

I'm sure it'll be cool to just sit in on a minor blues jam or something. One thing I'd like to do is get a decent amp to bring along so I'm not struggling with someone else's tone....

Really just a matter of making time to sit and work through multiple versions while recording. I'm way too used to throwing something down and not going back to do better versions. Didn't need to in the old days, we were a one-take live band, so I never built up any discipline...

The fakebook I did is all over the map. From folkie stuff I play (Ellis Paul, Martin Sexton, Dar Williams, Bill Morrissey, Greg Brown) to 80s stuff ("Take on Me" by a-ha is a fun campfire singalong when everyone's drunk enough, Eurythmics, even "Eye of the Tiger" or whatever) to some standards (Ray Charles, "Puttin' on the Ritz," "Summertime," etc). Basically, it's based on "what would make for a fun time of people swapping tunes."

I can play through most any song in the book -- some more "authentic" sounding than most.

I need something like that. I used one in college for jazz standards. But I always had to have my guitar buddy show me the melody lines because I suck at reading music (still). I've got one for renfaire songs (listed at the top of this page). I've also got a few tab books with a crazy plethora of stuff, the White Pages books for Acoustic, Guitar and Bass. Fun to flip through and play a little, but fake books allow for more easy playing of songs, no doubt.

Music purchasing (book and audio) is on hold for a few months while my budget recovers from my new pc (see the $$$ thread in pc forum) and the x-country ski package I bought last night (getting dumped with snow, I'm making the most of it).

Rise!

So after about 5 years I finally picked up my guitar again.  It's a PRS which I bought new in '96.  After a quick string change and some tuning I'm amazed at how well this thing has held up.  There is a little rust on the pick ups, the intonation is a little off, and the truss rods need some adjusting but other than that I think it's good to go. 

So, I'm looking for some advice here.  In the past I took my guitars to a man who built classical instruments for students at U of M.  He was fucking amazing to say the least, but he's also dead now.  I'm looking for some help learning to maintain this thing myself but I'm not finding a definitive source easily.  This thing has 4 (I think) Truss rods and that intimidates me.  So, does anyone have a good guide bookmarked that may be of help?  I've done some searches, read the manual that came with the guitar, and visited the PRS site but I'm still not comfy doing it myself.  I guess I just need to buck up and trust in the fact I'm not going to kill the thing?  Normally I'd try without hesitation, but this guitar is my baby.  I'd have sex with it if I thought I could, I like it that much.

Also, I was shocked to see how little I had lost in the way of dexterity.  Within 20 minutes I was shredding almost as well as I used to.  I remember all my scales, most of my theory, and even a few old songs from my band.  I'm almost glad I took the long break as I have not been this excited about playing since I was a teenager. 

Now the hunt for the perfect amp, and now that I actually make money, this should be a blast.  I have GAS again!

Don't do it.

I like mucking around with guitars a lot, but I even I wouldn't mess with that.

I don't know why PRS did that really. That kind of truss rod setup is really only necessary for super high tension instruments, like 5 or 6 string basses.


However, a good rule of thumb for a tech is: Find the shop in your town that sells boutique equipment. Top Hats, Orange, Mesas. etc.. Or alternatively, a shop that has a lot of vintage equipment. Like a good one with Fender blackfaces, and not just silvers. More than likely, the guys working there know what they're doing. Or simply, find a PRS dealer.

omfgdrool (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gibson-SG-61-Reissue-Antique-Ebony-with-Gold-Hardware-?sku=512788)

A few months after I finally buy the MR8HD....they release a MR16HD (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Fostex-MR16HD-16Track-Digital-Recorder?sku=701051). Goddamned technology. Anyone need a great 8-track? ;)

Posted another guitar instrumental, this one from ten years ago.

http://www.raphkoster.com/2007/04/08/the-sunday-song-the-march-of-the-elephants/

Virtual Band Idea:

I've come up with a short new song which I play mainly on the ukulele. My idea is that I'll record it as a .wav, upload it somewhere for ya'll to download, you'll add something to it, and then re-upload it for the next guy.

Any takers? I think this could be a fun little side project.

Can't hurt. I don't have any permanent upload space though.

That downslide part is perfect. Great song, might be my favorite of your stuff thus far (I hope that doesn't come across as an insult :P). DADGAD I always associate with Jimmy Page, but leave it to you to put on your crazy capo thingy.

My acoustic's neck was warped to hell for about a month or two, but now it's back to only fretting out on a couple bends :| Gotta get it fixed at some point, not sure it's worth what it'd cost, though. I miss the feel of the acoustic where I can really apply a lot more of my fingerpicking and bass styles (though I'm a horrid fingerpicker technically, I just play normal stuff with my fingers).

I'm up for the uke-overdubbing.

Glad you liked the tune, Sky. Me, I associate DADGAD with people like Hedges and Bensusan, but whatever!

I posted some noodling yesterday: http://www.raphkoster.com/2007/04/22/the-sunday-song-pick-em-all-up/

Now you're sounding like me :P Except I don't really write anything ahead of time and don't spend more than 15 minutes or so on stuff. Damned ADHD imo. I did do a version of a Willie Dixon tune I'm fond of, using some backing tracks I got in a book. The backing tracks are real hit-or-miss (the organ parts on Thrill is Gone are obnoxious) but it's nice to get into the swing of playing with a full band again, so I can put a lot more space in my playing (or could if I could). I do want to clean it up some, then I'll post it. Maybe that instrumental Thrill is Gone at some point, too. I've been busy, but as usual it's all sloppy stuff just jamming or jotting down ideas (I wrote a love song, heh).

Banjo debut! Intertube connection at work is being it's usual shit self, so I only got about a quarter in. Nice stuff, you make me want a mandolin :|

So....

I sold my Vibro-King (at a profit heh). Sweet, sweet amp (if you can recall (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/lonestar627/Guitars/VK_and_Jazzmaster.jpg)), but too much amp for me (I mean, to give an indication, freakin' Pete Townsend uses them....and I'm not Pete). It was also very high maintenance ($200+ for tube replacements, for example).

I'll probably get a Deluxe Reverb to replace it. 22 Watter, and unlike the VK, can be saturated at acceptable levels. Good for garages and possibly small clubs.


Anyways, I still have my Vox Valvetronix for now. The preamp's kind of finnicky in it, but it's a cool little thing. Not really an ideal alternative to real valves though.

I went through the amp dilemma last year iirc (Heh...page 9!). I still don't have a decent amp and I want to start playing at the blues jam nights (I'm part of the local Blues Society, cool group). I just don't have the dough to do it right, right now.

All I have now is my practice Pignose and my old bass practice amp, a 125W Peavey Mk III (run through a 400W 15" EV full-range in a Dean Markley cab). Both sound pretty crappy, even running through my Boss GT6. These days I usually am running direct through my mixer into my Sennheisers, so I'm all set to punch record if I stumble across something cool.

I need to do a LOT of test driving amps because my amp knowledge is circa 1993, and it was all about the MONSTER STACKS. In fact, I'd still like to get a nice Marshall tube half-stack for grins. But in reality, a nice club amp is what I need right now. A 1x12 or 2x10 kinda deal, maybe tubes. I'd prefer to ditch my Boss GT6 for my blues stuff and just use it to record, so an amp that has a good tone and breaks up nicely for leads would be perfect. I had a Peavey 2x12 for a while in the 80s, and it was a nice amp, but might be too beefy for blues.

Try the Deluxe Reverb I mentioned above. Either that, or a Custom Vibrolux. They break up nicely (to say the least) at acceptable volumes (the Lux can be pretty loud though...But it's wired to break up earlier).

I like loud, I'm an old metal guy ;) But I want to be good in the mix, I'm more of a team player, partly from playing bass for so long (though as a bass player, I had the guitarist tendency to crank my amp...). Lookiloo at musiciansfriend (as I have no dough), the Fender Blues Deluxe looks decent (40W 1x12). The Super Reverb I mentioned before would be nice (45W 4x10), but probably too loud for clubs and too heavy to tug around.

One thing that drives me nuts are all these blues guys that only talk about SRV in the comment threads.

The Super Reverb is the pretty the be all end all of blackface Fender amps (while the VK I had was the be all end all for blondes and tweeds, and bassman types).

Yeah, it's a kickass amp. And very loud (remember that Little Johnny Jewel track I posted here awhile back? That was a Super Reverb, but with a Tube Screamer).

Also, there's probably too much headroom than you're looking for. You'll get great clean sounds at very high volumes, but won't hear breakup until the very upper limit.

The Deluxe Reverb I mentioned is basically a mini version of the SR (sort of...it's a little brighter, especially with single coils). Standard blackface sound, but breaks up early.


If you really want to cut into a mix though, high mids is what you should go for. That's where a Vox AC (or an Orange for that matter) kicks everyone's ass. They make single 12" models now, so you should test one out.

[EDIT]

Excuse this guy's guitar face, but he provides a good sample of the Deluxe Reverb for blues playing. This is what it'd sound like through a Gibson once it breaks up. Different story with Fenders, of course.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JlvXI71FKg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JlvXI71FKg)

[edit] Fixed link :)

I've gotta get more stuff up on the tube.  Note I don't show my face when I play  :-P

I had one good blues jam on my acoustic...but I forgot to put on pants, hehe. Woops, I won't inflict that on you guys.

It should be mentioned that that same guy has a Super Reverb vid as well. I think he modded the speakers a bit, but you'll find that it and the Deluxe Reverb are similar in tone with a Gibson. Just one's a fuckload louder than the other.

I recently acquired a Marshall MG 250DFX.  After 9 years of never having an amplifier that worked, this thing is quite impressive.  Sure, it's digital and doesn't use tubes, therefore I'm not ready to be a professional just yet, but I love the sound it gives to my crappy guitars ;-)

I had something similar at one time (actually, I had the exact amp, I think. Except it was an older model with just chorus). Never could get into those Marshalls though (I mean, Marshall from the 80's to Present). Great high gain, shredding sound... But not much in the way of simple overdrive and cleans. Especially with Fenders and single coil guitars, which sound pretty atrocious with them.

Not that I don't like metal or anything, but I always feel limited with them.

Reading a guitar history book (see the Book Thread). Turns out we tabtards are traditionalists. Next time some haughty sight-reader of 'traditional' notation gives you shit for being a tabtard (dunno 'bout you guys, I get shit all the time from jazztards and the like, but I was in school and whatnot), tell them that what we call tablature now is how guitar was originally transcribed in the 16th century. I flipped the first time I turned the page and saw a sheet of 16th century music in tablature!

I don't play with too many notation readers really. One of my friends is a trumpet player, but he's easy to communicate ideas with. There's another friend who plays piano. She isn't difficult about it or anything, but she gets preachy sometimes (but in a nice way).

I've ran into strangers across the years though that sound like the jazz guys you mention, but not much.

Pretty cool.

http://damncoolpics.blogspot.com/2007/04/lego-guitar.html (http://damncoolpics.blogspot.com/2007/04/lego-guitar.html)

(http://bp0.blogger.com/_mmBw3uzPnJI/RipwlR37UHI/AAAAAAAADf4/759qBsr4O0k/s400/lego_guitar_05.jpg)


Not sure why he put real pickups in it though.

Jazz players can't talk -- a jazz guitar lead sheet isn't much more than the main riff in notation, and a set of chords.

Tablature is a superior notation for stringed plucked instruments because timbre varies from string to string and position to position. In jazz guitar, for example, they avoid playing open strings because of this fact. 5 on the E and 0 on the A just sound different; and 4 on the G and 0 on the B sound WAY different.

If only tab also notated some of the other subtleties -- like strum hand position. After all, timbre varies significantly depending on whether you are playing by the bridge, soundhole, or close to the neck. Naturally, you electric players cheat and just adjust your pickups to only pick up the stuff you want. Us acoustic guys get to mix it up personally, analog, just by moving our hand!

Those of us with a guitar that has 2 dead sets of pickups and only one working set actually get to do this too!  It's amazing how you can vary the way a string is played just by moving the position you strum from.  I've always done this instead of using nifty effects that fancy-pants professionals use.  I like to think it makes me cooler, but it really doesn't (at least my mom likes me).

Yeah, you misunderstand us electric guys Raph ;). Perhaps it's a little more subtle, but positioning is still used for changing timbre on electrics too. Probably more with certain styles than others (say, country players who transition between chicken pickin' leads high on their bridges and then into the low end for those bassy Johnny Cash/Duane Eddy type rhythms).

I know there's some songs of mine where changing to a neck pickup just doesn't get what I want -- but playing low with a bridge pickup setting hits the timbre I'm looking for.

I was just teasing. I do have that 62 Melody maker, remember? It's got 2 P90s in it... so I know how it works. :)

And some of us are stringed instrumentalists, the electric is only one of several instruments we play :P I'm in a money crunch (still) with trying to buy a house, but I want to get a bit more variety in my lineup: a mandolin, a resonator, a charango, a lute, some early guitars like chittarinos or something. But I love playing my acoustic equally as much as my electric, there's so much you can do on it that you can't do on the other, they're extremely complementary. And honestly, I'm still getting used to pickup switching and playing with volumes and tones. The SG is great for that (like the Les Paul), my old guitars were so shitty I was better off not touching the electronics!

As for rt-hand position, it's critical in some tunes. When I play All Your Love by Otis Rush, where it breaks into the solo arpeggiated triad, it's nice to move up close to the neck and get a real nice rich ringing tone, and when you slide down to the Bm triad it usually sends shivers down my spine.

Conversely, I like to play right on the bridge for the opening of Wish You Were Here by Floyd. That song has served me so well back when I'd sit in with hippies and use it as trade for reefers. Right-hand position subtlety gave me an edge over a lot of other guitarists, because Floyd used a few sounds on that track.

Wrote a new song last night at 1am, my poor landlord. I can direct-in to my recorded but the vocals...well, I'm loud. At least I don't have my drums there. It's a new spin on Kind-Hearted Woman, with a little Allman-y feel to the vocals (at least that's where I want it to end up, I'm not a great vocalist).

I went to the London Guitar Show this weekend. As its the UK hardly any of the big names had stands, and wasnt much on show that really took my fancy as i did plan on buying a V with a Floyd Rose. Played around on the Dean stall (low end models nice, high end 2900 GBP USA Dean new Razorback V model was incredibly disappointing), with some rather nice ESPs, watched the Sikth (http://www.sikth.com/) guitarists do a demo, which was awesome power/extreme metal/mathcore, and caught a bit of Phil Hilborne and Nicko McBrain doing their usual LGS show, which included guest vocals by Bruce Dickinson.

The highlight of the show had to be:

BlackMachine Guitars (http://www.blackmachine.net/)

In particular, one with handwound Nailbomb pickups (http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/ZH-nailbomb.html) that we played through a Diezel amp and cab (http://www.diezel.ch/en/news/download_read.php?mode=listall)

Wow, just wow. Once you've played a luthier made guitar using handmade pickups and through a handbuilt amp, (total cost of setup was roughly 8000 GBP) nothing will be ever be quite the same again.

I can't emphasize how badass that VK I had was. It was handmade too -- the only handmade amps Fender does anymore (that can be had through retail channels at least). It was one of the first ones they made at that.

But....Like I said. It was too much amp for me.

My pickups are custom as well (Curtis Novak (http://www.curtisnovak.com/pickups/jazzmaster.shtml)). As is my main stompbox (http://www.klon-siberia.com/).


The weak link in the chain is my guitar --- but I meticulously set it up myself. Down to sanding the small moving parts. That counts for something, right?  :-D


Heh. Actually, as far as guitars go, I'd want vintage more than some custom job. If only because the feel of a played in neck is superior to anything else. And can't really be replicated. Besides, guitars back then were made with more personal care too.

This is why I'm not impressed by the Trans-Siberian Orchestra.  My cousin, by himself in his homemade studio, basically did what it took them a ton more people and money to accomplish.  He's even started playing drums now, damn him.

Christmas Rush, as he's titled it (http://travisaustin.bluedomino.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/thechristmasrush.mp3)

I haven't heard anything from them except....whatever that song is that gets played on the radio a lot.



Anyhow, he recorded it well. Not to criticize too much or anything, but is he only playing the snare part? Sounds like the rest of the drum kit is a drum machine.

Much as I would liike a decent amp, I live in a small flat, so my amp is an old Peavy thing of my bro's that I think is broken and is little more than a speaker for the POD.  More often than not I run guitar into POD into earphones. My next guitar is going to be something spiky, EMGs or Nailbombs, with a Floyd, 12-70s and tuned so low the strings flap in the wind.

Brutal.

 :rock:


I think TSO only release Christmas stuff? The website didn't show much else.

I can't imagine a guitar feeling better in my hands than my 61 reissue (except, I guess, a 61 SG but I think Townshend broke them all ;)). I lament the Taylor classical I let slip by me last year, it's literally the only classical I've ever played that didn't feel like a plank (http://invention.smithsonian.org/centerpieces/guitars/images/eg08.jpg). I'm bringing my Alvarez back into shape, the neck was a bit out of whack for a few months there but I have hope for her. She plays pretty damned nice for an acoustic.

I want to get a cheapish acoustic to have here at the office so I can work on some stuff during lunch now and again, I just hate wasting money on cheap guitars that play like shit. Maybe one of those trashy high school classicals or something. I'm still considering a Baby Taylor, but that's too nice to leave sitting at the office imo.

Llava, if I didn't say it last time you posted his stuff, he's Splendid.

Penfold, you'd like my bass, it's EXTREME SPIKY. I'd have to take a picture, can't find any online (it's from the ESP shop in hollyweird).

Yeah, that's all I'm saying. A real 61 would be better. Just for the neck alone.

And 61 (and pre) PAF pickups are another story entirely. All of them were custom back then, so Gibson doesn't have any set spec to replicate them in a reissue. Unfortunately, this is what makes them so difficult to get your hands on now. 50's and 60's Gibson pickups alone (not the guitars) sell up to $10,000 a piece.

I keep my Baby at the office. Also one of those Nomad electrics with the built-in speakers (the Star Wars limited edition, no less). I always say it sounds like a dying duck.

Nope, he said it's "live acoustic drums" performed by him.

Ah cool. Just a variance in the snare level I guess. Good job though, I dig it :).

OK, that other thread did it for me. I am definitely going to buy a new guitar. The problem is, I do not know what to look out for. Almost 15 years ago (wow, that is a really long time *shudder*) bought a guitar and tried to play. Sadly I never took any lessons and the thing I bought was one broken piece of shit, even friends of mine who where really good players at that time found it frustrating to play.

So, any good advice (apart from the "practice, practice, practice part, I know that already :-D ) on what kind of instrument I should look out for ?

I haven't shopped for a guitar in a long long time and I'm not sure what's available where you are at but my suggestion would be to start with a Fender Standard Stratocaster since those should be relatively easy to find (there are a lot of different Stratocaster models, the Standard is one of the cheaper ones). If you remember some basic barr cords try out the fingerboard and study how it feels playing it (or holding it as the case may be :D) standing up wearing a strap and sitting down, paying special attention to the feel and shape of the back of the fingerboard (the way it curves). That plus the shape/size of your hand is going to dictate in large part how comfortable and easy the guitar will be to play for you.

Then just start comparing the Strat to other guitars in your price range and pick one you like.

Edit: typos

Just find a guitar shop with a lot of decent guitars and try each one. You don't have to be able to play them well, just see how each feels in your hands. That's the most important thing, you can always change pickups to get a different sound, but neck/body feel is critical, even in a cheap guitar. If it's awkward to play, you'll be less likely to practice as often.

I planned on getting a strat when I got my sg, so keep an open mind and try 'em all :)

Agree with Sky, I had no idea I would have picked up a Gibson Corvus II back in '85, still have it and just got it re-strung and tuned up...now to find a small practice amp (I could get a mini-stack from Marshall, Carvin, Mesa Boogie, etc...), was thinking of getting an Ibanez or Kramer back then (would have been there budget guitars) and the quality on the Corvus was much better than the cheap imports by Kramer and Ibanez.  I owe it to my 11 year old for having picked it up again, he is jamming on the keyboard and violin and sometimes he strums my guitar, wish I had his ear (he figured out Ode to Joy & Star Spangled Banner on the keyboard by ear).  I used to date a gal that had a beautiful Ovation, would love to have one of those too.

Whenever I practice major scale stuff (my kryptonite), I end up slipping into the First Noel for some reason. My ears just pick it out every time.

On my thinking about getting a Baby or something for the office...now I'm thinking of maybe getting a strat instead. Maybe a tele. If I can get a decent one on the cheap, anyway. Thing is, the local blues jam (which I'm getting up the fortitude to join in) was in a nice, safe hotel bar for a year. Now it's in the damn ghetto and I'm not bringing a $1500 guitar there! And, of course, I was thinking of playing this wednesday...but they invited the local media to film the event  :|

I love my $60 guitar for this reason.  I'd be very unhappy if someone stole it just because it has such sentimental value, but it sure doesn't look like something that would command high dollar.  I even used to carry it around in an old Target bag back before I managed to locate a case for it.

I have a cheap guitar (free), but it's set up for slide, the action is wicked high and I keep it in open G. I guess I could bring it and play slide, but I'm trying to learn how to sing the tunes I play on slide, especially I Can't Be Satisfied and Kind Hearted Woman. I posted a version of Satisfied here played on that crappy guitar a while back. I can cover maybe better than half of each, but that just don't cut it in my thinking ;)

Just looked up the jampod thing we tallked about a long time ago (plug your guitar into the ipod and play along)...doesn't work with 5G ipods :(

Continuing from the Live Music thread...last week was a great music week. Great blues jam Wednesday and Guy Davis Saturday. Also picked up Andy Aledort's Hendrix DVD. I was a big Hendrix fan when I was a kid, some of the first stuff I played badly on guitar. He does a nice job laying things out if you know what you're about, for beginners it would be real rough. I only intended on learning Little Wing (finally..and in preparation of learning the SRV version, which is one of my guitar milestones I want to hit), but I just started playing along from the beginning and ended up working on Spanish Castle Magic, inserting my own solos (of course!).

Good stuff, ten bones is a pittance for inspiration imo.

Little Wing is quite a milestone, but was never anything I've tried. I always wanted to get a feel for Jimi's funk oriented riffs though (Ezy Ryder, Crosstown Traffic, and especially Straight Ahead). I love those funky little grooves he was doing later in his life.

Thank you for this thread...

I spent a good portion of my weekend listening to some CD's and reminding myself why I need to play my bass more.  My finger tips are still sore from about 8h playing and I'm embarrassed by how much my skills have deteriorated since I used to play professionally.  I have a mid-1970's Fender Jazz that I play through a crappy old crate bass head and a homemade 2x12 enclosure (sold most of my gear 10+ years ago).  I have a few pedals that I like to mess with (phaser, chorus, compressor) but usually opt for a mid-supressed, clean sound. I play mostly with my fingers but will play with a pick when the mood strikes me.  I prefer a softer pick for running and a hard pick when I want attack punch.  Anyway, I thought I'd share the list of CD's with you guys.  It's a mixed bag of styles, but the techniques were a great exercise in humility. 

The Best of Larry Graham and Graham Central Station:  Great funk groove with some great slap techniques in E.

Jaco Pastorius, Self titled:  While I think Jaco was a bit more self-indulgent than musical, songs like Donna Lee are an outstanding example of breaking the typical jazz bass mold. Great harmonics exercises.

Stanley Clarke, School Days: Classic combination of scales, funk, and chording.  One of the kings of bass guitar.

Cream, Disraeli Gears: Jack Bruce and his no nonsense style.  Always fun to emulate.

Rush, Circumstances:  I have a hard enough time trying to play the title track without trying to imagine singing it as well.  Geddy Lee is one bassist that reminds me that I'll never be more than average technically.  I spent a lot of time retraining myself to double pick with my fingers.  I need work.

Yes, Fragile: Christopher Squire... need I say more. The circular scale patterns give me fits on occasion.  I find I can actually play this stuff better when I just stop tring to think about what I'm doing and just let it flow. 

Beatles, Revolver and Sgt. Pepper:  While not all that difficult technically, I always get great pleasure from playing songs like Taxman and A Day in the Life.  I enjoy McCartney's musical style as it's both rhythmic and approachable.

Victor Wooten, Live in America:  This guy is a bit all over the place, but there's no denying his natural talent.  Great practice for hammer, funk, and harmonics work.  If I had 1/10th of this guy's natural ability, I'd die a happy man. 

Primus, They Can't all be zingers: While I love Claypool for his talent, he can get to be a bit repetitive.  His singing grates on me after a while as well, but I think there's a lot to be learned from his style. 

Note: I made this list from memory, so I apologize for any errors. 

McCartney doesn't get enough credit as a bass player imo.


Besides him and Jack Bruce, your tastes confuse me a little (nothing wrong with others though, of course). I always thought you were more into the "no nonsense" Motown type grooves, but it seems like you're more into progressive and virtuosic stuff.

Stray, I think I'm confusing in that the music I enjoy listening to is often very different than the music I learn from.  You're right in that I enjoy a more straightforward approach in the music I listen to, but these cd's are a staple for educating myself as a musician.  I don't want to directly emulate these guys, but they do a great deal to help me grow in my playing repertoire. Does that make sense?  I also wanted to offer up this as a list of cd's that have a lot to offer the bass community.  It's a diverse collection of some of the most talented bass players across genres. 

This weekend also had me wishing I still had my early 70's Rick 4001.  I'm going to start browsing eBay to see if I can find another one.  I miss the growl that only a Rick with flatwounds can provide. 

Looking back it seems I didn't even buy a guitar until page 7 of this thread, and now I'm on my fourth, a sign, I suspect, that I could be turning into a collector. The low price of the dollar has driven the US guitar market prices right down, even in the UK, which is why I've managed to pick up a Jackson Custom Shop Soloist.

(http://img120.imagevenue.com/loc418/th_79938_CS_Soloist_21_122_418lo.jpg) (http://img120.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=79938_CS_Soloist_21_122_418lo.jpg)   (http://img14.imagevenue.com/loc1049/th_80032_CS_Soloist_20_122_1049lo.jpg) (http://img14.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=80032_CS_Soloist_20_122_1049lo.jpg)

More or less my dream guitar seeing I love the Chlorine Blue Quilt top that their custom shop do.  The Dimarzio Evolution pickups scream like a b***h, very hot. One of the strings is broken so I will replace them all with 9s and give the fret a clean, and then wrestle with the Floyd for a bit as I learn to string one. I've helped my friend restring his but not quite the same when sitting there alone.  I'll probably take it down the local shop to get the tech to set it up for some heavier strings and lower tunings at a later point, I'm not 100% sure on innotations and if I need extra springs etc and its too expensive to experiment on. 

As my playing abilties are coming on a bit slower than I am capable of (laziness really), it's a bit of a case of a newbie driver buying himself a V8, but I can see this lasting me a very long time.

I have been experimenting with recording over the weekend, playing about with the track in colloboration thread, as well as some of my own metal tunes. Its nice to actually hear things that sound like music and for it to all start gradually coming together.

Really nice. Cool idea to go with maple too.

I've never had a shredder like that myself, but I've always wanted one. Kind of sucks when you get in that mood, and all you've got are Fenders and Gibsons (which is to say, they can wail plenty -- but they can't scream ;).

When I was playing bass, my main inspirations were Geezer Butler and Steve Harris. Geez for the bluesy jamming (actually the basis of my current blues led playing, heh...everyone said I played bass like a lead guitar and now I play lead guitar like I played bass...) and Steve for the omg thumping rhythms. Imo there weren't a whole lot of good role models for metal bass players, and I didn't (and mostly still don't) like jazz. Oh, and Cliff Burton of course. Monster fingers and great theory, he is what turned me onto incorporating classical fingerpicking on the bass.

You think you're bummed about your technique? I used to be at the very physical limits of what I could do on the bass. Fast fingers, great chording, a triplet that only Steve Harris could beat...I miss impressing the shit out of every band I met in CA, it was great for the ego. Funny, because I always saw my limitations and don't consider myself braggy, I jsut honestly admitted my skills, but a lot of people thought I had a big ego. Some folks never truly listen to you, though, and hear how much I know I don't know and how much I daily strove to be better, practicing a solid eight hours a day back then when I was in a band (and in music school for a while). Bah. Played a bit last night and tore my fingers up, which is good for my guitar fingerstyle.

You should also add the mighty Duck Dunn to your list. Stax records stuff like Albert King's  Born Under A Bad Sign. There's also a book called What Duck Done that's been on my Amazon wishlist for a while.

Penfold - that's a hot guitar. When I was still playing guitar in my band (metal), I had a strat knockoff loaded with EMGs (the /other/ hot pickup) and a really nice pearl white finish BC Rich Bich with a rosewood fretboard. Unfortunately, I broke my Rich :| and never had money to get a decent guitar after that. The gear I used to play when I was in a band was actually pretty sad, but I feel it taught me how to pull a great sound out of subpar gear. Basically I used a Proco Rat into a clean amp head (Kasino or summat) I got at a hock shop. Later I got a Laney full stack, but I never liked it as much (the speakers, yes, 8x12 celestions).

Our other guitarist had a super hot Ibanez custom he picked up in Hollywood, it had a really cool polychrome purple/blue finish (like those shirts that change color depending on the angle).

I never liked the floating bridges or tremolo bars, I always took 'em off my guitars. I did have a locking nut on both my guitars, those are nice. Floyd Rose...ecch, I've played a few, not my style.

When you get it worked on, be sure to ask the tech if you can look over his shoulder. Ask questions if he doesn't mind. A good guitar is never a bad investment, imo!

Nothing but love for trem bars here. I wish I sounded like this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASF30_WXL9E). MBV is sex.

I've always dug the more traditional (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Adue3e3blO4) stuff as well. The guy who taught how to play was an old surf guitarist, and that's never left me.


And I freakin' love those harmonic dives (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TpYcA9bSaU&mode=related&search=) Dimebag used to pull off. They're the only reason why I'd want a shredder axe. Otherwise, Jazzmasters and Jags are fine by me.


I like pretty much whatever I can do to warp guitar sounds. Whether it be with different tunings or effects or slides or trem bars.

I'm in the market for an acoustic resonator. If it's old an worn, that's great since I'll be using it for slide guitar. I don't mind buying online since I can be less particular about quality since it'll be set up for slide.

If you guys are selling one, or happen to see one, let me know?

Thanks

You can get new ones pretty cheap.

Or relatively cheap. I mean, you're not going find anything good for $50 if that's what you're after. I wouldn't even recommend any of those off brands under $200.


Here's the cheapest Regal (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Regal-RD30-Resonator?sku=518044) for $260.

Yeah, I'm looking at the 200-300 dollar range. I don't have any experience with guitar makers other than the big names. Do you have any good info on lower end guitar makers? I'm not good enough to take advantage of having a really nice guitar. I sound the same either way.

edit: Also, what about ebaying instruments? Any experience with that?

Regal is good (they range from semi-budget to pricey). They're one of the only companies that specializes in them these days (and they've been around since the 30's).

National/Dobro is the more expensive brand. The truly old school resonator maker. They're owned by Gibson now. Don't bother though -- Their cheapest instruments are still in the $1000 range.

Fender is Fender. I've messed with them a bunch in stores. Servicable quality like their acoustics, but nothing to get crazy about. You can't really go wrong with one though.


Off brands are crap like "Rogue" that you see at GC or Musicians Friend. Sometimes another store may have the same exact Korean made guitars under a different brand name. Don't bother. Don't buy electrics, acoustics, or anything else from these companies. You're lucky if they're even set up right when you get them -- or even warped -- and even if they are, they'll magically fall apart in your hands eventually. Don't buy off brand electronics either (even practice amps). They'll crap out on you and sound like shit anyways.

Thanks Stray. I'll see if I can find a Regal around here. I'm excited to get a resonator because I love the sound they give my blues, and if I develop my slide stuff I'll have a real good time. My biggest problem with slide is an alternating bass line. I've started to play with fingerpicks, but I broke my hand in a motorcycle accident once and my ring finger doesn't cooperate well. With any luck I'll be able to work with a two finger setup.

I can't do alternating bass lines with slide. A whole lot of pros can't either. Hell, not even Robert Johnson did that (though he'd move to bass parts at the closing of a verse or whatnot, or maybe just do a simple pluck on the open bottom string).

[EDIT] Or maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying.

If you're going for pick heavy slide playing, you're going to have more difficulty alternating through certain types of bass parts. Picking is better for focusing on leads.

If you want a fuller rhythm slide sound with bass parts, drop the pick. Pluck everything.

I'm tuned to open D, and my typical playing is something like a low D bass line, then work my way up the strings for licks and back down to the D for a bass line. I don't sing at all, so I use the high D(and other strings, but mainly the D) like my vocal and the low D in between. That's how I get around alternating bass.

While I'm not as loud without a pick, I pretty much play with a bare thumb and forefinger.

Hmm, can't say I give much advice for open D.

I play open D a lot, but rarely do it for sliding (I like open E and G, and even this weird Gm tuning I sort of..made up. I think.).

I'm still upset whenever I see a Dime vid, such a waste.  Tom Morello is also one for making sounds that don't sound like he's playing it on a guitar. The Dragonforce guys have some excellent whammy tricks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtUiQJc7ZMI) too. I can't get enough of Dragonforce, video game music+ridiculously fast dual lead shredding+tons of tricks=teh fun.
 
Doubt anyone else here is into metal as much as I am, but for that type of music the ESP Ltd range is the best quality and guitars for the 300-900GBP bracket, played 3 or 4 of the models and they've all played and sounded really nice, on the higher end Korean made Ltds you get original brand electronics and hardware too (EMGs, original Floyd's and other bridges, Sperzel tuners etc), something lacking from most other makes at that price. 

Iirc, open D and E are just a whole step different, same intervals. Open G is the oddball (and the one I play in, because lots of the delta blues guys used it). You could also look into clawhammer banjo style, it only uses thumb + 1, again iirc.

The voicing just sits with me better in Open E. It's just one of those weird things...

The tension level on my guitars is better set up for the tightness of E as well. It just doesn't feel right sliding in D to me. I play completely different in D.

My open G guitar is set up wicked high action and like a friggin' high tension wire. Great for sliding, though.

Guitar-ish question:

I've been wanting to start 'playing' again.  'Playing' being used very loosely.  Problem is, I don't have anyone to noodle or jam around with.  I'm mostly selftaught, and pretty much suck.  But I enjoy(ed) it nonetheless.  Anyway, what I am looking for is something that I can throw a CD in or other media in which music is saved, start it up, and play along with it with my guitar mixed in.  The ghetto version would just be to turn up my stereo to a decent level to match my amp, but that's not really feasible with a 5.5 month old in the house.  Something that mixes the guitar/amp with the music and with a headphone output would be ideal.

Anything like that, or am I SOL?

Tascam has this guitar trainer thing I've seen around. I haven't used it though, so I'm not sure if it works well.

http://www.tascam.com/Products/cdgt1mkii.html (http://www.tascam.com/Products/cdgt1mkii.html)

Basically, it's a portable CD player that allows you to "cancel" out guitar sounds on CD's, so you can jam along with songs (I'm really not sure how it accomplishes that, since there aren't multiple tracks for CD audio). Basically, it's karaoke for guitarists.

It also allows you to change tempo and loop parts to help you learn riffs better.

Very cool, that's exactly what I was looking for - thanks.  Good set of earphones and I'll be living arena rock dreams in my living room and scaring the shit out of the dog.

And what about keyboards? I was thinking of buying one to use for input to a computer. I'd want a semi-nice once, but I don't know the first thing about them. I'd expect it to have a few different sounds, i.e. piano and synth and strings. I really dont know what I'm looking at as far as keyboards go, so if you've got any experience I'd appreciate it.

This may seem like a ghetto choice, but you really can't go wrong just starting with a simple Yamaha. They have enough decent, built in instruments to have fun with, as well as MIDI connectivity to expand on that. Most of them usually come with helpful training materials, so you can at least throw down some chords in no time. Just get something with at least 61 keys and you'll be set.

I dunno, I really want to get a keyboard for the old lady. She used to play, and now she feels I'm pressuring her too much. Hell, I just want someone to jam with, and she only needs three chords to get up and running on the blues, I'm not expecting Billy Powell (Skynyrd, great keyboarder). My motto is 'if you had bought (instrument x) when you first said you wanted to, you'd have been playing for (x years) already!'. The president of our blues society got that one last week when he was pining away about playing bass.

You just gotta jump in feet first and swim to shore, imo. Best way to learn is to start playing.

Anyway, I want to get something with full keys and good weights so it feels like a real piano. Good natural piano sound, maybe a leslie sound, probably wouldn't need any other gadgety stuff. Looks like anything decent is in the $1000+ range.

Posted another old track. Stretch Williams on lead guitar, me on the acoustic. It's a blues, Stray & Sky. :)

http://www.raphkoster.com/2007/05/27/the-sunday-song-share-some-secrets/

Cool on the whole, gets a bit too jazzy for my tastes. I like the kinda darker tone, though. I've been too lax in recording to share :(

I've written a couple nice stubs, though. Good beginnings to songs, seeds. I'm just not used to doing all the fleshing and finishing by myself, curse of having a band full of talented writers. I'd bring in a stub and have a full song an hour later.

Posted this from gak, maybe 1998. Off analog tape. Tune's still fun though.

http://www.raphkoster.com/2007/06/17/the-sunday-song-son-de-don-con

Oh snappity snap.

We hosted a jazz night with a great local musician last week, my band had recorded our only studio work with him in Jan 91. On a lark (because one of my core beliefs is the closed mouth does not get fed), I asked if he still had our master laying around. Not only did he remember the session, he said he had the tape.

I didn't post it here, because I frankly didn't want to get my hopes up. We had little money and he said he was probably going to record over the master. The last copy I had of that tape was one a fan had given me and went missing (ok, stolen) a solid twelve years ago.

Just got back from the studio, master in hand!  :-o :-D :heart:

Now the problem is getting it off this 8-track reel to digital files so I can remix it to cd and try to look up my old band members' addresses and sent them this incredible find out of the blue.

It's a goddamned good day...hopefully I can find someone to do the transfer...I still can't believe it and I'm looking at the tape.

You say it like it's a bad thing. I liked the sound of it, I favor rough live-sounding recordings. Was always getting into trouble when I was in school for that. Might be my favorite of yours, nice and vibrant, and as you say, rockin'.

Just got a new 12-string acoustic by Carlo Robelli.  Sam Ash was giving them away.  Now I just need to learn how to play.

I was adding a half dozen tunes to my fakebook tonight (prompted by the Paul Simon Gershwin Prize special on PBS) and I thought I would post the song list. I can play anything on this list, to varying degrees of competency depending on how recently I have played it and how often I play it. That's with the book in front of me, of course. No book, and all bets are off. :)

The book was designed after The Fat Man's famous fakebook from his 20-year running jam session in Austin. My song list has almost no overlap with his, however. Basically, it's built for drunken singalongs, campfires, song circles, that sort of thing. You'll notice a lot of the singer-songwriter stuff I like. Euro readers will note that there is actually a recent a-ha song in there (American readers will be dismayed and somewhat boggled). Also, there's an Xmas tunes section at the back, but I didn't bother listing it.

PS, yes, I know, I am missing a ton of Beatles stuff that ought to be in there.

0-9
1952 Vincent Black Lightning - Richard Thompson
3,000 Miles – Ellis Paul
32 Flavors – Ani diFranco

A
Across the Universe – The Beatles
Addicted to Love – Robert Palmer
Africa – Toto
Afterglow - INXS
Against All Odds – Phil Collins
Ain’t No Sunshine – Bill Withers
All Along the Watchtower - Bob Dylan
Alleluia - Dar Williams
Allentown  - Billy Joel
America – Simon & Garfunkel
American Tune – Paul Simon
A Most Peculiar Man – Simon & Garfunkel
And She Was – Talking Heads
Angel From Montgomery – John Prine
Angeline – James McMurtry
Another Folk Song - Uncle Bonsai
Ants Marching – Dave Matthews Band
April Come She Will - Simon and Garfunkel
Are You Happy Now? – Richard Shindell
Are You Out There - Dar Williams
As Close to Flying - Christine Lavin

B
Baby’s Gone Blues – Reckless Kelly
Bad to the Bone – George Thorogood
Bamboleo – Gipsy Kings
The Bare Necessities – Jungle Book movie
Beautiful Wreck – Shawn Mullins
Because the Night – Bruce Springsteen
Beer Run – Todd Snider
Bein' Green – The Muppet Movie
Biko – Peter Gabriel
Billie Jean - Michael Jackson
Billy From The Hills - Greg Brown
Birches - Bill Morrissey
Black Horse and the Cherry Tree – KT Tunstall
Black Sheep – Martin Sexton
Blacktop Train – Ellis Paul
Black Velvet – Alannah Myles
Blister in the Sun - Violent Femmes
Blood and Fire - Indigo Girls
Blow ‘Em Away – Chuck Brodsky
Blowin’ in the Wind - Bob Dylan
Born to Be Wild - Steppenwolf
Boy in the Bubble - Paul Simon
A Boy Named Sue – Johnny Cash
Boys of Summer  - Don Henley
Breakfast at Tiffany's - Deep Blue Something
Bridge Over Troubled Water – Simon & Garfunkel
Broken Wings – Mr. Mister
Brown Eyed Girl – Van Morrison
Burning Down the House – Talking Heads

C
California Dreamin’ - The Mamas and the Papas
Castanets - Alejandro Escovedo
Cat Came Back - Harry S. Miller
Cat Came Back (Muppets version)
Cat’s in the Cradle - Harry Chapin
Center Stage - Indigo Girls
The Chain – Fleetwood Mac
Changed the Locks - Lucinda Williams
Christians and the Pagans - Dar Williams
Chrome Plated Heart - Melissa Etheridge
Cinnamon Girl – Neil Young
Closer to Fine - Indigo Girls
Close to You – The Carpenters
Comes Love – Billie Holiday
Come Together – The Beatles
Coming Up for Air - Patty Larkin
Conversation With a Ghost – Ellis Paul
Copacabana - Barry Manilow
Copperhead Road – Steve Earle
Cradle and All – Ani diFranco
Crime for Crime – Ani diFranco

D
Dancing Queen - ABBA
Dangling Conversation - Simon & Garfunkel
Dear Abby - John Prine
Deep Soul Diver  - disappear fear
Desire – U2
Devil Inside – INXS
Diamond In The Rough - Shawn Colvin
Don't Ask Me Why  - Billy Joel
Down by the River – Neil Young
Downeaster 'Alexa' - Billy Joel
Down Under – Men at Work
Dude (Looks Like A Lady) – Aerosmith

E
Eleanor Rigby – The Beatles
End of the Innocence – Don Henley
Every Little Bit - Patty Griffin
Everybody Hurts- REM
Every Breath You Take – The Police
Eye of the Hurricane - David Wilcox
Eye of the Tiger – Survivor

F
Fast Car - Tracy Chapman
Father and Son - Cat Stevens
February – Dar Williams
Feelin’ Groovy - Simon & Garfunkel
Fields Of Gold - Sting
Flake – Jack Johnson
Flintstones – TV Theme
Follow That Road - Anne Hills
Folsom Prison Blues – Johnny Cash
For Emily, Wherever I May Find Her - Simon and Garfunkel
For my Lover -Tracy Chapman
The Fox – Nickel Creek
Fragile    - Sting
Free Fallin' - Tom Petty

G
Get Right With God – Lucinda Williams
Ghostbusters – Ray Parker Jr
Ghost of a Dog – Edie Brickell & The New Bohemians
Gimme Some Lovin’ – Spencer Davis Group
Give me One Reason - Tracy Chapman
Glory Bound – Martin Sexton
Goin’ Down Judah – Dana Cooper
Good Morning Coffee - Greg Brown
Goodnight Saigon  - Billy Joel
Good Thing – Patty Larkin
Graceland - Paul Simon
Great Day in the Morning – Dana Cooper
Grizzly Bear – Bill Morrissey
Gypsy Woman – Martin Sexton

H
Happy Days – TV Theme
Hard to Handle – Otis Redding
He Said, She Said - Loudon Wainwright III
Hearts and Bones - Paul Simon
Here Comes the Rain Again  - The Eurythmics
Homeward Bound - Simon & Garfunkel
Honesty – Billy Joel
Honky Tonk Women – The Rolling Stones
Horse with No Name - America
Hotel California  - The Eagles
Hound Dog - Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller
Houses in the Fields  -  John Gorka

I
I Can See Clearly Now – Johnny Nash
I Love Rock ‘N’ Roll – Joan Jett
Imagine – John Lennon
I’m On Fire – Bruce Springsteen
In The Living Years – Mike & the Mechanics
In Your Eyes – Peter Gabriel
I Shot the Sheriff – Bob Marley and the Wailers
Istanbul (Not Constantinople) – They Might Be Giants
I Still Haven’t Found What I’m Looking For - U2
I Told Him That My Dog Wouldn't Run - Patty Larkin
I Walk the Line – Johnny & June Carter Cash
I Wanna Be Sedated  - Ramones
I Want To Hold Your Hand – The Beatles
I Will Survive – Gloria Gaynor
If I Had Known - Greg Brown
Iko Iko
I'm a Lumberjack - Monty Python
I'm Gonna Be (500 Miles) - The Proclaimers
In the Air Tonight - Phil Collins
Iowa (Traveling III) - Dar Williams
It's the End of the World As We Know It - REM

J
Jack and Diane - John Mellencamp
Jet Plane – John Denver
Johnny Rottentail – Amy Ray
The Joker – Steve Miller Band

K
Kathy's Song - Simon and Garfunkel
Keep the Customer Satisfied – Simon & Garfunkel
The Kid – Buddy Mondlock

L
Landslide – Fleetwood Mac
Late in the Evening – Paul Simon
Layla – Eric Clapton
Leave it Like it Is - David Wilcox
Lemon Tree – Peter, Paul & Mary
Let’s Call the Whole Thing Off – Gershwin
Life by the Drop - Stevie Ray Vaughan
Life in a Northern Town  - Dream Academy
Lightning Crashes – Live
Live Free or Die – Bill Morrissey
Logical Song - Supertramp
Long Ride Home - Patty Griffin
Losing My Religion  - REM
Love Keep Us Together – Martin Sexton
Love Shack – B-52’s
Lovesong – The Cure
Luka - Suzanne Vega

M
Makin' Whoopee – Ray Charles
Marlene on the Wall – Suzanne Vega
Me and Julio Down by the Schoolyard - Paul Simon
Meanies – Jim Infantino
Mercedes Benz – Janis Joplin
Message in a Bottle - The Police
Metal Drums – Patty Larkin
The Mickey Mouse Club March – TV Theme
Money for Nothing - Dire Straits
Moon Over Bourbon Street - Sting
Moondance - Van Morrison
Moonshadow - Cat Stevens
Moses – Patty Griffin
Movin' Out - Billy Joel
Movin' Right Along - The Muppet Movie
Muppet Show Theme Song
My Wife Thinks You’re Dead – Junior Brown

N
Need You Tonight – INXS
New York State of Mind - Billy Joel
No Man's Land - Billy Joel
No One Is To Blame – Howard Jones
Not a Pretty Girl – Ani diFranco

O
Ocean -  Dar Williams
Ode to Billie Joe – Bobby Gentry
Old Time Rock ‘n’ Roll – Bob Seger
One of Us – Joan Osborne
Only the Good Die Young - Billy Joel
Orinoco Flow – Enya

P
Peggy-O – Traditional
Perfectly Good Guitar – John Hiatt
Poet Game - Greg Brown
Pretty Vegas – INXS
Pride and Joy - Stevie Ray Vaughan
Prince of Darkness - Indigo Girls
Puttin’ on the Ritz – Irving Berlin
The Rainbow Connection – The Muppets
Ready for the Storm – Dougie McLean
Reasons Why – Nickel Creek
The Remedy – Jason Mraz
Richard Cory - Paul Simon
The Road Goes On Forever – Robert Earl Keen
Robert Johnson - Bill Morrissey
Rock This Town - Stray Cats
Romeo and Juliet - Dire Straits
Rosanna – Toto
Roxanne – The Police
Runnin' Down a Dream - Tom Petty
Rusty Old American Dream - David Wilcox

S
Sad Lisa – Cat Stevens
Saga Begins  - "Weird Al" Yankovic
St. Judy’s Comet – Paul Simon
Santa Ana Winds – Survivor
Scarborough Fair - Simon and Garfunkel
Scenes from an Italian Restaurant – Billy Joel
Scream – Todd McKimmey
Sensitive New Age Guys – Christine Lavin
Shame on You  - Indigo Girls
She’s No Lady – Lyle Lovett
She’s Your Baby Now – Bill Morrissey
Shotgun Down the Avalanche – Shawn Colvin
Should I Stay or Should I Go - The Clash
Shy – Ani diFranco
Sing – Sesame Street
Sledgehammer – Peter Gabriel
Slip Slidin' Away - Paul Simon
Smells Like Teen Spirit - Nirvana
So Far Away  - Dire Straits
Solsbury Hill - Peter Gabriel
Something to Talk About - Bonnie Raitt
Somewhere Over the Rainbow – Judy Garland
Song for a Deck Hand’s Daughter – James McMurtry
Son of a Preacher Man – Dusty Springfield
Space Oddity – David Bowie
Spider-Man – TV Theme
Stand – REM
Stand By Me – Ben E. King
Stayin’ Alive – The Bee Gees
Still Crazy After All These Years - Paul Simon
Strange Fire - Indigo Girls
Stray Cat Strut – The Stray Cats
Strings of Wings – Karen Goldberg
Strong Chemistry - David Wilcox
Sultans of Swing  - Dire Straits
Summer, Highland Falls – Billy Joel
Summer Moved On - a-ha
Summer of ’69 – Bryan Adams
Summertime – George Gershwin
Sweet Dreams (Are Made of This) - The Eurythmics
Sweet Home Alabama – Lynyrd Skynyrd

T
Take Me Home – Phil Collins
Take On Me - A-ha
Talkin’ at the Texaco – James McMurtry
Talkin' Bout A Revolution – Tracy Chapman
Talkin’ Seattle Grunge Rock Blues – Todd Snider
Tangled Up in Blue  - Bob Dylan
Tears in Heaven – Eric Clapton
Tempted – Squeeze
That’s All – Genesis
That’s My Toy – Steve Fisher
That’s Right (You’re Not From Texas) – Lyle Lovett
These Boots Are Made For Walkin’ – Nancy Sinatra
These Cold Fingers – Bill Morrissey
The Way It Is  - Bruce Hornsby and the Range
The Whole Of The Moon – The Waterboys
Thirteen Step Boogie – Martin Sexton
Thriller - Michael Jackson
Time Bomb – Reckless Kelly
Time After Time – Cyndi Lauper
Tom's Diner - Suzanne Vega
Too Long in the Wasteland – James McMurtry
Total Eclipse of the Heart – Bonnie Tyler
Train in the Distance – Paul Simon
Trees – Marty Casey
Twist and Shout – Isley Brothers
Two Princes – Spin Doctors

U
Unknown Legend – Neil Young
Up Until Then - John Gorka

V
Velvet – a-ha
Veronica - Elvis Costello

W
Waiting for the Rain – Bill Morrissey
Wake Up Little Susie – Everly Brothers
Walk of Life  - Dire Straits
Walking in Memphis - Marc Cohn
Waltzing With Bears – Dr. Seuss
Washington Work Song - disappear fear
Way Over Yonder in the Minor Key - Woody Guthrie/Billy Bragg
We Can’t Dance – Genesis
We Didn't Start the Fire - Billy Joel
Welcome Me - Indigo Girls
What a Wonderful World – Louis Armstrong
What I Am – Edie Brickell & The New Bohemians
What I Like About You – The Romantics
What’s Up? – 4 Non Blondes
When Fall Comes to New England  - Cheryl Wheeler
When I Was a Boy - Dar Williams
When Love Comes To Town – U2
When You Love Somebody and They Dick You Around, Doesn't That Really Suck - David Wilcox
Where Have All the Flowers Gone - Pete Seeger
Where the Streets Have No Name - U2
Whip It – Devo
Who Will Save Your Soul? – Jewel
Who Woulda Thunk It? - Greg Brown
Why Aye Man – Mark Knopfler
Wicked Game    - Chris Isaak
Wild Abandon – Damion Schubert
Wild Night – Van Morrison
Wild World - Cat Stevens
With or Without You - U2
The World Ain’t Slowing Down – Ellis Paul
World Falls - Indigo Girls
Wrapped Around Your Finger – The Police

X

Y
YMCA – The Village People
Yoda  - "Weird Al" Yankovic
You Can Call Me Al - Paul Simon
You Can Sleep While I Drive - Melissa Etheridge
You Can't Always Get What You Want - The Rolling Stones
You Never Get What You Want – Patty Griffin
You’re the One That I Want – Grease
You Shook Me All Night Long – AC/DC

Z
Ziggy Stardust – David Bowie

That's a good idea I should lift since I've been jotting tunes in a notebook anyway. I've got a dozen or two songs listed, mostly for lyrics, though I can't sing and play simultaneously on all but a couple (Hootchie Cootchie Man, Mannish Boy, Kind Hearted Woman Blues (ala Thorogood)). I also know the bulk of a couple more tunes without the fake book, Since I've Been Loving You by Zep is my favorite, though song form and I share an uneasy truce. Me likee jammy.

Dickey Betts was on HDNet again, his gig at the R&R hall of fame. I love jamming along with that show as it really stretches my major key jamming and I improve with every show. Then he kicks in Liz Reed in the middle of the set and I just crush it and cry at my crappy major key skills (Liz Reed being a minor key song with extended jams).

+2 SkyPts for Life By The Drop. Should sub Simple Man for Sweet Home Alabama imo. Also, you should learn Melissa by the Allmans (in my fakebook!), good, simple acoustic jam. Lots of good tunes on the list, though!

Hmm. I'm actually inspired. Thanks, Raph.

You need to make fakebook entries for:

Queen Jane Approximately - Bob Dylan

Radio Radio - Elvis Costello and The Attractions

X-Ray - The Kinks

I can't drop Sweet Home Alabama, it's exactly the sort of tune that everyone knows and wants in the fakebook. Heck, I should add Freebird. :P

Righ, none of those three are ones I know really.

How about Uneasy Rider by Charlie Daniels?  :-D

Okay, how about:

Question - Moody Blues (cool Cdim, G7sus, C)

Red House - everybody, not least Hendrix

Xanadu - Olivia Newton John

Okay, I'm just trying to complete your alphabet. ;)

Nix on Red House. Decent enough song, but the blues catalog has SO many better tunes, especially for campfirey applications. Go for something pre-war and funny like I'm a Doctor for Women by Champion Jack Dupree or Brown Skin Shuffle by Big Bill Broonzy.

You could also go for Guster's X-Ray Eyes to flesh out X. And add Airport song while you're adding Guster, that's a cool acoustic tune.

This is fun. I forgot to jot down the contents of my nascent fakebook. Inspiration...it comes and goes for me.

Hmm. So, I imagine that for you guys some of these tunes fill the same role as the Ellis Paul and Greg Brown tunes do for me. But I barely get to slip those in when doing the jam sessions, and I don't really expect otherwise -- because nobody knows them. :)

The popular songs are the ones people know from their teen years, basically. :) Among the Cub Scouts, the little kids all want Weird Al "Saga Begins" and (boggle) "Black Horse and the Cherry Tree." The older parents want Simon & Garfunkel. The younger parents want Talking Heads and Police, unless they are sensitive or liberal types, in which case they also want Simon & Garfunkel. (In general, actually, most everyone wants Simon & Garfunkel or Paul Simon -- talk about cross-generational appeal...)

I think it's a matter of having different lists for different purposes.  I have a set of songs I play for myself (depending on mood and lesson goal) and song lists tailored for my audience.  I don't play out as much as I used to, but have played a large variety of gigs.  If I'm playing a coffee house, I have different solo sets than if I play with a friend for example.  I'll also play very different tunes at a bar gig than I would at a wedding... though I'm sure this is all common sense. 

I like your list though.  It shows a great deal of variety for both you and your audience. 

Yeah, sorry. I'm an artist, not a DJ :P In fact, that's what really pissed off the DJ I used to work with, he thought I was so good at it but in the end I couldn't just sit and play music I was so tired of just because someone else loves it. And the metric we always used was to gauge the age of the audience and play stuff from their high school years. Works every time. Maybe not surprisingly, it doesn't work real well for me...

I have made some compromises because I'm building a basic set to play at the blues open mics, but even those are songs I dig anyway. I'd rather play other stuff, but you have to start on the standards and work your way out from their as you get to know some of the guys. It's kind of a rite of passage, if you can rock Hootchie Cootchie Man, you're in. I do think I have a workaround with Early In The Morning by Junior Wells because a newer band likes to play that one.

If I could play and sing simultaneously, all bets would be off. Bringing the metal grit and volume to blues is friggin' awesome, especially when all but a couple of the other singers have that generic white guy blues voice.

It's always been a fine line for me, even when I was signed as a recording artist and songwriter.  I look at it like this: If it's my stuff or something that I've personally re-invented, then I'm an artist.  The rest of the time, I'm being paid to entertain and I do my best to deliver.  I don't think I've been an "artist" in public for a long time... I'm mostly still playing just to entertain and have a little fun. 

Nebu, I see an acoustic in your iconavatar thingie over there. Since I don't recall what all has been said in this eon-spanning thread... what do you primarily play? And if you were signed, is any of it still out there lurking?

Raph,

I was a musician for 7 years in the early 80's during a VERY active music period in Minneapolis (The Suburbs, Prince, Morris Day and the Time, The Jets, and later Soul Asylum and Husker Du (aka Bob Mould)).  I played with a number of moderately successful bands. To be completely honest, I never considered myself particularly talented as a musician.  I think my greatest skill was in surrounding myself with talent.  Between that and knowing many of the right people (I had been doing guitar repair work in a local guitar store since the age of 12), I got a lot of mileage in the business.  I'll see if I can dig up a few old demo tracks, but the music is painfully dated.

As for the avatar, you should see that the acoustic is actually a bass... it's a pic of Stanley Clarke.  As you may guess, I'm a bass player by trade but actually was a brass player when I studied music in college.  I can play the guitar well enough to get by, but I consider myself too much of a hack to ever call myself a guitarist. 

Edited for late night rambling-ness.

You guys should be getting used to my extremely long decision-making cycles on musical stuff :) I've been bringing the acoustic into work the last week and a half to test the theory that I'll get in more playing time every day, and it's averaged about a half-hour more, and most of that concise study. Right now it's the Berklee Press Guitar 1 (http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Method-Guitar-DVD-ROM-Berklee/dp/0876390696/) book (and snagging that link...it now ships with a DVD...might have to rebuy and donate my old copy to the library!). My theory is still way too rusty and my reading, too. And sight-reading is pretty much non-existent. I love working on stuff like this because my playing is really starting to open up (FINALLY) a little bit more. Some day I'll consider myself good on guitar ;)

Aaaanyway. The theory I'm testing about an office guitar (also for travel, renfaire, bbqs, etc) is in contemplation of getting a Baby Taylor. Heading out tonight to get one, hopefully they still have a mahogany in stock. New guitar, woohoo!

Continuing the fakebook thread, I'm still inspired to formalize mine, but didn't get to it over the weekend. Sunday I just jammed and played Gothic, Saturday was RenFaire day to watch Cantiga featuring the mighty Charry Garcia (for Charango, not Jerry) from South America on charango. The man is phenomenal, his precise machinegun strumming (fingers only, of course!) always amazes me. When he sees me coming he grins and really starts hamming it up because he knows I dig it. They also have a new guy playing some form of viola, which was really cool. Charry kept goading him to play faster and he did a few times, but he seemed uncomfortable showing off. I told him they should really go for it and get jammy, but the two bandleaders (the harpist and flutist) frown on too much showmanship :( So I went home that night and jammed renfaire tunes, I have a book the band published.

I apologize in advance for the n00biness of this post, as it seems there a lot of people who know what they're doing in this thread.

Thanks, in large part to this thread (and GH  :lol:) I decided to pick up the geetar as I've wanted to learn for a long time.  Went yesterday to a music shop and picked up an  Epiphone Special II Les Paul  (http://www.guitarcenter.com/shop/product/buy_epiphone_les_paul_special_ii_electric_guitar?full_sku=100161340). The vintage sunburst in the middle.
It's cheap, I'm learning, and the reviews were good, so i bought it. My father in law has a great Peavey amp, so I just bought a tuner, bag, new strings, and some picks (did I miss anything?)

I'd like to start taking lessons, and I found this site that looks pretty solid for beginners: Guitarnoise (http://Guitarnoise)

Anyway, thanks to all for this thread, I'm excited to get started.

Trot

Because we don't want to.   :-D

I'd love to hear a recording of that one.

This thread, while going completely over my head, is interesting as hell.

That's why I thought of it when I saw an icon on LJ that said "I broke my G string yesterday while finger A minor."  Sorry, I know it's bad.

No, I didn't save the icon, just wrote the the saying down.  I wish I had the time to learn guitar, but my time management skills suck as it is, and trying to keep up with my art/writing is enough of a challenge without adding something else to the mix.

/lurkon

Let me know how you like it -- I still love mine. Just remember -- treat her lightly, only put light strings and strum gentle, there's no pickguard. Did I ever tell the story of how the back on mine got INVERTED on a plane flight, by a clueless attendant jamming it into a bin? Also remember, she sounds tinny from behind the soundhole, but better to the listener.


We had a party at my place on the 4th. Plugged in amps, electrics, plus acoustic and even keyboards for a while. Based on that, the fakebook gained "Knockin' on Heaven's Door," "Black Magic Woman," "Smooth" ... the other guitar player likes Santana and rock, as you can see. He only knew the Hendrix "Watchtower," had never heard the Dylan one. And he knew "Knockin'" via GnR. So I also threw in there "Paradise City" "Welcome to the Jungle" -- huh, a straight swamp blues pretty much, who'da thunk? Sounds... different... on an acoustic -- and "Seet Child O' Mine" which of course works perfectly on acoustic.
[/quote]

Welcome to the dark side. Your fingers will hurt. Work up to the calluses. Or just play for two hours a day obsessively, that will push thru the pain. :)

Never took lessons, so I can't speak to that...

Either you are quoting Greg Brown's "Who Woulda Thunk It" or I don't know which song you are referring to.

Woohoo! Conversation in the guitar thread always makes me happy.

Trotsky: Woohoo! Good for you. I highly encourage everyone to pick up a musical instrument, it makes life richer. You get to stretch out creativity and also lizard brain stuff, plus some math thrown in. That Epi is way better than the guitar I started with, also way better than the guitar I re-started with a few years back (which I still use for slide, I set the action way high). Look back over the thread, I've made a few book recommendations. My first theory book (from high school) was this one (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0882842250). I recommend Fretboard Logic (http://www.amazon.com/Fretboard-Logic-SE-Reasoning-Arpeggios/dp/0962477060), I wish someone had turned me onto that twenty years ago! I still struggle with theory and fretboard knowledge. There's also a box set (http://www.amazon.com/Fretboard-Logic-Volumes-Videos-Combined/dp/1893884058) I wish I had known about before I bought I & II.

The main thing is to also take some time to play along with recordings you enjoy. Try to pick out what they're doing, spend time really critically listening and picking things apart. As long as you're playing music you enjoy, you'll have fun.

Rhyssa: Woohoo, lurker! At least you have a creative outlet in life, that's great. Music is wonderful, but I also had to make that decision when I was in high school (I was an art/science major who wanted to be DaVinci). I chose music because I sucked at art. Little did I know that apparently doesn't matter so much :|

Raph: Woohoo pt nauseum. Got a mahogany Baby, it's great. A lot louder than I expected, and I definitely have to change up my style so I won't break it. I still think I will at some point, it really makes me aware of how hard I play and how much I lean into the guitar. But it's cool. Got it for less than the going internet price, which was also nice. Of course, been shopping at the local store for decades, soo....The recording guy there didn't know where to find someone to do a transfer of my 1/2" 8-track master from 91. Bah. I believe you have mentioned your Baby inversion, probably a year ago when I was first considering one.

Black Magic Woman. Bah, Santana. I HIGHLY recommend this Fleetwood Mac (http://www.amazon.com/Live-Boston-Vol-Fleetwood-Mac/dp/B000007P3N) album. Peter Green wrote Black Magic Woman and it's a great version without the Oyo Como Va crap :P I like Santana, but he's no Peter Green. That album is in my top ten live albums, which is saying something since I have a LOT of live albums (I prefer live albums over studio). I was also surprised to find they wrote 'Green Manalishi', which I know via an early 80s Judas Priest album (British Steel, iirc). I was into early Priest, Sad Wings of Destiny was a great album. Anyway. Forget Rhiannon, THIS album is the real Mac ;) They were originally playing with John Mayall, so there's yer blues.

I know 'Knockin' via a local bar band. I still dislike that song because they played an extended version every night when I was a teenager. At one local open mic (which I haven't been to in ages, we mostly go to the blues jam now) there is a kid who plays 'Watchtower' every week...the Dave Matthews version, sung like Dave, he acts like Dave with the little foot twisty thing...it's annoying imo. "Jungle" as a slow swamp blues sounds like a great idea! *yoink*

Raph: My fingers are already sore as hell.  Two days of learning chords and twisting my fingers into pretzels. I can already tell this is an addiction, all I've done since I got the damn thing is think about what I'm going to work on when I get home. 

Sky: Thanks for the recommendations!  I think I'll order the Fretboard Logic set at some point.  What's your opinion on tab vs. reading music? I see people in other forums go back and forth on it all the time.  But I've seen musicians in interviews talk about never learning to read music in their life.  Just wondering what the value of learning to read music is for a casual player like me, who will probably never make it pro, sadly  :roll:. (Apologies if you covered this earlier in the thread, haven't quite made it through all 15 pages yet.)

Yes I am and you did.

Heh. I think I did bring this up a while ago, because I've struggled with traditional standard notation for decades now. I was good at theory, but applied theory, so I lost most of it. Now I'm working on it again, with the Berklee book I mentioned a few posts ago. That's also a great book. I'll probably never be able to sight-read complex stuff, but at least I want a working knowledge to pick apart things that aren't in tab.

A lot of musicians scorn tab as a crutch, and to a degree it is because they don't account for rhythymic notation well. But I was reading a book on 15th-16th century guitar (and viola) and tablature was the way music was originally laid out for those instruments. I find tab nice because it can lay out where to finger some things, but it's only as good as the transcriber, I've found a lot who have transcribed things quite wrong after watching the artist live.

So, I really don't have a good opinion on it ;) Tab is probably good if you're just fooling around, most musicians I know can't read standard notation. But if you start with tab, it'll be that much harder to pick up standard notation down the line if you want to. So...it's up to you :) You might want to check out that Berklee book at least and get a foundation in written notation, though it's not a theory book, it's meant to have an instructor but you could make do with a 'how to read music' book along side it. It also ramps up in difficulty pretty quick, I'm just repeating the first chapter over and over for now (easy to play for me, but tough to sight-read, calling out the notes as I play).

I approve most mightily.

The chording is actually really simple, mostly just D and A. He does venture into alternate tunings ("Poet Game" is in open G for example), but many of his songs are standard tuning.

The guitar has different timbres for the same note. 5 on the low E is not the same tone as open on the A string. Hence tab lets you see the actual timbres as well as the pitch. Really well done tab (like, professionally laid out, with stems) can give as much rhythmic accuracy as standard notation can.

That said, I recommend you learn as many notations as you can. Rhythm notation (I can read two of these), standard notation, and tab. :) It just doesn't hurt to learn it. My standard notation is really really rusty now, though, I can't sight-read anymore.

I mostly learn by ear, using any notation systems as a crutch to learn chords (I'm poor at picking out complex chords by ear) or very fast passages.

Think I've played the Jackson 3 times since I bought it. Oops. It's because I'm spending hours on my acoustic, having found I can all of a sudden pick with more than just 1 finger or my thumb. Kinda clicked one day and opened up so much for me.

These two feature heavily on my playlists at the moment.

Rodrigo Y Gabriela (http://video.google.com/videosearch?um=1&tab=wv&client=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=en&q=Rodrigo%20y%20Gabriela)

They headlined one of the stages at Glastonbury this year, reminded me to look them up having heard the name before somewhere else.

Rodrigo Y Gabriela are fantastic.

So after approximately a week and half, the fingers are starting to toughen up.  They definitely don't hurt as bad, after practicing, as they did last week. I've gotten chords A, E & D down.  Now I'm working on a couple songs that only utilize those three chords. Johnny B. Goode and Walk of Life.  So far, my chord progessions suck holy ass.  I play the chord -> look at my fingers -> change chords -> play chord...repeat. So it sounds completely disjointed.  I'm trying to memorize hand positions so I can make more fluid transitions.

Anyway, it's a lot of fun. I look forward to practicing everyday, and get pissed when I can't.

You're 3/5ths of the way to knowing all the chords. Well, the basic chord shapes anyway. C, A, G, E, D. I'm still suggesting that Fretboard Logic book I mentioned above, I wish I'd had it early on, it really puts things into context on the guitar fretboard. Once you start connecting chords, the scales follow, learn the variations and blam, fretboard mastery. Well, if blam = a significant amount of time, work and practice :P

Hehe.  Ahh, yes! Thanks for the reminder.  Just ordered the  Fretboard Logic box set. Amazon Prime gogogogogo!

You silly lead players, always pushing towards that... how about developing right hand technique before tackling scales? Sheesh.

One that would force you to learn rapid switches is U2's "Desire." The whole song is D, A, E, A, E. Yes, that "thump, thump, thump, thump-thump" riff is just that.

That said, I'd seriously work on right hand. Make sure you get the habit of both upstrokes and downstrokes -- it actually took me months to get the hang of that. Learn to appreggiate. Learn how to flatpick alternating bass. Learn how to hit only some strings and not all. Figure out how to do palm muting, and how to get the different timbres from the strings based on where you strum. Learn how to play SLOWLY, to milk a note for emotion.

A cheesy tune that forces some of this stuff -- "Clementine," believe it or not. If you can do the tune's melody just strumming, you will have learned a lot -- playing the melody as you strum can only be done if you can control your right hand. The whole song is just D and A -- you should be able to pick it out on single strings, then learn how to weave it into the strumming.

D
In a canyon, in a cavern, excavating for a
A
mine, lived a miner, 49er, and his daughter Clemen
D
tine

Well, of course you need to work the right hand, too. I always tend to take that for granted because it's what I worked on first and it's probably my strong point, both fingerpicking and plectrum, though I still consider it pretty weak compared to an old-timer from the '20s fingerpicking a rag or early blues. Like the complex bass lines, rhythms and melody line going over the top. It's hard for me to remember the early learning stuff because I was usually hammered while playing and it was almost 24 years ago now (!!). I should really be a lot better than I am :P

Fwiw, I don't consider myself a lead player at all, though that would also be a strength of mine if you gauge it by popular music standards. I just try to play good melodic and/or rhythmic stuff without worrying about the classification much ;) I want to get more chording into my leads and I already incorporate a lot of single-note lines into my rhythyms (people say I play guitar like a bass, I say I play both like stringed instruments!)

Anyway, to add to what Raph said, make sure you not only get good strumming, focus on alternate picking and look into different plectrum styles (when you start getting into more advanced stuff like string-skipping). Learning it right the first time will save you years of unlearning bad habits. I was self-taught for the first couple years and learned some real bad habits, when I picked up the bass I started the hard way and gained some great skills much faster.

The most important thing is to put in the practice time. It takes a metric shit-ton of practice to get good, and there are no shortcuts.

Cool, thanks Raph.  Any other good exercises you'd recommend for the right hand?