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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  World of Warcraft  |  Topic: Patch 6.0.2 - It's a Trap! 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: Patch 6.0.2 - It's a Trap!  (Read 117089 times)
Ironwood
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Reply #175 on: December 02, 2014, 03:49:22 AM

Fairly sure Jeff was replying to Lakov, not you.  At which point NO-ONE had mentioned SWOTOR at all.

It's still a fairly bad comparison.

This would all be solved if we could just use @.   why so serious?

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #176 on: December 02, 2014, 04:15:34 AM

Yes, you're right Ironwood.

I reckon that you don't have the ability to change the outpost buildings in the other zones once you've decided on one? I hope they don't contribute too much to your garrison performance because I chose them based on what made sense at the time without first checking what the internet has to say on it.

I don't really get how they decided on when certain buildings unlock. You get the mine and the forge pretty much from the start but you have to wait till level 96 to get access to the herb garden that compliments the alchemy lab. Dual crafting professions are pretty much set to go by the time they do the quest that upgrades the town hall to level 2 but the scarpyard and other building types for people with gathering professions or other play styles (trade post, stables etc.) unlock much later.

Not much of a problem because you hit 100 pretty easily but it's alittle bit weird.
Ironwood
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Reply #177 on: December 02, 2014, 04:49:22 AM

Apparently, you do get the option at 10,000 gold a pop.

You don't get the quests or followers tho, so I have zero fucking idea why you would do that, except MAYBE the Spires Outpost.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Jeff Kelly
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I'm an apathetic, hedonistic, utilitarian, nihilistic existentialist.


Reply #178 on: December 02, 2014, 05:19:29 AM

I hate it when games demand a choice from you at a time when you don't really know the repercussions and don't give you the chance to change your mind later.
Ironwood
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Reply #179 on: December 02, 2014, 07:21:46 AM

As far as I can see, it matters not a fuck.  Some of the followers that you are either allowed or denied have certain skills you might want, but not really need.  If you do need them later, well, I guess you could build a Tavern.

The only one that seems to matter is the Spires one, one of the choices seems like a waste.  Yet, the followers are better on that one.  Hmmm.

I know what you mean tho.  The initial Garrison the wife planned is (to my mind) utterly inefficient and worthless.

Please don't tell her I said that.


"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Jeff Kelly
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I'm an apathetic, hedonistic, utilitarian, nihilistic existentialist.


Reply #180 on: December 02, 2014, 07:41:28 AM

I built storage before reading up on why that is a bad idea so I'm not in the position to judge.  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?

My main problem atm is that the text descriptions are not really that helpful.  With profession based buildings I usually have to look up guides to get an idea if they would be useful or not. The main question is usually "is this building still usefull if I don't have that profession but one of my followers has?". Even that question depends on what type of building we're talking about.

With mine, herb, garden and fishing hut being defaults and access to stables etc. I don't really see how a gathering profession is really necessary or useful though.
Ironwood
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Reply #181 on: December 02, 2014, 08:00:47 AM

Frankly, I think they should make The Garrison ultimately account wide and let you have all the buildings.  Because that's what everyone is effectively doing anyway, right ?

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
March
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Reply #182 on: December 02, 2014, 10:25:51 AM

Frankly, I think they should make The Garrison ultimately account wide and let you have all the buildings.  Because that's what everyone is effectively doing anyway, right ?
Everything should always be account-wide, IMO.  We're seeing games trending this way, and the trend is good.  Basically I play the game, and all the characters are just the followers of House March... if Bliz still had an ounce of creativity left in them, all of my existing toons would just be various followers that I could play, send on missions, level-up, specialize, etc.
angry.bob
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Reply #183 on: December 02, 2014, 10:32:33 AM

Frankly, I think they should make The Garrison ultimately account wide and let you have all the buildings.  Because that's what everyone is effectively doing anyway, right ?
Everything should always be account-wide, IMO.  We're seeing games trending this way, and the trend is good.  Basically I play the game, and all the characters are just the followers of House March... if Bliz still had an ounce of creativity left in them, all of my existing toons would just be various followers that I could play, send on missions, level-up, specialize, etc.

Yes to all that you said.

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Jeff Kelly
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Reply #184 on: December 02, 2014, 10:44:09 AM

Let me speculate for a moment.

All named mobs I've seen so far are tagged with their special, just like a mob in a follower mission would.
I can level followers and send them on quests and into dungeons
I can equip them and they have professions

It would be trivially easy to extend that system to the levelling of alts. Basically you'd have to name one of your toons as garrison commander (probably your main) and the rest as officers and you could in theory do that. I'm not sure that Blizzard even has considered that possibilty but the way garrisons are set up would make this easy to do. They wouldn't even have to design new mission objectives, they could just use existing quests.

It would be an interesting alternative way to level alts. They'd probably have to limit the number of toons you could level that way on a server though and/or change the quest rewards accordingly.
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #185 on: December 02, 2014, 10:46:32 AM

You could even level professions by assigning your alts to buildings.

Make it so that the alternative "Garrison path" is viable but that still gives players an incentive to level toons the usual way (adapting quest rewards, slower levelling curve, timers etc.).
Ironwood
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Reply #186 on: December 02, 2014, 12:16:05 PM

 why so serious?

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #187 on: December 03, 2014, 07:15:36 AM

Apparently Blizzard is yet again the target of a huge DDOS attack and it's affecting all kinds of services. Maintenance was extended yesterday to deal with the problem but it seems that world and login servers are still afected by the debial of service attacks.
Ironwood
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Reply #188 on: December 03, 2014, 07:20:25 AM

Doesn't seem to be hitting Europe/Me ?

Yay ?

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Lantyssa
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Reply #189 on: December 03, 2014, 07:21:27 AM

Wasn't it determined that the last 'attacks' were just all of the internet trying to log on at once?  Seems suspicious that it's happening again at a moment when everyone is trying to log on at once.

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #190 on: December 03, 2014, 07:41:57 AM

It might be because the first WoD raid hit and people all logged in at once but Blizzard massively upgraded server capacity and tech to deal with the onslaught during WoD release and I reckon they didn't scale back on that a few weeks later.

Blizzard is actually dealing with DDOS attacks every few months or so, it usually only affects the login infrastructure but it's not been the first time that WoW has been hit by such an attack.
Hawkbit
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Reply #191 on: December 03, 2014, 08:33:38 AM

It's not surprising.  Lizard squad has been hitting major targets for the past week or two heavily.  I think they took down xbox live the other night, too.

This is a fun site to watch < 1% of attacks happening:  http://map.ipviking.com/  It's more of a marketing tool, but interesting to watch.
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #192 on: December 03, 2014, 08:44:27 AM

Last week they hit PSN too
Ironwood
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Reply #193 on: December 03, 2014, 09:13:08 AM

It's not surprising.  Lizard squad has been hitting major targets for the past week or two heavily.  I think they took down xbox live the other night, too.

This is a fun site to watch < 1% of attacks happening:  http://map.ipviking.com/  It's more of a marketing tool, but interesting to watch.

Lol.  Everyone is shooting the US.  That's crazy.

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Paelos
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Reply #194 on: December 03, 2014, 09:24:21 AM

So according to that map, the Chinese are the biggest assholes.

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Hawkbit
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Reply #195 on: December 03, 2014, 09:45:36 AM

From my understanding, Russia uses China to mask attacks, too. 
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #196 on: December 04, 2014, 04:06:07 AM

It was a bit laggy yesterday even on my EU server but nothing compared to the problems the US still has.

I'm now 97. I really like WoD so far. Well except the way the multi-stage fights and boss encounters work but I've already said entirely too much about what I don't like about them anyway.

I like just how much stuff they put into the zones to really make exploring worthwile. The bonus objectives, the rare and elite mobs, the little missions and tidbits you stumble upon while questing or travelling. The "feed ogres to the monster" type encounter was already mentioned but each zone features a lot of stuff like that. Also little bits and pieces to discover like hidden treasures or landmarks. That was what I liked about MoP the most and I'm happy they expanded on that. I'm also warming up to the idea of no flying in Draeonor it makes getting to places frustrating as hell because you constantly have to backtrack because you get stuck on mountain ranges or impassable terrain but the sense of exploration and discovery you get from stumbling onto some "secret" while being nowhere you'd intended to be is really great for explorer types like me.

Yesterday I cut up a falllen tree in Grongor and discovered Alexej Barov and made im a follower for my Garrison.

I also like the random quest reward upgrade system. It netted me two epic upgrades and a few blues already and it even works with rewards from treasures and rare bosses.
Azuredream
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Reply #197 on: December 04, 2014, 04:28:02 AM

I get that same feeling of frustration at not being able to just go in a straight line to places but it just leads me to loudly bitching at my computer screen. You can bet I took that outpost upgrade with the shredder that lets you fly (briefly). It's on a 10 minute cooldown, sure, but every time it's up I can just circumvent all these stupid ledges and mountains. Whenever I hop back to Stormwind it's like I can breath again because I'm not hobbled on a crappy land mount.

The Lord of the Land approaches..
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #198 on: December 04, 2014, 05:11:23 AM

They should at least bring back flying to the spirit healer. Even more annoying than normal travel in Draenor is doing it during corpse runs.
Hutch
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Reply #199 on: December 04, 2014, 09:09:08 AM


Plant yourself like a tree
Haven't you noticed? We've been sharing our culture with you all morning.
The sun will shine on us again, brother
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #200 on: December 04, 2014, 09:25:39 AM

Even though I never want flying in Draenor personally, it would be stupid to release a cash mount that can't fly considering it is available in all non Draenor content.

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Rokal
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Reply #201 on: December 04, 2014, 12:37:23 PM

The zone they show in the splash art of it flying is also from Draenor. Seems like a really poor planning.

If you build the Inn you can also get this from one of the daily dungeon quests, which launches you into the air and then lets you glide around. Also on a 10 minute timer. There is no slow-fall when you disable it and it flies very fast, so it can lead to some pretty comical results.

I loved the no-flight in WoD. When you finish the quests in a zone the Archaelogy vendor in Stormshield/Hordetown will sell you a treasure map for any treasures you missed. There were a bunch of really cool ones in Nagrand that involved using Goblin gliders around the zone to get to. None of that sort of content would have been worthwhile with flying mounts. I get that it might not be for everyone, but it was a pretty good example of how flying mounts limit content design.
Hutch
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Reply #202 on: December 04, 2014, 01:49:02 PM

So you take your jumping puzzles and your rope climbing, and you put it in a no-flying zone, like on the Timeless Isle.
You let the players fly in the main expansion area, once they reach the level cap and pay their fee.
You let the players decide how (or if) they're going to partake in the content that you've laid out.
More choices, not less. This isn't news.

Plant yourself like a tree
Haven't you noticed? We've been sharing our culture with you all morning.
The sun will shine on us again, brother
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #203 on: December 05, 2014, 12:55:07 AM

They will add flying eventually. Once the expansion is out long enough for the content to be no longer that important to both the community and Blizzard or at the latest once the next expansion hits and Draenor is just another levelling roadblock you'll eventually get a "Watlord's flight license" or something similar and be ablet to fly in Draenor.
Jeff Kelly
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Reply #204 on: December 05, 2014, 06:35:47 PM

The proving grounds seem to be not very well adapted to the class you play. First scenario they gave my single target damage monk a bunch of "AOE this" tests.
Zetor
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Reply #205 on: December 05, 2014, 09:40:15 PM

PG isn't adapted to the class you play at all, but every spec should be able to do bronze and silver without any issues (by the way, don't windwalker monks have decent aoe with fof, chi explosion and spinning crane kick?) since the timer is so lenient. Gold is easier as some specs than others (but still doable as all of them), and Endless is definitely easier to do with some classes/specs than others... but that's just for bragging rights, really.

e: also, adapting them to the class would defeat the purpose of PG in the first place. Like I said in my prev post, PG is supposed to teach players how to deal with some typical situations in groups/raids, which frequently does include AOEing (both cleave and many-target aoe).
« Last Edit: December 05, 2014, 09:45:45 PM by Zetor »

Jeff Kelly
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Reply #206 on: December 06, 2014, 08:16:36 AM

The scenario I had to do pretty much required a 360 degree AoE and the monk only has one pretty weak ability that does that. Other AoEs are better but then I'd sometimes hit the time limit because The other abilities only affect maybe a 90 degree angle.

I couldn't do it and now have postponed it until I have better gear than my mix  of iLvl 590greens and blues. No big deal but auto und it pretty weak nonetheless.
Rokal
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Reply #207 on: December 07, 2014, 11:22:32 AM

If you pick the level 90 talent Rushing Jade Wind you'll have a strong AoE spell and can still do damage and built chi while you're attacking. 2-3 casts of that should kill any AoE mobs in Proving Grounds and you can use single-target abilities on the stronger mobs in the packs while RJW kills the weak stuff.

They do get quite a bit easier with gear, but Windwalker Monk is one of the best classes for Proving Grounds. Some of the tougher waves for other classes, like the waves with 2 healers, are completely trivialized by Touch of Death.
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Reply #208 on: December 07, 2014, 03:51:57 PM

If you can't make silver with a class for the proper spec, the problem is behind the keyboard. My terrible, terrible wife did it as an iLevel 590 mage who thought she should still be spamming frost fingers.  My BM hunter (worst spec) did it at 590ish with no problems and I almost got through bronze tank on the hunter for the achievement at ilevel 600, and if I'd taken a tank pet I probably would have made it.

The classes do not play the same as they did and often what were once 'terrible' or 'great' abilities are no longer such. Guildie Unholy DK didn't know he was supposed to be using only Plague Strike and Festering Strike. He also didn't understand the big nerf that Army of the Dead received. Once he was taught the change was night & day. Read up.


The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
Father mike
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Reply #209 on: December 07, 2014, 09:36:11 PM

Where does one go to read up?  I used to go to Elitist Jerks, but by the end of Lich King, it was all about programming spread sheets to parse max theoretical output.  Practical advice on rotations and gearing was hard to find over there.

But I haven't looked over there since before Cata launched.

I would like to thank Vladimir Putin for ensuring that every member of the NPR news staff has had to say "Pussy Riot" on the air multiple times.
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