Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.

[jgsugden]

If you stalked some of those girls home, some of them have decent incomes and spend them on the 'nice things'

Dude.  Duuuude. 

Of course I was joking.  And I covered up any tracks that would prove otherwise.

[Ghambit]

There it is! I was watching trying to figure out what the whole action scene reminded me of.  I was thinking "80's action drama" but it didn't seem quite right.  MacGuyver fits.

I was thinkin shitty version of the A-Team.  (especially the action scenes)

[Signe]

I saw two episodes and I don't like them very much.  I think maybe it's geared more towards teens or something.  Dunno.  I just didn't fine it interesting or very superhero-y.  I'm disappointed.  I also am finding most of this thread confusing and I'm not even sure what show we're talking about sometimes.  Anyway, I gave it the second chance thinking maybe they'd have some actual superheroes or awesome special effects or anything to take the attention off the silly dialog.  But, no, they didn't. 

[Nevermore]

It's definitely geared towards a younger audience.  It seems almost like a live-action cartoon.

[jgsugden]

I got home at 10:30 at night (after starting my day at 3:30 in the morning) and watched Episode 2 while eating dinner.  My review:

I was a bit disappointed (and I've been very optimistic for those keeping track).  I'm still very enthusiastic for the show, but they did not make the strides I hoped between the pilot and episode 2, although I am still confident we'll get there soon.  I was groggy watching it, but here were things that jumped out to me:

1.) Glamour hacker had make-up, but her attire was certainly a step down from the pilot.  Apparently she ran out of her nicest clothes.  

2.) The cameo was as forced and unnecessary as the Hawkeye cameo in Thor.  I never disagree with seeing that guy, and while I was watching that scene I suddenly realized he might be the best actor in the world to deliver Whedon lines (and was likely under-utilized in Avengers in retrospect), but the scene was essentially a redo of the prior scene with an unnecessary Easter Egg.

3.) At least when I'm tired, Fitz and Simmons were hard to understand.  Too hard to understand.

4.) "A magical place" is going to get old, fast.

5.) I agree that Whedon is still going through the checklist of things Marvel wanted to see in the show.  I will be interested to see them get to a show that makes no reference (other than Coulson) to anything that was in a movie.

[Merusk]

There it is! I was watching trying to figure out what the whole action scene reminded me of.  I was thinking "80's action drama" but it didn't seem quite right.  MacGuyver fits.

I was thinkin shitty version of the A-Team.  (especially the action scenes)

You didn't watch much MacGuyver, did you? Better stories, cool sciency stuff, TERRIBLE TERRIBLE "action" segments.

[Fordel]

It's the wank that kills me. They keep trying to instill this kind of sentimental nostalgia with people I don't know and character's that don't know each other. Save that shit for the season finale, not the first couple episodes.

[Hayduke]

But, dude, dude, dude.  She's The Cavalry.  How does that not awe you?

[Signe]

But, dude, dude, dude.  She's The Cavalry.  How does that not awe you?

Yeah, I wondered about that.  Did I miss an explanation or is it a well known comic book thing which I wouldn't really know because I never read comics much.  Other than my ex brother in law's ancient collection of Zap Comix.  I'm sure they were priceless but I read them anyway.  I bet he still has them, too. 

[jgsugden]

But, dude, dude, dude.  She's The Cavalry.  How does that not awe you?

Yeah, I wondered about that.  Did I miss an explanation or is it a well known comic book thing which I wouldn't really know because I never read comics much.  Other than my ex brother in law's ancient collection of Zap Comix.  I'm sure they were priceless but I read them anyway.  I bet he still has them, too. 

The Cavalry thing is a set-up.  YOu'll hear about it for a few episodes and then they'll tell her story.  All of the characters in this show (save Fury and Hill) are original creations of the MCU.

[Khaldun]

Really agree on how the show wants us to already have highly developed, highly 'cued' feelings for the characters. That's also a really bad sign. You gotta earn that, guys: there is no way I can possibly have any feeling at all for what Mr. Bland Killer Guy is feeling.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Like how calling Mulan the cavalry means absolutely nothing but the characters keep telling us that we should care.

[Tmon]

Like how calling Mulan the cavalry means absolutely nothing but the characters keep telling us that we should care.

Crap now I'll never know her character name.

[Tannhauser]

With so many here hating the show, I'm sure this thread will be pretty empty this time next week. 

[Signe]

Aha!  So maybe THEY don't even know what the fucking cavalry means yet!

Really agree on how the show wants us to already have highly developed, highly 'cued' feelings for the characters. That's also a really bad sign. You gotta earn that, guys: there is no way I can possibly have any feeling at all for what Mr. Bland Killer Guy is feeling.

Yeah, this is kind true with me, too.  I don't feel anything for any of the characters at all.   It's almost like no one has a personality yet, which is okay, but the way they're addressing this is not making me look forward to seeing how they develop.  I love superhero films but I don't even get the feeling that this show has anything to do with superheroes.  Oh well.  I think The Dark Knight and Hellboy were my favs.  I really liked Watchmen, too.  But I think those were all mostly made for grown ups and precocious teenagers.  Maybe that's the reason this one bores me so much.

[MahrinSkel]

Yeah, I was not happy with the second episode.  It seems like they're trying to fast-forward through all the character and relationship development.  Rather than have the team actually have and work through conflicts, they just crammed together a "Everything is better with teamwork!" episode with absolutely no explanation or foundation.

I get that they don't want to spend an entire season with touchy-feely stuff, and hopefully they're just trying to get to the good parts (villains, heroes, freak/mcguffin of the week), but if that's the case they should have handled it like a cop show, jump straight into an already formed squad and let the relationship exposition flow organically.

It definitely didn't feel like a Joss Whedon show.

--Dave

[Lakov_Sanite]

They literally could have called this weeks macguffin "the macguffin"  does anyone know what it supposedly did beyond "some kind of laser"?  Between that, random tech magic staves and the star trek level of technobabble from the scientists, I don't have high hopes.

[Raguel]

Maybe it's due to reading all the negative comments but the second ep was better than I expected. I agree with the Macgyver comments. Not really feeling the raft bit. I still want moar Steranko but I'll go halfsies with moar Leonor. 

I find Camilla's critique of Coulson very meta. I don't think anyone pointed that out.

re: "The Calvary". I don't see the big deal; even in the pilot it was hinted that Mulan was a former badass field agent so I don't see the big deal. Why she decided to quit and get a desk i I guess is the question. Not that I care really.

[Riggswolfe]

Maybe it's due to reading all the negative comments but the second ep was better than I expected. I agree with the Macgyver comments. Not really feeling the raft bit. I still want moar Steranko but I'll go halfsies with moar Leonor. 

I find Camilla's critique of Coulson very meta. I don't think anyone pointed that out.

re: "The Calvary". I don't see the big deal; even in the pilot it was hinted that Mulan was a former badass field agent so I don't see the big deal. Why she decided to quit and get a desk i I guess is the question. Not that I care really.

The implication with "Mulan" is A) She is famous as a very, very bad ass fighter and is the one teams call when they're in deep shit ("The Calvary") and B) something went very wrong in her last mission causing her to retreat to a desk. My guess without any actual knowledge is that somebody she cared about got killed and she feels like it was a failure on her part or because of her arrogance. I thought the talk between Wade and Skye was kind of neat as their relationship is developing. They are clearly going to be the ones with sexual tension in the show. So far the team dynamics are: Wade/Skye: Sexual tension mixed with a bit of distrust and antogonism. Fitz/Simmons: Comfortable with each other, a bit intimidated by "Mulan" and Wade and Coulson. Coulson/"Mulan" : A bit aloof and disconnected from the others. Him because he's team lead, her because of whatever happened to make her go to a desk job.

[Nevermore]

It should be pointed out to the people who think the cast is too young and pretty that Ming-Na Wen will be 50 in November.

[Bunk]

Though she may be the best looking 50 year old in the country.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I also want to point out I'm not trying to be derogatory in calling a strong asian woman Mulan. Only that she is the VO of Mulan and I can't think of anything else watching her.

[Merusk]

I find Camilla's critique of Coulson very meta. I don't think anyone pointed that out.

I felt it was too on the nose and the discussion had moved on to other aspects of the show.

The implication with "Mulan" is A) She is famous as a very, very bad ass fighter and is the one teams call when they're in deep shit ("The Calvary") and B) something went very wrong in her last mission causing her to retreat to a desk. My guess without any actual knowledge is that somebody she cared about got killed and she feels like it was a failure on her part or because of her arrogance.

Well of course that's exactly what it is.  It's also a trope and one that's been clumsily jammed in to the show rather than revealed better because they wanted to get to "RAH RAH WE'RE A TEAM" right away.

[Khaldun]

I'm fine with the cavalry thing--it's the one bit of info about the characters' past that I thought worked. I think it's pretty obvious what they're setting up--she got too used to believing in her own image and fucked it up one time resulting in a catastrophe.

Wade is a hopeless character, though. I can't see how they're going to make him anything but a face and some bad lines. If the show starts to drop in the ratings, I think you can expect him to get killed and/or superpowered.

Fitz/Simmons are fine, plenty of room to make them more interesting.

Skye is a fairly lousy wild card but maybe they have a good idea for her, I'll allow that's possible.

I would love it if they'd just add some very low-key, non-visual-effect-requiring metahuman to the group.

But jeezus, the real thing is: make it Marvel, FFS. If it's got to be cheesy, go 2013-standard COMIC BOOK cheesy. Not McGuyver/A-Team/70s Show cheesy. Not Wizards of Waverly Place cheesy.

You know who they ought to hire RIGHT NOW as a writer? Dan Slott. He's got a proven ability to make clever low-key use of the Marvel Universe in ways that are at least somewhat 'realistic' and to work a premise for its hidden potential. I think if they brought Slott on and he started writing Damage Control and the law firm of Goodman, Lieber, Kurtzberg & Holliway into the show as background elements or occasional plot premises, they could really go places. But the clock is ticking now--moving to a bottle episode for your follow-up to the pilot is a terrible sign.

[jgsugden]

#1: There is a metahuman on the show... wait for the reveal.  And what separates Wade from Widow?  Fitz/Simmons from Stark?   
#2: My biggest complaint about the show is that I can't understand Fitz/Simmons when they speak.  Whedon fast talk and strong accents is a challenging combo.
#3: The 50 year old Meinda May / Ming Na is catching my eye more than Simmons or Skye.   
#4: Whedon has a laid out plan for each of these characters.  He knows why Melinda is known as the Cavalry, he knows what Wade's family issues are, he knows where Skye came from, and he knows exactly where/what Couslon went/is.  He also knows whether someone is going to die in the first 10 episodes (unless there is a contract issue, etc...)  He always has a plan.  However, he does change those plans as the story unfolds if it serves the story.  That is the way it goes.
#5: Reportedly, Whedon did some quick script doctoring on the first few episodes.  That tells me that there were problems, and that the 'fixes' may have been rushed.  I expect that as time goes by, they'll get the formula down a bit better.
#6: Anyone else waiting for the reveal that the things sent out via the Slingshot are not actually reaching the sun?

[Lakov_Sanite]

Miracle patch coming any day now.

[HaemishM]

There it is! I was watching trying to figure out what the whole action scene reminded me of.  I was thinking "80's action drama" but it didn't seem quite right.  MacGuyver fits.

This. The second episode was much more of a letdown to me than the first. I could forgive the really bad CGI compositing on most of the shots that involved the plane, but the fucking raft plugging up the hole in the plane? Or the way some actors walk and fight normally IN THE SAME SHOT with actors having to grab hold of things to keep from flying out of the plane? None of that whole fight scene made any fucking sense whatsoever. I still like it because I like Coulsen and May but the rest of the show really needs fucking work. And they really need to start interacting with super heroes not 40-year old tech buried in 1500 year old ruins.

It isn't on my death watch yet because it's Marvel - but it needs to improve.

[Margalis]

I also want to point out I'm not trying to be derogatory in calling a strong asian woman Mulan.

Call her Chun-Li. Much less derogatory.

[jgsugden]

Expecting to see mainstream heroes, villians and features of the Marvel Comic universe in the first few episodes is asking a lot.  They'll get to more of it, but it wouldn't make sense for a world without supers to go from a handful to hundreds in the span of a few months.

I was disappointed in episode 2 for many of the reasons above, but give them time to get it down.  They're trying to make a 42 minute movie every week.

[HaemishM]

They're trying to make a 42 minute movie every week.

No, I don't think that's it. That's far too kind.

[Tmon]

Expecting to see mainstream heroes, villians and features of the Marvel Comic universe in the first few episodes is asking a lot.  They'll get to more of it, but it wouldn't make sense for a world without supers to go from a handful to hundreds in the span of a few months.

But not getting some sort of recognizably super hero/villain type into the series early makes it unlikely that folks who expect that sort of thing when they see the Marvel brand will stick around watching MacGyver 90210 until the supers show up.

[Tannhauser]

Yep.  I like the show mostly, but no supers and I'm bailing.  Ain't got time for a show in the MCU that don't have no cape wearin' fellas.


Aside:  They said the macguffin was tessaract/gamma radiation powered.  Does this mean the tessaract output is gamma rays?  Any comic book science guys care to explain?

[Evildrider]

Yep.  I like the show mostly, but no supers and I'm bailing.  Ain't got time for a show in the MCU that don't have no cape wearin' fellas.


Aside:  They said the macguffin was tessaract/gamma radiation powered.  Does this mean the tessaract output is gamma rays?  Any comic book science guys care to explain?

The Tesseract emits low level gamma radiation.  That's how they were trying to track it in Avengers.

[Tannhauser]

Oh, OK TY sir.  I was thinking The Hulk was the most powerful super if he's energized by the same juice as the tessaract. (sp?)

[Evildrider]

Oh, OK TY sir.  I was thinking The Hulk was the most powerful super if he's energized by the same juice as the tessaract. (sp?)

He's not powered by the Tesseract, but he is potentially the most powerful super.