1.2 - Legacy etc.

[luckton]

Well then I'll be back from 1.2.  So freaking tired of being my companion's heal bitch.

WHO'S THE BITCH NOW, KALIYO?!   

[Sky]

Group finder is scheduled for 1.3 - same server only.

Edit: Source

So, just in time for GW2 

When I say you can't please some people, this is what I'm talking about.

[Nebu]

When I say you can't please some people, this is what I'm talking about.

Can we all admit that it's hard to be excited about getting features that should have been present in the game at release?

[ajax34i]

Take you one further:  not only should these features have been present at release, but they should have spent the thus-available time since release fixing teh bugs!!!

[01101010]

When I say you can't please some people, this is what I'm talking about.

Can we all admit that it's hard to be excited about getting features that should have been present in the game at release?

Have to admit, this does seem like a very bad trend in MMOs lately to salvage retention numbers. Polish up the game enough to release it, but allow for the glaring holes. This way, the customer will be more likely to stick around once these holes start getting filled. Parse out the "filling" over time and you can maximize the people who stay sub'd to your game because they want to see the upcoming changes. Just the way things go these days I guess. 

[Lakov_Sanite]

Yeah, how's that system working for WAR? Game companies have been releasing half-assed products since the beginning of time, MMO's are just more susceptible because they feel they can fix things after the fact.

Of course, this almost never works but people keep seeing wow and thinking they can just do whatever blizzard did and it'll work. So, they just do close to the bare minimum, trying to duplicate wow with all the features it had at release. they say to themselves "well, wow had bugs and lack of features at release but people didn't care so we're good" but that's completely missing the point of course.

Same old argument, you aren't catering to the players of yesterday, you need to cater to tomorrow's players.

[Paelos]

When I say you can't please some people, this is what I'm talking about.

Can we all admit that it's hard to be excited about getting features that should have been present in the game at release?

He's right though. Nothing they do now can fix the game for me. They burned that bridge and pissed me off with all the stupidity on the front end. Even fixing the stupidity isn't going to make me likely to forgive them for screwing me as a customer with a huge box cost and unfinished product.

[Threash]

When I say you can't please some people, this is what I'm talking about.

Can we all admit that it's hard to be excited about getting features that should have been present in the game at release?

He's right though. Nothing they do now can fix the game for me. They burned that bridge and pissed me off with all the stupidity on the front end. Even fixing the stupidity isn't going to make me likely to forgive them for screwing me as a customer with a huge box cost and unfinished product.

Ditto.  I can't play a game like this without the "mental commitment" of wanting to play for a long time.  I know i will bail for GW2 already so there is no desire to play anymore, even thought this patch has almost everything i thought the game needed (minus macros, which is still a big one).

[Wolf]

you guys just burned out. I'm sure I'll be in the same boat if I it was my only game, as it is I'm happily trucking along on 4 different characters, the highest being a 41 and find the legacy stuff exciting. They'll probably keep me on until Diablo.

[ajax34i]

Well I'm not burned out, by your definition, as I only have one character at 36 and a couple level 14 banking alts, and the 36 had a pretty decent story so far and it's giving hints it'll have a decent ending that I'm interested in seeing.  However, I do know exactly what they're talking about in the "it'll take more than just fixing my issue" department; I'm in the same boat.  I've quit over an issue with their customer support, they've pissed me off, and it'll take more than just fixing that issue for me to come back, and I don't even think they can deliver on "just fix the issue already."  Mine has been reported since game release, by a few people.

1.1.5 patch is out right now, and judging by their Customer Service sub-forum, the patcher may bug out and remove your entire SWTOR directory; first 2 pages are full of this issue.  Personally, I'm not going to patch today, let them fix this issue first.  It's beginning to look like CCP levels of competence.

[Fabricated]

I'm mostly just logging in to raid now since dailies are pointless to me. I hope the Legacy stuff regarding alts is retroactive because I kinda want to make an alt right now.

[amiable]

Update: they meant 1.2.x for dual spec.  I.E. no tthis patch but sometime before 1.3.

[Simond]

So what happened to "one planet per patch per month" anyway?

[Shatter]

So what happened to "one planet per patch per month" anyway?

Same thing as Hero Classes

[Sky]

Can I have your stuff?

[Nebu]

So what happened to "one planet per patch per month" anyway?

I'm guessing that 'planet' was supposed to be 'plant' and it was a typo.  Belsavis looks much greener than it did last month. 

[Raknor]

Haha Anyone see the price on those White saber crystal?  2.5 mil

That's one spendy vendor!

[Nevermore]

He's right though. Nothing they do now can fix the game for me. They burned that bridge and pissed me off with all the stupidity on the front end. Even fixing the stupidity isn't going to make me likely to forgive them for screwing me as a customer with a huge box cost and unfinished product.

But would you resub if they fired Ghostcrawler?

[Nebu]

If SWTOR
- created world pvp that was engaging
- decreased the amount of cc
- added appearance tabs and housing
- fixed the flashpoint bugs
- balanced melee and range a bit better

I'd play this game for at least another 6 months.  Want another $90 Bioware?  Come and get it!

[eldaec]

Haha Anyone see the price on those White saber crystal?  2.5 mil

That's one spendy vendor!

I love how the red and blue crystals look better than everything else in the game.

[Wolf]

- created world pvp that was engaging
- balanced melee and range a bit better

Not asking for much, are you 

[caladein]

I love how the red and blue crystals look better than everything else in the game.

I'd kill to be able to swap my black-red for a black-blue or even just plain green with the same stats.  At least I'm not stuck with it as a saber color .

[Paelos]

He's right though. Nothing they do now can fix the game for me. They burned that bridge and pissed me off with all the stupidity on the front end. Even fixing the stupidity isn't going to make me likely to forgive them for screwing me as a customer with a huge box cost and unfinished product.

But would you resub if they fired Ghostcrawler?

Kudos. 

[Nebu]

Not asking for much, are you 

Been waiting 15 years + for someone to get it right.  They've had more resources to do it than anyone before them... and THEY BLEW IT!   

[Ingmar]

When I say you can't please some people, this is what I'm talking about.

Can we all admit that it's hard to be excited about getting features that should have been present in the game at release?

He's right though. Nothing they do now can fix the game for me. They burned that bridge and pissed me off with all the stupidity on the front end. Even fixing the stupidity isn't going to make me likely to forgive them for screwing me as a customer with a huge box cost and unfinished product.

The product was not unfinished. You (this is more of a general you) just had unrealistc expectations of a new game having every single convenience feature and design element of a much older, more mature game.

Everyone has their pet feature they want in a game. If you add them all up the game wouldn't come out for another 3 years, and meanwhile some existing game would add some other new feature and then that would become a must-have. It is unwinnable.

[Nebu]

The product was not unfinished. You just had unrealistc expectations of a new game having every single convenience feature and design element of a much older, more mature game.

LFD, moddable UI and end game content that works is 'every single convenience feature'. 

If you're going to accuse people of overreacting, you might want to check yourself as well.

[Ingmar]

You replied before I edited my reply into coherence!

[Nebu]

You replied before I edited my reply into coherence!

The product was both unfinished and buggy.  Bioware knew this and lived with it to make a Christmas release.  Were you not in beta?

[Ingmar]

It was only unfinished in the sense that no MMO is ever "finished" until it shuts down.

[Paelos]

It was only unfinished in the sense that no MMO is ever "finished" until it shuts down.

You aren't this dumb.

[Ingmar]

I'm not going to argue the buggy part, although it has only slightly impacted me personally. I will point out that I've never seen a bug free game above the 'little indie game with 2 buttons' level.

But I'm going to dig my heels in on the unfinished thing. That's nothing but unrealistic expectations and entitlement. It is literally impossible for an MMO to come out that will make everyone happy with its exact feature set.

[Nebu]

But I'm going to dig my heels in on the unfinished thing. That's nothing but unrealistic expectations and entitlement. It is literally impossible for an MMO to come out that will make everyone happy with its exact feature set.

Have you played any MMO's released in the last 3 years?  There's a HUGE difference between 'satisfying everyone' and 'being feature complete enough to capture a significant marketshare'.  Take a look at what Rift had at release on a significantly smaller budget.  You'll see what people who know how to make an mmo will put into a game right out of the box (though they missed the boat on LFD as well).  Bioware made a single player/coop game with a large multiplayer lobby.  The lack of MMO-style features really demonstrates this.  

MMO gamers wanting common MMO features is not entitlement.  It's an expectation when you're buying an MMO, particularly in the WoW or post-WoW era.

[Sky]

Bioware knew this and lived with it to make a Christmas release.

Do you really think it was their call to make?

Take a look at what Rift had at release on a significantly smaller budget.

You mean the complete lack of creativity, setting and story?

And as you say, LFD was patched in later. As was appearance tabs. And some of the end game. And is the UI moddable yet? A slew of stuff...and yet they basically can't fix the blandness at the core of it. TOR at least has a great setting and interesting stuff to do (for casual players, I guess).

[Ingmar]

But I'm going to dig my heels in on the unfinished thing. That's nothing but unrealistic expectations and entitlement. It is literally impossible for an MMO to come out that will make everyone happy with its exact feature set.

Have you played any MMO's released in the last 3 years?  There's a HUGE difference between 'satisfying everyone' and 'being feature complete enough to capture a significant marketshare'.  Take a look at what Rift had at release on a significantly smaller budget.  You'll see what people who know how to make an mmo will put into a game right out of the box (though they missed the boat on LFD as well).  Bioware made a single player/coop game with a large multiplayer lobby.  The lack of MMO-style features really demonstrates this.  

MMO gamers wanting common MMO features is not entitlement.  It's an expectation when you're buying an MMO, particularly in the WoW or post-WoW era.

Rift had features that satisfied you. I found it bland to the point of near-unplayability and didn't last past the trial. Which one of us is the "real" audience that matters for these things?

EDIT: We don't actually know how many subscribers Rift has, right? And now I see that they didn't themselves have all these things at release, that people seem to expect SWTOR to have had at release?

[Mattemeo]

I am largely disappointed in the species unlock system they've talked about so far.

In fact, disappointed is the wrong word. Incredulous would be more fitting. I really cannot see the logic behind it. Playing a species to 50 unlocks it for use in classes that species was previously unavailable for. Call me crazy but doesn't the average player seek an entirely new experience for their next character? More importantly, what happens when I get that character to 50?

Example: I roll a Chiss Imperial Agent. I hit level 50, and therefore unlock Chiss Smuggler etc. I roll a Chiss Smuggler. I hit level 50.... what now? Oh hai loop.


I'm aware it would be naive of me to believe they'd actually bother allowing us to play one of the dozens of other races already present in the game (ho ho ho, without some sort of monetary exchange? EA thinks not) but the system as they've described it currently is bafflingly obtuse. Here's hoping the species for credits unlock thing is at least affordable. As a Human Jedi Knight Sentinel player, I already feel like I've done everything wrong since starting the game.