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Author
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Topic: Pathfinder MMO (Read 62751 times)
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Bunk
Contributor
Posts: 5828
Operating Thetan One
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Though they did recently release a "Beginners" Box Set, which is targeted for getting people new to RPGs in to the genre by keeping things simpler. Might be worth a look. Reviews of it have been quite good.
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"Welcome to the internet, pussy." - VDL "I have retard strength." - Schild
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Mrbloodworth
Terracotta Army
Posts: 15148
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That's what I have been looking at, asked for it for x-mass, especially for the pre-made character sheets with all the markup on the side. Still, For me, and anyone ill be playing with, stopping to do tons of math just kills the fun.
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Goumindong
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4297
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The most complicated math you're likely to have to do is adding numbers and checking the result.
The setup is often complicated, but that is because it is difficult to have a game be reasonably balanced and still have a simple system to create abilities.
I think that the base 4e (not sure about essentials or the starter box) is pretty serviceable in this regard so long as you are using pre-created adventures.
Level/2 + ability score + bonuses is pretty much everything you have to know.
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Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8306
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Essentials is still using the same underlying math, they just dramatically reduce power selection decisions.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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Mrbloodworth
Terracotta Army
Posts: 15148
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Ok. No thanks. With those features, you will only likely get High school age users, or those that peaked in highschool. Also, why do people think they can use those features yet follow up with this: One thing that we're deeply committed to at Goblinworks is building a game that has a low tolerance for "griefing." Those features ATTRACT the very people you want to stop. You are courting Griefers with those features, and you know it. An example is a group who attacks and kills trespassers in a certain area to deny access to that territory to other players. Whats the point of your goddam game then if you do not allow this!
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« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 06:13:53 AM by Mrbloodworth »
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HaemishM
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 42653
the Confederate flag underneath the stone in my class ring
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Translation: We haven't learned a goddamn thing from almost 13 years of released MMOG's. We are steadfastly committed to making the same fucking mistakes over and over again until our game is full of shitheels and crotchpheasants!
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shiznitz
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4268
the plural of mangina
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That is the initial EQ2 "soft" corpse looting system. There is a reason they removed it after less than a year. I wonder how this mechanic will deal with quest turn in items? No way they let those poof. What about bind-on-equip items? I see this being softening to the point of simply a travel tax pretty quickly. And the "we miss UO" section: If you attempt to heal or buff characters who are in the act of attacking others, even if you are not a member of the same group or social organization as those you're healing, you'll be subject to the same penalties as the criminals you've chosen to associate with. Likewise, if you debuff, dispel, or banish assets of characters engaged in PvP, you'll be tagged with the same penalties as those your targets are fighting if they should die. In both cases, you'll make yourself a legitimate target for retribution during the fight—your opponents won't become criminals by acting to stop you from aiding their enemies. Because the criminal system in UO was so successful at stopping griefing...
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« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 11:03:45 AM by shiznitz »
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I have never played WoW.
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Nebu
Terracotta Army
Posts: 17613
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Make that 4501. I like these kinds of things. It encourages me to play a class that is competitive naked.
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"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."
- Mark Twain
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Malakili
Terracotta Army
Posts: 10596
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Your character will re-enter play at the soulbinding point holding and wearing whatever gear they had equipped when they died, so you won't have to start without your armor, or the weapons, wands, or staves you were using. However, until you return to your husk, you are in danger of losing the rest of your inventory. If you get to your husk before anyone else, you'll be able to get all your stuff back. However, if another player finds your husk before you do, they'll be able to loot it. They won't recover everything that you had in your inventory—just a random selection—but the rest of your inventory will be destroyed and removed from the game. If you die surrounded by allies, they can't just pick up all of your equipment for you, as doing so would cause some of it to be removed from the game, but your allies could attempt to defend your husk until you return to it, so that you lose nothing but travel time.
I'm not particularly against item loss, but this might be the worst implementation of it I've seen.
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shiznitz
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4268
the plural of mangina
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The DIKU loot model most of us grew up on (i.e. random rewards for loot requiring a /ran function in the game to decide who gets what) had some basis at least in human psychology (eg. gambling) but twisting that into random punishment (i.e. losing the cool loot item you just won because 4a$r4p3r looter won the lotto looting your corpse) is beyond daft. BTW, here is his LinkedIn profile if you care enough to tell him he is batshit crazy. http://www.linkedin.com/in/rsdancey
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« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 02:08:35 PM by shiznitz »
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I have never played WoW.
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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Translation: We haven't learned a goddamn thing from almost 13 years of released MMOG's. We are steadfastly committed to making the same fucking mistakes over and over again until our game is full of shitheels and crotchpheasants! A lot of MMO devs have apparently never met a MMO player, or somehow think that the min/max tactics a dev might use when they play would never be used by anyone else. Nebu's almost correct - I don't think that your character loses what they are wearing, just what they have in their inventory. Player solution: wear the best weapons and armour you can possibly afford and carry almost nothing expensive in your inventory. Should the game ever launch, the first in will potentially have a huge advantage over those who come next, particularly if a guild can set up territorial control over key areas early. Not sure how many players from wave 4 will accept an introduction of, "Welcome to Pathfinder! The Empire demands its tithe; enjoy meeting the gank squad. All the good spots have already been taken too." Now all it needs is permanent player housing that can be built wherever players can find valid land and the circle will be complete.
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JWIV
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2392
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Ugh. If I wanted a kick to the nuts in my gameplay - I could just go play Vanguard again.
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Modern Angel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3553
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Amazing.
I will say that this is mitigated by the fact that they're planning on low sub numbers. I don't think, in a post-WoW world with the jury still out on SWTOR, that indie MMOs which are designed to be very niche are the worst outcome we could have.
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Malakili
Terracotta Army
Posts: 10596
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Ugh. If I wanted a kick to the nuts in my gameplay - I could just go play Vanguard again.
The part that really gets me is that you can't have allies loot you without perma loss of some of the items. I can deal with the idea of some enemy looting my corpse and therefore losing items, but it seems to me that anyone but you looting your corpse = some items get nuked is just a bad way to do it. Give me Darkfall over that.
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Lantyssa
Terracotta Army
Posts: 20848
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The DIKU loot model most of us grew up on (i.e. random rewards for loot requiring a /ran function in the game to decide who gets what) had some basis at least in human psychology (eg. gambling) but twisting that into random punishment (i.e. losing the cool loot item you just won because 4a$r4p3r looter won the lotto looting your corpse) is beyond daft.
The real DIKU model the mobs wore or carried what you could loot. There were even spells you could use to help pinpoint what mob had an item you were interested in. At least with stock code. It was EQ(?) or later that made random loot be the defacto rule.
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Hahahaha! I'm really good at this!
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shiznitz
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4268
the plural of mangina
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Right and EQ set the DIKU MMO genre hard on that random loot drop course. As annoying as it was to get on a list to have a chance to roll on the FBSS, it was strangely compelling. Until it wasn't.
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I have never played WoW.
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Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8306
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I've never found random loot compelling and the fact so many people seem to like it drives me a little mad.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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Mrbloodworth
Terracotta Army
Posts: 15148
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I don't think anyone likes it.
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Ingmar
Terracotta Army
Posts: 19280
Auto Assault Affectionado
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I don't think anyone likes it.
Millions of Diablo players disagree.
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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Mrbloodworth
Terracotta Army
Posts: 15148
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Completely different i think. I don't like a 1/20 chance of getting a _____ paw. For example. I also do not like getting an item I can't use ( Loved WAR for this ). What I do not mind is random item looks, stats and slots. That's fine. Maybe I misunderstood what you guys were talking about.
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Ingmar
Terracotta Army
Posts: 19280
Auto Assault Affectionado
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An SoJ is an SoJ, and your chances of getting one are far more random than most everything in an MMO.
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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shiznitz
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4268
the plural of mangina
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Completely different i think. I don't like a 1/20 chance of getting a _____ paw. For example. I also do not like getting an item I can't use ( Loved WAR for this ). What I do not mind is random item looks, stats and slots. That's fine. Maybe I misunderstood what you guys were talking about.
I wasn't referring so much to "type of item" randomness, but the kill the mob and "who the hell knows if he will drop anything this time" randomness.
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I have never played WoW.
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Ratman_tf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3818
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Awesome! I was afraid it was going the WoW clone route, and we'd have nothing to talk about.
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"What I'm saying is you should make friends with a few catasses, they smell funny but they're very helpful." -Calantus makes the best of a smelly situation.
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Kageru
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4549
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Random loot is fine. It's a design balance to extend content at a cost in repetition / tedium if you overdo it. It meant that when you saw a named mob in an EQ dungeon you got excited at what you might get, if you saw the item on the corpse you felt a burst of happiness. Worked especially well in EQ where sitting around killing mobs for XP was the regular game-play. For a low budget game, which I assume this is, it's probably almost mandatory.
We're certainly at a dry patch in MMO's though.
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Is a man not entitled to the hurf of his durf? - Simond
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Trippy
Administrator
Posts: 23638
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I don't think anyone likes it.
You would be wrong. Google "Partial Reinforcement Extinction Effect" (PREE).
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lamaros
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8021
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So very dumb. I take back all my earlier comments. They have no idea what they are doing at all.
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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A look at their staff page seems to indicate a heavy ex-CCP presence.
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Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 15185
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I think this is great. Look, if you're going to start an MMO that nobody gives a shit about anyway, in a market where MMO failure is nearly a given, in a game structure that doesn't work whether you spend $100 or $100 million, what's the only use of having a product? Helping to serve as confirmatory sociological evidence that the jerkoff 9th grade misanthrope braying on general chat in a more carebear product is in fact part of an excrutiatingly tiny fraction of humanity that no one would miss if their keyboards electrocuted them while playing this game.
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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If the Collector's Edition comes with an electrocuting keyboard, I will subscribe to this game (standard box) for at least a month.
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luckton
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5947
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"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."
"Tuning me out doesn't magically change the design or implementation of said design. Though, that'd be neat if it did." -schild
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Montague
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1297
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I hope Mr. Dancey enjoys the year or two of Mark Jacobsian self promotion he's indulging in before this piece of shit is exposed at release. He's been taking credit for Monte Cook's work on 3rd edition for years when all he really did was design the OGL and write the godawful Hero Builders Guidebook. That whole blog just screams "LOOK AT ME, I IZ A GAME DESIGNERRRR!!!"
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When Fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross - Sinclair Lewis.
I can tell more than 1 fucktard at a time to stfu, have no fears. - WayAbvPar
We all have the God-given right to go to hell our own way. Don't fuck with God's plan. - MahrinSkel
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shiznitz
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4268
the plural of mangina
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Time for a chart:
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I have never played WoW.
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Modern Angel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3553
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Let's see how much money they sink into this. Niche or not, that looks like the exact wrong way to do things and it'll break an RPG publisher with a quickness if it's awful.
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Ingmar
Terracotta Army
Posts: 19280
Auto Assault Affectionado
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Well, Paizo should be safe from that at least, they don't look to be sinking any money in themselves.
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The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT. Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
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