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Author Topic: NFL 2011  (Read 373924 times)
Paelos
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Reply #35 on: June 06, 2011, 01:07:37 PM

I think the Panthers are focused on a youth move. They know they won't win shit this year whether their starting QB is Moore, Claussen or Cam Newton. Burress won't help Steve Smith enough and he'll take reps from a young guy that could grow with whichever franchise QB they go with.

I disagree with the Smith help. Smith's going to draw doubles all year unless they bring in a name who can actually make a secondary think twice. Burress is a big enough name where leaving him 1 on 1 could be a total disaster.

By the way, you don't want receivers growing with QBs. That's a receipt for disaster. What you want is experienced WRs with younger QBs, and then when the QB matures, you give him younger WRs. Experienced WRs open up things for QBs who can only make so many reads, while younger receivers offer the speed and raw athleticism that a mature QB who can squeeze the ball into spots will abuse.

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HaemishM
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Reply #36 on: June 06, 2011, 01:58:01 PM

The Panthers already have Smith to help the young QB. Having another ego-driven older wideout taking up more money than he's worth isn't going to help. They'd be better off with running backs and o-linemen than another idiot receiver.

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Reply #37 on: June 06, 2011, 03:09:43 PM

The Panthers already have Smith to help the young QB. Having another ego-driven older wideout taking up more money than he's worth isn't going to help. They'd be better off with running backs and o-linemen than another idiot receiver.

The entire NFL would be better off with running backs or offensive lineman than another idiot receiver though.

'Reality' is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes.
Paelos
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Reply #38 on: June 06, 2011, 03:18:55 PM

That's true. I honestly don't know why people think that having a big name wideout matters. In almost every situation, I can point to the lineman and the QB being the reason for a team's success.

I'm trying to think of a game-changer wide receiver, and it's pretty damn hard. I mean, is there are guy you go, yeah without that wide receiver, there's no way in hell they make the playoffs? Conversely can you point to a situation where they had the line, they had the experienced QB, but they lacked a receiver that could make a difference?

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Reply #39 on: June 06, 2011, 03:28:38 PM

Jerry Rice?  He's the last game changer that I remember over a long scale of time.  And he had some damned good QBs to help him out. 
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Reply #40 on: June 06, 2011, 04:02:58 PM

While I do not think Jerry Rice would've been Jerry Motherfuckin' Rice without the QBs he played for, I don't think they would've been OMG Those Quarterbacks!!!! without him, yeah.

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Azuredream
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Reply #41 on: June 06, 2011, 05:41:01 PM

I think Andre Johnson makes Matt Schaub look better than he actually is, but Houston hasn't made the playoffs so he can't be that much of a game-changer.

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ghost
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Reply #42 on: June 06, 2011, 06:39:40 PM

While I do not think Jerry Rice would've been Jerry Motherfuckin' Rice without the QBs he played for, I don't think they would've been OMG Those Quarterbacks!!!! without him, yeah.

Jerry Rice was certainly a badass.  There's no disputing that.  He probably made Steve Young more OMG than Montana, who was on a different planet when it comes to talent. 

I don't remember any receivers that were "game changers" like Rice since then.  Does anyone have a name? 
01101010
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Reply #43 on: June 06, 2011, 06:46:13 PM

Tim Brown wasn't any slouch, but my hero back in the day was Steve Largent. Cris Carter was pretty good and Michael Irving. Dunno if anyone was on Jerry's level though, so kind of an unfair comparison.

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Reply #44 on: June 06, 2011, 07:20:47 PM

Sterling Sharpe was a beast. Sadly his neck injury ended his career early.

Of course, the loss of Sharpe is pretty much what turned Green Bay into the home of the "obscure wideout becomes league leader" capital of the NFL, and it arguably made Favre even better than he already was.

Most people just think of him as a funny analyst on ESPN/wherever he went to these days.

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01101010
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Reply #45 on: June 06, 2011, 07:27:09 PM

Sterling Sharpe was a beast. Sadly his neck injury ended his career early.

Of course, the loss of Sharpe is pretty much what turned Green Bay into the home of the "obscure wideout becomes league leader" capital of the NFL, and it arguably made Favre even better than he already was.

Most people just think of him as a funny analyst on ESPN/wherever he went to these days.

aka Wesley Snipes?  why so serious?

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HaemishM
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Reply #46 on: June 06, 2011, 08:49:16 PM

I think Terrell Owens and Randy Moss were both game-changers at times in their careers. Philly definitely wouldn't have made the Super Bowl without Owens that year, and Randy Moss made Dante Culpepper a much better NFL QB than he was, not to mention how dominant he made Tom Brady in 2007. They aren't Rice level, mainly because Rice was able to keep his level of play consistently high for a lot longer than to two of them combined. Marvin Harrison was certainly one of the reasons the Colts were good when they didn't have any good secondary receivers (i.e. until Reggie Wayne came along).

ghost
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Reply #47 on: June 07, 2011, 06:54:21 AM

It's interesting to check out the stats of TO, Jerry Rice and Moss.  Over an 11 year stretch in each of their careers they were very similar.  

Moss
TO
Jerry Rice

I think that Rice probably had two things going for him:  1.  He wasn't caught up with the "gotta get mine" mentality that Meshawn Johnson brought with him to the league, and 2.  He had a great fucking team.  I would love to see what a guy like Moss could have done with a reasonable mental state and a great team when he was in  his prime.

Reviewing his stats, it is clear that Plaxico Burress is not that special receiver
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 07:14:36 AM by ghost »
Paelos
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Reply #48 on: June 07, 2011, 07:43:20 AM

There's absolutely nothing that a loud-mouthed-me-first receiver can bring to my team that I couldn't get from a guy like Marvin Harrison, Brian Finneran, or Wes Welker.

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HaemishM
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Reply #49 on: June 07, 2011, 07:58:09 AM

Man, Wes Welker is absolutely worth his weight in fucking gold, IMO. He's like a more talented version of Donald Driver. Quiet, tough as nails possession receiver who always seems to get open when you need him. How the fuck Miami traded him to a division rival I will never figure out.

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Reply #50 on: June 07, 2011, 08:03:50 AM

Welker is amazing.  And there's a reason the Dolphins are so fucking terrible-  their front office sucks.  Of course they traded them to a division rival.  That's the only logical course for such a fucked up organization.
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Reply #51 on: June 07, 2011, 09:51:49 AM

FML...

So the NFL is considering an 8-game season, which would push the super bowl back one week to February 12th, which is my wedding day........
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Reply #52 on: June 07, 2011, 09:55:10 AM

Quote
It's not an absolute lead-pipe lock that we'll have a full NFL season, and as such, the owners and commissioner have been planning for alternate shortened seasons, the likes of which we haven't had since 1987, which was the last time there was a work stoppage.
awesome, for real

I think it's a lead-pipe-lock that we won't have a full NFL season.
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Reply #53 on: June 07, 2011, 12:08:51 PM

Welker is amazing.  And there's a reason the Dolphins are so fucking terrible-  their front office sucks.  Of course they traded them to a division rival.  That's the only logical course for such a fucked up organization.

Ireland/Sparano wouldn't have made that trade, but I see your point. The new regime had to draft Davone Bess to cover the loss of Welker when they took office in 2008.  awesome, for real Luckily, Bess can hold his own.

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Paelos
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Reply #54 on: June 07, 2011, 12:42:46 PM

In the worst trades in the that franchise, I'd rank them like this:

1 - Dolphins trade for Culpepper instead of signing Drew Brees.
2 - Dolphins trade away 2 #1's and a #2 for Ricky Williams
3 - Dolphins trade Anthony Carter to the Vikings for a LB and a pick
4 - Dolphins trade Wes Welker for 2 picks.
5 - Dolphins trade second round pick to Philly for AJ Feely

In that order. If I was a fan I'd just focus on the fact my basketball team is good.

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stu
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Reply #55 on: June 07, 2011, 12:52:39 PM

Those are still old deals. Oh lordy, the Brees deal was a real missed opportunity but I'm happy for the Saints. The Randy Mueller years were harsh for Miami. Still, they haven't made any bad moves since the new guys arrived, at least off the top of my head. Not having a replacement at QB has hurt them. I guess they could have taken Matt Ryan instead of Long, but then they wouldn't have a line (plus Long was a sure thing)...

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Paelos
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Reply #56 on: June 07, 2011, 12:59:05 PM

Trading 2 picks for Brandon Marshall is newer, and equally as dumb for the Dolphins.

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stu
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Reply #57 on: June 07, 2011, 01:07:49 PM

That's crazy talk. swamp poop Brandon Marshall is one of the top receivers in the NFL.

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WayAbvPar
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Reply #58 on: June 07, 2011, 01:08:41 PM

But WR is about the 6th most important position on a team (if that), and there are very few players worth that kind of bounty.

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Reply #59 on: June 07, 2011, 01:31:44 PM

That's crazy talk. swamp poop Brandon Marshall is one of the top receivers in the NFL when his QB can actually throw him the ball.

FIFY

Fucking Kyle Neckbeard Orton could hit Marshall for long bombs better than anyone on the Miami team last year.

Paelos
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Reply #60 on: June 07, 2011, 01:59:49 PM

That's crazy talk. swamp poop Brandon Marshall is one of the top receivers in the NFL.

Bradon Marshall had two good games. The loss to the Jets where he had 166 yards and a TD. The other was the OT win in Green Bay when he had 127 yards on 10 catches. Both of those were early in the season. After that, teams planned for him and completely took him out of the equation (excepting Buffalo and Detroit, who can't cover a wounded sloth).

Take away the two meaningless games against those crap teams at the end of the year, and you have a receiver that gets 65-70 yards a game, and catches a TD once in every 6. Hell even with the crap games, I can name 20 receivers I'd rather have in the league.

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Reply #61 on: June 07, 2011, 02:38:21 PM

You know as well as I do, that's not an accurate depiction of him. He had to rely on Tyler Thigpen to get him the ball in the second half. Tyler Thigpen.

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ghost
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Reply #62 on: June 07, 2011, 02:39:08 PM

Who is Brandon Marshall?
Rasix
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Reply #63 on: June 07, 2011, 02:50:18 PM

Some dude that tends to beat on his girlfriends.   

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HaemishM
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Reply #64 on: June 07, 2011, 02:53:19 PM

Not that that narrows the field down any.  why so serious?

Paelos
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Reply #65 on: June 07, 2011, 03:11:01 PM

You know as well as I do, that's not an accurate depiction of him. He had to rely on Tyler Thigpen to get him the ball in the second half. Tyler Thigpen.

I'm not pointing out that he sucks. I'm pointing out how stupid it was to trade for a receiver. You can gameplan for one guy, and you need him to get the ball.

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Reply #66 on: June 07, 2011, 08:28:22 PM

Not that that narrows the field down any.  why so serious?

You stole my post.  angry

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Reply #67 on: July 12, 2011, 05:51:28 PM

The IT Director at work is the brother-in-law of Dallas' head scout.  Just thought I'd pass along Jimmy Jone's personal guarantee that the season will go on. (This info was relayed as the ITD was looking to set up fantasy leagues for this year.)

Take it at the face value of JJ's integrity.

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Reply #68 on: July 25, 2011, 02:21:24 PM

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that the lockout is over and the season is on after all.

Over and out.
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Reply #69 on: July 25, 2011, 02:37:13 PM

Favre rumored to Philly as backup.  Vick tweets "it would be an honor to have Favre as my backup" and then deletes it an hour later.

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