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Author Topic: Buying a new car, need some advice  (Read 341580 times)
sinij
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Reply #70 on: April 19, 2011, 03:52:28 PM

For a lot less than the depreciation over the first few years of ownership, I can buy a gold-plated extended warranty on a used car.

There is no such thing as gold-plated warranty. Even "everything covered" warranty would not cover things that break most.

Buying extended warranties = waste of money. Huge scam perpetuated by fine print lawyering.

Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.
sinij
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Reply #71 on: April 19, 2011, 03:54:55 PM

You sir are quite wrong.
The only time leasing DOESNT make sense is on cars that dont depreciate or do-so very little, you drive a helluva lot of miles per year, or you have some sick fascination with maintaining/owning a car for more than 5 yrs.

Do the math on total cost of ownership over 5 years. Leasing is by far most expensive option.

Quote
Heh, in a normal car loan you still essentially owe money w/o any collateral.  This is why you're lucky to get a decent loan rate at a 5 yr. loan (banks really dont give a shit about using your car as collateral).  At which point you'd likely have spent over $30k for a $20k car.  Literally $10k is down the drain at the end of your loan period.

This is always the case when you borrow money. If you borrow, and most people do, leases are *always* higher interest than financing.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2011, 04:20:39 PM by sinij »

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Trippy
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Reply #72 on: April 19, 2011, 04:18:58 PM

For a lot less than the depreciation over the first few years of ownership, I can buy a gold-plated extended warranty on a used car.

There is no such thing as gold-plated warranty. Even "everything covered" warranty would not cover things that break most.

Buying extended warranties = waste of money. Huge scam perpetuated by fine print lawyering.
An extended warranty on my current car would've saved me a fuckton of money.
sinij
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Reply #73 on: April 19, 2011, 04:22:59 PM

For a lot less than the depreciation over the first few years of ownership, I can buy a gold-plated extended warranty on a used car.

There is no such thing as gold-plated warranty. Even "everything covered" warranty would not cover things that break most.

Buying extended warranties = waste of money. Huge scam perpetuated by fine print lawyering.
An extended warranty on my current car would've saved me a fuckton of money.


No it wouldn't. They would have showed you fine print and explained why none of it is covered. Extended warranties cover some engine work, some transmission work, compressor, alternator and some emission parts. Things that are not very likely to ever break in the modern car that would be eligible for extended warranty. If you car isn't "properly" maintained, and that includes buying all pointless schedule items that are money-maker for the dealer, like grease the fucking door hinges, or you put  any mods on you car forget about getting any money out of your warranty.

For example typical extended warranty would cover for head gasket failure, but only up to 120,000 miles or 5 years while you could expect any new car engine to not need it for the first 10 years or 200,000 miles. The same goes for almost any other component that they would cover, way below median life. Another example - most would tell you suspension is covered, but read fine print what they consider as a wear-and-tear item.  Another example - you put after-market stereo in your car; they now will deny you any and all electrical/wiring claims by blaming your stereo. Another example - you put short shifter kit on your car; you now voided any engine, transmission or drive train work.

The one time extended warranty makes sense if you _knowingly_ buying a lemon. Another one if you plan to race the shit out of your car and know how to game the system by taking off/hiding mods.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2011, 04:45:01 PM by sinij »

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Trippy
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Reply #74 on: April 19, 2011, 04:27:31 PM

Does an extended warranty normally not cover the same things the factory warranty does? If that's true then you might be right, I'd have to go read the fine print to know for sure.

Edit: same things

sinij
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Reply #75 on: April 19, 2011, 04:28:53 PM

Does an extended warranty normally not cover the things the factory warranty does? If that's true then you might be right, I'd have to go read the fine print to know for sure.


Read the fine print. It doesn't.

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Reply #76 on: April 19, 2011, 04:33:14 PM

Understood.
Selby
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Reply #77 on: April 19, 2011, 06:06:19 PM

Read the fine print. It doesn't.
My only experience with an extended warranty was exactly like Sinij says.  Every little thing had a weasel clause to allow the warranty company to get out of fixing it. My personal example was transmission related: it had to just "break" and it couldn't have been brought in a mechanic because it was slipping, leaking ANY fluid, missing shifts, etc.  The electronic sensors were also not covered and neither were planetaries.  Basically it had to just up and mechanically die (and not break the case, which if you know auto trannies they rarely just up and die without major case failure) and anything else was not covered.  The fine print in that thing that I spent hours going over with the transmission repair guy was unreal.
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Reply #78 on: April 19, 2011, 06:59:24 PM

Okay, fine, let me restate that: I could buy another used car with the amount that a new car depreciates in the first few years.

--Dave

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TheWalrus
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Reply #79 on: April 19, 2011, 10:16:53 PM

Oh noes depreciation!

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Numtini
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Reply #80 on: April 20, 2011, 06:37:42 AM

We buy new cars and drive them into the ground. Our reason is basically security, we want one car that is reliable--at one point it was for long trips and now it's because we have the sprog. So at any one time we generally have a 0-6 year old car and a 5-12 year old car. It's probably not logical. But we are willing to pay for it and our premium for buying new is rather low because we buy Japanese economy cars. They have low depreciation, so we wouldn't get much of a discount for buying recent used. And they're usually among the cheapest dozen or so cars available, so it doesn't amount to a large amount of money anyway.

I am a four/all wheel drive skeptic. Here's a great rule of thumb: if everyone where you live doesn't change from regular to snow tires in the winter, you don't need 4wd to live there. It's expensive and kills your gas mileage. (And if you think $4 is some kind of peak, you're crazy. It's only going to go up.) And I've lived in rural towns in the foothills of the Berkshires and driven past jeeps stuck in the snow while driving a fwd. Also, isn't there a mandate for all cars in the very near future to have traction control?

My understanding is leasing works out great for the 1950s crowd. People who buy a new car every other year. And yes, these people do still exist, though as far as I can tell they did, in fact, develop their purchasing habits in the 50s and 60s. We have several part time workers here who are retired well off women who have no need to work, but as far as I can tell, keep part time jobs for some "mad money" for the sole purpose of driving a brand new luxury car at all times. (This means we have several Lexuses in the parking lot that angry taxpayers throw in our faces as proof we're being over paid.)

I had an extended warranty. They're a joke. Even if you can cajole them into fixing things, they will do the absolute minimum. So if there's some bad widget in your transmission (and this is what happened to me) and the standard repair is to replace it and replace X, Y, and Z because they're cheap money, they're guaranteed to go if the other part did, and the thing is already disassembled which is 90% of the cost, the warranty will replace only the broken part and won't even allow you to pay for X, Y, and Z on your own money. And there I was 20k miles later after the warranty expired needing X, Y, and Z replaced. My understanding is these companies often disappear playing the bankruptcy and open under a different name thing.

If you can read this, you're on a board populated by misogynist assholes.
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Reply #81 on: April 20, 2011, 06:53:58 AM

Okay, fine, let me restate that: I could buy another used car with the amount that a new car depreciates in the first few years.

--Dave

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I don't think you understand depreciation.

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Reply #82 on: April 20, 2011, 11:06:18 AM

I really want to pick up one of these.



Needs black rims though.
Morat20
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Reply #83 on: April 20, 2011, 11:18:07 AM

One of my friends was bitching today that the gas pumps kept cutting off the gas at 75 dollars, and was bitching because she wanted to fill up her truck and she kept having to run it twice.

Which made me want to add -- definitely want to look at mileage. Gas isn't going to get cheaper.
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Reply #84 on: April 20, 2011, 11:43:04 AM

Mileage wasn't something I paid any close attention to when I got my truck a couple years ago, and I'm seriously regretting it now.  I'm currently in the process of looking into what vehicle to get when I trade in the truck, and it's pretty high on the list of important criteria.  Unfortunately, I'm hampered in that not many vehicles have great headroom or legroom for someone who's 6 ft. 5. 
Numtini
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Reply #85 on: April 20, 2011, 12:27:59 PM

Mileage wasn't something I paid any close attention to when I got my truck a couple years ago, and I'm seriously regretting it now.  I'm currently in the process of looking into what vehicle to get when I trade in the truck, and it's pretty high on the list of important criteria.  Unfortunately, I'm hampered in that not many vehicles have great headroom or legroom for someone who's 6 ft. 5. 

You'd be surprised.

Ford F150: Front Headroom 41", Front Legroom 41.4"
Honda Fit: Front Headroom 40.4", Front Legroom 41.3"

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Mazakiel
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Reply #86 on: April 20, 2011, 12:52:47 PM

I'm trying to avoid another truck if I can, but I'll have to take a close look at the Honda Fit, it'd slipped my notice when I was first trying to find stuff with decent interior dimensions.  Thanks! 
Morat20
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Reply #87 on: April 20, 2011, 12:57:15 PM

I'm trying to avoid another truck if I can, but I'll have to take a close look at the Honda Fit, it'd slipped my notice when I was first trying to find stuff with decent interior dimensions.  Thanks! 
I reiterate: Go to a Carmax, ignore the selling attempts, and sit in as many vehicles as you think might fit your needs. All it takes is time, and you can get a good idea of what manufacturers and models are likely to have the room you want.
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Reply #88 on: April 20, 2011, 01:01:05 PM

Yep, I'm hoping to have time in the next week or so to start looking in earnest before I really start having to travel a lot again. 
Johny Cee
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Reply #89 on: April 20, 2011, 01:03:04 PM

I am a four/all wheel drive skeptic. Here's a great rule of thumb: if everyone where you live doesn't change from regular to snow tires in the winter, you don't need 4wd to live there. It's expensive and kills your gas mileage. (And if you think $4 is some kind of peak, you're crazy. It's only going to go up.) And I've lived in rural towns in the foothills of the Berkshires and driven past jeeps stuck in the snow while driving a fwd. Also, isn't there a mandate for all cars in the very near future to have traction control?

Wait.  The Berkshires get snow?  When did that happen?


AWD/4WD doesn't help you stay on the road.  At all.  That's all your tires, which means that if you live in a climate with harsh and snowy winters you should have snow tires.

AWD/4WD help you accelerate and move forward.  In any place where you can see regular snowfalls of 6"-12"s, this is massively helpful to get going and to push through the drifts and tailings left by snowplows.  Also, if you do go off the road, it's usually easier to get a AWD/4WD back out.

Here, a major problem is driveways and intersections... places where the snow plows have pushed up a bank of snow & ice tailings that you need to bust through.  A 4WD, with better power and a higher wheelbase, has a much easier time then a car (or SUV on a car base).

Just about the only time I get stuck now, it's when I get the bodywork stuck on a snow drift...  which wouldn't be a problem if I didn't drive an Escape (which is on a car wheelbase).
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Reply #90 on: April 20, 2011, 01:03:58 PM

Unfortunately, I'm hampered in that not many vehicles have great headroom or legroom for someone who's 6 ft. 5.  

I think I may have the car for you!  :D  All kidding aside, I'm seeing more and more of these around town, and I think they're pretty keen.

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Sky
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Reply #91 on: April 20, 2011, 01:26:25 PM

I've seriously considered something like this for a summer ride, too.  DRILLING AND MANLINESS
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Reply #92 on: April 20, 2011, 04:11:53 PM

Unfortunately, I'm hampered in that not many vehicles have great headroom or legroom for someone who's 6 ft. 5. 

I am not 6'5, but I can tell you that a lot of smaller cars have a ton of room as they are much more efficient on use of space than larger cars are. My friend has a Scion XB (like posted above) and it has more head/leg room for all passengers (front and back) than my parents' full-size Ford Expedition. It also gets close to 30 miles a gallon. Big problems are it looks like a damn shortbus and it has the guages in the center console which bugs the hell out of me.

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Reply #93 on: April 20, 2011, 04:41:51 PM

Mileage wasn't something I paid any close attention to when I got my truck a couple years ago, and I'm seriously regretting it now.
I bought a diesel truck specifically because of this.  20MPG from a 5000lb truck that I can haul everything I own around in sure beats the gas equivalent of 8-12.  And I skipped the 4x4 as well (amusingly which is why the guy was selling it).  I use it for actually moving stuff around and since I have no friends with a truck...  I fill it up every 6-8 weeks after having driven ~350-400 miles or so and still have 3/8 of a tank.

Personally, I consider having to pay fuel prices a part of owning a car.  It allows me to get to work in 15 minutes vs. the 60 minutes public transportation takes.

As far as cars to fit in... sure being 6'3" myself I've had problems... but not anything overly recent.  Most of the "damn this car is tiny" comes from 70's and 80's econo-boxes I rode around in during high school.  My 2005 RX-8 has headroom issues, but not horribly.  All of the other cars I own have plenty of room.
sinij
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Reply #94 on: April 20, 2011, 04:47:45 PM

Okay, fine, let me restate that: I could buy another used car with the amount that a new car depreciates in the first few years.


Sure, if you don't mind driving THIS


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sinij
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Reply #95 on: April 20, 2011, 04:53:07 PM

I've seriously considered something like this for a summer ride, too.  DRILLING AND MANLINESS

Generally speaking, anything made before mid 50s is not highway-worthy, unless its a sports car.

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Mazakiel
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Reply #96 on: April 20, 2011, 05:33:38 PM

Unfortunately, I'm hampered in that not many vehicles have great headroom or legroom for someone who's 6 ft. 5. 

I am not 6'5, but I can tell you that a lot of smaller cars have a ton of room as they are much more efficient on use of space than larger cars are. My friend has a Scion XB (like posted above) and it has more head/leg room for all passengers (front and back) than my parents' full-size Ford Expedition. It also gets close to 30 miles a gallon. Big problems are it looks like a damn shortbus and it has the guages in the center console which bugs the hell out of me.

I'm at the point where I don't really care if it looks goofy or not, as long as it's comfortable for long drives and gets better mileage.  Between travel for work and trips to get the hell away from West Texas, I rack up a lot of hours on the road in a month.  Unfortunately, the few I've hopped into so far to test have me feeling like I'm in a clown car. 


Mileage wasn't something I paid any close attention to when I got my truck a couple years ago, and I'm seriously regretting it now.
I bought a diesel truck specifically because of this.  20MPG from a 5000lb truck that I can haul everything I own around in sure beats the gas equivalent of 8-12.  And I skipped the 4x4 as well (amusingly which is why the guy was selling it).  I use it for actually moving stuff around and since I have no friends with a truck...  I fill it up every 6-8 weeks after having driven ~350-400 miles or so and still have 3/8 of a tank.

Personally, I consider having to pay fuel prices a part of owning a car.  It allows me to get to work in 15 minutes vs. the 60 minutes public transportation takes.

As far as cars to fit in... sure being 6'3" myself I've had problems... but not anything overly recent.  Most of the "damn this car is tiny" comes from 70's and 80's econo-boxes I rode around in during high school.  My 2005 RX-8 has headroom issues, but not horribly.  All of the other cars I own have plenty of room.


Yeah, I don't mind paying for fuel in general.  Not that it matters, public transportation isn't an option at all for me out here.  Where it starts to hurt is whenever I travel.  I do get reimbursed for mileage for work travel, but it still adds up pretty quick, and it can get painful whenever I travel to Dallas or Austin.  I'd much rather spend that money elsewhere.   While having a truck has been handy at times, I really need something different for day to day use. 
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Reply #97 on: April 20, 2011, 06:29:52 PM

Okay, fine, let me restate that: I could buy another used car with the amount that a new car depreciates in the first few years.


Sure, if you don't mind driving THIS

More like a 4-5 year old version of the same model.  A 5 year old car generally costs half as much as the brand new version of the same model (there are numerous exceptions, as well as cars that go down in value far faster because they suck).

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Reply #98 on: April 20, 2011, 07:08:56 PM

Suck or are undersold. You've got 4-5 years of consumer feedback and repair history by that point to decide which it is, though.

And let's not pretend that buying new is an worry-free guarantee.  Work buddy had bought a brand-new Buick LaCrosse that had several problems with the belts and interior in the first 12 months. (Right up until he got rear-ended  awesome, for real)

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Reply #99 on: April 20, 2011, 09:25:29 PM

Unfortunately, I'm hampered in that not many vehicles have great headroom or legroom for someone who's 6 ft. 5.  

I think I may have the car for you!  :D  All kidding aside, I'm seeing more and more of these around town, and I think they're pretty keen.

Didn't they design the lwb version around carrying a sheet of 4x8 material?

And! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1pklvKKnd0 (Actually that might be the transit, not the transit connect).
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 09:32:21 PM by Furiously »

TheWalrus
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Reply #100 on: April 20, 2011, 11:59:30 PM

I'm trying to avoid another truck if I can, but I'll have to take a close look at the Honda Fit, it'd slipped my notice when I was first trying to find stuff with decent interior dimensions.  Thanks! 

I like hondas fine, but I'm a tall guy too and my big feet never fit the damn pedals. I would never feel safe driving one until they space those suckers out a little more.

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Reply #101 on: April 21, 2011, 06:35:42 AM

Generally speaking, anything made before mid 50s is not highway-worthy, unless its a sports car.
The only highway I use is optional. We're a two-car household, so in the summer we could use her compact for longer trips and in the winter we'd use the FJ.
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Reply #102 on: April 21, 2011, 08:47:12 AM

Quote
I'm trying to avoid another truck if I can, but I'll have to take a close look at the Honda Fit, it'd slipped my notice when I was first trying to find stuff with decent interior dimensions.  Thanks!


I just plucked it out of the air to show that small cars may very well have good amounts of room. We love our Fit and probably will end up getting a second when the Mazda dies. It's cavernous inside. by folding all the seats, including the front, I was able to put a double bed from Ikea in the thing and was able to close the hatch. Not bad for something that gets 35+ mpg. And it's a load of fun to drive.

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Reply #103 on: April 21, 2011, 08:54:22 AM

Currently they are selling 2011 4 door tundras for $22k with 0% financing for 5 years, I seriously doubt you could pick up a 2 year old one for under 20 and you certainly aren't going to get a 0% loan on it.  Seriously instead of blindly quoting rules of thumb just tell people to look at the deals and do the friggen math.  Wife just bought a new Camry hybrid, we paid 2k under msrp and financed it at 0%, pretty sure that deal wont be there in 6 months and with the 0% financing I can pretty much be assured I will never be under water on the car.
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Reply #104 on: April 21, 2011, 10:24:10 AM

I have a 2007 Acura RDX I bought new.  The car is awesome.  It has lots of room like a small SUV but it drives like a sports car in some ways.  I wore out the tires in less than 40,000 miles I drive it so aggressively.  I use the shifting paddles (99% of it downshifting) for cornering and passing all the time. 

A really fun and practical car.

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