CSM Elections Have Begun

[Goumindong]

Sauce?

General comments from current CSMs in the thread.

Basically if its for that post its a really stupid reason. Many of the current CSM's have expressed publicly the same type of sentiment and information that she did in her blog.(and said the same as i've said)

CCP is pretty stupid, but i don't think they're stupid enough to take someone off the CSM without cause.

[Pezzle]

That Chatlog Pezzle

Ahh, well you see that was not a chatlog.  That was generally from fanfest videos and interviews and various posts made back at the time when there was a massive upheaval against walking in stations.  CCP was trying to assure players the quality would not decrease.  There may have been a few people that told me some things like that face to face as well.  You will forgive me if it is all a bit blurry now.  Sorry I cannot source it now but the statements are out there somewhere. 

[eldaec]

While boring POS warfare was done away with

I often wonder if other people are playing a different space themed MMO where this has happened.

[Kitsune]

I'm at least glad to see the CSM's getting on CCP's case for their bullshit.  It's a shame if that post was what got her booted off.

[Numtini]

The minutes of the summit are up and available.

I commented to Mynxee that they were rather sterile and tense "like two surgeons looking for a lump." Her response was that clinical seemed better than just putting "you gotta be fucking kidding me?!"

[Sir T]

"You gotta be fucking kidding me" Would at least have been honest. But it would have spoiled the marketing gimmick of the csm

[Yoru]

Sir T 2010. I'd vote just to watch the awesome drama.

[Simond]

While boring POS warfare was done away with

I often wonder if other people are playing a different space themed MMO where this has happened.

To be fair, that is technically correct. It's just that it got replaced by something worse

The minutes of the summit are up and available.

I commented to Mynxee that they were rather sterile and tense "like two surgeons looking for a lump." Her response was that clinical seemed better than just putting "you gotta be fucking kidding me?!"

.
From the minutes: "Lag will always be an issue however EVE, but EVE is now, from a technical standpoint, in a better state than it has ever been."
Ahahahahaha, bloody hellfire. What colour is the sky in their world, I wonder?

[Sir T]

Sir T 2010. I'd vote just to watch the awesome drama.

Ok I admit. I laughed. While it might be entertaining to see the heads exploding all over eve and the people volunteering hours for huge heartfelt and emotional campaigns against my trip to Iceland, I think I'll pass.

Then again, tell CCP I'd be useless and I'd be a shoe in. No implication of vote rigging in CCPs totally fair and transparent voting system is indented. Its satire! Really!

[tgr]

Oh, it might be in a better state from a general technical standpoint, just like today's cars might generally be in a better state than the cars of 20 years ago.

Doesn't make the fact that one of its wheels is damaged and tends to go "oh hey, the driver wants to go that way, but I want to go that way instead" any better though. It'd still be rated as a piece of shit car.

[MahrinSkel]

The code is probably technically improved, but the actual end-user performance has dropped a lot since the high points of the Great War, when dedicated nodes hosted epic battles, an order of magnitude higher than any other game.  Hell, random unreinforced "meeting engagements" where medium sized fleets ran into each other in random systems performed better (at the expense of every other system that happened to share that node).

--Dave

[Numtini]

Teadaze just posted a pretty negative blog post about her feelings.

[Sparky]

They don't know how to fix their game or just think resources are better spent betting the farm on console MMOs and sparkly vampires.

Too bad console MMOs never work and by the time World of Darkness comes out tweens will have moved on to pirates or yetis or something.

[Stabs]

Hmm, tween yeti romantic fiction, sounds great.

He put his arms around her. She gazed longingly into his bloodshot red-rimmed eyes. His hug was so intense she felt a rib crack but in the passion of the moment it signified nothing. What are you thinking, darling? she said, nuzzlilng into his matted fur.
Mwooooooooooooooooogh!

If there are any publishers here who want more I can churn out 200 pages a day of that stuff.

[patience]

They don't know how to fix their game or just think resources are better spent betting the farm on console MMOs and sparkly vampires.

Too bad console MMOs never work and by the time World of Darkness comes out tweens will have moved on to pirates or yetis or something.

Twilights still envogue so they still have some hope of getting a bunch of newbs who will be put off by their poor implementation in 3 months.

[tgr]

Hmm, tween yeti romantic fiction, sounds great.

:words:

If there are any publishers here who want more I can churn out 200 pages a day of that stuff.

Oh god make it stop make it stop make it stoooooop

[Stabs]

Shush! You're spoiling my plan to be the new Stephanie Meyer!

[Stabs]

Oh by the way, I can write yeti porn too.

Oh, she said, oh oh oh yes YES!
His talons raked deep grooves in her mattress as his head bumped rhythmically against the wall.
Mwooooooooooooooooogh! he said, Mwooooooooooooooooogh! Mwooooooooooooooooogh! MWOOOOOOOOOOGH!

* runs away giggling as the mod sirens wail in the distance *

[Abysmal Horror]

Oh, she said, oh oh oh yes YES!
His talons raked deep grooves in her mattress as his head bumped rhythmically against the wall.
Mwooooooooooooooooogh! he said, Mwooooooooooooooooogh! Mwooooooooooooooooogh! MWOOOOOOOOOOGH!

I find your ideas fascinating and would like to subscribe to your yeti pr0n newsletter.    Mwoogh!

[Simond]

CCP attempts to calm the masses...by blaming the CSM.

CSM you say?

Like many of you, I have read the meeting minutes from the CSM 5 meetings in Reykjavik last month. To be completely up-front about it, I have to say I‘m quite taken aback by the difference in the meeting minutes compared to my firsthand experience from attending the meetings.

For my part, I felt the discussions were very constructive and I had great dialogue with the council members.

Maybe I‘m completely delusional and it didn‘t go that way at all, but there‘s definitely something broken in the feedback loop we have with the CSM and I will be working closely with them to enhance our collaboration. When two parties have such vastly different perceptions of the same event, something is wrong and needs to be fixed. We have some suggestions in mind and we will be exploring them in the fall. I‘m confident that with the CSM‘s help we can take this to the next level.

E: Oh God, the comments thread is great. There's people from all sorts of corps and alliances basically calling out CCP on their bullshit.

[Numtini]

The best part of that is those are the minutes that were negotiated with CCP. The private comments have been a lot more harsh.

My favorite tidbit from the last few days is they have 70 people working on walking around in stations and 15 people working on the ongoing game divided into four teams, one of which is working on lag.

[lac]

That's the same thing the guys returning from the CSM said last year. The Eve team is largely customer support/relations combined a small dev team while the company is focusing on their new products. Which is only normal I suppose.

[Simond]

Yep, I'm pretty sure Mythic, SOE and Funcom all did the same. 

[Comstar]

I hadn't realised till now that EvE won't get any major changes or fixes for the next 18 months. Looks like Aprocrpha and the 2nd Invasion of Delve was the high point of Eve Online and the game is now in maintenance mode while CCP works on Vampires, Bartender in Space and a Console FPS.

[tgr]

They should've started this process before dominion then, instead of breaking the game and THEN go into maintenance mode.

[Brolan]

This sounds like a great time to vote with your wallet and unsub for a while.  That's the only thing that gets attention from a MMO company.

[Phildo]

Funny, there are still a shitload of things about this game that I enjoy.  The only thing that's really messed up by lag is combat that's more often boring and full of blueballs than not anyway.  That and I guess they could buff Gallente a little.

[Kageru]

I've got to remember my rule to not read official forums. For enjoying a game ignorance can be bliss.

That said it is hard not to see them as spreading themselves far too thin on features with marginal value. I've not seen any new gameplay Incarna will bring and both the Eve and Xbox360 participants in dust have no real interest in the other which makes the effort of having that connection questionable. Not to even mention eve-gate.

[Stabs]

I'm not entirely sure I'm convinced that only having one team working on lag is a bad thing. It's a matter of quite delicate fine tuning and close communication at this stage, no? How does throwing more bodies at it help?

As for PI I'm enjoying it and I think it's going to be wonderful once it is integrated with DUST. I have several friends who can't cope with Eve who would love to run around with a rocket launcher on my behalf.

Incarna - well clearly it's going to be a lot more than RP in stations once it's done (several years hence). I can see a SWG style game where bounty hunters are sent to stations to take players out while dodging security. It's really a whole new game within Eve. I liked Galaxies and if I can headshot my enemies while they're having a drink at the pub as well as pod them in space I can see the attraction.

[Simond]

No PvP in Incarna.

[eldaec]

While boring POS warfare was done away with

I often wonder if other people are playing a different space themed MMO where this has happened.

To be fair, that is technically correct. It's just that it got replaced by something worse

No it isn't and I fail to understand how anyone playing in 0.0 would think otherwise.

You still have to kill all the fucking POS sooner or later - and since sov warfare is completely impractical under the dominion system, most fights are about moons and CSAAs anyway.

Heroically pointless station avatars : 70 developers
Shitty Console FPS integration : 7 developers
EVE Online the space themed MMO : 22 developers
Facebook but in space : 10 developers
Infrastructure and internal tools : 15 developers

[Sparky]

I'm not entirely sure I'm convinced that only having one team working on lag is a bad thing. It's a matter of quite delicate fine tuning and close communication at this stage, no? How does throwing more bodies at it help?

Really lag is only the most obvious facet of Eve's current shittiness.  You've got the horrible designed-on-the-back-of-a-napkin sovereignty system that desperately needs looking at,  balance issues that have turned capitals online into supercapitals online, shitloads of legacy bugs that people have bitched about forever and lots more.  There is literally years of shit that needs fixing but CCP have always been much better at new shiny than looking over their old code.

Bet they're regretting making the CSM now,

[Stabs]

No PvP in Incarna.

... in the short term.

In the longer term they're planning to make the complete sci fi experience where you can do anything.

[Numtini]

If an expansion was doing something useful, I don't think I'd have quite the same hostility towards the current development vs. bug fixing issues. But Incarna is IMHO a complete waste of time. I'll just repost what I put in my blog:

There are a lot of people who do not play Eve and many of them will tell you it’s because they’re not a person in the game, that they’re just a face and a spaceship. So the reaction has been to make a completely unrelated feature where people can wander around stations.

What the CCP devs are missing with Incarna is that the people who say they don’t like Eve because they don’t feel like a person aren’t asking for an add on to the game where they can walk around. They’re saying they don’t like the basic content of the game. It’s a way of summing up all of what Eve is about: Internet Spaceships. Eve will still be internet spaceships after Incarna, except there will be a lot of empty stations and one one full one, probably in Jita, that like The Reets Retreat in AO or Pocket D in COX is full of a couple of dozen G.I.R.L.’s cybering guys for isk.

Once the newness is gone, the only reason anyone else is going to venture into stations is if they’re forced to by game mechanics and doing so would be an enormous mistake. I dealt with being forced to use stations in Earth and Beyond, which was at its heart another Internet Spaceships game. In order to do anything in stations, one had to leave ones ship and go to the relevant room to do it. This additional “feature” of having to run around a station in order to get to the button to do something was not exactly a plus.

Instead of docking and hitting the fitting button, imagine docking, hitting the leave ship button, and running through a maze you’ve memorized for each cookie cutter station, so you can get to another room where you can press the fitting button stuck on a wall. Or “talk” with the “fitting sergeant.”

That’s not a social experience, it’s just a really really bad interface. And if you force players to do that, you aren’t going to get meaningful social interaction, you’re going to get silent zombies standing around like the mob of “bank alts” you find in every Auction House in WoW.

[eldaec]

Interestingly enough that was exactly the point that CCP made when they initially designed EVE not to have walking in stations and explicitly laughed at the idea that they'd ever be stupid enough to divert resources into such nonsense.