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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  World of Warcraft  |  Topic: Cataclysm 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: Cataclysm  (Read 1237972 times)
cmlancas
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2511


Reply #8225 on: August 15, 2012, 11:49:16 AM

We did a couple pulls and it's a clear step up in difficulty.  It'll be a few weeks for sure, but I think we have savior in reach now.

f13 Street Cred of the week:
I can't promise anything other than trauma and tragedy. -- schild
caladein
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3174


WWW
Reply #8226 on: August 19, 2012, 05:11:45 PM

Do you have a Warrior tank and non-awful damage dealers (for your progression level)?  If so, congratulations.

"Point being, they can't make everyone happy, so I hope they pick me." -Ingmar
"OH MY GOD WE'RE SURROUNDED SEND FOR BACKUP DIG IN DEFENSIVE POSITIONS MAN YOUR NECKBEARDS" -tgr
cmlancas
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2511


Reply #8227 on: August 20, 2012, 05:17:23 AM

Do you have a Warrior tank and non-awful damage dealers (for your progression level)?  If so, congratulations.

Our healers, MT, and two DPS have been carrying everyone for most of the expansion now.

It's readily apparent on spine -- even with the 30% debuff, we couldn't get the first tendon down in two lifts.

Also, people got their feelings hurt when we talked about this last night...I have a feeling our progression group is going to get incredibly butthurt in MoP.  Specifically, one of our hunters has argued with me that marksman is just fine, but he got out-bursted by a warlock last night.  In fact, our DPS is so bad I'm considering having our DK tank the amalgs in DPS gear just to beat the requirement.

We'll see how it goes next week.

f13 Street Cred of the week:
I can't promise anything other than trauma and tragedy. -- schild
Azazel
Contributor
Posts: 7735


Reply #8228 on: August 21, 2012, 05:55:34 PM

They're completely wrong. I did one last night for the first time in a while and it was a pain in the ass. "Hard" isn't quite the right word. Unfun is more like it.

Many of the encounters are cockstabs.  Yor'sahj is one that's just a stupid design.  Here's a really stupid boss, now here's random shit that happens.

I love, love, love Zon'ozz on heroic though.  It really feels like a truly heroic fight.

He was talking about Heroics (dungeons), I believe. Not DS.

http://azazelx.wordpress.com/ - My Miniatures and Hobby Blog.
Azazel
Contributor
Posts: 7735


Reply #8229 on: August 21, 2012, 06:40:14 PM

The most important word in that sentence in one you didn't bold: encouraged.  The matchmaking system, which is a huge positive otherwise, does encourage players to bail on a run that isn't perfect.  If one was stuck in the ass end of Scholomance or Botanica, they put up with a lot more because replacing someone or getting a new run for themselves was a chore.  Now, players can just bail, wait out any penalty, and get back into the dungeon with no repercussions.


Why should there be repercussions? We're playing a game to have fun. If people bail on a "non perfect" run, they get instantly repped by someone else the the rest of the players still get to finish the run. If you're having a shit time, or the others are asshats, why should you feel obliged to "suck it up" and stay in an unfun situation?

Across my characters, I've both bailed on groups and been part of groups that have been bailed on many times. I've kicked and been kicked. Who gives a rat's arse?

http://azazelx.wordpress.com/ - My Miniatures and Hobby Blog.
Lastwolf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 17


Reply #8230 on: August 22, 2012, 01:45:52 AM

They're completely wrong. I did one last night for the first time in a while and it was a pain in the ass. "Hard" isn't quite the right word. Unfun is more like it.

Many of the encounters are cockstabs.  Yor'sahj is one that's just a stupid design.  Here's a really stupid boss, now here's random shit that happens.

I love, love, love Zon'ozz on heroic though.  It really feels like a truly heroic fight.

I'm the opposite, Yor'sahj is an easier fight than Zon'ozz, for sure (the enrage timer is a lot softer as the setup has nearly always been 1tank-2healers) , but I enjoyed the encounter (Sahj) more, that ball is a pain in the ass to control as a tank, can't see it half the time, it never bounces back in a straight line, often does so in different directions, the distance between range group and boss has to be exact or the tank will take damage from the bounce back, which can often lead to tank death if timers mesh wrong, One fuck or buggy behavior, wipe, recovery from mistake is almost impossible.

Shaj is always different though and pre-buffs the combinations mattered, if you got two Red-yellow-black phases in a row, without the right or enough cooldowns, you're toast.
Lastwolf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 17


Reply #8231 on: August 22, 2012, 01:47:47 AM

They're completely wrong. I did one last night for the first time in a while and it was a pain in the ass. "Hard" isn't quite the right word. Unfun is more like it.

Many of the encounters are cockstabs.  Yor'sahj is one that's just a stupid design.  Here's a really stupid boss, now here's random shit that happens.

I love, love, love Zon'ozz on heroic though.  It really feels like a truly heroic fight.

I'm the opposite, Yor'sahj is an easier fight than Zon'ozz, for sure (the enrage timer is a lot softer as the setup has nearly always been 1tank-2healers) , but I enjoyed the encounter (Sahj) more, that ball is a pain in the ass to control as a tank, can't see it half the time, it never bounces back in a straight line, often does so in different directions, the distance between range group and boss has to be exact or the tank will take damage from the bounce back, which can often lead to tank death if timers mesh wrong, One fuckup with a dispell or buggy behavior, wipe. recovery from mistake is almost impossible.

Shaj is always different though and pre-buffs the combinations mattered, if you got two Red-yellow-black phases in a row, without the right or enough cooldowns, you're toast.
caladein
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3174


WWW
Reply #8232 on: August 22, 2012, 03:15:39 PM

The most important word in that sentence in one you didn't bold: encouraged.  The matchmaking system, which is a huge positive otherwise, does encourage players to bail on a run that isn't perfect.  If one was stuck in the ass end of Scholomance or Botanica, they put up with a lot more because replacing someone or getting a new run for themselves was a chore.  Now, players can just bail, wait out any penalty, and get back into the dungeon with no repercussions.

Why should there be repercussions? We're playing a game to have fun. If people bail on a "non perfect" run, they get instantly repped by someone else the the rest of the players still get to finish the run. If you're having a shit time, or the others are asshats, why should you feel obliged to "suck it up" and stay in an unfun situation?

Across my characters, I've both bailed on groups and been part of groups that have been bailed on many times. I've kicked and been kicked. Who gives a rat's arse?

I never said there should be any repercussions. The system as it is now works fine for what it's doing, which you describe well. It doesn't do a good job at providing the incentive/disincentive structure to get people to learn and teach encounters and work better as a team.

Which is something I derived a lot of fun out of in the bad old days. That doesn't seem to exist anymore as the pick-up world is dominated by either stuff that's easy in-and-of-itself or groups that aren't really pick-up groups at all but just various raiders' alts.

"Point being, they can't make everyone happy, so I hope they pick me." -Ingmar
"OH MY GOD WE'RE SURROUNDED SEND FOR BACKUP DIG IN DEFENSIVE POSITIONS MAN YOUR NECKBEARDS" -tgr
Rendakor
Terracotta Army
Posts: 10131


Reply #8233 on: August 22, 2012, 07:54:22 PM

The problem is that most people don't want to teach/learn encounters with random strangers. You'll have challenge modes to do with your guild in MoP, and they can keep the regular 5 mans easy. The same situation applies to raids as well.

"i can't be a star citizen. they won't even give me a star green card"
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