Cataclysm

[Lakov_Sanite]

Man, I can't remember but I'm pretty sure bloodlust was group only and on something like a crazy 30min cd in vanilla but it's entirely pointless because "huge dps boost" means jack shit when you need to constantly throttle your dps.

Though I admit, horde did have a distinct pvp advantage(well, except AV cause seriously, bottlenecks don't EVER turn the tides of battle ) but pve they were way, way behind in terms of how easy encounters were.

Think of it this way. Encounters needed to be balanced around the horde not having threat dumps, thereby needing to throttle DPS.  Which means that alliance, simply by having threat redux could out damage the 'intended' dps of an encounter. Also, vanilla was NOTORIOUS for threat sensitive fights.

[El Gallo]

I don't think Bloodlust even existed until TBC (when allies could be shamans).

[luckton]

I don't think Bloodlust even existed until TBC (when allies could be shamans).

It existed.  Alliance just got shafted.

[Malakili]

I don't think Bloodlust even existed until TBC (when allies could be shamans).

It existed.  Alliance just got shafted.

Didn't you not get that skill until the 60s? It was called Heroism on alliance right?  Or are we talking about different things?

[Wolf]

same thing, horde only, made a bunch of vanilla fights much much easier.

[Lakov_Sanite]

same thing, horde only, made a bunch of vanilla fights much much easier.

The fuck it did

[luckton]

I stand corrected, after a bit of research.  It was the Shaman's level 70 spell for BC.  Heroism was the Alliance Shaman's version.  Same effect, different spell effects.

[Wolf]

horde did have lust in vanilla.

But I stand corrected paladin blessings were superior for all fights but one AQ40, that was made easier by cleansing totem. Skipped most of vanilla & tbc, so I had to ask :)

[luckton]

horde did have lust in vanilla.

But I stand corrected paladin blessings were superior for all fights but one AQ40, that was made easier by cleansing totem. Skipped most of vanilla & tbc, so I had to ask :)

Oh yeah yeah yeah, you are correct, sir.  I forgot about them Pally blessings

[Miasma]

Instead of setting my clocks back one hour last weekend I must have mistakenly set them all back seven years and one hour since I'm reliving slapfights from 2005.

[Ingmar]

The most retarded part of this discussion is the idea that an acceptable solution to treating one group of players badly in the past is to even it out by treating a different group of players badly now.

[Ironwood]

All I know is Shaman fucking owned Pallies in PvP.

The Unbreakable vids still make me laugh today.

[Setanta]

I miss the days of shaman wielding 2H maces and proccing Windfury off Windfury procs. It was the olnly light to the class as DPS in Vanilla. If only Blizzard had a clue as to making shaman interesting/fun as hybrids - after 7 years I still don't think they have a clue

[Ironwood]

I like where Shaman are just now.

I heal and hit people with axes.  It works for me.

[Tannhauser]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

[Merusk]

I like where Shaman are just now.

I heal and hit people with axes.  It works for me.

I rolled a shaman for my Free-80 from the Rezz scroll and picked Elemental/ Resto.

I think I have a new favorite class.   Still love the DK, but Shaman gets almost as many tools with less whining for nerfs from the masses.

[Simond]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

Hey, at least they're not Bioware.

[Nevermore]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

Hey, at least they're not Bioware.

Bioware may be a lot of things, but they don't pull the old bait and switch like Blizzard keeps doing with their difficulties.

[Sjofn]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

Ahem: lol

[El Gallo]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

Hey, at least they're not Bioware.

Bioware may be a lot of things, but they don't pull the old bait and switch like Blizzard keeps doing with their difficulties.

Bioware does the Ike Turner, just a lot more literally than Blizzard does. 

[Azazel]

Wrathgate/Battle for Undercity, plenty of shame there.  Saurfang Jr, particularly in comparison to Burning Jesus, uh-huh.  

...........

One of my favorite examples of Horde bias is how at one end of Ashenvale, Zoram'gar outpost develops into this big walled port while at the other end, that same lonely Draenei worker is still hammering away at that same incomplete hut at Forest Song, unchanged for years and years.

There's been a castle full of Alliance soldiers in the orc/troll newbie zone a stone's throw from the capital since day 1 of the game.  Yes, when you remake a 60/40 world into a 50/50 world, the 60-percenters will experience a net loss.  Class warfare, Blizz hates America, etc.  I suppose they should've just retconned the maps.

The thing with Wrathgate is that the Forsaken have always been "bad guys" - nestled uncomfortably in within the Horde. Even within the Wrathgate event, it's essentially a rogue faction stabbing their main force in the back. Storyline-wise, it's not that far from the Alliance being douchebags to the High Blood Elves for no particularly good reason and telling them to fuck off. 

The castle full of Alliance soldiers outside of Orgrimmar is just there as quest/mob fodder for the Horde. NPC quest settlement from the opposing faction are just mobs. Like the dwarf miners near Thunder Bluff in vanilla (are they still there?) It really only becomes a (potential) issue for me when the numbers of "proper" settlements changes, or one side loses them while the other gains them.  I'm talking about Flight points and Inns and Merchants, essentially.

Really though, I don't much care about the story anymore because it's such a hack job, but when it's so badly done that it grates or really breaks immersion to a ridiculous level, it becomes a bit annoying. Like Alliance players killing Alliance guards to break Thrall out of prison so he can rejuvinate the Horde which will in turn kill lots of "our people", or the whole ridiculous "green Jesus" thing in Cata with the fucking dragons laying down for him.

[Fabricated]

God willing we're done with Metzen's Mary Sue for a while.

[FieryBalrog]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

Hey, at least they're not Bioware.

Bioware may be a lot of things, but they don't pull the old bait and switch like Blizzard keeps doing with their difficulties.

Yeah, they're 3 months in  

[Maledict]

horde did have lust in vanilla.

But I stand corrected paladin blessings were superior for all fights but one AQ40, that was made easier by cleansing totem. Skipped most of vanilla & tbc, so I had to ask :)

Sorry for going back to this but not they didn't. Lots of people complained about it because it was the signiture ability of shaman in the RTS games, but it was only introduced into the game in TBC for both factions at the same time.

Horde did have wind fury, which had a large dps increase for horde warriors due to the way it worked at the time and yellow versus white hits, but due to threat caps you couldn't actually *use* the extra dps because vanilla raids were so threat obsessed. (coming off the back of EQ where threat in raid boss fights is a lot more important than WoW).

[Xanthippe]

Blizzard's employing the 'Ike Turner' strategy again.  "Please baby playerbase, I swear I've changed!  Come back to me, I promise not to slap you with nut-crunching instances EVER AGAIN!  It's just that you never learn to play and you know that makes me so mad."

 

[Azazel]

Didn't Deathwing basically burn almost all of Ogrimmar to the ground? He kinda fucked up the facade at the front of stormwind and his cult members bombed furry-RP park, but that's getting rebuilt I thought.

In the storyline, perhaps. In practical terms, Stormwind is a bit messed up while Org has been rebuilt in the form of more awesomer than ever.

[Azazel]

I like where Shaman are just now.

I heal and hit people with axes.  It works for me.

I rolled a shaman for my Free-80 from the Rezz scroll and picked Elemental/ Resto.

I think I have a new favorite class.   Still love the DK, but Shaman gets almost as many tools with less whining for nerfs from the masses.

I did the same thing. I have NFI what I'm doing. Clearly the best thing to do is jump into level 80 Cata instances and screw with other players!
I reckon I'll start playing my Level 1 Goblin Shaman, to figure out some of the basics before I play the 80....

[Merusk]

Nah, there's vids on youtube explaining things.   Forums like EJ are too oldschool for today's kids, it seems.  Spec, rotation, suggested addons.

[apocrypha]

MaxDPS is kinda handy if you want a really, really basic "what buttons do I press?" for a class. Take it with a grain of salt, but the rotation is a good starting point. For example, here's the Ele Shaman one:

1) Searing Totem
2) Flame Shock dot is kept up
3) Lava Burst
4) Earth Shock with 6 or greater charges of Lightning Shield
5) Lightning Bolt
Cooldown Priority
1) Elemental Mastery used as often as possible
2) Unleash Elements

Flametongue Weapon imbued
Lightning Shield is kept up

Also, LFR is awesome. Really, really awesome! 10 days after I resub, after a 4-6 month hiatus, and I'm geared enough to hit LFR on a druid healer. Bit nervous, but I have 1-line tactics open on 2nd monitor and think "fuck it" and hit the button. 30 second wait, in raid, both LFR raids completed in about 1 hour, no wipes, no bitching apart from some minor ninja whines, great fun. I didn't get any loot but whatever, it was great fun.

Has there been any indication that they might add old raids to LFR at some point does anyone know? If they added all the old raids... well... I'd be very happy :)   

[FieryBalrog]

LFR groups can vary from "no problems, awesome!" to "holy shit, get me the fuck outta here". The worst part about the groups that fail badly (which tends to be on Madness) is that if you leave, you gotta run the previous parts again with no chance at loot. And if you stay, you get to deal with a bunch of whiny LFR assholes who complain about carrying everyone else.

at least they tend to be tolerable more often than not.

[Xanthippe]

Still waiting for a report from Paelos as to whether he resubbed or not.

[Paelos]

Still waiting for a report from Paelos as to whether he resubbed or not.

I did not yet. I will, because I do believe the game is improved. However, tax season must conclude before I can pour any real time into the game.

[apocrypha]

LFR groups can vary from "no problems, awesome!" to "holy shit, get me the fuck outta here".

So true. Second attempt lastnight, with my Fury warrior, and it was a clusterfuck. It was my second ever time there and I was better at it than half the raid... and I was the only one getting achievements, so they'd all been there before. We did complete, but it took a while and there was a lot of bitching. 

But then the same is still true, to a lesser extent I'd guess, of heroic 5-man pugs. 95% of them are fine, easy, no problems, but then you get the cursed group from Hell - and they're always bad because of the tank.

[Ironwood]

What bothers me most about the LFR is that the poor tanks really need to know what they're doing.  Healers heal, dps shoot, but God Forbid the tank misses a taunt or a jump into twilight.  I've played as all roles in there and it's just fucking annoying having 24 other retards, most of whom can't single target tentacles, screaming at the nub.  Hell, the Hagara fight itself is massively amusing since mobs swarm out and the fucking idiots just stand there, usually in the cold that's killing them, while the tank is supposed to run around taunting 24 mobs on a single ability with a 8 second cooldown.

But anyway.

[FieryBalrog]

That's why thank god you only need 2 tanks in LFR.

Actually healer queues are longer than tanks for LFR. Not because the healers do anything special, but because it's boring as shit. Give me 10 man or 5 man any day, 25 man combined with the snorefest mechanics of LFR make healing a chore. DPS is still fun because you get to fight for the meters.

Also you always get 1-3 healers out of the 6 who are barely putting in any effort, so you usually can't slack off and have to carry their asses.