Rift: Planes of Telara

[Nebu]

And you really think that's going to happen enough to ruin the game for you? Fuck man, you're just LOOKING for shit to hate.

For me?  I don't believe I ever said anything about it ruining the game for me.  I said that it may negatively impact the game for new arrivals. 

Bad mood this morning?

[Sky]

I'll just say it once more, Nebu has valid concerns.

Vinadil, grey mobs do drop loot, you can also group with lowbies and get loots/finish quests. So a level 50 could guide a group of level 18s or whatever through IT.

[Rendakor]

And what negative impact does a level 50 powerleveling his friends have through IT on anyone else?

[Sobelius]

My experience with rifts was that if I was even a single level higher than the level of the rift, the rewards degraded. I always got the most/best rewards from those higher than my level.

That said, if a 50 and an 18 group and the 50 does most of the work closing the rift, I'd think they'd get squat and the 18 would also get squat due to low contrib.

Overall, it doesn't honestly concern me much -- it's a pretty 'niche' thing (i.e. I expect a majority of people don't/won't have tethered heal bots or run dual-boxed).

[Sky]

And what negative impact does a level 50 powerleveling his friends have through IT on anyone else?

I was illustrating my previous point with an example that was not relevant to the discussion.

[Stabs]

It may be that the design emphasis is changing in a very logical way.

Back in 1999 controlling power leveling was very important as the leveling game was the game. Now looking around in many games similar to Rift leveling is trivialised. In WoW you can stack recruit a friend, heirlooms and rest exp; the cash shop games sell you all the exp potions you could want. Who cares if some hardcore players get to max level fast?

And you have to be quite hardcore to do it. That by definition means these guys might whine very vocally but are very unlikely to actually cancel. Hardcore players are the ones who are invested in your game, they aren't the ones who casually leave when disappointed in some aspect of it. So the guy with multiple accounts uses his level 50 to boost his alts then whines that there's nothing to do? So what. People who power level are a tiny minority and people who power level then actually leave are a minority of a minority.

So why should games need to be designed to combat the tendency of those people to kill their own fun?

[Falconeer]

39 NA servers, 26 EU servers. And growing.

The 1 million accounts is clearly bullshit, but I think it's safe to say that no other MMORPG except WoW had this many servers at launch (actually pre-launch) so far.

[Modern Angel]

I think Warhammer had more but that's because they deliberately overcompensated, a move which proved disastrous. WAR certainly didn't have this many full or high pop servers.

[Ghambit]

They wont release the server sizes, so those figures mean nothing.  They could be 39 servers of 1000 or 39 of 500 for all we know.

[Typhon]

[snip]Who cares if some hardcore players get to max level fast?

And you have to be quite hardcore to do it. That by definition means these guys might whine very vocally but are very unlikely to actually cancel. Hardcore players are the ones who are invested in your game, they aren't the ones who casually leave when disappointed in some aspect of it. So the guy with multiple accounts uses his level 50 to boost his alts then whines that there's nothing to do? So what. People who power level are a tiny minority and people who power level then actually leave are a minority of a minority.

So why should games need to be designed to combat the tendency of those people to kill their own fun?

Not Nebu.  The point Nebu was making was that a new person or a person rolling an alt might end up doing a rift encounter with a person who was being power-leveled by a high level character.  In this case he was concerned that a power gamer was reducing the fun for themselves and others.

I think CoHs monster mechanic was ahead of it's time in this regard - monsters were fixed relative to everyone that fought them.  Seems like the Rift mobs could be set the same way - level 50 shows up to help a lower level friend with a Rift?  That's fine, they'll both be challenged and both be able to impact the mobs.

[Lantyssa]

The CoH's monsters weren't perfect in that their health was fixed and damaging powers were not normalized against them.  However I agree they are a good basis for what rifts should spawn.

[Abelian75]

They wont release the server sizes, so those figures mean nothing.  They could be 39 servers of 1000 or 39 of 500 for all we know.

Yeah, pretty hard to compare server numbers across games because of this.  Though from an anecdotal standpoint, I will say that the massively-queued Faeblight server seems to have a whooooole lot of dudes in it.

[Lantyssa]

Well, we know some of the queues were into the thousands.  How many servers did they add to ease that pain?  That can provide a very rough estimate.

[Hawkbit]

There's 39 NA servers now, so that's near double.  Right now most are at Medium/High, with four at Low and two at Full. 

Also, Faeblight having a perma-queue isn't terrible - RPgriefers won't have the attention span to wait an hour just to troll a chat channel for five minutes before getting reported.   

[Stabs]

Regarding power-leveling I do take the point that it diminishes the gameplay of those who don't do it but I think the stable door is open pretty wide in the genre. If you sell exp potions can you then take the moral high ground about creative use of game mechanics to level fast? (Of course if you object to it on the grounds it's competing with a product you're selling that's perfectly valid).

I doubt a handful of people power-leveling would have a huge impact on the conventional players' experiences of rifts. They come so thick and fast, and sometimes all the mobs get vaporised seconds after spawning, sometimes it's hugely difficult for the people present to kill the mobs without dying. It's so hectic one doesn't really notice what everyone else is up to. I doubt people would really even realise if an occasional power leveler were there. There would need to be dozens of level 50s with low level friends for it to really be noticeable.

The trick of scaling the rifts to match the players present might create problems. It would allow some level 50 to join and then go afk, completely screwing the low level people. Also what if there's a high level stealthed enemy there on a pvp server? An assassin could kill 50 lowbies just by sneaking into the rift area and bumping the mobs up 20 levels unexpectedly.

Regarding population the guess on the official forums is 12000 per server. However we don't know whether numbers are throttled because of the population being so dense in the starter areas. Since 12k * 39 is almost half a million, then the EU servers probably have similar numbers to the US ones that seems a bit high, almost a million playing before the game's even launched. It must be more than 1000 however as some servers have had queues of well over 1000 and presumably most of those people eventually get in.

On the other hand it certainly wouldn't surprise me if there were a million players. The statistic they've given is two-edged. They've said that a million accounts have registered for the forums and people have been quick to point out that some of them won't have bought the game. However most people who play these games DON'T register for forums, there may be just as many people playing without registering on the boards as there are customers who registered on the boards but didn't pre-order.

[Minvaren]

What's kind of sad is that the gold spammers are already in business in the game, and it technically hasn't released yet...   

[ezrast]

I hadn't thought about it before, but rifts are really similar to giant monsters conceptually. They spawn, an alert is broadcast, and anyone sitting around the zone can group up and lay down the smack for some rewards, then go back to whatever they were doing. Since the events are spontaneous and supposed to be dealt with by whomever happens to be standing around, level scaling works really well. A shame that characters in Rift are essentially locked into content +/- 2 levels of them. A decent sidekicking system would have been a huge plus.

The CoH's monsters weren't perfect in that their health was fixed and damaging powers were not normalized against them.  However I agree they are a good basis for what rifts should spawn.

I'm 99% sure that a power's base damage does scale up when fighting a GM, though enhancements don't scale up (only down) and heals don't scale at all.

The trick of scaling the rifts to match the players present might create problems. It would allow some level 50 to join and then go afk, completely screwing the low level people. Also what if there's a high level stealthed enemy there on a pvp server? An assassin could kill 50 lowbies just by sneaking into the rift area and bumping the mobs up 20 levels unexpectedly.

The point is that the monsters themselves have no fixed level. A monster can hit a level 50 player for as much damage as a level 50 mob, and then turn around and hit a level 20 player with the same attack for as much damage as a level 20 mob.

On the other hand it certainly wouldn't surprise me if there were a million players. The statistic they've given is two-edged. They've said that a million accounts have registered for the forums and people have been quick to point out that some of them won't have bought the game. However most people who play these games DON'T register for forums, there may be just as many people playing without registering on the boards as there are customers who registered on the boards but didn't pre-order.

Trion accounts and forum accounts aren't separate. The 1 million number includes everyone playing the game.

[Stabs]

The point is that the monsters themselves have no fixed level. A monster can hit a level 50 player for as much damage as a level 50 mob, and then turn around and hit a level 20 player with the same attack for as much damage as a level 20 mob.

Oh, I see. That's pretty clever. The only drawback I can see is that it diminishes the sense of being more powerful one gets from leveling. If you can go to a level 7 rift with your level 50 elite-wearing uber character and get two-shot by a noob mob players could find it depressing. It also doesn't solve the problem of level 50 healers with level 7 tanks.

Trion accounts and forum accounts aren't separate. The 1 million number includes everyone playing the game.

Ah, I'd forgotten this. You're quite right, they altered the forums a couple of weeks ago so that you need to have ordered the game to post. Of course some people may pre-order then cancel before actually paying.

If that's the case though wouldn't that suggest that Rift has more than a million already? Since many people who have pre-ordered won't have registered?

[Falconeer]

Head Start Community Update
We are thrilled that so many people showed up for our Grand Opening! Every business wishes to be so successful! Imagine a cafe owner who opens his doors the first day and sees people lined up around the block! He would celebrate and immediately start making plans to expand so that he can accommodate everyone, all the way to the back of the line! But at the same time, he doesn’t want to rush or skimp on anything for those who are at the front of the line. He wants them to enjoy their experience so they will have the best possible experience once they’re inside.

It’s been no different here! We are all doing everything we can to accommodate you all as quickly as we can. Please remember that it’s no different for us than our café owner. There are a lot of things to consider and schedule. I am amazed at all the moving parts.

I am a gamer. I also ask things like “Why don’t they just open a bunch more servers?” and “Why don’t they just raise the server capacity?” I even asked those things the past couple of days. Well, having a front row seat, I have heard conversations, been in chats and seen emails and to be honest, I don’t always understand the technical side of some of what they are saying. But there are reasons for all of these decisions. They might be technical or logistical, but these things are being executed in the way that makes the most sense. Everyone is trying to make the best decisions to make Rift the best it can be, and balance between the short and long term health of the game and its server communities.

That being said, we are reading your feedback and we do hear your concerns. We have always tried to be as up front with you as we can and that isn’t going to change now. So without further ado, I’d like to address some of the hot topics here in the community now.

Queues:

Unfortunately, queues are part of launching an MMO. No one can predict how that is going to go. You make an educated guess and then you adjust as fast as you can. Our pre-order numbers continued to rise so quickly that we were adding servers right up until launch and are still continuing to add them. As for the queues for some of the servers, we understand that this is an issue for those who already have friends tied to that server. If you’re new, we do suggest choosing a server with a lower population. There are servers that have little or no queue at all. Our web team went as far as to get the first draft of a server status page with a queue watcher out this evening:

http://www.riftgame.com/en/status/index.php
http://www.riftgame.com/de/status/index.php
http://www.riftgame.com/fr/status/index.php

Rest assured, we are aware that some of you are in long queues and we are doing all we can to accommodate everyone and still maintain our quality of service.

AFK Tricks

We have been reading your complaints about this issue. An update to address the majority of them was just sent out to the EU servers, and is scheduled to hit the US servers tomorrow morning at 8am Pacific.

Transfers

We have seen all of the posts requesting character transfers and while it is not something we will be able to offer this instant, it is something we are absolutely working out the logistics on for when and if it is needed once the initial overpopulation subsides.

We are reading your feedback and we will always try to get you answers when we can. Thank you all for joining us in Head Start!
Cindy Bowens
Community Lead
Rift

AFK tricks 

[Cadaverine]

Lotta people AFK for hours, while auto-running in a corner, or against a wall.  If there were no queues, I wouldn't care in the least, but when I have to wait 3 odd hours to log in?  Yeah, fuck them.

[Comstar]

I only just noticed this game thanks to all the posting about it here.

I've checked out the website, and it seems to be ok...read the last couple of pages here...and it seems to be actually ready for release? is that correct? A MMO that's working on release? This would be a first.

I couldn't get into WoW past level 30 because I wasn't in a guild. If I signed up, it would be to join Bat country (or maybe the SomethingAwful Goon Squad). Why did you pick Guardians and that type of server?

I like to play a Rogue...but Eve Online has shown me how nice it is to be a Command Ship and give bonuses to everyone in the fleet. Can I make a rogue type character who can also buff friendlies? Could I play a bard who has stealth abilities? Or a Warlord with nightblade abilities?

Is the PvP WoW like in that a high level character will always defeat a large group of low level characters? Or can low level characters act like Eve frigates and still do *something* to help?

Is it pretty much a WoW MMO in terms of gameplay?

Is RIFTS a good reason to stop playing WoW (or from my perspective, Eve Online, where the great war seems to be over for the time being).

Edit- Ahh, crap. the SomethingAwful thread hooked me. Downloading now. Probably won't finish before the game goes live anyway :(

[Cadaverine]

You could be a bard with stealth, yeah.  Bard/Assassin.  Initially, the stealth is like Warhammers in that it only lasts 30 seconds, or whatever it is.  At around 20/21 points in to the Assassin tree is an ability to make the stealth permanent, a la WoW.  31 points nets you a Vanish type ability.  I haven't seen that much stealth, really, compared to Bards, and Ranger/Marksmen.  The handful of stealthers I did run in to ate me alive, for whatever that's worth.

You can't mix souls from different callings, though, so no Warlord/Nightblade.  There is the Riftblade soul for warriors, which is sorta like the Nightblade, I think.

It has similarities to WoW, but I think it's closer to Warhammer.  The pvp combat, if that's your thing, is a lot less frenetic than WoW's in my opinion.  I've had mixed results in pvp.  Sometimes I will kick all sorts of ass, and some times I can't seem to do jack shit.  I think that it's A) I suck, and B) I have a knack for ending up on the least organized team that just wants to get farmed in mid-field, with no heals, more often than not.

[Azuredream]

It does work, but the queue times can be brutal if you're on a high pop server. I've been on pretty much all day since it released and have crashed 2-3 times, they've also brought the servers down a few times for quick 15-30 minute maitenences. Haven't noticed any significant bugs, all the quests work. You can mix and match any 3 of the 8 (+1 PvP soul) souls you want, so yes, but like Cadaverine says, only the 8 that your calling can access. Yes, in world PvP low level characters are pretty much useless. In warfronts (BGs/scenarios) they give you a scaling buff if you're at the low end of that level bracket. Yes, it's a WoW MMO. If you don't like WoW, you probably won't like this. I've played WoW for 6 years so it's pretty stale by now for me, and this game is competent enough that it can fill WoW's shoes just fine.

[Lantyssa]

I couldn't get into WoW past level 30 because I wasn't in a guild. If I signed up, it would be to join Bat country (or maybe the SomethingAwful Goon Squad). Why did you pick Guardians and that type of server?

They prefer being the pretty side so they can sparkle.

[Threash]

Meh, i went guardian for the lower pvp queue times and no other reason.  If anything the guardian side is uglier, both sides have elves and humans but dwarves are definitely uglier than the big guys defiant side.

[Sky]

They prefer being the pretty side so they can sparkle.

I'm beginning to doubt your commitment to sparkle motion.

[Nebu]

Shadefallen server had their first level 50 last night.  Three days to level 50.  I hope there's a decent amount of endgame content. 

[Bzalthek]

I didn't know Rift had a pretty side.  In fact, even the toons seem appropriately proportioned.  The only libido graphics seem to be the armor, if only slightly.  I swear the tunic for my cleric is getting shorter and shorter as I level, and pants seem to be mostly leggings.

[Lantyssa]

I refer to Guardians as 'pretty' because they like shining armor, glowy wings, have that whole righteousness thing, and revere divine beings.  Defiants are fantasy greasemonkeys and "Damn the Man" types.

Mainly it's to mock the Guardians.

[Nebu]

Shadefallen server had their first level 50 last night.  Three days to level 50.  I hope there's a decent amount of endgame content. 

That sounds more negative than I meant it.  If the game provides 72 hours of play, then it's well worth the box price.  Whether it merits a subscription waits to be seen.

[Abelian75]

In fairness I think there's probably significantly more than 72 hours of leveling for people not focusing solely on leveling.   I don't mean that in a "TAKE YOUR TIME AND ENJOY IT, I HAVE ONLY DONE ONE QUEST SO FAR" sense, as I've been playing embarrassingly constantly over the past several days and am only just about to hit level 20, and I am a relatively speedy leveler generally (not a powerleveler, just, y'know, always doing stuff).  I think if you're actually doing the zone events and crafting and kinda learning the ropes it'll probably take significantly longer than that.

That said, I suspect they do have a decent endgame.  Just a hunch, though.  A strong hunch.

[Nebu]

IThat said, I suspect they do have a decent endgame.  Just a hunch, though.  A strong hunch.

I hope that you're right.  I've been playing exactly as you have.  Do a few quests, craft a bit, fight a few rifts, etc.  I've made it into the mid 20's playing very casually and enjoying the learning curve.  I was pleasantly surprised at how complex playing my toon got as I hit 25.  The options really begin to open up as to how you approach your toon after 20.

[Falconeer]

2 new European servers opened today.

[Quinton]

Remarkably fun so far -- I did not notice this game at all until today, pre-ordered it so I could check it out, took a rogue to lv12 and mage to lv6, wandered around, gathered, crafted, quested, and generally enjoyed myself.

It obviously borrows a lot of UI from WoW (unsurprising), but not too much of the visual style -- it sort of charts a middle ground between WoW's super-cartoony look and the hyper-realistic look that EQ2, etc, had and I dislike quite a bit.  The world feels suitably "worldy". 

I like the critters -- some nice undead, demons, goblins, etc.  Not too many random critters (ran into some wolves, no quests to kill 'em as yet, some spiders). 

I really like the invasion event things and the pickup raid groups that form around 'em.  I'll be questing away and whoah hello there demon horde, and suddenly I can join a group with 20-40 other people and go bash on the demons for a big, get some goodies, and then go back to questing.

[Falconeer]

Huge invasions are a blast. Sure you are confused and irritated at first. But get into a random raid, go where all the big arrows are pointing and start defending. It rains XP, Planarites, rewards and feels like a massive war (even if it's not). The immense tree thing that looks like a Warhammer? 

Seriously, they will get old and stuff, but what doesn't? We are talking about games who made their fortunes on REPETITION. These games are all about the same shit over and over, and I think rifts, but even more so invasions, are just awesome. They managed to do something we've been kind of asking for a long time, to make it work, to make it look epic, and, most important, fun. Hats off to Trion. Hats off.