[TF2] Scout Update

[Yoru]

Does the bat have increased damage? If not, fuck this update. I want my beta bat back.

[Xurtan]

It's actually -50% damage vs non-stunned players. 

...And it's slower.

[Yoru]

Fuck this update.

[Prospero]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX__swbUwag&fmt=18

amazing.

Fucking awesome.

[Kail]

It's actually -50% damage vs non-stunned players.

Removed this in today's hotfix, looks like.

[NiX]

Fuck this update.

Gameplay changes

- Removed the damage reduction against non-stunned enemies on the new bat

Unfuck this update?

[Xurtan]

Meh, still not sure it's worth using. Losing double jump is a huge issue. So far, the ball seems to be really easy to dodge. (How much that will change once people start learning to aim is up for debate.) Still, at max range it seems to be a five sec stun or so. So far I've only seen it hit on huge targets from large range (Read: Heavy on 2fort battlements), in a large melee where it has to hit -something-, or as someone comes around a corner/chasing someone. Haven't seen it used on ubers yet.

It's too bad the knockback on the fan is so horrible; would have been nice to have been able to use it to pseudo-rocket jump.

[Prospero]

The announcer has been disappointed again

[Malakili]

It's too bad the knockback on the fan is so horrible; would have been nice to have been able to use it to pseudo-rocket jump.

You can actually get a quite large amount of horizontal distance with it,but not a lot of height, so it does have some use for mobility, but it isn't quite a rocket jump.

[Samwise]

The announcer has been disappointed again

[Yoru]

Fuck this update.

Gameplay changes

- Removed the damage reduction against non-stunned enemies on the new bat

Unfuck this update?

No, that's just the removal of retardation. It doesn't return the bat to the awesome beatstick it was before they nerfed it.

[Samwise]

Does the FAN do increased damage from behind?  I just one-shotted two snipers in a row by hitting them point-blank in the back with the thing.  I'm pretty sure you can't one-shot a sniper with a scattergun at any range.

[Prospero]

Each individual bullet does less damage, but there is more of them. I believe as long as everything hits it is a good chunk more damage.

[Samwise]

Two weapons unlocked so far. 

I really like the FAN, and futzing around with the Pop Fly achievement (kills while double-jumping) in conjunction with the FAN's kickback has opened up some interesting possibilities re: being really hard to hit and getting to interesting places.  The kickback is nothing like a normal rocketjump and takes a lot of getting used to before you can use it to actually get anywhere; what it does right off the bat, though, is keep you in the air twice as long when you're just bouncing around like a maniac.  This is sometimes a good thing and sometimes a bad thing.

Not sure about the Sandman.  Whacking the ball around is fun, but it rarely turns the tide of a battle, and I'm really loathe to give up my double-jump.  I'll keep it for as long as it takes me to get the bulk of the achievements that rely on it and see if my opinion changes during that time.

Side note: what goddamn genius decided to make the ball the primary fire of the Sandman instead of the secondary?  What if something's right in front of me and I just need to club it?

Additional edit: It's really funny how after playing L4D for a while I keep right-clicking in an attempt to bash people with my pistol.

[Samwise]

Getting better with the Sandman.  Trick to using it effectively seems to be stun, rush in, double-shot with the FAN.  The stun will always last long enough for you to get up to point-blank range, so if your victim is alone, there is absolutely nothing stopping you from hitting them with every single pellet.  This is death for most classes.

Contrary to what I'd thought, it does not seem possible to hit the ball with the bat.  You get the "bean ball" achievement for picking up a fallen ball from another scout and beaning him with it, not batting it straight back at him.  (I got this last night by sheer accident.)

The soda is kinda fun for messing with people (HEY HEY HEY LOOK AT ME), but I have yet to do anything really useful with it.

[Valmorian]

The soda is kinda fun for messing with people (HEY HEY HEY LOOK AT ME), but I have yet to do anything really useful with it.

Hm, can you drink it while you have the briefcase?  Does it make sentry guns miss?  (that would be nice for zipping through 2forts chokepoints where there's usually sentries set up..)

[Samwise]

It does make sentries miss, but I don't think you can use it while carrying intel (it would be inconsistent with their usual rule of get-out-of-jail-free cards not working in combination with capturing objectives). 

The best use for it seems to be acting as a distraction for your teammates, i.e. getting all the defenders to abandon their posts chasing the invincible guy so your heavy hitters can surprise them from behind.  Really coordinated teams will use it to take out sentries by having the scout sit there soaking up bullets while the rest of the team rushes in to blow them up (they just have to do it before the scout's juice wears off).

One thing I do want to try is blowing up an engy with his own gun by running behind him in sight of it.   

[Malakili]

The soda is kinda fun for messing with people (HEY HEY HEY LOOK AT ME), but I have yet to do anything really useful with it.

Hm, can you drink it while you have the briefcase?  Does it make sentry guns miss?  (that would be nice for zipping through 2forts chokepoints where there's usually sentries set up..)

The best use for it is to Act as a cheap "uber" and stand directly in front of a sentry gun to block the bullets while a demo man comes in behind and destroys it. 

It isn't realy good solo, cause all it does is buy you a few seconds of invulnerability, and when it is over you get dramatically slowed for 3-5 seconds, meaning whoever you just saved yourself from is going to come and beat the crap out of you now that they can catch you easily.

[Kail]

It does make sentries miss, but I don't think you can use it while carrying intel (it would be inconsistent with their usual rule of get-out-of-jail-free cards not working in combination with capturing objectives). 

Pretty sure it does, or at least, you can drink it right before you get the intel.  Saw a couple scouts do that today, unless I'm mistaken.

Personally, I'm not liking this update.  The new bat is stupidly annoying in the hands of a decent player.  The other two aren't bad, but the FAN seems to be like a slightly cheesier version of the normal gun, and the Cola is pretty useless.  Ugh.

[Samwise]

I do think the scout might be a little overpowered now.  I was initially skeptical of the Sandman, but I'm so consistently raping face with it now that I'm starting to feel bad about it.  The FAN isn't quite as unbalancing, but the fact that I can't imagine ever switching back to the original scattergun at this point is a pretty good indicator that it could stand a little toning down.

Ironically, the one item I thought was going to be gamebreaking (the invuln soda) is the one that has turned out to be completely useless.  So that'll teach me to prognosticate.

[Prospero]

I still haven't picked up any of the unlocks, but having been on the receiving end quite a bit it feels like the Sandman is overpowered in 1 vs 1 matchups, but doesn't help much in larger conflicts. It does help some in breaking up overly defensive teams on ctf maps, but outside of that it is a minor annoyance. 1 vs 1 it is brutal, especially since the point blank range stun is plenty long enough for the scout to unload the FAN into my poor helpless medic body.

The FAN seems pretty awesome, but I'm not sure if it is overpowered. I think in the hands of a skilled scout it is a vicious weapon, but a lot of the scouts I've played against are pretty horrible with it. I've also found that in scout on scout battles the scatter gun is pretty damn good against FAN scouts.

The soda seems useful in very limited situations. It is sweet to have an uber in a can for distracting turrets for teammates, but that's about it. I'm curious to try it on goldrush. I think it could be handy for breaking behind enemy lines to molest snipers.

[Malakili]

I'm actually of the opinion that the Sandman isn't unbalanced (which is to say, I don't think it has a huge impact on the outcome of most matches, at least public matches, I left the competitive scene a while back and don't even know their general stance on unlockables anymore).  It is however, really farking stupid.  There is simply nothing more annoying than being stopped dead and just waiting to die.  Awful mechanic, has me playing the game less than before the update.

[ClydeJr]

Incredibly lucky Sandman shot

[Prospero]

Jesus the FAN is fun. Being able to jump onto the roof of the bridge from ground level in 2fort is  . Not to mention the awesome fucking jumps you can pull off on cp_well. I can'wait to try cp_egypt with this thing.

[Ookii]

Jesus the FAN is fun. Being able to jump onto the roof of the bridge from ground level in 2fort is  . Not to mention the awesome fucking jumps you can pull off on cp_well. I can'wait to try cp_egypt with this thing.

Not using the sandman are we?

[Hoax]

I hate the new scout, anyone without perfect ping playing as a scout is so fucking annoying and like 20 times more people use them then before the update.

[Prospero]

Not yet, I have a stack of achievements to get first. I haven't even picked up Bonk! yet. I'm addicted to mobility, so I suspect I'll avoid the Sandman. We'll see; stuns do look like a lot of fun.

[Samwise]

WOOOOO


This screenshot taken in front of the BLU base.  The sniper drew his last breath on the RED battlements.   

[Ookii]

I don't know how to feel about your non-achievement box antics.

[Samwise]

Are you saying you achievement-boxed Zombie Genocide?

[Ookii]

Are you saying you achievement-boxed Zombie Genocide?

Of course not, just like I didn't achievement-box getting a million pyro damage or healing for a million points.

But I did achievement-box "Out of the Park".   

[Samwise]

I won't lie.  I considered it.  But the adrenaline rush of finally pulling it off on a live target was worth it.  The guy actually stepped out of the way while I was winding up, and then stepped back right as the swing came.   

This is after swatting maybe ten snipers into a wall because the angle was wrong, and having maybe three times where I had the shot lined up perfectly and one of their teammates shot me in the back before I could finish the swing.  All the stars had to be aligned perfectly.

(edit) oh ya, I got Foul Territory the day before that, which was also one that had stumped me for a while.  Stunned a medic on ctf_well as he was crossed the tracks with our intel, and SPLAT.  I was too excited to take a screenshot.

[Valmorian]

Personally I'm surprised that Steam games don't automatically screen shot every time you get an achievement.  It's not like they're THAT frequent after all.

[Prospero]

I'm not sure a screen shot would be terribly exciting, but a video would be cool in some cases. I'd love a video of when I got Moonshot and Bean ball from the ball's perspective.

[Samwise]

A video of Out of the Park from the corpse's perspective would be  .