Avatar

[Triax]

James Cameron's thinking according to his interview in movies online below:

http://www.moviesonline.ca/movienews_17127.html

"It's a love story, too. So the physiological differences, the more alien we made them in the early design phase we just kept asking ourselves, basically the crude version is, 'Would you want to do her?' And our all male crew of artists were basically like, 'No, take the gills out.' Do you know what I mean? It was pretty simple but then taken to a very sophisticated degree. "

yes, he said sophisticated 

My other favorite interview of his is http://www.vanityfair.com/online/oscars/2009/12/james-cameron-on-avatar.html

Especially where he's talking about historical comparisons and states "You couldn’t get them to come to a movie theater and watch a film about the conquest of new Spain and how the Aztecs were slaughtered by the Spaniards for their gold. But you can get them to come to a movie theater and see how the Pandoran Na’vi are being slaughtered for [the fictional element] unobtanium. It’s the same frickin’ story, you know? "

He's not about the plot, he's about the $$$.

[UnSub]

For how much "Avatar" cost, he has to be about the $s. But outside of Sam Worthington I'm not sure too many actors would be putting this film in their highlight reel.

[Sheepherder]

"You couldn’t get them to come to a movie theater and watch a film about the conquest of new Spain and how the Aztecs were slaughtered by the Spaniards for their gold."

 

[Riggswolfe]

"You couldn’t get them to come to a movie theater and watch a film about the conquest of new Spain and how the Aztecs were slaughtered by the Spaniards for their gold."

 

Unfortunately I think he's right. You could make that movie but it wouldn't make $1 billion dollars or whatever Avatar's going to make. It would probably break even but I think most movie-goers these days are not into this kind of thing. Remember Gandhi? I bet if that was released today it'd lose money for the studio in a hardcore way. Our society is basically afflicted with society-wide ADD.

[Sheepherder]

No, he fucking isn't.  Hollywood managed to sell a completely retarded version of the Meiji Restoration and the failed plot to kill Hitler, FFS.  Both Tom Cruise movies, incidentally.

[Riggswolfe]

No, he fucking isn't.  Hollywood managed to sell a completely retarded version of the Meiji Restoration and the failed plot to kill Hitler, FFS.  Both Tom Cruise movies, incidentally.

And how successfull were these movies? I don't remember either movie making a big splash at all really.

[Sheepherder]

Considering I only emerge out of the desolate wastelands of the north to do exams, and have heard people talking about both movies, I'd say "well".

[Riggswolfe]

Considering I only emerge out of the desolate wastelands of the north to do exams, and have heard people talking about both movies, I'd say "well".

Ok, from the stats I could find on Box Office mojo:

Valkyrie made roughly $200 million worldwide in its theatrical release
The Last Samurai made roughly $450 million worldwide in its theatrical release

Avatar has made roughly $640 million worldwide so far in 2 weeks of release. I'm sure you can do the math here and see where this is going.

[Sheepherder]

Ok, from the stats I could find on Box Office mojo:

Valkyrie made roughly $200 million worldwide in its theatrical release
The Last Samurai made roughly $450 million worldwide in its theatrical release

Avatar has made roughly $640 million worldwide so far in 2 weeks of release. I'm sure you can do the math here and see where this is going.

70% for the Last Samurai?  Probably for a budget that was less or similar?

Really, at this point, I have to wonder why the fuck you hate history?  Possibly only native American history?  Because it's all good if you throw enough Hollywood fuckstupid and inaccuracy on.  Also, I need to know how much beer you have drunk, because I need to know how smart I am (relatively) when I'm seriously impaired.

[WindupAtheist]

I looked up the stats on Mojo with the intention of making the same snark post as Riggs, but in actuality both movies did pretty well. Valkyrie and Samurai beat their budgets by $125M and $310M respectively. That's not Avatar money, the sort of money that shakes up the all-time rankings, but it's still very successful by any standard.

And of course, you could make a movie like Valkyrie several times over for the price of making Avatar, and still have a hundred million bucks laying around to light your cigars with.

[Bunk]

Haven't seen Valkyrie, but Last Samurai was a Tom Cruise movie with an uber-Hollywoodified ending. Make it historically accurate and take Cruise off the marquee, then how much would it have made?

Avatar was as close to the Spanish invasion of the Aztecs as the Last Samurai was to accurate history anyways.

Oh, and I loved Avatar. I'm one to regularly pick movies apart, and my only real complaints here were the lack of dimensions to the bad guys, and a somewhat lackluster protagonist. I can't remember the last time I watched a three hour movie and didn't come out feeling that it needed to be edited down. I stopped actually "noticing" the 3d after about 15 minutes, and it just added a whole feeling of depth to the whole thing. Probably the most visually stunning movie I've seen since Crouching Tiger.

[Riggswolfe]

70% for the Last Samurai?  Probably for a budget that was less or similar?

Really, at this point, I have to wonder why the fuck you hate history?  Possibly only native American history?  Because it's all good if you throw enough Hollywood fuckstupid and inaccuracy on.  Also, I need to know how much beer you have drunk, because I need to know how smart I am (relatively) when I'm seriously impaired.

We'll see what legs Avatar has but so far it's looking pretty damn good. My point was that in two weeks it has beat both of their combined box office gross. I think his point is pretty damned accurate. People don't go to see historical movies in the same numbers that they go to other types of films. They just don't and trying to make believe otherwise is just silly. They will go to see a spectacle movie that has a slightly disguised version of some historical events in it.

Avatar was said to cost roughly $400 million including promotions and is now up to $725 million on box office. I think that the money is speaking for itself to be frank. If this had been a historical epic it would have cost less but also made probably half of what it has made so far.

And what makes you think I hate history besides the fact that I am not buying your idea that historical movies will be anywhere within spitting distance of a blockbuster? Keep in mind, we're talking about money here and not artistic merit. The Last Samurai is listed as #93 in the worldwide highest grossing movies. 2012 is listed as number 31. Do you get the point yet?

Edit: Ironically there is one "historical" movie that breaks this trend and that is Titanic. I prefer to think of that as just an anamoly though.

[Sheepherder]

Saving Private Ryan?

[NiX]

This argument is fuck stupid.

Cameron made both your points. You can't make a 1:1 recreation of history and expect it to do well, but you can fluff the shit out of the same damn story and people will flock. Which, funny enough, is a point both of you have made.

CONGRATS!

[Riggswolfe]

Yeah this is a stupid argument Nix so I'm dropping out of it.

[stu]

My local theater is offering this in RealD 3D and IMAX 3D. Which one is better? I noticed that the RealD 3D costs $1 more for admission, so I'm wondering what the difference is.

[LK]

I'm frankly surprised Valkyrie did that well. I seem to recall it being delayed and re-edited, along with a new ad campaign. Whatever they did must've worked.

[WindupAtheist]

Anyway, Avatar is sitting at #31 on the all-time worldwide box office chart and will probably crack the teens this weekend. In the next couple days alone it'll pull ahead of the complete worldwide theatrical gross of Star Wars, original and special edition releases combined. The complete run of The Da Vinci Code is probably already beaten, we're just waiting for them to count the money.

So yeah, this ain't a race. This is just a matter of watching to see how many victory laps it'll squeeze in. God I hope the noise about him wanting to do Terminator 5 is true. With the power he must now wield, if he wants it, he'll get it.

[Numtini]

The whole Aztec v. Na'vi thing--that's sort of what science fiction is for. That's what made the original trek so good even tho today black on the left/black on the right is cheezy funny.

[LK]

I hope he does Terminator 5. Maybe he can unfuck the franchise that the last two movies have done, introducing the world to a leather-clad Kristinna Loken aside.

[Vision]

I hope he does Terminator 5. Maybe he can unfuck the franchise that the last two movies have done, introducing the world to a leather-clad Kristinna Loken aside.

I hope he just writes off all of the other movies as never having happened, and just pick up where 2 left off.

[Ratman_tf]

Much as I liked T2, I think it was going off the rails there. Another attempt at killing John Connor by another terminator. I imagine that in the future, there's this huge line for the time machine, with humans and terminators glaring at each other waiting their turn to go back in time.

Showing the future war is like showing the monster in a monster movie. There's no way it's going to satisfy as much as our imagination.

I say let the franchise go. They'll do a remake in a decade or two...

[Teleku]

I came to accept the fact that you have to throw the logic of the Time Machine right out the fucking window to enjoy the Terminator movies.  I mean, why not send back an entire fucking army of robots.  In any event, ignoring that, the first 2 movies where great.  Just make up some bullshit reason in your head why the time machine only allows only 1 person to be sent back once every 15 years and yada yada yada.  The premise is fine beyond that as long as they are making good action movies.  They stopped doing that after 2 (though I actually didn't mind 3 as a movie.  Problem was that it was a rehash of T2 with nothing original to offer, and started fucking up the lore to boot).

[Ratman_tf]

They actually explained it in the first movie. The size of the sphere shows that about one man sized person can fit in the machine's effect, Skynet sent a Terminator back to kill Sarah Connor, and then the resistance gained access to the time machine, sent their own man back, and then smashed it so no one else could go back and stop him. There's some unanswered questions there, but you can't expect a grunt like Kyle Reese to know or even understand the answers.

One could theroize that changing the past created an opportunity for the second movies time traveling, but then you open the door for everyone going back and having a big time travel party. Which Sarah Connor Chronicles kinda sorta started doing.

[Merusk]

The novelization of T2 explained the "how did the 2nd one go back" as well.  If I remember rightly; there was a prototype Terminator and a 2nd Time Machine at a location on the other side of the Skynet complex.  When Skynet sent the T800 back and nothing changed, it initiated the protocols to send the 2nd one back right as it was being shut down.  I don't remember if or how they explained the liquid-metal T1000 being able to travel without flesh surrounding it.

[Slyfeind]

You know what would rock, James Cameron doing a movie that picks up where "Sarah Connor Chronicles" leaves off, with Summer Glau and all thems.

[stu]

I want to see his version of The Thing. Man, that would rock.

[WindupAtheist]

You know what would rock, James Cameron doing a movie that picks up where "Sarah Connor Chronicles" leaves off, with Summer Glau and all thems.

Fair enough if you liked the program and are just making "I'd like it to rain donuts" wishes, but I don't think a movie likely to mystify the 98% of everyone who didn't watch that show is the sort of wide appeal Cameron shoots for.

I want to see his version of The Thing. Man, that would rock.

1) That's... random.
2) Straight-up horror isn't really his particular thing, is it?
3) No one will do it better than Carpenter, leave it alone.

[gryeyes]

I really think that the impact of movies like The Thing and Exorcist cant be recreated now. What would it take to be shocked or amazed for a modern audience. Happy 2010 everyone, WUA got a new color!?!?

[Mattemeo]

I want to see his version of The Thing. Man, that would rock.

Fuck that, just check out the recent blu-ray remaster. Got a cinematic release in the UK late last year. Movie has never looked so fucking good, I swear to god I almost wept. Does not need a remake, not even with Cameron at the helm. I'd rather he got on with Battle Angel Alita.

[Comstar]

With all the Pandora being interconnected, and the movie being set on a moon of Alpha Centauri, i'm hoping we get a game called Sid Meier's Pandora, or it's the plot of the movie sequel.

Pandora is clearly the 5th Manifold.

[stu]

I still haven't seen the blu-ray version of The Thing, but I'd still like to see a Cameron version of it. He was able to expand upon the claustrophobic atmosphere of Alien. Why not The Thing? I read the novelization of the Carpenter version and I remember at least one scene that was left out because it was too much for the production. Part of the beauty of the Carpenter version was its willingness to take a slow burn but a balls-out Cameron version would be badass. His could be a separate story the way Carpenter's was totally different from the original.

I guess I just miss the R-rated sci-fi/horror movies from when I was a teen. I even want to see him do the Dark Horse comics version of Aliens vs. Predator.

I realize all of this is random... just had to get it out!

[Lakov_Sanite]

Just saw the movie and it didn't disappoint. Sure you can see the ending coming in the first 15min but that doesn't even matter because just like a rollercoaster where you know where you're gonna end up, it's a fun ride.

[Abagadro]

Read in EW that the glasses surcharge is being counted in the box office so it is benefiting from about 150M in extra revenue at this point compared to other movies from that source.

[Velorath]

Read in EW that the glasses surcharge is being counted in the box office so it is benefiting from about 150M in extra revenue at this point compared to other movies from that source.

It's not really a surcharge for the glasses (bring back the pair you got from the previous showing and you're still going to get charged the extra amount).  It's more of a "it costs us a fuckton of money to get all these new 3D projectors" charge.