Game of Thrones [SPOILERS]

[Rendakor]

I thought that was stupid too. But hey, more points for me!

Edit: Also, we didn't get any explanation for how Dany burned the Dothraki this episode; no Jorah and Daario oiling up the floor or anything of the sort.

[Khaldun]

I think basically, yeah, they decided a long time ago that the direwolves were too expensive to have on screen much.

[Shannow]

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[Speedy Cerviche]

[/spoiler]

[Merusk]

Well that's one way out of the hole they've dug, certainly.

Re: The Wolves.

I feel like Martin originally had some sort of plan here, but abandoned it around book 2. There was such a big deal about finding one for each Stark, including Jon, and then making a point of turning them into minor book characters. When things started fragmenting and they got separated, the death of Lady in book #1 symbolized Sana being lost to the house.

However that all seems to have been abandoned now and they're just kind of "There" being pointless, except for Ghost. Removing Summer and Shaggydog isn't a problem with the show writers, it's just an underscore of Martin's abandoning of the concept. I get the feeling if he could go back and rewrite book 1 he'd have had only Jon getting a wolf and be done with the premise.

[Khaldun]

I think actually you're misreading Martin here. Despite the fact that Dany and Jon in both books and series are largely conforming to the Chosen One archetype, one of the other messages of the books and to a less consistent extent series is that fantasy tropes are dull and predictable, so let's not do them in that way. So the idea of companion animals who thematically reflect and extend the character of their companions, and whose fate is tied to theirs? Martin kills off Sansa's wolf (while Sansa remains very much alive, if in peril) not to say anything about Sansa but simply to illustrate the capriciousness and cruelty of aristocratic power and to let us in on how out of touch Ned Stark is with the situation he's going into. Rob's wolf gets killed because all things Stark at the Red Wedding are getting killed, and because his enemies are exulting in every aspect of his humiliation and defeat--there's no mystic meaning in it, just cruelty and ugliness that extends to all the victims. Nymeria runs away and hides--I suppose you could say that's to echo Arya but it's not as if we've had even a hint of the wolf shadowing Arya's movements. I think it's just "that's what a wolf would do". I think Martin mostly just wants to say, "Don't assume anything about how things turn out--anybody can die, and not all deaths will be full of glory or meaning. Including beautiful direwolves."

[Chimpy]

The wolves were central to the whole warg thing in the books, which Bran is the only one in the TV show that has any of that going on (and they never really showed him using the wolf that way in the show like it is in the books). The whole "conciousness survives in the animal" bit with the wildling guy never happened in the TV show either which I am sure was how Martin was going to have Jon "resurrected" in the books.

[K9]

I wonder what Yara's plan is? I get that step one of the plan is 'get the fuck away from Euron' and that's a good step for sure. I'm just not sure what step two is.

I hope the show gets on and does something interesting with Tyrion, because having him kicking his heels in Mereen for half the season isn't particularly interesting.

[Threash]

If i had to guess step two would be to get to Dany before he does.  Dany can't have kids anyways so a husband with no cock is not much of a drawback.

[palmer_eldritch]

Are we going to see Richard E Grant more? Or was that just a little cameo.

[Khaldun]

If Dany makes her move on Westeros finally (or even if she stayed in Mereen) sooner or later her advisors *would* need to address the dynastic problem. She's either going to need an heir of her blood (in short supply, but maybe not as short as Dany herself thinks. Maybe not even shorter, if you buy one fan theory...)  Or she's going to need to find someone that everybody respects as heir. Or she's going to need a new kind of kingdom...

[eldaec]

If Dany makes her move on Westeros finally (or even if she stayed in Mereen) sooner or later her advisors *would* need to address the dynastic problem. She's either going to need an heir of her blood (in short supply, but maybe not as short as Dany herself thinks. Maybe not even shorter, if you buy one fan theory...)  Or she's going to need to find someone that everybody respects as heir. Or she's going to need a new kind of kingdom...

It will be the latter. I can't see how the story can have a satisfactory ending with anyone on the Iron Throne.

TV has been foreshadowing that fairly explictly, she had a house of undying vision of a ruined throne room and was talking about breaking the wheel not so long ago.

Also she is clearly going to have some form of child, when the sun rises in the west (dorne rising?) and the seas go dry (the iron fleet carries the khalasar?)  when the mountains blow in the wind (volcano reference? Similar to the doom of valyria?). MMD's prophecy is referenced too often to be nothing.

[Khaldun]

I would guess it's going to be a magic baby though.

[Merusk]

SON rises in the West - Sam goes home. Starts shagging Gilly.
Seas run dry - Ironborn give-up drinking, found Westeros Mormonism
Mountains blow in the wind - Ser Gregor's new life as a gay zombie begins.

[Rendakor]

Prophecies in general are very important in GoT; it's the one fantasy trope that isn't subverted.

[eldaec]

I would guess it's going to be a magic baby though.

Oh definitely.

It also has to be a stallion that mounts the world for one thing.

[Rishathra]

I don't buy the death as heroic

Maybe I'm just trying too hard to find a bit of heroism in a character I'm fond of, but...

[HaemishM]

I thought the death was completely heroic. It really upset my wife, though.

[kaid]

I wonder what Yara's plan is? I get that step one of the plan is 'get the fuck away from Euron' and that's a good step for sure. I'm just not sure what step two is.

I hope the show gets on and does something interesting with Tyrion, because having him kicking his heels in Mereen for half the season isn't particularly interesting.

Step one: live long enough to figure out step two.

She did not expect her uncle to show up, openly admit to murdering her father, and get cheered for it. That was pretty much time to execute step GTFO and figure the rest out later.

[schild]

I did not care about Hodor dying. I would've rather seen him go on to start talking and become a giant boss ass warrior that punched the frost giant thing in the face.

Also, fuck this show is slow as balls.

[Speedy Cerviche]

Greyjoy book references spoiler

[Samwise]

I would like it a lot if Yara's men team up with the wildlings to help retake Winterfell for the Starks in exchange for being able to settle in the North, since both groups are sort of displaced at the moment.  On the other hand it seems like it'd be out of character for either group to actually want to settle anywhere under any sort of ruler, so maybe there'd need to be some other motivation.

[MediumHigh]

Team waiting for Sansa to die this season 

[Setanta]

Team waiting for Sansa to die this season 

I'm waiting for Sansa to have Jon killed off in the ultimate twist. Brienne will kill off Melisandre and Davros at the same time so there's no coming back.

[MediumHigh]

Team waiting for Sansa to die this season 

I'm waiting for Sansa to have Jon killed off in the ultimate twist. Brienne will kill off Melisandre and Davros at the same time so there's no coming back.

Drop this show faster than the walking dead 

[apocrypha]

 

[Chimpy]

The Tormund looks at Brienne have pretty much been the only entertaining thing this whole season.

[Bzalthek]

I am totally rooting for Tormund.  That Ginger bastard needs some lovin too!

[Surlyboi]

[Rishathra]

 

I love the real life  face.

[apocrypha]

    

[Teleku]

I've mostly been fine with the changes the show has made, and not as down on things as some of you have been.

But the changes to Sam and Arya's story this episode is the first time I think I've well and truely gone 

Just, fuck.  Why!?

[Threash]

What changes? Arya is way ahead of the books.  Sam sent Gilly to live with his parents while he went off to old town, there is also nothing preventing this from happening at some point either.

[satael]

I really liked how GoT was basically War of the Roses meets Helliconia at start but the further along the story goes the more fantasy and side-plots are added the less I'm interested. This is especially true for the characters that have no real power to alter the big picture (like Sam and Arya) except as some kind of magical Deus ex Machina.  

I'll still keep watching since I've made it this far and expecting the books to get finished in the near future... (or even that they'd be any better)

[Merusk]

Arya's only just gone farther along than the books (and the released chapter of Winds) with this episode, it's just that her story has been mixed up to hell and back.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Arya_Stark

Sam's story was fucked with to get him to Horn Hill for who knows what reason. Probably just to get another Valyrian sword in to play. The Maester from Oldtown he talked to must not be terribly important (shock, surprise.)

For a guy who wanted to avoid fantasy tropes, they're really starting to rely heavily on them. Arya, Dany, Bran, and Sam should be dead multiple times but have been protected by destiny/ need to get the story to a point.