SWTOR

[WindupAtheist]

As for where Blizzard got their people, I know Kalgan used to be Evocare from the UO team. He bolted when EA fully borged OSI, after having been lead developer on the Age of Shadows expansion. If you've ever played both a UO necromancer and a WoW death knight, you can definitely see the same guy's fingerprints on both in terms of gameplay concepts.

[Venkman]

How about we not have raids?  Is there anything that can retain people endgame other than raids and/or random PvP gankery?  Maybe not, I guess...

Raids are a catchall term, of which Kidsune's analogy is a part.

What we're really looking for is a repetitive event-base activity that retains accounts with deep ongoing new content being added at the unrealistic rate at which it is consumed. That's raids, battlegrounds, arenas, etc. Repetitive gameplay with a different advancement arc.

If you want to get away from that, you're in the proven land of UO and Eve. And it's proven in two ways:

• Social commerce and player driven economies can retain interest in a virtual world.
• Somewhere south of 1% of all current MMO players give a rats ass about it.

It's also a lot harder to make something like that work than it is to get players conditioned to periodic new content and personal advancement paths.

So yea, we could not have raids, but...  

[tmp]

If they try to do WoW, it's already a flop.  Trying to pull off a 10-man raid scenario in Star Wars just results in stupidity.  A ten-minute-long fight of a 'boss' being tanked by a jedi while soldiers pump a few thousand blaster shots into it is ridiculous.

Funnily enough Star Wars is perhaps a setting where this works -- could definitely see some emperor-level guy to focus all attention on the one (few) jedi attempting to slice him, while some retards with lasers pointlessly take pot shots at him from around the room, only to get two-shotted wih lighting if they draw too much attention to themselves.

[WindupAtheist]

I've had too many low-level WoW mobs throw spears through my paladin until he looks like a pincushion while he stood there laughing, landed too many giant leap-into-the-air hammerblows on dudes without them even staggering, to think that typical medieval fantasy MMO combat is any more believable than guys shrugging off laser beams.

[Lantyssa]

It's okay, because they're blasters.

[Ratman_tf]

It's okay, because they're blasters.

Powered by blaster gas. Which means guns in the Star Wars universe are fart guns.

[Surlyboi]

Is that why the prequels stunk?

[calapine]

Someone please excuse my stupidity, but are this this  and this  actual screenshots or concept art? The art style would give me the feeling of playing an interactive painting   

Edit: oh, and this is what huts look like: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20090213_004_1600x900.jpg (all released 13th feb 2009)

[Tale]

This is the SWTOR thread, so insert random "they're both star wars" segue. I'm not posting it in Gutboyland.

SWG wants to be your furry valentine: http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3328/swgclientr2009021203552au4.jpg

[UnSub]

This is the SWTOR thread, so insert random "they're both star wars" segue. I'm not posting it in Gutboyland.

SWG wants to be your furry valentine: http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3328/swgclientr2009021203552au4.jpg

That's. just. WRONG.

[Surlyboi]

Yup, saw that and immediately logged right the fuck out and played TR instead.

[Malakili]

Someone please excuse my stupidity, but are this this  and this  actual screenshots or concept art? The art style would give me the feeling of playing an interactive painting   

Edit: oh, and this is what huts look like: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20090213_004_1600x900.jpg (all released 13th feb 2009)

Yep, thats the art direction the game is taking.  Screenshots.

[calapine]

Yep, thats the art direction the game is taking.  Screenshots.

Thank you. :)
A bit...uninspiring...to be honest. I realise MMORPGs should be designed to run well on the widest possible selection of systems as well as handle 100+ characters on the screen at the same time, but still... *sigh*

[Venkman]

Ok, I sorta agree on the interior shot. It reminds me of levels in the first Unreal, and all the spawn that have descended from it since.

But the outdoor shots on (presumably) Tatooine are fantastic. If there's any limitation at all it's from the source material. And given what they're trying with the engine, I think even the Hutt (two Ts ;-) ) even looks good.

Yea, I'm starting to have hopes for this title. I feel like 2010 is going to be the first full year where we'll have games that were reactions to WoW rather that oh-shit-too-late-to-change games that were in the queue prior to 2004.

[ashrik]

That stuff looks bad to you? Since when is being given the feeling of playing an interactive painting even close to being a negative comment?

It looks pretty decent so far. And probably looks pretty good to a whole legion of non-gaming star wars fans

[SnakeCharmer]

I've really come around to the art style as well.  Looks fantastic.  There's very little difference in concept art to screenshot.

The only thing I'm not keen on is the spandex suits.

[calapine]

I've really come around to the art style as well.  Looks fantastic. 

That stuff looks bad to you?

eeek! Time for some frantic backpedalling...

Well, Darniaq already pointed out its mostly on the interior shots. I still stand by my first impression though, which was somewhat underwhelmed.
Maybe these shots illustrate it better:

Exhibit 1: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20081021_TombLightsaberDuel_full.jpg
Exhibit 2: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20081021_PlatformLightsaberDuel_full.jpg

[Tmon]

It looks a little cartoony to me, but if, like WoW, it plays smoothly on my 4 year old PC I'd give it a shot.

[tmp]

Well, Darniaq already pointed out its mostly on the interior shots. I still stand by my first impression though, which was somewhat underwhelmed.
Maybe these shots illustrate it better:

Exhibit 1: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20081021_TombLightsaberDuel_full.jpg
Exhibit 2: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20081021_PlatformLightsaberDuel_full.jpg

Yeah, the style is not photorealism but rather something with slight cel-shaded quality to it. This is pretty consistent with the style from their previous KotOR games and not really wrong, imo -- avoids the uncanny valley effect and helps the immersion.

The interior shot doesn't really show anything wrong with the engine or the graphics style, it's rather issue with uninspired design.

[Hawkbit]

It's all taste, sure.  But I'm not seeing the issue. 

The character models need a bit of work, and a little anisotropic filtering wouldn't hurt those shots.  But the environments look wonderful. 

[Malakili]

Yeah, I used to be one of those people that was all "Ooooh, i love realism!! "  But then I realized, there are lots of styles that are plain nice to look at regardless of how real they look.  So now I'm pretty much willing to let any graphical style have a chance as long as its nice to look at.

If I want to bash on this game, there are plenty of reasons, but the graphics aren't one of them

[Lakov_Sanite]

Yeah, I used to be one of those people that was all "Ooooh, i love realism!! "  But then I realized, there are lots of styles that are plain nice to look at regardless of how real they look.  So now I'm pretty much willing to let any graphical style have a chance as long as its nice to look at.

If I want to bash on this game, there are plenty of reasons, but the graphics aren't one of them

It's starting to remind me a lot of the clone wars cartoon and I really dislike the look of that.

[Lantyssa]

SWG wants to be your furry valentine: http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3328/swgclientr2009021203552au4.jpg

Considerate of them to highlight the area to aim at.

Exhibit 1: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20081021_TombLightsaberDuel_full.jpg
Exhibit 2: http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/ss/SS_20081021_PlatformLightsaberDuel_full.jpg

Those are from their first released screenshots.  They've been tweaking the people from what I've seen of later ones.  I rather like the look of the environments themselves though.

[DraconianOne]

But the outdoor shots on (presumably) Tatooine are fantastic. If there's any limitation at all it's from the source material. And given what they're trying with the engine, I think even the Hutt (two Ts ;-) ) even looks good.

It's Hutta apparently. The original homeworld of - erm, someone - I forget who but sure I'll remember eventually. Before it got destroyed and they took to the moons.

The comments on this page are gold.

[Venkman]

Ah, Nal Hutta? Yea, the Hutts strip-mined everything including the atmosphere, but the moon (Nal Shardda) became a huge smuggler depot. I remember some early Solo visits there from some novels.

So I looked it up and saw that the shot on this entry looks fairly close to the ones above.

[UnSub]

I refuse to nerdrage every time a new set of photos is released and plan to save it for when the actual gameplay is available for testing.

[Triforcer]

What I'm mainly worried about is all the screenshots of people fighting animals.  We've been down that road before. 

EDIT:  I mean, fuck, what was it about the six movies that makes developers think Star Wars is a farm animal killing scenario?  The collective two minutes spent in the wampa cave and rancor pit? 

[Jobu]

EDIT:  I mean, fuck, what was it about the six movies that makes developers think Star Wars is a farm animal killing scenario?  The collective two minutes spent in the wampa cave and rancor pit? 

And fighting cat monsters in a gladiator pit, and fighting a space worm thing, and fighting mynocks, and fighting garbage snakes...

[Ratman_tf]

I blame the Womp Rats line. Exterminating vermin since ANH! 

[WindupAtheist]

What I'm mainly worried about is all the screenshots of people fighting animals.  We've been down that road before. 

EDIT:  I mean, fuck, what was it about the six movies that makes developers think Star Wars is a farm animal killing scenario?  The collective two minutes spent in the wampa cave and rancor pit?

It's because they're all a bunch of dickbags lacking in even the basic creativity required to divorce themselves from the medieval fantasy MMO "kill monsters" meme. Christ, this shit looks stupid.

[Oban]

Oh!  I hope there are swordsmen, people with pikes and medics that can throw damage over time poisons!

[tmp]

It's because they're all a bunch of dickbags lacking in even the basic creativity required to divorce themselves from the medieval fantasy MMO "kill monsters" meme. Christ, this shit looks stupid.

Nah, more like because people otherwise bitch about not enough variety in shapes of their xp bags. So it's not all robots and badly trained storm troopers/rainbow aliens with differently shaped foreheads, BFD. Limiting the types of targets isn't exactly creative, either; nor any less stupid in the settings dating back few thousand years from 'long, long time ago' and located in brain of some fart who thought knights with laser swords would be cool, to begin with.

[Ingmar]

I blame the Womp Rats line. Exterminating vermin since ANH! 

Seriously, Luke spent his first couple levels grinding wamp rats.

[Mrbloodworth]

Oh!  I hope there are swordsmen, people with pikes and medics that can throw damage over time poisons!

Pikeman was fun, and lore correct.

[DraconianOne]

Seriously, Luke spent his first couple levels grinding wamp rats.

Yeah but not enough. He got owned by sand people and nearly got owned in the Cantina. And the Dia Noga. Fortunately he was carried through the Death Star instance by the rest of his group and vehicle based combat didn't seem to have level based restrictions. Bet he got a stack of XP and a couple of levels for taking part in the "Death Star" raid. Mind you, rerolling into jedi class when the first expansion came out was a bit lame - and he still got owned by a low level wampa.