Noob advice

[ajax34i]

Well, frigates need to orbit, and blaster-based ships need to get in close, but cruisers and battleships are generally slow, long range ships (60km Caracal, 100+ km battleships), so I mean warp in at 60, target, activate weapons, and then line up with a planet. 

Hopefully the tacklers are keeping the target in place.  Or, if in a mission, you shoot one even if it's out of range, and it and its friends come readily enough.  Cruiser doesn't have to move an inch, in fact it makes salvaging easier if it doesn't.

[Der Helm]

So, how do you pull off both keeping yourself in a fight and being aligned to warp if it goes south?

I think this only works for ships who are so slow, that moving them around would not work anyway. They either have a falloff range that is so big that they do not need to chase their target, use missiles or drones.

If you are in a small agile ship, you do not really need to align yourself, since you go to warp almost immediately

[Kitsune]

Immediate my ass, it takes a solid eight seconds in my Punisher.  And that's with Evasive Maneuvering and Starship Command both at 4.

[Morat20]

I was going to do a few of the courier jobs, a few were listed at 10 million for about 12 jumps... and then I noticed that you needed a 1k+ cargo space, and I was bummed.

Industrials are fairly cheap -- I could just send you the money for the skillbook and the ship, and you only need a level of it. They're slow as shit, so you want to use "warp to zero". Do not EVER autopilot with one of those. Frankly, I'd avoid anything that goes lower than .5 in one of those, since you make get ganked on the off chance your sealed cargo is worth something.

I'm lazy, and I suspect there's a lot like me, so I habitually put up about 1500 m3 or more of shit to move maybe six jumps through high-sec -- all so I don't have to go get my Industrial, fly back, pick it up, fly it out there, drop it off. I tend to put a payoff of between 500k and a million on it, depending on the number of jumps -- and that's high sec.

[Mook]

Immediate my ass, it takes a solid eight seconds in my Punisher.  And that's with Evasive Maneuvering and Starship Command both at 4.

What are you warping to? Generally if I need to bug out in my Punisher, I'll just rightclick on and warp to the closest object to the center of my screen. With frigate aligning speed it makes almost no difference in alignment as long as it's not behind you or at the very edge of your screen.

[Kitsune]

Just about anywhere.  From the moment I hit the warp button, it takes about eight seconds before the ship 'jumps' into warp speed, i.e. the moment that all of the surroundings go flying off into the distance.  It turns to face the correct direction very quickly, but then it just sits there for several seconds before the warp kicks in.  That warp tunnel graphical effect appears quickly, but the ship isn't really moving that fast for a while.

[Der Helm]

Don't you count as "in warp" once you are aligned and the "warp drive" is "active" ?

[5150]

Just about anywhere.  From the moment I hit the warp button, it takes about eight seconds before the ship 'jumps' into warp speed, i.e. the moment that all of the surroundings go flying off into the distance.  It turns to face the correct direction very quickly, but then it just sits there for several seconds before the warp kicks in.  That warp tunnel graphical effect appears quickly, but the ship isn't really moving that fast for a while.

Do you have [big] plates fitted?

Don't you count as "in warp" once you are aligned and the "warp drive" is "active" ?

If you warp out with targets lock you should see the point at which you enter warp as it will be the point where you lose your locks (offhand I think its when your 'warping' speed hits 75%)

[Akkori]

I was going to do a few of the courier jobs, a few were listed at 10 million for about 12 jumps... and then I noticed that you needed a 1k+ cargo space, and I was bummed.

Industrials are fairly cheap -- I could just send you the money for the skillbook and the ship, and you only need a level of it. They're slow as shit, so you want to use "warp to zero". Do not EVER autopilot with one of those. Frankly, I'd avoid anything that goes lower than .5 in one of those, since you make get ganked on the off chance your sealed cargo is worth something.

I'm lazy, and I suspect there's a lot like me, so I habitually put up about 1500 m3 or more of shit to move maybe six jumps through high-sec -- all so I don't have to go get my Industrial, fly back, pick it up, fly it out there, drop it off. I tend to put a payoff of between 500k and a million on it, depending on the number of jumps -- and that's high sec.

I have been pouring everything into Learning skills, except for a few really important other skills, but should be done, *finally*, with them sometime tomorrow or the day after. Thanks to the generosity of F13, I am doing okay for isk. After I get the most pressing PvP skills down, I will start moving toward the rest. Thanks for the offer!

[Slayerik]

To be aligned while doing other shit you have to maunally drive more. You basically pick a celestial that will keep you at your current range (of course, unless they rush you) if you are using drones/rails.  Blaster boats are harder to stay aligned in , as you have to be up in someone's face.

[Numtini]

So I started the tutorial and screwed it up and lost the mission. Is there some reward worth restarting for or have things changed enough in the last year that I need to go through it? (If I stay I'll kill this character and reup my old account anyway, even if it's mostly barges and industry.)

And yes, i figured I'd never play again, but I am really bored.

Oh the new graphic engine is shockingly good.

[bhodi]

if you lose the mission you can re get it again by talking to the guy. If you're doing the 10 mission chain it is very much worth finishing since you get something like 3 skill books, 2 frigates and 2 implants.

RE: going into warp, you must be going something like 95 75% of top speed to go into warp. you 'sitting there' even when aligned is likely your boat ramping up to this velocity. When you hit the warp button, the speed meter may say warping and show a pretty tunnel but what it's really doing is just turning on your engines (and, if you aren't aligned, rotating your ship to face the object you are warping to). When you actually go INTO warp, you'll see the meter reset to 0 and then flick to max. Then, things will move on screen and you will dissapear from grid. Until things vanish, you are still targetable.

In general, the "If you can see them, they can see you" rule applies.

[Sir T]

RE: going into warp, you must be going something like 95% of top speed to go into warp. you 'sitting there' even when aligned is likely your boat ramping up to it's max velocity.

Incorrect. Its 75%. I often aligned in a BS by going 75% of my top speed and when I hit warp I was gone instantly.

[bhodi]

That falls under the 'something like'. I don't/didn't  know the exact number :)

Now I do! Edited!

[dwindlehop]

You can see people arriving on grid who are still in warp. If you target them before they come out of warp, the UI will seem to begin to lock, but then your lock will fail as soon as the server tells you they are still in warp. It requires some frantic clicking, good timing, or both to lock an interceptor before he bugs out.

[caladein]

To shift gears a bit...

I've been doing a lot of reading on Salvaging and still have no idea of when it'd be a good idea of how to approach it or get started on it (although I understand it's pretty good money and all).  Is it something I fit an alt for mainly, use a second ship for, or something that's really not viable as a side-task to mission running until X level missions?

[Der Helm]

To shift gears a bit...

I've been doing a lot of reading on Salvaging and still have no idea of when it'd be a good idea of how to approach it or get started on it (although I understand it's pretty good money and all).  Is it something I fit an alt for mainly, use a second ship for, or something that's really not viable as a side-task to mission running until X level missions?

I usually have a destroyer outfitted for salvaging (cargo-extenders, cap relays, mwd/ab, 4 salvagers 2 tractor beams) sitting in the hangar of the station I am doing missions from.

Salvaging "The blockade" Lvl 4 brought me roughly 7 mill in salvage for about 15 minutes "work" (I warped out a few times so the wrecks were all over the place.

So if you are running missions, I definitely recommend it.

[caladein]

Hmm alright, that seems like a pretty decent near-term goal to shoot for that'll help in the long run. Something along these lines in terms of skills?

Skill plan for Cal Escaa

1. Mechanic II
2. Survey II
3. Science II
4. Energy Grid Upgrades II
5. Spaceship Command III
6. Destroyers I
7. Mechanic III
8. Survey III
9. Salvaging I
10. Salvaging II
11. Science III
12. Energy Grid Upgrades III
13. Salvaging III
14. Science IV

14 skills; Total time: 4 days, 5 hours, 24 minutes, 6 seconds

Plus, most of those skills are on the way towards things I'm aiming for anyway like Astrometrics (damn you Endie!).

[lac]

You only need destroyers I if you are going to use them as a salvage boat. You also don't need science IV to start with the astrometrics skills but you will need it later on if you are going for covops.

[bhodi]

The Science IV is for small tractor beams. You don't need destroyers 2; then again, it's what, 30 minutes to train?

[caladein]

The Science IV is for small tractor beams. You don't need destroyers 2; then again, it's what, 30 minutes to train?

Yeah, Destroyers II and III are about 15 hours at this point.  After I get this Cormorant off the ground, it's learning skills bonanza for a week.

[lac]

The Science IV is for small tractor beams

Ah yes, I remember that being a serious pain in the ass. I waited forever to train that, now I wouldn't want to salvage without them.

[Jayce]

OK, necroing reviving this topic instead of making my own newb advice one.

First - characters. I just restarted with a Minmatar Brutor built from the ground up according to the Goonfleet guide linked from here.  I do have a 3.7million sp character on the account, but he's got a goofy name and is from before the newbie experience revamp.  Also, with the older guy I concentrated on craftard skills, so I think I'm going to save a lot of time by starting right with the Matari.   Also, he can drive the big Gallente industrial so that'll be helpful even if he's not actively skilling anything.  I'm nervous that I'm making a mistake though, so I'm interested in opinions on that approach.

Second - training.  I'm starting relatively from scratch, so I'll need a cash flow.  I'm interested in covert ops though.  My questions - are covops ships any good for running missions or other isk-making endeavors, or should I skill toward BS/HAC for the high level missions before I shoot for covops? Also, are covops pilots a dime a dozen or are they relatively rare and useful in PvP or other ops?  I guess I'm mostly worried that if I go straight for covops, will it impede my cash flow to the point where I don't have a lot of breathing space if I get popped a few times in a row.

Thanks in advance - all the other info here has been great, particularly Evemon, which recommended a few learning skills that shaved 23 days off my prospective plan!

[IainC]

OK, necroing reviving this topic instead of making my own newb advice one.

First - characters. I just restarted with a Minmatar Brutor built from the ground up according to the Goonfleet guide linked from here.  I do have a 3.7million sp character on the account, but he's got a goofy name and is from before the newbie experience revamp.  Also, with the older guy I concentrated on craftard skills, so I think I'm going to save a lot of time by starting right with the Matari.   Also, he can drive the big Gallente industrial so that'll be helpful even if he's not actively skilling anything.  I'm nervous that I'm making a mistake though, so I'm interested in opinions on that approach.

Second - training.  I'm starting relatively from scratch, so I'll need a cash flow.  I'm interested in covert ops though.  My questions - are covops ships any good for running missions or other isk-making endeavors, or should I skill toward BS/HAC for the high level missions before I shoot for covops? Also, are covops pilots a dime a dozen or are they relatively rare and useful in PvP or other ops?  I guess I'm mostly worried that if I go straight for covops, will it impede my cash flow to the point where I don't have a lot of breathing space if I get popped a few times in a row.

Thanks in advance - all the other info here has been great, particularly Evemon, which recommended a few learning skills that shaved 23 days off my prospective plan!

If you want a ship progression path for missioning effectively with relatively noob levels of skills then you will go Frig -> Cruiser -> BC -> BS for level 1-4 missions respectively. Forget the funky stuff for PvE, it only really works if you have uber skills otherwise it's unnecessarily expensive and gimped - you're better off in a bigger class of t1 ship than in a t2 ship normally unless you have all the skills to get the most out of your t2 vessel.

The good news is that you can get the skills to be able to afk through L3s and 4s reasonably fast and then the cash will roll in if you salvage and make the market work for you. Once you can do that you can back fill all the level V skills you'll need to be good with specialised t2 ships. Covops is pretty easy to train for - all you really need is the skill to fit a cloak and if you just want to be a warscout then it's low impact from a skills perspective.

[ajax34i]

Yup, you should already have Frigate; train Cruiser, Battlecruiser, and Battleship (along with the appropriate weapon systems for these ships, and upping your support skills as you go along).  You'll be restricted by your faction standings anyway; you can jump to level 2 agents by training the Social skills to 4, but after that it's a grind for faction (which will make you money as a byproduct).  Train what's required for Salvager I and Tractor Beam I and either pick a level of Destroyer to salvage with, or use a frigate with 4 high slots and a bigger cargo hold.

As for characters, if the Matari is the one you want, go with it.  3.7 million is about 3 months of training that you're losing, but oh well.  I've restarted from a lot more than that.  You could start the Matari on a new account so you can level him separately, then also continue to train the other guy to Hulk or something (couple months), then sell it for 1.5 billion ISK, and you'll have your cash too.