Why I can't take organized religion seriously #1001001SOS

[Sky]

I'm seeing quite a bit of the aforementioned bias against big people here. In a lot of cases, there's nothing wrong with being big if that's your bodies' natural size genetically. My family in Mississippi are all huge, even the 'skinny' ones would be considered fat here in NY. Meanwhile, they tend to live well into their 70s, with several into the 90s, healthy as people can be. I'm not completely dismissing that there are health problems that can arise from being heavy, type 2 diabetes in particular. But I think the whole thing is WAY overblown (and I suspect a profit motive from the industry and also a healthy dollop of snobbery).

And the snobbery is what gets me the most. Why is it ok in our politically correct world to make fun of fat people? Why not make fun of people with AIDS? Why not make fun of heroin junkies? If being overweight is indeed a health problem, we should be sympathetic. If it's not we should shut the fuck up and let people look however the hell they want.

[Endie]

Why not make fun of heroin junkies?

You say that as if we don't.

[Ironwood]

Um.  I do make fun of heroin junkies in the SAME way as I make fun of fat people.  In both cases it's usually a lifestyle choice.

Or a medical condition.  Like Cake-Retention.

[Tebonas]

I tend to agree. Its not like people run around pricking them with heroin needles and they are magically Heroin junkies all of a sudden.

There are too many conditions that are a good excuse for being fat that you can't make blanket statements about them. But Heroin junkies? Every day of the week.

[bhodi]

You're equating heroin, a terrible life-destroying substance that is so horrible that even if you can bear to quit you still think about it nearly every day, that causes vomiting and fever for weeks as withdrawal symptoms, to people overindulging in food?

Also, it's funny to point and laugh at both.

[Sky]

You people make me sad.

[Nebu]

It's wrong to mock anyone Sky.  Anyone.  Even if you're attempting to promote changes in behavior, there are much more effective methods.

[Tebonas]

Drugs are the ultimate overindulgence. At least you need a certain amount of food to survive.

[Sky]

Indulgence, sure. Overindulgence? Not for most people, though it's certainly possible in some cases.

[Tebonas]

Fair enough, I should have written "Hard Drugs like Heroin". Soft drugs are just an indulgence most of the time. Hell, one of the thing still pissing me off despite being anti-every-possible-druglike-substance personally is the illegality of Weeds.

[Damn Dirty Ape]

People would have to give up the high that comes with self-righteousness if they stopped mocking others.  I know I'm a judgment junkie.  But I'm trying to temper my cynicism with compassion these days.  Somedays I'm Buddha; others, I'm King Prick.

[Tebonas]

Its only a high if you don't have to pay for it. It stops being funny when your health care system has to pick up the bill!

[Furiously]

I should go around a few malls here in Cinci and get some photos for you.  Hell, I could even just go to work, as the co-worker who started the same time as I both have commented on the very round state of the majority of the staff.   I'm not exaggerating when I say there are 7 women in my dep't of 25 whose weight I'd put down at 195 or better.  The guys are a lot better off, but that's because the 4 who were large have quit or been fired in recent months.  The rest of us are teetering on the "better watch it" brink - including myself.    I'd say we've got 4 people at a 'healthy' weight.

Then you go out and see all the kids.  "Normal" kids in the mall around here would have been called "the fat kid" when I was in school.  My daughter's considered skinny, at a size I would have called normal.   Yes, we're definitely getting fatter as a nation.

Especially in Ohio... Case in point. http://direct.where2getit.com/cwc/apps/w2gi.php?template=state&client=bww&STATE=OH&map=default_shadow_names&FullStateName=Ohio

[Lantyssa]

Go to a mall in Houston, Texas.  The sheer amount of truly fat people astounded me the last time I was there.

I don't go to the mall often, but I can vouch for this.

Again, i went to Houston once, but I didn't go to any malls.  Given that the heat and humidity almost killed me, i can see why someone carrying a spare gut might have been sticking to the aircon.

95 degrees and 90% humidity is nice around here.

[Nebu]

For any interested, the CDC has posted a report on the economic consequences of obesity in the US.  Unhealthy lifestyles of all types cost everyone. 

 

[Sky]

Its only a high if you don't have to pay for it. It stops being funny when your health care system has to pick up the bill!

Do you really want to base legislation on whether things incur a health care cost in some situations? It'd be a shitty world, then.

I'm also calling bullshit on that CDC report. Vague as hell, and the CDC is a fairly shady organization anyway. Not as bad as the FDA, but close.

[Nebu]

I'm also calling bullshit on that CDC report. Vague as hell, and the CDC is a fairly shady organization anyway. Not as bad as the FDA, but close.

Well, if you can attribute the rising rates of heart disease and type II diabetes to something else, I'm all ears.  I work in healthcare.

[Tebonas]

Nah, I want increased health care rates for people who deliberately play hazard with their own health just for fun. Then they can pay for each others cancer and heart failures. Just like I have an additional insurance for the risks I take while biking.

[Nebu]

Perhaps I take for granted what I see on a daily basis.  Lifestyles in this country are out of control and it's obvious to anyone that currently works in pediatrics.  With the passage of the prescription drug bill, the costs to taxpayers for sedentary lifestyles are staggering.  It's quite commonplace to see adults in their 40's and 50's to be on 10-15 concurrent medications, many of which could be eliminated had the patient maintained proper diet and exercise over the course of their life.  If you'd like some examples, I'll be happy to provide them.  The evidence is far beyond anecdotal in this country. 

[Roac]

If you'd like some examples, I'll be happy to provide them.

I'm 100% in agreement with you on this subject, but if you have some that aren't too much trouble I'd be interested in seeing them.

[Strazos]

It's easy to make fun of fatties because, 99% of the time, they could eliminate the problem by Not Eating So God Damned Much.

Seriously. Believe it or not, but the PA/South NJ/North Delaware tri-state area has quite a high percentage of fatties. This is anecdotal, of course.

And you know why they're fat? Cause they eat like fatties. It's embarrassing. I probably eat a lot...when I eat. I eat Maybe twice a day, and the kind of food we have around at home is...well, I'm told it's different than what most households stock. Not much "instant" stuff at all, which is partially why I don't eat so much (I hate to cook).

People just eat Way Too Much.

[Roac]

It's easy to make fun of fatties because, 99% of the time, they could eliminate the problem by Not Eating So God Damned Much.

99% of the time, assholes could elimiate their problem by not talking.  Hasn't slowed you down either.

[Nebu]

I'm 100% in agreement with you on this subject, but if you have some that aren't too much trouble I'd be interested in seeing them.

Here's a medications list for patient in their 50's suffering from heart disease that I ran across yesterday. 

Toprol XL (metoprolol succinate) 50mg qday

Lipitor (atorvastatin) 80mg qday

ASA 325mg qday

Plavix (clopidogrel) 75mg qday

Lisinopril 10mg qday

Digoxin 0.125mg qday

Spiriva (tiotroprium) 1 puff qday

Advair (salmeterol / fluticasone) 250/50 1 puff BID

Albuterol MDI 1 puff q4 hours PRN

Zoloft (sertraline) 100mg qday

Ultram (tramadol) 50mg q4 hours PRN

This is not all that uncommon and I can think of several other medications that could easily be added (for diabetes etc.). 

[Riggswolfe]

It's easy to make fun of fatties because, 99% of the time, they could eliminate the problem by Not Eating So God Damned Much.

Yes and no. There are some people who that is the case for, like my girlfriend's 400 pound room mate. That fat bitch eats an entire bag of chicken nuggets in a meal. I'm talking those Tyson bags you buy at Walmart or wherever. They last me for a couple of months usually, maybe one meal or two a week for my girlfriend and I both.

Now...I weigh 200 pounds and am about 5'9". I'm overweight but not morbidly obese. I eat 2 meals a day, soup for lunch (sometimes with a small bag of potato chips), I drink 1 can of Diet Dr Pepper per day, otherwise it's water or grape juice for my fluid intake. For dinner I usually have some kind of a meat and green stuff, like maybe peas and a baked chicken breast.

The only time I have lost any weight was when I was very ill and had stuff coming out of both ends. Then I lost about 10 pounds in a week.

I think my problem is similar to many, it's not my eating that is killing me it is my lack of exercise. I'm going to be moving a treadmill into my house that used to belong to a relative in hopes that this will help things.

[Strazos]

It's easy to make fun of fatties because, 99% of the time, they could eliminate the problem by Not Eating So God Damned Much.

99% of the time, assholes could eliminate their problem by not talking.  Hasn't slowed you down either.

Hur, I didn't say I did. Honestly, I don't give a shit, because not only is it not my problem, but for most people, it's a problem with an easy, realistic solution. Seriously, most people can tell if they're overweight or whatever. It should be easy enough for them to change their diet, at the very least.

All the boohooing in this country over obesity is retarded. Far too many people think it's not their fault.

[Strazos]

It's easy to make fun of fatties because, 99% of the time, they could eliminate the problem by Not Eating So God Damned Much.

Stuff about eating not terribly, but not exercising either.

Yes, that probably is the case for a good portion of overweight people. It's just the crying about it that gets to me. The lack of self-responsibility. And the tendency for so many people to insist there's "omg so much more to it" than diet and exercise.

Yes, I suppose genetics Can play a part in the equation, but it is only a part. And how many people actually know that they have a genetic disposition to carry weight, compared to the number of people who just have...unhealthy lifestyles.

[Roac]

Hur, I didn't say I did.

Sorry.  Didn't realize fattie was a term of endearment.

It should be easy enough for them to change their diet, at the very least.

All the boohooing in this country over obesity is retarded. Far too many people think it's not their fault.

It is entirely within their power.  People are still overweight, almost none of them want to be, and there is a social cost to bear as a result.  It's not "boohooing" to say that there is a social problem, or to say that it's improper to tease or insult them. 

[Strazos]

But it is "boohooing" when so many people refuse to accept responsibility. Instead, far too many people come up with excuses and blame some other entity.

McDonald's doesn't make anyone fat. People choosing to eat at McDonald's makes those people fat. Most people, whether they want to or not, choose to be that way through their actions, or lack thereof.

[Ironwood]

Fuck Fatties.

Fuck them.

I hope they die running away from something that they can't possibly outrun.

Fuckers.

[Tebonas]

I'm going to be moving a treadmill into my house that used to belong to a relative in hopes that this will help things.

It doesn't. You would have to use the treadmill as well. Moving it around doesn't burn that many calories.

[Endie]

I think my problem is similar to many, it's not my eating that is killing me it is my lack of exercise. I'm going to be moving a treadmill into my house that used to belong to a relative in hopes that this will help things.

Spot on!  It's the old equation of eating less calories than you exercise: the only diet plan endorsed by the first law of thermodynamics.

I forget the exact figure, but I think it is c.3500 calories less consumed than burnt will cause a weight-loss of one pound.  If you eat 2000 calories in a day but burn 2500 - a pretty painless rate - you lose a pound a week.  Fifty pounds a year with what amounts to light exercise and enough calories to stuff yourself silly with healthy foods.  It's really do-able.

[WayAbvPar]

I'm going to be moving a treadmill into my house that used to belong to a relative in hopes that this will help things.

It doesn't. You would have to use the treadmill as well. Moving it around doesn't burn that many calories.

I don't know...ours weighs a couple of hundred pounds easy. It is not a trivial workout to mandhandle that bastard around.

[Furiously]

And something you never thought you would hear someone say.

"Yea, but your's is a monster sized one."

[WayAbvPar]

Thank god we cut that tree down last week so you will quit peeping in our windows now.

[Morat20]

Lisinopril 10mg qday

I take that -- 2.5mg a day. It's fucking dirt cheap, though. (Just started a few months ago. My blood pressure has stayed at 130/85 for 10 years. When I was 220, when I was 320, when I was doing heavy exercise three times a week, when I was doing none -- didn't budge an inch.). That shit is great -- I went down to something like 115/70. Hell, it was that high back when I was in high-school and technically "healthy". Weirdest thing? Not a fucking bit of family history of hypertension. Nada. Zilch. (And for the record -- blood sugar, cholestrol, thyroid, heartrate -- all just dandy.)

It'd odd that he finally put me on it (at 31) after I lost 20% of my body-weight (I'm down to 260 now, and have stayed there for about a year. Given I simply don't have time for exercise and did that by changing eating habits two or three years ago, I'm pretty proud of that. Exercise comes after my Master's. Work + Master's Degree == no fucking time). Losing 20% of your weight in two years is far better than most people do.

My 'ideal weight' is supposedly between 150 and 190 -- which is fucking bullshit of the highest order. When I was at my healthiest (post-high school), I was 225 -- I could have lost maybe another 20 pounds. I was doing heavy aerobic exercise three times a week, I had visible ab muscles (that was a shock to me), and it wasn't like I was bulking out for weightlifting. I wasn't doing any weight training. I don't see how I could possibly have lost enough weight to get down to below 190 and be "healthy". I'd be a fucking twig at 150. I was skinny as shit in High School and weighed 180 -- I did middle distance swimming, so it wasn't like I was unathletic.

I don't buy into the BMI indicators -- they're bullshit. A healthy weight for me is about 230, not 190. And hopefully I'll hit it next year.

As for the rest of the medicine list -- is she taking the zoloft because she's depressed she's fat, or were you just listing all medications regardless of whether they're related to obesity? (Even linsporil isn't necessarily related to obesity -- obesity is just a common trigger for hypertension. I had it when I was at my ideal weight, and I have it now.)