The News Thread

[Big Gulp]

It's new powers/archetypes

*cough*  Sure it is.   

[Xanthippe]

Ok, I get what you're saying.

It's like an expansion - that you have to pay for - similar to DAOC:SI or TOA - except that it also is a standalone, no need to purchase CoH to play.  In my book, that makes it another game.  Not a separate game, not a new game, but another game.

I think it's very cool, and am looking forward to the launch.

For a MMOG, I sure do like the fact that I can log in for an hour here and there and play, instead of sitting inside some zone advertising "LFT" for a half hour before finding a group.

[Alkiera]

It's new powers/archetypes

*cough*  Sure it is.   

The devs have said so over and over again publicly, and it's true.... CoV archetypes are rather different from the CoH ones.  Brutes do not play like Tankers, nor do Dominators play like Controllers.  Yes, they share quite a few powersets with the CoH archetypes... but with them as primary rather than secondary, or vice versa, or with a few powers removed and replaced with something else; or the powers are rearranged into a different order to be more useful to a class that plays differently than the CoH class with that powerset.

Although I frequently agree with you, Haemish, I find your definition of 'new game' to be ridiculous.  CoV is at least as different from CoH in gameplay, as, say, WoW is from EQ.  Perhaps moreso, since between WoW and EQ you can basically 1-to-1 map the classes from WoW back to EQ.  The engine is about as advanced, for polycount, etc, tho it admittedly has a better framerate.  You might as well say that Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, and Alone in the Dark were not different, because while the characters and areas were different, they used the same engine.(Scumm)  Or that Checkers and Go are the same, because they both use round pieces and a field of squares as the 'engine'.  Or that Monopoly is the same game as Sorry, or CandyLand, or the Game of Life, because they all have little pieces that move around a cardboard,  square-based path depending on a random number.  Or that Hoyle's Book of games is stupid, because none of the game are different, I mean, they all just use a deck of cards, right?

Yes, I blew your statement all out of proportion.  It was fun.  And I agree that the game has some issues, especially in the sense that it just takes too freeken long to level, from about 12-35... and from 35 on it takes WAY WAY WAY WAY too long.  My highest is 44, and I've getting to the point where I just don't wanna play him anymore.  He's more or less done, development-wise, and I don't feel it's worth the time to get 2 more powers, and a few more slots.  I'd like to play a peacebringer, but I don't know that my 44 can hold my attention long enough to get to 50, and the hope of playing something else isn't enough.  I don't respond well to dangled carrots, just ask my spouse.

But CoV not being a new game?  Heh.  I'll be impressed if WoW has as much new area/enemy content as CoV in its first expansion.  Nevermind that they added 5 new classes, new mission types, quite a few new powersets, and a bunch of modified powersets...

I know you aren't in the beta yet, since you've said as much.  But it's not the same game.  It's similar, but not the same.

Alkiera

[Signe]

A review of what took place on Alcatraz Island.  People said stuff.

It's on IGN.  Sorry.

[Signe]

The ATs do feel different to me, too, even the ones that appear to be the same.  I'm enjoying them, for the most part.  Yes, I know I'm playing a "version" of CoH but it's not the same thing in a different colour.  The flavour is different, too.  I don't know how long it'll keep me occupied, but for now, it's fun. 

  for good measure.

[Llava]

Statesman's Strike

Finally, Statesman said there will be a major event at the end of Beta on October 26. Beta tester villains will need to help Lord Recluse and Arachnos defend the Rogue Isles from an attack by Statesman and some of his top superfriends from Cryptic. Will we see Statesman and Lord Recluse go mano-a-mano during what is being billed as 'Statesman's Strike'?

Cool.

CoV is a new game in the sense that Werewolf: The Apocalypse is different from Vampire: The Masquerade is different from Changeling: The Dreaming.  Sure, same world.  Sure, very similar rules.  Sure, same title scheme.  And yet, three completely different games.  One is bloody war and violence, one is personal horror and angst, and one is childlike wonder and general homoeroticism.  (Actually I guess the homoeroticism goes for Vampire, too.)

That premier event sounds cheesy as hell, but if I was there in person I'm sure I would've eaten it up.

[UnSub]

Since I'm not nearly as jaded as Haemish ("Free! Meh! Not shiney enough!") I think the no extra charge is a brilliant move by Cryptic to get established players to buy CoV. How many new players come in ... well, that'll be interesting to see.

Makes me wonder how Cryptic can afford it in the long-terrm though.

[Glazius]

But isn't feeling the "need" to "grind to be competitive" just another way of drinking the kool aid?

You kinda "need" to unless you think being fodder is fun.

I am coming from more of a PvP mind-set, since that'd be the reason why I'd return.  Its the only thing that holds my attention past the afterglow.  If I came back my goal would be to have get to fun/fair PvP asap. So what is required to have a fair/fun PvP in CoH/V?  level to 50, get the best 4 or 5 accolades, and a couple dozen top notch enhancements, and guild with 20+ members with the same?

Since they stayed sane with their pricing(which is what I was referring to in the kool-aid reference), I'll probably keep watching and see how things shake out. But it seems to be going the the route of DAoC and that's not a good thing.

I will, however, say that accolades don't make as much difference as you might think, nor do Hami-Os. Accolades count as a new power at the level you got them at, which means when you exemplar down they go away. Enhancements also get depowered when you exemplar.

--GF

[HaemishM]

Sure, the NCSoft thing about no extra charge for CoV and CoH is a good thing, but only because I find the idea that I should pay extra for what I consider the same game to be fucking gouging.

As for the comparisons of why it's not a new game, you can't say it's like the difference between WoW and EQ. I cannot take my undead rogue in WoW and run him against players from EQ. I can't comingle. In CoV and CoH, I can. The new archtypes are just new classes, and yes they will play differently. I know that from EQ, playing an Iksar was a different experience than playing a Human after Kunark came out. Playing a beastmaster is a whole different thing than playing a Warrior. And Luclin was an entirely new planet, with a new graphics engine.

But that still doesn't make Shadows of Luclin a different game from EQ1. Sure they are giving us a lot with the CoV expansion, but that's why it's $50 instead of the typical expansion price of $30. It's still not a new game. It's an expansion.

[Signe]

Like people have stated, it does feel different as far as the ATs go.  It is absolutely an expansion in my mind, regardless of whether or not you can purchase and play it without CoH.  That's just a bit of glitter to distract you.  Not only that... but it's an expansion that, outside of the ATs and some costume bits, will be available to those only owning CoH eventually.  In that respect, it's just a matter of waiting a while and getting most of the expansion for free or not minding the $50 price tag (well, $35 if you count a free month, still pricey for an expansion) to get it all now, plus the new ATs.  It has been stated on the CoH boards and in some interviews that there are seven zones in CoV, three of which are PvP zones.  I'm sure eventually there will be more zones added, though I haven't seen that stated anywhere yet.  If you don't wish to take part in PvP, is that really enough of an area to warrant buying it as a stand alone game?

Anyway, lets just hope I haven't made up all that shit I just said.

[Llava]

Counting the free months, which we should because expansions generally don't give you a free month, $35 is a pretty damn cheap price for an expansion.  Signe mentioned it's still fairly expensive, but for every expansion I purchased for DAoC I paid $40 or more.

I still consider it an expansion, but I can absolutely see their reasoning in calling it a "new game".  For one, if they keep calling it an expansion then most people will assume you need CoH to play without ever really looking for info on it- lots of people said they'd wait until they could play villains, but probably would not purchase CoV if they assumed they needed CoH to play it.  Secondly, see my above comparison between Werewolf, Vampire, Changeling, etc.  Different games, same basic world, same basic rules.  (It's still an expansion though, because Werewolf Gifts are 100% different from Vampire Disciplines- they don't work the same and they generally don't accomplish the same things.)

[UnSub]

Sure, the NCSoft thing about no extra charge for CoV and CoH is a good thing, but only because I find the idea that I should pay extra for what I consider the same game to be fucking gouging.

Given that all other COH expansions to this point have been free, I'll let them call CoV a separate game. They sure as hell ain't Sony when it comes to ripping money from their customers' wallets..

[tazelbain]

Sure, the NCSoft thing about no extra charge for CoV and CoH is a good thing, but only because I find the idea that I should pay extra for what I consider the same game to be fucking gouging.

Given that all other COH expansions to this point have been free, I'll let them call CoV a separate game. They sure as hell ain't Sony when it comes to ripping money from their customers' wallets..

lol, can you take the CoH fanboi hat off for a bit. The issues weren't expassions.  All the large MMOGs(including Sony) do fix periodic content updates a long with their bug fixes.  Although they have done well with zones striga, its hardly an expansion.  In fact its part of the the reason the monthly fee exist.  I think players don't get enough content given the amount of money they shell out.

[Cheddar]

COH raised the bar when it comes to content.  Any other argument or comparison is futile.   

[Signe]

  has pissed me off enough to cancel everything... AGAIN.  Well, I will if this fucking  actually makes it through.  I'm tired of respeccing my char and having to figure out how to play it so often. 

Cryptic can kiss my ass.   

[Cheddar]

has pissed me off enough to cancel everything... AGAIN.  Well, I will if this fucking  actually makes it through.  I'm tired of respeccing my char and having to figure out how to play it so often. 

Cryptic can kiss my ass.   

SOMEONE GET HER SOME MARIJUANA STAT!

You can always join us on WoW.  Actually a relatively decent cross section of F13. 

[Signe]

I beta tested WoW and then I played for a couple of months or so.  I didn't like it.

[Cheddar]

I beta tested WoW and then I played for a couple of months or so.  I didn't like it.

It's not about the game, its about the community.  You do want to be cool don't you?

[Signe]

It's much cooler not to play any games and just smirk at people who do... because it's really, REALLY cool not to do anything at all.  I like to scoff at people who do stuff.

[Llava]

I'm willing to try  before I condemn it, but I think it's a bad idea.  (The NDA on this particular issue will mostly likely be dropped fairly soon, so don't worry- they're not sneaking something catastrophic in through the CoV box.)

Regarding content updates:
To my knowledge, no other game has provided an entirely new class free with an update.  (I consider Kheldians one archetype, while Warshades and Peacebringers are more like different powersets in that AT)

[Typhon]

  isn't coming from a bad place, but the details of the implementation look 

that they have put so much effort into it, and it doesn't have any give with the take, is depressing

[Signe]

Well, they're really going to have to drop the NDA by the 14th, aren't they?  That's the Fileplanet weekend.  Seems useless to have a bajillion Fileplanet subscribers and expect them not to blab about what they see, innit?

As for trying  before making a decision... I'm sorry, but I don't have to be a rocket scientist to see exactly where this lands me.  Unless they decide to nerf their nerfs, it's a bad thing for most of my characters in CoH... and I don't think they'll back off this one, to be honest.  After all, besides wee things like the sonic fixes, when have they ever decided to circumvent the test server before? 

[Signe]

It's been posted on the CoH board now. 

uh oh.

[Signe]

Here it is:

(Note from Cuppa - this is from the Devs - keep it civil in here, stick to the facts, do not personally insult any devs or other players or call people names. Focus on the system, not the people or their opinions)

I wanted to give you all a little heads up on something that we've had in the works since March of this year that is finally seeing the light of day soon.

Your questions and comments will help refine the patch notes so that we can make this new system as clear as possible for all players.

As always, we ask that you play and test the changes before crying "DOOOM".

Without further ado...

Enhancement Diversification:

This is a new system being implemented into City of Villains and City of Heroes (when City of Villains launches) to promote the use of more different types of Enhancements in powers. Using a system of diminishing returns, when slotting the same type of Enhancement into a power, you will begin to see less effect of that Enhancement when the bonus reaches a certain threshold. The effectiveness of Enhancements you are slotting in can now be seen in the Enhancement Slotting screen.

What does this mean? Simply, if you are slotting Enhancements and your bonus to a single attribute reaches 70% through Enhancements, you will begin to see a drop in the amount each Enhancement should be giving you. If you exceed 100% bonus, then the drop will be more severe. We have added to the Enhancement Slotting screen a display of how much bonus you are getting from your Enhancements. When you are adding in Enhancements that will be reduced in effectiveness you will be able to tell.

Note that this only affects Enhancements of the same bonus. So you can have a Damage bonus of 66.66%, and an Accuracy bonus of 66.66% (from 2 SO Damage and 2 SO Accuracy Enhancements) and you will not be affected in any way. Adding in another SO Damage Enhancement will not give you a 99% bonus, but a 94% bonus, because the damage bonus now exceeds 70%.

A good rule of thumb is “2 Single Origins Enhancements = No Reduction. 3 SO’s = Slight Reduction. 4 SO’s = Moderate Reduction. 5 or 6 SO’s = Major Reduction”

What if I don’t have more than 2 SO’s of any one type in my powers already? Then you have nothing to worry about, your character will function exactly as they did previous to this feature being added.

Does this affect Dual Origin Enhancements at all? Yes. If you have 5 DO’s of all the same type you would normally get an 83% bonus. Because of Enhancement Diversification your bonus will actually only get an 82% bonus. If you have 6 DO’s of all the same type, instead of a 100% bonus you will have a bonus of 95%.

Are Hamidon Enhancements affected? Yes. The bonuses that a Hamidon Enhancement gives you that exceed 70% will be reduced. Because of this change, Hamidon (and other dual-purpose) Enhancements are now combinable. You can only combine dual-purpose Enhancements that affect ALL the same bonuses (so you can combine Damage/Accuracy with another Damage/Accuracy, but not with a Damage/Endurance Reduction).

This totally cripples my character! I thought you were done balancing the game? All the Issue 4 and 5 balance adjustments were done with this system in place internally here at Cryptic. All playtests, QA checks, difficulty adjustments and balances have been done with Enhancement Diversification in mind since March 2005.

What if a power only takes one type of Enhancement to begin with? You have a couple of choices. You can respec the character and only go so far as putting a couple slots into the power, or you can go with more slots and eke out a little more effectiveness out of the Enhancements.

How can I tell when I am not getting full effectiveness out of an Enhancement? On the Enhancement Slotting Screen you will now see what bonuses Enhancements are giving you. This will help you make the choice as to what Enhancements to slot over what.

Does it matter what order I slot Enhancements in? No. The reduction in effectiveness is calculated off the total bonus you are receiving, so it does not matter what order you slotted the Enhancements in.

How is combining Enhancements affected by this? Enhancements that are higher level than you give you a bonus above normal Enhancements, if you combine Enhancements to get a higher bonus, this may put you over the point at which a reduction in effectiveness takes place.

Some Enhancements give me a 33.33%/16.66%/8.35% bonus, and others give me a different bonus, how are these affected by Enhancement Diversification? There are four categories of Enhancements, Schedule A, Schedule B, Schedule C, and Schedule D. The majority of Enhancements fall into the Schedule A category. This means that an even-level Training Origin Enhancement gives an 8.35% bonus, an even-level Dual Origin Enhancement gives me a 16.66% bonus, and an even-level Single Origin Enhancement gives a 33.33% bonus. All of the examples above assume using Schedule A Enhancements, since these are the most common.

Schedule B Enhancements are things Defense Buff, Damage Resistance, Range Increase and To Hit Buff. These have a smaller bonus because a small shift in these values has a larger impact on gameplay. With these Enhancements a Training Origin Enhancement gives a 5% bonus, a Dual Origin Enhancement gives a 10% bonus, and a Single Origin Enhancement gives a 20% bonus. Enhancement Diversification for these bonuses kicks in at 40% with a severe drop at 60%.

What Enhancement Types are what bonuses (schedules)?
Schedule A Enhancements (33.33%, 16.66%, 8.35%) are:
Accuracy, Confuse, Damage, Defense DeBuff, Drain Endurance, Endurance Discount, Fear, Fly, Heal, Hold, Immobilize, Intangible, Jump, Recharge, Recovery, Run, Sleep, Snare, Stun, Taunt, To Hit Debuff
These bonus types start to see reduction when the bonus is 70% or more, and a severe reduction at 100% bonus or greater.

Schedule B Enhancements (20%, 10%, 5%) are:
Range, Defense Buff, Resist Damage, To Hit Buff
These bonus types start to see reduction when the bonus is 40% or more, and a severe reduction at 60% bonus or greater.

Schedule C Enhancements (40%, 20%, 10%) are:
Interrupt
This bonus type starts to see reduction when the bonus is 80% or more, and a severe reduction at 120% bonus or greater.

Schedule D Enhancements (60%, 30%, 15%) are:
Knockback
This bonus type starts to see reduction when the bonus is 120% or more, and a severe reduction at 180% bonus or greater

[Llava]

See, the reason I'm willing to try it first, is because this means the following for my characters, some good mostly bad:
Permanent Hasten is gone (bad)
Uber Stamina is gone (bad)
Attacks will deal less damage (bad)
Attacks will recycle slower because Hasten is gone, even with recharge enhancements (bad-ish)
Suddenly, it's not redundant to have more than 3 or 4 attacks (good)
Since I will be buying more attacks, I will have a greater choice of which attack to use for which situation, according to their secondary effects (good)
However, a lot of these supplementary attacks weren't taken not just because it would be redundant, but because they just aren't that good either in damage, effect, or animation (bad)

THIS WILL REQUIRE A MASSIVE REBALANCING OF THE GAME.

There are a number of things they did wrong here.
First, they've been nerfing powers since the dawn of time with things like permanent hasten in mind- example, Accelerated Metabolism's recharge time, nerfed a few weeks after release because combined with permanent Hasten you could always have it up with little/no slotting.
Second, they're slowly peeling off the band-aid.  This should have been in Issue 5.  The freakout would've been about the same magnitude it was for i5 already.  Now players are getting the sense that they're being tag-team nerfed.  What's after this, a Global Damage Reduction?

I don't know how Blasters are going to survive this, since they rely on fast damage to kill things before dying.
I don't know how human-specialist Warshades are going to survive this, since Hasten is the only thing making them work.
I don't know how Super Reflexes Scrappers and Ice Tankers are going to survive this, since their defenses are already hurting and are now worse.
I don't know how Controllers are going to deal with this, since their most powerful effects already have an extremely long recharge even with Hasten.

I think this will make the game less fun.  It will slow down combat, it will cause more frequent losses further slowing down the already slow grind, and it will overall promote a different cookie-cutter build that is considered "optimized" instead of providing any real diversity.  If the devs think that people aren't going to just start slotting attacks with 1 accuracy, 3 damage, 1 recharge and 1 endurance reduction, or whatever else people consider optimized for attacks, they're fooling themselves.

But I'm willing to try it first.  This is all conjecture.  It's conjecture I absolutely expect will be accurate, but still conjecture.  I hope they are expecting to be flexible about this.  If it turns out that players really do not like it, even if Positron and Statesman remain convinced "No really, it IS a good idea!!" they need to be willing to go back on it.

[Llava]

Ug, nevermind.  I don't think they're listening to feedback about it.  Didn't notice the way it was phrased on that initial message

Your questions and comments will help refine the patch notes so that we can make this new system as clear as possible for all players.

Shitty idea, guys.  Very shitty.  I tried to be positive about it, trying to figure out ways it might make things more fun, and I just can't see anything.  Guess it doesn't matter if you let people test it or not, since it seems like this is already a done deal.  You've decided, and that's it.

So I'll be testing it- to see whether or not I still want to play.

[Signe]

This is what makes me think they are not going to be flexible:

I wanted to give you all a little heads up on something that we've had in the works since March of this year that is finally seeing the light of day soon.

Your questions and comments will help refine the patch notes so that we can make this new system as clear as possible for all players.

Maybe I'm wrong... I hope so.

I also can't see how Statesman had the audacity to spout this bit of rubbish not so long ago:

"First, a big thank you to everyone who played on the Training Room server and helped I5 to be one of our best launches ever! We’re extremely happy about how I5 went live.

Second, we’re still scouring the boards for bugs and other issues, but we’ve finished making large changes to the power sets. . We’ll still be looking at issues as the arise. For instance, there are issues with Defense builds; we’re going to look at that problem more carefully (the Damage Resistance Inspirations are a step, but there's a little more to come). "

[Signe]

Ug, nevermind.  I don't think they're listening to feedback about it.  Didn't notice the way it was phrased on that initial message

Your questions and comments will help refine the patch notes so that we can make this new system as clear as possible for all players.

Shitty idea, guys.  Very shitty.  I tried to be positive about it, trying to figure out ways it might make things more fun, and I just can't see anything.  Guess it doesn't matter if you let people test it or not, since it seems like this is already a done deal.  You've decided, and that's it.

So I'll be testing it- to see whether or not I still want to play.

I forgive you.

PS  If I hadn't of wandered off to feed Righ, I would have been able to post that quote before you gave up the fight.  Dammit.  That Righ and his eating!

[CmdrSlack]

This is what makes me think they are not going to be flexible:

I wanted to give you all a little heads up on something that we've had in the works since March of this year that is finally seeing the light of day soon.

Your questions and comments will help refine the patch notes so that we can make this new system as clear as possible for all players.

Maybe I'm wrong... I hope so.

I also can't see how Statesman had the audacity to spout this bit of rubbish not so long ago:

"First, a big thank you to everyone who played on the Training Room server and helped I5 to be one of our best launches ever! We’re extremely happy about how I5 went live.

Second, we’re still scouring the boards for bugs and other issues, but we’ve finished making large changes to the power sets. . We’ll still be looking at issues as the arise. For instance, there are issues with Defense builds; we’re going to look at that problem more carefully (the Damage Resistance Inspirations are a step, but there's a little more to come). "

I guess you could spin the green part to mean, "Well, we finished all of the large changes to the power sets, individually.  This is more of a game-wide large change than a large change to an individual power set."

Guess I need to spend more time in the beta test to see what this really does.

[Typhon]

I feel (sickeningly) sure that they are going to say, "We didn't change the powersets, we changed the way enhancements work.  See?  We didn't lie."

At which point the old-timer playerbase will completely implode.  Maybe they think that the turnover with the move to PvP will more then completely replace the old playerbase... who knows?  Not me.

It's been so long since they talked about adding anything that I gave a damn about that I don't know why I still play (course, that's not very often at this point).

[Trippy]

Bloody Hell. I just used up one of my respecs last night too. Oh well at least I'll get to enjoy my new 6-slotted Hover for a week and a half or so before I go on vacation.

[Big Gulp]

Maybe they think that the turnover with the move to PvP will more then completely replace the old playerbase... who knows?  Not me.

Ooohh!!!  I do!  I do!

They won't attract jack with PvP, because:

A) PvP as it currently stands is quite unpopular.  The arenas are ghost towns in large measure because PvP fights just aren't that fun in this game.

and

B) Anyone interested in a PvP game is already playing WoW.


It galls me, because the game was once fun.  Sure it was shallow, but it was fun, dammit.  They now seem to be intent on sodomizing their loyal fans with nerfs to the only thing that was appealing about the game; non-stop villain stomping fun.  Now they're also releasing an expansion where you're a villain in name only with completely rehashed powers from the first game.  

Here's a hint for you guys; I don't want to play through the same fucking game I've already played, only this time with "Dark" in front of my character's name.  I, and judging from the CoH boards, wanted NEW POWERS.  From what Statesman's said, apparently putting in new powers (or even getting off your lazy asses and changing the effects for pre-existing powers) is hard.  To that I say "tough shit".  I don't care how the sausage is made, bitch, I just know that I want it a certain way and if you can't deliver it then I'll find another company who can.

These people are completely out of touch with what their playerbase has been clamoring about for over a year now.  They deserve to fall down with this game.

[schild]

The enhancement change, as I told Signe before, is as devastating to the game as ToA or Trammel. It's a truly terrible idea.

[Alkiera]

I wanted to give you all a little heads up on something that we've had in the works since March of this year that is finally seeing the light of day soon.

Your questions and comments will help refine the patch notes so that we can make this new system as clear as possible for all players.

Someone on the CoH forums wrote:

"Patch Notes 10/08/05:

- Implemented yet another change to the way character builds function and instituted another free respec.

- Removed all enemies from the game and changed the title to City of Respecification. Fighting enemies was clearly less fun than getting free respecs.

- Gameplay will now consist of trying to guess which power/enhancement/tactic might stay unchanged in next week's patch."

I was amused enough to copy/paste.

Alkiera

[SurfD]

Im not a number cruncher, but how exactly does this REALLY effect things?  Can someone give me some concrete examples?

For example, my energy blaster has most of his main attacks slotted 5 SO Damage, 1 SO Accuracy. 
Exactly how much of a damage nerf is that going to result in? 

What if i then Switch to 4 SO Damage, 1 SO Accuracy, 1 SO -End Cost?

I am also a little unclear on the special stuff.  For example, If i have 4 SO Damage, 1 Hamidon Damage/-endcost/accuracy and 1SO Accuracy, does the Hammidon one damage component recieve deminishing returns on top of the 4 SO damage, or does it only recive deminishing returns if I grab multiple Hamidon enhancements?

Personally, I think this isnt as bad as most people think, and is mostly an attempt to again improve the advantage of having a Deffender/Controller or other buffer class in your party.   It looks like what they are trying to do is lower the players ability to max their +damage/accuracy etc etc cap without the assistance of a buffing class.