Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
September 25, 2017, 01:11:53 AM

Login with username, password and session length

Search:     Advanced search
Donate! | Subscribe! | Shop: Amazon

***DONATION DRIVE 2 HAS BEGUN:
CLICK HERE TO BURN MONEY***
*
Home Help Search Login Register
f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  General Discussion  |  Comics  |  Topic: Secret Wars (2015) 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Pages: [1] 2 3 Go Down Print
Author Topic: Secret Wars (2015)  (Read 9047 times)
Velorath
Contributor
Posts: 7811


on: May 06, 2015, 07:41:22 PM

(The old Secret Wars thread was somehow already a mess despite only having seven posts, between the spam bot and Whedon thing in the title).

Secret Wars #1 dropped today and #0 was available for Free Comic Book Day this last Saturday. That scheduling in and of itself is worth discussing for a moment. Having read both, #1 continues directly from the events in the final issues of Avengers and New Avengers with zero attempt at a recap for people jumping in without reading any of the buildup. #0 has about a good a recap as you can expect for Hickman's kitchen sink approach to storytelling. It doesn't mention the convoluted Doom/Molecule Man/Beyonders stuff at all, which is probably for the best because they had already devoted the entirety of New Avengers #33 to that plot thread and the result is a case study in how far Hickman can get up his own ass.

My issue with the scheduling is that without any sort of recap in #1, #0 is helpful for people jumping in with Secret Wars #1 without reading the preceding Avengers books. However from my admittedly limited searching, #0 doesn't seem to be available digitally, meaning people actually had to physically go to a comic book shop (online retailers were likely giving FCBD stuff away with orders also) to get a copy on Saturday, and then go back again a few days later to get #1 (or buy that digitally at least). There are any number of ways around the inconvenience I suppose, but it seems like a missed opportunity to not offer #0 for free online.

As far as my thoughts on #1 go, it wasn't horrible and it accomplishes what it needed to with the destruction of the MU and the Ultimate Universe. Most of it is taken up with a battle scene with forces from the two universes fighting each other, but the story doesn't even make a pretense of the outcome mattering. Also having not read much of Hickman's stuff, I had to look up Manifold because he becomes important to the plot at one point, only to find that Hickman at some point decided to make a character that is just a younger and more powerful version of Gateway (but it's totally not just ripping off old ideas because Gateway trained this guy so it's like a legacy character and not Hickman just creating new characters for the sake of it).

Actually, the more that I think about it this issue kinda sucked, from the random Punisher appearance to Cyclops (with the Phoenix Force back in him) and his monologue to nobody in particular that starts with "Listen to me... you can't kill an idea." which has absolutely no connection to anything that's going on in the story at the moment. When I say it's not horrible, I guess that's because the situation in the last few pages makes for a decent setup for what is to follow even though the rest of the issue felt like pointless filler, which is bad considering this is only the first issue and it already feels like there's a lot of padding. Also, if you're going to close out both these Universes with a big fight scene, the one we got here was incredibly underwhelming and failed to capture any real sense of  the scale involved beyond "here are a couple panels of giant ships".

Anyhow, I'm only really following this event because I'm interested in some of the odd books they've got coming out during it.
Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8294


Reply #1 on: May 06, 2015, 08:02:25 PM

Did they ever explain the Ark and where it was supposed to go after all the universes went poof.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Velorath
Contributor
Posts: 7811


Reply #2 on: May 06, 2015, 08:21:56 PM

From the stuff I've read, I haven't seen any explanation as to what they're expecting to exist after everything collapses, but the ship itself is a large focus of both #0 and #1.
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #3 on: May 06, 2015, 10:33:59 PM

In long form, the New Avengers story that lead to it is actually kind of compelling. This I'm not so sure of.
CmdrSlack
Contributor
Posts: 4388


WWW
Reply #4 on: May 06, 2015, 10:48:42 PM

Just finished reading this. It was a shit follow up to what I'd read before it: Guardians Team Up with Rocket and Cosmo and Groot with the Pet Avengers.

No on to Tails of the Unbeatable Squirrel Girl. It will most assuredly be more fun.

I traded in my fun blog for several legal blogs. Or, "blawgs," as the cutesy attorney blawgosphere likes to call 'em.
Teleku
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8972

http://tinyurl.com/d89qk7g


Reply #5 on: May 10, 2015, 01:48:18 PM

I still can't get my head around this.  Why did they feel the need to merge the universes?  Seems like only bad things can come from this, and I'm not sure how they are going to explain everything.  Are they really going to replace spider man with miles morales?  Wtf is going to happen to actual Spider-Man, just write him out of existance?

What exactly is suppose to exist after all this?

Just seems like another silly event where they are going to have to retron everything back within a few years.

"My great-grandfather did not travel across four thousand miles of the Atlantic Ocean to see this nation overrun by immigrants.  He did it because he killed a man back in Ireland. That's the rumor."
-Stephen Colbert
HaemishM
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 37872

Prevent all damage that would be dealt to you and other troops you control.


WWW
Reply #6 on: May 10, 2015, 02:02:05 PM

Well, since it's apparently the brainchild of Johnathan Hickman and the end result of all the shit he's been writing on Avengers the last few years, they had to do something big. I'm still about 6-7 months behind because of reading on Marvel Unlimited, but damn if the whole New Avengers/Illuminati incursion shit isn't basically requiring they reboot the entire Avengers/Fantastic Four line because of how far afield of baseline Marvel reality they are going.

Velorath
Contributor
Posts: 7811


Reply #7 on: May 10, 2015, 03:59:04 PM

I still can't get my head around this.  Why did they feel the need to merge the universes?  Seems like only bad things can come from this, and I'm not sure how they are going to explain everything.  Are they really going to replace spider man with miles morales?  Wtf is going to happen to actual Spider-Man, just write him out of existance?

What exactly is suppose to exist after all this?

Just seems like another silly event where they are going to have to retron everything back within a few years.

They aren't going to write Peter Parker out of existence. Solicitations for Amazing Spider-man: Renew Your Vows #1 show Peter on the cover with MJ and a daughter. What they'd probably like us to believe is that maybe they'll set Miles up as the active Spider-man and One More Day and the baby stuff from the Clone Saga will be undone allowing Peter to settle down with a family and probably act as a mentor to Miles. That seems like the obvious speculation though and I'm guessing whatever happens won't be that clean cut.

The event itself is very much modeled on Age of Apocalypse, in that you've got most of the books being temporarily replaced by alternate reality stuff. A lot of the books they have planned during the event look like a lot of fun. I'm guessing what ends up coming out of it looks a lot like the regular MU with a few things pulled in from other Universes.
Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8294


Reply #8 on: May 10, 2015, 04:23:22 PM

The entire event is just a big excuse to make a bunch of 'What if' books and to save a handful of character from the Ultimate's universe, as that is going away due to poor sales or whatever. It's really not any more complicated then that. They'll smooth over some characters that were excessively convoluted and contradictory, bring in some alt versions that garner popularity and then return to a recognizable status quo.

Almost all of the in story reasoning is basically entirely bullshit straight out of their collective asses. It's the inevitable outcome of in-house writers trying to 'one up' each other in terms of scope and scale.

-I'll Destroy the City!
-I'll Destroy the Earth!
-I'll Destroy the Galaxy!
-I'll Destroy the UNIVERSE!!
-I'll Destroy ALL THE UNIVERSES!!!!

And all of it at the expense of proper characterization, so it's all  Ohhhhh, I see. why so serious? swamp poop

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Teleku
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8972

http://tinyurl.com/d89qk7g


Reply #9 on: May 10, 2015, 05:09:57 PM

Ah, ok.  I was given the impression this was like DC's crisis, where they finally decided to reset everything and start from scratch (sort off), destroying all realities and creating one new one.

If it's them just killing off the abomination the Ultimate Universe has become and trying to salvage some of the characters they made in it (I have a nasty feeling Samual L Jackson will make his way to the main world for obvious reasons), then fine.  Though I'm an old stubborn asshole and still think Miles Morales is bullshit.   awesome, for real

"My great-grandfather did not travel across four thousand miles of the Atlantic Ocean to see this nation overrun by immigrants.  He did it because he killed a man back in Ireland. That's the rumor."
-Stephen Colbert
HaemishM
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 37872

Prevent all damage that would be dealt to you and other troops you control.


WWW
Reply #10 on: May 10, 2015, 06:23:15 PM

Sam Jackson's Nick Fury is already in the 616 Marvel Universe as the formerly hidden bastard son of the real Nick Fury, and Phil Coulsen is his main buddy.

Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8294


Reply #11 on: May 11, 2015, 12:37:32 AM

Ah, ok.  I was given the impression this was like DC's crisis, where they finally decided to reset everything and start from scratch (sort off), destroying all realities and creating one new one.

If it's them just killing off the abomination the Ultimate Universe has become and trying to salvage some of the characters they made in it (I have a nasty feeling Samual L Jackson will make his way to the main world for obvious reasons), then fine.  Though I'm an old stubborn asshole and still think Miles Morales is bullshit.   awesome, for real


They COULD do that in theory, but it looks more like a streamlining or whatever. Just a big thing to let writers and editors 'fix' things with one big blanket excuse, instead of making 5000 individual deals with the devil or whatever.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Velorath
Contributor
Posts: 7811


Reply #12 on: May 14, 2015, 12:14:20 AM

Issue #2 is out today, and as many people suspected would have made for a much better first issue of the series than what we got. At the start of this issue Battleworld is in full swing, and we get introduced to a small chunk of it via the Thors who act as the police force for much of Battleworld, as well as a couple other scenes that hint as to how this world was created. If not for the hype in the buildup to this event or the fact that the 616 universe was "destroyed" this would feel just like any other alternate reality story Marvel has done like House of M or Age of Apocalypse.

For this issue at least Hickman has seemed to reign in some of his more annoying habits, like making things needlessly complicated or creating as many new characters as he can. Less surprising is that Esad Ribic's art continues to be strong. He's firmly in his element in this issue given his time spent on Thor: God of Thunder. With Battleworld established I expect this series to rapidly descend back into incoherent Hickman storytelling, but we start getting the tie-in books next week, a few of which I'm interested in checking out.
Velorath
Contributor
Posts: 7811


Reply #13 on: May 21, 2015, 06:49:00 AM

Read through the first issues of A-Force, Master of Kung Fu, Planet Hulk, Spider-verse, and Secret Wars: Battleworld. Skipped over Ultimate End and the Deadpool book. Battleworld is a bit of a throwaway book with a couple of random, albeit slightly entertaining stories. To it's credit, the M.O.D.O.K. story that makes up the second half of the issue has the baby M.O.D.O.K. from Nextwave in it which is a bit of a plus. The first story is an odd one about a Dr. Strange possessed Punisher fighting a slightly demonic version of the "New" FF (Hulk, Spider-man, Wolverine, and Ghost Rider). The other books are surprisingly solid.

Spider-verse of course benefits from following the recent storyline in the Spider-man books, although at the outset of this book none of the characters remember any of that or each other. In fact, their memories are a bit hazy in general (as are their spider-senses) and Spider Gwen in particular is a tad fuzzy on how she's around even though Gwen Stacy has clearly been killed by the Green Goblin. Overall not a bad read although it's a little odd that neither Slott nor Spider Gwen writer Jason Latour are writing this.

The remaining three books are much more self-contained. Due to the nature of the comic book industry and the fact that retailers (and by extension customers pre-ordering books) have to put their orders in three months in advance and need to have at least some sliver of information as to what they should buy, Marvel has already slowly been letting information out about post-Secret Wars books. In particular, they stated that A-Force, as well as Squadron Sinister, and Weirdworld, would continue on in some fashion past the end of Secret Wars. A-Force as it stands in this first issue is an all female team made up of seemingly dozens of members and led by She-Hulk. There's not a whole lot of back-story here yet as a good chunk of the issue involves an action sequence which leads to one of the members accidentally breaking one of Doom's main rules of Battleworld. The rest of the issue deals with the ramifications of that. Decent start so far even though they haven't established the premise of why the team is all female.

Master of Kung Fu is a solid martial arts story. Haden Blackman is an odd choice of writers for Marvel as he apparently spent a long time writing Star Wars comics for Dark Horse as well as doing writing on a lot of SW video games including Galaxies and Force Unleashed (he also wrote a lot of issues of Batwoman for DC). Nothing too surprising in this issue, but if you want to read a Marvel martial arts book featuring alternate universe versions of people like Shang-Chi, Iron Fist, Fu Manchu, and... Callisto and Caliban for some reason, this will certainly do.

Planet Hulk features a Gladiator Steve Rogers, with his fighting partner Devil Dinosaur getting sent off by Doom to a land populated by Hulks. That should tell you whether or not you want to read this.
CmdrSlack
Contributor
Posts: 4388


WWW
Reply #14 on: May 21, 2015, 08:51:19 PM

Fuck. Forgot to get A Force yesterday. But I spent almost $100 on old Daredevil comics (like back when they were 12 cents) that were in pretty good condition (like 12-18 bucks each). Hopefully they're not out of it on Saturday.

I traded in my fun blog for several legal blogs. Or, "blawgs," as the cutesy attorney blawgosphere likes to call 'em.
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #15 on: July 21, 2015, 11:10:41 AM

Well, holy shit, a big company crossover thing that's actually good. Like, really good. The first issue of the main crossover book stunk, but since then it's been flying high. Most of the associated books are also really fun.

It's also changing my view of Hickman's FF and Avengers work. He really does seem to have been building up to this.

I think this is the first time I've felt invested in a comic-book event since DC One Million.
jgsugden
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2798


Reply #16 on: July 27, 2015, 05:56:30 PM

I am shocked to see positive reviews of this event.  It sounds like a trainwreck - sort of like taking one bite of your 50 favorite meals and gluing them together.  It just boggles my mind that this could actually work.  I have not bought a comic book from Marvel or DC for a few decades... but you're making me curious.   

I miss Good Eats.  *Sniff*
Velorath
Contributor
Posts: 7811


Reply #17 on: September 09, 2015, 06:40:52 PM

A lot of the minis are wrapping up, with a few not finishing up until October, and the post-Secret Wars relaunches begin to roll out next month as well. Due to delays as well as being extended by one issue however, the main Secret Wars book won't be wrapping up until December. I'm not particularly worried about spoilers since due to the nature of the industry we've had a flood of information for months about the post-SW MU and the relaunched books are supposed to take places months after the end of SW. These delays and lack of planning aren't particularly surprising in any way, but it once again highlights the lack of professionalism in how the industry is run.
Raguel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1109


Reply #18 on: September 14, 2015, 12:42:56 PM

I am shocked to see positive reviews of this event.  It sounds like a trainwreck - sort of like taking one bite of your 50 favorite meals and gluing them together.  It just boggles my mind that this could actually work.  I have not bought a comic book from Marvel or DC for a few decades... but you're making me curious.   



If it makes you feel better I think it stinks. Hickman has a child's understanding of infinity, the only characters he writes consistently well are Richards and Doom, his portrayal  of Steve Rogers and Thanos feels me with murderous rage, he shows the least interesting bits of the story and "tells" the most interesting parts in flashbacks
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #19 on: September 14, 2015, 02:39:59 PM

Steve Rogers isn't even in Secret Wars as his "true" Marvel self, though. He's a bunch of echoes spread across Battleworld. Thanos is both himself and various "echoes", but the real Thanos has only just shown up in the main book. (Though he looks to be playing a crucial role in the upcoming, delayed #6).  I don't think Hickman has actually written Rogers since the event began, just in the books that preceded it. (There, I agree with you: in the pre-SW books that I'm catching up on now via Marvel Unlimited, Marvel can't seem to decide if Steve is a tough-minded pragmatist who will make hard but fair and moral decisions or a crazy idealist. Hickman in particular wrote Rogers almost as a guy with an almost-unhinged obsession with the Illuminati, reminding me a bit of Batman after the reveals of Identity Crisis over at DC.)

Thanos seems fine to me in the Cabal subplot before Secret Wars--there's one or two lines of dialogue that make very clear that he's biding his time, waiting for the chance to extinguish the multiverse and give Death her final gift. Since the members of the Cabal that just think they're ruthlessly preserving their prime reality (Namor, the Black Swan, and maybe Maximus and Terrax) wouldn't approve of killing all of reality, Thanos isn't about to say so.
Raguel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1109


Reply #20 on: September 14, 2015, 04:29:23 PM

Thanos seems fine to me in the Cabal subplot before Secret Wars--there's one or two lines of dialogue that make very clear that he's biding his time, waiting for the chance to extinguish the multiverse and give Death her final gift. Since the members of the Cabal that just think they're ruthlessly preserving their prime reality (Namor, the Black Swan, and maybe Maximus and Terrax) wouldn't approve of killing all of reality, Thanos isn't about to say so.

I concede the CA point,I'm  just going to hold it against Hickman forever.

As far as Thanos goes Hickman is way off base. Thanos isn't giving Death anything she wasn't going to get, and from someone else to boot. Up to the issue I stopped reading Thanos was content  playing  the pawn in a game he didn't even understand. Thanos should have been looking at the big picture just like Doom was.
HaemishM
Staff Emeritus
Posts: 37872

Prevent all damage that would be dealt to you and other troops you control.


WWW
Reply #21 on: September 14, 2015, 04:42:59 PM

To be fair, Thanos should have never been a part of the Cabal in the first place unless he'd been the one forming it. He doesn't play second bannana to anyone especially not a traitorous former Avenger. Of course, the idea of Namor forming the Cabal in the first place was even more idiotic.

Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #22 on: September 14, 2015, 06:57:16 PM

Thanos got returned to being a (somewhat motiveless) big bad for the Infinity series largely because the MCU is trying to sell him on the need. I don't think he's had any meaningful motive since they moved him back into the Big Bad slot after he "died" in the Cancerverse. I don't think they've even tried to give him a motive. We'll see what happens in next week's Secret Wars.

I liked the Namor and Black Panther hate each other subplotting but I agree that Namor forming the Cabal was kind of dumb. But I don't think it's at all inconsistent to have Thanos act like a second banana. Nobody who knows the character would say that, in fact. He's not at all the egomaniac that Doom is, or perhaps more to the point, is only that way *after* he gains ultimate power and self-sabotages. One of his most striking early appearances involved pretending to be Adam Warlock's friend and partner so he could siphon Warlock's soul gem. More recently, he served as second banana to Annihilus for reasons that are still somewhat unclear. For a giant purple-faced monster with god-like power, he has a long history of being a subtle schemer and strategically humbling himself when it suits his agenda.
Raguel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1109


Reply #23 on: September 14, 2015, 09:30:55 PM

When he plays second banana it's usually because he has an ulterior motive. For example Death told him to study Annihilus because he was allegedly a better servant to Death. When Thanos discovers Anni's true plans he's outraged (imo out of jealousy, which is why I hate Hickman's version who is all too happy letting someone else get Death hot and bothered) and immediately turns on him. I'm not sure which  Magus story you're referring to but iirc in the original the Magus is Thanos' opposite (the avatar of life) but he was more powerful than Thanos, so Thanos tricks Adam into destroying the Magus). In the latest Thanos comics, including the one before Annihilation, it's been established that Thanos respects Adam and thinks of him as a friend.

Thanks also has moments when he plays the hero because he's nuts.

Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #24 on: September 14, 2015, 10:04:36 PM

Um, I am remembering a really different Annihilation apparently, where Thanos is still working with Annihilius when Drax bursts in and kills him. Didn't all the Death-told-him come later? And didn't we have (imho, much better) characterization work in Giffen's earlier story where Death meets Thanos at the Kyln and tells him, "Stop trying to kill everything you want to love me, death is something I get anyway."

Thanos allied himself to Warlock in one of his earliest appearances (basically his post-Cosmic Cube story arc) and did so partly out of fear of the Magus--but he says himself that Warlock is as much a champion of life as his alter ego might be.

This is the problem with the character--he's all over the fucking map, has almost no consistent characterization or motives, and every time someone makes some headway in trying to develop him, Jim Starlin comes in and says , "Everytihng everybody else did with my precious character is a lie" without doing anything else himself beyond returning him to where he started. So I don't see how I can fault Hickman for not getting him right, considering that there isn't any consistent "right". If "right" is "Demigod in love with Death" that's not in and of itself terribly interesting, and is barely differentiated from his model, Darkseid.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2015, 09:41:34 AM by Khaldun »
Raguel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1109


Reply #25 on: September 14, 2015, 11:05:39 PM

The Kyln story  sort of leads into Annihilation. Starlin started a Thanos series but Giffen finished it. Before Drax kills  him Thanos gets Moondragon to read Annihilus' mind. Thanos is actually in the process of freeing Galactus when Drax shows up. (I remembered all that and can't find my keys or cell  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly? ).

The point I'm trying to make is that the Thanos I know would have beaten Doom to the Beyonders instead of being their bitch.
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #26 on: September 15, 2015, 09:52:10 AM

Again, I'm not so sure. "The End" isn't in continuity, but combine it with the Kyln series, the storyline where Thanos fights Hunger and Annihilation, and I think you could suggest that Thanos is kind of off the "seeking ultimate power" motivation, that he's learned that's not what he's about, even if he's still in love with Death. (This is leaving aside the recent attempt to rationalize his love for Death by suggesting that he might be insane and hallucinating about her.)  In Infinity, he's less about ultimate power, and more about killing any surviving children of his (perhaps because Death has set this as a precondition of their continued connection)--he's bit less cosmic, more unpredictable.

I kind of took this to be why Thanos is skeptical about Doom's claim to godhood in the most recent Secret Wars issue--he think that if Doom really were God, he wouldn't have the same frailities and obsessions any longer. Thanos and Reed Richards can both tell very quickly that Doom is still very much himself and quite mortal in his psychology and outlook (and Dr. Strange pretty much confirms that in the final conversation that he and Doom have). Which would explain a lot about Battleworld, too, and why it's so fragile and vulnerable to subversion--because it depends on Doom and on the Molecule Man, and if Doom loses his concentration or sense of balance, it all falls apart.
jgsugden
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2798


Reply #27 on: September 15, 2015, 12:47:10 PM

So maybe they made such a mess of things before Secret Wars that the crazy crazy in Secret Wars doesn't seem so bad?

I miss Good Eats.  *Sniff*
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #28 on: September 15, 2015, 01:36:49 PM

Well, that's almost what they're celebrating with all the minis: how messy and crazy Marvel's continuity has become over the years. Just before they wipe the slate somewhat clean and try to start again. It looks like they're filching selectively from alternative realities etc. for some of the elements they like best, since (for example) the Logan of the new Marvel Universe is going to be Old Man Logan. Also looks like they're going to be sensible about "who remembers what": I think most of the MU characters will remember at least something of the 616 continuity as it was, just as I think Miles Morales will remember that he originally came from another reality. (I'm being hopeful here: the biggest mistake DC made with Crisis on Infinite Earths was the muddle about who remembered what, and about trying to make everything fit as they kept rebooting. Hawkman is the best/worst example of that.)
Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8294


Reply #29 on: September 15, 2015, 03:03:28 PM

The mainline 'plot' to Secret Wars is still utter shit that throws characterization away to forward the 'story', which is going to leave roughly no one satisfied with it's ending and most folks are going to go 'that's it?'. It's going to be the underwhelming of a century.


The real gems are all the little side books of the various what-if universes. Some are serious, some are goofy as shit, some are in between... but there is at least one book for everyone in this mess.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Raguel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1109


Reply #30 on: September 15, 2015, 06:12:18 PM

I liked the Peter David books and a few others.

@Khakdun I didn't mean to suggest that Thanos (since Annihilation) is interested in gaining power. I'm saying he wouldn't sit back and watch someone else get that power, or destroy the multiverse. Also Infinity was also  by Hickman so that's just more proof Hickman sux. why so serious?
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #31 on: September 15, 2015, 08:48:31 PM

Honestly, I like the main plot to Secret Wars. It's essentially a character piece for all the sturm und drang around it. Doom finally proved it: he's actually better than Reed Richards. He saved reality when Richards could only survive. But what if he has the power to restore what was? Where people wouldn't be dependent upon him  to keep reality intact? What if he had the power to be the kind of God who let people live without needing God to save them? Would he be that great? That much of a man?

The answer, hanging in the balance, very likely, is no. He's proved he's better than another man...but he's not better than All Men (and Women). And that's what you have to be to be God. I think that's where that's going, and I hope Doom is allowed to remember it all as he falls, like Lucifer, back down to being Just Another Man. To have had the chance to prove it--to be better than anyone. No one in your way. And--to have been good enough to save everything but not good enough to be better. You put out the fire, you killed the robber--but you weren't Good. Adds a lot of density to Doom as a character--even if the Fantastic Four don't appear in the new Marvel Universe much. Nothing worse than a man who had a chance, without obstacles, to prove that what he's always believed about himself is true, and fails to prove it.

Mattemeo
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1128


Reply #32 on: October 10, 2015, 03:15:06 PM

The entire event both confuses the everliving shit out of me and leaves me cold equally; however there's a few side-titles I'm interested in that I'm hoping will get collected.

Weirdworld looks amazing; Jason Aaron getting his Robert E. Howard on and Mike Del Mundo in full on Frazetta-mode? Fuck YES. I want this shit OVERSIZED, Marvel.

E is for Extinction - New X-men is one of my all time favourite comics runs and a What If? version of the first arc intruigues me.

A-Force has a character cast and a premise I find really interesting but I don't know how much I'll end up resenting the fact that it's tied to Secret Wars. Good creative team, though.

Either way I have to seriously wonder how or even if they're going to collect some of this stuff together - there's thousands of pages of this shit. I don't think they'll fit it all into one 'Secret Wars Companion' omnibus...

If you party with the Party Prince you get two complimentary after-dinner mints
Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8294


Reply #33 on: October 10, 2015, 07:34:30 PM

They will put each side series into it's own trade collection probably.

They are apparently selling very well.

and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
Khaldun
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8585


Reply #34 on: October 10, 2015, 08:02:37 PM

Weirdworld is very fascinating. I've also liked Siege a lot.

The main storyline continues to be surprisingly compelling and it makes me like Hickman's FF work a lot more retrospectively--I'm actually convinced that he's had this story in mind for 8-10 years. There's a lot of noise and bustle around it, but at its heart, the main arc is:

a) a very intimate exploration of Dr. Doom's entire character arc in Marvel to date, and a revelation of just how lonely he's been all along;
b) a strange but kind of moving celebration of the centrality of the Fantastic Four to Marvel's line even as the series prepares (I think) to sideline them for a good bit

There's also a kind of fun redoing of the first Secret Wars that makes it look better than it actually was--and a kind of sense that maybe this is what all the cosmic-level stuff at Marvel was always about (e.g., that superpowered humans at the end of the day were being groomed by cosmic beings like the Celestials as weapons against the Beyonders, and that this is also what stuff like the Infinity Gauntlet was about--backdoors built for hacking the work of gods).
Pages: [1] 2 3 Go Up Print 
f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  General Discussion  |  Comics  |  Topic: Secret Wars (2015)  
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.10 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC