Crowfall aka Play2Crush aka Shadowbane II aka Nostalgia Online

[Rasix]

Well, as much of a "pie in the sky" dream as a good PVP MMOG is, it's still a less ambitious goal than what Star Citizen is promising. 

SkyNet has less feature creep than Star Citizen.

[WayAbvPar]

He might as well have just come out and said "We aren't Star Citizen."

Which is a good thing of course.

The SC debacle is a cautionary tale that might actually help other crowdfunded projects in the future. Nice of Christ Roberts to take that bullet for us. He is dying for our sins.

[Paelos]

I'm sure many funders will wish he was dead once this all spins into oblivion.

[Draegan]

I played the game last night. Feels much better than the previous version. Lag and latency is way down. Only complaint is combat feedback and controls are very loose.

They are making amazing progress.

[Threash]

I played the game last night. Feels much better than the previous version. Lag and latency is way down. Only complaint is combat feedback and controls are very loose.

They are making amazing progress.

I should be in at some point during this test too, can't wait.

[Rendakor]

I think I'm in too. Will give it a look this weekend.

[WayAbvPar]

Give them good feedback and help shape a good game.  I am done with betas and early access games, but I have a copy of this waiting if/when it ever comes out.

[Threash]

Movement is...weird, but there is a surprisingly fun game here already after 8 months of work.

[Draegan]

All movement is server side. They haven't implemented client based movement yet. Should come either at the end of the 1.1 test or for the next testing group whenever that is.

[Threash]

Well, it's not really "laggy" it's just...weird.

[Falconeer]

The new stage of testing will be about environment destruction, and it's gonna be called.... Siege Perilous. That is a beautiful, nostalgic low blow.

[Falconeer]

Well, it's not really "laggy" it's just...weird.

I agree. The lag is there, but the weird part is that you don't control and move around your character like EVERY other MMORPG out there where the S key in the WASD scheme makes you backpedal. Instead, with S you turn around and run towards the camera. Basically, there is no strafe of any kind in the game at the moment (not even "backward strafing") and you move like you would in a Dark Souls game, minus the ability to lock target. It is not a matter of remapping, these are design decisions.

So yes, while it's less bad than it sounds (because your mouse still aims and rotates the camera very responsively), it is very weird. Seems thought for... a console controller. 

[Draegan]

The control scheme is definitely not good, but I don't think they've really refined it at this point.

[Speedy Cerviche]

So it's like the control setup in a tank game? sorta

[Falconeer]

Well, they listened to "us" and decided to delay the February test of Sieges and Destruction to focus on more combat polishing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQttL0fEY3c

In short, our whining delayed the game 

More seriously, a lot of good feedback might actually end up delivering a good combat system, should the game ever be released.

[Paelos]

Combat is paramount. The more they realize that, the better. It doesn't matter how many things you can destroy if you don't even like playing the combat.

[Threash]

Yeah, they know that and they are making it their main focus which is very good.  On the other hand they seem to be trying to reinvent the wheel here and mostly striking out.  Ideal combat would be Tera, a second acceptable choice would be DCUO, those are the two games they said they were sorta modeling their combat after, but so far it was nowhere close to either.  I know it is super super early but they have a very limited budget and I'm not sure how many delays they can afford.

[Draegan]

Yeah, they know that and they are making it their main focus which is very good.  On the other hand they seem to be trying to reinvent the wheel here and mostly striking out.  Ideal combat would be Tera, a second acceptable choice would be DCUO, those are the two games they said they were sorta modeling their combat after, but so far it was nowhere close to either.  I know it is super super early but they have a very limited budget and I'm not sure how many delays they can afford.

Lead dev said he wants something close to Tera. He was actually a dev for DCUO for combat too.

The combat they rolled out was crap.  You weren't tied to the retical so it felt like a space sim.  There was no velocitybto your attacks. Etc etc.

In their last update video basically claims all the shit i hated about it they are fixing.

[Threash]

Their big reveal finally dropped, it's basically account based leveling i think.

[Rendakor]

Yea pretty much.

Vessels are items that are tradeable, craftable, etc. , with quality/rarity levels. You possess one of them as a character to play as. That determines your stats, and puts a cap on your skills based on your race/class. Your actual skills are all account based, and passively train online or off like EVE.

[Threash]

Seems like a fun system, also it means i get like 100 extra game dollars from my pledge since there are no extra character slots anymore.

[Falconeer]

I think you could say that you skill up level up your account, and then your characters are your EVE ships. Not surprised they call the characters "vessels", which literallymeans both "hollow container" and "large ship or boat". This is trying to cater more and more to the EVE people (but not just them).

[palmer_eldritch]

It sounds like a good system. I hadn't realised the game was so hardcore though - it sounds like in certain circumstances people can loot your vessel, which is pretty much your character class, if they kill you. Presumably the basic vessels will actually be pretty easy to craft (like a basic "tier one" ship in Eve) but there also seem to be some rare vessels or vessels which need rare ingredients to craft.

[Rendakor]

That's only in 0.0 though (Dregs).

[Falconeer]

That's only in 0.0 though (Dregs).

This. You can choose what campaign/servers to play on and change it periodically, so you are never ever forced to go anywhere where you can be looted upon death.

[Teleku]

Wow, this is actually a really cool system.  They did their homework and tried to pick the best parts of other systems out there, rather than trying to stick with the standard WoW MMO path.

[Falconeer]

Relevant additional info:

CROWS AND VESSELS FAQ
 

How does advancement work in Crowfall?

Advancement in Crowfall is slightly different than what you’ve seen in other games. We’ve effectively broken advancement into two parts: physical (represented by attributes such as Strength, Intelligence, etc.) and mental (skill gain, such as concentration or competency with two-handed weapons).

Every player is an immortal, chosen by the gods to participate in an endless war to determine who shall be the King of the Gods. As an immortal, you have the ability to take different forms (or avatar) which provide you different attributes and powers. You retain your memories between these vessels, in the form of retained knowledge (skills).

What is a “vessel” and how does it work?

Vessels are (basically) bodies – corporeal forms that players can inhabit. You possess the body of a fallen hero and use it for as long as you like.  It’s up to you how frequently you want to change vessels – some players will collect them and change often, other players will pick one that they like and play it forever.

Do the players have a spiritual (non-corporeal) form?  How do I appear when I am in between avatars?

You have an immortal form that looks like a ghostly crow in the 3D world. This represents your immortal, eternal spirit.

In technical terms, the crow is really the “account level” version of you (the player). You take this form in the game when you die and remain in that form until you possess your next vessel.

How do you split advancement between the crow and the avatar(s)?

Character power is divided into two distinct parts:

Physical Attributes are dictated by the mortal vessel.  This means that a Minotaur Myrmidon will be much stronger than an Elven Frostweaver who will be much more agile than a Human Knight. The avatar will set base attributes and will encapsulate the combined effects of runestones (archetype, disciplines, talents and traits).

Spiritual Knowledge is comprised of the memories that you accumulate over the course of many lives – which means that they are stored on your crow. Think of this as the residual knowledge that you carry between avatars, such as how to craft a helmet, recite an incantation or wield a blade. The vessel that you choose to possess (your avatar) will determine how much of your residual knowledge you can use at any time.

Notable Functionality:

Each Crowfall account may have one crow (and thus one master skill list).
All skill training happens on the crow.  This means that skill train benefits you across all characters, subject to the skill limitations of each vessel.
Guild memberships happens at the crow (account) level. You can change between avatars without affecting your guild affiliation.
Crows will have a unique name.  Avatars can take names as well, but they are not unique.

[Mandella]

Well crap this is actually looking interesting.

No way I can see it can be played casually though. It's looking like it's going to be one of those, "Live in the world, or just give up" type of games.

Pretty much why I gave up on group PvP -- just can't make that kind of time investment anymore.

[Merusk]

Yep. You're going to find a lot of people coming to that realization, too. Even back in the Shadowbane days I was "casual" and I was sticking 5-8 hours a night into the game.

The quote I had back then was something like, "You don't have to be the best to win open PVP games. You just have to play an hour longer than your opponent."

[tmp]

The quote I had back then was something like, "You don't have to be the best to win open PVP games. You just have to play an hour longer than your opponent."

Or, depending on the system used, "You just have to hold the advantage at the right time (zone)".

[palmer_eldritch]

Is this a game where joining a big guild is going to be a good thing?

Edit: From what I can see on the website it doesn't have factions, which would make it a bit easier to just drop into I think, as you'd just find out what a big group in your faction is up to and go join them. If it's a complete free for all then I guess being in a guild becomes more important?

[Threash]

There are a large amount of different rule sets, some are factions (chaos order and neutral) some are god based (12 different sides) some are guild based and some are free for all.

[palmer_eldritch]

I feel like I'm going to join the hype train

[Merusk]

You're old and don't have the time. Just say no. 

[Tmon]

You're old and don't have the time. Just say no. 

That's what I keep telling myself.  Hopefully it will be subscription based.  If it is ftp or buy the box to play I'll probably get sucked in.