Healthism!!11

[Paelos]

People are smug about fat because fat people have been trying to include themselves under the same victimization headers as other groups with actual unchangeable conditions.

At its core, grossly fat happens because you're lazy and eat like shit. You don't get special treatment for obviously killing yourself in public, and then complaining you are persecuted.

[Malakili]

People are smug about fat because fat people have been trying to include themselves under the same victimization headers as other groups with actual unchangeable conditions.

At its core, grossly fat happens because you're lazy and eat like shit. You don't get special treatment for obviously killing yourself in public, and then complaining you are persecuted.

Or you were born into a family where you never learned to live a healthy lifestyle and now you're just an adult trying to live your life and don't really need random people giving you shit about it. 

The reality is you have no idea why a given person you meet is fat.  Don't be a shit to them.  That might mean you are occasionally nice to someone who is "lazy and eats like shit" - the horror.

[tazelbain]

People are smug about fat because fat people have been trying to include themselves under the same victimization headers as other groups with actual unchangeable conditions.

At its core, grossly fat happens because you're lazy and eat like shit. You don't get special treatment for obviously killing yourself in public, and then complaining you are persecuted.

Make all the rationalizations you want, the root is satisfaction of a desire to feel better than another. Funny how golden rule goes out window in the face of prejudice.

[Paelos]

You know how I know I feel better? I'm not aching to walk up the stairs, or constantly complaining about my back, or a myriad of other health problems.

I don't feel sorry for them. I'm not going to buy into their level of bullshit they can't change or that shit is hard, or the other bullshit excuses that get tossed around in our everybody is a victim society. Fat people aren't victims. It's insulting to people that are actually victims of unchangeable circumstances that meet with real discrimination and prejudice.

That doesn't mean I'm going to poke them with a stick and yell HEY EVERYONE LOOK AT THAT FAT BASTARD! You can treat people the way you want to be treated, and the way I'd want to be treated if I was making excuses about killing myself through food would be for someone to call me on my bullshit.

[Sky]

The problem with fat prejudice is that people are trying to equate it to racial prejudice. But it's actually more of a smoking prejudice, and look at where we are with that. It's impacting your health, which is impacting my medical and insurance bills. You have the 'right' to be obese, but you should then pay for it like a smoker does.

On going to the store: I go at least every other night, it's just part of my routine. Much like time spent in the kitchen can be an enjoyable experience, making the trip to the store into a social thing where I see a lot of people regularly that I otherwise wouldn't because life, is a pretty awesome thing. And I keep in touch with the sales and pricing trends and can stock up and save a shitload of money with little effort. Also develop a relationship with my butcher and produce guy, so they key me into upcoming specials or set aside stuff (last year the produce guy gave me a deal on a full box of honeycrisp what you knew they were going to come up in this thread).

Healthy eating, cooking and sourcing has kind of become seen as a burden, when it's actually a vibrant and enjoyable part of a daily routine. I can only imagine the same people who don't take joy in these things also sleep on old mattresses and wonder why they sleep like shit :)

[Ironwood]

Which is fine if you have the time to do it.

Alas.

[Nebu]

Which is fine if you have the time to do it.

Alas.

The people saying "I don't have time to eat right" or "I don't have time to workout" often have plenty of time for TV and movies.  

Most people have the time.  This isn't the 3rd world.  It's all about making choices.

[Paelos]

Which is fine if you have the time to do it.

Alas.

The people saying "I don't have time to eat right" or "I don't have time to workout" often have plenty of time for TV and movies.  

Most people have the time.  This isn't the 3rd world.  It's all about making choices.

I know exactly what it's like to have limited time. From February to April 15th, my life is basically work and sleep. And yet, I still find time on my one day off a week to make enough food, put it in containers, and have them ready to microwave at the end of the day. It's really not that bad. It absolutely is about choices. It's also cheaper than eating out all the time.

[Ironwood]

Which is fine if you have the time to do it.

Alas.

The people saying "I don't have time to eat right" or "I don't have time to workout" often have plenty of time for TV and movies.  

Most people have the time.  This isn't the 3rd world.  It's all about making choices.

Wait a fucking minute here, I was talking about Sky's idyllic 'go to the local shops and chat to the butcher' bullshit.  I WISH I had time to do that, but by the time I'm home, he's closed.   

Of course, the one time I DID manage to chat to The Butcher, he said 'Ahhh, Fresh Meat' and chased me around with a cleaver.

[DraconianOne]

The problem with fat prejudice is that people are trying to equate it to racial prejudice. But it's actually more of a smoking prejudice, and look at where we are with that. It's impacting your health, which is impacting my medical and insurance bills. You have the 'right' to be obese, but you should then pay for it like a smoker does.

Some interesting stats from the UK health service between 2011-2012:

No of people admitted to hospital between an obesity related condition: 11,570
No of people treated in hospital with a sports related injury: 388,500

[Nebu]

Some interesting stats from the UK health service between 2011-2012:

No of people admitted to hospital between an obesity related condition: 11,570
No of people treated in hospital with a sports related injury: 388,500

FITNESS KILLS!!! 

[Malakili]

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/79/1/6.full

Many health disparities in the United States are linked to inequalities in education and income. This review focuses on the relation between obesity and diet quality, dietary energy density, and energy costs. Evidence is provided to support the following points. First, the highest rates of obesity occur among population groups with the highest poverty rates and the least education. Second, there is an inverse relation between energy density (MJ/kg) and energy cost ($/MJ), such that energy-dense foods composed of refined grains, added sugars, or fats may represent the lowest-cost option to the consumer. Third, the high energy density and palatability of sweets and fats are associated with higher energy intakes, at least in clinical and laboratory studies. Fourth, poverty and food insecurity are associated with lower food expenditures, low fruit and vegetable consumption, and lower-quality diets. A reduction in diet costs in linear programming models leads to high-fat, energy-dense diets that are similar in composition to those consumed by low-income groups. Such diets are more affordable than are prudent diets based on lean meats, fish, fresh vegetables, and fruit. The association between poverty and obesity may be mediated, in part, by the low cost of energy-dense foods and may be reinforced by the high palatability of sugar and fat. This economic framework provides an explanation for the observed links between socioeconomic variables and obesity when taste, dietary energy density, and diet costs are used as intervening variables. More and more Americans are becoming overweight and obese while consuming more added sugars and fats and spending a lower percentage of their disposable income on food.

Come on guys, this stuff is pretty well known at this point.  We all known someone who is lazy and fat and has (apparently) every opportunity to change and doesn't, but on a societal level this has a LOT to do with social and economic class, education, poverty, etc.

So I really don't get the hostility here.  If you seriously think people need to change, the average person isn't going to benefit a lot from you telling them to stop being lazy and eat better.  

[Nebu]

While I don't mean for this to apply to this topic...

I find it amazing that we're in an age where information is more easily available than ever and yet people still choose to be ignorant.   

[DraconianOne]

While I don't mean for this to apply to this topic...

I find it amazing that we're in an age where information is more easily available than ever and yet people still choose to be ignorant.   

I work with someone who stunned me recently by asking what the difference was between sugar and carbohydrate. I thought he was being sarcastic but it turns out he wasn't. After I explained, he said "Oh, I thought sugar was like fat." 

Not only is this guy an adult (older than me) but he's also a diabetic.

[Merusk]

The problem with fat prejudice is that people are trying to equate it to racial prejudice. But it's actually more of a smoking prejudice, and look at where we are with that. It's impacting your health, which is impacting my medical and insurance bills. You have the 'right' to be obese, but you should then pay for it like a smoker does.

Some interesting stats from the UK health service between 2011-2012:

No of people admitted to hospital between an obesity related condition: 11,570
No of people treated in hospital with a sports related injury: 388,500

Yes, fitness is bad and we should all be obesee to avoid injuries instead.

Cherry picking a narrow window stats instead of looking at a long-term effects. What are you, a Republican?   

[DraconianOne]

Come on guys, this stuff is pretty well known at this point.  We all known someone who is lazy and fat and has (apparently) every opportunity to change and doesn't, but on a societal level this has a LOT to do with social and economic class, education, poverty, etc.

So I really don't get the hostility here.  If you seriously think people need to change, the average person isn't going to benefit a lot from you telling them to stop being lazy and eat better.  

At the moment, in the US, over a third of the population (just under 34%) is classed as obese. Comparatively, according to a recent US census, just under 15% of the general population is classed as living in poverty.  Figures from the CDC NHCS (National Center for Health Statistics) show that, in men, the prevalence of obesity was similar regardless of education or income (in fact, in some ethnicities, men with higher income were more likely to be obese).  In women, generally those with a higher income or with a degree were less likely to be obese).

Source

[tazelbain]

Information overload plus education decline plus willful ignorance makes world strange place where the smarter we get, the dumber we get too. If we live in the Information Age than made we have information class structure to match.

I was looking for gout information after foot pain left me hobbling. After a couple of hours of research on the goggles, I found a lot speculation and the feeling that a witch doctor would be more useful.

[Numtini]

It's impacting your health, which is impacting my medical and insurance bills.

Unhealthy people are cheaper. Becoming sick and dying is expensive. However, everyone becomes sick and dies eventually. The difference between a healthy person and unhealthy person is how long they're on social security before that happens. Yes, there's a cite.

[01101010]

On going to the store: I go at least every other night, it's just part of my routine. Much like time spent in the kitchen can be an enjoyable experience, making the trip to the store into a social thing where I see a lot of people regularly that I otherwise wouldn't because life, is a pretty awesome thing. And I keep in touch with the sales and pricing trends and can stock up and save a shitload of money with little effort. Also develop a relationship with my butcher and produce guy, so they key me into upcoming specials or set aside stuff (last year the produce guy gave me a deal on a full box of honeycrisp what you knew they were going to come up in this thread).

This is my problem. I hate the grocery store and the local market. The other customers make things unbearable. They are overwhelmingly rude and selfish in their behavior at every chance. These places are like fucking petting zoos with too many animals for me. There is no social quality at all to be found in these cesspools. If people would have some common courtesy and manners, I would not be so negative...but around here, that is next to impossible. Big city problems I guess, but minimizing trips to the market leave me better off in the mental health dept than the chance to get fresh produce. I think I will stick to frozen stuff.

[Pennilenko]

but people are particularly smug about fat for whatever reason.

I'll say it. It is because they fucking choose to be that way. They deserve derision and ridicule. Protected status is only for people that cannot make a choice to change, examples would include, the handicapped (mental and physical), minorities (gender and ethnic), homosexuals (of every particular flavor), the poor.

I refuse to cut extremely fat people a break because they are fucking lazy. Don't even try to sell me on that people can't eat healthy if they don't have money or time. Stopping at McDonald's is a choice, eating an entire pizza is a choice, eating an entire box of hamburger helper is a choice, portion size is a choice, not exercising is a choice. I've got thirty pounds to lose because I made the choice to be sedentary and eat shitty. Nobody made me fat but me, and I don't expect anybody to take the blame but me. The super crazy fat people you see in pictures being ridiculed took years of bad choices and extreme laziness to get that way. They deserve their shame. If we quit treating them like special snowflakes and quit playing into their self image maybe they would be motivated to change.

Are there going to be examples of people that are outside of the parameters of my rant? Sure, there are always outliers, but for the majority of fat people, they are that way because they are lazy and delusional. I've only got so much sympathy and bleeding heart to go around and, unfortunately for them, fat people don't deserve a slice of that pie.

Edit: Somebody equated fat prejudice to smoking prejudice and I totally agree with that. I don't smoke anymore because everybody I know thought it was disgusting and I changed because I was tired of people being grossed out by my smell and habits. Frankly, I don't see how that process was negative for me. Maybe the same type of social pressure will work on obesity.

[Nebu]

Politics in 3... 2...

[Paelos]

The truth hurts, but we're not doing obese people any good by pretending they are just fine until they die at 53, leaving two kids in college and a mortgage.

McDonalds has started putting up their calories on all the menus. I applaud that, and I want it on every menu in every establishment in the United States, on every item. I want it to be so fucking obvious that you're making shitty choices, that you own your garbage. Nobody gets to claim ignorance anymore.

[tazelbain]

And its wimpy kids fault for being wimpy, bullying them helps them get stronger.

[Phildo]

Let's make fun of unhealthily fit people:  Stop skipping leg day!

[Paelos]

And its wimpy kids fault for being wimpy, bullying them helps them get stronger.

Nice try.

[Goreschach]

Politics in 3... 2...

[tazelbain]

And its wimpy kids fault for being wimpy, bullying them helps them get stronger.

Nice try.

I like the comparison, both have lifestyle and genetic components. Both have people sprouting non-sense that shitting on them is for their own good.

You don't know their situation. You don't know their health issues. You don't their family history. The way to you prejudge them as lazy and gluttonous says more about you than than you.

[MahrinSkel]

While I don't mean for this to apply to this topic...

I find it amazing that we're in an age where information is more easily available than ever and yet people still choose to be ignorant.   

I work with someone who stunned me recently by asking what the difference was between sugar and carbohydrate. I thought he was being sarcastic but it turns out he wasn't. After I explained, he said "Oh, I thought sugar was like fat." 

Not only is this guy an adult (older than me) but he's also a diabetic.

Correct me if I'm wrong: All sugars are carbohydrates, but not all carbohydrates are sugars.  Specifically, sugars are simple carbohydrates that are easily used for energy, but more complex carbohydrates require energy inputs to break them down (but still produce a major net surplus)?

I'm sure the proper organic chemistry explanation is a lot more complicated.  I just know that my system seems to treat potato starch as directly equivalent to sugar of equal weight.

--Dave

[Samwise]

And its wimpy kids fault for being wimpy, bullying them helps them get stronger.

Nice try.

I like the comparison, both have lifestyle and genetic components. Both have people sprouting non-sense that shitting on them is for their own good.

You don't know their situation. You don't know their health issues. You don't their family history. The way to you prejudge them as lazy and gluttonous says more about you than than you.

I would buy this if I hadn't heard so many people complaining that THEIR DOCTORS were "fat-shaming" them by advising them to lose weight in order to improve their health.

[Sky]

Since we're twisting what everyone else says for our own benefit, how many doctors are telling people to pack on an extra fifty+ pounds of fat to be healthier?

But I'm an eskimo and I'll die without blubber!

[Merusk]

Depends on how many see anorexics.

It's not OK that I have to subsidize morbidly obese people's insurance and long-term care. Since insurance is mandatory in the US now, this doesn't get to be an "I'm ok with me" issue any more than smoking and drunk driving. Your behaviour affects us all.

[tazelbain]

And its wimpy kids fault for being wimpy, bullying them helps them get stronger.

Nice try.

I like the comparison, both have lifestyle and genetic components. Both have people sprouting non-sense that shitting on them is for their own good.

You don't know their situation. You don't know their health issues. You don't their family history. The way to you prejudge them as lazy and gluttonous says more about you than than you.

I would buy this if I hadn't heard so many people complaining that THEIR DOCTORS were "fat-shaming" them by advising them to lose weight in order to improve their health.

It still could be, doctors aren't without prejudice. Everyone needs to floss. I know it, but *effort*. But my old dentist was real jerk about it. Can easily say he floss-shaming me even if it was good medical advice. It didn't work made me less liking go to the dentist. You see slut-shaming from doctors all the time in regard std testing.

[Sky]

I left my last GP because I was tired of her shitty advice. But really, a big part of it was that she was fat, and not that 'size 12 model' fat. Hard to take health advice from someone who is probably not healthy.

See that assumption there?

And floss shaming is something I miss since we got a new hygienist. She's ok, but not amazing like the one who floss-shamed me. I'd apologize in advance, even though I floss pretty regularly. Imo it's her job to bitch me out when I'm being less than perfect with my dental hygiene. But I can live with the fact that I'm less than perfect and don't have to have people speak to me in soothing tones or I get offended.

[Miasma]

Depends on how many see anorexics.

It's not OK that I have to subsidize morbidly obese people's insurance and long-term care. Since insurance is mandatory in the US now, this doesn't get to be an "I'm ok with me" issue any more than smoking and drunk driving. Your behaviour affects us all.

Fat people don't have long term care, they die.  As mentioned already everyone dies of something.  The guy who made it to 90 because he was super healthy is just going to die of something exotic and expensive, plus he had 40 more years of using the hospital system than the fat guy who died at 50 of a heart attack.

You're not saving the health system any money by living longer, quite the contrary.  Smoking and drunk driving hurt other people directly.

[tazelbain]

If that's your thing Sky, I am sure you can find nice lady to berate you for $2.99/min.