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Author Topic: Bitch Thread for Warlords of Draenor  (Read 219014 times)
Paelos
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Reply #525 on: April 05, 2014, 12:21:01 PM

That being said, there was very little that MoP brought that was great,
The content?

The initial content was so gated and annoying that people quit in droves after Q1 2013. I would wager most people that came back to the game after the fact never even saw much of the Thunder King stuff at all, since it happened in the middle period between Blizzard being cockblockers, and the Timeless Isle. The last raid was fun, but it's the last raid. It should be the most fun since it's usually when you battle the Big Bad finally.

Is there a reason to sub until Blizzard finally releases all the raids and content, since they gate the crap out of it in the beginning? I would say not really. If anything you'd have more fun skipping the entirety of MOP up to patch 5.4, buying the xpac at a discount, and subbing for 3 months to enjoy the good parts of the game. Blizzard doesn't release the fun until a year after the fact.

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Simond
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Reply #526 on: April 05, 2014, 12:32:04 PM

That being said, there was very little that MoP brought that was great,
The content?

The initial content was so gated and annoying
E: Nevermind. You're not looking for anything other than excuses to bitch.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2014, 12:43:27 PM by Simond »

"You're really a good person, aren't you? So, there's no path for you to take here. Go home. This isn't a place for someone like you."
Paelos
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Reply #527 on: April 05, 2014, 12:55:28 PM

Read the title numbnuts.

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Reply #528 on: April 05, 2014, 02:49:56 PM

lol if you thought the initial faction grind of MoP was good.

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Sjofn
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Reply #529 on: April 05, 2014, 03:13:25 PM

That may have been my problem with MoP, I tried it too early in the cycle (I think I messed with it just before the first patch? I can't remember any more). What I remember is doing a bunch of quests on my paladin, only being about halfway to 86, and not being at all interested in what was happening story-wise. So I did a bunch of pet battles (totally fun!) and quit. I've been considering giving it another month or two now that (I assume) the high levels go by faster and the cockblocks are gone/lessened at 90. Can't decide.

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Reply #530 on: April 05, 2014, 03:47:24 PM


"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."

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Simond
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Reply #531 on: April 05, 2014, 04:06:47 PM

lol if you thought the initial faction grind of MoP was good.
Nah, that sucked but reducing the content of MoP (levelling & max) to "Well the dailies in 5.0 were bad therefore the expansion was the Worst Thing Ever" is p. dumb.

"You're really a good person, aren't you? So, there's no path for you to take here. Go home. This isn't a place for someone like you."
Paelos
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Reply #532 on: April 05, 2014, 06:40:20 PM

lol if you thought the initial faction grind of MoP was good.
Nah, that sucked but reducing the content of MoP (levelling & max) to "Well the dailies in 5.0 were bad therefore the expansion was the Worst Thing Ever" is p. dumb.

Very few people will say it's the worst thing ever. That spot falls to Cataclysm and not many outside of Rokal are willing to argue that point anymore. MoP was average with many stupid front-loaded decisions that caused them to lose subs. The back end was much better, but it raises the point of why people should buy in on the front end if this is Blizzard's M.O.

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luckton
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Reply #533 on: April 05, 2014, 06:46:34 PM

I don't expect them to rehash the end game of 5.0s faction grind.  But IMO, if they plan to go full tilt with Timeless Isle style gameplay, I'd rather have the faction grind back.  I'm cool with the RNG gods dictating when/if/what gear I get.  Not so much with general gameplay.

"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."

"Tuning me out doesn't magically change the design or implementation of said design. Though, that'd be neat if it did." -schild
Paelos
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Reply #534 on: April 05, 2014, 06:53:42 PM

I don't expect them to rehash the end game of 5.0s faction grind.  But IMO, if they plan to go full tilt with Timeless Isle style gameplay, I'd rather have the faction grind back.  I'm cool with the RNG gods dictating when/if/what gear I get.  Not so much with general gameplay.

I agree that Timeless Isle on the front end is silly. I don't mind a little faction rep for some neat rewards like a ring, or a trinket, or some consumables/patterns. It was putting the valor gear on there that ruined the party, and then spreading it out, and then putting it behind a single faction to open factions.

I don't think they'd do that exact method again, but at this point they have to gate something somehow so people don't burn down their slow-ass content cycle. It's just a matter of the mechanics.

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Reply #535 on: April 05, 2014, 06:54:45 PM


Quote
As we suspected, Draenor Perks will be learned randomly between 91 and 100. The reason for their randomness is to provide variety, and also to remove the problem of choice, and the pressure of making the wrong choice.

Ah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.

They took it out of Diablo because they were worried people were going to bitch about random rune drops.... then they go and put in the the game NOT about random chance.

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Reply #536 on: April 05, 2014, 11:26:15 PM

Garrison data: http://www.wowhead.com/news=233351/warlords-of-draenor-garrisons-buildings-and-leveling-perks-new-class-and-pet-abi

Scroll past the pet stuff, unless you're a Hunter that cares  why so serious?

"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."

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Reply #537 on: April 06, 2014, 01:55:28 AM

I need to keep reminding myself that the Horde Garrison buildings are going to be stupid and ugly and out of character for my paladin and I don't need to try it out.

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Reply #538 on: April 06, 2014, 05:50:43 AM

I hate myself for doing this but....


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Reply #539 on: April 06, 2014, 08:23:24 AM

Lmao; just make it so each class is like a MOBA character and only has enough abilities to map to like 4-5 keys and get it the fuck over with.

I would play that game. Probably would be the best design decision they ever made.
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Reply #540 on: April 06, 2014, 08:28:55 AM

Whether you agree with Paelos or not on the "retread" thing (and for the record, I don't think it's a retread of TBC ... the attraction of the new areas is going to be "this is what orcplanet looked like before everything got totally ruined, neat" not "Outland: AGAIN!"), that is how it comes across to a lot of people, and that's the problem. You can stamp your foot that it'll look different all you want, but for people who wandered off and were glancing over this expansion thinking about maybe coming back, the first impression is going to be "I already WENT to Outland. And I thought they killed Garrosh already. No new races or classes? They want me to pay how much for this?!"

And for people like me, it's also "fuck I am so fucking sick of orcorcorcorcorcorcs." Orcs are the new trolls.

Aren't like half the people that were going to play this not even born when TBC came out?
Paelos
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Reply #541 on: April 06, 2014, 11:00:50 AM

Lmao; just make it so each class is like a MOBA character and only has enough abilities to map to like 4-5 keys and get it the fuck over with.

I would play that game. Probably would be the best design decision they ever made.

I would too, tbh. I don't think there needs to be more than a bar of abilities for any MMO, especially since so many abilities are just doing the same thing on different cool downs with slightly different variations.

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Malakili
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Reply #542 on: April 06, 2014, 11:57:45 AM


I would too, tbh. I don't think there needs to be more than a bar of abilities for any MMO, especially since so many abilities are just doing the same thing on different cool downs with slightly different variations.

The WoW I remember had me putting at least 3 ranks of healing touch on my primary bar so I could downrank for maximum efficiency most of the time.  awesome, for real

I was actually upset when they took downranking out.  I'm that guy.  Oh god, I'm that guy.
Paelos
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Reply #543 on: April 06, 2014, 12:18:02 PM

There's a loud minority of people on the forums that want downranking back. I can see why they did take it out, because the fault was with the system that may downranking important in the first place.

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Reply #544 on: April 06, 2014, 12:24:33 PM

I never used downranking, but I'm certainly the guy who likes 4 bars of abilities.

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Malakili
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Reply #545 on: April 06, 2014, 12:36:06 PM

There's a loud minority of people on the forums that want downranking back. I can see why they did take it out, because the fault was with the system that may downranking important in the first place.

I played a lot after it was gone and didn't really miss it in practice, but I do like choices because I do think decision points are interesting.  Taking WoW down to a MOBA level of abilities doesn't automatically mean it is going to have MOBA-like excitement in combat.  MOBAs get their decision points from other things, map objectives, last hitting, trading health with champions in lane, etc.  But a game like WoW doesn't have that, so ability use/choice is one of the engaging things, so there's sort of two ways to take it.

1) Say, well, I don't care if it is that engaging, I just want to zone out, listen to music/podcast/chat with friends on Teamspeak while I'm questing/farming. That is what most MMOs turn into when you aren't in a dungeon, and leave the part where you have to be really engaged for group content.

or

2) Totally revamp combat and the way gameplay works on a moment to moment basis to make it more interesting.

A lot of games have tried for 2 and in my opinion failed to make it actually interesting.  See: All games using the "action oriented combat" buzzword.  I'm all for actiony combat, but when you apply it to the same old pull a monster, kill him pacing of an MMO it usually just feels tedious to me.  

I actually thought Champions Online did combat pretty well with active blocking, groups of bad guys so you are fighting multiple things at once, etc, having enough abilities to be interesting, but not so many that I need a ton of bars, and having actual different outcomes even when soloing depending on ability choices.  That did depend a lot on how you built your character though.  The game had other major problems, but it's combat wasn't one of them for me.

Ninja Edit:  But Champions lacked severely in making group play interesting to me, there was almost no difference in playing in a group vs. playing solo - which meant people almost never played as a group in my experience.  Dungeons were about impossible to find a group for because the gameplay in groups was a disaster.  So, I think there is at least some correlation between option 1 being for more boring combat while solo, but more interesting combat while in a group, while option 2 is a better solo experience if it is done well, but is hard to parlay into great group gameplay.

« Last Edit: April 06, 2014, 12:43:12 PM by Malakili »
Simond
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Reply #546 on: April 06, 2014, 03:17:38 PM

EQ2 abilities or GW2 abilities?
I'll take GW2 every time, thanks.

Also: Frogloks!

http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/3891-Warlords-of-Draenor-Alpha-Models

(Okay, 'Goren'. Sure, whatever. Like the 'Saurok' being iksar in all-but-name).

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Reply #547 on: April 06, 2014, 03:29:46 PM

EQ2 abilities or GW2 abilities?
I'll take GW2 every time, thanks.
I'll take EQ2 with no question.

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Reply #548 on: April 06, 2014, 03:56:25 PM

EQ2 abilities or GW2 abilities?
I'll take GW2 every time, thanks.
The only winning move is not to play.

EQ2 (insta-85 fury): 3 different combat rezes, 2 OoC rezes, 4 cleanses, 3 hotbars filled with various nukes and heals that you probably didn't use most of the time anyway. An entire bar filled with nothing but 5+min cooldowns, most of them 15+min. An entire bar's worth of buffs.
GW2 (warrior axe/mace + greatsword): "Press 2 and 4 on CD when it's not interrupting the last autoattack. Press 3 at range. Press 5 if you need a stun. Press your utility skills and elite pretty much on cooldown. Switch to greatsword and press 2 when it's up, use 3 and 5 to move around / avoid stuff. But seriously, just let it do the autoattack chain."

(To be fair, GW2 staff elementalist was actually pretty versatile and fun to play with a good number of buttons... that is, if you wanted to do anything except damage, which meant that you were playing the game wrong.  why so serious?)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2014, 04:14:41 PM by Zetor »

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Reply #549 on: April 06, 2014, 06:12:28 PM

GW2 here as well.  I was doubtful about Diablo 3's skill system but I have to say the runes and changing skills out like that is actually very enjoyable to me.
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Reply #550 on: April 07, 2014, 12:28:56 AM

GW2's limited set is also way easier to come back months later and pick back up than HELLO HERE ARE FIVE HOTBARS WORTH OF SHIT.

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Reply #551 on: April 07, 2014, 12:43:50 PM

TESO probably has the best class design/mechanics in the genre right now. I really really love that system. I like the idea of having a ton of different abilities but only being able to slot a bunch. Forces you to find interesting synergy.
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Reply #552 on: April 07, 2014, 01:17:12 PM


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Reply #553 on: April 07, 2014, 03:33:04 PM

I like the new character models. I don't mind them redoing outland. In theory, they're creatively bankrupt, Garrosh is boring, etc. In practice I tend to enjoy poking around zones "how they used to be".

Other than that, the patch notes kill all my enthusiasm for playing my Mage. I'm not at all tempted to start playing my Warrior again - I used to tank as recently as Cata, then in Pandas I finally gave up and went Fury instead and stopped tanking in 5-mans or raids. Then I stopped playing completely around Feb 2013. Hunter and Lock - who were my other max level toons who I LFRed with, I'm not so sure about, mostly because I glossed over the hunter notes and didn't bother reading the Lock ones. Basically, I don't see a compelling reason to resub and learn the systems again. I'm especially unimpressed by the idea of playing a castrated mage.

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Reply #554 on: April 14, 2014, 12:05:58 PM


"Those lights, combined with the polygamous Nazi mushrooms, will mess you up."

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Reply #555 on: April 14, 2014, 12:47:52 PM

Quote
Berserker Rage doesn't Enrage you anymore
lol

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Reply #556 on: April 14, 2014, 02:15:33 PM

wat

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Reply #557 on: April 14, 2014, 03:15:02 PM

Berserker Rage has been renamed Berserker Passive-Aggressiveness.  Tooltips will update in a future patch.

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Simond
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Reply #558 on: April 14, 2014, 06:40:58 PM

I need to keep reminding myself that the Horde Garrison buildings are going to be stupid and ugly and out of character for my paladin and I don't need to try it out.
You could always reroll Alliance: http://imgur.com/a/xGkxI

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Reply #559 on: April 15, 2014, 08:05:23 PM

I don't need to "reroll" Alliance, I have plenty of those as well (in fact, I played Alliance way more than Horde until Cataclysm rolled around and my guild split between going Full Catass and quitting), it's just the people I know that still play are Horde (or still catass and the odds of me playing with them are low, because meh).  why so serious?


edit: That IS one thing about the Alliance and Horde visually ... human buildings and the Alliance races are generic enough that I could see pretty much all my Alliance people in them without stretching too far. Oh, my night elf hunter might want a purple roof on her inn, my gnomes might want some more gears around, but by and large, it's not too aggressive in its THIS IS A HUMAN STRUCTURE, FUCK THE REST OF YOU.

Orc buildings are not as ... useable in that way, because the Horde is less ... uniform? It fits for orcs. I could see my goblins hanging out in a SPIKES SPIKES SPIKES garrison. But then I start to go "nnngh" with my tauren or trolls or forsaken characters. And blood elves wouldn't be caught dead in that shit.

Does that make sense?
« Last Edit: April 15, 2014, 08:09:43 PM by Sjofn »

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