Mists of Pandaria

[Maledict]

Garosh has been a fucking moron since the start. Even I'm tempted to resubmit just to plant a axe in his forehead.

Just amused / slightly vexed they keep falling back on the same tropes all the time.

[Lakov_Sanite]

You'd be hard pressed to find ANY horde liking garrosh and especially if they've read the cataclysm books.  The alliance got a roidrage king sure but at least he's got honor, garrosh is like a whiny teenager who at first was too busy pissing his pants to do anything, then when he finally did he became an entitled douchebag.  BTW if you've done the new troll starter quests there is a conversation between vol'jin and garrosh, really hope it comes to pass.

[Fabricated]

I don't like Garrosh; I'm just finding it weird they spend portions of the 1-60 experience trying to show him learning an inkling of decency (and I think he's characterized in the books as being traumatized/troubled at actually killing Cairne?) only for us to kill him. I'd say it's a good morally ambiguous storyline (killing Garrosh because he wasn't "ready" to lead, with it being semi-tragic since he would've grokked the whole "honorable horde" thing in time if Thrall had appointed someone else warchief), but I don't think Blizzard's writing is good enough to pull that.

[Lakov_Sanite]

No their writing is not good enough and of course they wanted people to like him.  I don't think they had originally planned to get rid of him at all, or anytime soon but overwhelmingly players hate him.  Even in a video game people really identified as horde, there was a sense of pride and garrosh really diminished that.  They did their best to try and give him some depth but the damage was already done and they aren't that good.  You can't just go from killing cow-ghandi(first by even challenging him, then by winning through poison) and completely sweeping it under the rug to then feeling 'bad' about it and it'll make everything better.

Garrosh could have been an interesting and complex character set amongst the rest of the npc's but people want team captains they can get behind. 

[Fabricated]

Wait, I thought that Garrosh was stupid as hell and didn't realize the whatever-the-evil-Tauren-faction-is person had poisoned his weapon?

[Lakov_Sanite]

Wait, I thought that Garrosh was stupid as hell and didn't realize the whatever-the-evil-Tauren-faction-is person had poisoned his weapon?

He realized after the fact, said nothing, then cairn's death was used by evil tauren lady(magatha grimtotem) as an excuse to raid thunder bluff and kill hundred or so peaceful tauren. Garrosh finally lent some aid to taking TB back but I don't think he ever admitted HOW he killed cairne.

Also correction, it was Cairne who was pretty much forced to challenge garrosh to a duel but cairne wanted a regular /duel, garrosh made it to the death in the naive hope it would make cairne back down but not realizing some creatures have 'codes of honor' etc and wouldn't ever back down.  It should be noted, garrosh would have lost if not for the poison.

[Ironwood]

Where do you chaps get all this ?

[Lakov_Sanite]

Read a book motherfucker.

[Merusk]

Books are Blizzard's new way of feeding lore, as I mentioned before.  They realized it could be a revenue stream and they didn't have to pay artists, coders, etc to put this shit in game. One guy writes it, another edits it, they publish and change shit in game based on it.  If you want to know what's going on, you have to buy the books now.

It's a lot easier (and cheaper) to just not care and chase shineys.

[Ironwood]

Pass.

[Rokal]

Edit: wait. Looking things up.
http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3445148&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=103#post401695788

the mmo-champ guy on somethingawful posted this so.
"No, [Garrosh] is the final boss of the Pandaria Campaign. MoP has its own final boss."

MoP will have it's own final boss when it launches, since they are trying to make patch content stand on it's own rather than having us wait around for a year+ to fight the boss of significance in the story. Garrosh will still be the final boss in the expansion, but he'll be added as patch content (the Pandaria campaign).

[fuser]

AoE looting finally!

[luckton]

AoE looting finally!

Gotta keep up with the Jones.   

[Nevermore]

Haha, we're we just arguing about whether the game has a horde or alliance bias?

So let's see. Final patch has us all seizing orgrammar. The horde commit attrocities in war. The Horde allies with a group of 14 year old boys / monkeys with rockets launchers whilst the alliance allies with a  group of wise transcendal mystics. The alliance pandaren leader is a calm, wise ancient, the horde pandaren leader is a headstrong moron.

Feels like wrath all over again. Seems whenever blizzard wants to big up the faction difference the horde go do something evil again.

Theramore will still be smashed, but Orgrimmar will be fine.  All the crap that happens to the Alliance leaves a lasting impression on the game world.  The stuff that happens to the horde boils down to 'we don't like that guy' or 'we'll just fix this with a coup in an instance and then everything will be fine'.

[luckton]

I for one am liking what I'm reading thus far...with LFR in place and fleshed out, along with all the other QoL stuff being added, this is kinda getting me torn between GW2, TOR, and this.

Global/account-wide achievements are kind of a big thing for me too.

[Fabricated]

GW2 is a one-time purchase and not a sub so you can play that whenever after buying the box. Play Pandas and Spacemen until you run out of content and get bored, then unsub.

[luckton]

GW2 is a one-time purchase and not a sub so you can play that whenever after buying the box. Play Pandas and Spacemen until you run out of content and get bored, then unsub.

This is a factual statement that I will keep in mind 

[Simond]

I don't like Garrosh; I'm just finding it weird they spend portions of the 1-60 experience trying to show him learning an inkling of decency (and I think he's characterized in the books as being traumatized/troubled at actually killing Cairne?) only for us to kill him. I'd say it's a good morally ambiguous storyline (killing Garrosh because he wasn't "ready" to lead, with it being semi-tragic since he would've grokked the whole "honorable horde" thing in time if Thrall had appointed someone else warchief), but I don't think Blizzard's writing is good enough to pull that.

Plus I'd still rather see Warchief Meathead rather than having fucking Marty Stu Jesus-Superman Thrall back.

Oh yeah, WoW-Farmville is in MoP as well as WoW-Pokemon.

[Paelos]

I will be resubbing after 4/15 to get in on the party. Sounds like they are doing a lot of what I wanted and heading back to the casual dungeons with hardcore stratifications that add flavor items instead of stat boosts.

[Merusk]

Plus I'd still rather see Warchief Meathead rather than having fucking Marty Stu Jesus-Superman Thrall back.

Hey, maybe Thrall and what's-her-name will pull a Bill 'n Ted, skip forward in time and bring Jr. back to take over so they can go do the ubershaman thing.

[Lakov_Sanite]

What's this about wow farmville?


edit:nm found it.

The Tillers faction will let you run your own farm! The farmer's market will provide daily quest to improve your farm every day, you will be able to clear plots of land and plant things like cooking ingredients, herbalism nodes, gifts for NPCs to build your reputation... etc.

And you say these things like they should be bad, like them or not more choices in how you play is always better.

[Fordel]

The removing Garrosh from power is going to be really fucking dumb from the Alliance PoV... again.


We can't attack the Horde unless the Horde also attacks the Horde. 

[luckton]

The removing Garrosh from power is going to be really fucking dumb from the Alliance PoV... again.


We can't attack the Horde unless the Horde also attacks the Horde.  

Eh, just wait.  I'm sure the Dark Iron Dwarfs will fuck up their three-way peace soon enough and we'll be raiding Ironforge.

I for one would like for there to be some aftermath Cataclysm that would have the Draenei and Blood Elf cites/landmasses fall into the abyss, but that's just me ranting about silly content that serves no other purpose except taking up hard drive space 

[Simond]

Lor'themar for Warchief!  

Also:
http://wow.joystiq.com/2012/03/19/mists-of-pandaria-cool-class-stuff-we-found/

    Glyph of Stars Transforms your Moonkin Form into Astral Form. This glyph essentially makes your character appear as a spirit instead of a moonkin. You look very nearly like you do while dead -- but people can see you this time ... and your armor, for that matter.
    Glyph of the Orca Transforms your Aquatic Form into an orca. This one is pretty straightforward. Remember those orcas in Northrend? Yeah. Much better than your weird, snarling, rubbery seal.
    Glyph of the Chameleon Gives you a random appearance when you shift into Bear or Cat Form. Essentially, this one gives you a random coloring every time you shift. Great for breaking up the monotony of locked-in bear/cat coloring.
    Glyph of the Stag Transforms your Travel Form into a stag that other players can mount. Yes, that's right. Your pals can ride you while you're in Travel Form, and you're also a stag instead of the clearly inferior cheetah.
    Glyph of the Tree Lets you transform into Treant Form.

And more.

[Ingmar]

They still don't really "get it" regarding the Alliance complaints about Cataclysm etc. A Horde dude going bad so we have to kill him, is still not "Alliance does something cool" content.

[Paelos]

They still don't really "get it" regarding the Alliance complaints about Cataclysm etc. A Horde dude going bad so we have to kill him, is still not "Alliance does something cool" content.

But nobody ever really dies.





Except in stupid novels.

[Mattemeo]

Glyph of Stars Transforms your Moonkin Form into Astral Form. This glyph essentially makes your character appear as a spirit instead of a moonkin. You look very nearly like you do while dead -- but people can see you this time ... and your armor, for that matter.

Good lord, a sub-class I'm no longer locked out of due to the Moonkin form (and moonkin in general) giving me the raging heebiejeebies?

Please tell me the Glyph also removes the fucking terrifying screaming noises, too.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I mean, I get that some expansions favor one side or another...at least that's how people feel and I think it's valid but really, deposing the leader of the horde isn't enough? Yeah yeah, maybe horde help too but still, in what world would this not be considered a great benefit to the alliance?

[Ingmar]

I mean, I get that some expansions favor one side or another...at least that's how people feel and I think it's valid but really, deposing the leader of the horde isn't enough? Yeah yeah, maybe horde help too but still, in what world would this not be considered a great benefit to the alliance?

Teaming up with Thrall so Green Jesus can get back on his throne isn't really doing something for the Alliance, no. It's just more of their wishy-washy "let's team up the two sides against the bigger problem" nonsense - and in any case "Horde side is doing bad stuff" isn't what Alliance people want to see, in general; they want to see "Alliance side is doing awesome stuff".

The Icecrown thing is a good example. The Horde people complain that they backstabbed the Alliance making them look like the evil faction, but "hey all our dudes are dead" wasn't exactly a "yay Alliance" moment either.

[Azazel]

Haha, we're we just arguing about whether the game has a horde or alliance bias?

So let's see. Final patch has us all seizing orgrammar. The horde commit attrocities in war. The Horde allies with a group of 14 year old boys / monkeys with rockets launchers whilst the alliance allies with a  group of wise transcendal mystics. The alliance pandaren leader is a calm, wise ancient, the horde pandaren leader is a headstrong moron.

Feels like wrath all over again. Seems whenever blizzard wants to big up the faction difference the horde go do something evil again.

Maybe it's to balance the Thrall = Green Jesus story arc from Cata?  
Seriously though, I agree that it sounds awful. I'd also go with Garrosh over Sylvanas any day. The horde already have a whole faction of 14 year old boys with rocket launchers anyway. They just have bronx accents at the moment.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I mean, I get that some expansions favor one side or another...at least that's how people feel and I think it's valid but really, deposing the leader of the horde isn't enough? Yeah yeah, maybe horde help too but still, in what world would this not be considered a great benefit to the alliance?

Teaming up with Thrall so Green Jesus can get back on his throne isn't really doing something for the Alliance, no. It's just more of their wishy-washy "let's team up the two sides against the bigger problem" nonsense - and in any case "Horde side is doing bad stuff" isn't what Alliance people want to see, in general; they want to see "Alliance side is doing awesome stuff".

I am willing to bet thrall does NOT become warchief again, everything about his story says he's beyond that.  For that matter, all this thrall bashing (and look I never thought he was the bees knees) is fine except he was never all that awesome until he actually left the horde.  Yeah he's an orc but you can't really call all the bullshit he's been doing some sort of horde bias.

[Ingmar]

If it isn't Thrall then it is arguably even worse, since we'd then be putting a non "neutral" character in there.

[Merusk]

Vol'jin for warchief.

Ousting/ killing Garrosh was the fan push, why not take-up the other half of it, too.

[Ingmar]

Maybe Jaina will teleport us all away before we can finish things off again.

[Lakov_Sanite]

There really is no option besides vol'jin...maybe saurfang