DOTA2

[Megrim]

Oh, you'll be entering a troll zone regardless, it will just be a completely different one.

In my pants.

[cmlancas]

Played a few games last night...still find myself longing for more gamma for heroes...5v5s tend to devolve into clusters of shadowy figures where it's very hard to tell who's who.

Tidehunter is still very strong, but I think Pudge is a little overpowered early game.  Rot seems like it just doesn't eat his health as quickly as it should.

Also, the range for bounces with Lich's chain frost seems severely nerfed...I played Lich competitively in CAL, and he just doesn't feel the same.

Edit:  Typo.

[ezrast]

Thinking of trying to get over my camera hate and give this another shot. To those of you who advocate newbing it up in the jungle: 1) what do you think of Enchantress jungle? 2) what do you do to keep your 2v1 lane from losing horribly? Gank a lot or just farm enough to make up for them if they fail?

[cmlancas]

Thinking of trying to get over my camera hate and give this another shot. To those of you who advocate newbing it up in the jungle: 1) what do you think of Enchantress jungle? 2) what do you do to keep your 2v1 lane from losing horribly? Gank a lot or just farm enough to make up for them if they fail?

The person soloing should probably be someone suited to do so, perhaps lich or somesuch.  Also, ganking certainly helps.

Ench could do okay, but she'd be even better with a nice pusher, imo.

[Fordel]

Enchantress is pretty Micro intensive, keep that in mind.


She can jungle just fine, but she favors aggressive play early game with her neutral creep advantage. You keep your 2v1 lane safe by having it be the lane beside you in the jungle, so you can occasionally show up and give them the business, keep them honest and fearful. In the newbie bracket, you can probably even farm in the enemy jungle most of the time if need be.


She isn't going to win a game on her own though, not unless you already utterly outclass your opponents. She's a beast early/mid but if the game goes late she drops off in effectiveness. She can certainly push the outer towers, but doesn't really have the chops to push down the tier 3/base, not the way a prophet or lycan could.

[Megrim]

Probably the easiest and most newbie-friendly guy to run in the neutrals is Lycan. You have about two buttons to worry about, your summoned wolves will get you free kills on support heroes, once they hit level four, and your ultimate makes you practically un-gankable. Be prepared however, to be called all kinds of mean names.

[Ingmar]

Is there a good noob jungler that doesn't have to juggle pets?

[Megrim]

Fuzzy URSA BEAR, Naix or Axe.

[cmlancas]

I'm really starting to take a liking to Silencer.  Extremely disruptive, especially when you're playing with a group of folks who know what they're doing.

Triple silence with a mek isn't half bad either ;)

[Fordel]

The issue with Silencer is against heroes that don't give a shit about being silenced.



Nature's Prophet trees don't really require much Micro either and if you totally balls it up, you can just make more in 30 seconds or so. Prophet can also be a cheesy bastard and use his ultimate to farm the map too, though your team mates may dislike you for doing that non-stop. 


Ursa has the ability to solo Roshan as soon as he gets his Vlads (Vladimirs Offering, a lifesteal item) up, at a very early level, due to how his abilities work.

[eldaec]

You don't really even need all of Vlad's, just the life steal part. And be whatever level you get your ultimate.

[Megrim]

It can technically be done at level one if you have a Skeleton King with lifesteal aura and some healing pots. But its more of a gimmick in most cases.

[Ingmar]

Wow, Ursa is pretty silly.

[Ice Cream Emperor]

It can technically be done at level one if you have a Skeleton King with lifesteal aura and some healing pots. But its more of a gimmick in most cases.

And if you're going to do a level 1 Roshan you should just bring everyone anyways, then you get to start the game at level 2.

[eldaec]

Cmlancas is attempting to get an f13 gang going in this using am obscure sub forum you probably don't read here:

http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=22488.msg1100100;boardseen#new

[cmlancas]

Cmlancas is attempting to get an f13 gang going in this using am obscure sub forum you probably don't read here:

http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=22488.msg1100100;boardseen#new

Many thanks, eld.  Oh, and the obscure subform makes it COOL.  It's so awesome you don't even know where it is!

[Rasix]

Played a few games with Fordel and Ingmar last night.  It wasn't bad, although the first game was mostly me fighting with the interface and figuring out the basics of  the consumables and shopping.

Played as Tidehunter, Zeus, and Tiny.  Tide was easy to play and fun. His ult is just brutal.  Zeus has animation issues and horrible taunts, but I like his ult and he can do some decent damage.  Tiny, I really didn't get a good feel for (if you toss an ally, does it hurt them as well?).  Seems to have pretty long cooldowns and only two actives you're working with.  Still, could be fun.

Wasn't a bad experience and felt better than the last time I played.  Wish the animations were a bit snappier in some situations as it made last hitting a bit difficult.  

edit:

So, abilities don't scale with stats?

[Malakili]

 Wish the animations were a bit snappier in some situations as it made last hitting a bit difficult.  

edit:

So, abilities don't scale with stats?

1) The animations tend to take a bit of time to get a feel for, but now that I am used to them I don't find last hitting appreciably more difficult than in LoL, it just had an adjustment period.

No, abilities do not scale with stats.

[cmlancas]

 Wish the animations were a bit snappier in some situations as it made last hitting a bit difficult.  

edit:

So, abilities don't scale with stats?

1) The animations tend to take a bit of time to get a feel for, but now that I am used to them I don't find last hitting appreciably more difficult than in LoL, it just had an adjustment period.

No, abilities do not scale with stats.

I actually found the animations off from DOTA as well.  The range auto-attack animations aren't as crisp as the WC3 engine, in my opinion.

[Hoax]

Fuzzy URSA BEAR, Naix or Axe.

NO.

Do not jungle Axe.

Do not jungle Lifestealer aka Naix.

These are not the heros for any of you really new players in thread. Firstly Lifestealer is a really slow jungler without a lot of practice and guide viewing compared to real junglers and he's not even that good.

Axe. Here's a LoL comparison. Axe is like jungle Trynd (or maybe Yi), it seems like it could be good, occasionally you see him just wtfrape everything and you think how cool and powerful he must be. Most of the time though the Trynd is on your team and plays like a fucking retard, dies all over the place, dives all over the place, dies alone against 2-4 enemies and bitches at his team then claims that's how you need to play Axe/Trynd.

There are certain cast members that just cause people to play bad because playing correctly and playing like a retard are very close cousins for that character. Axe is really really hard, or at least a lot harder than he sounds and looks. Axe is one of those. Stay away.

Ursa is the simplest of the jungle farm into game winners but Lycan is close and carries a lot harder with bad teammates/team comp than Ursa can.

Dark Seer can jungle without any multiple unit micro but for a lot of people trying him too early will not make a great impression because his power is deceptive unlike something like Lycan that just clicks people 5 times and they die while going max movespeed.

[cmlancas]

There are certain cast members that just cause people to play bad because playing correctly and playing like a retard are very close cousins for that character. Axe is really really hard, or at least a lot harder than he sounds and looks. Axe is one of those. Stay away.

The big thing with this hero and similar melee carrier-possibles is to be patient.  At level six, you aren't going to roll up on someone Lina style and blow him or her up in three clicks.

[Ingmar]

I tried Axe out on the bots, he seems kind of bad. Ursa now, Ursa was ridiculous.

[Fordel]

Played a few games with Fordel and Ingmar last night.  It wasn't bad, although the first game was mostly me fighting with the interface and figuring out the basics of  the consumables and shopping.

Played as Tidehunter, Zeus, and Tiny.  Tide was easy to play and fun. His ult is just brutal.  Zeus has animation issues and horrible taunts, but I like his ult and he can do some decent damage.  Tiny, I really didn't get a good feel for (if you toss an ally, does it hurt them as well?).  Seems to have pretty long cooldowns and only two actives you're working with.  Still, could be fun.

Wasn't a bad experience and felt better than the last time I played.  Wish the animations were a bit snappier in some situations as it made last hitting a bit difficult.  

edit:

So, abilities don't scale with stats?

Tiny's toss doesn't hurt ally's, it's a fun way to actually initiate. Toss your Tidebringer friend into the middle of the enemy group.  

Tiny's combo is a little tricky to get off, but once you figure it out, you can kill any squishy hero in under a second.

No, abilities don't scale with stats, which is why if you have big nukes, you level them up first. It also means generally, Int heroes start off really strong early game and don't require many (if any) items, but drop off late game. The reverse is true of most agility heroes (specifically all those carries), they start off kinda poopy, but if they get the items and hit late game, its over the end. The Strentgh heroes are generally the most consistent throughout the game.

I think the only items that effect ability damage are the Veil of Discord and Aghamaims Scepter if applicable.


-edit- Morphling is an exception I believe, to some degree. He is weird in general though.

[Ingmar]

I would really really like a way to set up my shop lists, outside of being in an actual game.

[Eldron]

I would really really like a way to set up my shop lists, outside of being in an actual game.

Just tried it for a little last night, but http://code.google.com/p/d2ric/ should do it.

And i miss the HoN feature where users have writen guides for different playstyles with items associated with it on their webpage and you can see them all ingame and set a favorite for heroes. Really neat feature.

[Mavor]

90% of pubs (unless they are a premade team) *cannot* counter ursa. They just don't have the teamwork/game sense to do it.

In reality, Ursa is a mediocre carry that gets 140% shut down by a bunch of hard item counters/team comps/hero picks.

However, most pubs don't give a shit about helping their team and countering things.

Also, even against teams that have 1 or 2 good players, the 3 players that aren't on top of their game get absolutely mauled by Ursa leading to snowball and death.

I haven't lost a game as Ursa where I was actually working with my team and giving a damn about winning in random pickup. He's actually boring now.. i find myself at the point that winning with Ursa is just a waste of 30-40 minutes. Generally the most fun I get out of the game nowadays is playing a decent divine rapier holder and going balls out DR rush (divine rapier rush on natures prophet.... well it's a good way to lose the game, but also challenging). :)

[Ice Cream Emperor]

Does it explain anywhere how to interpret the whole 'how good are you at playing this hero' rating in your profile? For a long time Lich was the only hero who I had played enough games with, and I had this big red bar, and I was like 'okay, maybe red means I'm crap at Lich?' But just recently I got enough games with CM and she has an even smaller red bar -- so maybe the bar is always red, and I'm actually amazing at Lich but mediocre at CM?

[cmlancas]

Last night was frustrating...I think I got reported for abandonment because my PC bluescreened for the first time since I've rebuilt it and then lady-issues...ugh.  Also, sorry bhodi.  

I forgot to e-mail myself the screens I took of our matches from Wednesday, but I'll be writing Radicalthon articles later tonight.

I find AP games to be reaching the pinaccle of unfunness because folks are still picking the same old heroes or using the same tactics that facerape newer people.  Single draft and random is where I'm finding the most fun.

Mavor's right:  nobody would pull half that shit in a higher bracket.

ICE:  Are you winning or losing your matches?  I don't give a shit if someone is 25-0 if we lose.  :)

[Ice Cream Emperor]

ICE:  Are you winning or losing your matches?  I don't give a shit if someone is 25-0 if we lose.  :)

Errr, not sure how that relates to 'how to read the statistics in my profile'? Regardless of whether I win or lose I'm also interested in these sorts of stats, both a) how they're calculated and b) what they might say about my play, if accurate. For example, my win record is better with CM than Lich, but my Lich 'rating' appears to be higher. That's interesting to me. After all, DOTA is a team game, so it's interesting to see evaluation of individual play that in theory cuts across other factors (like how good your random teammates were.)

[cmlancas]

ICE:  Are you winning or losing your matches?  I don't give a shit if someone is 25-0 if we lose.  :)

Errr, not sure how that relates to 'how to read the statistics in my profile'? Regardless of whether I win or lose I'm also interested in these sorts of stats, both a) how they're calculated and b) what they might say about my play, if accurate. For example, my win record is better with CM than Lich, but my Lich 'rating' appears to be higher. That's interesting to me. After all, DOTA is a team game, so it's interesting to see evaluation of individual play that in theory cuts across other factors (like how good your random teammates were.)

Ran through DOTA2 dev forums for a bit and found it to be a cumulative algorithm (currently unpublished) amalgamating stats such as K/D/A, EPM, and GPM and comparing them to people in your bracket.

The red part is important because you might play a good Lycanthrope, but others might play him better.  I have a feeling a lot of people will notice this with Lich, Lyc, Ursa, Skeleton King, and Zeus.  I have a feeling the opposite would be true with more obscure heroes.

[Ingmar]

I would really really like a way to set up my shop lists, outside of being in an actual game.

Just tried it for a little last night, but http://code.google.com/p/d2ric/ should do it.

Nice, I'll have to mess with that.

[Fordel]

Does it explain anywhere how to interpret the whole 'how good are you at playing this hero' rating in your profile? For a long time Lich was the only hero who I had played enough games with, and I had this big red bar, and I was like 'okay, maybe red means I'm crap at Lich?' But just recently I got enough games with CM and she has an even smaller red bar -- so maybe the bar is always red, and I'm actually amazing at Lich but mediocre at CM?

It's just a reflection of your overall K/D ratio and how good you can farm relative to everyone else.

[Malakili]

Public Service Announcement: Playing Lycanthrope and jungling for the first 25 minutes without giving any help to any lanes, and then bitching when you team is behind because they'v ebeen playing 4 on 5 is a dick move.

[Thrawn]

Public Service Announcement: Playing Lycanthrope and jungling for the first 25 minutes without giving any help to any lanes, and then bitching when you team is behind because they'v ebeen playing 4 on 5 is a dick move.

You still get to win though because you're Lycan and you've been farming for 25 minutes.  

[Rasix]

I'm going to feed so hard when I finally decide to play against other humans.  This won't be like LoL, where my first three games were something like 50/8/x on Annie.

This game is just really, really complex compared to what I'm used to.