Dragon Age 2 - Here be spoilers.

[Nevermore]

In other news, Isabella's boobs make my back ache.

The way they seem to float on her chest they look like they're filled with helium, so that should ease any back problems. 

[tmp]

Does it matter? I mean if you want it to be hard, put it on nightmare, right?

Unfortunately since "hard" translates to "give the mobs assload of hp" it pretty much turns "hard" into "boring" since no amount of xtreme makes watching a rogue flip out dozen times just to kill one guy any more bearable. Having FF enabled in setting where the mobs die at reasonable pace would be preferable, but alas.

[Paelos]

I really don't understand the hardon for friendly fire. If anything with the way tactics and UI are set up in this version it doesn't seem like you could control it all that well.

Then again, I don't like microing every fight and playing armchair tactician with a group of 4. I prefer 4000. 

[Merusk]

See, I'm the exact opposite.  I hate microing large armies and expect them to just fucking know how to accomplish a goal I've given.  Thus my hate for RTS games.

Small groups like this, though I'll micro down to pausing after every skill has fired off. I had combats in Baldur's Gate set to pause after every round, after an enemy died, and after a spell or skill was completed.  It's no wonder playing those took me a few hundred hours. 

[Paelos]

A lot of it comes down to leadership style I suppose. I like to believe that people can generally handle their shit unless they prove otherwise. They don't need to be hovered over, and in many cases they hate it. It sucks a lot of the personality out of a game for me if I have to tell everyone what to do every second of every fight.

At that point I'm playing 4 people instead of roleplaying one with some sidekicks. I want to be one guy surrounded by an interesting world.

[tmp]

I really don't understand the hardon for friendly fire.

It's just without it i keep noticing how the big balls of blazing fire (or ice, or whatever) fly towards the group of people and mysteriously manage to hit everyone but not my own guys, even when my guys would actually work as meat shield for these enemies due to the positioning and whatnot. Would have easier ignoring that if they just selectively set things on fire instead, without the flying pyrotechnics bit, but if they make it look like the damn thing should hit and toss around everyone in the radius then i want that actually happen. Even if that means having to be more careful where i throw the stuff, then.

[Tannhauser]

Enjoyed the demo.  Really like the new look and the main guy talks now.  The UI does kinda suck though.  Glad to see the tank and the rogue actually have cool and effective abilities.  Aveline really did well tanking the boss while we cleaned out the trash.  Taunt works quite well. 

I wasn't that pumped for DA2, but now I can't wait!


As for the FF discussion, just rationalize it that each of your allies has an a magic amulet attuned to the group's mage that prevents damage. 

Ok it's a stretch but what can ya do?

[Lantyssa]

Flemeth's redesign was pretty damn cool, and I hope if there's a DA3 they do it again, showing more depth as she chooses what form to use based on how she's manipulating people.

I really liked her new look.  She's a little old, but I wanted her for a romance option right then and there.

[Ingmar]

Flemeth's redesign was pretty damn cool, and I hope if there's a DA3 they do it again, showing more depth as she chooses what form to use based on how she's manipulating people.

I really liked her new look.  She's a little old, but I wanted her for a romance option right then and there.

[Lantyssa]

Glad I haven't lost my touch.

I'm sure there will be a friendly fire mod before long, too.  (Assuming DA2 will allow mods.)

[Merusk]

A lot of it comes down to leadership style I suppose. I like to believe that people can generally handle their shit unless they prove otherwise. They don't need to be hovered over, and in many cases they hate it. It sucks a lot of the personality out of a game for me if I have to tell everyone what to do every second of every fight.

At that point I'm playing 4 people instead of roleplaying one with some sidekicks. I want to be one guy surrounded by an interesting world.

They're not people, they're game pieces.  Also, my approach goes back to playing gold box games where I  AM the whole party, so each piece is a little bit of me in the world.

If each of them could move or make a decision on their own without me having to laboriously code their tactics* it'd be different.  They can't, so it's not. 

*(I didn't use them beyond "always keep this aura/ ability on because, damnit it's stupid that I have to waste 3 seconds of combat time buffing every 5 steps. )

[Xuri]

I seem to get excellent FPS in the demo overall, but (oh snap, the demo just crashed as I alt-tabbed out to write this post) there is weird lag/delay between every single line of dialogue which doesn't make a good first impression on me.

I'm trying to play the demo right now (or I was until it crashed, anyway), but so far I've encountered too many annoyances to be able to enjoy it. Those delays between lines of dialogue. Loading occurring in the middle of an action sequence/dialogue. Characters with fancy facial expressions in the cutscenes - but with eyes that always look straight forward. The eyes are what make the characters come to life, and when they just keep looking straight ahead when the characters turn their heads (try it), it spoils the entire effect. Also, the camera auto-rotates to look down on the ground when I move. STOP FUCKING WITH MY CAMERA, Bioware! Gah! Either give me no control whatsoever or leave it completely up to me. Also, old people aren't young-looking people with wrinkle-textures applied on top of their face. My character's mother looks like she could be his slightly older sister.

Graphics are fancy overall, but the landscapes shown early in the demo look bland and boring, with lots and lots of invisible walls to keep me from straying from the path.

So, yeah. First impression - not really all that impressed. Will give it another whirl to see if I can get past these issues - though I'll likely have to start over after the crash.

[Sjofn]

I think I said it before, but in combat I find the animations are completely spazzy (I can't decide if melee rogues or 2h warriors are doofier), but functionally it seems pretty fun, so I'm glad about that, as I'll get used to tuning out the animations (seriously every time I paused during the Isabella boss fight I was like "wtf is that woman doing now?"). I did find myself wishing for tactical view for AE placement, though, and I imagine I will be SUPER wishing for that when I turn FF on. It's the only time I really ever used it in DA:O (I love grenades  ), so I was surprised to find myself pining for it, but there it is. Hopefully that will be another "I'll get used to it" area.

I hate the new darkspawn look. A lot. I don't super love a lot of the new art direction (I do love New Flemeth, though, but I love Flemeth in every respect anyway), but I can get used to what I don't like except the new darkspawn. So I'm really glad I probably won't have to fight them a whole bunch. The ogre in particular just ... isn't intimidating in the least. I think it's the skin color that bugs me most. I also dislike that the tutorial takes place on Mars. I'm sure their thinking was "this land has been blighted so it should look shitty!" but it didn't really look like "ravaged, blighted land you're circling back through," it looked like "random patch of rock."

I really don't get the "Carver is useless" and "waaaah I don't want Carver ever" stuff I've been reading (not just here). He didn't seem useless at all (2h warriors are mean and whirlwind was HILARIOUS). Is it because he doesn't have boobs? Because frankly, I'M annoyed I won't get him unless I play a stupid mage. I guess that's extra motivation for me to bother with one.

Speaking of siblings that do or do not have boobs, Ingmar theorized Bethany has a huge rack because Varric has a crush on her, which made me laugh. LadyHawke herself amuses me because she's straight up flat in her warrior outfit, which looks extra hilarious when she's standing next to Boobed Avenger Isabella. I guess she has her father's boobs, as MamaHawke was not exactly lacking either.

[Merusk]

Carver just irritated me in the tutorial because he seemed somewhat overwrought and whiny.  This is just a brief glimpse so I can't make any real judgments on that point.   I didn't see him as useless, though.  Far from it actually, as he was a decent damage dealer.

I forgot to mention the lack of tactical pan & zoom.  Irritated the hell out of me as a few times I'd try to cast a fireball and came out of pause only to find I hadn't clicked close or far enough away because it was at the far edge of the zoom.  Quite a nuisance.

[Lantyssa]

I really don't get the "Carver is useless" and "waaaah I don't want Carver ever" stuff I've been reading (not just here). He didn't seem useless at all (2h warriors are mean and whirlwind was HILARIOUS). Is it because he doesn't have boobs? Because frankly, I'M annoyed I won't get him unless I play a stupid mage. I guess that's extra motivation for me to bother with one.

Does that mean you don't get Bethany if you play a mage?  I wanted to do a mage duo.

[koro]

I really don't get the "Carver is useless" and "waaaah I don't want Carver ever" stuff I've been reading (not just here). He didn't seem useless at all (2h warriors are mean and whirlwind was HILARIOUS). Is it because he doesn't have boobs? Because frankly, I'M annoyed I won't get him unless I play a stupid mage. I guess that's extra motivation for me to bother with one.

Does that mean you don't get Bethany if you play a mage?  I wanted to do a mage duo.

Bethany died for me (quite brutally  ) when I played as a mage, so it looks that way.

[Mazakiel]

Yeah, unfortunately, Carver's for the mage Hawkes, and Bethany for the melee Hawkes.  I wager changing that will be one of the first mods someone puts together once the game goes live. 

[Paelos]

They're not people, they're game pieces.  Also, my approach goes back to playing gold box games where I  AM the whole party, so each piece is a little bit of me in the world.

When I'm playing a game I want the characters to be characters, not me. That was the point. I want to be entertained by some personalities and their own quirks and combat styles.

Different strokes I guess.

[Sjofn]

Yeah, unfortunately, Carver's for the mage Hawkes, and Bethany for the melee Hawkes.  I wager changing that will be one of the first mods someone puts together once the game goes live. 

The devs have stressed several places that such a mod would utterly break the game story-wise, so I'm thinking Only One Mage Hawke is important for some reason.

Carver had what, two lines? Neither were whiny to me. One was a typical brotherly "wtf are you trying to blame ME for" when Bethany basically implied it was his fault they didn't leave earlier (I assume because it took him a while to get to Lothering from Ostagar) and ... I can't even remember what he said after Bethany died.

By the way did anyone else think the complete lack of reaction from anyone but MamaHawke to the sibling death was a little psycho? Poor Ser Redshirt's death was a lot sadder, because Aveline was allowed to sound upset. It showed me part of why I don't like the voiced protagonist. Here we have a voice that is supposed to keep us from the horror of the stone faced mute, but they deliver their lines so flatly (because God forbid there be too much emotion, because douchebags would wail that their character is a whiner) I really don't see any improvement at all. At least my mute Cousland had the decency to look sad about the situation her parents wound up in.

I see the potential in a voice protagonist, but it's probably always going to take me out of the game instead of draw me in, and I'm a little sad about it, I guess.

[Mazakiel]

Yeah, unfortunately, Carver's for the mage Hawkes, and Bethany for the melee Hawkes.  I wager changing that will be one of the first mods someone puts together once the game goes live. 

The devs have stressed several places that such a mod would utterly break the game story-wise, so I'm thinking Only One Mage Hawke is important for some reason.

Carver had what, two lines? Neither were whiny to me. One was a typical brotherly "wtf are you trying to blame ME for" when Bethany basically implied it was his fault they didn't leave earlier (I assume because it took him a while to get to Lothering from Ostagar) and ... I can't even remember what he said after Bethany died.

By the way did anyone else think the complete lack of reaction from anyone but MamaHawke to the sibling death was a little psycho? Poor Ser Redshirt's death was a lot sadder, because Aveline was allowed to sound upset. It showed me part of why I don't like the voiced protagonist. Here we have a voice that is supposed to keep us from the horror of the stone faced mute, but they deliver their lines so flatly (because God forbid there be too much emotion, because douchebags would wail that their character is a whiner) I really don't see any improvement at all. At least my mute Cousland had the decency to look sad about the situation her parents wound up in.

I see the potential in a voice protagonist, but it's probably always going to take me out of the game instead of draw me in, and I'm a little sad about it, I guess.

Hmm.  I'll be curious to see how there only being one mage from the family works out to be important. 

As to the voice thing, it didn't strike me as too off.  Hawke's whole thing in that sequence is to keep the family moving so that they can try to escape.  That being said, I'm willing to overlook occasionally off lines.  I much prefer voiced protagonists to mute ones anymore. 

[Ingmar]

The conversation scene with LadyHawke standing next to Isabela always makes me think of this picture:


Carver has a douche face, I think that is his main problem.

[tmp]

The ogre in particular just ... isn't intimidating in the least. I think it's the skin color that bugs me most.

I suspect that may be because the new ogre armour has perfect shape and colour combination to make him look just like the sweet transvestite from Transexual, Transylvania. Combine that with every single darkspawn looking the same now and their tendency to play their animations in perfect sync, and all that's missing is appropriate music.

For the siblings, it seems like the story has some sort of mage/no mage sibling conflict planned down the road and so they ensure the game always keeps one of either.

[Sjofn]

Hmm.  I'll be curious to see how there only being one mage from the family works out to be important. 

As to the voice thing, it didn't strike me as too off.  Hawke's whole thing in that sequence is to keep the family moving so that they can try to escape.  That being said, I'm willing to overlook occasionally off lines.  I much prefer voiced protagonists to mute ones anymore. 

I think a big theme is going to be Templars versus Mages, so having one half of the pair NOT being considered a threat to society will play into that dynamic somehow. So thinking about it, Carver probably WILL wind up being a dick in some way, because HE'S not a mage, why does he gotta hide from Templars? Because of his stupid APOSTATE SIBLING. Grr! I am looking forward to the sibling thing though, probably because I am a big sister to three siblings. 

It wasn't just Hawke's complete lack of interest in Sibling Death that bugged me (although I maintain having at least ONE of those damn "we need to keep going" options at least sound strained in a "shit, I am trying to keep it together here but oh my God Carver/Bethany totally just died" way would go a long way ... you could even use a tragedy mask for those sorts of things, to go with the comedy ATTENTION THIS IS THE SARCASTIC ONE mask!). The living sibling doesn't seem terribly upset either. Of course, if they did, I'm sure people would complain they're whining. I look forward to complaints about Aveline being too emotional because she doesn't get over her husband dying in ten minutes (not necessarily here, of course).

[Lantyssa]

How blasé the siblings were did bother me.  I can kind of see it for the main character, trying to keep everyone alert and not dead, but "I'll mourn later" way.  I agree there should at least be a hint of putting them on the edge of breakdown.  They lost their dad, now this, yet the most you get is a bored "we should keep moving".

[Mazakiel]

Well, to be fair, their dad they lost several years before the game starts, according to the codex. 

As to sibling rivalry stuff, going off of the default relationship values I recall seeing on their character screens, it looks like if you have Carver, the default dynamic will along the lines of a 'Stupid apostate sibling getting me into all this shit....'.  It looks like at least initially, you'll have gotten along a lot better with Bethany.  And one of the lines you can go with when you meet Ser Redshirt is basically a 'Touch my sister and die.'

[tmp]

And one of the lines you can go with when you meet Ser Redshirt is basically a 'Touch my sister and die.'

Of course, with the way she's dressing Hawke probably has to use that particular line quite a bit

[Morfiend]

They're not people, they're game pieces.  Also, my approach goes back to playing gold box games where I  AM the whole party, so each piece is a little bit of me in the world.

When I'm playing a game I want the characters to be characters, not me. That was the point. I want to be entertained by some personalities and their own quirks and combat styles.

Different strokes I guess.

I totally agree with Paelos. I would rather I didn't have to manage the other party members so much. In DA:O on my second play through I played on easy, just so that I didnt have to micromanage, and also to turn off FF. It did make the game a bit to easy though.

[Sophismata]

The demo hasn't sold this for me. The stupid animations, continued ridiculous presence of blood on everyone forever, constant brief but annoying pauses to load, requirement to spam 'R' and repeat the same (stupid) animations over and over again, and (most irritatingly) lack of a tactical zoom have destroyed any desire I had to purchase or play this game. Which is unfortunate for me, I guess. (Also the game is FAR too easy, Bioware suck at managing their difficulty scaling in a way that isn't annoying, and low cooldown potion and temporary buff spam annoys me).

[Mosesandstick]

After spending god knows how many damn hours on DA1, I wouldn't want to play DA2 without all the blood, even if it's a bit stupid. Hopefully it means we get another mabari...

[Sophismata]

After spending god knows how many damn hours on DA1, I wouldn't want to play DA2 without all the blood, even if it's a bit stupid. Hopefully it means we get another mabari...

From a quick skim of the store earlier, the mabari is DLC or something. There's an underground bazaar you can buy, or comes with pre-ordering/collector's edition, etc. Might even be there by default (free DLC like in the first game).

[Merusk]

From the vid linked earlier the Mabari isn't a character like it was in DA1.  From what I gathered it works more like the summoned monsters in DA1 (Spiders, Wolves, etc.)  You can buy it for your party but I thought they said that DA1 owners would get it as a perk of owning/ importing.  It was brief though, so I could be making it up in my head.

[Ingmar]

The demo hasn't sold this for me. The stupid animations, continued ridiculous presence of blood on everyone forever, constant brief but annoying pauses to load, requirement to spam 'R' and repeat the same (stupid) animations over and over again, and (most irritatingly) lack of a tactical zoom have destroyed any desire I had to purchase or play this game. Which is unfortunate for me, I guess. (Also the game is FAR too easy, Bioware suck at managing their difficulty scaling in a way that isn't annoying, and low cooldown potion and temporary buff spam annoys me).

You can turn the persistent blood off in the options. What does R even do? I certainly don't feel required to spam it. What do you mean by tactical zoom? Seems like I can zoom in or out far enough to manage things fine?

The demo is easy, but it is a demo, odds are good they made it easy on purpose.

[Sjofn]

After spending god knows how many damn hours on DA1, I wouldn't want to play DA2 without all the blood, even if it's a bit stupid. Hopefully it means we get another mabari...

I know a summonable mabari comes with the pre-order Bazaar whatsit shit, but I don't know if it will be a New Copy thing or not.

I will be turning off the blood in DA2, personally, as it got even stupider looking this time around. It looks less like blood splatters to me and more like everyone was helping paint the kitchen red and were being sloppy about it. I wish there was a slider to tone down the "every creature you attack is nothing but a sack of blood ready to explode at the slightest touch" thing as well, but what can you do. SOMEONE at Bioware thinks the blood is totally X-TREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEME, so I guess we're stuck with it.

[Ingmar]

Given that darkspawn blood is supposed to be like super poisonous omg it will kill you, you'd think people would be more careful about splashing it around all the time.

[Sjofn]

Maybe darkspawn evolved to explode in a shower of blood for just that reason.