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Author Topic: Obligatory WUA UO post! Game free through the 12th!  (Read 84166 times)
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #140 on: October 19, 2010, 02:56:26 PM

Sorry champ, but you're the one who said a simple system would encourage people to use their own crafting characters instead of buying items from dedicated crafters. Now you have to explain how a system which discourages people from using their own crafting characters with the addition of pointless clicking is anything but tedious by definition. You're left trying to claim that A=B but B≠A and you're floundering.

So either answer the fucking question or piss off back to some soft safe forum where nobody can call you a fucking tool for being a hardcore MMO guy for years and still not being able to define "cooldown" in a way that doesn't make a board full of people shake their heads.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #141 on: October 19, 2010, 03:13:02 PM

Sorry champ, but you're the one who said a simple system would encourage people to use their own crafting characters instead of buying items from dedicated crafters. Now you have to explain how a system which discourages people from using their own crafting characters with the addition of pointless clicking is anything but tedious by definition. You're left trying to claim that A=B but B≠A and you're floundering.
I need a reference as to what you deem an acceptable level of crafting. Making 3 items to fire a cannon shot does not seem very tedious to me. I want to know what game you think does a better job at this so I can respond to you.
Cadaverine
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1655


Reply #142 on: October 19, 2010, 03:42:13 PM

I'm just gonna assume this is a gimmick account of WUA's, and he's arguing with himself for laughs.

Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats.
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #143 on: October 19, 2010, 03:45:05 PM

No. You've been quoting the last three sentences of posts and trying to avoid giving a meaningful response to anything for a while now. Forget that I exist. Forget that we're talking about UO in particular. I want you to tell me the difference between these two things.

1) This adds extra steps and thus encourages people with crafting mules to buy their items instead.
2) This adds extra steps so tedious that people who could do it themselves would rather pay money than bother.

Spoiler alert, there is no damn difference. The same way there's no difference between "a delay to keep you from spamming" and a cooldown.

Frankly I think you're wrong and the crafting shit won't even stop anyone from muling. (It's going to get me to start muling, if they ever add a good reason for me to participate.) That doesn't make what you said any less conceptually ridiculous. The crafting bullshit isn't a huge roadblock, it's just laughably pointless because it serves no purpose whatsoever.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
Sheepherder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5192


Reply #144 on: October 19, 2010, 04:16:39 PM

I'm just gonna assume this is a gimmick account of WUA's, and he's arguing with himself for laughs.

The "cooldowns are lazy design" from a guy playing the online successor to (a series of) games that invented (AFAIK) variable swing speeds in a pseudo real time game is a dead giveaway.
Soulflame
Terracotta Army
Posts: 6486


Reply #145 on: October 19, 2010, 04:20:35 PM

The biggest problem with UO trades, any crafting annoyances aside, is the lack of a centralized selling system.  I remember I managed to find an armor/weapon vendor, bought items from that person for months, and then one day the restocking stopped.

I made my own blacksmith at that point, because I didn't want to:
1. Traverse near and far until I found a vendor that restocked on a reasonably frequent basis
2. I didn't want to depend on that person, knowing they'd probably stop someday
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #146 on: October 19, 2010, 05:36:50 PM

No. You've been quoting the last three sentences of posts and trying to avoid giving a meaningful response to anything for a while now.
The last time I quoted the first paragraph?

You just don't like my response so you are ignoring it. I am not going to respond to every single point because it would be boring writing an essay. This isn't Stratics. I am responding to what I think is most important.


Quote
I want you to tell me the difference between these two things.

1) This adds extra steps and thus encourages people with crafting mules to buy their items instead.
2) This adds extra steps so tedious that people who could do it themselves would rather pay money than bother.

Spoiler alert, there is no damn difference. The same way there's no difference between "a delay to keep you from spamming" and a cooldown.

Frankly I think you're wrong and the crafting shit won't even stop anyone from muling. (It's going to get me to start muling, if they ever add a good reason for me to participate.) That doesn't make what you said any less conceptually ridiculous. The crafting bullshit isn't a huge roadblock, it's just laughably pointless because it serves no purpose whatsoever.
I don't really know how to respond because the question you asked me isn't a question.

It is very obvious you don't like crafting in general. It is a pretty niche area of MMOs which few people enjoy compared to monster bashing or PVP combat. You even mentioned earlier you don't have a crafter. But just because you don't enjoy it does not mean it should be changed. I don't enjoy fishing. Should they rework it to satisfy me? For the people who do enjoy crafting and want to play with it, you have to design it for them. The people who seem to be complaining about cannon crafting are non-crafters at the moment.

In the past couple of years the UO developers have been struggling to make crafting as enjoyable and profitable as it used to be. In Mondain's Legacy and Stygian Abyss they added rare material drops to high end monsters. But that didn't work. Now they are trying out something new by having several components go into something which gets used up. It only costs about 50 gold to make a cannon shot. The real investment is the time spent putting it together.

So you have a choice, hunt monsters for gold and buy cannonballs or craft them yourself. Either way you get your items.
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #147 on: October 19, 2010, 05:38:26 PM

The biggest problem with UO trades, any crafting annoyances aside, is the lack of a centralized selling system.
For the past several years there have been websites which search every vendor in the game for you. Everyone is using these.
Cheddar
I like pink
Posts: 4987

Noob Sauce


Reply #148 on: October 19, 2010, 05:40:41 PM

The biggest problem with UO trades, any crafting annoyances aside, is the lack of a centralized selling system.
For the past several years there have been websites which search every vendor in the game for you. Everyone is using these.

Post an introduction thread in general and people will take you more seriously.  I think thats the disconnect everyone is having.

No Nerf, but I put a link to this very thread and I said that you all can guarantee for my purity. I even mentioned your case, and see if they can take a look at your lawn from a Michigan perspective.
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #149 on: October 19, 2010, 05:44:03 PM

I think the disconnect people are having is a few people already know who I am and just don't like me.  Ohhhhh, I see.
Cheddar
I like pink
Posts: 4987

Noob Sauce


Reply #150 on: October 19, 2010, 05:46:52 PM

I think the disconnect people are having is a few people already know who I am and just don't like me.  Ohhhhh, I see.

There are like... 3 people who have sub'd to UO since 2001 around here.  No one knows you.  Just posts a quick intro thread, it will do wonders.

No Nerf, but I put a link to this very thread and I said that you all can guarantee for my purity. I even mentioned your case, and see if they can take a look at your lawn from a Michigan perspective.
sinij
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2597


WWW
Reply #151 on: October 19, 2010, 05:48:34 PM

Psychos.

I don't even need to quote, we all know who you are. The only thing that missing now are charts.

Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.
sinij
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2597


WWW
Reply #152 on: October 19, 2010, 05:50:53 PM

I think the disconnect people are having is a few people already know who I am and just don't like me.  Ohhhhh, I see.

Sorry to bring it to you, but we don't give a fuck... so from now on you are "that crafting guy".

Yes, we eat our young here.

Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #153 on: October 19, 2010, 05:53:57 PM

I don't even need to quote, we all know who you are. The only thing that missing now are charts.
How to craft a Powder Charge



How to craft a fuse cord (which I mislabeled a match cord)

Cheddar
I like pink
Posts: 4987

Noob Sauce


Reply #154 on: October 19, 2010, 05:58:53 PM

I don't even need to quote, we all know who you are. The only thing that missing now are charts.
How to craft a Powder Charge



How to craft a fuse cord (which I mislabeled a match cord)



WUA proof.  Ignore Mr. JC

No Nerf, but I put a link to this very thread and I said that you all can guarantee for my purity. I even mentioned your case, and see if they can take a look at your lawn from a Michigan perspective.
Ashamanchill
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2274


Reply #155 on: October 19, 2010, 06:59:21 PM

Rasix pass some of that popcorn this way.

A poster signed by Richard Garriot, Brad McQuaid, Marc Jacobs and SmerricK Dart.  Of course it would arrive a couple years late, missing letters and a picture but it would be epic none the less. -Tmon
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #156 on: October 19, 2010, 06:59:37 PM

I like how you are claiming I am a regular here and making my name out to be a conspiracy.

All I wanted to point out was cannons are not difficult to figure out, lol.
Rasix
Moderator
Posts: 15024

I am the harbinger of your doom!


Reply #157 on: October 19, 2010, 07:03:47 PM


-Rasix
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #158 on: October 19, 2010, 07:18:25 PM

You've given up trying to argue that a cooldown isn't a cooldown because of random reasons that nobody else can understand, now you're blathering to get out of explaining your own words. Look at these again.

1) This adds extra steps and thus encourages people with crafting mules to buy their items instead.
2) This adds extra steps so tedious that people who could do it themselves would rather pay money than bother.

You stated number one. I stated number two and you objected, even though they're the exact same goddamn thing. I'm not really interested in naming some other game's crafting so you can run around counting how many clicks it takes. Instead I'll just post my own chart, incorporating yours and adding my own MSPainted icons because I'm too lazy to clip real ones, showing everything it takes to go from raw materials to firing a cannon.

BEHOLD THE ELEGANCE! My favorite is still the eight-icon block that all goes into making a match.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #159 on: October 19, 2010, 07:59:28 PM

I'm not even going to bother anymore. You are all over the place and I have gone over the same explanation several times and you just keep coming back with "oh you're not responding to this, this and this". I understand your opinion that every item should be crafted in 1 button press. I don't think that is how it should be. We will all just have to live with you being wrong.
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #160 on: October 19, 2010, 08:45:49 PM

You've blatantly ignored the same request to explain the difference between what you espouse and sheer tedium, you've long since given up trying to explain your nonsensical opinion on what constitutes a cooldown, and you've embarrassed yourself with the ridiculous notion that anyone here besides me knows or could possibly give a shit who the hell you are.

You've done nothing but make an asshole out of yourself, say stupid things, go silent or frantically try to change the subject when confronted with how stupid they are, and then make dipshit posts like this about how clearly right you are. Fuck back off to wherever you came from.

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #161 on: October 19, 2010, 09:02:42 PM

It is extremely obvious you've grown frustrated that you haven't gotten me to respond with a huge rant. You are just attempting to bait me into blowing up over your circular replies. Anyone who reads our exchange from the start can see I attempted to explain that the new cannon related crafting is a lot more simple than you made it out to be. I also attempted to explain how it is a good attempt to revive crafting in UO which is currently a shadow of its former self. Here at the end of our exchange you are practically screaming "look at these words, tell me how they are not the same!" I've already accepted your opinion, why can't you let it go?
Slyfeind
Terracotta Army
Posts: 2037


Reply #162 on: October 19, 2010, 09:13:07 PM

My faith in JCtheBuilder is shattered. :( I will continue to believe.

"Role playing in an MMO is more like an open orchestra with no conductor, anyone of any skill level can walk in at any time, and everyone brings their own instrument and plays whatever song they want.  Then toss PvP into the mix and things REALLY get ugly!" -Count Nerfedalot
Sheepherder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5192


Reply #163 on: October 19, 2010, 09:26:56 PM

[image]
Setting the mood.

Also, since this place actually gets mod traffic I might as well mention that one of the IPY threads in the UO subforum has been severely douched up.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 09:30:03 PM by Sheepherder »
Lantyssa
Terracotta Army
Posts: 20848


Reply #164 on: October 19, 2010, 09:28:30 PM

I love crafting.  Mindlessly gathering a bunch of materials and clicking a lot is not crafting.  It's repetitive motion for people with OCD.

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #165 on: October 19, 2010, 10:08:34 PM

Also, since this place actually gets mod traffic I might as well mention that one of the IPY threads in the UO subforum has been severely douched up.
The topic asked if IPY would deliver. I posted my opinion that it wouldn't. Then someone goes off saying IPY was the holy grail of UO gaming and people flocked to it and it was actually more popular than real shards. Then he goes on to claim EA shards suffer from up to 2 hours of downtime per day (lol, try 20 minutes past 8 years).

I'm sorry, for some reason I just set some people off by trying to correct false information.
Sheepherder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5192


Reply #166 on: October 19, 2010, 11:29:49 PM

I'm sorry, for some reason I just set some people off by trying to correct false information.

No, you set people off by being an assgoblin of the highest order who evidently feels the need to fall to his knees and phallate EA at every opportunity, while trolling some dude who's making a freeshard for a now shitty game made during the neolithic era, and another dude who absolutely does not need to be trolled at all in order for him to get into batshit insane arguments. (but we love him anyways)  Then, you rebut with a passive-aggressive deflection of blame onto other people for taking objection to your reasonable corrections, which are seemingly some sort of self-obfuscation designed to prevent yourself from realizing that every fucking game ever made makes extensive use of some form of timing mechanics to prevent imbalance, and that UO's convoluted crafting trees and heavy emphasis on shittons of player input to make and fire a cannon are fucking woefully outdated shit.  Likely a result of you being a tool and living in a fucking cave for the last seven years.

I'm sorry, but for some reason people think I'm an asshole.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 11:34:16 PM by Sheepherder »
Arthur_Parker
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5865

Internet Detective


Reply #167 on: October 20, 2010, 12:02:41 AM

I think the disconnect people are having is a few people already know who I am and just don't like me.  Ohhhhh, I see.

There are like... 3 people who have sub'd to UO since 2001 around here.  No one knows you.  Just posts a quick intro thread, it will do wonders.

I don't want him banned for an intro thread.  

Stratics account with 2,412 posts, youtube channel, blog

Quote
JC THE BUILDER
EAST X-ROADS, FELUCCA, ATLANTIC

He plays on felucca, looks like WUA Kryptonite to me, so welcome.

Edit to add, It just occurred to me, maybe that trammel thing was a bad idea.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 12:07:17 AM by Arthur_Parker »
jcthebuilder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 58


Reply #168 on: October 20, 2010, 12:35:07 AM

I still reside in the same house on Felucca Atlantic if anyone wants to come pay a visit. I would probably kill you though.



You missed a link to the guild I'm in: http://www.hot-guild.com
My main character profile: http://my.uo.com/cgi-bin/my_chars.pl?52616e646f6d49565961cde26cf0ccc53a9bc40b44fd791838dc9c2bb91b9aa6b9d2c9a16bfa0065c6dff5a8822bcd73
I used to post videos on Veoh before Youtube became good: http://www.veoh.com/collection/ultimaonline
My favorite ice cream is Strawberry
Arthur_Parker
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5865

Internet Detective


Reply #169 on: October 20, 2010, 01:36:46 AM

You've done nothing but make an asshole out of yourself, say stupid things, go silent or frantically try to change the subject when confronted with how stupid they are, and then make dipshit posts like this about how clearly right you are. Fuck back off to wherever you came from.

I know exactly what he's getting at.  He's playing a game that the vast majority of people here have moved on from, he's defending their implementation of a crafting change for a game he still likes and plays.  I'm not sure I agree with him about the crafting involved to make a cannon ball, although his point about combat being more complicated because you need to think about crafting actions during combat is perfectly valid, but I certainly don't agree that everything would be better by adding a global cool down.

In an argument over simple cool down verus tracking mountain goats down, skinning them, boiling their hides, stealing a leprechaun purse during a full moon and then combining it all with the blood of a virgin, while near a magic whirlpool, just to make a cannonball or whatever stupid shit is involved.  At least with the mountain goats idea, I can ask how high the mountains are.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 01:38:20 AM by Arthur_Parker »
WindupAtheist
Army of One
Posts: 7028

Badicalthon


Reply #170 on: October 20, 2010, 01:53:30 AM

If anything in WoW that involved shooting a cannon expected you to carry around a ramrod to load it, and a swab to clean it afterward, and don't forget to put a fuse in it, and so forth, there would be riots. At the end of the day, having four buttons to click in order to shoot really isn't any more fun than one.

In any case, I don't really care about that. If they made it worthwhile to do so, I'd click my four "SHOOT->ORLY?->YARLY!->SHOOT!!!" buttons just to have something new to do. The main thing I spent a few days trolling Stratics over is the lack of reward for bothering in the first place.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 01:56:37 AM by WindupAtheist »

"You're just a dick who quotes himself in his sig."  --  Schild
"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
Reg
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5270


Reply #171 on: October 20, 2010, 01:58:26 AM

The flame war with JC has been fun but I wish you could get some of the really awful Stratics characters over here. That Popps guy would be amazing!
Arthur_Parker
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5865

Internet Detective


Reply #172 on: October 20, 2010, 02:05:25 AM

If anything in WoW that involved shooting a cannon expected you to carry around a ramrod to load it, and a swab to clean it afterward, and don't forget to put a fuse in it, and so forth, there would be riots. At the end of the day, having four buttons to click in order to shoot really isn't any more fun than one.

I suspect someone else will wander along and bother sooner or later, someone who hasn't already had their fill of flaming Stratics tards who missed (or failed to understand) the last 10 years of MMO design.

Stop for a second and think do you believe UO should be more like WoW, UO should be like the better version of EQ?  Is the lesson from the last ten years that all games should be like WoW because that's the most popular way to design a game?  Instead of people suspecting you are arguing with yourself via a gimmick account, you want me to quote you saying the exact opposite?  Saying there's room in the market for a sandbox mmo with a few hundred thousand subs?
Sheepherder
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5192


Reply #173 on: October 20, 2010, 03:36:10 AM

Stop for a second and think do you believe UO should be more like WoW

Yes?  Is that supposed to be hard or at all objectionable?
Reg
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5270


Reply #174 on: October 20, 2010, 03:44:52 AM

What on earth would be the point of turning a 12 year old game into a 12 year old bad copy of WoW?  They're well past the stage of attracting new users.  At this point their best bet is just to hold on to as many of the old users as they can for as long as they can.  If those people wanted WoW that's what they'd be playing already.
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