Bioshock: Infinite

[KallDrexx]

"Duke Nukem is filth, John Carmack is married to an Asian, Red Faction is neither an FPS or pro-nationalist, and the first BioShocks were terrible." - Loland

lol

[Paelos]

I liked that one of comments was written by "End White Genocide Now"

Oh man. The irony, she is so very heavy.

[Samwise]

I may finish it at some point, but my inital reaction was to just wait near this lighthouse for help. The story makes no sense to me. Why would I ever get in that sub?

Because WOULD YOU KINDLY get into the sub?

[Malakili]

I may finish it at some point, but my inital reaction was to just wait near this lighthouse for help. The story makes no sense to me. Why would I ever get in that sub?

Because WOULD YOU KINDLY get into the sub?

I feel like the game would have been so much better without that 

[Samwise]

I thought it was a pretty clever use of narrative to excuse (via lampshade) a lame (but common) gameplay trope.

[bhodi]

Me too. It was pretty much the only thing to distinguish it from all the other decent AAA FPS titles I've played. I don't get the hype for the new bioshock except that since it was marketed like crazy, everyone's talking about it and I guess a subset of those people want to play it.

[Fabricated]

Bioshock again was pretty good IMO. Shallow compared to System Shock 1/2 but I think it nailed the atmosphere pretty well, had memorable set pieces, and was generally fun enough to be worth a playthrough...one playthrough. I imagine this will be the same.

I better write an article about how it's GAME OF THE DECADE GAMING'S CITIZEN KANE MOMENT

Can we call Colonial Marines gaming's "Baseketball moment"? Can SimCity be gaming's "Waterworld"?

[HaemishM]

I liked Baseketball.

[Hoax]

I enjoy all the interviews with Levine where Bioshock 2 is literally never ever mentioned. They must agree to that beforehand or something.

[Evildrider]

I liked Baseketball.

I also liked Baseketball.


Steeeeeeeeeeeeeeve Perry!

[Kail]

I thought it was a pretty clever use of narrative to excuse (via lampshade) a lame (but common) gameplay trope.

I had the exact opposite opinion.  I saw them intentionally break the fourth wall (Wonder why our game world is linear despite allegedly being a "city?" It's because of mind control, not limited game development resources at all!) for no reason other than to wink at the audience ("Hey, I'm cured of the mind control now, I guess that means I'm free to..." NEW OBJECTIVE RECEIVED) which dragged any immersion I had out behind a shed and murdered it.  From that point on, I couldn't get into the game as a setting, it was just a video game with some tired mechanics and a ridiculous story I had to progress through.  Why can I carry a million guns and ten tons of ammo at once, is that a plot point?  Is there some magic plasmid explaining how I can run for three hours straight without getting tired?  What magical convergence of ley lines causes nothing but vending machines selling bullets to survive the apocalypse?  I assume there must be an explanation for all this stuff, right?  Otherwise, you would just be lampshading something for the purpose of lampshading it, which is just lazy.

I can ignore logical flaws or shortcuts in the gameplay if you don't have a choice, but don't point them out like you're proud of them and then expect me to coo with appreciation that you managed to awkwardly wedge it in to your already fairly nonsensical narrative.

[Ruvaldt]

I enjoy all the interviews with Levine where Bioshock 2 is literally never ever mentioned. They must agree to that beforehand or something.

That's probably because he passed on Bioshock 2 and had nothing to do with its development.  Bioshock 2 was made by 2k Marin, not Irrational Games.

He was asked about it a lot when he decided not to do it, but there isn't much else to ask beside that.

[Ironwood]

I thought it was a pretty clever use of narrative to excuse (via lampshade) a lame (but common) gameplay trope.

I had the exact opposite opinion.  I saw them intentionally break the fourth wall (Wonder why our game world is linear despite allegedly being a "city?" It's because of mind control, not limited game development resources at all!) for no reason other than to wink at the audience ("Hey, I'm cured of the mind control now, I guess that means I'm free to..." NEW OBJECTIVE RECEIVED) which dragged any immersion I had out behind a shed and murdered it.  From that point on, I couldn't get into the game as a setting, it was just a video game with some tired mechanics and a ridiculous story I had to progress through.  Why can I carry a million guns and ten tons of ammo at once, is that a plot point?  Is there some magic plasmid explaining how I can run for three hours straight without getting tired?  What magical convergence of ley lines causes nothing but vending machines selling bullets to survive the apocalypse?  I assume there must be an explanation for all this stuff, right?  Otherwise, you would just be lampshading something for the purpose of lampshading it, which is just lazy.

I can ignore logical flaws or shortcuts in the gameplay if you don't have a choice, but don't point them out like you're proud of them and then expect me to coo with appreciation that you managed to awkwardly wedge it in to your already fairly nonsensical narrative.

Actually, I agree with both of you, which is why I wanted the game to end after that bit.

Because it was clever and it made everything after make no fucking sense.

[Ironwood]

But I'm only talking about the story, the game itself was shit even up to that point.

Shit.

[Segoris]

I liked Baseketball.

I'm with you, I liked Baseketball. Quite a bit actually.

I also liked Baseketball.
Steeeeeeeeeeeeeeve Perry!

Hey you said no more Journey psychouts.

I still sometimes pull out the Steve Perry, and also - "Your sister is going out with Squeeks!"

http://www.destructoid.com/racists-call-bioshock-infinite-a-white-killing-simulator-240586.phtml

I ... sigh. Just sigh.

I wonder how many of them play Madden, or anything else sports related.

[Surlyboi]

http://www.destructoid.com/racists-call-bioshock-infinite-a-white-killing-simulator-240586.phtml

I ... sigh. Just sigh.

I kinda want to fund a game called, "Kill Whitey" Just to watch these douchebags' heads literally asplode.

[Rasix]

I'm not minding killing the racists.  It's quite satisfying.

The game so far is just Bioshock 3. Or 2 if you want to ignore the one that no one played (I didn't).  The gunplay feels a bit improved.

[Phildo]

Yes, but is it fun?

[Khaldun]

Started it. Good art direction, they actually know something about American history, and...it's Bioshock 3. Same formula. Totally on rails.

In many ways, I think the Bioshock games are really adventure games, not FPS. Adventure games with a little FPS minigame stuck inside.

It's not only that you can't go anywhere but the narrow corridors that you're meant to go on. There are other things that don't make sense and didn't make sense in either of the other Bioshocks. If it were a novel, I would point out that it has a very strange point-of-view that doesn't really work creatively. You are the protagonist, but the protagonist is a bad combination of a specific and a general character. He says specific but often quite stupidly general things in response to environment and events, as if he's talking to you. But he's not narrating, omnisciently or otherwise--he doesn't tell you all the things that "he" knows. So you're forced to do things without even knowing why you're doing them, even though you are controlling a character who DOES know. You are rowed to a lighthouse in Maine where there are ominous signs. A sensible person would just turn around and go away. But you don't--so you have a reason for expecting these things and going onward. But he doesn't say what that is, and yet also reacts with surprise to some of what he sees. Why is he surprised and yet not surprised? Is he expecting a city in the clouds? It sort of seems so and yet it doesn't seem so. Because that's the dumb way they've chosen to build the story in all these games: with a person who is part of the story and yet not part of the story, who is both the player and not the player.

I'd just as soon watch it and not be pretending to play it. It's interesting enough as a creative work, which is why all the reviewers are spurting all over it--because in the exquisitely dumb landscape that is contemporary video game storytelling, it does look like "Citizen Kane" in one sense. But it's really, really not--Citizen Kane rethought its medium, expanded the boundaries of what a film (and a cinematic narrative) could be. Bioshock Infinite has a crippled structure as a game and a world--it is at best a terribly traditional structure to a very passive kind of game.

[rk47]

In many ways, I think the Bioshock games are really adventure games, not FPS shit FPS games.

[Velorath]

I disagree with Khaldun on a couple points. First is that in a lot of parts so far I don't find the corridors all that narrow. Some are, but a number of them so far have also had a good amount if side areas to explore along with an occasional optional goal. The annoying thing there is that since you can't save the game (it only has a checkpoint system) I'll spend a lot of time exploring an area and the have to force myself to push forward to a checkpoint in order to save before I turn the game off.

Also, having only played around 4-5 hours so far, I feel like they do a fairly good job of filling in what your character does and doesn't know (he flat out states at one point that he didn't even know this city existed for instance).

[Khaldun]

Yes, but that doesn't make any sense, at least so far--what did he think he was going to a lighthouse in Maine for? He seems pretty well briefed on his target once the shit hits the fan and he's running from the cops. Plus if you look in all the kinetiscopes you see that Columbia & the Prophet at least *claims* to have been in the news re: the Boxer Rebellion and its secession. Maybe that's all unreliable narration, I suppose I'll see. Or maybe the protagonist is a dumbass who doesn't pay attention to the news. There's no way to know given the way they choose to write the p.o.v.--which of course means whatever the inevitable twist or surprise is, it will probably be as "sigh, yes, I get it, it's a game" as the first Bioshock's.

It's not literally corridors but you can't go anywhere you're not meant to go, even when the terrain seems to make it possible. Nor, at least so far, do you have any meaningful choices that open up branch points in the plot or in the way the character develops. Maybe that will also change. I doubt it mightily.

I also find the FPS controls unwieldy.

[Venkman]

I'm finding the FPS controls a bit janky but not unwieldy, and I don't feel the corridors any more than I did in TR. There's limited resources, there's pushing you in a specific direction, you can backtrack to 100% everything if you want, and the game is going to give you one way to get to a place. Heck, the comparisons go further: you're not entirely sure what's going on but you're pretty sure there's an objective*, you're making shit up as you go, and you quickly find out there's more to the place than you thought.

I will say this is the brightest looking Unreal Engine I've seen in while  

* Big difference of course is how the mission goal is conveyed.

Tens of hours too early for me to critique, but this kind of game makes me miss Dishonored's treatment of open-ish world and options to achieve goals.

[Rasix]

I also find the FPS controls unwieldy.

I'm having some issues with them.  I can't seem to get the mouse sensitivity in a good place.  If it's just right for aiming, it's too slow for turning.  Push a bit up and I can no longer aim.  I dislike that I have to hit a button to pick up health and salt in firefights.

Yes, but is it fun?

I'm looking forward to playing tonight.  I enjoyed Bioshock despite its flaws, so there's no surprise I'm having fun here.  

Perhaps they should do the next iteration of the franchise in space on a derelict ship or something.   Open up the exploration a bit.  Think of the potential.

[Bzalthek]

I just really, really like how they animated Elizabeth; She's almost alive.  Add to that to the almost mythological take on early America. 

[Fabricated]

Played a few hours. Really fun, nice looking, well written, etc, but incredibly linear. Moreso than Bioshock was. Setpiece to setpiece to setpiece.

Also unless it's explained later the "vigors" are a gigantic asspull in order to add the equivalent of plasmids or Psionics to a game set way before either. Plasmids figured directly into the plot of Bioshock; they were integral. Vigors? Eh who the fuck knows, just drink the shit and use..."salts" to cast them. Salts? Like literal salt? I guess not since they're sold sorta like smelling salts, but what? Whatever shut up or you won't be casting magic fireballs at people.

Also I don't get the vehement Bioshock hate unless this is some leftover nerdrage for old people who were mad it didn't have inventory tetris or dozens of skills to meticulously level or some dumb shit like that. I mean, yeah, it was pretty linear and easy. So fucking what.

fake edit: oh yeah- there is one thing Infinite utterly fails at. Being scary. System Shock was scary, Bioshock was scary/creepy too IMO and had more than cat scares. This game is not scary. It's not even really creepy. It's just more commentary/takedowns of nationalism/etc. Like, I kinda thought the main undercurrent of the the *shock series was dumping an unaware player character into a hostile, fucked up environment controlled by people/things that are literally/figuratively alien. Like, SS2 isn't like, "awww yeah time to blast some aliens", it's "oh god, these people are still conscious and can feel me killing them and they can't control their bodies and AI is trying to kill me what the fuck". Bioshock is an underwater utopia-turned-dystopia ran by psychotic Randians who found a way to twist themselves into the monsters that they really were.

Columbia is...uh, what if Americans were even bigger racist/nationalist assholes than they were back then and made a floating city. And also some shit about time/string theory or whatever I guess. Uh, okay.

[murdoc]

Elizabeth is really well done.

[Nonentity]

I just beat the game.

It's... huh. The whole ending sequence is gonna take some time to process, i might run through it again.

[schild]

Ruin it for me please.

[Nonentity]

Ruin it for me please.

I don't want to!

[Rasix]

Carnival song on the beach sounds a lot like "Girls just want to have fun".

[angry.bob]

The ending feels like it was a rejected concept for a Twilight Zone/Generic late night sci-fi suspense show. What happens to
I honestly think it would have made a much better game as a dating sim where you dress up Elizabeth in different outfits and go do date stuff.

[angry.bob]

Ruin it for me please.

[Fabricated]

I liked Baseketball.

Hudson Hawk?

[Ironwood]

Ruin it for me please.

Oh Dear God.