StarCraft II

[K9]

Yeah, I'm slowly getting a grip on my Changeling-fu. They are brilliant.

My problem playing random is that I forget about cool shit like Overseers.

I'm also terrible with Banelings, I'm still a little stuck in that Bronze League mentality in that regard.

[Malakili]

Yeah, I'm slowly getting a grip on my Changeling-fu. They are brilliant.

My problem playing random is that I forget about cool shit like Overseers.

I'm also terrible with Banelings, I'm still a little stuck in that Bronze League mentality in that regard.

Yeah, when I was playing random I was all over the place, forgetting about units, abilities, and so forth.  Since switching to full time protoss, like 3-4 days ago, I've gotten SUCH a better understanding of their units and abilities just after maybe 10 games straight with the same race.  It really helps a lot to not have to focus on a ton of different possibilities all the time.  Changed my entire outlook on the game.

[Fordel]

Planetary fortresses as static defenses is something I have seen pro players do. For 650 minerals and 150 gas it's a pretty awesome unit in it's own right. Surrounded by bio and tanks it's a fucking monster.

You start to use PForts as 'super bunkers' once you reach 200 army, since at that point you're still rollin in cash and have nothing to spend it on and normal bunkers just crumble against your opponents own 200 army.



I'm still often torn between Orbitals and PForts, since you can start to do really silly things with extra mules. Drop them on your mechanical army to repair anywhere in the field, or drop them on your opponents tank ball so they blow themselves up. No one expects the offensive mule!  

Then on the other hand, a PFort with a couple Missile Turrets is going to stop almost all 'cutesy' harass at an expansion. Especially if you have the range upgrade for your turrets and fort.

On the other, other hand, you can never have to many scans either! Once you reach a surplus, you can start scanning to just nullify high-ground during pushses, or being able to always check if that big blob of red on your sensor tower is really a doom drop, or just a bunch of probes.

[K9]

True all those points. Also echoing how awesome the +1 range for missile turrets and fortresses is. The building armour upgrade isn't bad either, later in the game. It gives your expansions quite a chunk more longevity

[Ironwood]

6 bunkers can also surprise.  I just wish they didn't look different.

[Fordel]

Another benefit of the bunker capacity upgrade, is it also doubles the capacity of Command Centers and Pforts. Setting up that island expansion is a lot easier if you have 10 slots in your command center for SCVs.

[K9]

6 bunkers can also surprise.  I just wish they didn't look different.

They do? I rarely use bunkers, so never researched it. Will have to check that out

[Malakili]

Another benefit of the bunker capacity upgrade, is it also doubles the capacity of Command Centers and Pforts. Setting up that island expansion is a lot easier if you have 10 slots in your command center for SCVs.

Or you can just get a drop ship and then also have a unit to use for harass or healing :).

I can't rightfully say I know much about Terran, but I almost never got bunkers when I played them before unless I was very specifically building one as an attack was coming and I needed a little extra oomph to hold it off.  It seems like investing the upgrade in them is a little iffy.  Especially since you can salvage them now, there is no reason to really make them more cost effective. 

[Ginaz]

Had a very weird game today.  The guy made his own little mega fortress by walling in a few command centers that were turned into fortresses.  I think he might have been a young kid or something.



http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=139699

[Fordel]

Another benefit of the bunker capacity upgrade, is it also doubles the capacity of Command Centers and Pforts. Setting up that island expansion is a lot easier if you have 10 slots in your command center for SCVs.

Or you can just get a drop ship and then also have a unit to use for harass or healing :).

I can't rightfully say I know much about Terran, but I almost never got bunkers when I played them before unless I was very specifically building one as an attack was coming and I needed a little extra oomph to hold it off.  It seems like investing the upgrade in them is a little iffy.  Especially since you can salvage them now, there is no reason to really make them more cost effective. 

You also have to factor in placement and build time. You can also get the space upgrade long before you could even think of getting medivacs. Though I would agree that it is currently a very rare and neglected upgrade.

[Strazos]

I've taken to 2-bunkering my natural. Seems to work alright, especially with sieged tanks overlooking. I heart siege tanks.

[Ginaz]

Seems BNet is having some problems.  Kind of sucks since I had 3 games almost won when I lost connection.

[slog]

No issues here.

I 'm ranked #1 in my Bronze league, and I just beat a Silver and a Gold in my last 2 matches. 

[kildorn]

No issues here.

I 'm ranked #1 in my Bronze league, and I just beat a Silver and a Gold in my last 2 matches. 

For a few hours this evening, bnet was giving out odd SC2MASTER_UNKNOWN_MMQ something errors and signing you out of bnet if you tried to join a multiplayer game.

[Ginaz]

No issues here.

I 'm ranked #1 in my Bronze league, and I just beat a Silver and a Gold in my last 2 matches. 

For a few hours this evening, bnet was giving out odd SC2MASTER_UNKNOWN_MMQ something errors and signing you out of bnet if you tried to join a multiplayer game.

Yeah thats what happened to me.  Cost me 3 wins.  My record for today should have been 8 wins 4 loses.  Oh well, at least I'm getting better.

[Rasix]

God, my macro fell apart after not playing 1v1s for a few days.  Lost like 4 matches in a row in no time flat.  2 were kind of lame with one being a bunker rush cheese and the other being a massive marine all in (could have probably won, but I was being stupid). At least I got to beat up on some Terran who was bitching about how OP protoss was the entire time.

"How do you blink up with no sight.  I killed that fucking observer"
"ORLY"  2 observers sitting on his ledge.
"Huh"
...
"Best macro mechanic and best units. WAH WAH WAH WAH WAH"
/ragequit

Made a crappy run worth it in the end.

[Wolf]

Finally had time to play one quick game last night. Lost a 30 min ZvZ, really annoying. I'm still trying to figure out why I decided going for Ultras would work. It probably would have in any case, but I would have destroyed the guy if I had played standard. I was ahead all game, in every aspect, and he decided to attack 1 minute before my ultralisk cavern was going to pop, and i was forced to spent the money I had saved up on roaches :(

A 550 diamond dude that got his 1/0, when I was 2/1 and 2nd carapace was just finishing up. Lost 1 point, should've won that game easily to be honest. Watching the replay was painful.

btw, on the changeling thing - I'm super surprised on how people can't see them? It always pops out at me. The second I see a zergling or marine just wandering or lagging behind. Hmmm, if you have speed on lings, does the changling have speed too? Maybe that's it.

[Malakili]

btw, on the changeling thing - I'm super surprised on how people can't see them? It always pops out at me. The second I see a zergling or marine just wandering or lagging behind. Hmmm, if you have speed on lings, does the changling have speed too? Maybe that's it.

I think they are pretty easy to spot.   Especially if they are moving, because I'm like hey....I didn't give that order.  That being said, I don't think their point is to walk around inside the enemy base for 5 minutes, I see it more an expendable scout that costs energy instead of minerals so you don't need to sack and overlord to fly over.

[K9]

I normally set the changeling to follow a unit, I think detectors pick them up too?

[rk47]

So I went to a LAN cafe. They claimed they had Starcraft II installed. I was planning to play 2 v 2 compstomps with my friend. Just a test-drive of sorts - we're about to get our seats when the clerk asked us, 'You need to have your own B.Net accounts to play team skirmishes. or else you're stuck with single player. Sorry, that's just the way it is.'

So instead, we went to watch Salt that night.

[Malakili]

So I went to a LAN cafe. They claimed they had Starcraft II installed. I was planning to play 2 v 2 compstomps with my friend. Just a test-drive of sorts - we're about to get our seats when the clerk asked us, 'You need to have your own B.Net accounts to play team skirmishes. or else you're stuck with single player. Sorry, that's just the way it is.'

So instead, we went to watch Salt that night.

That's just how bnet 2.0 rolls

[bhodi]

GLORPGLORPGLORPGLORP

If your pissing sounds like that, I think you've got some serious issues.

[El Gallo]

Is there a hotkey for "select all of this kind of unit" (not just "select all of this kind of unit on screen"). It'd be nice to start all my overlords pooping creep without tracking each one down individually. Or if they'd just start doing that automatically when you get the ability.  There's sooooo much busy work in this game. I understand that the ability to keep going through your busywork routines and never missing a beat while getting punched in the face is a big part of the skill in this game. But still, there's a lot of busywork in this game.

I'm a shitty bronze player who never played RTS games before. I kinda wish I'd gone Terran. They don't seem to lose very much by turtling, which would probably let me focus more on scouting and not having buildings idle (and once that's solidly in my brain, go more aggressive). As zerg, the need to expand-expand-expand, have 5 queens vomit on 5 hatcheries every 30 seconds, constantly spread tumors, fend off little raids on undefended bases and keep an eye out to see if the other guy has unturtled and is about to roflstomp one of my bases takes up about 150% of my thought-per-minute capacity. That leaves nothing for scouting the bad guy's base, harassing/raiding, herding overlords, or thoughtfully managing larva. I've developed a hotkey system for queen vomit, which makes that part easier (when I don't forget, that is) and I'm sure the rest will become semi-automatic as I keep playing. This is probably just grass-is-greener thinking, but it seems like Terrans turtle up to 200/200, beat my 200/200, and then whether they win or not depends on whether I can whip my larva into another big army to take out his army before he gets to my main.

Anyway, end whine. I have two actual questions.

1. As a shitty Zerg, is there any way I can take out a shitty T/P's defended base before ultras/broodlords?  I have 4 bases and the other guy has 2; I'm making a lot more money and am doing at least as well on tech.  I feel like there should be a way to press that advantage then. But no matter what I bring near that ramp, it gets instantly evaporated. I know that good players don't mind this since they'll always win in the end.  I usually will too. But it's long and boring.

2. How do I harass his workers midgame? mutas seem to get blown up pretty easily because their range is pretty short. Also, they take up 100 gas. I have a hard time justifying not spending that gas on 2 hydras. I'm very dependent on hydras to protect my army (and bases) from air attacks.

[jakonovski]

Nydus worms?

[Ironwood]

NYDUS WORMS.

[slog]

Is there a hotkey for "select all of this kind of unit" (not just "select all of this kind of unit on screen"). It'd be nice to start all my overlords pooping creep without tracking each one down individually. Or if they'd just start doing that automatically when you get the ability.  There's sooooo much busy work in this game. I understand that the ability to keep going through your busywork routines and never missing a beat while getting punched in the face is a big part of the skill in this game. But still, there's a lot of busywork in this game.

I can tell you that control clicking any unit (or double clicking a unit) will select all units of the same type on the screen.
Also

If you have multiple unit types, the TAB key will move through each of the unit types in that group.

[Astorax]

I can tell you that control clicking any unit (or double clicking a unit) will select all units of the same type on the screen.
Also

If you have multiple unit types, the TAB key will move through each of the unit types in that group.

Yah, he knows bout that, he's asking if there's a way to select all units of a given type you've created, regardless of whether or not they're on the screen.  I too would love something like that...easier to select all my SCVs for example, in the case of an attack to move them all even if I'm not fully on the screen with all of 'em...otherwise, some dumbly continue to stand there while they get eaten.

[Ironwood]

That'd be real silly.  If it selects all the SCVs even off screen, then all your wee expansion ones would also run and hide.

 

[Malakili]

I can tell you that control clicking any unit (or double clicking a unit) will select all units of the same type on the screen.
Also

If you have multiple unit types, the TAB key will move through each of the unit types in that group.

Yah, he knows bout that, he's asking if there's a way to select all units of a given type you've created, regardless of whether or not they're on the screen.  I too would love something like that...easier to select all my SCVs for example, in the case of an attack to move them all even if I'm not fully on the screen with all of 'em...otherwise, some dumbly continue to stand there while they get eaten.

Hotkey your groups of probes per base, or if you don't want to or can't afford the control groups, just do it with the one which you think is most likely to need emergency movement.

[Astorax]

That'd be real silly.  If it selects all the SCVs even off screen, then all your wee expansion ones would also run and hide.

 

Right, right, I knew that. :D

Okay, so the first time I tried it, I'd have been really surprised. :D

[jakonovski]

Oh man, I hit a total slump tonight, only won one out of five games, and even that was against a really weird gimmick (Terran opponent moved his base to a gold expansion right at the beginning, then started proxying shit all over the place).  My macro still has a looong way to go.

I think I'll try triple barracks next for early aggression.

[Malakili]

Oh man, I hit a total slump tonight, only won one out of five games, and even that was against a really weird gimmick (Terran opponent moved his base to a gold expansion right at the beginning, then started proxying shit all over the place).  My macro still has a looong way to go.

I think I'll try triple barracks next for early aggression.

Early aggression is a great way to get out of a slump.  You can sort of let yourself get stagnant and lazy with some builds if you do them over and over again  (I know I do), but early aggression gets you "into" the game immediately and helps you to "snap out of it."

In any event, I've been making a lot of mistakes myself today, but at least I'm to the point where I'm noticing what they are.  I'm not losing and thinking "well fuck, I don't know what I could've done."

[K9]

1. As a shitty Zerg, is there any way I can take out a shitty T/P's defended base before ultras/broodlords?  I have 4 bases and the other guy has 2; I'm making a lot more money and am doing at least as well on tech.  I feel like there should be a way to press that advantage then. But no matter what I bring near that ramp, it gets instantly evaporated. I know that good players don't mind this since they'll always win in the end.  I usually will too. But it's long and boring.

Depends on the defense. A terran playing very conservatively and very defensively isn't likely to win, but they won't loose easily either. If they don't wall off well you can just run huge clumps of zerglings into the base to harass stuff. If you end up pulling half his army off his ramp or whatever to kill zerglings hitting his workers/pylons/supply depots/tech buildings, then you can use mutas or roaches to smash against the remainder of his wall. As zerg your main aim isn't necessarily to keep your losses 1:1 with the enemy, if anything you should not just expect but almost plan to loose a lot more units than them. Where your strength lies is in your ability (through larva vomit) to bring a new army back up in the fraction of the time it takes your opponent.

Against an aggressively walled in opponent, particularly terran, brood lords are ultimately your only option. Nydus worms are awesome, but they aren't infallable. Spawning multiple worms can help though. Harrassment and erosion are your best weapons. Nibble at him to draw him out then crush him. If your opponent prefers to sit on one base, simply take all te others and suicide waves of your expendable units against his that he cannot afford to replace.

Also, learn to love baneleings. Accept that they are suicide weapons and just send waves of them at his wall. Once the wall is broken, just run your zerglings in and hit stuff.

2. How do I harass his workers midgame? mutas seem to get blown up pretty easily because their range is pretty short. Also, they take up 100 gas. I have a hard time justifying not spending that gas on 2 hydras. I'm very dependent on hydras to protect my army (and bases) from air attacks.

The trick with Mutas is not to over commit, it's the same with Banshees. You have to resist the "just one more kill temptation". Run in, kill one or two workers then bail. Run around hit one of his tech labs or pylons, then bail. Always keep moving and hit in an unpredictable fashion (i.e. don't just circle his base in one direction hitting every 20 seconds). Mutas are fragile, and depending on what he brings to bear you need to be careful. The absolute best way to piss off terrans is to kill workers that are constructing a building, a lot of Terran players will not even notice for ages, and it's a free kill you can steal then run. If he has expansions hit his main, then his expansion then back again. Mutas are fast, it's their biggest strength, use that to be all over the map. Having to chase mutas around with a ground army is very irritating. Don't use mutas to take out production buildings, they're awful against armoured targets (generally). Go for tech labs, reactors, pylons, workers, refineries, overlords and if you can get your opponent out of position, unprotected siege tanks, immortals, colossi, zealots and zerglings are muta fodder. Just remember to pull out after a kill or two, don't sit there until the defense comes, be gone before it can get there. Keep your opponent all over the map.

Mutas also need a critical mass. Three mutas is pretty useless, four mutas is fairly weak. Once you hit six or seven though you are good to go. Seven or more mutas can start holding their own against reactionary vikings or corruptors. Learn what reflex reactions your opponents will have and meet them. If you are against a terran without any air, expect him to start popping vikings. If you can catch them as they spawn 7 or so mutas will kill two vikings without a loss (I think), and it will really frustrate your opponent.

A cheaper alternative is the good old zergling run-by. With about 20 zerglings you can maul mineral lines, and with the speed upgrade you are highly mobile. Like with the mutas, run in and hit the workers. The nice thing about zerglings is that since they are so cheap, you can afford to just run them past enemy armies, even siege tanks and cannons, and just hit the mineral lines. Sure you may loose half your zerglings, but you'll still damage him more than he damages you if you can take out even as few as 3-4 workers. In particular go for workers on gas, as people forget to keep those topped up.

[K9]

On another note, mass infestors spamming infested terran is my new favourite way to beat someone. 10 infestors = 70-80 infested terrans, and they really don't do bad damage tbh.

[Ratman_tf]

NYDUS WORMS.