iPad

[Surlyboi]

[K9]

Elegant 

How is your new toy?

[Engels]

Manhattan Mac store, corner of 5th and fiftysomething:


Not sure if the image captures the ginormous line of people wanting to purchase.

[Signe]

And yet, some people just wandered into the local Best Buy and picked one up.  No lines, nothing.  Me, I wouldn't stand in a line like that for anything, not even tickets to Emerson, Lake and Palmer for the Show that Never Starts.

[Engels]

There are things worth standing in line for. Berlin Symphony does Mahler. Pink Floyd in Barcelona. Off the top of my head. Dubious Apple product, on a glorious spring day in Manhattan? Idon'tthinkso.

[Kitsune]

My faith in nerds has been shaken somewhat by the iPod kilo.  When it was introduced, a lot of reviews were all, 'Oh, it's a giant iPod.'  Because it is in fact a giant iPod.  But those SAME people over the course of two months are now babbling about how it's revolutionizing everything.  Before it even hit any shelves.  Was something added to the water?  Are they dead and replaced by Apple agents?  Or are tech nerds really that pathetically easy to feed a line of bullshit until they buy it?  If it were a fully functional OS X tablet, I'd've been elbowing elderly people in the face to get at one.  But it's a giant iPod.  For twice as much money.  Which I can't take anywhere unless I get a purse.

[Quinton]

Have you ever watched an apple product launch before? ^^  Ya gotta give it a few weeks for the reality distortion field to wear off before you get anything besides the rabid pro- or anti-apple ranting.

The thing that has me scratching my head is why in the world do they require you to have a computer with itunes to "activate" this thing.  I mean, really, we got that right in 2001 with hiptop/sidekick, and most modern smartphones are usable without first tethering them to a computer (but not iphone...).  It's just weird.

I see a lot of "this will be great for people who don't like computers", but I'm wondering what happens when they get home with their shiny new ipad and can't use it because they lack a computer to activate it.  #outoftheboxfail

[Sheepherder]

but I'm wondering what happens when they get home with their shiny new ipad and can't use it because they lack a computer to activate it.

They'll put it on their coffee table and talk about how great it is.

[Kitsune]

I hadn't heard of that particular piece of stupid.  I've been using my touch as a completely self-contained device for months without syncing.  Song I like on itunes?  Direct download.  New software I want?  Direct download.  The last time I actually plugged the thing into my computer was for the OS update a while ago.

[Quinton]

A coworker of mine told me that his was not usable until activated by syncing with itunes, and that in order to use itunes to activate it he had to either have an apple account (itunes account?) or provide name/address/phone/creditcard.  Seems pretty obnoxious to me -- both that you have to sync it with a pc to get going (yuck) and further that you have to setup an account to just use the basic features (like the web browser) as a side-effect.

[Trippy]

The iTunes activation is the same as it is with the iPhone and the iPod Touch (contrary to Kitsune's statement). You don't, however, have to be "tethered" to iTunes to buy stuff since the devices all support on device purchasing.

If you don't have a computer you can activate it in store. If you had it shipped to you and don't have access to a computer then good luck to you

[Quinton]

It's just such an obvious oversight -- especially given that, duh, you can buy things via itunes without having to sync with your pc.  What possible reason could there be to require tethering for activation?  Best explanation I've heard (from ex-apple folks) is that it's a political / control issue on the side of the itunes group.

[Kitsune]

I hooked my ipod to my computer first thing, yeah.  But that step just makes sense for an ipod, given that it's a music player and your music's on your computer.  Given that the touch can communicate with your computer wirelessly, it's not so mandatory as it was with previous generations, but I wasn't incensed or anything at having to plug the thing in.  Iphones and ipads, however, are being presented as stand-alone devices, and that tethering requirement is increasingly ludicrous.

[Trippy]

It's just such an obvious oversight -- especially given that, duh, you can buy things via itunes without having to sync with your pc.  What possible reason could there be to require tethering for activation?  Best explanation I've heard (from ex-apple folks) is that it's a political / control issue on the side of the itunes group.

It's not an oversight. Apple forces you to register your device with them.

[Quinton]

They could easily do that without forcing you to use another computer.  It seems like an unnecessary roadblock, especially if their goal is to try to go mass market as some kind of computer for people who aren't into computers, etc.

[Mattemeo]

My faith in nerds has been shaken somewhat by the iPod kilo.  When it was introduced, a lot of reviews were all, 'Oh, it's a giant iPod.'  Because it is in fact a giant iPod.  But those SAME people over the course of two months are now babbling about how it's revolutionizing everything.  Before it even hit any shelves.  Was something added to the water?  Are they dead and replaced by Apple agents?  Or are tech nerds really that pathetically easy to feed a line of bullshit until they buy it?  If it were a fully functional OS X tablet, I'd've been elbowing elderly people in the face to get at one.  But it's a giant iPod.  For twice as much money.  Which I can't take anywhere unless I get a purse.

It's zealous early adoption syndrome. Apple rely on it, but I think this time round, the drop-off rate is going to be catastrophic. The Air sold bucketloads in the first few weeks, and then everyone realised what a horrible, poorly devised bit of kit it was and it has been Apple's albatross over the last couple of years. When the punters realise the iPad is actually half as useful as the Air and just as impractical, Apple ought to start worrying, or at least pulling their finger the fuck out and getting the 2nd gen (with some actual fucking hardware worth buying) out. Until that time, I remain firmly in the 'haha no' population.

[Mattemeo]

It's also worth noting that unless Apple aggressively price the iPad in the UK and EU, it is going to sink like a stone. $499 for the most basic model is currently around £329 at conversion rates... and that won't take into account a: import costs; b: traditional european tech mark-up; and c: VAT. If the basic, wifi/16gb model goes on sale for more than £399 ($610), Apple are going to have some real trouble shifting units, and the 'fully specced' 3G/64gb models will be simply outrageously priced, more along the lines of £650-700 ($988-1065).

[Surlyboi]

Meh.

[Mattemeo]

Show us on the doll where Steve touched you...

He certainly won't be touching me on the wallet.

[Quinton]

Show us on the doll where Steve touched you...

Steve is currently trying to destroy the platform I've worked on for over five years by way of litigation (using a bunch of pretty absurd patents that illustrate the defects of the uspto and current patent law -- varying cpu voltage to save power? granted in 2008? what a crock, etc, etc).  He may talk a lot of talk about some groups at Google wanting to destroy iPhone (total bullshit), but his actions speak a lot louder than his words.  I only see one party here trying to destroy anything.

If anything, that fucker should be sending us a thank you note for scaring him into shipping an SDK and an app store in 2008 -- it's certainly worked out pretty well for him.

Usually you don't see tech companies devolve into patent trolling outfits until after they've failed miserably, but you know, think different.

[Righ]

Usually you don't see tech companies devolve into patent trolling outfits until after they've failed miserably, but you know, think different.

The term "patent trolling outfit" is typically applied to companies who do not produce anything related to their patents but who register technologies that are being used in other companies' products. Is it your professional opinion that Apple is doing this as its primary business agenda, or are you simply flinging mud in the hope that some sticks?

[Viin]

Oo Google-fanbois vs Apple-fanbois.... fight!

Just kidding. Does anyone know if you can tether (the real term, not the fake definition you guys are using above) the wifi iPad with your iPhone? How about a jail broke iPhone?

[Trippy]

Just kidding. Does anyone know if you can tether (the real term, not the fake definition you guys are using above) the wifi iPad with your iPhone?

To quote Steve Jobs: "No".

How about a jail broke iPhone?

Should be able to.

[Trippy]

iPad apparently jailbroken already:

http://www.macnn.com/articles/10/04/04/early.hack.gets.root.on.ipad/

[01101010]

The only thing I actually agreed with Jobs about is the Flash issue.

[sigil]

Usually you don't see tech companies devolve into patent trolling outfits until after they've failed miserably, but you know, think different.

The term "patent trolling outfit" is typically applied to companies who do not produce anything related to their patents but who register technologies that are being used in other companies' products. Is it your professional opinion that Apple is doing this as its primary business agenda, or are you simply flinging mud in the hope that some sticks?

I think he's positing it as Apple using patents of tech that had been developed previously in other iterations outside of Apple to eliminate competition. Frankly that would be worse than simple patent trolling, but i was willing to cut Quinton some slack. When a man starts fucking with your livelihood, you tend to get a bit more involved.

The only remark I was going to make was that Surlyboi is posting on his laptop and scrolling on the screen as I didn't see tell tale fingerprints on the screen. Perhaps this will make chamois handkerchiefs popular.

[Kitsune]

Apple is being a giant pile of douches and using bullshit patents to try to shut down competition.  That's a little more than 'lol google fanboys' on the list of corporate douchebaggery.  And amazingly, this lawsuit magically appeared immediately after microsoft showed off their own improved mobile OS that looks like it's actually going to be the first un-shitty wince platform, and targeted the people who'd be manufacturing the bulk of the new windows phones.  Hmmmmmmmmmm.   

[Venkman]

The entire cell phone industry in the process of sueing itself at any given time. I know this stuff can get personal for those in it, but it's not like Apple is acting any different than, say, Nokia. It's not like they're claiming to "not be evil" 

[Quinton]

Usually you don't see tech companies devolve into patent trolling outfits until after they've failed miserably, but you know, think different.

The term "patent trolling outfit" is typically applied to companies who do not produce anything related to their patents but who register technologies that are being used in other companies' products. Is it your professional opinion that Apple is doing this as its primary business agenda, or are you simply flinging mud in the hope that some sticks?

Nah, that closing line was just me being snarky about their tactics.

I do firmly believe they're spooked by Android's rapid growth (Eric's mention of 60K units/day at MWC was, I believe the first public number we've ever mentioned and it surprised a lot of people) and they've chosen to respond by with litigation rather than competing by improving their phone products.  Specifically they're targeting a successful Taiwanese OEM (so they can try for a fast path ITC injunction, etc), and hoping (I suspect) to frighten smaller shops as a result.  There are plenty of other OEMs that ship Android devices, but getting into a patent litigation war with Motorola, for example, might be unwise.

The mobile space is frickin' enormous, and there's a lot of room for a lot of products out there.  Steve is totally smoking crack if he thinks a single product family from a single company is going to own 80-90% of it like he pulled off in the mp3 player space.  He's also pretty crazy if he thinks he invented mobile phones and can deflect competition there with patent litigation, because the companies that *did* invent mobile phones have shit-tons of patents in this space -- it's just that nobody has been stupid enough to go all scorched earth about it yet.

This is, of course, my personal opinion, as a pissed-off engineer, and I certainly don't speak for Google in an official capacity on anything other than kernel/OS architecture and implementation. ^^

[Quinton]

Aaaanyway, to get back on-topic, I borrowed an ipad from a coworker to check it out.  Some first impressions:

- It looks very pretty.  Animation is very clean and smooth.
- It's heavy.
- When holding one-handed, the aluminum cases sharp edges around the bezel cut into my hand -- it hurts to hold it one-handed.
- Apps are slow to launch (2-8 seconds by my stopwatch, from tap icon to app actually up and ready for input)
- Since there's no multitasking / background apps, apps are *always* slow to launch (every start is a cold start)
- Using the keyboard while holding it is not comfortable and setting it down to type is annoying.
- Font quality in the browser seems less impressive than I'd expect from Apple -- maybe just the density is low compared to N1/Droid.
- The 2x scaling mode for legacy iphone apps looks really really bad.  I was expecting a clean 2x scale to look much better.
- The comic viewer wants me to have a marvel.com name/pw to view free content. fail.
- I miss having a back button and instead having to hunt for a back widget onscreen, or cope with app modes where my only choice is to hit the square button to go home.
- youtube video quality is terrible (compare the OK Go Rube Goldberg video at 720p on the desktop to this).  Are they using 480p?  Scaling badly?  This issue doesn't seem to exist in the itunes video player.
- The UI likes to make me reach a long way -- why is the back button all the way in the upper left (if it's onscreen at all) instead of down near where I'm holding the device?
- The UI is crazy inconsistent.  Let's take the app store... there's this side to side coverflow thing at the top (cute)... then there are two separate boxes below with apps listed in them... that you scroll horizontally by tapping arrows embedded in the box borders... and the whole page scrolls vertically... and when you click on an app and go to the info page, the preview screenshots smoothscroll horizontally in an inset window.  It's just all over the map interaction-wise.

Anyway, even ignoring external issues I have with Apple, this one's definitely not for me.  

[Samwise]

- When holding one-handed, the aluminum cases sharp edges around the bezel cut into my hand -- it hurts to hold it one-handed.

I was curious about this.  On seeing its dimensions and hearing how much it weighs, one of my first thoughts was "huh, that seems like an uncomfortable combination of sharp and heavy".  I sort of dismissed that as a realistic concern, though, because it seems like it'd be easy enough to round the edges to keep it from scoring the user's hand.  And yet.

[Quinton]

This photo is the best I've found so far illustrating the sharp edges around the front side bezel:
http://www.tipb.com/images/stories/2010/04/ipad-gallery-5.jpg

I'm not sure why they didn't machine it so it was smooth.  Seems like a strange decision.

[Trippy]

Jonathan Ive likes his sharp edges. I've complained about this before on various iPod designs.

[Trippy]

Wifi no workie:

http://techcrunch.com/2010/04/05/trouble-in-paradise-ipad-users-complain-of-wifi-issues/

[AutomaticZen]

- It's heavy.
- When holding one-handed, the aluminum cases sharp edges around the bezel cut into my hand -- it hurts to hold it one-handed.

I didn't know about the edges, but this is the thing I didn't get.  Everyone was talking about a internet device for their mother or grandmother, but the Kindle 2 is right at the correct weight for me to hold up one handed.  The iPad is twice the weight.  Who's grandmother is going to be holding it up?