Rumour of Mythic Layoffs

[UnSub]

Way to be assholes. Piss $300 million on fucking web-game developer, then layoff an asston of people working on actual games. Fuck you, EA.

I see a bigger future in browser game development than I do in old school PC game development.

Quoting someone else, PCs are going to become the MMO and casual games platform of choice. The sales just aren't there for PCs anymore (or: consoles outsell PC games easily).

[Kitsune]

"We are focusing on what works and what matters," Chief Financial Officer Eric Brown said in an interview.

So, their employees don't work and don't matter.  Great guy, Eric Brown.  I'd momentarily regret not taking my foot off the accelerator if he crossed the road in front of me.

[Velorath]

"We are focusing on what works and what matters," Chief Financial Officer Eric Brown said in an interview.

So, their employees don't work and don't matter.  Great guy, Eric Brown.  I'd momentarily regret not taking my foot off the accelerator if he crossed the road in front of me.

Way to take an out of context quote and make it sound like he was talking about the people instead of the products.

[Azazel]

With that many layoffs right before Christmas, it still works out as pretty Apt.


They really should have given Need for Speed a hiatus of a year or two, instead of "cancelling" the series with great fanfare, then shipping the fucking thing out right afterwards. Does anyone buy those games at full price/new anymore?

[01101010]

I see a bigger future in browser game development than I do in old school PC game development.

Quoting someone else, PCs are going to become the MMO and casual games platform of choice. The sales just aren't there for PCs anymore (or: consoles outsell PC games easily).

Sadly, consoles are the game systems of choice these days - I fear what its breeding though. Perhaps its my own "elite assholeness," but I always put consoles in the amateur category when it comes to true gaming... ever since I played pac-man in the arcade and then picked up the pac-man cart for my 2600... that was a very sad day.

PC gaming will dig itself in and emerge as the new cool in a few years.

[Velorath]

Perhaps its my own "elite assholeness,"

No perhaps about it.  People who look down on consoles like that miss out on a lot of good shit.

[Tannhauser]

I guess five star drive will drive you to the unemployment office.  And three star ability will keep you from burning your hand when you scoop fries.

Jokes aside, I'm sad to see anyone lose their jobs, hope they all land on their feet.  But you make a bad game you suffer the consequences.  WAR was a bad game.  They had a great idea and IP, they released at a good time, they just couldn't pull it off. 

[NiX]

With that many layoffs right before Christmas, it still works out as pretty Apt.

Financial losses don't stop so you can lay people off after Christmas and feel good about yourself. Who knows what they got in terms of packages or assistance. Plus, just hop on the bandwagon of people on Unemployment.

[Sky]

This thread and the Lum thread make me think that if I were to get into game development, I'd do it as an MBA, not a developer.

[01101010]

Perhaps its my own "elite assholeness,"

No perhaps about it.  People who look down on consoles like that miss out on a lot of good shit.

I don't think I miss out on anything since I own consoles, I just prefer PC control and feel - I have always had control issues with gamepads and joysticks, but that's on me... But yeah, 'no perhaps about it' is correct.

[UnsGub]

I see a bigger future in browser game development than I do in old school PC game development.

Agree.  The tech games are built on will always be changing until it standardizes on inputs and output which is coming.  Spend too much time on a given tech is going to mean one day you are behind and possibly out of business.  Currently the eyeballs (many millions) are on the social media sites and if one is not working on the tech and products to integrate there it is time to start asking questions and getting into action.  Players like Hollywood and TV are already working on solutions to catch-up so this issue is not just limit to the game industry.

[Malakili]

Perhaps its my own "elite assholeness,"

No perhaps about it.  People who look down on consoles like that miss out on a lot of good shit.

I dunno, frankly, controllers just aren't very good for the kind of games I enjoy.  I find a mouse and keyboard to be superior in every game except sports games, which I think are the console's best suit.  Though, I also own a wii in which my girlfriend and I play silly party games and mario games, which are also silly fun, but not really what I would call "hobby" games.

I mean, you can make lots of FUN stuff for consoles and broswers, but its not just about fun.  I know that sounds stupid, but when you think about hobbies, most of them are more than just something you do for "fun" you get some sort of greater satisfaction out of it.  Its the difference between someone who tosses a few firecrackers a few times a year and someone who is a model rocket "hobbyist."  Sometimes in gaming we call the divide "casual" and  "hardcore" but I prefer to think of it as hobbyists and not hobbyists.

[HaemishM]

The video game market has past the point where it can focus mainly on hobbyists for profitability. See the success of the Wii with its really really poor lineup of games for hobbyists. I don't have a problem with casual/browser-based game developers. I have a problem with EA laying off 1,500 people while spending 2 to 3 times the amount those people would have cost them for 1 year of employment on a fucking broswer-game company. Fuck's sake, hold off on laying the people off until after Christmas and stop trying to acquire your soulless way to profitability, you miserable fucks.

[schild]

I'm not gonna defend EA's firing practices, but things like "Oh god, Timmy isn't going to get anything nice for Christmas" doesn't really play into the role of pleasing investors. So let's dispense of the hippy dippy shit and focus more on facts, of which there are a disastrous few here. Playfish probably makes more money as around 50-75 people than the majority of those 1500 did (shame, but most likely closer to reality).

[ghost]

I'd do it as an MBA

Good idea for a lot of business goals, these days.

[01101010]

I dunno, frankly, controllers just aren't very good for the kind of games I enjoy.  I find a mouse and keyboard to be superior in every game except sports games, which I think are the console's best suit.  Though, I also own a wii in which my girlfriend and I play silly party games and mario games, which are also silly fun, but not really what I would call "hobby" games.

I mean, you can make lots of FUN stuff for consoles and broswers, but its not just about fun.  I know that sounds stupid, but when you think about hobbies, most of them are more than just something you do for "fun" you get some sort of greater satisfaction out of it.  Its the difference between someone who tosses a few firecrackers a few times a year and someone who is a model rocket "hobbyist."  Sometimes in gaming we call the divide "casual" and  "hardcore" but I prefer to think of it as hobbyists and not hobbyists.

This sorta thing is perfectly reflected in the Modern Warfare 2 debacle. Face-value, it would seem IW decided that making MW2 metrosexual will sell more copies. Granted there is a lot of shit tied in with it, but on the surface it just screams "consoles first - cut and port to PC later."

[Threash]

it would seem IW decided that making MW2 metrosexual will sell more copies.

Explain?

[Velorath]

Fuck's sake, hold off on laying the people off until after Christmas and stop trying to acquire your soulless way to profitability, you miserable fucks.

Well, it's not like they just canned 1500 people yesterday.  They announced that they'd lay off 1500 people by April.

[Mrbloodworth]

I thought this could not happen. At least, isn't that what was said by some in power when we were talking about the mythic buyout?

Hats off to those that are made to move on, you will land on your feet. Sad this is, I am somewhat accustomed to layoffs like this, doing contract work.

[AutomaticZen]

They really should have given Need for Speed a hiatus of a year or two, instead of "cancelling" the series with great fanfare, then shipping the fucking thing out right afterwards. Does anyone buy those games at full price/new anymore?

Apparently they have Criterion working on the next one, which means I'm back to buying Need For Speed games.

[Xanthippe]

I guess this means I'll never open my unopened Warhammer box. 

[Lum]

of course, presumably Paul is still safe? 

Cue Lum to defend  Paul in 1..2..3...

Don't look at me. Whatever you can say about Paul, he's quite capable of promoting himself and needs no help from me.

As for everyone else, there's a LOT of people looking for work at the moment. There's few studios in Austin left standing, and the EA cutback makes me suspect a lot of people will be leaving the gaming industry entirely. Not enough jobs, too many people.

[Ingmar]

All those people should clearly be getting together and starting studios and making "That game I always wanted to make, you know, like we hashed out 300 times over beer at the saloon* while bitching about the crap they had us working on." Surely there are some bored Russian millionaires whose tastes don't run towards playing Eve looking for gaming stuff to fund.



* - 'Cause they're in Texas, see.

[Merusk]

The problem with that is always that they're creative people, not business people sitting around looking for work.   I imagine that like any other creative field you wind up bitching about how you got into business to make things, not to study budgets, evaluate employees and sit in meetings 2/3 of the week.

[Lum]

Unfortunately, the business people are out of work, too.

The economy has very effectively dried up the ability to fish up new venture capital for studio startups. There are a few but they are rare and very small in comparison to prior efforts.

[Arthur_Parker]

http://herald.warhammeronline.com/warherald/NewsArticle.war?id=980

With all that is going on within Mythic Entertainment and EA, I would like to take a moment to reinforce the studio’s dedication to both our games and our players.  At Mythic, we remain committed to our games and the passionate people who play them – we’re going to continue to deliver the content and service that keeps you playing. We want to assure our community that we will maintain the same high level of customer support you’ve come to expect and continue to improve our games with an exciting schedule of patches, live events and new content.

At least he dropped the "WAAAGH!"

[Montague]

http://herald.warhammeronline.com/warherald/NewsArticle.war?id=980

With all that is going on within Mythic Entertainment and EA, I would like to take a moment to reinforce the studio’s dedication to both our games and our players.  At Mythic, we remain committed to our games and the passionate people who play them – we’re going to continue to deliver the content and service that keeps you playing. We want to assure our community that we will maintain the same high level of customer support you’ve come to expect and continue to improve our games with an exciting schedule of patches, live events and new content.

At least he dropped the "WAAAGH!"

Jeff Hickman sounds like a broken man. The air of defeat from that article is palpable.

[Azazel]

I'm not gonna defend EA's firing practices, but things like "Oh god, Timmy isn't going to get anything nice for Christmas" doesn't really play into the role of pleasing investors. So let's dispense of the hippy dippy shit and focus more on facts, of which there are a disastrous few here. Playfish probably makes more money as around 50-75 people than the majority of those 1500 did (shame, but most likely closer to reality).

I think it's relevent because of the human factor - not the hippy dippy trippy shit, but the way something like that effects your entire workforce. Like the guys staying on. Practices like this destroy morale and ensure that the 5-star talent that you do have goes off to find a job somewhere more secure, or at the very least somewhere that they won't announce they'll be kicking you out the door 6 weeks before Christmas.

I guess this means I'll never open my unopened Warhammer box. 

Also, this.

Anyone want to buy an upopened Collectors Edition? It's got an art book and a cool Orc miniature! Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller...?


I wonder how Jacobs feels now, seeing his company ground into the dust?

[UnSub]

I have a problem with EA laying off 1,500 people while spending 2 to 3 times the amount those people would have cost them for 1 year of employment on a fucking broswer-game company.

The browser-game company made (as stated previously in the thread) an estimated $75m revenue and I doubt they would have spent anywhere near that, so they are very profitable.

Mythic and WAR (and UO and DAOC)? Not profitable.

on the surface it just screams "consoles first - cut and port to PC later."

I really don't want to piss on the thread from a great height (he says, opening his fly), but this is partly due to piracy. Console piracy just isn't in the same league as PC piracy. Consoles are going to see release first because they are more profitable releases at the moment. PCs are going to go towards titles where piracy is less an issue - MMOs and browser-based games.

If PC game sales were setting the world on fire, PC games would be getting the attention. They aren't, so they aren't.

[Venkman]

it just screams "consoles first - cut and port to PC later."

Because that's how the industry thinks. PCs have one exclusive genre, and really only WoW qualifies as "mass market". Is anyone really surprised that the general industry goes console first?

[NiX]

I think it's relevent because of the human factor - not the hippy dippy trippy shit, but the way something like that effects your entire workforce. Like the guys staying on. Practices like this destroy morale and ensure that the 5-star talent that you do have goes off to find a job somewhere more secure, or at the very least somewhere that they won't announce they'll be kicking you out the door 6 weeks before Christmas.

Bold mine. That part there ruined your argument. People do not try to leave a company if they've been spared during a recession. That means they're worth something and people worth something typically don't get laid off.

[Azazel]

No, but you're not really listening.

Do you think those who remain at EA feel safe or secure in their jobs? Really? 

We all know that EA does the big cull every year or two. We all know that they Borg the developers that they purchase.

I know I'd go and try to find work at Valve or Blizzard or somewhere like that if I were in the industry and had the talent to do so. Otherwise I'd go get a real programming job, somewhere not in the fucking games industry.

[Pennilenko]

I wonder how Jacobs feels now, seeing his company ground into the dust?

Probably smiling all the way to the bank imagining all the blow he gets to do off of hooker titties.

[Ingmar]

Also it isn't like people quit their jobs, THEN go find a new one in these situations. I guarantee that resumes are being updated and monster.com is getting hit pretty heavily from there these days.

[Merusk]

No, but you're not really listening.

Do you think those who remain at EA feel safe or secure in their jobs? Really? 

We all know that EA does the big cull every year or two. We all know that they Borg the developers that they purchase.

I know I'd go and try to find work at Valve or Blizzard or somewhere like that if I were in the industry and had the talent to do so. Otherwise I'd go get a real programming job, somewhere not in the fucking games industry.

One could argue that if they had the talent they'd have done so already.  Plus, they'd have to move which is often a non-starter for a lot of people because right now they're so fucking upside down on their mortgage there's no way out of the hole.    As for programming jobs not in the games industry... I thought most of those were all overseas these days.   That aside, I thought game programming was looked-down on by 'real' programmers as where the washed-up, lazy and inept went to.  I'd gotten that impression over the years.

Anyway Nix is right, folks aren't leaving even shitty, insecure, jobs right now simply because it's a job and a paycheck.  Even if they're looking, they're competing with a LOT of unemployed folks who are going to be willing to take a lower pay rate.