Rift: Planes of Telara

[Falwell]

Well, they've done at least one smart thing with that small mountain of cash they've raised. Now I'm interested.

[Tarami]

From what I hear, their "revolutionary intelligent resource sharing server" is all HP/windows/SQL server/.NET. I can't think of any other MMOs with MS stack backends. Flat files, linux, oracle, and MySQL are all pretty common, but not windows. Is this a first?

Late to the party, but I'm pretty positive LotRO runs on Windows aswell. You can see server console windows running in the background in some demo videos, suggesting they're even running the server and the client on the same machine in those cases. Thing is, once you're running on Windows, there's not much point not running MSSQL aswell if you got the finances to do so. It's a good database engine, it just has a bit of a price tag if you're looking at the enterprise editions.

[Hartsman]

As a child growing up playing video games, lying even deeper than the aspiration to grow up and become a online game developer was the unspoken desire to have my middle name transform into a gerund worthy of an R rating.







(read: Thanks, sir. :)

[Ghambit]

Let it begin.

[Nonentity]

Every time I hear people getting into discussions about servers and server tech, I can't help but think of those Garry's Mod videos people made for Darkfall, where the server was a 486-looking PC sitting in a corner.

[Kovacs]

Not just some guy. It's Scott Motherfucking Hartsman.

Obvious understaement isn't obvious?   And I liked green, it was reassuring.  There really should be a collective rethinking of the move away from it.

[Bzalthek]

Welp, I'm sold.

It's gotta be creepy, though, having a cult following.

[Lantyssa]

He can ask Raph for tips on how to handle stalkers.

[Draegan]

Rift: Planes of Telara

Big overhaul on the website including the name.  It reveals a couple races and classes and how the game is set up.  Two factions, some pvp, "dynamic" content.  New video also on the front page.

The dynamic content so far appears to be just random encounters, but we'll see how they tie it in.

Schedule released date as of now is 2011.  Didn't see that coming.

[JWIV]

Also of interest is the press release

http://www.riftgame.com/en/news/listings/trion-unveils.php

In addition to the Rift: Planes of Telara, they're doing a RTS (End of Nations) and a Syfy action game.

[Draegan]

Scott Hartsman talks about (and shows) Rift

"Dynamic Content" looks like randomly spawning Public Quests.

[raydeen]

Seems like they're really playing up the public quest concept with the Rifts. As long as they don't make it a mandatory thing to advancement like WAR did I'll dig it. I also like how the ambient light seems to change based on whether you're in the light or in the shadow. Most games seem to be designed with light as a given. Darker or shadier areas would be a neat implementation.

Edit: And...Draegan beat me to my observation.

[Draegan]

I don't think much is going to change with this game except that the scenery might change every once in a while and players might not be clumped up in the same areas as your character progresses.

Anyway, what I'm really interested in is the class system.  From what I remember from their last E3 presentation is that you picka  class initially and then you can loot "class cards" and equip them or something.

The rest seems standard in MMOG Fantasy stuff.  Graphics seem neat though. 

[Stabs]

"Dynamic Content" looks like randomly spawning Public Quests.

Well sMFh did say that the rifts were just one form of the game's dynamic content (and one of the most visually spectacular).

There's a lot of other dynamic content that could be done. The resource spawns in SWG are a much-missed feature. In fact I'd really like to see a game use dynamic resource distribution to provoke player trade wars (eg your iron mine runs out of iron so you have to go take some iron off some other clan).

Wandering quest givers, secret quests, easter eggs would all be interesting. I'd particularly like a game where stuff dries up. You find something cool and when people ask "dude, where did you get that?" (which of course means "where can I get that?") you tell them it was off a mammoth but that mammoths are now extinct. Sorry.

I think overall a game that screws with thottbot type sites would be really interesting. "Wow, where did you get that quest?" "off some gypsy woman here but she left town, sorry dude".

He also mentions that fauna reacts to alien fauna coming out of the rift by running away. This implied a VW interactivity that then seemed a bit contradicted by watching the horrible MMO mechanic of 9 mobs stood still next to a player killing one of their mates. I guess that's just a MMO trope we're stuck with, I guess also I'll never get used to how dumb it looks. Maybe it's better than big angry trains of mobs gameplay-wise but there's a "they're letting me win" feel about going up to 10 mobs and killing one safely while his 9 mates scratch their bums.

[Hartsman]

He also mentions that fauna reacts to alien fauna coming out of the rift by running away. This implied a VW interactivity that then seemed a bit contradicted by watching the horrible MMO mechanic of 9 mobs stood still next to a player killing one of their mates.

Good eye.  Aggro was turned off for the demos.  (Easier to stop to go into detail on whatever you're being asked.)

I've trained myself pretty thoroughly in those by not paying attention. :)

[Ollie]

Just skimmed through the new website and watched the motion sickness inducing shaky-cam YouTube clip. 
Interesting times, that's for sure. PQs done right is something people have been talking about ever since WAR fumbled the ball. Come to think of it, didn't we just discuss the very topic on one of these threads?

Fake edit: Yep, we did. We chatted about socialisation and PQs in the SWTOR thread, pages 89-91.

It'll be fun to watch them balance dynamic, world-affecting content while still maintaining a sense of continuity and persistence in the game world. Too little makes the whole thing inconsequential, too much and the world might become freakishly disjointed and chaotic. Constant change, while neat on paper, might become grating after a while – barring a setting like Planescape, where it would be a part of player expectations. Getting the scope right is key.

Many previous MMOGs have flirted with the idea of making dynamic content a significant part of game play (NPC-built cities and random attacks on player towns in AoC, anyone?), but once the enormity of the task sets in, these ideas are scrapped in favour of static mob grinding. Here's hoping Trion pulls it off.

[Ghambit]

I'm sure Planescape was on their minds, which probably explains why they changed the title.
Btw...  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rifts_(role-playing_game)  

My biggest "?" is what kind of toolkit GMs will have.  Scripted dynamics is one thing, direct event control is another.  What kind of god-mode must there be on such a server-side game wherein just about any plane of reality can pop into existence?

[Margalis]

Rifts was an awesome game. (Your link is messed up by the way)

[WindupAtheist]

The noise about dynamic content has me interested, in sort of a "yeah let's see if that still exists by beta" way. All it needs now is a famous athlete to come here and post some empty bullshit so a bunch of starfuckers will blow this thread up to 50 pages while spewing nonsense and calling him by his first name. 

[Falwell]

Rifts was an awesome game. (Your link is messed up by the way)

Damn straight, Wormwood was host to many a gaming night for our guys. No M.D.C. / S.D.C. discussions permitted however.

[JWIV]

Rifts was an awesome game. (Your link is messed up by the way)

Damn straight, Wormwood was host to many a gaming night for our guys. No M.D.C. / S.D.C. discussions permitted however.

Rifts had awesome fluff.  And Wormwood really was one of the best settings ever.  Completely disgusting, but it really hit a lot of great themes for gaming.

[Ollie]

The noise about dynamic content has me interested, in sort of a "yeah let's see if that still exists by beta" way. All it needs now is a famous athlete to come here and post some empty bullshit so a bunch of starfuckers will blow this thread up to 50 pages while spewing nonsense and calling him by his first name. 

Unless their website abuses customer expectations with greater abandon than Ellingsen and Barnett combined, it seems likely that some form of dynamic content will make it to launch. The question is the extent to which it will permeate everyday play. Will it be meaningful, or relegated to a gimmick? And of course, the question everyone shudders to ask in an MMOG context, "Will it be fun?"

Anyhoo, I wonder how I've managed to miss Rifts. Especially since we played the Palladium RPG from the early 80's for a spell, so it's not like the publisher wasn't on our gaming-group's radar. The mind boggles.

[Hawkbit]

Pretty game.  Animations look nice, a lot better than Bioware is putting out with SWTOR (yes, I realize the two games are of different design cores).  Regardless, it's a nice looking game.  I hope it can transcend the last four years of crap in the mmo genre. 

[Stabs]

He also mentions that fauna reacts to alien fauna coming out of the rift by running away. This implied a VW interactivity that then seemed a bit contradicted by watching the horrible MMO mechanic of 9 mobs stood still next to a player killing one of their mates.

Good eye.  Aggro was turned off for the demos.  (Easier to stop to go into detail on whatever you're being asked.)

I've trained myself pretty thoroughly in those by not paying attention. :)

Thanks for clarifying that Scott.

That's very interesting. If a player walks into a field of mobs and they don't all just stand there but aggressively support each other are we heading back to the EQ paradigm of needing a group to grind optimally? Does it also bring back the dreaded train to zone?

By the way commiserations on the end of your F13 celebrity. One page you've got Schild raving about you next page WUP is lamenting your company doesn't have Michael Jordan on the dev team. I'm sure it was nice while it lasted.

[Xilren's Twin]

Never had a chance to play Rifts, but i've always wanted to see an MMO that could mash up dimensions to allow for widely different flavors of gameplay.  i.e. different worlds have different tech levels and magics backgrounds so you could have your standard high fantasy world with the expected elves and dwarves and whatnot, but also be able to link to planes with no magic and musket level firearms, or high tech/alient crap.  Multiverse stuff.  Make travelling from one dimension to another non trivial and it builds in economic game play too - imagine a mission where you're group is hired to transport stuff thats low value in one world to another dimension where it is very desirable, but you have to fight your way through to do it.

At any rate, this game with better PQ sounds like its worth a look.

[Lantyssa]

By the way commiserations on the end of your F13 celebrity. One page you've got Schild raving about you next page WUP is lamenting your company doesn't have Michael Jordan on the dev team. I'm sure it was nice while it lasted.

Schild knows the industry inside and out.  I doubt most would know who Hartsmann is unless they pay a lot of attention to it.  That's fine.  He's respected by a small group of people who understand the significance of what he's done, rather than followed by the legions of celebrity stalkers WUA is mocking.  We can do without the influx of "Ooh, look at me!" posters that popularity brings.

It's definitely one to keep an eye on, because now there's a small glimmer of hope that a team will take the good ideas out there and refine them into something workable.  The info release schedule might work out, too, if they are really on track to hit 2011.  Pacing that right has been another of our big gripes.

[Threash]

Mildly interested, need to know about pvp before i really give it a serious look though.

[Ghambit]

Mildly interested, need to know about pvp before i really give it a serious look though.

The PvP is Dynamic. 

[Malakili]

they're doing a RTS (End of Nations)

This looks interesting, I think i'll start a thread about it.

[Hartsman]

Thanks for clarifying that Scott.

That's very interesting. If a player walks into a field of mobs and they don't all just stand there but aggressively support each other are we heading back to the EQ paradigm of needing a group to grind optimally? Does it also bring back the dreaded train to zone?

This isn't a comment on our game as much as it is about MMO content in general: I think there's a fine line between "challenging solo content" and "faceroll content." 

Given that solo doesn't necessarily need to mean faceroll, it's entirely possible (and desirable) to make things interesting and fun while not going back 10 years to "You need to be in a full group to do anything."

If a player blindly walks into a field of hostile mobs in the middle of an invasion, in any fiction, solo mobs or no - Chances are, they kinda deserve to be eaten.


Trains to zone, personally (again) I'm of two minds on.  Personally? I loved them. I loved being one of the people who was good enough to derail massive ones (e.g. karnor's castle) brought by others with one or two friends.  Is that a wide-appeal dynamic?  Likely not as much.

[UnSub]

I was completely ignoring this title until I saw the video - I'm now registered. Sounds interesting enough and I'm hoping the final execution matches up.

Most interesting bit of the video was the final 30 seconds, where Hartsman talked about how they are using console-experienced artists who know that if they go over budget their game typically won't ship. That kind of discipline needs to be standard for MMOs if they are going to progress forward.

[Ghambit]

If they get the balance right you shouldnt be able to "farm" at all.  At least not in the sense you can just go hit a node you know produces.  For all you know, that node might be overrun with maneating venus flytraps the next time you frolick by... where before it was just pink bunnies.  All the more intriguing is if at that moment you NEED that node (assuming it even produces the same farmage) and are forced to think tactically to get the goods, or call for reinforcements, or both.   Why have to PLAN a "raid" when one can just smack you in the face when you're not ready.... and then that raid isnt scouted.

Shades of an open-pvp server I guess, with bots instead.

[Ollie]

Most interesting bit of the video was the final 30 seconds, where Hartsman talked about how they are using console-experienced artists who know that if they go over budget their game typically won't ship. That kind of discipline needs to be standard for MMOs if they are going to progress forward.

That piqued my interest as well. Lord knows a project as vast in scope as an MMOG has huge inertia, and is subject to all kinds of bloat, both technical and financial. If Trion has people who are used to working in a real-world project management setting, as opposed to the normal bumblefoolery we get from MMOG dev houses, more power to them. I hope that experience translates to the end product.

It would be nice to log on to a new game on day one and have everything run more or less smoothly for a change, that's for sure.

[Margalis]

The thing about that quote that excites me is that PC games traditionally have awful character animation.

[Spiff]

I'm really liking the visuals of it at the very least, has a definite Lotro/AoC feel to it, but AoC done right (not just 50 shades of grey and brown).

Also: Gamasutra has an article about it: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/28231/Trion_Announces_MMORTS_End_Of_Nations_Renames_Heroes_Of_Telara.php

Now the article doesn't have anything particularly interesting to say (at least that you haven't read anywhere else before), but have a look at the comments, especially near the bottom; it's rare for me to feel such pity reading a forum