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Author Topic: Game of Thrones  (Read 344886 times)
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #5355 on: August 09, 2017, 08:38:26 AM

I don't know if they explain it in the books but it doesn't seem like anybody ever flies dragons, they ride them.  You can kinda give them general commands like "let's go this way" "burn those guys they suck" and "let's head home"  but anything even as complicated as "burn that line lengthwise" or even "turn in this direction now"  is just out of the question.

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eldaec
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Reply #5356 on: August 09, 2017, 10:39:29 AM

Nobody has flown a Dragon in the books - unless you count Drogon flying Dany away from Mereen.

Inability to control dragons is still a plot point.

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Teleku
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Reply #5357 on: August 09, 2017, 11:05:23 AM

One they haven't addressed in the books yet, so actually a big one.  TV show just decided "she suddenly can."   awesome, for real

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HaemishM
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Reply #5358 on: August 09, 2017, 11:08:17 AM

How hard could it be?  why so serious?

Khaldun
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Reply #5359 on: August 09, 2017, 11:16:28 AM

I remember a bit in the old Harold Shea fantasy series by DeCamp and Pratt where Harold just has a foil and he's supposed to have a sword fight with an armored knight and a broadsword and he thinks it through pretty carefully. Reminded me of that scene with Arya and Brienne.
Merusk
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Reply #5360 on: August 09, 2017, 11:48:22 AM

If we're gonna get all nitpicking on things..

Ed: Shit missed Cyrrax's post saying the same thing here.

Also: Dothraki never dismount. Certainly not to chase down one man.

« Last Edit: August 09, 2017, 11:50:10 AM by Merusk »

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I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
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Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #5361 on: August 09, 2017, 12:14:26 PM

One they haven't addressed in the books yet, so actually a big one.  TV show just decided "she suddenly can."   awesome, for real

Well that's what I'm saying, she can't really. Lot of people saying she should have done this or the dragon should have flown that way and all I can think is it's a miracle the dragon not burning her own men.

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Phildo
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Reply #5362 on: August 09, 2017, 02:03:17 PM

It's a miracle it didn't stop for a snack in the middle of the battle with all that tasty bbq horse lying around.
lamaros
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Reply #5363 on: August 09, 2017, 04:52:45 PM

Jon has taught Dany the secret ways of amgic animal control, duh. Ain't no special secret in the books.

Maybe Bran will come in for an episode and conduct a symphony of dragons and other animals fighting. Maybe he'll puppet a thousand men to build the largest human pyramid of all time.

It's all stupid at this point.

Expect poison from the standing water.
HaemishM
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Reply #5364 on: August 10, 2017, 10:20:45 AM

They need to make this a regular, weekly thing.

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RhyssaFireheart
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Reply #5365 on: August 10, 2017, 04:22:53 PM

I don't even watch the show (no HBO), but am I the only one bothered by Dany's dragons actually being wyverns?

Or least Drogon (whatever one she's flying on) is.


pxib
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Reply #5366 on: August 11, 2017, 12:19:06 PM

I don't even watch the show (no HBO), but am I the only one bothered by Dany's dragons actually being wyverns?
Most "realistic" "dragons" are nowadays. See also: The Harry Potter films. How to Train Your Dragon did six limbs, but I don't think I've seen a live-action one since Dragonheart.

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Merusk
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Reply #5367 on: August 11, 2017, 01:29:35 PM

You're asking too much nerd for even Hollywood art departments these days. As nerdom got trendy the pendantics got pushed off the bus.

But yes, it bothers me a lot too. Even Smaug in The Hobbit was a Wyvern, not a Dragon, and Jackson is a big enough nerd to know better. I blame Reign of Fire, which was the first modern movie I remember with shitty dragons.

I can't get past the panties - Alluvian
I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
People rarely believe just how good I am at sucking. - Lantyssa
I love the swinging dongs - Signe
Sir T
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Reply #5368 on: August 11, 2017, 02:30:13 PM

Trivia - Reign of Fire was shot in the Wiclow mountains in Ireland. It was shot in the winter/early spring, and in the middle of filming they too a 2week break. When they got back, instead of the lovely hell landscape they left, everything was green. so the most expensive special effect in the movie was to make the new green grass match the earlier dead grass. So the Dragons probably got shortchanged because of that.

The fantastic Dragon which fought the WW2 bomber in "Sucker Punch" was a Wyvern too. God I wish that was a better movie because some of the scenes in that were so bad ass...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP6Go0ooEWw
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 02:31:57 PM by Sir T »

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pxib
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Reply #5369 on: August 11, 2017, 03:37:16 PM

I blame Reign of Fire, which was the first modern movie I remember with shitty dragons.
I blame the Academy Award nominated effects work in this. It lost to Raiders of the Lost Ark. Dragonslayer is mediocre movie with an awesome creature. It pretty much set the standard for special effects dragons. All the directors who had dragons in their works went MAKE IT LIKE THIS ONE.

"But technically that's a wyvern..."

Sadly, nobody cares. I'm pretty sure How to Train Your Dragon would have had wyverns if the books hadn't been illustrated.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 03:39:17 PM by pxib »

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Abagadro
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Reply #5370 on: August 11, 2017, 03:52:23 PM

Probably just easier to animate 2 legs and 2 wings instead of 4 legs and 2 wings.

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Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #5371 on: August 11, 2017, 04:15:15 PM

Wyvern
noun, Heraldry.
1.
a two-legged winged dragon having the hinder part of a serpent with a barbed tail.

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Typhon
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Reply #5372 on: August 11, 2017, 04:34:07 PM

Possibly also something to do with the whole "JUST JAM THE WINGS ONTO THE BACK, IT DOESN'T HAVE TO MAKE ANATOMICAL SENSE" plays in there as well.  With the Wyvern you can at least point at a bat or pterodactyl and say, "see? it sort of makes sense".
Morat20
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Reply #5373 on: August 11, 2017, 04:40:04 PM

Nobody has flown a Dragon in the books - unless you count Drogon flying Dany away from Mereen.

Inability to control dragons is still a plot point.
Yeah, but you'd think there'd be books. Dragons USED to be a pretty common instrument of warfare. There'd be stories about how dragons are used in combat in conquering Westeros, and you'd think a Targeryeon who had a decade or so sitting around in a damn house before getting married off might have read them.

And if she didn't, Tryion "I've read everything about Dragons because they're awesome. Also I've read everything, and also my last big battle I spent reading books on famous sieges to prepare" Lannister damn well would have.

Things like "Don't fly directly at the funny looking giant crossbow". Maybe she's got shit eyesight.

I was okay with her flaming the line perpendicular to it -- the idea was to make a big ass hole that ran all the way through the line, so..success. Seems the best use of a dragon, if you want to avoid friendly fire, is breaking up hard points (shattering a line like that) and then doing stuff like burning baggage, fucking with the reserves, flaming any knots of organized resistance, and in general setting shit on fire and breaking up the opposing force so your troops can crush each portion separately.
eldaec
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Reply #5374 on: August 11, 2017, 07:08:53 PM

The books imply quite strongly that the reason you can't pick up a Dummies manual on the subject of Dragon operation is that an anti-magic faction, probably run out of the citadel, has been working to restrict knowledge of magic, dragons, zombies, and 300 mile long walls of ice. While they obviously couldn't remove Baleron's Skull from the Red Keep, or the keep the 300 mile long of wall of ice a secret, they have been pretty successful at making sure nobody understands any of it. 

Maybe because use of magic caused the long night, and/or the doom.

Maybe because they are evil fun-hating bastards.

TBD



On the subject of dragon tactics, Sarah Connor hasn't fought anything that can touch her before, so I have no idea why anyone would expect her to be on the lookout for modified Dragon-piercing Ballistae.

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HaemishM
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Reply #5375 on: August 11, 2017, 07:13:32 PM

I imagine the reason the Maesters in the Citadel have locked all the books on dragons and fucking ice zombies away is for the same reason they did the "cure" to the stoneskin sickness. Sure, the knowledge might help people but chances are pretty good that some unscrupulous bastard like Qyburn will use them to fuck up a whole bunch of shit instead.

eldaec
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Reply #5376 on: August 11, 2017, 07:43:30 PM

And maybe Varys really is in it for the little guy.

It is explicitly claimed that the citadel killed the Dragons last time, and that they seek to control everyone because plans within plans. Somehow.



If you want to get into deep tinfoil territory the books even have a steward in the night's watch, who is notably from oldtown, ends up involved in Jon's murder, and goes around wearing perfume for no obvious reason other than to trigger 'perfumed seneschal' prophecy speculation.

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MahrinSkel
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Reply #5377 on: August 11, 2017, 07:50:40 PM


On the subject of dragon tactics, Sarah Connor hasn't fought anything that can touch her before, so I have no idea why anyone would expect her to be on the lookout for modified Dragon-piercing Ballistae.
This is funny to me because Sarah Conner is the one that had the dragon-piercing ballista built.


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Samwise
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Reply #5378 on: August 11, 2017, 08:53:22 PM

I don't know why I didn't put together until just now that the last two people to play Sarah Connor are both in GoT.

Someone get Linda Hamilton on this show as the Night Queen or something.   DRILLING AND WOMANLINESS

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Shannow
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Reply #5379 on: August 13, 2017, 09:53:08 PM

Meh.

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Khaldun
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Reply #5380 on: August 13, 2017, 09:56:33 PM

That was about as convoluted a plan as I've ever seen in fantasy literature.

"So let's go north of the Wall, kidnap a zombie, bring it back undead to King's Landing, convince Cersei that there really are zombies, then Cersei will sign an armistice and Danerys can safely move her troops north to help with the zombies."

WTF, guys. Seriously?

I get the appeal of a Dirty Dozen/Magnificent Seven adventure in the North, but there has got to be a better way to get to it than that fucking dumb shit.
Brolan
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Reply #5381 on: August 13, 2017, 10:36:45 PM

It does sound like a hare-brained scheme from the pen of a bad writer.  Do you think it was GRRM or the TV people?
Bzalthek
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Reply #5382 on: August 13, 2017, 10:39:31 PM

Wasn't impressed, though I really liked seeing Gendry again.

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Polysorbate80
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Reply #5383 on: August 13, 2017, 10:46:27 PM

I liked the way they snuck in Jon's legitimacy (and Sam's development of a spine in general)
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Reply #5384 on: August 13, 2017, 11:42:55 PM

Is #dreamteam trending on social media yet?  They're just missing Bronn and Brienne at this point.
jgsugden
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Reply #5385 on: August 14, 2017, 12:19:41 AM

It does sound like a hare-brained scheme from the pen of a bad writer.  Do you think it was GRRM or the TV people?
It is the tv way to get back towards the GRRM storyline they screwed over with earlier changes.

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Reply #5386 on: August 14, 2017, 12:25:11 AM

I liked the way they snuck in Jon's legitimacy (and Sam's development of a spine in general)

I told you all Gilly was the key to the whole shebang.

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Merusk
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Reply #5387 on: August 14, 2017, 05:14:13 AM

The rowing joke, while funny, was too meta for me. Lots more TV writer stuff here than GRR.

I can't get past the panties - Alluvian
I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
People rarely believe just how good I am at sucking. - Lantyssa
I love the swinging dongs - Signe
Brolan
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Reply #5388 on: August 14, 2017, 06:59:00 AM

I liked the way they snuck in Jon's legitimacy (and Sam's development of a spine in general)

I told you all Gilly was the key to the whole shebang.

Isn't Sam now head of house Tarly?  No one mentioned that in the show.
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Reply #5389 on: August 14, 2017, 07:10:09 AM

He would be if taking the black didn't require renouncing of all claim to titles. Remember, Sam is the older brother and was thrown into the Night's Watch so Dickon could become the heir.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/House_Tarly

Sam would have to go through the Snow Loophole or otherwise be absolved of his vow to the Night's Watch. Considering that the vow was so strong it let a Targaryen remain alive there's probably no way around it.  The fact that the northern lords allow Jon to lead despite taking the black while also not knowing he died and returned is a rather large plot hole.


I can't get past the panties - Alluvian
I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
People rarely believe just how good I am at sucking. - Lantyssa
I love the swinging dongs - Signe
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